Eatin' Queer Fetuses for Jesus: To all the Texas farkers and their butthurt: there is a reason Colorado's passing lanes are clogged with slow-driving Texas license plates and not vice-versa.

Very edgy indeed

Paris1127: Keizer_Ghidorah: Paris1127: violentsalvation: It sounds like conditions very similar to the Monument, Horseshoe 2, and Wallow fires in Arizona last year every major forest fire ever. Dry drought conditions, excessive amounts of fuel, relentless winds and shiatty forest management.

FTFY. I know a few fire ecologists. They believe these fires are becoming too large and too common.

Because of the aggressive "put out every fire that pops up" mindset. Fire is an essential cycle, it clears out dead wood and thick brush, aids in returning nutrients to the soil, and helps many species of plants grow (there's one pine tree species that needs a fire in order to open its cones and disperse the seeds). But everyone's afraid of their homes being burned up, air quality going down, or the inconvenience of ash in their swimming pool.

The Yellowstone fire was as horrible as it was because of the lack of natural burns. All of the dead trees, underbrush, dry grass, etc just built up and built up until it triggered a titanic firestorm that was impossible to stop.

Precisely. As for other fires we see in America today, maybe we shouldn't think every National Forest burns the same way as one forest in Arizona...

There is a whole lot to be learned from the infernos that tore through Arizona last year. But still people say "just let it burn, it is good for it and natural", but these types of fires are not healthy or natural. A healthy fire can not exist with the amounts of fuel in our forests and we need to get out there and thin them and bring them back to where a fire can safely go through the forest periodically and play its important role in the forest's ecosystem instead of obliterating it. There are some efforts, private businesses making pellets and OSB and other things but it isn't happening fast enough. It might be an impossible task.

KidneyStone: It's times like these that I remember all of the comments along the lines of "only an idiot lives in hurricane country"

Stay safe, coloradians.

You oughta heard em when California had its last round of wildfires. They were leaping up and down and screaming in delight while throwing their feces through the bars. Same as now.

girljen: tinfoil-hat maggie: //Had a relative in the forest service near here but he went out west to fight a lot of fires and proper management (yea, no one can decide what it is) seems is key

Emphasis mine, and no kidding! It's easy to talk about letting fires burn, but which ones? Where? Nowhere near people's homes, obviously, and people are building homes way the hell out there in the middle of mountain forests. Plowing a 150ft. perimeter around each home would keep them free of fuel, but how many people would be open to that? (genuinely curious) There would obviously be differences between managing fire in uninhabited areas, and managing fire in places where people live. But what happens when ALL of the areas become inhabited? It'll happen.

Things like this make me worried about my wildland firefighter friends, sad for the people whose homes are wrecked (regardless of reason or supposed 'blame', losing all your stuff would suck), and glad I live in suburbia.

/ok, maybe not suburbia, it's actually Aurora
//I can see the smoke, too!

Yea, I know it's gotta be crazy, around here we get the luxury of doing controlled burns in the wet season but what if you don't get even minimal rain for 5-10 years. Also the scope of acreage well I can't relate it blows my mind.

Even here though I've been working to clear underbrush and dead limbs trees from around the house cause one day we'll have a bad drought again . I am in the southeast US so I understand it's very different.

And now a drive by sgooting happens. Cant they wait until after the fire?

Estes is about 25+ miles from this. Shot these yesterday from different vantages up 43 thru Glen Haven from Estes. The winds changed here and smoke has settled in our valley.

Glen Haven

Estes Park

Storm Mountain

Storm Mountain

JesseL: Paris1127: Keizer_Ghidorah: Paris1127: violentsalvation: It sounds like conditions very similar to the Monument, Horseshoe 2, and Wallow fires in Arizona last year every major forest fire ever. Dry drought conditions, excessive amounts of fuel, relentless winds and shiatty forest management.

FTFY. I know a few fire ecologists. They believe these fires are becoming too large and too common.

Because of the aggressive "put out every fire that pops up" mindset. Fire is an essential cycle, it clears out dead wood and thick brush, aids in returning nutrients to the soil, and helps many species of plants grow (there's one pine tree species that needs a fire in order to open its cones and disperse the seeds). But everyone's afraid of their homes being burned up, air quality going down, or the inconvenience of ash in their swimming pool.

The Yellowstone fire was as horrible as it was because of the lack of natural burns. All of the dead trees, underbrush, dry grass, etc just built up and built up until it triggered a titanic firestorm that was impossible to stop.

Precisely. As for other fires we see in America today, maybe we shouldn't think every National Forest burns the same way as one forest in Arizona...

Did something give you the impression that AZ forest fires are mild?

No, they based the forest management strategies for every NF in the US on Arizona. So for an NF in Maine, they use strategies that pertain to Arizona. Alaska? Arizona. They didn't take climate or geography into account. They use a wide brush.

beta_plus: gilgigamesh: Good thing we are presently in a national debate about the efficacy of cutting fire departments.

Presumably the GOP's answer to this is to let the free market decide which homes get destroyed.

But liberals are supposed to be pro-wild fire, so you should like that this is getting dangerous.

Is there a joke or reference I'm missing here?

intelligent comment below: Didn't this fire start in a small children's park or something? Sounds more like arson to me than lightning.

We had quite the lightning storm here on Friday night/ Sat morning. With all the beetle kill trees up here, it's a no brainer, and when there is lightening, we aren't surprised to hear about a fire afterwards. It won't be the last fire here. When the western portion of Rocky Mountain National Park sparks up, it will be insane. Grand Lake won't stand a chance. In the next 5 years, you'll hear more about huge fires. The main fuel is the Beetle Kill Lodge Pole Pines.

intelligent comment below: walkerhound: intelligent comment below: I read an article yesterday about the Colorado fire saying they suspected lightning but the fire started in a park.

Google "Colorado Park" and you'll find there's thousands of them. "Park" has a completely different meaning out west.


I don't mean national park. I mean a park like a childrens park. I'll look for the article.

High Park in Toronto was arson, and that was from over a year ago.

There are a lot of "park" names here. I live in Estes Park. The fire started in High Park. There's also Paradise Park, etc.

santadog: Estes is about 25+ miles from this. Shot these yesterday from different vantages up 43 thru Glen Haven from Estes. The winds changed here and smoke has settled in our valley.

Glen Haven [img819.imageshack.us image 640x427]

Estes Park [img21.imageshack.us image 640x427]

Storm Mountain [img256.imageshack.us image 640x264]

Storm Mountain [img543.imageshack.us image 640x427]

Those shots sorta remind me of volcanic eruption starting. What killed the trees in the foreground of the last two pics? Although Storm Mountain sorta gives a hint.
Straight line wind damage with lightning?

Lost Thought 00: The residents knew what they were getting into when they signed up. No government resources should be spent rescuing people from their poor life decisions.

What poor life decision is this? To move to a place that would one day, unknown to anyone, be ravaged by beetles that would kill all the trees in the area and make for a perfect fire mix? All the trees have died in the last 5 years. How does one prepare for that?

Really? Where do you live, and what natural disasters happen near you? Tornados? Floods? Earthquake? Hurricanes? Big snow storms?

That's such a dork ass statement, it can't possibly be a troll.

tinfoil-hat maggie: santadog: Estes is about 25+ miles from this. Shot these yesterday from different vantages up 43 thru Glen Haven from Estes. The winds changed here and smoke has settled in our valley.

Glen Haven [img819.imageshack.us image 640x427]

Estes Park [img21.imageshack.us image 640x427]

Storm Mountain [img256.imageshack.us image 640x264]

Storm Mountain [img543.imageshack.us image 640x427]

Those shots sorta remind me of volcanic eruption starting. What killed the trees in the foreground of the last two pics? Although Storm Mountain sorta gives a hint.
Straight line wind damage with lightning?

There was a fire on Storm Mountain in the early 90s. It's about 8 miles from Estes as the crow flies, and I thought with the lack of trees, and the height, it would be a decent vantage point. Also thought the dead trees would be interesting with the plume. I wanted to go again at night to get some glow shots, but the winds were gusting at 45mph, and it seemed like too much of a pain in the ass to do.