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(Huffington Post)   Early polls show 64% of Americans support the President's decision on immigration, though experts expect that number to be death panelled down to about 45%   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 372
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3077 clicks; posted to Politics » on 19 Jun 2012 at 1:58 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-19 10:14:25 AM
The Bloomberg article that this references says that the immigration would be for people without criminal records.

Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.
 
2012-06-19 10:30:34 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.

Undocumented immigrants who came to the United States under the age of 16 and have lived in the country for at least five years can apply for the relief, so long as they are under the age of 30, according to a memo from DHS. They also must be either an honorably discharged veteran of the Coast Guard or armed forces, or a student who has graduated from high school or obtained a GED. Immigrants will not be eligible if they "pose a threat to national security or public safety," including having been convicted of a felony, a "significant" misdemeanor or multiple misdemeanors.


Because saying that would be inaccurate and would put the bar higher than it is, given how many trivial acts are misdemeanors. A bright line simply isn't realistic.

Battery, assault, petit larceny, driving 120 in a 55, DUI, hit and run, etc are all certainly "significant misdemeanors." Failing to come to a complete stop at an empty intersection, while a misdemeanor, is not a "significant misdemeanor."
 
2012-06-19 10:31:18 AM
Yep, Fartbongo said only illegals who are in prison with felony convictions for murder will be eligible.

And they would be released immediately.
 
2012-06-19 10:34:32 AM
Stupided in the boobies

/whatever it is, I'M AGAINST IT
 
2012-06-19 10:35:29 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: The Bloomberg article that this references says that the immigration would be for people without criminal records.

Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.


Why are you lying here in this thread? As kronicfeld quoted President Obama after your post, you were completely wrong with that silly claim.

Or did you just get your "facts" from Fox News again?
 
2012-06-19 10:40:25 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.


What Obama said, as in the words that came out of his mouth in the Rose Garden when announcing the new enforcement policy, did not specify the criteria. However, it is explained on the DHS website if you're so inclined to look.
 
2012-06-19 10:40:54 AM
Honestly, it is a pretty crappy half-assed measure that is a fairly blatant vote getting mechanism.

It's also an idea that basically every realistic immigration proposal included or went beyond and is a common sense measure.

It's also something the GOP has proposed and publicly supported. Of course they're opposing it. I don't think they've figured out yet though that having Mitt constantly dodge it means it's going to be brought up again and and again, putting them in a negative light every time.
 
2012-06-19 10:42:14 AM

kronicfeld: Failing to come to a complete stop at an empty intersection, while a misdemeanor, is not a "significant misdemeanor."


IANAL, but isn't that generally considered a civil offense and not a misdemeanor?
 
2012-06-19 10:51:04 AM

Happy Hours: IANAL, but isn't that generally considered a civil offense and not a misdemeanor?


In California (and other states too, I'm sure) most traffic violations are considered infractions. The more serious ones like DUI, running from the cops, or drag racing are misdemeanors.
 
2012-06-19 10:58:18 AM

AirForceVet: tenpoundsofcheese: The Bloomberg article that this references says that the immigration would be for people without criminal records.

Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.

Why are you lying here in this thread? As kronicfeld quoted President Obama after your post, you were completely wrong with that silly claim.



Wut. kronicfeld confirmed what I said. You can be convicted of a misdemeanor. Where is the description of what is "significant" or is that up to interpretation?
 
2012-06-19 10:59:12 AM

Happy Hours: kronicfeld: Failing to come to a complete stop at an empty intersection, while a misdemeanor, is not a "significant misdemeanor."

IANAL, but isn't that generally considered a civil offense and not a misdemeanor?


Yes. Kronicfeld doesn't know what he is talking about.
 
2012-06-19 11:03:06 AM

AirForceVet: tenpoundsofcheese: The Bloomberg article that this references says that the immigration would be for people without criminal records.

Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.

Why are you lying here in this thread? As kronicfeld quoted President Obama after your post, you were completely wrong with that silly claim.

Or did you just get your "facts" from Fox News again?


In Wisconsin, a Class C misdemeanor can result in jail time of 30 days. Repeat offenders can have jail time for 2 years.

So that is hardly failing to come to a complete stop.

Care to try again?
 
2012-06-19 11:08:07 AM

Happy Hours: IANAL, but isn't that generally considered a civil offense and not a misdemeanor?


Depends on how it's charged. Plenty of cops will charge it as a reckless.
 
2012-06-19 11:09:52 AM
Wouldn't a serious misdmeanor be the higher or highest degree of misdmeanor in the state or Federal court system?

Example in Pennsylvania there are three classes of misdemeanors. I would assume that the other states have similar statutes.
Link

By the way if a majority of people support Obama's action does that mean he is poll driven? How does the GOP spin that without admitting that the majority of America agrees with his position?
 
2012-06-19 11:11:14 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: Yes. Kronicfeld doesn't know what he is talking about.


In Virginia, failure to use one's turn signals is reckless driving, and is punishable as a class 1 misdemeanor. Clearly, a deportable offense.
 
2012-06-19 11:12:54 AM

spongeboob: Wouldn't a serious misdmeanor be the higher or highest degree of misdmeanor in the state or Federal court system?

Example in Pennsylvania there are three classes of misdemeanors. I would assume that the other states have similar statutes.
Link

By the way if a majority of people support Obama's action does that mean he is poll driven? How does the GOP spin that without admitting that the majority of America agrees with his position?


Like with the Gay Marriage thing they'll say he's doing it because it's popular without realizing they've admitted to being out of step with the American people.
 
2012-06-19 11:15:50 AM
Given how lockstep the GOP usually is, the fact that only 56% oppose the idea doesn't bode well for the party's chances on coming out on top with this issue.
 
2012-06-19 11:17:20 AM
The GOP basically can't side with anything Mr. Obama does. It's 'we're the opposite of everything' with those people.

And they are winning, because people in our country are too stupid to think critically about anything, so they vote with their obese guts.
 
2012-06-19 11:17:32 AM
None of those people polled are on my fb. There have been so many obnoxious responses to this - I don't have the time to address them all.

Someone actually implied that the reason why I was unemployed was because of illegal immigration. Because illegal immigrants have flooded the white collar labor market.
 
2012-06-19 11:18:31 AM
Perfect troll followup, shifting the topic from criminal record to "significance" of the misdemeanor.

Go get 'em, cowboy.
 
2012-06-19 11:20:51 AM

kronicfeld: tenpoundsofcheese: Yes. Kronicfeld doesn't know what he is talking about.

In Virginia, failure to use one's turn signals is reckless driving, and is punishable as a class 1 misdemeanor. Clearly, a deportable offense.


No. You are lying. Failure to use a turn signal is failure to use a turn signal.

The judge can decide if it your actions were reckless driving and decide if it is Class 1, 2 or 3. Or even if a charge is a felony. Or even if a felony charge can be negotiated down to a misdemeanor.

So Bloomberg lied in the article when they said no criminal record since even a Class C misdemeanor can result in 30 days of jail.
 
2012-06-19 11:21:58 AM
All speeding violations in Utah are Class C misdemeanors. I'd say 50 in a 45 would not be a "significant misdemeanor".
 
2012-06-19 11:22:38 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: So Bloomberg lied in the article when they said no criminal record since even a Class C misdemeanor can result in 30 days of jail.


But not necessarily.

Regardless, how does it feel to be a minority in America for once?
 
2012-06-19 11:25:04 AM
The only thing people care about when it comes to Wisconsin is the Packers.
 
2012-06-19 11:31:55 AM

Aarontology: The only thing people care about when it comes to Wisconsin is the Packers.


I like cheese.
 
2012-06-19 11:34:43 AM
It doesn't do enough. Not that I can blame Obama for that. It was a republican plan until Barrack played his fartbongo to the same sheet of music and now it is apparently the worst thing ever.
 
2012-06-19 11:35:37 AM

violentsalvation: It doesn't do enough.


Of course it doesn't do enough. Obama admits as much. He never said that was the whole solution. It's a temporary stopgap measure until such a time as the Congress pulls its head out of its ass.
 
2012-06-19 11:39:37 AM

Three Crooked Squirrels: I like cheese.


OK, the Packers and cheese.

violentsalvation: It was a republican plan until Barrack played his fartbongo to the same sheet of music and now it is apparently the worst thing ever.


That's a fairly decent summary of the Obama presidency in general.
 
2012-06-19 11:48:04 AM

cameroncrazy1984: tenpoundsofcheese: So Bloomberg lied in the article when they said no criminal record since even a Class C misdemeanor can result in 30 days of jail.

But not necessarily.

Regardless, how does it feel to be a minority in America for once?


wut? why are you assuming I am a minority?

or are you attempting to ask how does it feel to have an opinion shared by a minority of individuals?

What are you trying to say?
 
2012-06-19 11:50:53 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: wut? why are you assuming I am a minority?

or are you attempting to ask how does it feel to have an opinion shared by a minority of individuals?


What else could I have meant by that? I guess to be a conservative you have to avoid context at all cost.
 
2012-06-19 11:58:35 AM

cameroncrazy1984: tenpoundsofcheese: wut? why are you assuming I am a minority?

or are you attempting to ask how does it feel to have an opinion shared by a minority of individuals?

What else could I have meant by that? I guess to be a conservative you have to avoid context at all cost.


I don't know, you seem to change your mind a lot when confronted with facts so I thought it would be good to get you to be specific.

First off, I think 0bama is generally right. We should allow anyone who wants to come into the country to do so. That will help drive down the labor costs and have the US be more competitive. I disagree that people with criminal records should be included, but hey, maybe they will be willing to work even cheaper.

Secondly, I don't really care whether or not my opinion is shared by a majority or a minority of people. I don't know why liberals have such a need to point at people and say "hah, that person has views that aren't shared by the majority". Sounds really lame and someone big brotherish.

I brought this topic up because I wondered whether or not this "detail" was included in the question. I doubt it since even the Bloomberg article got it wrong.
 
2012-06-19 12:10:02 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: I disagree that people with criminal records should be included


You keep saying this, hoping that we'll agree that people with class C misdemeanors are criminals, when it's been shown many times in this thread that minor traffic infractions can be considered class C misdemeanors.

I don't know about you, but I don't think that driving without using your turn signal should be a deport-able offense.

But keep yammering on about "criminal records" and maybe you can get the rest of the country to be afraid of these guys who are running around committing minor traffic offenses.
 
2012-06-19 12:12:56 PM
Also, tpoc you better not vote for Romney, because he won't say whether he'll repeal the same order that you say will allow criminals to stay in the country. And neither has Gary Johnson.

I guess you better stay home.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-06-19 12:56:09 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: The Bloomberg article that this references says that the immigration would be for people without criminal records.

Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.


That is what he said. Maybe they didn't report it over at World Nut Daily?
 
2012-06-19 12:56:49 PM
I guess tpoc doesn't have a rebuttal for that.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-06-19 01:04:50 PM
If I remember correctly, to be deported requires being convicted of a crime that carries a sentience of 1 year or more, or an aggravated felony.

Link
 
2012-06-19 01:41:35 PM

Aarontology: Three Crooked Squirrels: I like cheese.

OK, the Packers and cheese.


Bratwurst and Leinenkugel's are nice.
 
2012-06-19 01:42:10 PM

kronicfeld: Failing to come to a complete stop at an empty intersection, while a misdemeanor, is not a "significant misdemeanor."


That's not a misdemeanor, its an infraction.
 
2012-06-19 01:49:14 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Also, tpoc you better not vote for Romney, because he won't say whether he'll repeal the same order that you say will allow criminals to stay in the country. And neither has Gary Johnson.

I guess you better stay home.


Eventually you are going to change his mind and he will come to see the error of his ways.
 
2012-06-19 02:01:41 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: The Bloomberg article that this references says that the immigration would be for people without criminal records.

Too bad that is not what 0bama said, so I wonder how accurate this survey is.


Republicans: Who needs facts, we make up our own.

/Vote Republican
 
2012-06-19 02:02:07 PM

FloydA: Bratwurst and Leinenkugel's are nice.


Leinenkugel gives me nasty farts
 
2012-06-19 02:02:23 PM

Petit_Merdeux: Yep, Fartbongo said only illegals who are in prison with felony convictions for murder will be eligible.

And they would be released immediately.


And given food stamps and Cadillacs and told to go sell drugs and kill whites.
 
2012-06-19 02:02:50 PM
Not a bad idea. However arbitrarily not enforcing existing laws on a presidential whim is not the way to go about it.

Sounds good when you agree with the law being mandated not being enforced but what happens when it is a president you disagree with?

Bad path to start down...
 
2012-06-19 02:03:04 PM
Death Panel Van would be a pretty good band name
 
2012-06-19 02:03:31 PM

vpb: If I remember correctly, to be deported requires being convicted of a crime that carries a sentience of 1 year or more, or an aggravated felony.

Link


Sentience is overrated. ROMNEY 2012.
 
2012-06-19 02:04:00 PM

FloydA: Aarontology: Three Crooked Squirrels: I like cheese.

OK, the Packers and cheese.


Bratwurst and Leinenkugel's are nice.


Both Johnsonville and Leinenkugel's (i.e. Miller-Coors) supported Walker.
 
2012-06-19 02:04:22 PM
Completely boring thread. I give it two thumbs down.
 
2012-06-19 02:05:29 PM
Executive orders are awesome when my team uses them and a travesty of justice when the other team uses them.
 
2012-06-19 02:05:56 PM
From the article:

"The scope of the directive largely mirrored that of the Dream Act, a version of which failed in the Senate in December 2010"

So President Obama has decided he can pass laws now without Congress?

While I don't have a problem with this particular issue, we have three branches of government for a reason.
 
2012-06-19 02:06:43 PM

PowerSlacker: Executive orders are awesome when my team uses them and a travesty of justice when the other team uses them.


there was no executive order, hth
 
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