Kar98: And THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is the typical NPR audience. People who still have answering machines. And not just one, but one for each member of the household.

Read on, douchebag.

Typical Rush listener: Arrogant, ignorant and proud of it.

Debeo Summa Credo: Funny. Its my saturday morning chore radio of choice as well. I hate when I'm late getting going and run into the beginning of the painful to listen to wait wait don't tell me.

Are you confusing Wait Wait Don't Tell Me with Whaddya Know?

I haz a sad.

/Stump the Chumps FTW.

my favorite staff member was the curator of medieval weaponry: Brittany Spears.

I almost had to pull the car over i was laughing so hard.

well this sucks :(

Kind of wish they weren't going to go into the archives and replay old stuff. That will likely feel tired after awhile. They should just let it go.

chaddsfarkprefect: Why have so many PBS-like commercial networks become profitable while PBS itself flounders.

Huh? Name one. And while you're at it, explain exactly how PBS is "floundering" (Hint: the word you're looking for is "founders". It's a nautical term, not a piscatorial one.)

And if you're talking about cable tv channels like Discovery, that's narrow-casting. As to the cash flow, I can explain that to you as well, seeing as I've been in the cable royalties business for over twenty years.

But let's just let your threadshiat go with this: you are underinformed about the subject and the process and should probably refrain from further comment.

"Better to be silent and be thought a fool", and all that.

Since the callers are always asking about twenty year old pieces of shiat, would anyone really notice if they didn't tell anyone and just played re-runs?

Straight from the horses mouth:


From: areps [mailto:] On Behalf Of NPR Communications
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2012 11:07 AM
To: AREPS
Subject: [areps] Car Talk News

Colleagues-

Below is an important note from Doug Berman, Esteemed Producer of Car Talk, about an important transition occurring with the program.

To see the compilation of research and materials Doug mentions, please visit this page, where you will also find an FAQ that will answer additional questions.

If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me directly (///rpnorg) or your NPR Station Relations Manager.

Best,
E------
VP, Programming, NPR

Dear Friends,

I wrote to many of you in 1987, trying to convince you to drop an hour of classical music, and add a call-in show about cars. I hope most of you have since forgiven me. I'm writing now about another transition we're all about to embark upon.

With Tom turning 75 this year, and the show celebrating 25 years on NPR this fall (35 years, if you include the local years on WBUR), the guys have decided that it's time to step back. So as of October, we will no longer be recording new Car Talk shows.

I know that's big news. But we have more big news. And I believe it's good news for everyone (except the Zamfir Pan Flute show that's been coveting Car Talk's timeslot): The series is going to continue.

No, we have not finally tracked down Nunzio, the long lost Tappet Brother. But we do have 25 years worth of pretty spectacular material to draw on. Over the past two years, we've experimented with the best ways to produce new shows using that material and we are now confident that:

1) We can produce a great sounding, fresh, Car Talk show every week from our archives. And, just as important

2) Its performance on your air will match the performance of the existing show.

Let's take those statements one at a time.

Why do we think we can produce a meaningful, fresh sounding show from our archives? We've got some experience in this area. You guys know us pretty well. We invented the "produced call-in" format for public radio. Having created and produced Car Talk and Wait Wait, I like to think we know what makes people laugh and listen. And we know the importance of making every minute of a program engaging.

The key is going to be how we use the archive material. These will not be "throw on a tape" reruns. These will be programs that are produced as if they were new programs, but sourced, carefully and methodically, from the top tier of some 12,500 logged and rated calls in our archives.

In our opinion, the entertainment value of these new archive shows is actually higher than that of a current Car Talk show. 25 years in, we're actually going back and editing the series, to make it better, stronger, and funnier.

The second statement I made concerns the show's performance. Why do we believe this approach will work with listeners? Because it's already working. It would have been malpractice for us not to plan for this eventual transition. In 2010, I told you that the guys would begin gradually stepping back. During this time, we've taken the opportunity to experiment and conduct research.

What have we learned?

Quantitatively: In this last year of production, when our "new programs from the archives" were at their highest percentage of the mix, AudiGraphics shows that Car Talk's power and loyalty both increased.

More specifically, when we asked our researchers to compare the actual listenership of these new archive shows with our "original" programs side by side (which can now be done fairly precisely thanks to people meters), they told us there was no measureable difference in audience between the two.

Could that change? Of course it could. The knowledge that new shows are no longer being recorded may cause some people to feel less compelled to tune in.

That's the reason we'll make the show sound exactly like it does now: While we have an obligation to be honest with our audience about Tom and Ray's plans, and are still exploring how and where to best identify the material as archival, our overall goal will be to make the show sound fresh, alive, and current, as if it could be happening this week, rather than present it as a "best of" or "special presentation."

This decision was reinforced by our qualitative research: We learned that at least in the case of Car Talk, listeners really aren't concerned when the show was recorded, or even if they're hearing something for a second time (and only 1 in 12 listeners has any idea that Car Talk ever repeats anything). To them, funny is funny, and entertaining is entertaining. So clearly, the series has the potential to be timeless.

We realize that we're breaking new ground with this approach. So rest assured, our research won't stop here. We'll be collecting new data as we go forward. And we'll share with you what we learn. And that actual, real world evidence will tell all of us how well we're succeeding and what we can still improve.

So what will you hear on your air in October? You'll hear Car Talk at its best. You'll hear great callers, new funders, new invitations to engage in whatever is on the web site that weekend, the Puzzler, and timely jokes in the "even though" lines that end our show segments. Basically, you'll be getting a fresh, new, "Best of Car Talk" to air every Saturday morning.

What else will stay the same? Well, I'll continue to produce the show (hope that doesn't drive too many of you away), and our Peabody Award-winning staff will be here producing alongside me. We'll continue to provide support materials, like promos, fundraising shows, new premiums for pledge time (stay tuned for a big, 25th anniversary package this fall), and all of our other station supporting activities (that includes the Car Talk Vehicle Donation program). Overall, we'll use our producing skills and talents to ensure that Car Talk continues to sound alive on your station.

I'd love to chain Tom and Ray to their studio chairs and force them to keep making me laugh for another 25 years. But realistically, they've earned the right to change their weekly routines at this point. They're stepping back from a show that is still among the most powerful programs in all of public radio, even 25 years into its run. We see our job as to continue to delight those listeners, and by doing so, serve our stations as well.

Please visit the web page Eric references above to see the research on which we based this decision, and some FAQs we've posted to help answer more of your questions.

In the meantime, I want to express my personal thanks to so many of you who've taken this extraordinary 25-year ride with us so far. We'll do our very best to keep it going strong.

Doug

They sent that e-mail after they read my post, god damnit!

LandOfChocolate: Krieghund: theesir: Not_Todd: And the last reason to listen to NPR goes away.

This American Life would like an hour or so to speak with you about this....

This American Life is not an NPR program.

He said listen to NPR, not NPR programming you pedantic twit (now I know you listen to This American Life). Most, if not all, people tune in to their local NPR affiliate to listen to that show. Whether its an NPR show or not is not important..

Hey, idiot: NPR affiliates are just stations that air some NPR shows. They are not subsidiaries of NPR, they're just public radio stations.

Also, for everyone who likes Wait Wait but hates Whad'ya Know; I don't want you to live on this planet anymore. Wait Wait is the Two and a Half Men to Whad'ya Know's Community, in that Wait Wait goes for the most predictable jokes about any given topic.

MelGoesOnTour: Straight from the horses mouth:

Thank you for sharing that

Theaetetus: So, who exactly is your "editing buddy at NPR"?

Yeah, that claim had the whiff of BS on it when I read it, since the boys are trying to choke out words during most of the laughs, it's pretty hard to see that that sort on "canning" would even be possible.

JokerMattly:
/Surprised how often I hear something on Fresh Air I didn't think I'd enjoy but really did, like a few recent musical interviews

Terry Gross annoys me. Her questions are too long. Sometimes you can feel the pain of the person she's interviewing because they can't get a word in edgewise or remember half of the question.

"When you were making this film, did you draw on personal experience, because you were a boy once and when you were growing up you were in a neighborhood with people in it, and did those people affect you in any way and if so what did you learn from it, and how did you work that into your film, and how did you impress that knowledge on your actors, and was it easy for them to grasp or difficult because it seems like it would be difficult to put someone in your shoes that didn't grow up with you and how does that work anyway..."

Sad, but not completely unexpected. Tom is 75 after all. Actually, subby, they've been doing this show for 35 years. They did it for 10 years as a local broadcast on WBUR.

gunther_bumpass: They're not my favorite, and I get a little irritated that they take about 3 calls during the course of the show, (two of which are from some twits arguing with their spouse over glove compartment space), but anything that isn't Garrison farking Keillor is ok with me. Listening to that maudlin, pug-faced, unfunny, loudly-inhaling bastard is only slightly less boring than eating a cardboard and dust sandwich. Fark that guy and the stupid-ass socks he sleazed into town in.

I'm glad I'm not the only one annoyed by Garrison's loud breathing. I mentioned it once in a Fark thread years ago and everybody called me crazy. I'm half deaf, but I can definitely hear his whistling nose-hairs or deviated septum or whatever it is that makes his breathing so horrendously loud.

It also seems like most of the people on NPR have some sort of speech impediment or clicking teeth or saliva issue.

When I hear this woman's voice, I open the car door and jump onto the highway.

People who like car talk hate Bob and Tom.

It's the same thing, just one is aired on NPR on weekends.

2 sides of the same coin.

/apparently, where i live, doing the NPR shows on saturday is bad and wrong. I get them sunday.
//I don't understand it
///but i work sundays, so it's not like i don't hear them anyway

Theaetetus: "Could... be wor[cough]se... it...... could be... Dianne......... Rehm[wheeze]."

Shame on you.

It's the only substantive talk show where guests actually converse and listen to one another, and Rehm will chide them like a schoolmarm if they are rude. Actual information is conveyed instead of it being the typical shouting match.

You, of all people, should know better.

It's not her fault she has Spasmotic Dysphonia.

chandie: Wait Wait Don't Tell Me

WWDTM had the dirtiest joke ever told on public radio. They were talking about the reports of people going blind after taking Cialis and Viagra. Paula Poundstone started joking about the name "Cialis".

Cialis?
No, but I heard her coming.

CSB: I was wandering around Harvard Square on vacation about 15 years ago and saw an interesting old office building on the corner with beautiful marble stairs and an open door. There was a sign outside for a used book shop so I walked up the stairs to the third floor and lo and behold there was an old-timey wooden office door with a transom and the words "Dewey, Cheatham and Howe" in black stenciled letters on the frosted glass. Mrs. Jitsu took a photo with me in front of it. Pretty awesome.

chaddsfarkprefect: Oh, it was on NPR. No wonder I never heard of it.

Too hipster for NPR? Isn't that like, dividing by zero?

I've only known about the show 3-4 years, but goodness, I've enjoyed it heartily, and my wife and I chuckle at their humor, laughter, and good-natured attitudes as often as we can.

We were shocked and pleasantly surprised when someone told us of the Cars cameos. Excellent and fun.

Good work Click & Clack. Godspeed.

/And don't drive like my brother!

Theaetetus: Optimus Primate: A little inside info here...from my editing buddy at NPR. Oftentimes a bunch of the classic (*to some) "guffaw-style" laughter is simply edited into the show for effect. It's a running joke to see how much they can sometime put in. Not that the brothers don't laugh like that a lot, but the editors MAKE SURE the "laugh quota" is met or exceeded.

Huh. That's odd. You see, I was the assistant chief engineer at WBUR for 8 years, and sat in on many of their shows. I worked with all of the engineers who mix their show, did some side consulting work fixing computers and the network at Car Talk's offices, and have even stayed at one of the producers' awesome house in New Hampshire. I've never seen any canned laughter added to the show at all.

Furthermore, the show comes out of Boston and the only time NPR's studios get their hands on it is after the fully mixed and edited show is sent to them.

So, who exactly is your "editing buddy at NPR"?

He actually works for NPR in Florida (not gonna out him), but did a lot of work up with the locals in Boston as well as NYC. He is a very straight up guy and a good friend who has given me lots of insight into the operations of various NPR shows. I believe the additional laughter thing is something added in recent years (I guess the laugh output was not meeting proper levels or something - as determined by the wonks in charge). The "fully mixed and edited" version you speak of was the one with the laughter added.

He points out that it is well known in the industry and totally not a big deal at all, regarded as just another editing tool to tweak/improve the feel fo the show. People want their guffaws dammit!

There is surprisingly (to me) little mention of it on the web, but check this:

Link

I love NPR, and have been a member of my local station for 20+ years. In no way do I hold it against Tom & Ray's editing team...but now that they are on the way out - shouldn't they be honest?

Theaetetus: "Could... be wor[cough]se... it...... could be... Dianne......... Rehm[wheeze]."

spentmiles: When I hear this woman's voice, I open the car door and jump onto the highway.

[i48.tinypic.com image 450x300]

Let's make fun of people with cancer next!

Deucednuisance: Kar98: And THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is the typical NPR audience. People who still have answering machines. And not just one, but one for each member of the household.

Read on, douchebag.

Typical Rush listener: Arrogant, ignorant and proud of it.

Da fuq? That was the only line IN YOUR STUPID POST!

Also, I don't even listen to broadcast radio. Recordings of the Bavarian State Opera only, thank you very much.

Dodge Darts rusting in junkyards everywhere, are inconsolable.

P.S. My buddy is not an editor per se. But as any NPR station worker can tell you, they wear a lot of hats at times.

I'd listen on occasion, but the show often annoyed me with the same dumb jokes repeated every week and the constant laughing.

But it's probably the only car-themed radio call-in show I'd listen to... At least it was entertaining and often more about people than cars.

MelGoesOnTour: I know that's big news. But we have more big news. And I believe it's good news for everyone (except the Zamfir Pan Flute show that's been coveting Car Talk's timeslot): The series is going to continue.

Hey Dougie? Do us all a favor, take the high road, and just end it. This is a money grab, plain and simple, and your standards should be higher than that. It's not like you don't already have other shows to produce, and I'm sure other shows would love a shot at getting the slot.

chaddsfarkprefect: Oh, it was on NPR. No wonder I never heard of it.

Why have so many PBS-like commercial networks become profitable while PBS itself flounders. Not asking for partisan answers but it can't be just commercial money making it better. Or maybe capitalism isn't so bad; better than constantly begging, huh, PBS?



\back to the Politics tab for you, you tool

chandie: JokerMattly:
/Surprised how often I hear something on Fresh Air I didn't think I'd enjoy but really did, like a few recent musical interviews

Terry Gross annoys me. Her questions are too long. Sometimes you can feel the pain of the person she's interviewing because they can't get a word in edgewise or remember half of the question.


I'm OK with Terry Gross, but I can't stand Krista Tippett's ("Speaking of Faith"/"On Being") voice. Actually, just for timbre or whatnot, it's great, but she has a simpering tone that drives me batty.

wxboy: I think it's also the fact that Whad'ya Know is live, while WWDTM tapes two days ahead of time and is heavily edited. If WWDTM aired live it wouldn't be nearly as entertaining.

As someone who has attended three tapings of WWDTM and heard the shows on-radio later I can say that you're greatly overstating things.

Marshall Willenholly: I'm glad I'm not the only one annoyed by Garrison's loud breathing.

Proximity Effect He speaks very close to the mic in order to get it, so a lot of small noises get picked up.

What bothers me, as a professional singer and trained musician, is the way he insists on improvising harmonies with singers he doesn't really listen to, and how unimaginative those improvisations are. Mostly a lot of repeated Vs and Is, whether those notes are in the chord or not. I don't begrudge him the pleasure of singing with other people, it's one of the great joys in my life. But I don't think he should subject an audience to it. He's just not that good at it. He's a fantastic writer and storyteller, he should stick to that.

Either that or actually show up for music rehearsal or something...

For those who think I am a troll regarding the dubbed laughter, here's another small mention of it...nothing like an article in the New York Times, but just showing that it has been brought up. It's not really talked about outside the industry:

Link

Less dead air, more guffaws!!

Theaetetus: Optimus Primate: A little inside info here...from my editing buddy at NPR. Oftentimes a bunch of the classic (*to some) "guffaw-style" laughter is simply edited into the show for effect. It's a running joke to see how much they can sometime put in. Not that the brothers don't laugh like that a lot, but the editors MAKE SURE the "laugh quota" is met or exceeded.

Huh. That's odd. You see, I was the assistant chief engineer at WBUR for 8 years, and sat in on many of their shows. I worked with all of the engineers who mix their show, did some side consulting work fixing computers and the network at Car Talk's offices, and have even stayed at one of the producers' awesome house in New Hampshire. I've never seen any canned laughter added to the show at all.

Furthermore, the show comes out of Boston and the only time NPR's studios get their hands on it is after the fully mixed and edited show is sent to them.

So, who exactly is your "editing buddy at NPR"?

THIS -- I sense shenanigans in this "canned laughter" claim.

/Thanks Click and Clack -- I won't listen to reruns because that's not how I roll, but I enjoyed and learned a lot from the show.

Pants full of macaroni!!: Erasmus B. Dragon, Bud Tuggli, Heywood Jabuzzoff, Pikup Andropov and the entire Payne-Diaz family should all be getting their resumes in order.

Not to mention Gene Masseth.

calm like a bomb: Hey Dougie? Do us all a favor, take the high road, and just end it. This is a money grab, plain and simple, and your standards should be higher than that. It's not like you don't already have other shows to produce, and I'm sure other shows would love a shot at getting the slot.

Well, let's be honest here... Car Talk is one of the biggest moneymakers for NPR. It only makes sense for NPR to continue to make Car Talk because they survive on donations.

Hence, why lose their most popular show if they can just repackage and edit the old ones that people have either forgotten or have never heard?

Could local affiliates put another show in its place? Certainly, but it's not going to generate the support for their station that Car Talk reruns will. And, unfortunately, it's about business.

chaddsfarkprefect: Oh, it was on NPR. No wonder I never heard of it.

Why have so many PBS-like commercial networks become profitable while PBS itself flounders. Not asking for partisan answers but it can't be just commercial money making it better. Or maybe capitalism isn't so bad; better than constantly begging, huh, PBS?


I'll take the begging over non-stop commercials for gold and boner pills.

Kar98: Da fuq? That was the only line IN YOUR STUPID POST!

Can't even count to three, can you? Poh-TAY-toh.

And again, it was a reference to a cliche from the show, which you'd have known if you'd ever listened to it.

Gonz: One of the many reasons I give to NPR. Thanks for years of entertainment, guys.

For me, they're a lot of the reason that I'm a 30-year member of KQED, my local NPR station. Other reasons are "A Prairie Home Companion," "City Arts & Lectures," "Wait, Wait... Don't Tell Me," "On the Media" and "Fresh Air."
While it's fascinating, I find "This American Life" a little too eerie.

Theaetetus: Optimus Primate: He actually works for NPR in Florida (not gonna out him), but did a lot of work up with the locals in Boston as well as NYC. He is a very straight up guy and a good friend who has given me lots of insight into the operations of various NPR shows. I believe the additional laughter thing is something added in recent years (I guess the laugh output was not meeting proper levels or something - as determined by the wonks in charge).

Unless it was added in the past four years, having not been used for the previous 31, then, no. And your metafilter link is 2005, when I personally can attest that it was not being done, since I've seen the edited ProTools files.

There is a lot of jealousy between stations that originate shows, particularly popular ones: people at small stations hate WBUR, WHYY, WNYC, etc., because those small stations end up airing hours of shows that have someone else's call letters in them. I wouldn't be surprised if your buddy was either making up stories, or passing on someone else's made-up story.

Link

John Solomon mentions it as well...

Two16: Well HAHA HAHA HA HAAHHAWWWW AH AWWWH AWH I guess HAHAHEHEHEHA HAAWWWW WHAHAHAHA that's gonn- HAAAAAAA AHA AHA AHAHEHEHE ;EHEHEHEHE*SNORT* HAHAHAHAAAA AHA AHAAAA that's gonn- HHOOO HAHAHAHAHAHWHWAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAWWWW that's gonna be the last HEHEHAHAHAHAHAAHAHJAHAAAAHAHAAA the last of us! HEHEHEHAHAHAHAAAAH AHAAAA HAAAA AHHAA AHAHAHA AHAAAAA AHAHAHHHHAAAASAAAAAAA!

/won't be missed

I agree -- you won't be missed.