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(Huffington Post)   "Christian" pastor calls for gays to be imprisoned in an electrified pen until they die. A Taliban spokesman commented: "Seriously? Don't you think that's a bit over-the-top?"   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 591
    More: Asinine, Charles L. Worley, North Carolina, acting out, lesbians, Baptist Church, Winston-Salem  
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17092 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 May 2012 at 10:05 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-22 01:02:44 AM  
Why the quotes around "Christian"? He's obviously the real deal.
 
2012-05-22 01:03:10 AM  

WhyteRaven74: tinfoil-hat maggie: Well to be far I doubt there are any southern baptist in Tanzania.

The funny thing is Islam's issues with homosexuality are fairly recent. The Koran itself says nothing on it unless you misread the story of Lot. There's a few hadith that speak to it, but a thousand years ago there was a school of thought that said they weren't exactly reliable since their authenticity was in question. So you had some Muslims, who wouldn't even call it a sin. And then those who did say it was a sin, but that was as far as you could go with it. Now there were some other who suggested various punishments, but they were hardly overwhelming voices. It's only been recently that Islam has come to have some sort of big issue with gays. And that really is due to how selectively certain old interpretations are presented and even remembered these days. You have people, who like the Baptists, insist a certain position is the only valid position and has been the only position that has ever existed.


Interesting, BTW any good books you could suggest? It's been a while since I even bothered, I think the last thing I read was Jesus and the lost Goddess about the gnostic tradition and such.
/Yea just finally said well I'm agnostic and that's enough for now.

//but it is a fascinating subject, the whole why do people believe what they do
 
2012-05-22 01:03:16 AM  

RexTalionis: You know who else wanted to put gay people in camps until they die?


You mean other than the Mr. Rogers of the Right, Mike Huckabee?
 
2012-05-22 01:03:42 AM  
"Christian" asshat atheist calls for gaysReligious Extremests to
be imprisoned in an electrified pen until
they die.
Amen, and pass the ammo -
`

t2.gstatic.com
 
2012-05-22 01:05:00 AM  

Sylvia_Bandersnatch: RexTalionis: You know who else wanted to put gay people in camps until they die?

You mean other than the Mr. Rogers of the Right, Mike Huckabee?


All fascists love that idea, from Thatcher onward.
 
2012-05-22 01:07:54 AM  

clyph: FlashHarry: extremism in ANY religion is bad.

FTFY.


/ Hmmm, I'm not sure I can totally agree with this.

My parents get a lot out of going to there church, with the support and and all and well it's not a real judgmental one so. And it's not quite a country club or what not but it works for them so.
 
2012-05-22 01:08:42 AM  

Murphyr: "Bait-y"? If someone posted this psychotic "let's just make some concentration camps" nonsense with an account named "Ron Baity", it would be the worst attempt at trolling in history.


That was my first thought. Particularly because "baiting" is frequently used in connection with trolling gay sex chat rooms for conservative married men and posting the resulting logs on 4Chan.
 
2012-05-22 01:09:33 AM  

LesserEvil: You think Dr. Tiller's death was the result of a preacher speaking, not of an individual asshole who was already of a vengeful, homicidal mind?


If it's not possible to incite violence, then let's get rid of the laws against doing so.
 
2012-05-22 01:10:35 AM  

RatMotor: B/C I don't think as a species we do recognize the wrong-doing.


Sure we do, it's just that we don't all agree on what's "wrong". But that's not the real problem. The real problem is that we're not evolved to live in communities so large as we do now. We deal beast with communities in the lower few thousands of members. Above that and our tribal instincts kick in and we start looking in fear at "outsiders". But there are no more real outsiders within a nation, so we make our own. And we tend to look for the most easily identifiable traits to define what outsiders are.

We haven't peaked. Not by a long shot. We're just battling survival instincts that have served us well for the bulk of our existence. It's not the fault of our genes that we changed the rules faster than our biology can adapt.
 
2012-05-22 01:10:51 AM  

cmb53208: tinfoil-hat maggie:

I once had to serve members of the southern baptist convention at a restaurant I worked at : (
Never would go to one of their churches..

I'm guessing they were lousy tippers, wouldn't surprise me in the least


One of the worst conventions I worked, the bikers were awesome : )
 
2012-05-22 01:11:11 AM  
This pastor's gay and clearly into extreme kink. Perhaps his male assistant can send this lost lamb home to his shepherd.
 
2012-05-22 01:11:17 AM  
I don't know if there is an afterlife. Even though I'm not christian, that doesn't mean I've ruled out Jesus/God works it. But man, if they do, a lot of 'Christians' are going to be harshly disappointed when they are held accountable for stuff like this.
 
2012-05-22 01:12:00 AM  
I really do think that some of these nutball Baptist and Pentecostal preachers do pose a threat. Could their follwers carry out a terrorist attack? Of course they could, people that blinded by hatred and ignorance are capable of anything.

Southern cities I think are the ones most in danger from these assholes: do you think they like the fact that Atlanta and New Orleans have large gay communities? Or that there's a bunch of pointy headed smarty pants people in Nashville and Chapel Hill?
 
2012-05-22 01:15:10 AM  

cmunic8r99: Shiat like this makes me weep for my country.


I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. Seriously. We've always had losers like this, and always will, but those on the losing side of history always scream the most in their last hours. So all this is (assuming it's not merely grandstanding for dollars, which I still think is likely) is one of countless symptoms of the kind of change he's railing against. He can't stand the fact that we won, and he's got to live to see it. But his views are not typical; they're in a rapidly shrinking minority. It'll never disappear completely, but it won't be much longer before we don't see much of this anymore.
 
2012-05-22 01:15:46 AM  

Theaetetus: Murphyr: "Bait-y"? If someone posted this psychotic "let's just make some concentration camps" nonsense with an account named "Ron Baity", it would be the worst attempt at trolling in history.

That was my first thought. Particularly because "baiting" is frequently used in connection with trolling gay sex chat rooms for conservative married men and posting the resulting logs on 4Chan.


Wow, learn something new and disturbing every day.
 
2012-05-22 01:16:38 AM  

Ed Grubermann: RatMotor: B/C I don't think as a species we do recognize the wrong-doing.

Sure we do, it's just that we don't all agree on what's "wrong". But that's not the real problem. The real problem is that we're not evolved to live in communities so large as we do now. We deal beast with communities in the lower few thousands of members. Above that and our tribal instincts kick in and we start looking in fear at "outsiders". But there are no more real outsiders within a nation, so we make our own. And we tend to look for the most easily identifiable traits to define what outsiders are.

We haven't peaked. Not by a long shot. We're just battling survival instincts that have served us well for the bulk of our existence. It's not the fault of our genes that we changed the rules faster than our biology can adapt.


100% agree. Question is - is it a battle we can win? Maybe all the optimism has been beaten out of me, but it sure does some like a lot of people are actively trying to back-pedal to the dark ages.
 
2012-05-22 01:18:00 AM  

Ed Grubermann: s2s2s2: Hell awaits, sodomite!

See Ezekiel 16:49 for an explanation of why I am saying this to this shiathead tool of Satan, the accuser.

And I give a shiat what your god thinks, why, exactly?


Who said you did? Keep your lack of concern to yourself.
 
2012-05-22 01:19:32 AM  

Sylvia_Bandersnatch: cmunic8r99: Shiat like this makes me weep for my country.

I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. Seriously. We've always had losers like this, and always will, but those on the losing side of history always scream the most in their last hours. So all this is (assuming it's not merely grandstanding for dollars, which I still think is likely) is one of countless symptoms of the kind of change he's railing against. He can't stand the fact that we won, and he's got to live to see it. But his views are not typical; they're in a rapidly shrinking minority. It'll never disappear completely, but it won't be much longer before we don't see much of this anymore.


I feel essentially the same way. Fifty years ago this sort of rant wouldn't have happened simply because gay rights wasn't even on the radar. People like this know where we're headed as a society (ie - further acceptance of LGBT lifestyles) and it scares them to death.
 
2012-05-22 01:21:22 AM  
If gay marriage is a slippery slope to bestiality then so is regular marrige. fark you.
 
2012-05-22 01:21:58 AM  

Theaetetus: Murphyr: "Bait-y"? If someone posted this psychotic "let's just make some concentration camps" nonsense with an account named "Ron Baity", it would be the worst attempt at trolling in history.

That was my first thought. Particularly because "baiting" is frequently used in connection with trolling gay sex chat rooms for conservative married men and posting the resulting logs on 4Chan.



Ron Baity, founding pastor
of Winston-Salem's Berean Baptist Church and head of the anti-marriage equality organization Return America, referred to homosexuality as "a perverted lifestyle" in a Sunday sermon before telling his congregation that lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) people should be prosecuted, Good as You is
reporting.
"For 300 years, we had laws that would
prosecute that lifestyle," he is quoted as
saying. "We've gone down the wrong path.
We've become so dumb that we have accepted a lie for the truth, and we've...discarded the
truth on the shoals of shipwreck!"
 
2012-05-22 01:24:15 AM  

RatMotor: 100% agree. Question is - is it a battle we can win? Maybe all the optimism has been beaten out of me, but it sure does some like a lot of people are actively trying to back-pedal to the dark ages.


True, but I think they're a very vocal minority. Just look at how far we've come in only a few human generations. My great grandmother wasn't even a citizen under the law for most of her life. For every person actively trying to reverse our progress there are at least three times as many moving it forward.
 
2012-05-22 01:24:25 AM  

Sylvia_Bandersnatch: cmunic8r99: Shiat like this makes me weep for my country.

I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. Seriously. We've always had losers like this, and always will, but those on the losing side of history always scream the most in their last hours. So all this is (assuming it's not merely grandstanding for dollars, which I still think is likely) is one of countless symptoms of the kind of change he's railing against. He can't stand the fact that we won, and he's got to live to see it. But his views are not typical; they're in a rapidly shrinking minority. It'll never disappear completely, but it won't be much longer before we don't see much of this anymore.


Time to watchCaberet again, what it can happen here.
 
2012-05-22 01:25:35 AM  
Has this guy considered the whole "bi" thing? Why is the gay thing always so black and white - It rarely is, in reality. It's a scale, not binary.
 
2012-05-22 01:25:46 AM  
Maybe you people should have thought a little harder about the consequences of "majority rules" before transforming our representative Republic into a basic democracy.
 
2012-05-22 01:29:27 AM  

jaylectricity: dameron: He continues: "Do the same thing for the queers and the homosexuals and have that fence electrified so they can't get out...and you know what, in a few years, they'll die out...do you know why? They can't reproduce!"

So, it's genetic then?

Because People in power are Stupid: "Do the same thing for the queers and the homosexuals and have that fence electrified so they can't get out...and you know what, in a few years, they'll die out...do you know why? They can't reproduce!"

Okay so he basically admits that it's genetic and not a choice (at least for men). That's a gayby step forward.

I think he's assuming that the gay men won't want anything to do with the lesbians, so there will be no reproducing.


Okay, everyone? Go back and watch it again, and this time pay attention: He makes it pretty clear that he's talking about TWO DIFFERENT places -- one for women, and one for men. He doesn't mumble it or slur his speech. How did so many of you miss that detail?
 
2012-05-22 01:30:18 AM  
His e-mail address and mailing address are easily available online. I sent him an e-mail asking him where in the Bible does Jesus say anything explicitly about homosexuality, and to tell him that I'm praying for him to find peace.

I'm guessing that's just gonna piss him off even more.
 
2012-05-22 01:34:15 AM  

zarberg: His e-mail address and mailing address are easily available online. I sent him an e-mail asking him where in the Bible does Jesus say anything explicitly about homosexuality, and to tell him that I'm praying for him to find peace.

I'm guessing that's just gonna piss him off even more.


I did something similar. Waiting for the response.
 
2012-05-22 01:36:22 AM  

zarberg: His e-mail address and mailing address are easily available online. I sent him an e-mail asking him where in the Bible does Jesus say anything explicitly about homosexuality, and to tell him that I'm praying for him to find peace.

I'm guessing that's just gonna piss him off even more.


I could be wrong, because I'm certainly not religious, much less christian, but wouldn't that be covered under "If you would enter into Life, keep the Commandments"? I think there's one about adultery. Note that I am not claiming this invalidates your general argument, just that I believe it answers your specific objection.
 
2012-05-22 01:36:33 AM  

Sylvia_Bandersnatch: jaylectricity: dameron: He continues: "Do the same thing for the queers and the homosexuals and have that fence electrified so they can't get out...and you know what, in a few years, they'll die out...do you know why? They can't reproduce!"

So, it's genetic then?

Because People in power are Stupid: "Do the same thing for the queers and the homosexuals and have that fence electrified so they can't get out...and you know what, in a few years, they'll die out...do you know why? They can't reproduce!"

Okay so he basically admits that it's genetic and not a choice (at least for men). That's a gayby step forward.

I think he's assuming that the gay men won't want anything to do with the lesbians, so there will be no reproducing.

Okay, everyone? Go back and watch it again, and this time pay attention: He makes it pretty clear that he's talking about TWO DIFFERENT places -- one for women, and one for men. He doesn't mumble it or slur his speech. How did so many of you miss that detail?


Can I be a guard at the lesbian/bi camp?

webhamster.com
Pick Me!PickmEee!!
 
2012-05-22 01:38:04 AM  

Somaticasual: Has this guy considered the whole "bi" thing? Why is the gay thing always so black and white - It rarely is, in reality. It's a scale, not binary.


It's pretty obvious this guy hasn't even thought past gays are bad much.

Also bisexuals are fictional just like ... well yeah I can't even go there. I just fear these idiots are feeling under pressure and there going to blow, hopefully it's in some motel with a rent boy but...
 
2012-05-22 01:38:38 AM  

pastorsteve: As a Christian pastor, I want to express my deep regret for this inexpressibly hideous thing that was said by a colleague - however out of the mainstream of Christian teaching he is. I am sorry.


I thank you Pastor Steve as it gives me and others hope that there are those who still know the word of God being a message of love and not of hatred. This "colleague" is a wolf in sheep's clothing, sowing hatred and evil. Thank you for still remembering and keeping the Word alive.
 
2012-05-22 01:39:48 AM  

RexTalionis: You know who else wanted to put gay people in camps until they die?


Helen Keller?
 
2012-05-22 01:40:57 AM  

untaken_name: zarberg: His e-mail address and mailing address are easily available online. I sent him an e-mail asking him where in the Bible does Jesus say anything explicitly about homosexuality, and to tell him that I'm praying for him to find peace.

I'm guessing that's just gonna piss him off even more.

I could be wrong, because I'm certainly not religious, much less christian, but wouldn't that be covered under "If you would enter into Life, keep the Commandments"? I think there's one about adultery. Note that I am not claiming this invalidates your general argument, just that I believe it answers your specific objection.


Maybe that word doesn't mean what I think it means, but isn't adultery basically cheating on a marriage? I looked it up online and it said "adultery is voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and someone other than the lawful spouse."

Nowhere in the 10 commandments does it say "don't be gay."
 
2012-05-22 01:42:05 AM  

Boatmech: Sylvia_Bandersnatch: jaylectricity: dameron: He continues: "Do the same thing for the queers and the homosexuals and have that fence electrified so they can't get out...and you know what, in a few years, they'll die out...do you know why? They can't reproduce!"

So, it's genetic then?

Because People in power are Stupid: "Do the same thing for the queers and the homosexuals and have that fence electrified so they can't get out...and you know what, in a few years, they'll die out...do you know why? They can't reproduce!"

Okay so he basically admits that it's genetic and not a choice (at least for men). That's a gayby step forward.

I think he's assuming that the gay men won't want anything to do with the lesbians, so there will be no reproducing.

Okay, everyone? Go back and watch it again, and this time pay attention: He makes it pretty clear that he's talking about TWO DIFFERENT places -- one for women, and one for men. He doesn't mumble it or slur his speech. How did so many of you miss that detail?

Can I be a guard at the lesbian/bi camp?

[webhamster.com image 60x70]
Pick Me!PickmEee!!


What you're thinking of:

www.colourbox.com

What you're more likely to see:

mulletjunky.com
 
2012-05-22 01:44:32 AM  

untaken_name: What you're thinking of:


If they somehow had a device that let them sort people due to orientation, you'd see more of the first then the second, as long as you focused on the younger age groups. Here's a hint, the first picture you posted becomes the second in about twelve years.
 
2012-05-22 01:44:55 AM  

zarberg: untaken_name: zarberg: His e-mail address and mailing address are easily available online. I sent him an e-mail asking him where in the Bible does Jesus say anything explicitly about homosexuality, and to tell him that I'm praying for him to find peace.

I'm guessing that's just gonna piss him off even more.

I could be wrong, because I'm certainly not religious, much less christian, but wouldn't that be covered under "If you would enter into Life, keep the Commandments"? I think there's one about adultery. Note that I am not claiming this invalidates your general argument, just that I believe it answers your specific objection.

Maybe that word doesn't mean what I think it means, but isn't adultery basically cheating on a marriage? I looked it up online and it said "adultery is voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and someone other than the lawful spouse."

Nowhere in the 10 commandments does it say "don't be gay."


Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.
 
2012-05-22 01:46:51 AM  

PonceAlyosha: untaken_name: What you're thinking of:

If they somehow had a device that let them sort people due to orientation, you'd see more of the first then the second, as long as you focused on the younger age groups. Here's a hint, the first picture you posted becomes the second in about twelve years.


I'm certainly not anti-gay, but keep in mind that the first picture I posted doesn't even represent the majority of straight women, so it's not likely to represent the majority of gay women, either.
 
2012-05-22 01:47:19 AM  

untaken_name: Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.


Except there are plenty of instances of God approving the Israelites raping women whom they have conquered without marriage AFTER that commandment.
 
2012-05-22 01:47:44 AM  

Nightmaretony: pastorsteve: As a Christian pastor, I want to express my deep regret for this inexpressibly hideous thing that was said by a colleague - however out of the mainstream of Christian teaching he is. I am sorry.

I thank you Pastor Steve as it gives me and others hope that there are those who still know the word of God being a message of love and not of hatred. This "colleague" is a wolf in sheep's clothing, sowing hatred and evil. Thank you for still remembering and keeping the Word alive.


Nice to see you guys congratulating yourselves on be such fine, upstanding christians.
Are you going to actually do anything besides 'pray' these people will change?
 
2012-05-22 01:47:54 AM  
How is this abuse seen as a "cure" in any way? I really feel bad for any gay kid born into a very religious family...
 
2012-05-22 01:49:03 AM  

PonceAlyosha: untaken_name: Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.

Except there are plenty of instances of God approving the Israelites raping women whom they have conquered without marriage AFTER that commandment.


Addendum to my previous post: Not to mention the farking giant swarms of concubines that the Kings of Zion had.
 
2012-05-22 01:49:16 AM  

WorldCitizen: Aw, isn't that cute. I know we're not supposed to Godwin, but come on. This guy in nearly every shape wants to create Nazi concentration camps. The only thing he didn't say is that we should have pink triangles stitched to our clothes.

Disgusting.

If there is a God who agrees with this man, all hope is lost.


====================================

No, I think Godwining this one is absolutely justified. Uncle Adolph would be VERY proud of this jackass.
 
2012-05-22 01:49:31 AM  

PonceAlyosha: untaken_name: Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.

Except there are plenty of instances of God approving the Israelites raping women whom they have conquered without marriage AFTER that commandment.


Really? That is interesting. I've not been exposed to that before - would you mind linking one or two? It would make fascinating reading. I'm certainly no expert, although I do find the Hebrew tradition oddly intriguing.
 
2012-05-22 01:51:22 AM  

PonceAlyosha: PonceAlyosha: untaken_name: Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.

Except there are plenty of instances of God approving the Israelites raping women whom they have conquered without marriage AFTER that commandment.

Addendum to my previous post: Not to mention the farking giant swarms of concubines that the Kings of Zion had.


Clarification - concubines are considered wives in the bible. Polygamy isn't proscribed in the bible. It's like the old joke - do you know what the biblical punishment for polygamy was? Multiple wives.
 
2012-05-22 01:51:56 AM  
Am I the only one who sees this as a victory for the green movement? Now we've got the conservatives using electrified fence on two problems - immigration and teh ghey. We just build two fences in parallel between Mexico and the US, and then put the gays in between them, blammo, both problems solved with the same project!
 
2012-05-22 01:53:51 AM  

untaken_name: Really? That is interesting. I've not been exposed to that before - would you mind linking one or two? It would make fascinating reading. I'm certainly no expert, although I do find the Hebrew tradition oddly intriguing.


Lamentations 5:11

Numbers 31:1-18

Deuteronomy 21:11-14
 
2012-05-22 01:54:44 AM  

untaken_name: zarberg: untaken_name: zarberg: His e-mail address and mailing address are easily available online. I sent him an e-mail asking him where in the Bible does Jesus say anything explicitly about homosexuality, and to tell him that I'm praying for him to find peace.

I'm guessing that's just gonna piss him off even more.

I could be wrong, because I'm certainly not religious, much less christian, but wouldn't that be covered under "If you would enter into Life, keep the Commandments"? I think there's one about adultery. Note that I am not claiming this invalidates your general argument, just that I believe it answers your specific objection.

Maybe that word doesn't mean what I think it means, but isn't adultery basically cheating on a marriage? I looked it up online and it said "adultery is voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and someone other than the lawful spouse."

Nowhere in the 10 commandments does it say "don't be gay."

Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.


So if man legalized same sex marriage, god wouldn't send gay people to hell? Sorry I'm going to fight on Odin's side during Ramnorock and win my place in Valhalla.
 
2012-05-22 01:54:52 AM  

untaken_name: Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.


My far-too-many years of Catholic school are 20 years ago, but I don't remember the Bible specifically saying anything outside marriage is adultery. I know English common law used to state that in the strictest definition. In Hebrew sources, specifically Exodus and Leviticus, adultery applied only to the woman.

The Mormons specifically extend (I.E. add their own swing) on that commandment to say it includes a lot of stuff, but they sure don't speak for every Christian denomination.

My humble apologies, not trying to be an argumentative or contrary a-hole, just curious where you got your information.
 
2012-05-22 01:54:53 AM  

Mock26: Dear Pastor Prick,

Guess what? If people stop conditioning children to believe in god and jesus and all that crap do you know what will happen? christianity will die out! And do you know why? Because religion is a learned behavior! Everyone on the planet is born an atheist!


I wish that were true, and I used to believe it myself. I used to believe that religion was memetic, a social equivalent of cumulative personality. (The latter is why long-term coma patients are 'different people' when they come out of it: Your personality is a cumulative effect of recent social memory, and if you go long enough without that you sort of lose it and start over again. I used to believe that religion is like that. And it kind of is, but there's more to it.) I used to believe that if you could just identify and server the transmission vectors, or sufficiently disrupt them, you could in effect kill off religion within a few generations, or at least manage to changer it into something a little less nutty and damaging. Alas, I no longer believe this.

It turns out, based on some fairly recent science of the last decade or so, that religion is apparently more or less inborn in most people, and very common, nearly ubiquitous. There's a part of the brain that has been identified with the profound experience of the divine: it does pretty much the same thing, no matter what one's faith or spiritual background. Why this is, no one really knows. Some philosophers, such as Daniel C. Dennett (see 'Breaking the Spell') speculate that it's the human equivalent of the 'intentional agent' reaction that many 'thinking animals' such as dogs have. (If your dog barks at a stick hitting the gutter -- an example from his book -- that's arguably similar to primitive humans assuming that thunder was some god expressing anger.) Dennett also points to how extremely self-deluding humans can be, using as example the rather unsettling case of cargo cults. The fact that otherwise perfectly sensible humans can come up with something like that may go a long way to explain how religion works both individually and socially, and why it's so pervasive and durable.

On the whole, religion just seems like a powerful human imperative, like hunger or the sex drive, and no matter what anyone might do we're probably stuck with it as long as there are humans around.

I guess my point is that yes, humans are "born atheist," to the extent that a baby does not have any sophisticated sense of divinity, either real or imaginary, and certainly does not possess what we would call 'religion' in the sense of humans who can wipe themselves and tie their shoes. But it's not like if you put a baby on an island they wouldn't get religion. Modern science suggests that they more likely would than not, even if they have to invent it themselves. I wish it wasn't so, but that seems to be the reality.
 
2012-05-22 01:55:13 AM  

untaken_name: PonceAlyosha: PonceAlyosha: untaken_name: Adultery is defined in biblical terms as sex outside the bounds of marriage. Since men are not allowed to marry men, and women are not allowed to marry women (according to the bible), then any gay sex is, by definition, adultery. So is straight sex between unmarried partners, so it's not SPECIFICALLY anti-gay, but it does entirely exclude any gay sex under any circumstances, so I'm pretty sure it answers your original objection. Now, please stop making me defend things I don't even believe in.

Except there are plenty of instances of God approving the Israelites raping women whom they have conquered without marriage AFTER that commandment.

Addendum to my previous post: Not to mention the farking giant swarms of concubines that the Kings of Zion had.

Clarification - concubines are considered wives in the bible. Polygamy isn't proscribed in the bible. It's like the old joke - do you know what the biblical punishment for polygamy was? Multiple wives.


Only under very specific circumstances. See the deuteronomy link I just posted.
 
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