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Why does 'alledged' seem out of place in that statement. It sounds like the LATimes and W Post handed them their ass and they are trying to sound like they are right while apologizing.

Which would explain why Dubya is trailing an unknown democrat in the polls. OK.

In 'Frisco, maybe. Everywhere else...

I know I've said this before, but it bears repeating. I hate nothing more than those who treat politics as a football game. Some people just seem to act like cheerleaders for their "team" ignoring all facts of the "game" and blindly rooting for their team no matter what.

They will NEVER admit they were wrong, no matter how obvious it is, they will ALWAYS support their "team" no matter what absurd or even dangerous policies they come up with.

These are the type of people who, when confronted with an incontravertible fact of their party that NO freedom loving person could agree with, they just point out that the other side does it too, like that makes it somehow right. This just goes to their mentality, they really have no sense of reality, to them it really is a game, and that's disturbing and sad at the same time.

Chelsea is a perfect example of this, not that there aren't "liberal" examples as well. He will never, ever stray from the republican party line, if he is pointed out to be wrong about something, he will just respond with an offhand insult and change the subject. He has no allegiance to truth, only to his ego, which is pathetically and inextricably tied to a corrupt political organization. He's not a troll, alot of people are trolls, he is a propagandists dream, willing to believe everything he's told as long as the source has the proper affiliation. God that's pathetic.

Now, having said this, at least he pays attention and has opinions. Apathy is more dangerous than idiocy, just not much :) I'm not going after Chelsea so much as I am using him as an example. Anyone with absolute allegiance to a POLITICIAN deserves scorn, and lots of it.

taraque

Yes, At least in your particular example. I've seen my share of liberals blow statistics out thier ass too, though.

CatPeople

I'm glad you asked that. Here's my prediction:

-Elections suspended in the intrest of national security.
-Civil war breaks out.
-Civil strife causes stock market to plunge.
-2nd Great Depression.
-Europe, Russia, and China sell weapons to rebels.
-PNAC orders them to stop.
-Resistence nations refuse, start sending troops to aid rebels.
-PNAC retaliates with nuclear strike.
-Resistence nations retaliate with own nuclear strike.
-three billion people die. Civilization is reduced to Middle Ages era technology.
-Christian theocracy takes over North America Contient, subjugates populace to Second Dark Ages.

300 years later:
-rebuilt European Union sends explorer ships to learn the fate of North America.
-Explorers are mistaken for demons. The christian high council calls for holy crusades against the foreigners.
-Dark Age America gets ass beaten by Industrial Age Europe. Promptly conquered and colonized.
-Europe will do everything in its power to make sure there is not a revolution this time, least the events of the early 21st century repeat themselves in another 300 years.

Who cares about the majority opinion of Americans? Look at the billboard top twenty albums, or our president elect. Nuts on the majority. With abortion, we need to listen to the opinions of people who work with the issue daily. (Non scientifically) I polled a few doctors, who have witnessed or taken part in abortion procedures. Most describe an early term abortion (first-early second trimester) as scraping embryonic jelly out a womb. However late term abortions, which are rare but legal, look more like a fetus being speared with a scalpel, or like a fetus being sucked out via vacuum. We need well thought out restrictions on abortions that disregarding the opinions of the bomb packing Christian freaks, and the hippy baby killers.
P.S. I am aware there are some abortion restrictions, however third trimester fetuses, regardless conception circumstances, need to be protected from infanticide.

Brockway

There's a big motherfarking difference between strategic operations to fool the enemy army and domestic propaganda to lie to the American population.

We know that it was The Office of Special Plans.

We know they were intentionally lying to promote the decision to go to war.
http://www.usnews.com/usnews/politics/whispers/documents/truth.pdf

And we know that they lied about Jessica Lynch to deceive the American public about the realities of war.

Emperor-Jay

intesting theory . sounds realistic till about the end with explorer ships, demonizing and holy crusade, that part was gay.

Brockway

1. I love the way people on Fark make claims to know something about this. The fact is, practically 100% of you know zilch about it. You think you know something because you hear it from the news media, or the pentagon, or Lynch herself, or whomever. But unless you were there, all you have as what someone else would have you believe.

2. Deception is an important part of war, whether you agree with the war effort or not. Do you think we told the other side when and where we were landing our troops in WWII? The press has a job to do, and if they go out on a limb and make mistakes of fact, do you think the pentagon has some obligation to come out and correct it? If you recall Gulf War I, remember how the press was playing up the amphibious landing in Kuwait? That served the purpose of the pentagon. That was not a lie told by the pentagon. Do you think the pentagon should have come out after those press stories and said, "Uhm...we just want to clarify, we will actually be attacking from the west"?

Who said LYNCH couldn't remember? Where did you hear that? Was the press, or the pentagon, or Lynch? I bet on the press.

Let me get this straight - Kelly Lynch in a direct quote, said she didn't remember being raped. And this is commie, Liberal media spin??? Wow. You need to go on Bill O'Reilly's show.

Deception is part of war, yes. But what part of war is spinning the story of Kelly Lynch being a great war hero and the poster girl for the war on Iraq AFTER she has been rescued? If they had revealed the truth about Lynch, would the war have been compromised somehow???

Clinton News Network

You'd think they'd have something more Iraq-themed after CNN International's GWII coverage and the bit where they were burying Saddamite atrocity stories so as to secure the goodwill of the Iraqi government regarding their news crews.

You were another one of those people who predicted we would find WMD in the first month in Iraq, right?

i don't remember any exact time table for the prediction of finding WMD's, ZipBeep, but i do seem to recall a few other people talking about WMD's, namely...

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998.

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002.

:)

ZipBeep

I gotta say that Kelly Lynch was super hot in Drugstore Cowboy. ;)

Speaking at a fundraising event, presidential hopeful Al Sharpton denied he had anything to do with the fabrication and exploitation of Jessica Lynchs alleged rape.

Chelsea: Why would you denounce the "popular vote" argument for Gore, when you just got done repeatedly telling us that all the Repugs got more of the popular vote than Clinton?

Oh, because you're a moron. Got it.

Chelsea Clinton Is Carrot Top's Lost Twin


You were another one of those people who predicted we would find WMD in the first month in Iraq, right?

i don't remember any exact time table for the prediction of finding WMD's, ZipBeep, but i do seem to recall a few other people talking about WMD's, namely...

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

done. Iraq no longer had the capacity to develop WMD

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998.

Done. The threat was diminished to the point of being non-existant.

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

He certainly has, but they are no longer stored anywhere. They were destroyed.

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002.

He certainly was. Past tense.

:)

You forgot to mention which of those 3 decided to go to war and allowed for US soldiers to die, without a shred of credible evidence. Maybe you can include that in your next post.

I think the REAL issue here is how will I profit from this war? Selling Bibles in Iraq has been done to death, Iraqi babies are worth almost nothing on the black market (thank you Cambodia), and why can't I get no Tang 'round here? Well? Answer me!

Everyone who posted in this thread is stupid.

Yes I know what that says about me.

And in other news CNN reports that the sky is blue.

SchlingFo


"I have shot both of these, and while the AKs aren't quite as accurate as the M16s, they are much better suited for the desert environment."

Aren' quite as accurate? Err... They are much less acurate. with an AK, at best, you'd get 5" group @ 100 yards. My Colt w/20" chrome barrel hit's sub 1 inch groups at the range. Also, the 223 is a much higher velocity round than the 7.62 x 39 and bing with it almost as much kentic engergy upon hitting it's target so it does just as much damage. Ballistics on a 223 are also provide a much more predictable shot pattern because cross winds effect it less.

So, what makes the AK better suited for a desert envoirnment than an M-16? Also remember, you don't hear about AK's jamming in the field because usually there is no enemy left to tell stories about it so you really don't know if the AK jams less or more. From my experience, the AK jamms more regarless of what mag I use. My AR has NEVER jammed on me even without it regular cleaning.

The sand sticks to the lube and cakes up, causing the bolt

"Any sand sticks to the bolt if you use too much lube. However, as I said earlier, the M16 and M4 like to jam up even under optimal conditions with good maintenance."

Not true. Hell, I can dunk my Colt with a round chambered in a vat of mud (done it before just for fun), leave it there for 2 or 3 days. Come back and fire and it never jams.

"Will someone here please inform airzonk why you don't use water to clean a weapon. I'm really not in the mood to explain it."

Truthfully, soapy water works great on Aluminum and chrome with a good bore brush. M-16 recievers for the most part are made of forged and even milled Aluminum but forged
is most common. Most soldiers wouldn't use it, or leave the rifle un lubed if THEY had to pay for it, but since it isn't there's they leave it dry just for the conditions.

Well on the Reagan movie, I'm sure nothing they were going to show was anywhere near the truth. Here then, brought to you direct from Hollywood.

Ronnie, was an informant for McCarthy. Ron, had very little scruples about turning in fellow actors, screenwriters etc. Perhaps it was some bizzare patriotism, or simply eliminating the competition, who knows.

Now Nancy on the other hand was shall we say the Monica Lewinsky of her day. Having very little talent other than her oral fixations she was looking for a trusty mule to hitch her wagon to and bring her into fame and fortune.

Well in Ron she found what she was looking for. Men, sometmes after the fact like to talk. And if you're impassioned about a cause, well who better to talk to about it then the one who's just swallowed your load? Nancy listened, then ran to Ron and spilled the beans. Ron listened and reported. Ron and Nancy were rewarded for the rest of their lifes for their efforts for America.

Oh, and about Jessica. Isn't the pretty female soldier captured by the Arabs henchmen and butt banged an Internet pr0n story from about 5 or 6 years ago?

Chelsea, In a post deriding us for not discussing issues you set forth these as the real issues which are being avoided:

1. the democrats are in a free fall death spiral.

2. the majority of americans want republicans in charge of this country.

3. the majority of americans are against abortion.

4. the internet.

While most of these have been refuted in this thread (with logic and data) you have failed to even mention these issues again in the two posts you have made since then.

I guess it's obvious who really refuses to discuss the issues.

You were another one of those people who predicted we would find WMD in the first month in Iraq, right?

i don't remember any exact time table for the prediction of finding WMD's, ZipBeep, but i do seem to recall a few other people talking about WMD's, namely...

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998.

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002.

:)

I really really really like cheesecake



DOESN'T ANYONE ELSE LIKE CHEESECAKE?!?! CAN'T WE ALL AGREE ON THIS ONE SIMPLY THING AT LEAST?!?!?

jdave, who the hell asked for your opinion? I certainly didnt. when I want your opinion I'll give it to you. this isnt a cliche contest, so fark off.

Well, since Jessica Lynch WAS the only person actually there, I think I'll trust her version before anyone else's, including the medias. The fact that she pretty much refuses to go into specifics regarding what parts of the "official" story are outright false leads me to believe that she has been "coached" on what she is and is not allowed to talk about. I have no way of proving this since it will undoubtedly be buried in secrecy, it just seems logical and it's CERTAINLY been done before to other soldiers who become tools of the Pentagon's PR machine.

I just find it funny that the same people who were lionizing her as a hero and "America's Daughter come home" now try to paint her as a profiteer, almost as if she planned this just so she could make a book deal, just because her version of the story isn't the one they like. Goddamn that's DISGUSTING.

I do not like Cheesecake.

I don't like cheesecake, not because it doesn't taste good, but just because you like it.


hehehehe :)

Sir Spanksalot

The part about Europe re-colonizing North America only gets included whenever I go off my meds. When I'm medacated back into semi-sanity, the results of the 2004 elections seem all but inevitable:

1) If Bush's popularity is still high, he will be re-elected.

2) If Bush's popularity is low, the new electronic voting booths will be reprogramed to count 2/3 of the votes for Bush.

3) If rigging the electronic voting booths is not feasible, PNAC will allow terrorists to commit another national tragedy on the same scale as 9/11 which will give Bush the leaverage required to suspend elections in the intrest of national security.

George Walker Bush is destinied to be America's last president.

.
.

I like cheesecake, too.

SneakinSally Cheesecake and pancakes. Two things everyone likes!

Actually IAmSuperBeast, by posting you sort of are asking for all of our opinions. If you don't want feedback on your posts then well, you know.

farking cheesecake killed my brother.

Cheesecake is just a huge lie!

There is no cheese in the moon either.

I like cheescake too.

IAmSuperBeast

When I want you to open your mouth, I'll rattle my zipper.
thankyuhverrymuch.

Fark.com now says this post has Infinity comments.

Hey for those of you camping on this thread (ALL DAY!) there are new articles on FARK's main page.

Let's all go to a new thread and fight!

Interesting theory a certain farker proposed earlier: Is Jessica Lynch the "Whore of Babylon" prophesized in Revelations?

At anyrate, Bush is most certainly the Anti-Christ and PNAC is the Beast.

Fark.com now says this post has Infinity comments.

nevermind, no flame potential in those... sigh

Fark.com now says this post has Infinity comments.

Chelsea, you sound pretty bloody deluded and childish, also rather blindly conservative. You seem to take great solace in the fact you think the democrats "are in a free fall death spiral". This isn't a farking game, what about the fact your country's in the shiatter?

shylock,

Ignorance and arrogance are a terrible combination, yet you seem to embody both qualities in quite an efficient little package.

It is quite obvious that you have not read all my posts in this thread. My opinion is clearly stated - take all the shots that you want.

Original - No. I'm sure that others feel the same as me and many do not. Futsal fred listed three specific items that highly agree with him on. Please check my original post for more detail.

Now, close your eyes and think real hard... No one countered the three items that he made. Since you are a little slow, lets review quickly:

1) It was NEVER the Pentagon or Centcom who put out this story. Indeed, in briefings they refused to comment at the time. It was the media that concocted most of the story from partial reports they got from Iraqis.

2) The basic rescue story is true. They sent special forces, fully armed, into unsecure territory to grab a US soldier. They did engage in a firefight.

3) The Iraqi doctors who treated Ms. Lynch are saying that SHE is lying through her teeth in order to sell books. They claim she's just full of crap.


Ok, you like quotes: find one from a named Pentagon or Centcom staff member - Not a nameless "official", but an official statement. Good luck.

I don't care how many Iraqi doctors would have, could have, or should have returned Lynch back over to the U.S. It just didn't happen that way. U.S. forces raided the hospital period.

The facts about the rape of Lynch are disputed by Iraqi doctors. Good luck arguing against this one.

If you are offended and perplexed by my post, please skip them in the future. Quite frankly, your posts are not worth my time.

Emperor-Jay

That kind of screwball new age conspiracy theorizing won't get anybody anywhere.

didn't you all get the memo? the new topic on this page is cheesecake. stop your politics gibberjabber and talk some cheesecake. Chocolate? New York Style? With fruit? Plain?