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(ABC)   Cool: Bank error lets man withdraw almost $1.5 million from his bank account which had a $300 balance. Dumbass: he promptly gambled it all away at local casinos   (abcnews.go.com) divider line 37
    More: Sad, custodial sentence, Detroit, U.S. Attorney  
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14573 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Jun 2012 at 11:30 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-19 10:05:26 AM
7 votes:
I'd have donated as much money as I could to every PAC and SuperPAC and lobbyist I could find. Watching the bank go after those political organizations to get their money back would be worth doing the 15 months in jail...
2012-06-19 10:23:25 AM
5 votes:
Instead of this:

unhindered.com

He'll get this:

lyontheeves.com
2012-06-20 09:54:01 AM
2 votes:

mauricecano: violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?

So under that logic then we remove all theft from the books and no more larceny right? Because your car/house should have been locked, how is your family supposed to trust you with their stuff if you don't lock your car or home? It's your fault someone decided to break the law and take it right?


Believe it or not, most of the time theft involves breaking in when the doors are locked.

If you leave your iPod in an unlocked car, you deserve to have it taken.
2012-06-19 11:43:26 AM
2 votes:
Step 1: Withdraw $1.5MM from B of A
Step 2: Convert to Judaism
Step 3: Flee to Israel
Step 4: Laugh at B of A

/Doing this right?
2012-06-19 11:35:11 AM
2 votes:

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: What's a balanace?


Its a furnace fueled by sheep.
2012-06-19 09:56:21 AM
2 votes:
i'm sure there's some law that says otherwise, but feel that if the bank made the mistake, then they are responsible for that money. this statement is not swayed at all by how much i think BofA should die in a fire.
2012-06-19 09:45:45 AM
2 votes:
A Detroit man is facing 15 months in prison after he was able to withdraw unlimited ATM cash from his Bank of America account that only held a few dollars.

Aww, what a tragedy. It couldnt've happened to a nicer bank.

I'm not saying what he did was right, but I can't say I'm sad to see BoA get farked by one of their customers rather than the other way around.
2012-06-20 12:00:02 PM
1 votes:

MycroftHolmes: If it was 1.5 million yes. If it was $20, then it should be treated the same as theft of $20 should be treated.

Keep in mind, I am talking about willfully and knowingly keeping money that was given to you in error. I am not for applying criminal punishments to honest mistakes. By keeping money that is not yours that was given to you in error, you are committing theft. The law is clear on this.


Citation needed.
2012-06-20 11:30:32 AM
1 votes:

Electromax: To claim that the bank should have to "eat it" is to me saying that a homeowner should have to "eat it" if they screw up and leave their front door unlocked, it doesn't take into account intent or understanding from the "stealer". How is your rhetorical question any less false than mine? I think they're all variations on a similar scenario. He didn't punch in $100 and the ATM gave him $1000, he realized there was an error and exploited it. If you went back and bought 10 more of the $15 things for $13, i think this would be a better example. Just my .02 though.


The homeowner does generally eat it. If a guy breaks into your house, steals your tv, pawns it and buys crack, you don't get your money back. The cops don't give you the crack and let you sell the crack to recoop your loss.

If you have home insurance that covers theft, then you may get reimbursed. The bank should be paying for insurance to cover errors that they placed in their software and systems. Or they should just not skimp out on bad software/employees.
2012-06-20 11:25:53 AM
1 votes:

Electromax: Bullseyed: Electromax: violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?

You could apply this to anything, though. You could say the same about someone robbing your house if you forgot to lock a window, or a hospital getting drugs stolen because someone ran into an emergency room that wasn't properly secured. I'm no friend to banks but this is probably less BOA's fault and more "some poor sucker in their huge company infrastructure". There's plenty of precedent for this sort of thing. "Our CEO ran off with illegitimate funds from our account, but it's our fault for hiring him." Not usually how it works.

That said, the guy could've handled this in a few different ways and been a lot better off.

Wow. I haven't seen that much false equivalency in one place in quite some time.

Here is an accurate comparison. If you go buy a shirt at the store and the price tag says $15 but it rings up for $13 at the register, did you steal $2?

I don't think it's THAT much of a false equivalency... the essence of it is whether the party that made the mistake is at fault, which would apply to the bank in this case, the store in your example, or the homeowner/hospital in mine. There's plenty of precedent including this very article that the bank is legally able to demand money back, just as the homeowner/hospital has legal recourse for theft.

Dunno about your example but I know Amazon cancels orders when they misprice things... I personally wouldn't say you stole $2 but according to this:
http://money.aol.co.uk/2012/03/14/tesco-misprices-ipad-but-no-bargain s /
"The law says that if something is mispriced ...


Legally able doesn't equal ethically or morally correct. We have many bad laws on the books. You can talk to the Founding Fathers about ethical and moral objections to unjust laws.
2012-06-20 11:24:40 AM
1 votes:

MycroftHolmes: MycroftHolmes: Bullseyed: Electromax: violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?

You could apply this to anything, though. You could say the same about someone robbing your house if you forgot to lock a window, or a hospital getting drugs stolen because someone ran into an emergency room that wasn't properly secured. I'm no friend to banks but this is probably less BOA's fault and more "some poor sucker in their huge company infrastructure". There's plenty of precedent for this sort of thing. "Our CEO ran off with illegitimate funds from our account, but it's our fault for hiring him." Not usually how it works.

That said, the guy could've handled this in a few different ways and been a lot better off.

Wow. I haven't seen that much false equivalency in one place in quite some time.

Here is an accurate comparison. If you go buy a shirt at the store and the price tag says $15 but it rings up for $13 at the register, did you steal $2?

Yes, it is. An invoicing error does not relieve you of your obligation to pay for the product or services received. Now, here is where you are trying to trip people up. Crimes usually involve intent, and no one would accuse you of theft if there was a mistake made at the cash register that no one noticed. However, if it was noticed, and they asked for renumeration, and you refused, they would have a case for theft.

Actually, I will take that back. A case could be made that the money requested at the register was an explicit contract of sorts, so that the price asked by the cashier was binding. This is not an analogous situation, though, to wha ...


The guy didn't refuse to pay it back when asked. He didn't have the money anymore. If the cashier gives me 5 $20s instead of 5 $1s and it blows out of my hands in the parking lot and flies away, it isn't my problem to repay the money. They made an error and will live with the consequences.

Cash errors at the register fall under "the customer is always right" doctrine. If the store overcharges they owe the customer reimbursement, but if they undercharge the customer it is eaten as an expense of the business.
2012-06-20 11:22:31 AM
1 votes:

MycroftHolmes: Bullseyed: Electromax: violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?

You could apply this to anything, though. You could say the same about someone robbing your house if you forgot to lock a window, or a hospital getting drugs stolen because someone ran into an emergency room that wasn't properly secured. I'm no friend to banks but this is probably less BOA's fault and more "some poor sucker in their huge company infrastructure". There's plenty of precedent for this sort of thing. "Our CEO ran off with illegitimate funds from our account, but it's our fault for hiring him." Not usually how it works.

That said, the guy could've handled this in a few different ways and been a lot better off.

Wow. I haven't seen that much false equivalency in one place in quite some time.

Here is an accurate comparison. If you go buy a shirt at the store and the price tag says $15 but it rings up for $13 at the register, did you steal $2?

Yes, it is. An invoicing error does not relieve you of your obligation to pay for the product or services received. Now, here is where you are trying to trip people up. Crimes usually involve intent, and no one would accuse you of theft if there was a mistake made at the cash register that no one noticed. However, if it was noticed, and they asked for renumeration, and you refused, they would have a case for theft.


How do you know the mistake was at the cash register and not with the tag on the product? Your bias and lack of logic is showing.
2012-06-20 11:21:13 AM
1 votes:

MycroftHolmes: Bullseyed: mauricecano: violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?

So under that logic then we remove all theft from the books and no more larceny right? Because your car/house should have been locked, how is your family supposed to trust you with their stuff if you don't lock your car or home? It's your fault someone decided to break the law and take it right?

Believe it or not, most of the time theft involves breaking in when the doors are locked.

If you leave your iPod in an unlocked car, you deserve to have it taken.

What is the difference between a closed door and a locked door that can be broken? By your inane logic, if you do not secure something to the point where it cannot be stolen, it is not theft when someone takes it. Do you actually believe one word of that, or are you so intent on saying 'screw BoA' that you will put clearly warped and inane logic out there?


Oh hi there strawman!
2012-06-20 11:20:23 AM
1 votes:

MycroftHolmes: Bullseyed: houndoggie: or maybe you shouldn't spend money that isn't yours.

The money became his when the bank gave it to him.

The bank did not give it to him. He took it. Why is this such a hard concept.

Reading a thread like this, it is very easy to see why America is having financial problems. There are so many 'screw everyone else, I want to mine, even if I have to game the system to do so'. Very sad.


The bank's teller gave him the money. He did not take it. Taking the money would involve prying open the ATM.
2012-06-20 11:19:34 AM
1 votes:

houndoggie: Bullseyed: houndoggie: or maybe you shouldn't spend money that isn't yours.

The money became his when the bank gave it to him.

did it really?

he exploited a glitch and stole the money.

the first time when he discovered the glitch was the "freebie", but he kept going back for more... theft.


Glitches are not the customer's responsibility. If it is in the public domain, then it is working as intended.
2012-06-20 09:58:23 AM
1 votes:

Electromax: violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?

You could apply this to anything, though. You could say the same about someone robbing your house if you forgot to lock a window, or a hospital getting drugs stolen because someone ran into an emergency room that wasn't properly secured. I'm no friend to banks but this is probably less BOA's fault and more "some poor sucker in their huge company infrastructure". There's plenty of precedent for this sort of thing. "Our CEO ran off with illegitimate funds from our account, but it's our fault for hiring him." Not usually how it works.

That said, the guy could've handled this in a few different ways and been a lot better off.


Wow. I haven't seen that much false equivalency in one place in quite some time.

Here is an accurate comparison. If you go buy a shirt at the store and the price tag says $15 but it rings up for $13 at the register, did you steal $2?
2012-06-20 09:48:32 AM
1 votes:

kronicfeld: rhino33: i'm sure there's some law that says otherwise, but feel that if the bank made the mistake, then they are responsible for that money. this statement is not swayed at all by how much i think BofA should die in a fire.

Just like the Lay's guy leaving the vending machine open entitles you to all those free bags of chips, right?


Not a comparable situation at all. If the ATM was left open and he took all the money out, then that would be.


If you buy your bag of chips and two bags fall down, do you deserve 15 months in prison too?
2012-06-20 09:47:12 AM
1 votes:

houndoggie: or maybe you shouldn't spend money that isn't yours.


The money became his when the bank gave it to him.
2012-06-20 09:46:15 AM
1 votes:

rhino33: i'm sure there's some law that says otherwise, but feel that if the bank made the mistake, then they are responsible for that money. this statement is not swayed at all by how much i think BofA should die in a fire.


This. If the bank is not liable for "glitches" with their ATMs, what motivation does the bank have to fix their ATMs?
2012-06-19 09:21:19 PM
1 votes:
Jon iz teh kewl: Oldiron_79: Jon iz teh kewl: Wade_Wilson: See, this is how I know the brain of a gambler is fundamentally different than mine.

This guy WON. He has unlimited ATM withdrawals. That is pretty much literally a slot machine that pays out every time.

And his first thought wasn't "I will use this infinite money to buy nice things", it was "I will take this infinite money, and spend it all on a game that gives me 1000:1 odds on getting 2x infinite money! Then I buy nice things!"

I mean, casino games can be fun and all, but if someone gave you 1.5 million,can any of you honestly say your first thought would be "Alright, time to hit the craps table!"

right cause slot machines that pay out will eventually handcuff you

Cuff? Pfft. All right, I'm gonna give you a choice. You can either have the money and the hammer or you can walk out of here. You can't have both. What do you want?

[sfist.com image 625x461]


Wow, you turned a Casino reference into a MC Hammer reference.
2012-06-19 03:22:34 PM
1 votes:
Here's a hypethetical situation... What if EVERY SINGLE PERSON with a BoA account was able to withdraw say 10k that was placed in their accounts in error. Lets say that 1million people have a BoA account in America (prob. much higher in reality) and half of them chose to spend the money that wasn't theirs. Do you think it would be right to send 500,000 Americans to prison? Don't you see any protential problems arising from doing that? It's easy to call one person a dumbass, but not so much when everyone is affected huh?
2012-06-19 02:34:30 PM
1 votes:

scottydoesntknow: Finally, on August 18, Bank of America placed a hold on his account when it was overdrawn by over $1.5 million, his indictment states.

$1 million of that being overdraft fees


I missed this somehow. Brilliant.
2012-06-19 02:04:56 PM
1 votes:
I'd have invested it in BoA and watched them sue themselves to get it back.
2012-06-19 01:24:43 PM
1 votes:

mauricecano: So under that logic then we remove all theft from the books and no more larceny right? Because your car/house should have been locked, how is your family supposed to trust you with their stuff if you don't lock your car or home? It's your fault someone decided to break the law and take it right?


Who the hell White Knights for the banking industry?

/Dude, everyone knows it's wrong, but it's fun to think about alternatives to doing the right thing
//lighten up, Francis
2012-06-19 01:19:12 PM
1 votes:

kronicfeld: Just like the Lay's guy leaving the vending machine open entitles you to all those free bags of chips, right?


If the vending machine was closed and it kept spitting out free bags of chips when you pressed a button this would be a valid analogy.
2012-06-19 12:57:09 PM
1 votes:

freewill: Bottom line, the banks were given considerable discretion in how to invest the money. Without commenting on specific cases, they didn't misappropriate it, they simply failed at what they were empowered to do.


Without commenting on specific cases, they wildly misappropriated it. You know the funniest thing to come out of this? When a bank tries to foreclose on you, you can demand to see the mortgage note. Banks are having a tough time proving they actually hold the mortgages they think/say they do. That's how farking bad it was. They bundled these things up and sold them over and over and since the cash was rolling in like crazy, who needs to do paperwork?

Bottom line - banks were given considerable discretion in how to invest money and still farked it up and went further than they were supposed to.
2012-06-19 12:24:31 PM
1 votes:

houndoggie: or maybe you shouldn't spend money that isn't yours.


Yeah, but see, it becomes yours.

I don't think i'm explaining this right. You know the jars of pennies on the convenience store counter?
2012-06-19 12:11:34 PM
1 votes:

mainstreet62: How is what he did different than what Wall Street bankers did at the height of the financial crisis a few years ago?

Why is he going to jail and not anyone at Goldman Sachs or Bank of America, among numerous large financial entities?


Because Bank of America paid back every single dime that they BORROWED. This guy can stay in jail until he pays back the 1.5mln that he STOLE. Big, big difference.
2012-06-19 12:00:57 PM
1 votes:

Weaver95: I'd have donated as much money as I could to every PAC and SuperPAC and lobbyist I could find. Watching the bank go after those political organizations to get their money back would be worth doing the 15 months in jail...


A better scenario: pay off all your friends' and family's debts under collection. Then BOA could spam collection agencies with collection calls.

/divide by zero!
2012-06-19 11:58:19 AM
1 votes:
I'm sure the money was just resting in his account.
2012-06-19 11:41:07 AM
1 votes:

violentsalvation: I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?


You could apply this to anything, though. You could say the same about someone robbing your house if you forgot to lock a window, or a hospital getting drugs stolen because someone ran into an emergency room that wasn't properly secured. I'm no friend to banks but this is probably less BOA's fault and more "some poor sucker in their huge company infrastructure". There's plenty of precedent for this sort of thing. "Our CEO ran off with illegitimate funds from our account, but it's our fault for hiring him." Not usually how it works.

That said, the guy could've handled this in a few different ways and been a lot better off.
2012-06-19 11:37:06 AM
1 votes:

BurnShrike: A Detroit man is facing 15 months in prison after he was able to withdraw unlimited ATM cash from his Bank of America account that only held a few dollars.

Aww, what a tragedy. It couldnt've happened to a nicer bank.

I'm not saying what he did was right, but I can't say I'm sad to see BoA get farked by one of their customers rather than the other way around.



I gotta agree. There's something about this line:

In this case, the bank's glitch allowed the defendant to lose a significant amount of money that was not even his in the first place

that reminds me of the banking crisis, with banks gambling on our deposit money. No one has gone to jail over those hundreds of billions of dollars and the rape of our economy, yet this guy gets 15 months for $1.5 million.
2012-06-19 11:31:50 AM
1 votes:
What's a balanace?
2012-06-19 10:43:44 AM
1 votes:
I sorta think the banks in these situations should have to just eat it and the guy should get a pass. Sure it is stealing and wrong, but on the bank's end this is pretty much the same as leaving the bank and vault unlocked. How the hell are we supposed to trust you with our money if you let shiat like this happen? We are supposed to be accountable for our actions, how about some accountability on your part, BOA?
2012-06-19 10:20:43 AM
1 votes:
Please tell me he got some hookers and blow in the mix.
2012-06-19 10:16:36 AM
1 votes:

rhino33: i'm sure there's some law that says otherwise, but feel that if the bank made the mistake, then they are responsible for that money. this statement is not swayed at all by how much i think BofA should die in a fire.


Just like the Lay's guy leaving the vending machine open entitles you to all those free bags of chips, right?
2012-06-19 10:01:16 AM
1 votes:
It's almost as if sustainable acquisition is related to prudent stewardship.
 
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