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(AlterNet)   "Good News" clubs teach children in public schools the Biblical importance of killing all nonbelievers   (blogs.alternet.org) divider line 413
    More: Asinine, Bibles, elementary schools, New Apostolic Reformation, youth pastor, Second American Revolution, eastern religions, Islamic fundamentalists, Child Evangelism Fellowship  
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14538 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Jun 2012 at 11:41 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-04 02:08:14 AM

s2s2s2:
Yeah, why can't you?



What exactly was I wrong about?

Feel free to point out what here does not prove me right

Even in the later years of the Third Reich, many Protestant and Catholic clergy within Germany persisted in believing that Nazism was in its essence in accordance with Christian precepts.

From the mid 1930s, anti-Christian elements within the Nazi party became more prominent, however they were restrained by Hitler.

A number of historians maintain that the Nazis had a general covert plan, which some argue existed before the Nazis' rose to power,[53] to destroy Christianity within the Reich.[54][55][56][57][58][59][60] To what extent a plan to subordinate the churches and limit their role in the country's life existed before the Nazi rise to power, and exactly who among the Nazi leadership supported such a move remains contested."[53] However other historians maintain no such plan existed

Summarizing a 1945 Office of Strategic Services report, New York Times columnist Joe Sharkey, stated that the Nazis had a plan to "subvert and destroy German Christianity," which was to be accomplished through control and subversion of the churches and to be completed after the war.[65][66] However the report stated this goal was limmited to a "sector of the National Socialist party," namely Alfred Rosenberg and Baldur von Schirach
 
2012-06-04 02:09:00 AM
Wow. There is an actual argument on how Christian/non-Christian nazis were.

They were farking Nazis! Some were Christians, atheist, pagans, and Catholic. But they all were farking Nazis!

Any who opposed them, catholic, pagan, christian and atheist was killed.
 
2012-06-04 02:10:38 AM

Kali-Yuga: But I'm sure Torquemada wasn't a "real christian" either right?


Considering his conduct was directly contrary to the teachings of Jesus....
 
2012-06-04 02:11:37 AM

intelligent comment below: s2s2s2:
Yeah, why can't you?


What exactly was I wrong about?

Feel free to point out what here does not prove me right

Even in the later years of the Third Reich, many Protestant and Catholic clergy within Germany persisted in believing that Nazism was in its essence in accordance with Christian precepts.

From the mid 1930s, anti-Christian elements within the Nazi party became more prominent, however they were restrained by Hitler.

A number of historians maintain that the Nazis had a general covert plan, which some argue existed before the Nazis' rose to power,[53] to destroy Christianity within the Reich.[54][55][56][57][58][59][60] To what extent a plan to subordinate the churches and limit their role in the country's life existed before the Nazi rise to power, and exactly who among the Nazi leadership supported such a move remains contested."[53] However other historians maintain no such plan existed

Summarizing a 1945 Office of Strategic Services report, New York Times columnist Joe Sharkey, stated that the Nazis had a plan to "subvert and destroy German Christianity," which was to be accomplished through control and subversion of the churches and to be completed after the war.[65][66] However the report stated this goal was limmited to a "sector of the National Socialist party," namely Alfred Rosenberg and Baldur von Schirach


What hitler believed Christianity was
/autocorrect won't even recognize hitler as a proper noun.
 
2012-06-04 02:12:01 AM

Darth_Lukecash: Wow. There is an actual argument on how Christian/non-Christian nazis were.

They were farking Nazis! Some were Christians, atheist, pagans, and Catholic. But they all were farking Nazis!

Any who opposed them, catholic, pagan, christian and atheist was killed.


No. Jews, atheists, etc. were all sent to death camps.

But that's not the argument. The argument was what the Nazi's thought they were. And they claimed to be true Christians.
 
2012-06-04 02:13:37 AM

s2s2s2: What hitler believed Christianity was
/autocorrect won't even recognize hitler as a proper noun.



None of you have put forth a factual argument to counter that Hitler considered himself a Christian and the Nazi party was Christian. /The end
 
2012-06-04 02:14:02 AM
Filter pwned. What hitler thought Christianity was is not equal to what Jesus said salvation/Christianity is.
 
2012-06-04 02:14:04 AM
Kali-Yuga: The only reason the "no true scotsman" fallacy may not apply is that there are as many definitions of what it is to be a christian as there are christians.
Religious apologists are experts at moving the goal posts and being deliberately vague on what exactly constitutes a "real christian"


But I'm sure Torquemada wasn't a "real christian" either right?


Except that when one does something that would be considered against Christian doctrine, including creating their own cult or doctrine to support those actions, the claim of No True Scottsman isn't fallacious. It's a case where the Fallacist's Fallacy applies.

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/relevance/fallacists/

The fallacist's fallacy involves rejecting an idea as false simply because the argument offered for it is fallacious. Having examined the case for a particular point of view, and found it wanting, it can be tempting to conclude that the point of view is false. This, however, would be to go beyond the evidence.
 
2012-06-04 02:14:33 AM

WhyteRaven74: It's more than a verse that's missing, it's an entire parable they're apparently completely ignorant of.


Yeah, pretty much.
 
2012-06-04 02:15:03 AM

BronyMedic: Bevets: 2) Christians have been around for nearly two thousand years and have not engaged in genocide.

Bevets, you know you're not a very good liar, don't you?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8whn597qTY


That was not at all what I was expecting. Guess I should have read the user name. +1
 
2012-06-04 02:15:16 AM

GAT_00: MaudlinMutantMollusk: This thread is a Godwin waiting to happen

/is that a Godwin in itself?

Bevets: Christians have been around for nearly two thousand years and have not engaged in genocide.

And there it is, brought to you by the original worthless troll-bot.


How hasn't everyone just put Bevets on "ignore" at this point? To those who haven't, when you're not online, do you have arguments with trees, dogs, or newborns?
 
2012-06-04 02:16:16 AM

s2s2s2: Filter pwned. What hitler thought Christianity was is not equal to what Jesus said salvation/Christianity is.



And that was never the topic of debate.

The Crusades were never true Christian and not what Jesus would want either.

Your failed point is a strawman. Good day.
 
2012-06-04 02:17:04 AM

intelligent comment below: s2s2s2: What hitler believed Christianity was
/autocorrect won't even recognize hitler as a proper noun.


None of you have put forth a factual argument to counter that Hitler considered himself a Christian and the Nazi party was Christian. /The end


I never claimed he didn't think he was. I have no idea what he thought he was. Jesus said we'd know them by their fruits, he explained in great detail what those fruits were. Adolf didn't bear those fruits, so he wasn't a Christian.
 
2012-06-04 02:17:17 AM
Straelbora: How hasn't everyone just put Bevets on "ignore" at this point? To those who haven't, when you're not online, do you have arguments with trees, dogs, or newborns?

We like to make fun of the mentally handicapped.
 
2012-06-04 02:18:53 AM

Straelbora: GAT_00: MaudlinMutantMollusk: This thread is a Godwin waiting to happen

/is that a Godwin in itself?

Bevets: Christians have been around for nearly two thousand years and have not engaged in genocide.

And there it is, brought to you by the original worthless troll-bot.

How hasn't everyone just put Bevets on "ignore" at this point? To those who haven't, when you're not online, do you have arguments with trees, dogs, or newborns?


It would be more interesting than watching people whine about bevets.
 
2012-06-04 02:20:19 AM

Bevets: "Good News" clubs teach children in public schools the Biblical importance of killing all non believers

This headline is full of fail. 1) For the Secular Fundamentalist: these clubs are not held during school hours. They are held after hours when the general public has access to public schools. 2) Christians have been around for nearly two thousand years and have not engaged in genocide.


Absolute lie. They have, indeed, indulged in genocide. From attempting to wipe out the Jews in Europe during the middle ages, to attempting to wipe out the "heathen" muslims in the middle ages, to wiping out the American Indian, to wiping out the Jews under Hitler.
 
2012-06-04 02:20:47 AM

Darth_Lukecash: Wow. There is an actual argument on how Christian/non-Christian nazis were.

They were farking Nazis! Some were Christians, atheist, pagans, and Catholic. But they all were farking Nazis!


Which is why the nazi's closed down the German Freethinkers League in the spring of 1933, when Hitler outlawed all atheistic and freethinking groups in Germany, and it was turned into a to a bureau advising the public on church matters.

The German census of May 1939 indicates that 54 percent of Germans considered themselves Protestant and 40 percent considered themselves Catholic, with only 3.5 percent claiming to be neo-pagan "believers in God," and 1.5 percent unbelievers. This census came more than six years into the Hitler era.

Nazi Christians didn't abandon basic Christian doctrines, like the divinity of Jesus. The actions of Hitler and the Nazis were as "Christian" as those of people during the Crusades or the Inquisition. Germany saw itself as a fundamentally Christian nation and millions of Christians enthusiastically endorsed Hitler and the Nazi Party, seeing both as embodiments of German and Christian ideals.

So, no, the nazi's weren't atheists.
 
2012-06-04 02:22:56 AM
i.imgur.com
 
2012-06-04 02:23:32 AM

Straelbora: GAT_00: MaudlinMutantMollusk: This thread is a Godwin waiting to happen

/is that a Godwin in itself?

Bevets: Christians have been around for nearly two thousand years and have not engaged in genocide.

And there it is, brought to you by the original worthless troll-bot.

How hasn't everyone just put Bevets on "ignore" at this point? To those who haven't, when you're not online, do you have arguments with trees, dogs, or newborns?


You know; sometimes, even trees have a good point or two. It's been known to happen.

/ we do it for the lulz; the only reason anyone does anything
 
2012-06-04 02:23:54 AM
Kali-Yuga: So, no, the nazi's weren't atheists.

Who claimed they were? Besides from fundamentalist kooks like Bevets?
 
2012-06-04 02:25:21 AM

sharpiegreed: I am a Good News Club volunteer.
If followed correctly, it is simply church for children. They have a meal, sing bible songs, have a basic bible lesson (like the Good Samaritan), play games for small prizes, memorize a bible verse, and have a story about a missionary.

In no way, shape, or form should there be anything else going on. It is no different than traditonal Vacation Bible School or Sunday School.

I see that the article is talking about a lesson in next year's plan, which I have not seen and can't comment on it's accuracy.

Just because some Christians are crazy and fanatical doesn't mean every Christian is crazy and fanatical.

I did not convert to Christianity until I was 30 years old. I have been on both sides of the fence and both sides have ridiculous assumptions about the other.

The most amazing part of the Good News Club for me is that I know for alot of kids, the meal we serve them is the only decent food they will get for the rest of the day and sometimes the praise and attention we give is all they will get outside of the classroom. Sometimes including the classroom.

These children are not forced to go to club. It is a completely voluntary club. Parents sign permission slips. If you have any earnest questions about my experience with the Good News Club , EIP.

I'm not trying to change any one person's opinion. I just wanted to share my experience.


So, like a lot of soup kitchens, come for the chow, but you have to stay for the sermon? Why not just feed the kids if they need it and spare the prosletyzing?

When I lived in the Dominican Republic, a lot of people were convinced that the major religion in the US is either Jehovah's Witness or Mormon, because the JWs and the Mormons both open up rec centers with basketball courts and free pizzas, etc. , and then tell the kids that the US is wealthy and powerful because it's God's Chosen Nation because it's a majority JW/Mormon nation, depending on who's peddling the propaganda.

On the other hand, I've run across Mennonite missionaries throughout Latin America. They just kind of hang out and do good stuff, help out poor people, give out food, and hope that their Christian example might encourage others to learn more about their faith. Guess which group is making the largest inroads: Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, or Mennonites.
 
2012-06-04 02:25:48 AM
"I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so."

( Adolf Hitler, from John Toland [Pulitzer Prize winner], Adolf Hitler, New York: Anchor Publishing, 1992, p. 507. )
 
2012-06-04 02:26:21 AM
Christians have been violently persecuting each other since they first gained political power. In that regard, the Christian Nazis are no different than the rest of Christianity.
 
2012-06-04 02:28:41 AM

Sabyen91: 100 Watt Walrus: Lionel Mandrake: Fun fact: the vast majority of Germans in the 1930s and 40s were devout Christians!

Fun fact: the vast majority of Germans in the 1930s and '40s weren't Nazis and had little to do with the war or the genocide.

Look, there are a lot of good and easy arguments that can be made against what Bevets said (or really, anything Bevets says), but this one is just stupid.

Actually German citizens knew what was happening.

/Just following orders isn't just something people made up.


Yes, all Germans knew. They all had access to news networks from around the world, and could tune in to the latest broadcasts from overseas without penalty. The press in Nazi Germany was as free as any in the world. Stories about death camps and the slaughter on the Eastern Front were almost a daily staple. At any rate, there were no penalties for passing on stories from friends or relatives about what they might have seen, and the people involved in atrocities were always proud to tell their friends and families what they had seen and done. There was a war going on with the front hundreds or even thousands of miles away, but all Germans knew exactly what was going on in those far-away lands. Besides, no Germans were ever executed for passing on rumors or stories that contradicted official stories. Germans were unique in that they had access to all this information, and yet did nothing. No Germans opposed the Nazis either. No other people is as evil as they were.

/amirite?
 
2012-06-04 02:28:54 AM
Bookmark, I may take part later, if the godwin shiat storms die down and the alt-trolls finish up posting.
 
2012-06-04 02:31:20 AM

Bevets: Christians have been around for nearly two thousand years and have not engaged in genocide.


OK, now you're being deliberately obtuse.

/Notice how I said "obtuse" instead of "stupid."
//Just my way of being polite.
///On an unrelated note: how much does Drew pay you per month?
////Cause this shiat is pure comedy gold.
 
2012-06-04 02:31:35 AM

BronyMedic:
Except that when one does something that would be considered against Christian doctrine


Considered against christian doctrine by who? Who gets to decide what constitutes christian doctrine? Because as far as I know there are thousands of sects of christianity that all have their own opinions on that.

Each sect has their own definition of "Christian" that agrees with their own beliefs about the nature of Jesus, God, church tradition, written text, evolved theology, the cultures in which they are implanted, etc. There appears to be no way to compromise on a single definition that is acceptable to all

Because of this, apologists like you can claim anyone doing anything you don't agree with to be not a "real christian"
 
2012-06-04 02:33:46 AM

Kali-Yuga: Nazi Christians didn't abandon basic Christian doctrines, like the divinity of Jesus.


There was little difference between Nazi ideas of what to do with Jews and Martin Luther's ideas. The Nazis just had better technology with which to carry out their plans.

/Waaah! Martin Luther wasn't a real Christian!
 
2012-06-04 02:34:58 AM

Kali-Yuga: Considered against christian doctrine by who? Who gets to decide what constitutes christian doctrine? Because as far as I know there are thousands of sects of christianity that all have their own opinions on that.


The easiest answer is, does it follow with what Jesus taught? Jesus was rather unequivocal when it came to how people should live and treat each other.
 
2012-06-04 02:37:26 AM

Kali-Yuga:
Because of this, apologists like you can claim anyone doing anything you don't agree with to be not a "real christian"


I don't want to step on your argument, but I'm just curious. Do you lump all Muslims together?
 
2012-06-04 02:38:45 AM

brap: Take it down a notch with the namecalling, you bloviating hoagie-biting mansandwich


That's so beautiful.
 
2012-06-04 02:39:27 AM

WhyteRaven74:
The easiest answer is, does it follow with what Jesus taught? Jesus was rather unequivocal when it came to how people should live and treat each other.


That part about casting the first stone was a later addition to the Gospel.

There is also that whole 'torturing in Hell for all eternity if you don't believe in him' that some people might find a tad unenlightened.
 
2012-06-04 02:39:27 AM

Kali-Yuga: Darth_Lukecash: Wow. There is an actual argument on how Christian/non-Christian nazis were.

They were farking Nazis! Some were Christians, atheist, pagans, and Catholic. But they all were farking Nazis!

Which is why the nazi's closed down the German Freethinkers League in the spring of 1933, when Hitler outlawed all atheistic and freethinking groups in Germany, and it was turned into a to a bureau advising the public on church matters.

The German census of May 1939 indicates that 54 percent of Germans considered themselves Protestant and 40 percent considered themselves Catholic, with only 3.5 percent claiming to be neo-pagan "believers in God," and 1.5 percent unbelievers. This census came more than six years into the Hitler era.

Nazi Christians didn't abandon basic Christian doctrines, like the divinity of Jesus. The actions of Hitler and the Nazis were as "Christian" as those of people during the Crusades or the Inquisition. Germany saw itself as a fundamentally Christian nation and millions of Christians enthusiastically endorsed Hitler and the Nazi Party, seeing both as embodiments of German and Christian ideals.

So, no, the nazi's weren't atheists.


He also shut down Catholic youth groups. And forbade any crucifixes in schools. And tried to get children out of religious schools. At the same time he also had God Is With Us on some military units buckles.

My point being that the Nazi wanted party/National loyalty. I didn't say they were all atheist.

There were atheist among hitlers group. The only thing Hitler demanded was loyalty to his cause and you werent a Jew.

There were many religious people who followed him... Just as there was a German resistance movement that has been downplayed by history.
 
2012-06-04 02:41:43 AM

WhyteRaven74: The easiest answer is, does it follow with what Jesus taught? Jesus was rather unequivocal when it came to how people should live and treat each other.


So what percentage of the people who claim to be christians are "real christians" in your opinion?
 
2012-06-04 02:43:06 AM
Not news, extremists are bad of any stripe or color and people who are not truly religious, will manipulate religious people to get what they want. Atheism is a religion, and their nutjobs are just as bigoted and bad as ones toting a Bible or Koran.

The only true religion should be the Golden Rule Religion, with it's One Commandment. If only people weren't so stupid.
 
2012-06-04 02:44:43 AM
They need to stop all this silliness and get back to teaching kids that we're all going to drown in a man-made global warming flood.
 
2012-06-04 02:48:00 AM

sharpiegreed: The most amazing part of the Good News Club for me is that I know for alot of kids, the meal we serve them is the only decent food they will get for the rest of the day and sometimes the praise and attention we give is all they will get outside of the classroom. Sometimes including the classroom.


Ah, the typical religionist method of preying on the weak, lonely and needy in the hopes they'll eventually buy your line of bull out of gratitude or desperation.

Carry on, then.

/You could just provide the meal without the preaching
//If you really cared about them, and not about scoring brownie points with God
 
2012-06-04 02:49:23 AM

Terrible Old Man: Atheism is a religion


That's not going to help your viewpoint if you want to be taken seriously.
 
2012-06-04 02:50:14 AM

omeganuepsilon: viewpoint


err, image?
/whatever
 
2012-06-04 02:54:01 AM
Wow, nice thread derail. Was it intentional to distract people from the Christian children being indoctrinated to kill? Who knows. It'd be nice to go back to it, though, since it matters a lot more right now than a 70-year-old war and a dead madman's thoughts.
 
2012-06-04 02:56:23 AM
... is anyone else under the impression that Bevets and such others are just alts that Drew and his like use to up their advertising click-counts?

/hold on, there's someone at the door
 
2012-06-04 02:58:23 AM

Kali-Yuga: So what percentage of the people who claim to be christians are "real christians" in your opinion?


I dunno, not something I particularly concern myself with.
 
2012-06-04 03:06:09 AM

imprimere: I don't want to step on your argument, but I'm just curious. Do you lump all Muslims together?


I "lump together" all god-botherers regardless of creed as people who would rather persist in a comfortable delusion than accept some of the stark realities of life.

Religious belief is a culturally acceptable mass delusion, and like other mental illnesses, there is a spectrum of severity. One one end of the spectrum you have moderate believers who claim the contradictory parts of their scripture and outright historical and scientific inaccuracies contained within as allegory, and on the other end you have fundamentalist biblical literalists.

Religion is a culturally evolved institution that adopts specific answers to circular questions and establishes authority schemes to indoctrinate people to those beliefs, substituting dogma for reason and truth.
It provides myths to answer real questions, and those myths are protected by their unfalsifiability, threats and promises. The paradoxical idea that a lack of evidence is a positive virtue is self sustaining because it is self-referential, and once a believer has been indoctrinated into thinking this way, it automatically undermines any opposition to its self.

Until recent history religion has also had a traditional exemption from analysis and criticism, this is one of the reasons it's such an insidious meme.
 
2012-06-04 03:13:01 AM

Trance354: ... is anyone else under the impression that Bevets and such others are just alts that Drew and his like use to up their advertising click-counts?


Considering Drew has met Bevets?
 
2012-06-04 03:14:54 AM

Kali-Yuga: Un-examined Religious belief is culturally acceptable, but not a mass delusion



FTFY

Being indoctrinated and not coming upon a reason to be skeptical, and therefore never really giving it serious thought =/= delusion.

When it was popular theory that the earth was flat, one was not delusional for taking it as "fact", just ignorant, that's all.
 
2012-06-04 03:15:22 AM

if_i_really_have_to: sharpiegreed: The most amazing part of the Good News Club for me is that I know for alot of kids, the meal we serve them is the only decent food they will get for the rest of the day and sometimes the praise and attention we give is all they will get outside of the classroom. Sometimes including the classroom.

Ah, the typical religionist method of preying on the weak, lonely and needy in the hopes they'll eventually buy your line of bull out of gratitude or desperation.

Carry on, then.

/You could just provide the meal without the preaching
//If you really cared about them, and not about scoring brownie points with God


Straelbora: sharpiegreed: I am a Good News Club volunteer.
If followed correctly, it is simply church for children. They have a meal, sing bible songs, have a basic bible lesson (like the Good Samaritan), play games for small prizes, memorize a bible verse, and have a story about a missionary.

In no way, shape, or form should there be anything else going on. It is no different than traditonal Vacation Bible School or Sunday School.

I see that the article is talking about a lesson in next year's plan, which I have not seen and can't comment on it's accuracy.

Just because some Christians are crazy and fanatical doesn't mean every Christian is crazy and fanatical.

I did not convert to Christianity until I was 30 years old. I have been on both sides of the fence and both sides have ridiculous assumptions about the other.

The most amazing part of the Good News Club for me is that I know for alot of kids, the meal we serve them is the only decent food they will get for the rest of the day and sometimes the praise and attention we give is all they will get outside of the classroom. Sometimes including the classroom.

These children are not forced to go to club. It is a completely voluntary club. Parents sign permission slips. If you have any earnest questions about my experience with the Good News Club , EIP.

I'm not trying to change any one person's opinion. I just wanted to share my experience.

So, like a lot of soup kitchens, come for the chow, but you have to stay for the sermon? Why not just feed the kids if they need it and spare the prosletyzing?

When I lived in the Dominican Republic, a lot of people were convinced that the major religion in the US is either Jehovah's Witness or Mormon, because the JWs and the Mormons both open up rec centers with basketball courts and free pizzas, etc. , and then tell the kids that the US is wealthy and powerful because it's God's Chosen Nation because it's a majority JW/Mormon nation, depending on who's peddling the propaganda.

On ...


My point was that was part of it that I personally enjoy, not the intent of the program. It is a religion club that happens to have food for the kids. Obviously if kids are staying after school for an a lengthyctivity, they need to eat.
There's no such thing as brownie points with God in Christianity. It is a faith, not a contest.

Excuse me, I have to get back to plotting how I can get my hands on the weak and needy.
 
2012-06-04 03:16:32 AM

WhyteRaven74: I dunno, not something I particularly concern myself with.


Why? Because you're concerned you may not like the answer?

At what percentage would they become "real christians" and you be the one who isn't? 51%? 75%? 90%? Because the majority of the christians who don't belong to your particular sect probably don't consider you to be a "real christian" either.

Protestants believe "real christians" must agree that the Bible is inerrant, that salvation is by grace, and that one must be "born-again" to be saved and avoid eternal punishment in Hell.

Roman Catholics believe "real christians" are defined according to their baptism status and the presence of any unresolved mortal sin in their lives.

The earliest christians before the new testament was written and translated and modified and translated, and modified and translated again, believed that "real christians" were simply people who were baptized and proclaimed "Jesus is Lord"
 
2012-06-04 03:31:37 AM

I Have The Touch of a Shocked Monkey: Yes, it is condemned by the Bible, but don't pretend it hasn't been done./i>

Where, specifically, is it condemned in the bible? I recall a lot of genocides in the bible, and all of them were supposedly righteous because they were commanded by god, but nothing about not committing genocide.

 
2012-06-04 03:31:51 AM
WTF was that blog about? Bigots reporting on what other bigots are imagining?

And why is fark now reporting on blogs?
 
2012-06-04 03:32:13 AM
Kali-Yuga: and you be the one who isn't?

Sorry. But this irks me. If someone disagrees with your rabid brand of fundamentalism, and yes - what your frothing on about IS fundamentalism, no different than what's discussed in this article - they have to be Christian? If they disagree with you, and argue from reality complex historical and sociopolitcal issues rather than from some base ignorance and laughable "ALL RELIGIONS ARE THE EVULZ LOL" principal, they're automatically apologists?

I'm an Atheist, and people like you bother me on a base level. And this argument is entire fallacious. It assumes that despite the differences in belief, there are not fundamental principals agreed upon that transcend all of the major "flavors", if you will, of Christianity.

"He who fights monsters should see to it that he himself does not become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Kali-Yuga: I "lump together" all god-botherers regardless of creed as people who would rather persist in a comfortable delusion than accept some of the stark realities of life.

Religious belief is a culturally acceptable mass delusion, and like other mental illnesses, there is a spectrum of severity. One one end of the spectrum you have moderate believers who claim the contradictory parts of their scripture and outright historical and scientific inaccuracies contained within as allegory, and on the other end you have fundamentalist biblical literalists.

Religion is a culturally evolved institution that adopts specific answers to circular questions and establishes authority schemes to indoctrinate people to those beliefs, substituting dogma for reason and truth.
It provides myths to answer real questions, and those myths are protected by their unfalsifiability, threats and promises. The paradoxical idea that a lack of evidence is a positive virtue is self sustaining because it is self-referential, and once a believer has been indoctrinated into thinking this way, it automatically undermines any opposition to its self.

Until recent history religion has also had a traditional exemption from analysis and criticism, this is one of the reasons it's such an insidious meme.


Ladies and Gentlemen - the Strawman Atheist. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HollywoodAtheist

Excuse me. Alterac Valley just popped.
 
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