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(Huffington Post)   Sorry about the five years you spent in prison because I falsely accused you of rape. Wanna be friends on Facebook?   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 392
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20884 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 May 2012 at 11:28 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-25 11:24:28 AM

Banned on the Run: I submitted this with a more flame baity headline:

Duke lacrosse reprise: Star football player has rape charges dropped after victim recants. Just kidding, he's black so we never heard about it and he spent 6 years in jail


Good point. By saying the victim does not deserve justive in this case, MBK is a RACIST in addition to being a scheming RED.
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-05-25 11:26:12 AM

spiderpaz: I hope he sues the living dogshiat out of her.


Please, find the quote I wrote that said this woman should not be punished.

Go on, I'll wait.
 
2012-05-25 11:33:54 AM

MmmmBacon: PunGent: machoprogrammer: IMO not only should he be able to sue her, but should be able to sue the state for his lost wages from the NFL. It if obvious they didn't have sufficient evidence to convict him if she farking lied about the whole thing.

Sue her, and/or her mom? Oh, hell yes. And prosecute her for perjury.

Otoh, the state? he plead no contest, when he probably should have gone for a jury trial.
That's not such an easy one to win.

I would say both the mom and the State are safe from legal implications here. The accuser's mom didn't know her daughter was a liar, so she sued the school, district on her child's behalf in good faith, believing the school had failed to keep her child safe. While the lying daughter should be sued by the school district for fraud, the mother did nothing wrong.

As for the State, they brought charges in good faith, based upon the lies they were told by the accuser. While it sucks that the guy went to prison for half a decade, he was not wrongly imprisoned. The State simply brought charges based on what evidence they had, and the defendant chose to plead No Contest. Whether he felt he had no better choice at the time or not is irrelevant. He was not wrongly imprisoned by the State, so they should be safe from a lawsuit.

No, the full brunt of the blame falls squarely on this one woman who chose to make a false claim of rape, and had plenty of opportunity to recant her story both before he was tried and afterwards. We only have proof of her story because her victim was wise enough to catch her on hidden video admitting that she had made the whole thing up.

Her mother is safe.
The State is safe.

This lying twunt (love that word, btw) deserves to be sued into the ground by the School District, her victim, and have fraud and perjury charges brought against her by the State. But I suspect she will not be sued by either the schools or her victim, and the State is already declining to charge her.

There will be no Justice here.


Sue the daughter, and see what shakes out in discovery...wouldn't surprise me if Mom knew and/or collaborated in the lie somewhere along the line while the defendant was in prison. If she did, and didn't step forward, perhaps fraud, perhaps false imprisonment? I'd have to read up on various torts, it's been awhile.
 
2012-05-25 11:35:39 AM

MBK: spiderpaz: I hope he sues the living dogshiat out of her.

Please, find the quote I wrote that said this woman should not be punished.

Go on, I'll wait.


No MBK, you don't get to control the debate. You do not get to make demands such as this. It is not for you to set the goalposts.

It is you who conveniently mixes up real rape victims that can't prove with false-claim perpetrators that can and have been proved. It is verbal deception, designed to bolster your creeping leftist control-freakery.

You have been called out repeatedly in this thread. You carry on because you think you are clever enough to win, but you and your ideology are discredited. You are a disappointment to your mother - and nobody else cares about you either way.
 
2012-05-25 11:38:13 AM

MBK: Please, find the quote I wrote that said this woman should not be punished.


MBK: "Women who are raped have to deal with a lot of problems. If a girl was raped, and accuses her rapist, and the evidence doesn't support her claim, should we lock her up?"

If there's proof that she wasn't raped and made it up? YES!! Hell YES!!

There is proof. PROOF that she made this all up and ruined this guy's life and stole 1.5 million ... MILLION farking dollars!!! At what point do you stop casting everyone woman ever into the victim role and let one be accountable for her actions? You're one of those people who think in rape cases, when in doubt lock him up "because it's so hard to come forward with a rape charge." Well guess what - men have a right to justice in the legal system too. I know it's hard being a woman, but life is hard for men too - in their different ways.

And trying to draw some FALSE EQUIVALENCE between this case and a scenario where an accuser comes forward, but the case false apart for lack of evidence, and the accused gets off is shameful for you. Your transparent attempt to let her off the hook by doing so is contemptible. In your little hypothetical, there isn't PROOF that the accuser lied. When a rape case turns out not guilty, that doesn't mean the rape didn't happen - it just means in America we'd rather let a guilty man go than put an innocent man like this in prison with doubt in our minds. That's VERY different than this case.
 
2012-05-25 11:46:19 AM

spiderpaz: MBK: Please, find the quote I wrote that said this woman should not be punished.

MBK: "Women who are raped have to deal with a lot of problems. If a girl was raped, and accuses her rapist, and the evidence doesn't support her claim, should we lock her up?"

If there's proof that she wasn't raped and made it up? YES!! Hell YES!!

There is proof. PROOF that she made this all up and ruined this guy's life and stole 1.5 million ... MILLION farking dollars!!! At what point do you stop casting everyone woman ever into the victim role and let one be accountable for her actions? You're one of those people who think in rape cases, when in doubt lock him up "because it's so hard to come forward with a rape charge." Well guess what - men have a right to justice in the legal system too. I know it's hard being a woman, but life is hard for men too - in their different ways.

And trying to draw some FALSE EQUIVALENCE between this case and a scenario where an accuser comes forward, but the case false apart for lack of evidence, and the accused gets off is shameful for you. Your transparent attempt to let her off the hook by doing so is contemptible. In your little hypothetical, there isn't PROOF that the accuser lied. When a rape case turns out not guilty, that doesn't mean the rape didn't happen - it just means in America we'd rather let a guilty man go than put an innocent man like this in prison with doubt in our minds. That's VERY different than this case.


Note the bolded. He was not referring to this girl in this case.
 
2012-05-25 11:47:11 AM

cman: This is why I get all pissy about the way that Jerry Sandusky is being treated. He has already been convicted and sentenced by the court of popular opinion. Same thing probably happened to this dude. In this world of media at our finger tips we are too ready to judge people simply by the accusations of others.


Yea. Hitler was never convicted of anything, either. Let's be fair.
 
2012-05-25 11:47:33 AM

KiplingKat872: Note the bolded. He was not referring to this girl in this case.


Yes, because he was making a straw man so that he could use false equivalence to say this girl should not go to prison, you fark.
 
2012-05-25 11:49:27 AM

cman: This is why I get all pissy about the way that Jerry Sandusky is being treated. He has already been convicted and sentenced by the court of popular opinion. Same thing probably happened to this dude. In this world of media at our finger tips we are too ready to judge people simply by the accusations of others.


Well, who is is going to accuse someone? Isn't it always "others"?

/are you serious
/is that a small boy in your lap?
 
2012-05-25 11:52:31 AM
http://rivals.yahoo.com/footballrecruiting/football/recruiting/player - Brian-Banks-9326

This man had offers from USC in 2003. He would have gone to Rose Bowls, and been part of numerous BCS campaigns. He really did have a shot at eventually being an NFL star. All that was taken away from him because of a lie. There was obviously not enough evidence that he raped her, since he in fact did not rape her. So why is it that one lie from a cute little white girl is enough for us to send this guy to prison? We have a seriously farked up legal system that sanctifies venomous little biatches like this one.
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-05-25 11:54:17 AM

spiderpaz: Yes, because he was making a straw man so that he could use false equivalence to say this girl should not go to prison, you fark.


No you moron.

I'm saying if a girl makes up the rape claim, she should be punished according to the law.

But what you are not understanding is IF new laws are introduced that punishes false rape victims even more servery, it MIGHT discourage REAL rape victims from coming forward to make a rape claim, because they may fear that these laws will punish them if the evidence doesn't support rape.

What I have a problem with is people in this thread who think new laws should be enacted that will help rapists and punish the raped. Even if they don't mean it that way, it will happen.

Knee-jerk reactions hurt more than help.

And I think THE GREAT NAME has a crush on me. I haven't had my name shouted this loudly and as many times since my last girlfriend.
 
2012-05-25 12:00:26 PM

KiplingKat872:
Note the bolded. He was not referring to this girl in this case.


MBK develops an argument that because some women do get raped, this woman, who was not raped, should be let off more lightly.

It is patently ridiculous when stated plainly, as NAME has done here. MBK obfuscates by skipping between the two scenarios and making comments where it is not clear which scenario he refers to. This is all done to try to extend an argument that is reasonable in one context into another context where it is not. It is the same technique used by stage hypnotists (not for evil) and cult-of-personality dictators (generally very evil).

He does this because he is selling power (not justice). He is selling power not to the morally-upright women who refuse to lie even when they're provoked, but to the immoral/amoral women who will play the game given the chance.

Power is extremely appealing to the morally weak. Justice is only ever a mild comfort. By conflating true rape victims with screeching liars, MBK tries to divert society's wish to protect the former into a source of power for the latter. He assumes they will grant him power in return - with which he can introduce his grand neo-Leninist vision.

MBK is the evil within. He (and Yoko Ono) must be called out, just like the Reds in the Macarthy era.
 
2012-05-25 12:00:51 PM

MBK: You know what? I hate these threads. A bunch of people coming in this thread and begging "this coont needs to die and raped" and all this shiat.

While this story is HORRIBLE and he should sue the shiat out the state, the girl, and everyone involved (and win), let's not get drastic and say "False accusations of rape need to be tortured and raped and killed".

Women who are raped have to deal with a lot of problems. If a girl was raped, and accuses her rapist, and the evidence doesn't support her claim, should we lock her up? These type of laws will scare the shiat out of women. And I know, there is a difference between no evidence vs false accusations, but I just see more harm coming from it than good. If a man rapes a young girl or boy, they will use the "No one will believe you, and you will be sent to jail if you tell" line to scare their victims even more.

Women will doubt themselves even more. More rapes will go unreported because of fear of being labeled a false accusation.

This world is filled with evil people that will lie, steal, cheat, rape and kill to get what they want. Putting the blame on victims will not make it go away.


You said 'rape' eight times.

/probably miscounted
//mobile's fault
 
2012-05-25 12:04:10 PM

MBK: But what you are not understanding is IF new laws are introduced that punishes false rape victims even more servery, it MIGHT discourage REAL rape victims from coming forward to make a rape claim, because they may fear that these laws will punish them if the evidence doesn't support rape.


You're still making false equivalences, you douche. You really must be mentally challenged to not understand it at this point.

If laws are enacted to punish women that make false rape claims, those cases would need PROOF that said rape claim was false, right? I mean, we need evidence to convict someone of a crime in this country still after-all. So in your strawman scenario, there obviously will be no proof that the accusation was made up, because in your strawman, the victim was ACTUALLY raped, but the charge didn't stick.

This case has proof that the biatch lied. In your strawman, there is now proof that the victim lied. See the difference?
 
2012-05-25 12:08:59 PM

spiderpaz: KiplingKat872: Note the bolded. He was not referring to this girl in this case.

Yes, because he was making a straw man so that he could use false equivalence to say this girl should not go to prison, you fark.


No, he never said that. He said that we should not further legislate against women who make rape claims that cannot be proven beyond what already is in place for filing false charges and perjury because women who have been raped but have cases that can't be convicted in court would be caught up in the same net you want to drown this woman with.

There is evidence that this woman lied and she deserves to be punished according to the law for filing false charges, perjury, and fraud. However, say there is a woman who was raped by her boyfriend but without much physical evidence it turns into a "she said, he said" and the jury can't convict beyond a reasonable doubt. Does she deserve to be punished the same way as this coont?
 
2012-05-25 12:12:13 PM

cman: This is why I get all pissy about the way that Jerry Sandusky is being treated. He has already been convicted and sentenced by the court of popular opinion. Same thing probably happened to this dude. In this world of media at our finger tips we are too ready to judge people simply by the accusations of others.


Yeah, that's working out so well for George Zimmerman, isn't it?
 
2012-05-25 12:16:59 PM

MBK: spiderpaz: Yes, because he was making a straw man so that he could use false equivalence to say this girl should not go to prison, you fark.

No you moron.

I'm saying if a girl makes up the rape claim, she should be punished according to the law.


More trickery - by now readers will be seeing straight through MBK's obfuscation. Because there are no laws to punish false rape claims, MBK is really saying this woman should be let off scott-free.

MBK does not say it out loud, but the meaning is there, clear as day.


But what you are not understanding is IF new laws are introduced that punishes false rape victims even more servery, it MIGHT discourage REAL rape victims from coming forward to make a rape claim, because they may fear that these laws will punish them if the evidence doesn't support rape.


Very interesting. For this to make sense the bolded word should be "accusers".

But MBK (propbably without realising it) substituted the word "victims" because in his view the accuser is always the victim and the accusation is always real. So much so that in his mind, punishing known guilty deliberate false accusers is the same as punishing victims.

Readers, if you doubt what I mean, compare:

"...new laws are introduced that punishes false rape victims..."

with

"...new laws are introduced that punishes false rape accusers..."

First one sounds bad because of the pattern "punishes [...] victims". But in context, after the Freudian slip is corrected, he really means the second one. Which is actually just normal justice in action and quite correct!

With slippery manipulators like MBK, one has to read the actual words, it's very important.
 
2012-05-25 12:21:25 PM

KiplingKat872: Yes, because he was making a straw man so that he could use false equivalence to say this girl should not go to prison, you fark.

No, he never said that.



He is making false equivalence by saying:
To avoid making girls fearful of being charged with falsely accusing in cases where there is no evidence they are making false accusations,
We can't punish girls like this harshly in cases when they make accusation of rape and this is proof that they are lying.

By drawing a comparison between the two, he is drawing a false equivalence between them.

It would be like me saying "in order to avoid making people afraid to use lethal force to defend themselves against a home invader/murderer because they are afraid of being charged with murder themselves if a jury finds that it was not self defense, we must not punish murderers too harshly".

I suspect the underlying cause of this is some misconception of women as being lily-white damsels in distress that need special rules to protect them since they must be too stupid to live under the same laws as everyone else on your part and MBK's part.
 
2012-05-25 12:26:08 PM

spiderpaz: I suspect the underlying cause of this is some misconception of women as being lily-white damsels in distress that need special rules to protect them since they must be too stupid to live under the same laws as everyone else on your part and MBK's part.


Prove it. Where have I said anything of the kind?
 
2012-05-25 12:27:39 PM
fusillade: "Yeah, I love the fact that they're not going to prosecute her because she was a minor, when they had no problem prosecuting him as one."

That's different. We all know the same rules don't apply to womyn. Not fair, but just the way it is. Remember Andrea Yates, the Houston housewife who drowned her children? If any man had done the same thing she did, he'd have gotten the needle in record time. But a crazy lady does it and everybody wants to make excuses for her and understand how and why she could committ such a terrible crime. Hey, I'm against the death penalty in almost all circumstances, but the double standards are appalling.

Also, I notice a lot of folks here talking about what "should" be done to this lying biatch. As troubling as it is, we might as well just accept the fact that she will NEVER be held responsible for destroying an innocent man's life. It happens all the time.

\not sure what the answer is other than fatalistic resignation to the status quo. It sucks.
 
2012-05-25 12:28:16 PM

spiderpaz: It would be like me saying "in order to avoid making people afraid to use lethal force to defend themselves against a home invader/murderer because they are afraid of being charged with murder themselves if a jury finds that it was not self defense, we must not punish murderers too harshly".


Actually, you have your metaphor mixed up.

For it to be analogous to MBK's argument, it should read, "In order to avoid making people afraid to use lethal force to defend themselves against a home invader/murderer because they are afraid of being charged with murder themselves if a jury finds that it was not self defense, we must not punish murderers victims of home invasion who defend themsleves too harshly."
 
2012-05-25 12:29:08 PM
She told Banks, "`I will go through with helping you, but it's like at the same time all that money they gave us, I mean gave me, I don't want to have to pay it back,'" according to Freddie Parish, a defense investigator who was at the meeting.

Well that's just plain shocking and unheard of - a black woman who feels entitled to a large amount of money for no reason whatsoever.
 
2012-05-25 12:30:47 PM

FirstNationalBastard: Hate is a bit strong.

But you should never trust a woman.

Now, granted, there are plenty of scumbag men in the world... no one is denying that. But no man has the absolute power to ruin someone's life with three simple words... "He raped me".


No, a man just has the power to completely destroy a woman's life by raping her.

You will not only be farked physically, but mentally as well. And the fallout will permanently fark up the rest of your life.

KiplingKat872: Dude, I was raped by a guy I had been dating. And I never went to the cops because I thought, "It's my word against his. Who'd believe me after I was in his apartment of my own free will."


**hugs her little sister and cries**

/wonders what her life would have been like if she hadn't naively believed the asshole she dated for several months who one day told her, "Nothing will happen unless you want it to."
 
2012-05-25 12:42:40 PM

Lorelle: No, a man just has the power to completely destroy a woman's life by raping her.

You will not only be farked physically, but mentally as well. And the fallout will permanently fark up the rest of your life.


This is what so many people do not understand. They think rape is just rough sex, but it's is a violation of your most intimate self. Someone else forcibly takes control over something you are supposed to have utter control over and it is literally a world shattering event. Everyone social norm you rely on in your day to day life is tossed on it's head.

Many rape victims suffer PSTD, the same as combat veterans. It is that level of trauma and the guy can be long out of jail before the emotional damage that they caused is at least dealt with in a way that the person can get on with their lives, when they transition from rape victim to rape survivor.

At least in the U.S., in the U.K. for instance, a sentence for a conviction of rape can be a life imprisonment.

And as hard as it is to cope with for women, it is much harder for men to comes grip with because they have the addition social pressure of "a real man isn't victimized like that" or "well, you're gay so you asked for it." Authorities think that male rape is so under-reported, they won't even make guesses as to how much it really happens.

/wonders what her life would have been like if she hadn't naively believed the asshole she dated for several months who one day told her, "Nothing will happen unless you want it to."

*hugs back* I too wonder about that, how my relationships in my 20's would have panned out if I did not have the intimacy issues that stuck me with, until in my 30's I realized what I was doing.

/survivor fist bump of love.
 
2012-05-25 12:50:42 PM

Lorelle: /wonders what her life would have been like if she hadn't naively believed the asshole she dated for several months who one day told her, "Nothing will happen unless you want it to."


It's the octopus in the room. You try to ignore it, but it has it's tentacles wrapped into everything you do. Yo have to put free yourself, shove it in a box and learn to live aroudn it.
 
2012-05-25 12:58:14 PM

KiplingKat872: This is what so many people do not understand. They think rape is just rough sex, but it's is a violation of your most intimate self.


I think 90% of people understand. Also, if you think that's bad, imagine having a future as a millionaire football stud ripped away from you because everyone believes a cute white girl's word when she lies and accuses you of rape, and then being sent to prison and being afraid to close your eyes at night because you might get shanked, or going to the shower without any friends because you might get raped by another man, or worse - shanked. Imagine everyone being ashamed of you and calling you a sexual predator when you've never hurt a fly in reality.

That's worse. If you don't think it is, you have lost all objectivity, and for that I pity you.
 
2012-05-25 01:07:35 PM

KiplingKat872: ...Many rape victims suffer PSTD, the same as combat veterans. It is that level of trauma and the guy can be long out of jail before the emotional damage that they caused is at least dealt with in a way that the person can get on with their lives, when they transition from rape victim to rape survivor...


It's even worse when you think you've become pregnant as a result of the attack (the stress can cause a woman to skip several periods). Being suicidal isn't fun. And some of us have to spend $$$ on years of therapy in order to deal with this shiat.

Rape victims today have more help available to them, which is a good thing. That wasn't the case 30 years ago, when "date rape" was unheard of.

*hugs back* I too wonder about that, how my relationships in my 20's would have panned out if I did not have the intimacy issues that stuck me with, until in my 30's I realized what I was doing.

/survivor fist bump of love.


The best therapist I ever had gave me this timeless advice: "DON'T LET THE BASTARDS WIN." :)

/about to knock over 50
//hopes to hang around for another 50
 
2012-05-25 01:10:22 PM

spiderpaz: KiplingKat872: This is what so many people do not understand. They think rape is just rough sex, but it's is a violation of your most intimate self.

I think 90% of people understand. Also, if you think that's bad, imagine having a future as a millionaire football stud ripped away from you because everyone believes a cute white girl's word when she lies and accuses you of rape, and then being sent to prison and being afraid to close your eyes at night because you might get shanked, or going to the shower without any friends because you might get raped by another man, or worse - shanked. Imagine everyone being ashamed of you and calling you a sexual predator when you've never hurt a fly in reality.

That's worse. If you don't think it is, you have lost all objectivity, and for that I pity you.


Will you stop projecting your stupid B.S. onto everyone? I have said, repeatedly, that this woman did a horrible thing and she needs to be tried for filing false charges, perjury, and fraud. That he needs to sue her and her mother so that they are paying him for the rest of their lives for destroying his future.

Just because one person is talking to a person about how horrible rape is, that does not mean they are dismissing the terrible damage done by false rape claims. Real rape survivors HATE women like this because it makes it hard for other to come forward.

Talk about losing perspective, yeesh.
 
2012-05-25 01:13:39 PM

spiderpaz: KiplingKat872: This is what so many people do not understand. They think rape is just rough sex, but it's is a violation of your most intimate self.

I think 90% of people understand. Also, if you think that's bad, imagine having a future as a millionaire football stud ripped away from you because everyone believes a cute white girl's word when she lies and accuses you of rape, and then being sent to prison and being afraid to close your eyes at night because you might get shanked, or going to the shower without any friends because you might get raped by another man, or worse - shanked. Imagine everyone being ashamed of you and calling you a sexual predator when you've never hurt a fly in reality.

That's worse. If you don't think it is, you have lost all objectivity, and for that I pity you.


You're projecting a false dilemma/either-or argumentative fallacy onto this discussion, trying to state that someone who defends real rape victims must be against lairs being punished to the full extent of the law.

It's possible to believe both, dude. I do.
 
2012-05-25 01:13:52 PM
I would sue the fark out of that girl and her family.


fark them
 
2012-05-25 01:15:29 PM

Lorelle: No, a man just has the power to completely destroy a woman's life by raping her.


Also, if I have to be completely honest, this is a tad hyperbolic. Rape is horrible. For the rest of your life certain scenes on TV or movies will send a chill up your spine or give you anxiety and you will have to change the channel. Sexually, you may have trouble being intimate.

That is a far cry from ruined though. A rape victim can still go to school and have a career and fall in love, have children, and all the same experiences as if it never happened, aside from the PTSD I mentioned before.

This man has had his life LITERALLY ruined. He has been in a living hell for 5 years (the prime of his life), and even though that's over now, his prospects or forever gone (which doesn't happen for all falsely accused ... he's a lucky exception). He will never go to the NFL - never. And Prison for men is so violent and terrifying, a large percentage would rather kill themselves or flee the country than go there. It's like being raped every day for years and it's institutionally enforced. You are kept in a cage with animals. Image the paranoia, and psychological effects of that kind of trauma on this man for the rest of his life.
 
2012-05-25 01:18:31 PM

KiplingKat872: You're projecting a false dilemma/either-or argumentative fallacy onto this discussion, trying to state that someone who defends real rape victims must be against lairs being punished to the full extent of the law.


What law? Is this woman going to prison? Which law will send her there? There are people saying she shouldn't be punished because rape is so traumatizing - even though SHE WASN'T RAPED.
 
2012-05-25 01:34:55 PM
Now who is downplaying the heinous effects of what happened.

spiderpaz: Also, if I have to be completely honest, this is a tad hyperbolic. Rape is horrible. For the rest of your life certain scenes on TV or movies will send a chill up your spine or give you anxiety and you will have to change the channel. Sexually, you may have trouble being intimate.


Actually, the trouble often is not physical intimacy, it's emotional intimacy. Rape victims can even be very promiscuous, trying to regain that control that was taken from them, but their ability to trust and be emotionally intimate is usually shattered. They will often push others away, friends, family, in feelings of fear and self loathing. You lash out, nothing has perspective. I had to miss meeting my friends for a movie becuase they were late getting my car fixed and I had a farking hysterical meltdown in the repair ship. My BF would hook up with some guy they met at a festival and I wouldn't talk to her for days afterward.

And guilt and self hatred is amazingly powerful. It's like it wasn't this guy that did it to you, God did this to you. Yo must be a horrible person that the universe hates you this much that this happened. It literally took me 20 years before I realized that I had not blamed him, I blamed myself. I don't know why it works like that (maybe becuase it is somehting you are supposed to have complete control over, so you must be repsonsible in some way), but for a lot of rape victims it does. And you don't deserve to have friends, and you don't deserve to do well in school, and you don't deserve to be happy.

That is a far cry from ruined though. A rape victim can still go to school and have a career and fall in love, have children, and all the same experiences as if it never happened, aside from the PTSD I mentioned before.

Yeah, aside from the horrible emotional effects of rape, they will have completely normal lives.

I dropped out of school because I couldn't focus, didn't care anymore, I stopped listening to music, I pushed all my friend's away, I realized it had been five months since I had changed the sheets on my bed, I held down a job or a relationship for more than 18 months....

Yeah, my life was just farking spiffy.

Then in my 30's I realized my life utterly sucked and it was going to continue to suck until I fixed some thing. I went into therapy.

Really, before you make such statements, at least read some of the literature:

National Center for the Victims of Crime: Rape/Sexual Assault

Rape Related Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

This little tidbit blew my mind, because I do have a very hard time distinguishing the passage of time:

Some disturbing new research indicates that certain physiological changes in the brain may be permanent conditions. Some survivors with RR-PTSD are unable to accurately gauge the passage of time. Consequently, they are likely to show up for appointments late, early, or not at all. Another possible permanent side effect is a kind of tunnel vision. Victims may be unable to see the "big picture" which results in difficulty distinguishing between a little crisis and a big crisis. Therefore, all events in their lives are viewed as crises.

Again, what this woman did was horrible, it was a kind of rape in and of itself. But that does mean rape is something that can be shaken off, that does not effect the survivor for the rest of their lives.
 
2012-05-25 01:38:04 PM

spiderpaz: KiplingKat872: You're projecting a false dilemma/either-or argumentative fallacy onto this discussion, trying to state that someone who defends real rape victims must be against lairs being punished to the full extent of the law.

What law? Is this woman going to prison? Which law will send her there? There are people saying she shouldn't be punished because rape is so traumatizing - even though SHE WASN'T RAPED.


NO ONE IS SAYING THAT SHE SHOULD NOT BE PUNISHED. WILL YOU STOP SPOUTING COMPLETE AND UTTER BULLSHIAT!

She filed false charges - Illegal
She perjured herself in court - Illegal
She defrauded the state of California for 1.5 million dollars - Illegal.

And she deserves to have the book thrown at her.

What MBK has been arguing against is additional punishments heaped on her for filing false rape charges. If you set that legal descendent, then women who just do not have enough proofs to convict could be caught up in the same punishment.
 
2012-05-25 01:38:32 PM

KiplingKat872: Talk about losing perspective, yeesh.


No kidding.

spiderpaz, can you imagine what it's like to be date-raped and not be able to talk to many people about it afterwards because of the still-persistent belief that it's the woman's fault? Can you imagine what it's like to think that you're pregnant by the bastard? Can you imagine what it's like to want a romantic relationship, but can't go out on a date because you don't want to be raped again? Can you imagine what it's like to develop an addiction because you can't deal with the rape? Can you imagine what it's like to have a huge chunk of your paycheck go to paying therapy bills? Can you imagine what it's like to occasionally have horrible nightmares about the rape decades later, even after years of therapy?

As KiplingKat872 noted, REAL rape victims hate women like the one who farked up Brian Banks' life.
 
2012-05-25 01:39:00 PM

spiderpaz: KiplingKat872: You're projecting a false dilemma/either-or argumentative fallacy onto this discussion, trying to state that someone who defends real rape victims must be against lairs being punished to the full extent of the law.

What law? Is this woman going to prison? Which law will send her there? There are people saying she shouldn't be punished because rape is so traumatizing - even though SHE WASN'T RAPED.


KiplingKat isn't one of them, why do you keep acting like she is?

The fact that rape is so devastating is why what this woman did is so brutal.

And there are laws, stop pretending there aren't. They aren't the "ZOMG FARK HER WITH RUSTY CHAINSAWS" you seem to desire, but the laws are there.
 
2012-05-25 01:40:16 PM

KiplingKat872: I held down a job or a relationship for more than 18 months....


"I HADN'T held down a job...."

Sorry for the typos.
 
2012-05-25 01:41:42 PM

KiplingKat872: KiplingKat872: I held down a job or a relationship for more than 18 months....

"I HADN'T held down a job...."

Sorry for the typos.


Now we have to kill you.
 
2012-05-25 01:45:13 PM

Lorelle: spiderpaz, can you imagine what it's like to be date-raped and not be able to talk to many people about it afterwards because of the still-persistent belief that it's the woman's fault? Can you imagine what it's like to think that you're pregnant by the bastard? Can you imagine what it's like to want a romantic relationship, but can't go out on a date because you don't want to be raped again? Can you imagine what it's like to develop an addiction because you can't deal with the rape? Can you imagine what it's like to have a huge chunk of your paycheck go to paying therapy bills? Can you imagine what it's like to occasionally have horrible nightmares about the rape decades later, even after years of therapy?


That's another sad set of facts from the NCVC:

Rape victims are:

13.4 times more likely to have two or more major alcohol problems; and
Twenty-six times more likely to have two or more major serious drug abuse problems.


...and thirteen percent of rape victims will attempt suicide.

And as far as getting and staying close to people, I realized that I had developed this amazing mechanism of just quietly drifting away. I have to force myself to stay in touch with the friends I from because I find it very hard to be emotionally intimate with someone, even on a friend level.

And it's 22 years after the fact.
 
2012-05-25 01:46:02 PM

SweetSilverBlues: KiplingKat872: KiplingKat872: I held down a job or a relationship for more than 18 months....

"I HADN'T held down a job...."

Sorry for the typos.

Now we have to kill you.


*sigh*....well, my wild-living had to catch up with me someday.
 
2012-05-25 01:48:36 PM

KiplingKat872: I have to force myself to stay in touch with the friends I from because


Example of why it is bad idea to edit as you write. I started saying, "the friends I make.." and switched to "the friendships I form..." and it came out all wonky.

Sorry.
 
2012-05-25 01:56:41 PM

Lorelle: spiderpaz, can you imagine what it's like to be date-raped and not be able to talk to many people about it afterwards because of the still-persistent belief that it's the woman's fault? Can you imagine what it's like to think that you're pregnant by the bastard? Can you imagine what it's like to want a romantic relationship, but can't go out on a date because you don't want to be raped again? Can you imagine what it's like to develop an addiction because you can't deal with the rape? Can you imagine what it's like to have a huge chunk of your paycheck go to paying therapy bills? Can you imagine what it's like to occasionally have horrible nightmares about the rape decades later, even after years of therapy?


My wife was date raped years before I met her. She was also molested by her brother for years until she was 9 or so. I went to years of therapy with her. I helped her confront her parents and her brother. I was man enough to respect her wishes not to wreak personal vengeance on the date-raper. I've been through the wringer with someone that is recovering from rape. At time she was a basket case. But after dealing with all that and processing it all, she has gotten better. During that time she went to college and got a degree and a teaching credential, and teaching emotionally disturbed children that have been abused and has intervened and helped dozens of children suffering from abuse. We have a house, a baby, a great life. She is one of the most happy people I know. Her life is not ruined, even though it was derailed for a time. Ruined, and damaged are inherently ambiguous terms, but I think with some reasonable perspective you would not put her life into the former category.

What happened to this guy is several magnitudes of greatness more terrible than that. That's the difference in saying "this life is ruined" for arguments sake, hyperbolically, and saying "this life is totally ruined". The only reason his life is only mostly ruined instead of totally ruined is because he got lucky in ways almost nobody in his situation ever would be and he got her on tape confessing after the fact. There is a difference in being in a figurative prison, and being in a real PMITA prison for a crime you didn't do. If he hadn't got out how many times would he have fallen in love? How many college degrees could he have gotten? What would his job prospects have been if he'd been to prison for a sex crime and got out in his 30s with no education?

And you want her to just be charged with false charges and perjury? She might not even do time for those. Let alone hard prison time. And the law suit? So farking what! That's not proportionate - so she'd have to file bankruptcy and work a shiatty job. She wouldn't pay it all back you realize that right? She'd stop at coffee bean on the way to a lawyers office once a week while she was filing for bankruptcy. Meanwhile - she's free.

Anything less than throwing her scumbag ass in prison is not justice.
 
2012-05-25 01:57:03 PM

KiplingKat872: That's another sad set of facts from the NCVC:

Rape victims are:

13.4 times more likely to have two or more major alcohol problems; and
Twenty-six times more likely to have two or more major serious drug abuse problems.

...and thirteen percent of rape victims will attempt suicide.

And as far as getting and staying close to people, I realized that I had developed this amazing mechanism of just quietly drifting away. I have to force myself to stay in touch with the friends I from because I find it very hard to be emotionally intimate with someone, even on a friend level.


I relate, oh how I relate. I wasn't addicted to drugs or alcohol, though.

And it's 22 years after the fact.

For me, it was 30 years ago last month. I woke up that morning feeling upset, then went to a baseball game and had a good time. :)
 
2012-05-25 02:02:54 PM

spiderpaz: What happened to this guy is several magnitudes of greatness more terrible than that.


..and that is where you lost me completely.

Why are you making this an either/or question? Why does it have to be "several magnitudes greatness more terrible?" Why does he deserve more sympathy than your wife (or other victims of rape) did?

I am glad your wife was able to recover, I think that is awesome, but respect the amount of work she did for that, work she should not have had to do. Just because she made it over the hump, realize there are tens of thousands who don't. Who remain alone, who fall into addiction, who commit suicide. Rape is not something you just shake off, it is life altering as it clearly altered your wife's life in terms of her work.
 
2012-05-25 02:03:37 PM

Lorelle: I woke up that morning feeling upset, then went to a baseball game and had a good time. :)


Good. :)
 
2012-05-25 02:07:05 PM

spiderpaz: Lorelle: spiderpaz, can you imagine what it's like to be date-raped and not be able to talk to many people about it afterwards because of the still-persistent belief that it's the woman's fault? Can you imagine what it's like to think that you're pregnant by the bastard? Can you imagine what it's like to want a romantic relationship, but can't go out on a date because you don't want to be raped again? Can you imagine what it's like to develop an addiction because you can't deal with the rape? Can you imagine what it's like to have a huge chunk of your paycheck go to paying therapy bills? Can you imagine what it's like to occasionally have horrible nightmares about the rape decades later, even after years of therapy?

My wife was date raped years before I met her. She was also molested by her brother for years until she was 9 or so. I went to years of therapy with her. I helped her confront her parents and her brother. I was man enough to respect her wishes not to wreak personal vengeance on the date-raper. I've been through the wringer with someone that is recovering from rape. At time she was a basket case. But after dealing with all that and processing it all, she has gotten better. During that time she went to college and got a degree and a teaching credential, and teaching emotionally disturbed children that have been abused and has intervened and helped dozens of children suffering from abuse. We have a house, a baby, a great life. She is one of the most happy people I know. Her life is not ruined, even though it was derailed for a time. Ruined, and damaged are inherently ambiguous terms, but I think with some reasonable perspective you would not put her life into the former category.

What happened to this guy is several magnitudes of greatness more terrible than that. That's the difference in saying "this life is ruined" for arguments sake, hyperbolically, and saying "this life is totally ruined". The only reason his life is only mostly ruined instead of totally ruined is because he got lucky in ways almost nobody in his situation ever would be and he got her on tape confessing after the fact. There is a difference in being in a figurative prison, and being in a real PMITA prison for a crime you didn't do. If he hadn't got out how many times would he have fallen in love? How many college degrees could he have gotten? What would his job prospects have been if he'd been to prison for a sex crime and got out in his 30s with no education?

And you want her to just be charged with false charges and perjury? She might not even do time for those. Let alone hard prison time. And the law suit? So farking what! That's not proportionate - so she'd have to file bankruptcy and work a shiatty job. She wouldn't pay it all back you realize that right? She'd stop at coffee bean on the way to a lawyers office once a week while she was filing for bankruptcy. Meanwhile - she's free.

Anything less than throwing her scumbag ass in prison is not justice.


You are exactly why emotion should be removed from the law.

You don't know his life has been ruined or just "derailed". Recovery is just as possible for him as it was for your wife (who, by the way, sounds like an amazing person).

Will it be easy? Will he ever get back what he lost? Will he ever know what opportunities he missed?

No.

But the same goes for those rape victims you say have it easier than he does.

Creating a horrific punishment for this biatch will not get any of that back for him, and don't even start on "closure".

The laws exist. It's up to him to pursue them civilly and the DA to pursue them criminally. They absolutely should.

But making her life a living hell won't fix his. That's why rape isn't a capital offense. The victim still has a chance to have a good life.

He does, too.

Although...I wonder what would motivate 4Chan to get on her...

That's bad and I'm a bad person for posting it.
 
2012-05-25 02:10:22 PM

Lorelle: KiplingKat872: Talk about losing perspective, yeesh.

No kidding.

spiderpaz, can you imagine what it's like to be date-raped and not be able to talk to many people about it afterwards because of the still-persistent belief that it's the woman's fault? Can you imagine what it's like to think that you're pregnant by the bastard? Can you imagine what it's like to want a romantic relationship, but can't go out on a date because you don't want to be raped again? Can you imagine what it's like to develop an addiction because you can't deal with the rape? Can you imagine what it's like to have a huge chunk of your paycheck go to paying therapy bills? Can you imagine what it's like to occasionally have horrible nightmares about the rape decades later, even after years of therapy?

As KiplingKat872 noted, REAL rape victims hate women like the one who farked up Brian Banks' life.


How do you feel about women who equate non physical confrontations with rape? I know a woman who thinks that if a man makes her feel (very) uncomfortable, it's equivalent to rape.
 
2012-05-25 02:14:26 PM

spiderpaz: KiplingKat872: This is what so many people do not understand. They think rape is just rough sex, but it's is a violation of your most intimate self.

I think 90% of people understand. Also, if you think that's bad, imagine having a future as a millionaire football stud ripped away from you because everyone believes a cute white girl's word when she lies and accuses you of rape, and then being sent to prison and being afraid to close your eyes at night because you might get shanked, or going to the shower without any friends because you might get raped by another man, or worse - shanked. Imagine everyone being ashamed of you and calling you a sexual predator when you've never hurt a fly in reality.

That's worse. If you don't think it is, you have lost all objectivity, and for that I pity you.


Agreed. Wanetta Gibson is no cute white girl, though

i.dailymail.co.uk
 
2012-05-25 02:15:55 PM
farm5.staticflickr.com
 
2012-05-25 02:17:46 PM

WhippingBoy: Lorelle: KiplingKat872: Talk about losing perspective, yeesh.

No kidding.

spiderpaz, can you imagine what it's like to be date-raped and not be able to talk to many people about it afterwards because of the still-persistent belief that it's the woman's fault? Can you imagine what it's like to think that you're pregnant by the bastard? Can you imagine what it's like to want a romantic relationship, but can't go out on a date because you don't want to be raped again? Can you imagine what it's like to develop an addiction because you can't deal with the rape? Can you imagine what it's like to have a huge chunk of your paycheck go to paying therapy bills? Can you imagine what it's like to occasionally have horrible nightmares about the rape decades later, even after years of therapy?

As KiplingKat872 noted, REAL rape victims hate women like the one who farked up Brian Banks' life.

How do you feel about women who equate non physical confrontations with rape? I know a woman who thinks that if a man makes her feel (very) uncomfortable, it's equivalent to rape.


Then she has a serious problem and has no idea what rape really is.

Really, I wish people would stop equating the most farked up example of a woman they can find with every single person who knows that rape is a really, realy horrible thing. Just because you know a crazy person that does not make rape "better."
 
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