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(NPR)   When transporting a revolutionary new trachea built up from stem cells for a time-critical transplant, spend a couple of extra bucks so you don't have to rely on ultra-budget airline easyJet   (npr.org) divider line 77
    More: Obvious, easyJet, stem cells, low-cost carrier, organ donors, Bristol University, organ transplants, lung function, scaffolds  
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9472 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Jun 2012 at 11:56 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-20 05:14:51 AM  

crispyone:
It would be nice to have a logical discussion with an actual expert in the field about the past and/or continuing need for the use of fetal stem cells in research, It seems to me that the only way this stem cell medicine was ever going to work would be using with one's own stem cells. It's not like you are gonna comb through a database of aborted fetuses to find a genetic match for each person needing a stem cell procedure. The end result would always be using one's own stem cells.


i2.kym-cdn.com

Logical?? THIS IS FAAAAAAAARK!!
 
2012-06-20 06:16:09 AM  
FormlessOne:
You're missing the point - the Republicans need these advances to extend their lifetimes and retain power. That's exactly why they're hoping to snuff out the poor, after all, because the poor tend to vote Democrat and they can't have that. The rich always vote to keep themselves alive, and the poor just don't get a vote - that's the world they want to live in, and they're working hard to get there.

It's definitely why they're working hard to destroy public education - because the difference between a dumb, easily-manipulated reactionary mob (ie. "acceptable" voters) and the average joe sometimes voting in their own interest is largely a decent education.

crispyone:
It would be nice to have a logical discussion with an actual expert in the field about the past and/or continuing need for the use of fetal stem cells in research, It seems to me that the only way this stem cell medicine was ever going to work would be using with one's own stem cells. It's not like you are gonna comb through a database of aborted fetuses to find a genetic match for each person needing a stem cell procedure. The end result would always be using one's own stem cells.

Autotransplantation would, I think, always be preferable to allo- or xenotransplants, but it's only recently that tissue engineering has progressed to the point where we can actually grow anything from the patient's own cells. In biological science a decade is a long time, and the fetal stem cell controversy started way back in the primordial dark ages of stem cell research, when our understanding was very different. If we don't have to use fetal cells, great, because that will handily sidestep the fundamentalist churchy morons trying to halt human progress once again.
 
2012-06-20 06:48:08 AM  
Why is the medical-student-who-knew-a-pilot the hero of the story? Shouldn't the pilot have gotten a little credit?
 
2012-06-20 06:51:44 AM  

Gyrfalcon: crispyone: Mugato: I thought stem cell research was evil because of the baby Jesus.

The evangelicals are against research with stem cells from aborted fetuses. This was done with her own stem cells. Not sure how important/neccessary previous stem cell research using fetal stem cells was for this breakthrough.

It would be nice to have a logical discussion with an actual expert in the field about the past and/or continuing need for the use of fetal stem cells in research, It seems to me that the only way this stem cell medicine was ever going to work would be using with one's own stem cells. It's not like you are gonna comb through a database of aborted fetuses to find a genetic match for each person needing a stem cell procedure. The end result would always be using one's own stem cells.

As I understand it, the reason fetal stem cells are needed and used is because there's no need for genetic matching. A stem cell is a cell that isn't a person yet, so tissue grown from it can be designed with any genetic markers you need. (I'm sure I am totally wrong about the specifics, however) The cells are undifferentiated, hence, they won't be rejected by anyone's immune system. Also, once the stem cell line is established, there's no need to "comb through" a database, as you say. The cell line is reproducable (which is not a word, but it's very late) on its own, so it can be used without augmentation.


Not quite accurate. Immunological markers are genetically encoded; embryonic stem cells will look just as foreign as any other tissue graft from a different individual. The difference is that ESCs are "totipotent", that is, they can give rise to any tissue in the body. Adult stem cells are "pluripotent", that is, they can give rise to a limited number of different tissues. Interesting work is being done with inducing stemness in adult cells (see work by Shinya Yamanaka et al.), but right now, ESCs are the only cells that can grow any (or all) of a human. An organ built from ESCs is less than ideal, but it would be better than a traditional transplant, and far better than dying.

I'd also like to point out that human embryonic stem cells don't come from aborted fetuses. hESCs are produced from unimplanted embryos produced for in vitro fertilization. No fetuses were harmed in their production.
 
2012-06-20 07:08:06 AM  

solenoid: I'd also like to point out that human embryonic stem cells don't come from aborted fetuses. hESCs are produced from unimplanted embryos produced for in vitro fertilization. No fetuses were harmed in their production.


Yes, but every sperm is sacred.
 
2012-06-20 07:31:39 AM  

Sid_6.7: solenoid: I'd also like to point out that human embryonic stem cells don't come from aborted fetuses. hESCs are produced from unimplanted embryos produced for in vitro fertilization. No fetuses were harmed in their production.

Yes, but every sperm is sacred.


Then I commit mine to a holy war daily

/sometime more.
 
2012-06-20 07:52:32 AM  
Most airport security people are unthinking, but I'm going to put more than a bit of the blame on the doctor unless he has an email or some documentation of the conversation with the airline. What did he do, call 1-800-EasyJet and say, "yo dog, Imma gonna to bring a trachea grown from stems cells on a flight. You all cool with that? Yes? Sweet!!!"

I never ceases to amaze that people look at complicated processes that have multiple failure point and in the words of Dr. Evil "I'm just gonna assume it all went to plan." What if there was a weather problem, bomb scare, or given that it's Europe, a strike? He didn't have any backup plan? Couldn't he have just taken a train or taxi into Heathrow airport? It's less than two hours away and there are 14 non-stop direct flights from there to Barcelona. It would also have afforded the possibility of flying to Madrid or Toulouse if Barcelona was closed. Yes, +1000000 for inventing a replacement trachea but -999999 for not thinking through how you get it to the patient.
 
2012-06-20 08:16:39 AM  

billii: Make advances like this and the IDIOT REPUBLICANS want to cut Medicare. What is the sense of doing research, if the Republicans don't want to help anybody but themselves. Remember their insurance, which we pay for out of our taxes, probably would have covered this for any Republican Congressman or Senator, but not the average Joe Blow on the street and working to make ends meet.


You are just a political troll who can only see in two colors, Republican and Democrat. Keep farking that chicken if it makes you feel good little d.
 
2012-06-20 08:41:33 AM  

crispyone: Mugato: I thought stem cell research was evil because of the baby Jesus.

The evangelicals are against research with stem cells from aborted fetuses. This was done with her own stem cells. Not sure how important/neccessary previous stem cell research using fetal stem cells was for this breakthrough.

It would be nice to have a logical discussion with an actual expert in the field about the past and/or continuing need for the use of fetal stem cells in research, It seems to me that the only way this stem cell medicine was ever going to work would be using with one's own stem cells. It's not like you are gonna comb through a database of aborted fetuses to find a genetic match for each person needing a stem cell procedure. The end result would always be using one's own stem cells.


People have been researching embryonic and adult/somatic stem cells for decades, but it's really only in the last 10-15 years that developing practical applications of using stems cells first really took off. In those early days (and in biomedicine, 15 years ago is the farking dark ages at the rate that the field progresses) we really didn't know much about the adult stem lines or how to manipulate them. It was easier to get embryonic stem cells to do what we want because they are "totipotent", meaning they can form any cell in the body, compared to "pluripotent" adult/somatic stem cells which have already taken steps down the path to differentiating into different cell types and so can only form a restricted set of cell types.

Now that we've gotten better at manipulating adult stem cells, for these applications it does make sense to use the patient's own cells if possible to avoid immune complications. But the knowledge that we gained wouldn't have been possible without studying those embryonic stem cells to find out what makes them special. And there could still be applications for embryonic lines that adult lines aren't suitable for. The only way we'll know is to experiment.

In research, you don't use primates when you can use mice, and you don't use mice when you can get your answers from cultured cell lines. Similarly, if you can get results with adult stem lines, then by all means use them first over embryonic stem lines. It all depends on the application. But don't take that tool out of researchers' hands.

Also, as someone else mentioned, to the best of my knowledge nearly all embryonic stem cells and lines used for research come from unused frozen embryos, not aborted fetuses. In a fetus, cells have already begun to differentiate into tissues and the beginning of organs pretty early in development, so most of them aren't "embryonic" any longer.
 
2012-06-20 09:26:10 AM  
i.usatoday.net
Can I fark it?


"Sorry your trachea was taking so long ma'am, I went ahead and gave it a protein bath to keep it fresh."
 
2012-06-20 09:40:14 AM  
Sounds like the courier had absolutely no paperwork confirming they could fly with the container, so I am assuming that the prof screwed up.

I flew from the UK to Spain last month with a budget airline with a container of liquid larger than the max limit. All I needed was a letter from my doctor and they let it through. So this prof farked up loyally.

Alternatives - put it in the hold of the plane or farking DRIVE it to Barcelona before you blow money on a private plane.
 
2012-06-20 09:40:18 AM  
Veritas:

Endless, vat-grown bacon. Maybe one day every household will have its own mini bioreactor churning out a renewable supply of tasty tasty pig-friendly, PETA-approved bacon.

/I have a dream


Cleary, you do not understand what PETA actually stands for. Look at MADD for your analogy. It's not about the animals. t never was. It was always about fear of and hatred for humanity and science.
 
2012-06-20 10:15:35 AM  

Metraxis:

Cleary, you do not understand what PETA actually stands for.


People Eating Tasty Animals?
 
2012-06-20 10:33:07 AM  

namatad: forget how it gets paid for for a second. this is INSANELY AWESOME technology.
little or no rejection. building parts out of scaffolds and stems sells. dont even need a donor.
this is CRAZY AWESOME news.

jaws, eyes sockets, what's next? fingers, thumbs? noses, ears, ...
ear drums? nerve cells, spinal cords???

brave new world


I completely agree with your sentiment, however in this case there was in fact a donor. They needed to wash the tissues off the skeletal structure in order to use the underlying scaffold to grow the stem cells, but the skeletal structure itself is still someone else.

Even with that, the fact that someone doesn't have to be on immunosuppressants for the rest of their life is pretty goddamn good news. My dad's on the transplant list for a kidney now, and this gives me a little bit of hope. Now if we can only get the farking bible-thumpers in Congress to allow across-the-board stem cell therapy and research, we can help a LOT of people in this country.
 
2012-06-20 11:02:11 AM  
Comic Book Guy:

I completely agree with your sentiment, however in this case there was in fact a donor. They needed to wash the tissues off the skeletal structure in order to use the underlying scaffold to grow the stem cells, but the skeletal structure itself is still someone else.

Even with that, the fact that someone doesn't have to be on immunosuppressants for the rest of their life is pretty goddamn good news. My dad's on the transplant list for a kidney now, and this gives me a little bit of hope. Now if we can only get the farking bible-thumpers in Congress to allow across-the-board stem cell therapy and research, we can help a LOT of people in this country.


Read a bit further into the article. They subsequently built two more for different patients from scratch from stem cells.
 
2012-06-20 11:06:04 AM  

LadyBelgara: namatad: forget how it gets paid for for a second. this is INSANELY AWESOME technology.
little or no rejection. building parts out of scaffolds and stems sells. dont even need a donor.
this is CRAZY AWESOME news.

jaws, eyes sockets, what's next? fingers, thumbs? noses, ears, ...
ear drums? nerve cells, spinal cords???

brave new world

This. Holy crap.


This is a trolling article. This has been done for YEARS. It's common for knee surgeries. I had the ACL of a dead guy, stripped of cells that would cause rejection (leaving connective tissues only, as I understand it), implanted into my knee to replace my destroyed one. They took a few cell samples, grew my cells, dipped the ACL in the growth, and then implanted it in my body...four years ago. This technology isn't even novel anymore. They have huge repositories of body parts that have been "sterilized", they just pick one out that matches yours, grow your cells around it, implant it, and let your body fill in the rest of the growth. I even remember seeing the "purchase order" (I don't know what the proper term is) from my orthopedic surgeon to the supplier asking for an ACL. It was eerie and cool.

The doc that did my surgery only did surgeries like this, using sterilized donated tissue. This wasn't groundbreaking at all.
 
2012-06-20 11:10:55 AM  

HeFixesTheCable: LadyBelgara: namatad: forget how it gets paid for for a second. this is INSANELY AWESOME technology.
little or no rejection. building parts out of scaffolds and stems sells. dont even need a donor.
this is CRAZY AWESOME news.

jaws, eyes sockets, what's next? fingers, thumbs? noses, ears, ...
ear drums? nerve cells, spinal cords???

brave new world

This. Holy crap.

This is a trolling article. This has been done for YEARS. It's common for knee surgeries. I had the ACL of a dead guy, stripped of cells that would cause rejection (leaving connective tissues only, as I understand it), implanted into my knee to replace my destroyed one. They took a few cell samples, grew my cells, dipped the ACL in the growth, and then implanted it in my body...four years ago. This technology isn't even novel anymore. They have huge repositories of body parts that have been "sterilized", they just pick one out that matches yours, grow your cells around it, implant it, and let your body fill in the rest of the growth. I even remember seeing the "purchase order" (I don't know what the proper term is) from my orthopedic surgeon to the supplier asking for an ACL. It was eerie and cool.

The doc that did my surgery only did surgeries like this, using sterilized donated tissue. This wasn't groundbreaking at all.


Wow, a medical procedure hipster. Now I've seen everything.
 
2012-06-20 11:35:27 AM  

Teufelaffe: HeFixesTheCable: LadyBelgara: namatad: forget how it gets paid for for a second. this is INSANELY AWESOME technology.
little or no rejection. building parts out of scaffolds and stems sells. dont even need a donor.
this is CRAZY AWESOME news.

jaws, eyes sockets, what's next? fingers, thumbs? noses, ears, ...
ear drums? nerve cells, spinal cords???

brave new world

This. Holy crap.

This is a trolling article. This has been done for YEARS. It's common for knee surgeries. I had the ACL of a dead guy, stripped of cells that would cause rejection (leaving connective tissues only, as I understand it), implanted into my knee to replace my destroyed one. They took a few cell samples, grew my cells, dipped the ACL in the growth, and then implanted it in my body...four years ago. This technology isn't even novel anymore. They have huge repositories of body parts that have been "sterilized", they just pick one out that matches yours, grow your cells around it, implant it, and let your body fill in the rest of the growth. I even remember seeing the "purchase order" (I don't know what the proper term is) from my orthopedic surgeon to the supplier asking for an ACL. It was eerie and cool.

The doc that did my surgery only did surgeries like this, using sterilized donated tissue. This wasn't groundbreaking at all.

Wow, a medical procedure hipster. Now I've seen everything.


You got an LOL out of me. Yeah. that came across kinda douche-y. I apologize. I guess I was pissed that this read more like a Daily Fail article than an NPR article.
 
2012-06-20 11:40:00 AM  

billii: Make advances like this and the IDIOT REPUBLICANS want to cut Medicare. What is the sense of doing research, if the Republicans don't want to help anybody but themselves. Remember their insurance, which we pay for out of our taxes, probably would have covered this for any Republican Congressman or Senator, but not the average Joe Blow on the street and working to make ends meet.


You failed to include the other Approved Talking Points™

Racist Homophobe Racist Christian Racist Rich Racist Capitalist Racist Bankster Racist Southerner Racist Israel Racist Fox News Racist

/holla
 
2012-06-20 12:16:26 PM  

Teufelaffe: HeFixesTheCable: LadyBelgara: namatad: forget how it gets paid for for a second. this is INSANELY AWESOME technology.
little or no rejection. building parts out of scaffolds and stems sells. dont even need a donor.
this is CRAZY AWESOME news.

jaws, eyes sockets, what's next? fingers, thumbs? noses, ears, ...
ear drums? nerve cells, spinal cords???

brave new world

This. Holy crap.

This is a trolling article. This has been done for YEARS. It's common for knee surgeries. I had the ACL of a dead guy, stripped of cells that would cause rejection (leaving connective tissues only, as I understand it), implanted into my knee to replace my destroyed one. They took a few cell samples, grew my cells, dipped the ACL in the growth, and then implanted it in my body...four years ago. This technology isn't even novel anymore. They have huge repositories of body parts that have been "sterilized", they just pick one out that matches yours, grow your cells around it, implant it, and let your body fill in the rest of the growth. I even remember seeing the "purchase order" (I don't know what the proper term is) from my orthopedic surgeon to the supplier asking for an ACL. It was eerie and cool.

The doc that did my surgery only did surgeries like this, using sterilized donated tissue. This wasn't groundbreaking at all.

Wow, a medical procedure hipster. Now I've seen everything.


I'm commander Shepard, and this is my favorite post on the citadel.
 
2012-06-20 02:27:28 PM  
Hrmmmmm..... how long before this hits the "can I build a custom penis" stage? And.. uh... where do you sign up?
 
2012-06-20 04:15:08 PM  

Mugato: I thought stem cell research was evil because of the baby Jesus.


This work was done with adult stem cells. In fact, all of the most promising therapies depend on adult, not embryonic, stem cells. Those are the ones that can be transplanted without rejection issues, because they can be taken directly from the patient who needs the transplant.

I see no reason to waste any more public money on embryonic stem cell research, when adult stem cells can do the same job (particularly now that iPS cells have been shown to be truly totipotent).
 
2012-06-20 04:59:47 PM  

solenoid: Interesting work is being done with inducing stemness in adult cells (see work by Shinya Yamanaka et al.), but right now, ESCs are the only cells that can grow any (or all) of a human. An or ...


Didn't someone show that you could actually make a mouse from iPS cells? Hasn't been done in humans, maybe, but seems like a strong proof of principle that you can theoretically make any cell from adult stem cells.
 
2012-06-20 05:15:08 PM  

cs30109: solenoid: Interesting work is being done with inducing stemness in adult cells (see work by Shinya Yamanaka et al.), but right now, ESCs are the only cells that can grow any (or all) of a human. An or ...

Didn't someone show that you could actually make a mouse from iPS cells? Hasn't been done in humans, maybe, but seems like a strong proof of principle that you can theoretically make any cell from adult stem cells.


I don't know that a mouse has been made with iPS cells, but they have made chimeras with iPS-derived cells in all three germ layers. The issue, however, is that the production of iPS cells is still difficult, and their therapeutic use is limited by this difficulty, their propensity to form tumors, and the fact that oncogenes are often used in their production. There is no reason not to use hESCs to learn how to manipulate stem cells while the issues with iPSCs are worked out, particularly when considering the fact that hESCs are derived from blasts that would otherwise be discarded as medical waste.

Science is rarely all-or-nothing, and abandoning one promising avenue of research to pursue a better yet riskier one is foolish.
 
2012-06-20 07:33:44 PM  

Gyrfalcon: As I understand it, the reason fetal stem cells are needed and used is because there's no need for genetic matching. A stem cell is a cell that isn't a person yet, so tissue grown from it can be designed with any genetic markers you need.


I'm not a doctor, nor a researcher. I just like reading about this sort of stuff.

Incorrect. Fetal stem cells still have the genetic markers from the combined sperm/egg used to make the cells, or the baby that the umbilical cord was attached to for those.

They're less differentiated and can thus be used for some things; but when it comes to the immune system matching is still needed, and they can work well because there's no 'learning' yet when you're replacing the immune system itself, so it 'grows up' knowing the body you implanted it in as it's own, and thus doesn't attack it.

crispyone: The evangelicals are against research with stem cells from aborted fetuses. This was done with her own stem cells. Not sure how important/neccessary previous stem cell research using fetal stem cells was for this breakthrough.


The way it seems to work is that we do research into differentiation - HOW stem cells decide to be a heart, brain, kidney, skin, liver, or whatever on fetal cells. Then we use that knowledge to figure out how to generate adult stem cells of that type and encourage the transformation into the appropriate cell line.

Basically, for most treatments it's adult cells to prevent rejection, but fetal research was 'pretty critical' to the actual development.
 
2012-06-20 08:04:43 PM  

HeFixesTheCable: LadyBelgara: namatad: forget how it gets paid for for a second. this is INSANELY AWESOME technology.
little or no rejection. building parts out of scaffolds and stems sells. dont even need a donor.
this is CRAZY AWESOME news.

jaws, eyes sockets, what's next? fingers, thumbs? noses, ears, ...
ear drums? nerve cells, spinal cords???

brave new world

This. Holy crap.

This is a trolling article. This has been done for YEARS. It's common for knee surgeries. I had the ACL of a dead guy, stripped of cells that would cause rejection (leaving connective tissues only, as I understand it), implanted into my knee to replace my destroyed one. They took a few cell samples, grew my cells, dipped the ACL in the growth, and then implanted it in my body...four years ago. This technology isn't even novel anymore. They have huge repositories of body parts that have been "sterilized", they just pick one out that matches yours, grow your cells around it, implant it, and let your body fill in the rest of the growth. I even remember seeing the "purchase order" (I don't know what the proper term is) from my orthopedic surgeon to the supplier asking for an ACL. It was eerie and cool.

The doc that did my surgery only did surgeries like this, using sterilized donated tissue. This wasn't groundbreaking at all.


In TFA they point out that this happened in 2008, so it kind of was groundbreaking at the time. Also points out that this actually was the first of it's kind.
 
2012-06-21 01:04:09 PM  

Spiralmonkey: In TFA they point out that this happened in 2008, so it kind of was groundbreaking at the time. Also points out that this actually was the first of it's kind.


Yeah, I found his original point a bit silly. Just because, say, heart transplants have been done before doesn't mean that transplanting a liver for the first time isn't 'groundbreaking'. Heck, it mentions in the article that the procedure ended up being vastly different(and better) like 3 months later.
 
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