KiplingKat872: Er.., have you actually seen his New Mutants run?
Nina_Hartley's_Ass: KiplingKat872: I can see where his compositions may have influenced by Adams, but calling his work a "slavish" imitation is patently rediculous.STARTED. Try Moon Knight and earlier.
MayoSlather: I usually don't question artistic talent that is presented professionally. I naively assume the work is a style or is intended to look like that for a reason. People like me are how shiatty artists continue to make a living.
KiplingKat872: It seemed like you were coming at me over it.
Nina_Hartley's_Ass: KiplingKat872: It seemed like you were coming at me over it.I could have been clearer. My main point was Liefeld's lack of improvement and apparent disdain for simple competence. But it's guys like him that gave me a real appreciation of artists like Don Heck and George Tuska. They're not flashy but at least you can tell what's going on.
KiplingKat872: FastJeff: I'm trying my best not to just pull an Ogre here considering I have stacks of old comics around there somewhere. Can somebody point me in the direction of some good comic art examples?All I know is this guy draws better than I do, therefore, it's "good". Ridiculous and stylized, but still better than whatever I can draw.My first exposure to comics was the Bill Sienkiewicz run of Marvel's New Mutants. Pretry much spoiled me for a lot of artists.
Nina_Hartley's_Ass: While his style is somewhat jarring in the middle of a run of more mainstream artists and just plain shocking following Kaluta on The Shadow, Robbins work was expressive and dynamic. He may not be to your liking, but he was a real artist on par with the likes of Romita, Buscema or Adams.Liefeld is just a mess who either can't or doesn't want to get any better.
KiplingKat872: Nina_Hartley's_Ass: KiplingKat872: It seemed like you were coming at me over it.I could have been clearer. My main point was Liefeld's lack of improvement and apparent disdain for simple competence. But it's guys like him that gave me a real appreciation of artists like Don Heck and George Tuska. They're not flashy but at least you can tell what's going on.Ah, well then I am in complete agreement. One of the reasons I would not list John Byrne as a great comic book artist is that while he is iconic and technically competant, certainly far better than Liefeld, he has not evolved in 30 years.
BigLuca: Whiplash!!!: BigLuca: forgotmydamnusername: BigLuca: Zombalupagus: [i.imgur.com image 453x700]I find it odd that the author didn't mention the knife in this one. This is a perfect example of the draw things out of order thing and such. If you mentally remove the knife for a second, it's clear that this guys right arm is against his chest while his left is out resting on his thigh. Ok, now see the knife again. Did your head just assplode?Do you know who else was criticized for his use of impossible objects and paradoxical spacial relations?[www.meridian.net.au image 640x611]Liefeld is just trying to bring a little high-brow surreal culture to a low-brow artistic medium and he is lambasted for not being "realistic" enough. Liefeld art is something you just need to experience ... view with your soul, not your eyes.But Liefeld doesn't play with perspective, he's just close to totally unaware of it. Who are you doing next, Rembrandt? May as well go for broke. The original troll is hard to top.Rembrandt doesn't have anything on Liefeld. If you wanted to create a Rembrandt today, just take a picture of your kids church play. The only thing he is good for is knowing historical continuity and evolution of art. Need to be free of the shackles of literal interpretation to create the kind of societal homonculus in Liefeld's design. I mean, Rembrandt was a necessary step to get to where we are today, but we are past him now.Yea, you're right. Rembrandt is pretty awful. We're way past him.Example of an awful RembrandtThat's ok. But if religious realism is your thing you should really check out some Thomas Kinkade. Way better than Rembrandt.[framingpainting.com image 640x409]You got Santa Claus in a sleigh on a snowy christmas morning. Like something straight out of the bible.
BigLuca: Do you know who else was criticized for his unconventional use of perspective, exaggerated or simplified features and hatred of feet?[1.bp.blogspot.com image 561x700]Do you know who else was criticized for his unconventional use of perspective, exaggerated or simplified features and hatred of feet?
Sgt Otter: Current Resident: I'm pretty sure that these girls have wieners.[assets.sbnation.com image 455x650]That is the wost drawing of Domino I have ever seen.
Christian Bale: The other 79 examples are all puke-a-riffic, but this one a great. I even forgive the deformed hand.
Bill Frist: That's his style.
t3knomanser: Bill Frist: That's his style.It's certainly identified with him, but I'm not sure it's truly a stylistic choice other than the fact that he refuses to change or learn or grow as an artist. It's his style because he keeps doing it, no matter how wrong and terrible it is.Because, here's the thing: your art does not need to be an anatomy drawing. I mentioned books like "Orc Stain" and "Chew" because they both have highly stylized anatomy. Same thing for "Invincible", although I don't think it's nearly as strong as the other two books.It's not just that Liefeld's anatomy is bad, it's not just that every woman is a centaur-spined snake-beast with bewbs. It's that every character design he ever works with, whether his original design or not, ends up looking exactly the same. They all use the same facial expressions. They all use the same poses. They all are bristling with weapons (sword in each hand, two swords strapped to the back, in case the first two break).It's obvious that he doesn't plan his drawings- you can see a bunch of different vanishing points in every panel because all he really did was draw a bunch of stuff without worrying too much about how it actually ties together in a scene.
Roook: Reminds me of the art of Pat Lee for Transformers comics[tfwiki.net image 460x189]TFWiki Article
LesserEvil: Crap, while we are at it, there is a complete failure on the perspective between the left foot and her hand.
Dr. Mojo PhD: If that's just Liefeld's "style", then his style sucks, period. But it's not. It's not Liefeld's style at all. It's just that Liefeld himself sucks.
Bill Frist: You know, it honestly doensn't bother me so much that Liefeld has impossible anatomy and insane muscles, etc. That's his style. I think it is a shiatty style, but these are comics not real life. People getting pedantic over how realistic the muscles are or how big the waists are is a little silly.HOWEVER, I can not stand how farking lazy he is. The way he simply will not draw some characters hands or second leg, how he'll slap on a gun over a hand that clearly was originally holding something else, how he doesn't even erase errors sometimes. So farking lazy.
Bill Frist: thunderbird8804: Alex Ross, who I'm pretty sure is an avatar of an art god.I think Alex Ross more or less sucks. His shiat is totally soulless. Yes, he can paint realistically (he uses models so is truly drawing from life) but so what? The great artists have STYLE. We don't remember Magritte or Dali or Picasso or Van Gogh because their stuff looked completely naturalistic. We remember them because they had original styles and visions.Alex Ross is one of those technically great illustrators who is a boring artist. His work is like watching some guitar virtuoso do a bunch of technically hard solos, but who is unable to write a memorable song.
Bill Frist: Like google Alex Ross and comics and ignore the technical aspect of the realism, and look at what's being drawn. Mostly a bunch of cheesy poses. (no wonder he is most famous for his covers, which can just be superheros in corny poses without worrying about any flow between panels). Everything is stiff and wooden, no real personality and no flow when he does do panels.
thunderbird8804: Style: Most of his work presents a highly idealized (not naturalistic), photo-realistic throwback to the silver age
thunderbird8804: Expressive and dynamic composition: Most of the characters are practically moving on the page, and every single one of them exudes the personality of their character
thunderbird8804: Ross's work is still the pinnacle of craftsmanship
thunderbird8804: [www.dialbforblog.com image 576x595]Expressive and dynamic composition: Most of the characters are practically moving on the page, and every single one of them exudes the personality of their character
Bill Frist: Yes, and its cheesy and done to death. thunderbird8804: Expressive and dynamic composition: Most of the characters are practically moving on the page, and every single one of them exudes the personality of their characterTruly can't tell if this is a joke or not. It isn't quite bad enough to make him the comic book Thomas Kinkade, but its still pretty corny and stiff.He is obviously a talented illustrator on a technical level, everyone knows that. I will say that basically every comic artist I know thinks he is pretty poor beyond that. If you like him, cool stuff.
Bill Frist: If you fixed the problems you mention in that example, it would still be a pretty ugly drawing but one could understand why someone else might like it. But having the neck be coming out of one shoulder blade, not thinking through the poses, etc.... that's just lazy and sad.
St_Francis_P: Mawson of the Antarctic: BigLuca: Do you know who else was criticized for his unconventional use of perspective, exaggerated or simplified features and hatred of feet?Do you know who else was criticized for his unconventional use of perspective, exaggerated or simplified features and hatred of feet?Now this is a troll for the ages.You laugh, but 100 years from now when an original Liefeld goes for $1M, you won't be laughing so much.
way south: Woman and cyborg drawn by an artist known for stretching the bounds of anatomical beauty.[dl.dropbox.com image 599x769]Woman and cyborg drawn by a twelve year old.[dl.dropbox.com image 454x705]
RolandGunner: Also...[img88.imageshack.us image 212x372]W... T... F
FastJeff: I'm trying my best not to just pull an Ogre here considering I have stacks of old comics around there somewhere. Can somebody point me in the direction of some good comic art examples?All I know is this guy draws better than I do, therefore, it's "good". Ridiculous and stylized, but still better than whatever I can draw.
HeartBurnKid: There's a difference between "stylized" and "shiat". Liefeld is the latter.
Christian Bale: I HATE Rob Liefeld's work. Everything about it. His deformed people, musculature invented anew for each person, awkward poses, and the fact that you can't tell the foreground from the background or tell what the hell is going on in half his drawings.That said, the original "40 worst" included this drawing:[assets.sbnation.com image 392x600]I love everything about the above panels. It's the one instance where his style--as he used it here--actually works. Not drawing superheroes, but a grizzled, dying loser with a great pained expression in a "noir" setting.The other 79 examples are all puke-a-riffic, but this one a great. I even forgive the deformed hand.
RolandGunner: Back when I used to have time to draw I drew things like this and this and knew that my weaknesses would make drawing comics a long shot... little did I know that Liefeld was blazing a trail for critically limited artists like me.
way south: Not knowing much about Liefeld himself, I can only hazard a guess that his luck at staying employed has less to do with his art so much as his ability to produce finished* pieces on a deadline.
Liefeld has become known for producing late books, primarily his creator-owned ones,[dead link] though somewhat less so when doing work-for-hire. Some issues of his series Youngblood shipped as much as nine months late. Liefeld has attributed this to the greater incentive a freelancer feels when doing work-for-hire assignments for a company, as opposed to working on one's self-owned work.It was alleged that Liefeld was too preoccupied by aspirations of Hollywood production deals, spending time in meetings with Steven Spielberg and Tom Cruise, to effectively publish comic books or participate in the business side of the Image venture, a criticism that Liefeld admits is at least partly true. He reportedly fell asleep at numerous Image board meetings.
bifford: Liefeld's 40 worst are probably behind him because he's getting better over time. Still not stellar, but his latest work in Deadshot #10 is actually passable.
No Such Agency: rickycal78:FirstNationalBastard: Baron Harkonnen: I remember Rob Liefeld really coming on the scene in the early 90s and thinking his artwork was the most awesomest thing ever. In my defense, I was about 13. What more could I want than giant boobs and giant guns? I still think Liefeld is the greatest comic artist a 13 year-old could hope for.On a related note, Tarot is one of the best worst comics ever. The writing is beyond abysmal, with the creater having absolutely no idea how to plot or pace anything, but the strange thing is, the artwork is not bad. The whole series is a porno/exploitation that the artist makes all of the women look like porn stars with huge porn-star breasts and shaved porn-star crotches (including Samantha Brown's haunted vagina), but the writer/artist who does the comic really believes that he's empowering women's sexuality with it. It's such an amazing train-wreck that it's hard to look away.If nothing else, Jim Balent is empowering chubby chicks to send nudes of themselves in to be printed in the back of the book.Wait what? Some comic is printing pics of naked chubby chicks in the back?This point was never adequately addressed. I've clearly been away from comics for a while, things must have... changed.
Dr. Mojo PhD: NOPE!
way south: Dr. Mojo PhD: NOPE!...Well now he sounds like a giant douchebag too.That was my last guess then.How does he manage to stay employed?
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