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(The New York Times)   After the murder of two Chinese USC students, their parents are suing the college on the grounds that USC's marketing materials described the campus as being in an "urban" location rather than "crime infested"   (nytimes.com) divider line 223
    More: Fail, University of Southern California, Chinese, safe area, graduate students, internet application, murders, colleges, foreign students  
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8018 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 May 2012 at 4:13 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-21 03:23:32 AM

mugwump867: They've got nothing on all the foreign students who attend Wayne State University in Detroit. I did some post-grad work there and grew up in the area so I knew what I was in for but so many of the foreign students end up in seriously sketchy off campus housing with no access to any sort of grocery store or other basic services. I'm sure it's not what they had in mind when they decided to head to the US for school.


I studied at Wayne also. You are absolutely right. However, even the on campus housing is filthy and dangerous. What department were you affiliated with? I was in the Chemistry Department from 2001 until 2008.
 
2012-05-21 04:47:03 AM
Newsflash to Americans: your euphemisms don't export very well. 'Urban' doesn't mean 'unsafe'. Or it shouldn't. And no, that is very different around the world.
 
2012-05-21 05:20:44 AM
Ming Qu & Ying Wu: Without Regard; "In my country & taking advantage of benefits I'm denied." Los Angeles Black Foot Soldiers Encourage Foreigners to "Regard US History & Trans Atlantic Slave Trade Reparations," Hail Javier Bolden & Bryan Barnes "Heroes" In "Stand Against US' Continued Anti Black, Pro Asian Preferences in College, Lending & Business," Condemn Qu & Wu's Tolerance of Inequalities & Apparent Racist Violence

2.bp.blogspot.com


Quote: Foreigners like Ming and Ying come here because they know that we are are this country's stepping stones. They KNOW we will be denied opportunities that are quickly and easily awarded to them. So people like Ming and Ying AREN'T innocent. THEY COME HERE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE "ANTI BLACK, PRO ASIAN" CULTURE that discriminates against us and favors them!

Now just think if it was a whyte debbil who'd stole their opportunity!
 
2012-05-21 05:29:56 AM

Pete_T_Mann: Ok, just WTF?

[underprivilegedmedianetwork.files.wordpress.com image 545x364]


Not In Memory of Ming Qu & Ying Wu: Los Angeles Black Foot Soldier Icon Javier Bolden Shows Off Gun (on Myspace) Used to Defend Self Against Anti Black USC Students Accused of "Social Advancement at Expense of Blacks"

Its like a black stormfront. Except even less literate....

Hopefully the image will post, the img link keeps getting cut short for some reason


Ah, severe mental illness is alive and well in the USofA. What a heaping bowl of fruitloop farkups that site is.
 
2012-05-21 06:14:49 AM

St_Francis_P: The 15-page lawsuit accuses the institution of hiding behind the word "urban" and not saying the campus is in a high-crime area. It also notes that Chinese students in particular would interpret "urban" to mean the university is in a safe area.

I'm sorry for their loss, but that statement makes no sense whatsoever.


In many parts of the world urban areas are safer, crime-wise, than sparsely populated rural areas.
 
2012-05-21 06:51:41 AM

glassbottomboatcaptain: This wasn't random crime, it was a targeted killing so crime rate is moot. One of the guys who shot them said it was because chinese immigrants are coming in and taking away 'opportunities' that would otherwise go to black students.


That's because that sounds better in court than 'They stiffed me on a drug deal so I shot them' which seems a lot more likely. Anyone with an image of wealthy Chinese students in a foreign country with money as naive innocents has no idea whatsoever.
 
2012-05-21 07:00:42 AM

St_Francis_P: The 15-page lawsuit accuses the institution of hiding behind the word "urban" and not saying the campus is in a high-crime area. It also notes that Chinese students in particular would interpret "urban" to mean the university is in a safe area.

I'm sorry for their loss, but that statement makes no sense whatsoever.


you may not agree with the logic, but the statement makes perfect sense. in fact i am struggling with figuring out a snarky way to condense it down that doesn't basically just repeat the statement.

You could argue that it makes more sense than the fact that the University thinks this is "a baseless lawsuit," however they have convinced the local PD to "send more than 30 additional officers to the division that handles the campus area" and "pay for four more officers to patrol the students' residential areas."

They also announced new security measures after the shootings and promised more video cameras, escorts and patrols.

Schools have been successfully sued before for not providing adequate protection for their students. The fact that they were a mile off campus isn't really going to help them, but who knows. Obviously the school has recognized the existence of a problem. What a tragedy...

I think the real story here is yet another story of POS losers that kill contributing members of society... reminds me of those shiatheads where I live that killed a graduate student at Duke and then the student body president at UNC. All for what amounted to tiny amounts of money and an ipod.

They still had the ipod on them they'd taken from the duke student when they arrested them for killing the UNC student.
 
2012-05-21 07:04:47 AM

Geotpf: No way in hell an American jury (which doesn't speak Chinese) could be convinced that "urban" means "safe". Plus, the murder didn't even happen on campus. Bet the lawyer suing isn't working on contingency.


They don't need to convince a jury that urban means safe - they need to convince a jury that the university misrepresented the campus and surrounding area on their international literature. if they did, that should be a fairly straight-forward case.

If there's even a chance that this could happen i doubt it will ever see a jury - they'll settle.
 
2012-05-21 07:10:11 AM
I'm surprised there isn't more support for such suits. The message it sends, "Those with money are bad, so they should be held legally responsible for how those without money interpret words, as a means toward social justice." resonates here.
 
2012-05-21 07:43:02 AM

GoldSpider: I'm surprised there isn't more support for such suits. The message it sends, "Those with money are bad, so they should be held legally responsible for how those without money interpret words, as a means toward social justice." resonates here.


That makes little sense even for you.
 
2012-05-21 08:15:03 AM

GoldSpider: I'm surprised there isn't more support for such suits. The message it sends, "Those with money are bad, so they should be held legally responsible for how those without money interpret words, as a means toward social justice." resonates here.


huh?
 
2012-05-21 09:12:19 AM

monkeyc: Ming Qu & Ying Wu: Without Regard; "In my country & taking advantage of benefits I'm denied." Los Angeles Black Foot Soldiers Encourage Foreigners to "Regard US History & Trans Atlantic Slave Trade Reparations," Hail Javier Bolden & Bryan Barnes "Heroes" In "Stand Against US' Continued Anti Black, Pro Asian Preferences in College, Lending & Business," Condemn Qu & Wu's Tolerance of Inequalities & Apparent Racist Violence

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 640x442]


Quote: Foreigners like Ming and Ying come here because they know that we are are this country's stepping stones. They KNOW we will be denied opportunities that are quickly and easily awarded to them. So people like Ming and YingAREN'T innocent. THEY COME HERE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE "ANTI BLACK, PRO ASIAN" CULTURE that discriminates against us and favors them!

Now just think if it was a whyte debbil who'd stole their opportunity!


monkeyc: Ming Qu & Ying Wu: Without Regard; "In my country & taking advantage of benefits I'm denied." Los Angeles Black Foot Soldiers Encourage Foreigners to "Regard US History & Trans Atlantic Slave Trade Reparations," Hail Javier Bolden & Bryan Barnes "Heroes" In "Stand Against US' Continued Anti Black, Pro Asian Preferences in College, Lending & Business," Condemn Qu & Wu's Tolerance of Inequalities & Apparent Racist Violence

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 640x442]

Quote: Foreigners like Ming and Ying come here because they know that we are are this country's stepping stones. They KNOW we will be denied opportunities that are quickly and easily awarded to them. So people like Ming and Ying AREN'T innocent. THEY COME HERE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE "ANTI BLACK, PRO ASIAN" CULTURE that discriminates against us and favors them!

Now just think if it was a whyte debbil who'd stole their opportunity!


I've seen this website! They shop crowns on the heads of the killers(literally white-knighting them) and blame the victims real perpetrators for not heeding reparations obviously owed to them.

Also their Facebook pages are funny to read.

Also they often don't spell too good.
 
2012-05-21 09:15:49 AM

BMFPitt: Do you believe the term "inner city youth" has ever been used to reference young people who live near a metropolitan center?

It's not racists to understand racial euphemisms. It's often racist to use them.



That's not what he said.

I understand what he means just fine. I was born, raised, and still live in Tennessee. When you say "urban" here, it means the city. When you say "country," it means a rural area. If it's in-between, you'll almost always say the name of the town or community, or possibly "just outside [city]." To everyone I know from around here, "urban youth" means "kids with no yards."

We're not pollyannas; we're simply not subverting the meaning of words in order to pretend racial issues don't exist and maintain some faux moral high ground.
 
2012-05-21 09:25:13 AM

pyrotek85: Tatterdemalian: Well, in China, "urban" actually is synonymous with "safe." They're not so coddled and entitled yet that they honestly believe wild animals are supposed to be less dangerous than their fellow citizens.

/the sad thing is how the US has written this assumption into our laws without telling anyone
//"But if someone has a gun, then they're going to use it to kill other people, because they can't be expected to control themselves! Humans don't have the self control wild bears do!"

Yeah there's often a bit of psychological projection going on with anti-gunners. Most people can control themselves just fine, it's only a small part of the population causing most of the crime (lots of recidivism) but that's another conversation.


It never ceases to amaze me how you gun-nuts can see in stories of people getting gunned down evidence of how unhinged anti-gun people are. This is a story of two Chinese students getting shot to death, and your takeaway from it is that attempts at gun-regulation are the psychological projections of sociopaths. Your ability to twist anything into some crackpot conspiracy which justifies your world view is truly a sight to behold.

Do I really even need to point out that one of the reasons mainland Chinese would find this story so appalling is because gun-ownership is heavily restricted in that country? This doesn't just make the US look like a place you might get murdered, but also a place where any damn fool can get a gun with minimal effort.
 
2012-05-21 09:47:13 AM

Carousel Beast: BMFPitt: Do you believe the term "inner city youth" has ever been used to reference young people who live near a metropolitan center?

It's not racists to understand racial euphemisms. It's often racist to use them.


That's not what he said.

I understand what he means just fine. I was born, raised, and still live in Tennessee. When you say "urban" here, it means the city. When you say "country," it means a rural area. If it's in-between, you'll almost always say the name of the town or community, or possibly "just outside [city]." To everyone I know from around here, "urban youth" means "kids with no yards."

We're not pollyannas; we're simply not subverting the meaning of words in order to pretend racial issues don't exist and maintain some faux moral high ground.


There's a difference between comprehension and usage which seems to be lost on you. It's like hearing the term "family values" and assuming it means anything other than "anti-gay."
 
2012-05-21 10:14:51 AM

RandomAxe: Universities have been successfully sued before on the grounds of creating a false or exaggerated expectation of a safe campus environment.

There are various issues involved: The university's responsibility to provide a safe environment. False advertising. Possible endangerment of students by misleading them (lulling them into a false sense of security, essentially).

I'm not saying this particular case is justified, but it's not a new concept in litigation, and it's sometimes justified. That 14-year-old who vanished while attending MSU back in the 80s leaps to mind. The university assured his parents that he'd be specially looked after because of his age, and then they basically just gave the kid a dorm room and a class schedule. Oops.

Foreign students obviously pose certain problems, as far as this stuff goes. In my own experience, some schools do a great job of making life easier and safer for foreign students, and some just take their money and let them fend for themselves. I would have thought USC would be pretty good with Chinese students, at least, though.


You must work for a university...because you got it about 103% correct on colleges/universities and their liability. I work for a college and, yes, you are subject to much more litigation than the average public/private organization

Personally, I would not send an Asian kid to an inner-city school like USC....it is no secret that blacks are notoriously racist towards Asians...and moreso in L.A. USC probably more concerned with political correctness..."offending blacks"...than being factual and honest.

USC will probably settle with the families
 
2012-05-21 11:08:00 AM

Coming on a Bicycle: Newsflash to Americans: your euphemisms don't export very well. 'Urban' doesn't mean 'unsafe'. Or it shouldn't. And no, that is very different around the world.


Uh, here in America the word "urban" means of, relating to, characteristic of, or constituting a city. That is it. But, there are urban areas that are unsafe, and USC is located in one of those areas.
 
2012-05-21 03:38:00 PM
Last week, VH1 showed some crap documentary about the 1992 LA riots with tons of raw footage and a 'gangsta' soundtrack. The 'documentary' portrayed the riots in a very sympathetic light. the documentary was a collection of on the scene handheld footage, set to hardcore gangsta rap, with a sympathetic narrator.

The consistant rationalization throughout was 'white police oppress us, so this insane level of violence is justified.'

however, most of the people getting beaten in the footage were latinos accidentally passing through the wrong intersection. drug out of their cars and beaten and stomped by groups of 6-8 attackers. it was violence for the sake of violence.

and it was very shocking to see the murderous mob scene set to rap, playing on VH1 as if it was justified. maybe VH1 was showing it as a warning. like, 'look at the violence these folk are just itching to inflict.' but i think it will have the effect of making them feel justified. it was priming the pump for the upcoming Trey Martin riots.

/murderous culture is murderous culture
 
2012-05-21 03:48:27 PM

Pete_T_Mann: Ok, just WTF?

[underprivilegedmedianetwork.files.wordpress.com image 545x364]


Not In Memory of Ming Qu & Ying Wu: Los Angeles Black Foot Soldier Icon Javier Bolden Shows Off Gun (on Myspace) Used to Defend Self Against Anti Black USC Students Accused of "Social Advancement at Expense of Blacks"

Its like a black stormfront. Except even less literate....

Hopefully the image will post, the img link keeps getting cut short for some reason


WTF did I just read? That's for real?
 
2012-05-21 05:04:55 PM

Heron: It never ceases to amaze me how you gun-nuts can see in stories of people getting gunned down evidence of how unhinged anti-gun people are.


As a gunnie, I'd say that in this situation it's more a case of a gun in the wrong hands. I don't have enough knowledge of this specific case to blame:
1. Drug War
2. Past welfare/housing projects that resulted in more broken families, especially among the minorities.
3. Failed Schools
4. Failed prison/justice system that's so bad at reform that it released people who were more dangerous than when they came in.
5. Failed healthcare systems, especially in the mental health field.
 
2012-05-21 06:10:48 PM

Satanic_Hamster: HairBolus: The_Homeless_Guy: Satanic_Hamster: Honestly, the "urbanness" of Georgia Tech and Carnegie Melon were the prime reasons I didn't go there. Especially Georgia Tech, man were they in a shiattacular part of Atlanta.

Carnegie Melon is hardly "urban". I suppose it is kinda ghetto if you decide to live near Pitt's campus and put up with oakland (it's really only the north parts of oakland that get bad), but you can just as easily live in Squirrel Hill, which really doesn't have any bad areas. It's quite unlikely you are going to get mugged by a Rabbi.

I get the feeling that Satanic_Hamster is using that as the excuse for why he didn't go to CMU as opposed to the truth that he wasn't admitted. I doubt that he has seen the area around campus.

I did. And 18ish years ago? The area looked like shiat. Was accepted and offered a decent scholarship. But when it came down to it, fark Pittsburgh. :0

Went to Virginia Tech.


Yeah, 'cause nobody gets shot there!

Seriously, you turned down a scholarship to CMU (USN&WR #23) and GT (USN&WR #36) to go to VT (USN&WR #71)? I call BS.
 
2012-05-21 07:08:20 PM

mangeybear: Yeah, 'cause nobody gets shot there!

Seriously, you turned down a scholarship to CMU (USN&WR #23) and GT (USN&WR #36) to go to VT (USN&WR #71)? I call BS.


All good engineering schools, but two in shiat holes of cities vs. being in scenic Blacksburg. Carnegie Melon got some bonus points for having the marching band in kilts, however.

No one got shot (on campus) when I was there; of course, the university didn't have a prohibition against carrying concealed when I was there either.
 
2012-05-21 11:36:22 PM
I went to USC, it was very dangerous. I lived off campus but I was fairly paranoid so I would never walk alone at night and with that and some luck I never got mugged but I would estimate that 75% of my friends/roommates did get mugged at some point, mostly non-violent. One roommate of mine was abducted at gunpoint and driven to an ATM for cash, another was traumatized by her mugging and decided to drop out of her program and leave school entirely. Some gang people beat the shiat out of another gang guy on the sidewalk outside our house one day. The house where we lived (2 blocks off campus) had MULTIPLE bullet holes in the door -- some that were created after we moved in. What I'm trying to say is it is not a safe area by any means.

BUT if these Chinese students had been going to USC for three years, they knew all this too. At that point in time I don't think whatever the university publishes in its marketing material makes any difference. The people at fault are the people who shot them.
 
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