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(The Advocate)   Kansas trying to re institute Jim Crow laws. Because 'religion'   (advocate.com) divider line 259
    More: Asinine, Jim Crow laws, Kansas, Lawrence Journal-World, faiths  
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9260 clicks; posted to Politics » on 19 Jun 2012 at 7:50 PM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-19 08:50:37 PM
Omahawg: I encourage any and all kansas farkers who find this outrageous to move on up here to Iowa. It seems ya'll have lost the fight against derp but we could sure use ya here.

4.bp.blogspot.com

Does not approve.
 
2012-06-19 08:51:43 PM
MaxxLarge: Look, you assholes...I'll make this REEEEEAL easy for you.

The First Amendment guarantees your right to have a religion.
The Second Amendment guarantees your right to have a gun.

But neither amendment gives you the right to use EITHER ONE to take away the rights of someone else.

PERIOD.


The first amendment also gives you the right to free association - you don't have to have a GOOD reason for not wanting to hang out/ do business/ or otherwise associate with someone. It's a fundamental freedom. To say you have you be forced to associate with anyone you do not wish to - and that certainly includes business relationships - is unconstitutional
 
2012-06-19 08:54:40 PM
spongeboob: lockers: spongeboob: Help me out would my man here be allowed to do what he saw as his Christian duty under this law

[www.pbs.org image 226x240]

I'll need some context smartass.

John Brown abolitionist who believed in direct action
LinkLink

During his time in Kansas he was involved int Pattawatomie Masacre Link


The laws should be applied equally. To all. Period. If at its time he should of hanged, he should of hanged. While i disagree with the law in place at the time, i will never think that it should be applied differently for whatever reason.
 
2012-06-19 08:56:13 PM
Cato: To say you have you be forced to associate with anyone you do not wish to - and that certainly includes business relationships - is unconstitutional

So laws banning hiring discrimination are unconstitutional?
 
2012-06-19 08:56:16 PM
fusillade762: While everyone's bashing Kansas, they're not quite the only state where you can be fired for being gay:

[cdn.front.moveon.org image 600x403]


To be fair, most of those states allow firing without stated cause, period. So technically you can fire anyone for whatever, just so long as you don't make any statements to the effect of it being because they're a minority, etc.

Honestly, most people do fire without cause because, frankly, the civil rights act has led to a farkton of frivolous lawsuits in addition to legit ones.

//The problem with just adding "sexual orientation" to the protected class list is that it'll just cause people to move on to some other petty bullshiat criteria to fire people. I'd say we should just amend it to "any reason not related to work performance" but that would cause trouble too (especially since it'd outlaw drug testing, a lot of people'd lose a lot of money over that).
 
2012-06-19 08:59:26 PM
This country wants to fail. There's no other reason to behave this way. It's become so preoccupied with what legal channels it has to fark itself over that it completely forgot that it shouldn't be trying to fark itself over.
 
2012-06-19 08:59:27 PM
lockers: spongeboob: lockers: spongeboob: Help me out would my man here be allowed to do what he saw as his Christian duty under this law

[www.pbs.org image 226x240]

I'll need some context smartass.

John Brown abolitionist who believed in direct action
LinkLink

During his time in Kansas he was involved int Pattawatomie Masacre Link

The laws should be applied equally. To all. Period. If at its time he should of hanged, he should of hanged. While i disagree with the law in place at the time, i will never think that it should be applied differently for whatever reason.


And to explain further, if the issue was homosexuals are okay to be slaves, i would have hung with him despite being straight. So this is false equivalency.
 
2012-06-19 09:00:45 PM
This sort of thing always makes me thing of my husband's cousin who's a serious evangelical type. Her wedding was all about "woman submits to the man," doesn't use birth control, etc. She constantly claims her religious rights are being violated.

Law requiring employers to provide free birth control with health insurance violates her religious rights.
Employers choosing to provide free birth control with health insurance violates her religious rights.
The existence of pornography violates her religious rights.
People having sex that involves bondage violates her religious rights.

I don't understand why these religious types are always getting all worked up by things that don't actually affect them.
 
2012-06-19 09:01:20 PM
deschinc: Omahawg: I encourage any and all kansas farkers who find this outrageous to move on up here to Iowa. It seems ya'll have lost the fight against derp but we could sure use ya here.

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 320x286]

Does not approve.


oy...i know. i'm so glad he's no longer my rep and sure hope christie can beat him back to derpville. the northwest extremists are bleeding population fast though so I do congratulate him on the increasing marginalization of that part of our otherwise fine state.
 
2012-06-19 09:01:32 PM
And just how much enthusiasm will Kansans have for this law when a Muslim landlord evicts their Christian tenant?
 
2012-06-19 09:01:56 PM
Phins: I don't understand why these religious types are always getting all worked up by things that don't actually affect them.

That's the definition of a religious belief system.
 
2012-06-19 09:02:43 PM
Phins: Employers choosing to provide free birth control with health insurance violates her religious rights.

I'd love to hear her try to explain that.
 
2012-06-19 09:04:26 PM
We really just need a Supreme Court case that establishes sexual orientation as a protected class. Lawrence v. Texas started the ball rolling, and even the more conservative Justices seem to be okay with saying you can't discriminate against people for who they do. I may be overly optimistic, but I think within the next 5-10 years it'll be established as a protected class and all these state and local asshats can go fark themselves (NTTAWWT, since people should be able to fark whomever they want, provided consent).
 
2012-06-19 09:06:17 PM
Cato: MaxxLarge: Look, you assholes...I'll make this REEEEEAL easy for you.

The First Amendment guarantees your right to have a religion.
The Second Amendment guarantees your right to have a gun.

But neither amendment gives you the right to use EITHER ONE to take away the rights of someone else.

PERIOD.

The first amendment also gives you the right to free association - you don't have to have a GOOD reason for not wanting to hang out/ do business/ or otherwise associate with someone. It's a fundamental freedom. To say you have you be forced to associate with anyone you do not wish to - and that certainly includes business relationships - is unconstitutional


The courts don't agree with you on that. And the Constitution says what the courts say it says - and nothing else.
 
2012-06-19 09:07:09 PM
nmrsnr: I may be overly optimistic, but I think within the next 5-10 years it'll be established as a protected class and all these state and local asshats can go fark themselves

That's very optimistic. Five of the nine current justices are GOP shills, and if Romney wins, it isn't going to get any better.
 
2012-06-19 09:07:26 PM
Omahawg: deschinc: Omahawg: I encourage any and all kansas farkers who find this outrageous to move on up here to Iowa. It seems ya'll have lost the fight against derp but we could sure use ya here.

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 320x286]

Does not approve.

oy...i know. i'm so glad he's no longer my rep and sure hope christie can beat him back to derpville. the northwest extremists are bleeding population fast though so I do congratulate him on the increasing marginalization of that part of our otherwise fine state.


Luckily I live in the People's Republic of Johnson County :)
 
2012-06-19 09:08:37 PM
The Name: nmrsnr: I may be overly optimistic, but I think within the next 5-10 years it'll be established as a protected class and all these state and local asshats can go fark themselves

That's very optimistic. Five of the nine current justices are GOP shills, and if Romney wins, it isn't going to get any better.


My biggest fear.
 
2012-06-19 09:12:04 PM
LasersHurt: Hey, guys, remember THE PAST? Good, because we're going back!


Obama's been there he has a time machine... seems to have to use it a lot to fix the past..
 
2012-06-19 09:16:32 PM
Phins: Her wedding was all about "woman submits to the man,"

Phins: People having sex that involves bondage violates her religious rights.

She sounds like a hypocrite.
 
2012-06-19 09:16:53 PM
LouDobbsAwaaaay: This country wants to fail. There's no other reason to behave this way. It's become so preoccupied with what legal channels it has to fark itself over that it completely forgot that it shouldn't be trying to fark itself over.

But but but ... American Exceptionalism!
 
2012-06-19 09:18:32 PM
hourheroyes: LouDobbsAwaaaay: This country wants to fail. There's no other reason to behave this way. It's become so preoccupied with what legal channels it has to fark itself over that it completely forgot that it shouldn't be trying to fark itself over.

But but but ... American Exceptionalism!


The dodo bird is a warning, but the majority of our country think it's a role model.
 
2012-06-19 09:27:49 PM
Virulency: LasersHurt: Hey, guys, remember THE PAST? Good, because we're going back!


Obama's been there he has a time machine... seems to have to use it a lot to fix the past..


Let me borrow it, I'll fix it better than he did.
 
2012-06-19 09:29:20 PM
Kome: Phins: Her wedding was all about "woman submits to the man,"

Phins: People having sex that involves bondage violates her religious rights.

She sounds like a hypocrite.


Maybe she is only against males being bound and at the mercy of the woman. Or she could be worried about sex that doesn't lead to procreation, oral, manual, anal, because if there isn't a possibilty of prenancy God frowns on it. She just knows that her husband might slip in her backdoor if she can't stop him, but wait if she is supposed to submit to her husband does that mean that she does oral when her husband ask for it or does her Bible say that is a no no and that trumps her husbands position as head of the household.

/When the wife and I got our premarriage counseling the preacher told us a couple of stories, the first was about a husband who had trouble getting it up and his wife helped him out with this by "kissing his penis" he said this was not only okay it was a sign that the wife loved her husband. The second story was about a couple who approached him about whether anal sex was allowed, he said he went through the whole Bible but couldn't find any place anal sex between a married couple was forbidden.
//No he didn't use names when he told us the stories so I am not sure that my inlaws weren't one of the couples
///Yeah I know CSB
 
2012-06-19 09:30:14 PM
Reminds me of Shirley Jackson's "The Lottery". People who support this crap are like the woman in the story, until they come up with the short straw. (In this case, having an employer or other person in power who doesn't agree with their religion.)
 
2012-06-19 09:30:46 PM
spongeboob: /When the wife and I got our premarriage counseling the preacher told us a couple of stories, the first was about a husband who had trouble getting it up and his wife helped him out with this by "kissing his penis" he said this was not only okay it was a sign that the wife loved her husband. The second story was about a couple who approached him about whether anal sex was allowed, he said he went through the whole Bible but couldn't find any place anal sex between a married couple was forbidden.
//No he didn't use names when he told us the stories so I am not sure that my inlaws weren't one of the couples
///Yeah I know CSB


Actually, that is kind of cool. I chuckled sincerely.
 
2012-06-19 09:32:59 PM
lockers: spongeboob: lockers: spongeboob: Help me out would my man here be allowed to do what he saw as his Christian duty under this law

[www.pbs.org image 226x240]

I'll need some context smartass.

John Brown abolitionist who believed in direct action
LinkLink

During his time in Kansas he was involved int Pattawatomie Masacre Link

The laws should be applied equally. To all. Period. If at its time he should of hanged, he should of hanged. While i disagree with the law in place at the time, i will never think that it should be applied differently for whatever reason.


I am saying where does the right to say my religion requires this end. If someone's religion causes them to fire a gay person, what about someone who thinks they need to kill homosexuals to save them from hell, is that protected too.
 
2012-06-19 09:34:09 PM
Kome: F*CK RELIGION GODDAMMIT! YOUR RELIGIOUS FREEDOMS DO NOT TRUMP THE FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS OF PEOPLE WHO ONLY WANT TO BE TREATED AS EQUALS YOU STUPID MOTHER F*CKERS!!

touché
 
2012-06-19 09:39:25 PM
deschinc: Omahawg: deschinc: Omahawg: I encourage any and all kansas farkers who find this outrageous to move on up here to Iowa. It seems ya'll have lost the fight against derp but we could sure use ya here.

[4.bp.blogspot.com image 320x286]

Does not approve.

oy...i know. i'm so glad he's no longer my rep and sure hope christie can beat him back to derpville. the northwest extremists are bleeding population fast though so I do congratulate him on the increasing marginalization of that part of our otherwise fine state.

Luckily I live in the People's Republic of Johnson County :)


I used to a long time ago but that's a hard ass place to try and live when you're working all night at the gilbert st country kitchen.
 
2012-06-19 09:47:58 PM
So... as an atheist does this mean I could move to Kansas and legally discriminate against Christians now? Not that I'd want to, because I'm not the kind of douche that is so insecure in his religious beliefs that I feel the need to try and force everyone else to live according to my own beliefs.......... but if it made the point and got the law changed I think someone should do exactly that. Or an Islamic business owner to do the same thing.

I have a sneaky suspicion that these same lawmakers aren't interested in the freedom of religious people to discriminate against others...... just for "christians" to do so.
 
2012-06-19 09:48:03 PM
Who wants to bet they'll repeal this law as soon as they realize it applies to non-Christians?

I mean, as soon as a Muslim boss decides all his female employers must wear burkas, or a Scientologist boss decides to fire everyone who's ever been to a shrink, or...
 
2012-06-19 09:50:48 PM
MrEricSir: Who wants to bet they'll repeal this law as soon as they realize it applies to non-Christians?

I mean, as soon as a Muslim boss decides all his female employers must wear burkas, or a Scientologist boss decides to fire everyone who's ever been to a shrink, or...


They've already banned Shariah, haven't they? Just need to nip a few more in the bud, and it's smooth sailing for the Greater Christian Christocracy.
 
2012-06-19 09:51:22 PM
My religion does not recognize taxation.

Therefore, I'm free to refuse payment of taxes to the state of Kansas and all subsidiary localities.
 
2012-06-19 09:52:35 PM
Wangiss: Kome: F*CK RELIGION GODDAMMIT! YOUR RELIGIOUS FREEDOMS DO NOT TRUMP THE FREEDOMS AND RIGHTS OF PEOPLE WHO ONLY WANT TO BE TREATED AS EQUALS YOU STUPID MOTHER F*CKERS!!

touché


Meh, the thread was lacking emotional indignation. Felt it could use a boost.
 
2012-06-19 09:55:39 PM
MrEricSir: Who wants to bet they'll repeal this law as soon as they realize it applies to non-Christians?

I mean, as soon as a Muslim boss decides all his female employers must wear burkas, or a Scientologist boss decides to fire everyone who's ever been to a shrink, or...


You mean the way that the rules allowing Christian clubs were used to allow the formation of gay straight alliances. I think there were some schools that got rid of all clubs to keep the gays out. Here is one Link
 
2012-06-19 09:56:30 PM
LasersHurt: Hey, guys, remember THE PAST? Good, because we're going back!

To pass the shiatty laws that suck ass?
 
2012-06-19 10:05:24 PM
Hagbardr: To pass the shiatty laws that suck ass?

We'd rather have a buffalo take a diarrhoea dump in our ears than see these laws passed.

/Now I have that song stuck in my head.
 
2012-06-19 10:10:37 PM
okay does this qualify Kansas for a fark tag?

Seriously i have little doubt this will be struck down in court in due time.
 
2012-06-19 10:10:40 PM
The question is personal belief as far as religion

Makes sense to me. Wait, no it doesn't. On the other hand, f*ck you, Kansas.
 
2012-06-19 10:17:28 PM
tomWright: [ecx.images-amazon.com image 300x300]

He has a great column in the current issue of Harpers about all the other crazy stuff Kansas politicians have recently been up to.
 
2012-06-19 10:30:50 PM
hourheroyes: meat0918: Lionel Mandrake: A message for Evangelicals from The Big Guy:



[skepchick.org image 222x150]
YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG

Kansas is why God is punishing America.

Remember that whole "Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

Yeah, a whole lot of Christians are headed for Hell.

I like how you defend true Christianity by invoking eternal torture of people you disagree with.


It's what is written in their book of fairy tales.
 
2012-06-19 10:33:26 PM
HellRaisingHoosier: Quasar: "I don't think an ordinance should trump other people's religious rights," said Rep. Jan Pauls, a Democrat on the Judiciary Committee that heard testimony about the bill. During a forum earlier this year, Pauls gave an example to explain why she backs the bill, saying an employer should be allowed to fire a "cross dresser."

That sounds reasonable. Why should my religious rights be trampled by your sheer audacity to exist as you are?


How does that sound reasonable?

I worked with a man that was a cross-dresser. He dressed very tastefully and had much better fashion sense then most people I know. He was a cool guy to chat with, very smart, and wouldn't bring it up unless you questioned him about it.

He has two children, a college degree and was a very nice guy. Why should he lose his job? Just because he doesn't dress the way a lot of people dress? Are we Americans so against individuality that we think it's acceptable to fire someone over that?

You know, this is not the freedom loving country I was told it was while growing up.....


I'm pretty sure Quasar was being sarcastic.
 
2012-06-19 10:35:11 PM
I predict the constitutional lawyers are going to rack up a butt-load of fees on this case.

Sorry, bad euphemism.
 
2012-06-19 10:35:34 PM
kg2095: hourheroyes: meat0918: Lionel Mandrake: A message for Evangelicals from The Big Guy:



[skepchick.org image 222x150]
YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG

Kansas is why God is punishing America.

Remember that whole "Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me."

Yeah, a whole lot of Christians are headed for Hell.

I like how you defend true Christianity by invoking eternal torture of people you disagree with.

It's what is written in their book of fairy tales.


DRINK
 
2012-06-19 10:39:08 PM
The Name: LasersHurt: Hey, guys, remember THE PAST? Good, because we're going back!

This isn't even a joke. Twenty or thirty years from now, we're going to be fighting the exact same battles we fought in the 1960s (or the 1930s vis-a-vis labor rights), and it will likely only be more violent and divisive. Look what's going on with labor in Wisconsin, voting rights in Florida, gay rights in Kansas, immigr . . . well, just about everything in Arizona.

And now, with Citizens United, the possibility of a peaceful pendulum swing or even finding an equilibrium are quite remote. Americans are going to have to forcibly take back with is rightfully theirs (which they admittedly handed over by voting stupidly in the first place), and it's not going to be pretty.

We are living in interesting times, my friends.


I don't think so. These dinosaurs are on the way out and they know it. That's why they are making so much noise - they're struggling against reality.

With each passing year there are less of them and thirty years from now the last of them will have succumbed to old age.
 
2012-06-19 10:47:33 PM
Jim_Callahan: //The problem with just adding "sexual orientation" to the protected class list is that it'll just cause people to move on to some other petty bullshiat criteria to fire people. I'd say we should just amend it to "any reason not related to work performance" but that would cause trouble too (especially since it'd outlaw drug testing, a lot of people'd lose a lot of money over that).

Wait... was that supposed to a bad thing?
 
2012-06-19 10:59:14 PM
spongeboob: Kome: Phins: Her wedding was all about "woman submits to the man,"

Phins: People having sex that involves bondage violates her religious rights.

She sounds like a hypocrite.

Maybe she is only against males being bound and at the mercy of the woman. Or she could be worried about sex that doesn't lead to procreation, oral, manual, anal, because if there isn't a possibilty of prenancy God frowns on it. She just knows that her husband might slip in her backdoor if she can't stop him, but wait if she is supposed to submit to her husband does that mean that she does oral when her husband ask for it or does her Bible say that is a no no and that trumps her husbands position as head of the household.

/When the wife and I got our premarriage counseling the preacher told us a couple of stories, the first was about a husband who had trouble getting it up and his wife helped him out with this by "kissing his penis" he said this was not only okay it was a sign that the wife loved her husband. The second story was about a couple who approached him about whether anal sex was allowed, he said he went through the whole Bible but couldn't find any place anal sex between a married couple was forbidden.
//No he didn't use names when he told us the stories so I am not sure that my inlaws weren't one of the couples
///Yeah I know CSB


Maybe, but surely she should only worry about her own adherence to the rules of her religion. What other people do is none of her business.
 
2012-06-19 11:00:49 PM
kg2095: The Name: LasersHurt: Hey, guys, remember THE PAST? Good, because we're going back!

This isn't even a joke. Twenty or thirty years from now, we're going to be fighting the exact same battles we fought in the 1960s (or the 1930s vis-a-vis labor rights), and it will likely only be more violent and divisive. Look what's going on with labor in Wisconsin, voting rights in Florida, gay rights in Kansas, immigr . . . well, just about everything in Arizona.

And now, with Citizens United, the possibility of a peaceful pendulum swing or even finding an equilibrium are quite remote. Americans are going to have to forcibly take back with is rightfully theirs (which they admittedly handed over by voting stupidly in the first place), and it's not going to be pretty.

We are living in interesting times, my friends.

I don't think so. These dinosaurs are on the way out and they know it. That's why they are making so much noise - they're struggling against reality.

With each passing year there are less of them and thirty years from now the last of them will have succumbed to old age.


if wish you were right but look at the young ron paul pseudo-libertarians, evangelical youth pastors who have wives with clown car vaginas and don't believe in evolution, and the otherwise mass of uninformed youth who pay more attention to angry birds and celebrity gossip than their future.

yeah...the derp is growing and spreading and must be stomped out with the great light of rationality. or, you know, a two by four.

extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice indeed, barry.
 
2012-06-19 11:06:05 PM
Is this a repost of an Onion article?
 
2012-06-19 11:06:06 PM
Omahawg: kg2095: The Name: LasersHurt: Hey, guys, remember THE PAST? Good, because we're going back!

This isn't even a joke. Twenty or thirty years from now, we're going to be fighting the exact same battles we fought in the 1960s (or the 1930s vis-a-vis labor rights), and it will likely only be more violent and divisive. Look what's going on with labor in Wisconsin, voting rights in Florida, gay rights in Kansas, immigr . . . well, just about everything in Arizona.

And now, with Citizens United, the possibility of a peaceful pendulum swing or even finding an equilibrium are quite remote. Americans are going to have to forcibly take back with is rightfully theirs (which they admittedly handed over by voting stupidly in the first place), and it's not going to be pretty.

We are living in interesting times, my friends.

I don't think so. These dinosaurs are on the way out and they know it. That's why they are making so much noise - they're struggling against reality.

With each passing year there are less of them and thirty years from now the last of them will have succumbed to old age.

if wish you were right but look at the young ron paul pseudo-libertarians, evangelical youth pastors who have wives with clown car vaginas and don't believe in evolution, and the otherwise mass of uninformed youth who pay more attention to angry birds and celebrity gossip than their future.

yeah...the derp is growing and spreading and must be stomped out with the great light of rationality. or, you know, a two by four.

extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice indeed, barry.


Even Barry G. wouldn't buy into this one.
 
2012-06-19 11:08:17 PM
nope.

ozmud.files.wordpress.com
 
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