The Jami Turman Fan Club: the biggest redneck here: The Jami Turman Fan Club: He wasn't guilty. Using steroids isn't illegal.

Can we get our money back from this crap? These stupid prosecutions cost millions.

Lying under oath is, and that's what he was charged with.

Yeah, we've heard that horsecrap before. Sleeping with somebody is illegal, lying about sleeping with someone is an impeachment offence. Didn't work then either.

Steroids are generally legal. Most are prescription, the others are legal over the counter, such as Preparation H (Hydrocortisone). They're not banned.

The doctor or trainer could be in trouble, though.

You dum.

Indubitably: Harry_Seldon: RickyWilliams'sBong: It's a true sign of what a bunch of old, out of touch asshats Congress is made up of that they think a significant number of people below the age of 80 outside of a handful of cities in the NE still care about baseball, let alone Roger Clemens.

Is there really a much more enjoyable way to spend a nice summer evening than sitting outdoors at a MLB ballpark, and enjoying a game, or a lazy Sunday afternoon at the game.

If you can afford it...

I can get tickets to Friday's Rangers game for $8 a pop. If I sit where I REALLY wanna sit, they're $38. I worry more about the game being sold out than the price.


UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: This didn't happen to me, dumbass. I play FIRST-base.

I'd let you at LEAST get to second base.

Well, this case felt all OJ-ey for a while now, so no big shocker.

He's still probably not welcome anywhere in Boston. Kinda wish they'd give 21 out to someone just to piss him off.

Meanwhile, Randy Johnson and Greg Maddux are seen tag-teaming Pedro Martinez in the best pitcher of this generation Royal Rumble.

Di Atribe: I'd let you at LEAST get to second base.

"PLAY BALL!"

We could do that whole MeatLoaf song! :)

Guess what Roger...

I'm on the, S.S I Don't Give a Shiat...



"Suck it, d-bag".

/I was at Fenway for your 20 SO game
//Ur still a fat, juice-head coont

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: We could do that whole MeatLoaf song! :)

Well I'll sleep on it


KyDave: Looks like the defense team **sunglasses** hit a home run

YEEEAAAHHhhhhhh

KyDave: /You cut me, Shrek.
//Cut me deep.

Please never stop. Thank you.

Actually, wombatsrus, I am serious. Minor leaguers were tested for steroids long before major leaguers were, and the inability to have a level playing field cost many players a chance at being major leaguers. There were many good players you never got to see at a major league level, because there was someone willing to cheat to stay a major leaguer beyond his natural career path. It sounds trivial, but it cost some worthy players, who spent thousands of hours honing their skills, millions of dollars in potential income, and was a perversion of the rules of fair play. It wasn't fair, it wasn't decent, but it WAS sanctioned by MLB.

If my fr'instance seemed melodramatic, it's closer to the truth than any line Major League Baseball has spun.

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Do you want to know why steroids are cheating?

Picture this: You are 23 years old. You're a damned good baseball player, if you were ranked, maybe you'd be number 1,000 in the entire world. You're a AAA minor-league third-baseman, and you're in a good spot. The organization you play for has an aging third-baseman, that you're the equal of in every way, except he's making millions, and you have a winter job, and live at your parents' house in the off-season. He's 36, and it is your turn. You've rode buses, and slept two to a bed, and showered in rusty water, and you've pissed in a bottle to prove you're clean, and you've paid your dues. Now, it's your turn to go to The Show.

But in Spring training, that 36 year-old guy is just killing the ball. He's moving like he's 23, diving for balls he couldn't reach last September. He's no longer got warning-track power, people now pay attention when he's in the batting cage. He's got his swagger and ego back, and it shows. So instead of sending him down at the end of Spring training, you have to go back to AAA ball, while he gets a new bigger contract, which further cements him into the job that's rightfully yours. And because he's a major leaguer, he doesn't have to test for the very thing that has given him new abilities, extended his baseball lifetime.

Now imagine that this has gone on for four years. He's now 40, and has made himself a tidy pile of dough while stealing your glory, your headlines, and most importantly, your MONEY. Now, you're 28 and your best years are behind you. Your parents still love you, but they don't brag about you nearly as much. You think "maybe this year", but there's a new 23 year-old phenom third-baseman in the system, who is maybe just as good as you, but he's only 23. Guess who your organization is going to keep.

THIS is why steroids are cheating. This scenario has played out hundreds of times in the steroid era.

/it's worse than cheating
//it is stealing

For the sake of brevity: steroids are cheating because they allow mediocre players to become good players, and good players to extend their careers five or more years beyond what was pretty much the cliff (37-38 years for field position players) for MLB players up until the 90s, and by proxy this cheats athletes out of an opportunity that may make (or break) a career. Yes, there were a very few exceptions (Hank Aaron being one... who had a .300/40 HR season at age 39, though he quickly fell off from there), but most players are a shell of their former selves in their late 30s.

Now, it didn't cost many 24 year old good prospects their jobs (realistically, if you're 24 and hit like a Major League vet, you're almost guaranteed to be called up or traded for value to a team that will call you up), but it cost many mid/late 20s guys who otherwise may not have had a shot from their short-lived MLB opportunities. Guys who may have sat on the bench, but a few guys who may have made an impact to some small, but measurable, degree.

puffy999: For the sake of brevity: steroids are cheating because they allow mediocre players to become good players, and good players to extend their careers five or more years beyond what was pretty much the cliff (37-38 years for field position players) for MLB players up until the 90s, and by proxy this cheats athletes out of an opportunity that may make (or break) a career. Yes, there were a very few exceptions (Hank Aaron being one... who had a .300/40 HR season at age 39, though he quickly fell off from there), but most players are a shell of their former selves in their late 30s.

Thank you, you said it better than I could. This is why I have you favorited in a color that makes me pay attention to your thoughts.

/I'd have made my post shorter, but I didn't have time

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: This is why I have you favorited in a color that makes me pay attention to your thoughts.

Well, that or the trolling.

puffy999: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: This is why I have you favorited in a color that makes me pay attention to your thoughts.

Well, that or the trolling.

LOL, intelligent trolling doesn't bother me, sometimes idjuts need their nose tweaked. Sometimes it's my nose that needs it.

/keep doin' what yer doin'

eggrolls: mikaloyd: jaybeezey: I want to see the dollar total on this waste of time and beat it out of every congressman that pushed for this stupid investigation to begin with.

Reported to congress

I hope so.

eggrolls: mikaloyd: jaybeezey: I want to see the dollar total on this waste of time and beat it out of every congressman that pushed for this stupid investigation to begin with.

Reported to congress

I hope so.

I hope every one of the farktards who wasted our time and money on this pointless spectacle are aware of how angry the electorate really is, and it makes them walk a little faster to their cars after a late night congressin' because they worry that one of us is going to come up behind them and explain our dissatisfaction...with an aluminum bat.

/Not suggesting violence, just saying.

//But violence does make the point soooo well.
Really?
Be careful what you wish for

Di Atribe: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: We could do that whole MeatLoaf song! :)

I gotta know right now!

Di Atribe: Well I'll sleep on it

Where did this line go from my previous post?

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Di Atribe: Well I'll sleep on it

Where did this line go from my previous post?

You dont happen to be in the cats meow in NOLA right now do you?

mikaloyd: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Di Atribe: Well I'll sleep on it

Where did this line go from my previous post?

You dont happen to be in the cats meow in NOLA right now do you?

LOL, no. I had to go ask my niece (a NOLA native) just what the Cat's Meow was. Are they karaoke-ing that song now?

/you don't wanna hear me sing it
//YOU'LL be prayin' for the end of time

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: mikaloyd: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Di Atribe: Well I'll sleep on it

Where did this line go from my previous post?

You dont happen to be in the cats meow in NOLA right now do you?

LOL, no. I had to go ask my niece (a NOLA native) just what the Cat's Meow was. Are they karaoke-ing that song now?

/you don't wanna hear me sing it
//YOU'LL be prayin' for the end of time

I get knocked down but I get up again

Link

KyDave: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: puffy999: (snip)
/I'd have made my post shorter, but I didn't have time

Clever, what you did there. Made me chuckle.

That was paraphrased from a letter George Washington sent to someone. He apologized for the long letter, but claimed he didn't have time to shorten it. I liked it too. :)

/who knew he had a sense of humor (humour?)

OO baby harry yam sine seal de-livered

mikaloyd: I get knocked down but I get up again

The guy with the two plaid prints is pretty damn good.

/I get knocked up, but I get down again
//signed, sealed, delivered, I'm a dead letter

You got to fight for your right

DoctorRock: Harry_Seldon: I bet if the trial was 100% exactly the same, but the defendant was black, he would have been found guilty.

you are farking idiot

Right. *inserts tongue firmly in cheek* Because there is absolutely no precedence of exactly that kind of unfairness in the history of American jurisprudence. *removes tongue, inserts finger*

*pop*

/YOU are farking idiot
//AND willfully blind

skrame: Thanks for the info. I watch some baseball, but not to the point that I know when different rules were introduced. If the steroids were banned and players were caught with them, I'm all for punishment including a ban from the HOF.


that is just one thing that always annoys the hell out of me (the, "well, MLB never banned steroids until 2006!") argument. it is in the mitchell report, in case you didn't check the link. it isn't "gee, i think that something happened but i can't source it...." it's in the freaking mitchell report.

and yet established sportswriters still, from time to time, make that claim. i've argued this point on-air with sports talk radio folks. if you are in sports journalism and make that claim, you're either incompetent or willfully deceiving your audience (and yourself).