SkunkWerks: mat catastrophe: Yes, let's prove how progressive we are by talking about how big women are farkable.

No, genius. What we're actually saying is those farkable women referred to as "big" are simply normal. I understand why you'd want to pretend otherwise though. When you fap to girls that look like bio lab skeletons, you either have to admit you have a fetish for scrawny women -- or just pretend that normal girls have something wrong with them. I can see why it's more convenient to go with the second option.

There's thin, there's normal, and there's "plus-sized". These are all okay. It's the "multiple-sized" and the "exponential-sized" that I have a problem with. If she's so fat that I have doubts about certain parts being exposed to the open air with any regularity, that's just gross.

skepticultist:
/also explains why when I bought her that outfit is was a "large," which I thought had to be a typo or something. She's 5'3" and 130 lbs. How the fark is that "large?"

My girlfriend thinks she's fat too but when I buy her stuff from the USA on eBay I order Medium.

And if I buy stuff for myself I buy L, or maybe XL if I want a loose fit. Around here I have trouble finding clothes that are big enough.

My gay friend once took me out for an image makeover and none of the shops he took me to had clothes that were big enough for me. Eventually he admitted that buying USA brands like Levis was a sensible choice for me.

KrispyKritter:

the 'looks like a ten year old boy' death cry is almost as telling as those who use "real women have curves". everybody knows what you're really saying. again, it just doesn't reflect well on the writer.

Bullshiat. It's not a "death cry" when referring to something so obvious in plain sight. You can only take so much curves away from a woman before she looks like a child. Which is exactly why certain men (ehem) are attracted to those types in the first place...which leads me to:

and what if a man is attracted to a woman who is crack skinny and looking like a ten year old boy?

At least you're an honest pedophile. I guess that counts for something.

TheRedMonkey: nimawai: It used to be that plus size models were size 16 and up. In our warped sense of what is beautiful it's now around a size 6. I'd KILL to be a size 6. Yes, yes I know I sound fat. Welcome to fark and all that.

The woman in the adds don't even have a stomach. If you're plus sized shouldn't you have a stomach? One that pouches out? Then we wonder why woman are starving themselves. It's because companies like Special K consider those woman as plus sized. smh

Except a modern size 6 is what a 16 was. Sizes are not a scientific measure and clothing manufacturers have admitted to manipulating sizes to make women think they are smaller.

Modern sizing is unreliable for off the rack clothing but sometimes consistent with certain designers. Also, I sell vintage and a size 12 in the 50's is more like an 8 now.
I'm tall and when I was younger I was always a shapely - 12 or 14 and never had an issue with being dateless.
The gals in TFA look healthy and beautiful.

Wartime Consiglieri: I understand

No, you don't. But here's a hint:

Instead of substituting one form of women's body dysmorphia with a different sort of women's body dysmorphia; instead of blaming skinny women for the plight of heavier women; and instead of blaming the media for promoting neurosis in women, well...


Why don't we stop tearing down people for how they look, hmm?


Not just the men, but the women too. As far as the media is concerned? They don't make trends, they act on the things that are already trending.

WE make the trends.

WE belittle heavy women and love skinny women.

WE belittle skinny women to "vindicate" heavy women.

WE substitute compassion and understanding for vengeance and reversal.

WE hate ourselves for everything society says we're supposed to hate ourselves for.

WE hate society for everything it "made" us hate.

WE blame the media for being the mouthpiece of that society whilst forgetting that we are a part of that society.


Want to stop being a "puppet" of advertising and media? Great! Then stop. Because as improbable as this all sounds, it starts with US.

Okay, here's the deal, guys. Plus sized MODELS are often too small to wear actual plus sized CLOTHING. Plus sized models start at size 6, whereas the lowest end of plus plus sized clothing is size 14, size 16 being more frequent. So, plus sized models don't look like the girls who wear the actual plus sized clothing, they are usually just at a healthy weight, not overweight by BMI but not underweight either.

Basically, the fashion industry will use size 0 models to sell things to size 10s, and size 10 models to sell things to size 20s. So in conclusion, many plus sized models do not look plus sized because they aren't actually. They just model the clothing.

SkunkWerks: Wartime Consiglieri: I understand

No, you don't. But here's a hint:

Instead of substituting one form of women's body dysmorphia with a different sort of women's body dysmorphia; instead of blaming skinny women for the plight of heavier women; and instead of blaming the media for promoting neurosis in women, well...


Why don't we stop tearing down people for how they look, hmm?


Not just the men, but the women too. As far as the media is concerned? They don't make trends, they act on the things that are already trending.

WE make the trends.

WE belittle heavy women and love skinny women.

WE belittle skinny women to "vindicate" heavy women.

WE substitute compassion and understanding for vengeance and reversal.

WE hate ourselves for everything society says we're supposed to hate ourselves for.

WE hate society for everything it "made" us hate.

WE blame the media for being the mouthpiece of that society whilst forgetting that we are a part of that society.


Want to stop being a "puppet" of advertising and media? Great! Then stop. Because as improbable as this all sounds, it starts with US.

This all sounds very poetic and sweet, and in some respects there is some truth to it. But not in this specific case.

The media doesn't always follow trends, often it sets them. When they started glorifying waifs and stick figures very few women actually looked like that. I also don't remember a demand for size zero women as most guys in my surroundings were perfectly happy with what was considered sexy up to that point. The fashion designers who first started choosing rail thin women as runway models weren't taking any cues from society, they were just using girls that were shapeless enough to act like walking coat hangers.

For the last decade or so there has been a major disconnect between what hot girls look like in real life and what the media and fashion world (the latter not even populated by straight men) consider beautiful. Of course recently girls are tripping over themselves to conform to the media standard, but that doesn't mean there was some type of "demand" on part of society. In this case, society is following the media, not the other way around.

AdolfOliverPanties: These are plus-sized?

[i.dailymail.co.uk image 634x481]

Then I guess I like plus-sized women?

You are a farker, of course you do.

Yes, they are fat. Couple of em are just chubby, but most are flat out fat lards. All a chick has to do in life is look good and she is set. Not sure why they don't all do it.

Arcturus72: Not to mention, of course, that I would rather have a size 22 who's a freak in the bedroom (and obviously knows how to cook) than a size 0 who's a biatch...

Not to mention that it's just better planning in the long run. To paraphrase Terry Pratchett:

"While kissing initially seems to have more charm than cookery, a stolid lad looking for a bride should bear in mind his father's advice that kisses eventually lose their fire but cookery tends to get better and better over the years, and direct his courting to those families that clearly show a tradition of enjoying their food."

Thunderpipes: AdolfOliverPanties: These are plus-sized?

[i.dailymail.co.uk image 634x481]

Then I guess I like plus-sized women?

You are a farker, of course you do.

Yes, they are fat. Couple of em are just chubby, but most are flat out fat lards. All a chick has to do in life is look good and she is set.


Riiiight...Except your definition of "looking good" is something that resembles a meth-head after it's been starved for 2 weeks straight.

Anyone who thinks those girls are "fat" is either a retard or just a pedophile who faps to shapeless girls as a legal alternative to kiddy porn. You ain't fooling anybody.

Flragnararch: archichris: Its impossible to have pleasurable sex with a size zero woman.

I'd say have her blow you but who am I kidding, being all boney, that's going to be teethy and oww.

And they'd be worrying about the calories.

The idea that Marilyn Monroe was a size 16 has long since been debunked. It's actually quite difficult to fit her into any one size, because so much of what she wore was custom-tailored, but the closest modern size was actually 8.

The thing is, this is still considered plus-size. It's at the lower end of the scale, to be sure, but it goes to show just how ridiculous that moniker has become.

i like fat chick threads.

What the fark is "plus sized" about ANY of those women?

Wartime Consiglieri: The media doesn't always follow trends, often it sets them

With our permission.

You can't keep going in a direction if there's no momentum to be supplied. You also can't stop the car if you spend most of your time debating whose fault it is for not putting on the brakes.


As much as I'm no friend of advertising and marketing, we enable it. We buy the products, we fall for the advertising. We complain about how advertising is "manipulating" us, but we allow ourselves to be manipulated.

If all this hate of skinny women I see in this thread were to become the trend tomorrow, you may be certain that's the form advertising would take as you watch the morning news hour.

There was a time -believe it or not- when the "trend" was to be heavy. It denoted wealth, success, and even (~gasp~) health. It changed because we changed as a society. As a social species, we're very invested in what other people think of us, and we act on it often to an irrational degree. Advertising and media exploits this tendency.

These ads have been airing in America for over a year now...

And I think it's ridiculous that, I'm considered plus sized still. I have been in every spectrum of the BMI weight classes in my adult life, and have a tendancy to fluctuate depending on what's going on in my life. (Emotional eater? Yes. And I am better at it than Oprah.) But right now and for the last while I have been holding steady where an 8 is comfortable... And to be considered "plus size"??? these people who feel they need to make me feel bad about myself b/c I don't look like a bobble-headed coat-hanger can kiss my butt. Women were meant to have curves.

/thatisall...
//for now...

Tat'dGreaser: IBreakdance2NIN: Yeah, it really doesn't make us bigger girls feel any better when our fellow women get torn down for our sake. (Well, not those of us with some empathy.)

"Real" women come in all shapes and sizes.

Exactly! The mindset of guys on here boggles me. Appreciate women, in all shapes and sizes. Encourage them to be healthy and more importantly, happy.

While I understand your sentiment, there's an upper limit to size beyond which a person is irredeemable (useless, without redeeming qualities) without drastic measures. i.e. people who are too big to move around and spend all day watching TV and eating butter.

/Extremely small (hah) subset of the population though
//Most "fat" people are perfectly capable of changing their bodies or working past the hindrance posed by the extra weight.

octopied: "Plus sized" in fashion industry is apparently now a size 8 or 10.

I come in at size 14, or XL, the small end of "plus sized" but usually wear 14 standard, not 14 plus. The difference is the cut. Standard assumes you are bigger but sill have curves. Plus assumes you are shaped like a marshmellow.

That's the sizes of clothes they sell. Not their advertising campaign. I'm talking about models. The modeling industry considers anything above a size 6 to be plus size. There was even a big bru ha ha a few years ago because Lane Bryant's were too small to actually fit in the clothes they sold. That's how sick the fashion industry is. How many size 18 models have you seen in their adds? Heck even size 16. Most of their models are a size 10 - 12. So technically they can't shop at Lane Bryant.

meat0918: What world do you live in that women are starving themselves?

66% of America is overweight, with half of that 66% overweight and obese.

"Normal" is the minority, and underweight "bags of antlers" are 1%-7% of the population, depending on your source.

Just because someone is overweight doesn't mean they don't starve themselves. Trust me I know. My mother has been dieting for pretty much her entire life. She practically starves herself. Yet she's still well over 200lbs. I keep telling her she's doing it wrong but evidently I'm too stupid to know anything. So she keeps starving herself. Yes she loses some of the weight but it comes right back on & she gets added weight because her body is storing it for the next time she decides to starve herself. For one of her diet fads at every meal she would have a can of diet coke & an apple. That's it. Three times a day. I'd call that starving one's self.

My mother isn't a rare case. I know a lot of woman who do the exact same thing. A new fad diet comes out & go gang busters on it. Starving themselves. What they don't understand is that diets DON'T WORK! The entire dieting business counts on the fact that these fads aren't going to work. That way they can resell to these woman over & over & over again. Why do you think the dieting industry is a billion dollar industry? They've set it up for us to fail. So don't just assume that fatties can't put down the fork. Because in a lot of cases you'd be very wrong.

octopied: I wouldn't want to be a size 6, as I'd be too small. A size 10 or 12 would be nice, but whatever. I walk all the time, so I'm just heavy, not overly unfit.

As for having a stomach, I used to be just under a size 14(I could fit 13, but not 12) I had a tiny waist(about a 30) with big hip, butt and breasts.

Well I'm fairly short 5ft 1in. Which makes a difference. A size 6 on me vs someone who's tall isn't going to look the same. The taller girl would appear thinner than me. My goal is go be around 130 - 140lbs. Which at my height is around a size 6 to 8.

Wartime Consiglieri: Leeters: Wartime Consiglieri: Leeters: archichris: Its impossible to have pleasurable sex with a size zero woman.

Maybe the size zero woman you had sex with didn't know what she was doing...

No, it's not that. It's just kinda hard to enjoy sex when being poked by every bone in the girl's body while every time you look at her legs and torso you're reminded of your own when you were six!

What on earth were you doing that bones were poking you? Serious question! I guess you probably do all those crazy impractical positions.

No, just don't like having hip bones pressing against me when I'm on top of the girl. Nor do I enjoy the rough feeling of collar bones and the rib cage against my face when I'm trying to kiss her neck and torso. Reaching for her ass and grabbing nothing but loose skin over bones is also somewhat of a turnoff!

Guys who prefer that crap to a soft, healthy woman need to get their heads checked. It's not the worst fetish I've ever seen...but man is it sad and creepy.

Strawman alert, strawman alert. This idiot thinks (female) anorexia is actually popular among guys. Strawman alert, strawman alert.

meat0918: nimawai: It used to be that plus size models were size 16 and up. In our warped sense of what is beautiful it's now around a size 6. I'd KILL to be a size 6. Yes, yes I know I sound fat. Welcome to fark and all that.

The woman in the adds don't even have a stomach. If you're plus sized shouldn't you have a stomach? One that pouches out? Then we wonder why woman are starving themselves. It's because companies like Special K consider those woman as plus sized. smh

What world do you live in that women are starving themselves?

66% of America is overweight, with half of that 66% overweight and obese.

"Normal" is the minority, and underweight "bags of antlers" are 1%-7% of the population, depending on your source.

THIS THIS so goddamned much THIS. Sorry, kids-this whole "women starving themselves" meme is ridiculous. FFS, the real problem is men and women who eat eat eat eat. How many diabetes commercials are there on daytime teevee compared to just 10 or 15 years ago? How many times a day a day do you see someone and say to yourself "Holy crap, that person is unhealthily thin?" versus "Holy super size, how does someone get that big?" So far my tally this calendar year is one too skinny woman (actress, of course) versus god knows how many insanely fat humans. Just get out and move, people.

Tat'dGreaser: Well that goes back to health. I'm not talking about women who are a little overweight or a little underweight. BUT there are guys on here who will call a petite woman (who is like that naturally) a 13 year old boy. That's f*cking retarded.

Having a taste in a certain build/weight of women isn't the problem. No one can like absolutely everything they see in other people- or even find it compelling or attractive.

The problem is (as it is usually) taking your standard of beauty and saying that it must apply to everyone- saying that it's wrong for people to find attraction in people you don't personally find attractive. That anyone who can't get on board with this is a sad, sad person, or "needs help" or some such.

We can't let this stuff remain in the eye of the beholder, apparently. That's not enough for us.

My girlfriends body looks just like scarlett johannssens.

I like it...shes the 'thickest' girl I've ever dated. Realistically, she just has big boobs.

IBreakdance2NIN: :makes whale noises:

Breaks out the mukluks and kayak.

/Manning harpoon stations

LavenderWolf:
Strawman alert, strawman alert. This idiot thinks (female) anorexia is actually popular among guys. Strawman alert, strawman alert.

Moron alert, moron alert. This idiot thinks I actually said most guys like anorexic women!

I'm well aware those waif-fetishists make up only a small minority and in no way did I imply otherwise. You really have to be going out of your way to misunderstand that comment.

My question is: What does a healthy, well nourished human look like? Any time I ask this question, I can't seem to get a good answer from any one.

Relevant to his interests....

/You about a size 14?

AdolfOliverPanties: These are plus-sized?

[i.dailymail.co.uk image 634x481]

Then I guess I like plus-sized women?

I'll take a dozen.
Don't wrap them.
I'll eat them here.

szyska: My question is: What does a healthy, well nourished human look like? Any time I ask this question, I can't seem to get a good answer from any one.

Varies by person, I'd say. Different frames carry weight differently, different metabolisms do better with different schedules of intake.

But you're right, the only answer you're going to get out of people in this matter is going to be to the question of what they personally, find aesthetically pleasing. They'll make that a synonym of any number of less biased sounding things, however...

kradio:
THIS THIS so goddamned much THIS. Sorry, kids-this whole "women starving themselves" meme is ridiculous. FFS, the real problem is men and women who eat eat eat eat. How many diabetes commercials are there on daytime teevee compared to just 10 or 15 years ago? How many times a day a day do you see someone and say to yourself "Holy crap, that person is unhealthily thin?" versus "Holy super size, how does someone get that big?" So far my tally this calendar year is one too skinny woman (actress, of course) versus god knows how many insanely fat humans. Just get out and move, people.

First of all, what you're pulling here is what every dishonest douche on your side does. You try to tie the obesity issue to discussions involving perfectly normal women, conveniently ignoring that there is a whole normal area between underweight and overweight where those girls you call "fat" actually fall into.

Second, you also give yourself away when you claim to not see overly skinny women in everyday life. Most of the fat people I see these days are over 35. In just this past year I've seen more anorexic young women than I ever saw in my life before that. When I go clubbing now I actually see some girls that are maybe 10 lbs away from full-fledged anorexia. Anyone who denies this either hasn't left the house since 2011 or is full of crap.

Wartime Consiglieri: When I go clubbing now I actually see some girls that are maybe 10 lbs away from full-fledged anorexia. Anyone who denies this either hasn't left the house since 2011

While I don't doubt what you've seen, you can leave the house (after 2011) and not go to clubs.

Let's say for instance that you spend a lot of your out-of-the-house time at Wal-Mart, for instance. You probably won't see a lot of women "just shy of anorexia". What you're far more likely to see is a lot of people in store-supplied mobility scooters whose only disability is morbid obesity.

Different crowds, different sights. Still out of the house.

IBreakdance2NIN:

Ahem. There's a lower limit, too. Anorexia/bulimia aren't healthy, either.Exactly. But good luck getting those waif-fetish guys pretending to be health fanatics to ever acknowledge this. They'll tell you with a straight face that a size 8 woman is obese while they drool over a starving woman with the muscle tone of a six-year-old.

And for the record, I'm not talking about naturally petite women with normal weight distribution. I'm referring to the malnourished skeletors with sharp knees, boney torsos and hollowed faces that these a$$holes pretend to be the healthy alternative. And the difference between the body types is very easy to spot.

If the Daily Mail has taught me anything, it's that every single woman on the face of the planet is either too fat or too thin, and sometimes both.

Wartime Consiglieri: kradio:
THIS THIS so goddamned much THIS. Sorry, kids-this whole "women starving themselves" meme is ridiculous. FFS, the real problem is men and women who eat eat eat eat. How many diabetes commercials are there on daytime teevee compared to just 10 or 15 years ago? How many times a day a day do you see someone and say to yourself "Holy crap, that person is unhealthily thin?" versus "Holy super size, how does someone get that big?" So far my tally this calendar year is one too skinny woman (actress, of course) versus god knows how many insanely fat humans. Just get out and move, people.

First of all, what you're pulling here is what every dishonest douche on your side does. You try to tie the obesity issue to discussions involving perfectly normal women, conveniently ignoring that there is a whole normal area between underweight and overweight where those girls you call "fat" actually fall into.

Second, you also give yourself away when you claim to not see overly skinny women in everyday life. Most of the fat people I see these days are over 35. In just this past year I've seen more anorexic young women than I ever saw in my life before that. When I go clubbing now I actually see some girls that are maybe 10 lbs away from full-fledged anorexia. Anyone who denies this either hasn't left the house since 2011 or is full of crap.

Well, I don't go clubbing because I'm married and almost 50. So there's that. OTOH, I was young in the 70s and 80s and damn well don't remember this many morbidly obese young people from my youth. In reality, it seems like the recession has skinnied up some people, but before 2008, I was seeing some scary scary fat young people (in my job, weight of passengers is important). Not to mention the scary fat guy in my mirror. But that was 30lbs ago.

Wartime Consiglieri: And for the record, I'm not talking about naturally petite women with normal weight distribution. I'm referring to the malnourished skeletors with sharp knees, boney torsos and hollowed faces that these a$$holes pretend to be the healthy alternative.

You know, it's VERY hard to affect positive change in your health when society at large keeps attaching terms like "beached whale" to you for going in one direction and "skeletor" for going in the other.

As another poster said earlier, when asking what a "well-nourished and healthy" woman is, few seem to be able to supply a meaningful answer.

Incidently "skel" was the nickname the boys on the bus liked to refer to my mother by when she was in primary school in the late 1940's and early 1950's. Just because you can't imagine a time when this was so doesn't mean it didn't happen.

IBreakdance2NIN: Thudfark: IBreakdance2NIN: :makes whale noises:

Breaks out the mukluks and kayak.

/Manning harpoon stations

f*cking Scandinavians

:P

I like the way you think

IBreakdance2NIN: Wartime Consiglieri: IBreakdance2NIN:

Ahem. There's a lower limit, too. Anorexia/bulimia aren't healthy, either.

Exactly. But good luck getting those waif-fetish guys pretending to be health fanatics to ever acknowledge this. They'll tell you with a straight face that a size 8 woman is obese while they drool over a starving woman with the muscle tone of a six-year-old.

And for the record, I'm not talking about naturally petite women with normal weight distribution. I'm referring to the malnourished skeletors with sharp knees, boney torsos and hollowed faces that these a$$holes pretend to be the healthy alternative. And the difference between the body types is very easy to spot.

Yeah, no kidding. Plus I think a lot of folks put entirely too much stock into the number on the scale, forgetting that muscle weighs more than fat.

I'm no skinny Minnie, and could definitely stand to lose some more weight (already down ~15lbs), but I'm nowhere near obese. Even though I'm overweight, I've always had plenty of muscle (not to mention being gifted in the T&A departments). Yet I've certainly been called exactly that, obese. Recent photo:



Everybody's got their preferences, granted, but let's not skew reality here.

How you doing....

AdolfOliverPanties: These are plus-sized?

By fashion industry standards, yes.

The industry standard for sample garments (which the models wear in fashion shows, catalog shoots, etc) is size 0. A model who can't wear standard samples is plus-sized.

It's industry specific jargon and shouldn't be used outside that context.

The problem is that sample sizes have shrunk over the years. In the 50s it was a 6, then it dropped to 4, and now it's 0. There's a growing movement to force the industry to go back to size 4 as the standard.