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(USA Today)   House votes to end military sponsorships of NASCAR, professional fishing, and professional wrasslin'. It's still real to me, dammit   (usatoday.com) divider line 59
    More: Interesting, NASCAR, Betty McCollum, squashes, Jack Kingston, House committees, sponsorships, House Appropriations Committee  
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911 clicks; posted to Sports » on 17 May 2012 at 5:56 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-17 03:01:15 PM
The House Appropriations Committee passed a $608 billion defense bill

BUT WE HAVE NO MONEY TO LOWER STUDENT LOAN INTEREST RATES!
 
2012-05-17 03:10:15 PM
This is going to bite them in the ass. It's basically saying, we don't need any more volunteers.

The business model with NASCAR has, and most likely always will be, a 3 time return on your investment.
For the armed forces, this will mean significantly less recruits next year.

NO ONE stays in Nascar sponsorship if they aren't getting a measurable return.
 
2012-05-17 03:11:03 PM
Like the funding of NPR and PBS, why are people getting their panties up in a bunch over a small amount?
 
2012-05-17 03:13:42 PM

cman: Like the funding of NPR and PBS, why are people getting their panties up in a bunch over a small amount?


Biatching about pocket change distracts from the big budget items that need reform and fixing.

Consulting to DoD Finance for 6 years was at once the most enlightening and frightening experiences of my life.
 
2012-05-17 03:14:45 PM

cman: Like the funding of NPR and PBS, why are people getting their panties up in a bunch over a small amount?


Symbolism, I suppose.

With NPR, PBS, NASCAR and whatnot, you get to say you cut an entire government program! Even if it's fractions of pennies in the grand scheme of things.
 
2012-05-17 03:20:12 PM
It's also for show. Like what I call "feel good" legislation. Like the Do Not Call Registry. Easy to pass, does nothing, and is unenforceable. It gives the people the impression their representatives are doing something.

The airlines do it, too. Don't reform your business model. Just get rid of peanuts and those awful pillows and start charging the bag fee.
 
2012-05-17 03:22:28 PM
Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?
 
2012-05-17 03:23:50 PM
This is going to have a pretty big ripple effect in NASCAR. The National Guard sponsors Dale Jr... and the Army Ryan Newman.
 
2012-05-17 03:25:16 PM

Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?


I believe it originally was a response to the efforts to cut PBS/NPR funding last year
 
2012-05-17 03:26:46 PM

Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?


To be fair, I'm pretty sure military advertising is wasteful spending. Its the first time the GOP has actually done anything resembling cutting wasteful spending.
 
2012-05-17 03:29:21 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?

I believe it originally was a response to the efforts to cut PBS/NPR funding last year


Oh goodie. A cultural pissing match.

Feel the representation!
 
2012-05-17 03:30:10 PM

Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?


The only defense I've heard is that the military recruitment booths they have at the races have done fairly well, but I doubt those would go away with the end of military sponsorship?
 
2012-05-17 03:30:47 PM
I always thought it would be cool if the Army car was driven by some officer and most the crew were enlisted, maybe a couple warrant officers, and those were their military specialties. Blue sticker on the windshield so people in uniform have to stand up and salute every lap. Couple machine guns mounted on the roll cage.
 
2012-05-17 03:33:51 PM
Man, first his wife, now the troops?

i6.photobucket.com

Sad Cena is Sad.
 
2012-05-17 03:35:44 PM

Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?


I'm going to go with knee-jerk. Having been in the Army I can pretty much assure everyone that NASCAR, fishing & wrestling is probably the best example of targeted marketing in the history of Madison Avenue. I can't imagine that recruiting went anywhere but up once the programs started.
 
2012-05-17 03:41:17 PM
Just because the House passed it doesn't make it a done deal. As a NASCAR fan I'm kind of ambivelent about it. Good teams always manage to find sponsors. If this is a first step towards spending cuts in defense for things that don't actually defend I'm for it.
 
2012-05-17 03:47:18 PM

Recoil Therapy: Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?

I'm going to go with knee-jerk. Having been in the Army I can pretty much assure everyone that NASCAR, fishing & wrestling is probably the best example of targeted marketing in the history of Madison Avenue. I can't imagine that recruiting went anywhere but up once the programs started.


Yeah, but have you ever met anyone or heard of anyone who joined ONLY because they saw an ad on Jimmy Bob's car?
 
2012-05-17 03:48:58 PM
www.wwe.com

But I had "the first major public assembly after 9/11!" I'm an American hero, damn it!
 
2012-05-17 03:56:46 PM

GAT_00: Recoil Therapy: Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?

I'm going to go with knee-jerk. Having been in the Army I can pretty much assure everyone that NASCAR, fishing & wrestling is probably the best example of targeted marketing in the history of Madison Avenue. I can't imagine that recruiting went anywhere but up once the programs started.

Yeah, but have you ever met anyone or heard of anyone who joined ONLY because they saw an ad on Jimmy Bob's car?


Advertising does not work that way
 
2012-05-17 03:59:45 PM

cman: GAT_00: Recoil Therapy: Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?

I'm going to go with knee-jerk. Having been in the Army I can pretty much assure everyone that NASCAR, fishing & wrestling is probably the best example of targeted marketing in the history of Madison Avenue. I can't imagine that recruiting went anywhere but up once the programs started.

Yeah, but have you ever met anyone or heard of anyone who joined ONLY because they saw an ad on Jimmy Bob's car?

Advertising does not work that way on something of this magnitude. Joining the Army is a life altering decision, and these people understand that. It takes significant enforcement and repeated efforts to burn an idea like this in one's head



God damn that TAB+SPACE combo. FTFM
 
2012-05-17 04:02:17 PM

Old_Chief_Scott: As a NASCAR fan I'm kind of ambivelent about it. Good teams always manage to find sponsors.


Yeah, but the problem is its a trickle-down (or up?) situation.

Dale Jr. loses his National Guard sponsorship. He'll find a new sponsor in a minute. But most likely it'll be wrestling it from a mid-level team. Maybe Mikey Waltrip Racing loses NAPA to Dale Jr. Well, now Mikey has to wrestle sponsorship from a developing team most likely.

There are more active racers right now than there are sponsors. (Just look at the blank cars in every race... especially the Nationwide and Trucks.)

Those are supposed to be the stars of the future.
 
2012-05-17 04:06:04 PM

cman: cman: GAT_00: Recoil Therapy: Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?

I'm going to go with knee-jerk. Having been in the Army I can pretty much assure everyone that NASCAR, fishing & wrestling is probably the best example of targeted marketing in the history of Madison Avenue. I can't imagine that recruiting went anywhere but up once the programs started.

Yeah, but have you ever met anyone or heard of anyone who joined ONLY because they saw an ad on Jimmy Bob's car?

Advertising does not work that way on something of this magnitude. Joining the Army is a life altering decision, and these people understand that. It takes significant enforcement and repeated efforts to burn an idea like this in one's head


God damn that TAB+SPACE combo. FTFM


It kind of worked before too. But that's what I mean. Nobody joins the military because BE ALL YOU CAN BE was plastered on a car. So it's a waste of money.
 
2012-05-17 04:06:12 PM

cman: Yeah, but have you ever met anyone or heard of anyone who joined ONLY because they saw an ad on Jimmy Bob's car?

Advertising does not work that way


Thank you. Advertising is complex. Its about creating an image most of the time. Heck yeah people think the National Guard is "cooler" (for lack of a better term) because Dale Jr. sports their logo on his car.

Then you have to take action- recruiting. Yes, in the back of the mind of a recruit, this "cool" aspect plays *some* role. Not 100%, but indeed some.

Otherwise Mc Donalds wouldn't advertise. Everyone knows where to find one. Everyone knows what their food tastes like.

If advertising didn't work, it wouldn't have been around since the beginning of media, and still be a multi-billion dollar industry.

And I'm barely scraping the surface of the complexity of advertising, even just in NASCAR.
 
2012-05-17 04:10:03 PM
Anyone else read that as "professional fisting"?
 
2012-05-17 04:20:19 PM

Ed Finnerty: Anyone else read that as "professional fisting"?


They're safe... they'll always have the KY sponsorship.
 
2012-05-17 04:35:58 PM

Diogenes: It's also for show. Like what I call "feel good" legislation. Like the Do Not Call Registry. Easy to pass, does nothing, and is unenforceable. It gives the people the impression their representatives are doing something.

i>
The Do Not Call Registry works great and is enforced.

 
2012-05-17 04:38:10 PM

GAT_00: It kind of worked before too. But that's what I mean. Nobody joins the military because BE ALL YOU CAN BE was plastered on a car. So it's a waste of money.


1) Fan goes up to the 88 National Guard to check out Dale Jr's sponsor and Dale Jr. givaways.
2) Recruiter ends up getting fan's contact info. Hounds him mercifully (like all recruiters do).
3) Fan signs up


The point is: This fan would not simply walk into a recruiter's office normally. The recruiter got to give his "pitch" to a broader audience, where the recruiter already has something in common with the fan: NASCAR.


The numbers don't lie. This was brought up last year, and the year before that. The military vehemently supports Nascar, because they can measure the returns. Only reason it passed this time is because Betty One-Note got backing from Jack Kingston. We still don't know what she will support for him as a part of the deal.
 
2012-05-17 05:15:34 PM
I do not see the relevance of this. Just send Cena to all of the wars. He will sell the injuries for the while then get the STF locked in on the enemy at the last moment.
 
2012-05-17 05:18:38 PM

toddalmighty: Diogenes: It's also for show. Like what I call "feel good" legislation. Like the Do Not Call Registry. Easy to pass, does nothing, and is unenforceable. It gives the people the impression their representatives are doing something.

The Do Not Call Registry works great and is enforced.


Yep, this.
 
2012-05-17 05:28:56 PM

downstairs: toddalmighty: Diogenes: It's also for show. Like what I call "feel good" legislation. Like the Do Not Call Registry. Easy to pass, does nothing, and is unenforceable. It gives the people the impression their representatives are doing something.

The Do Not Call Registry works great and is enforced.

Yep, this.


Seriously, I'm glad if that's been the case for you guys. But it really has not been my experience. I think I'm in everyone's favorite farking demographic. And I have no idea what the hell that might be.
 
2012-05-17 05:30:22 PM

Diogenes: The Do Not Call Registry works great and is enforced.

Yep, this.

Seriously, I'm glad if that's been the case for you guys. But it really has not been my experience. I think I'm in everyone's favorite farking demographic. And I have no idea what the hell that might be.


I think you have to re-sign up every year.
 
2012-05-17 05:36:15 PM
With the current trends in technology, how much longer will the Do Not Call List exist?

We are moving far away from landlines into mobile phones, and they are powerful farking computers. I have an iPhone and I have a program called iBlacklist. I had to jailbreak it to get it, but what the hell.

It lets me ignore other callers (such as unknown or blocked numbers) and regular phone numbers. I can even set it to, lets say, always give the busy signal to 1-800-ACM-E420 and always accept then hang up to blocked/unknown numbers
 
2012-05-17 05:37:25 PM

downstairs: I think you have to re-sign up every year.


I don't want to threadjack (and the DNC ranks right up there with tipping in terms of derailing topics), but I do. I've had no choice but be vigilante with that. Esp. the cell phone. Which shouldn't be happening in the first place.
 
2012-05-17 05:52:04 PM

toddalmighty: Diogenes: It's also for show. Like what I call "feel good" legislation. Like the Do Not Call Registry. Easy to pass, does nothing, and is unenforceable. It gives the people the impression their representatives are doing something.

i>
The Do Not Call Registry works great and is enforced.


Enforced against who, exactly? Certainly not the identity thieves who call to tell me that I've won a free cruise twice a day.
 
2012-05-17 06:02:58 PM

Recoil Therapy: Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?

I'm going to go with knee-jerk. Having been in the Army I can pretty much assure everyone that NASCAR, fishing & wrestling is probably the best example of targeted marketing in the history of Madison Avenue. I can't imagine that recruiting went anywhere but up once the programs started.


Not to mention a goodly number of Marines that think they could tango with any gatekeeper/tomato can MMA fighter of comparable weight.

/Guess Dana will have to pump Harley and Energy Drink/Supplement du jour for more funds
//Or god help us, more Joe Rogan
 
2012-05-17 06:04:37 PM
Does the WWE still give free tickets to live shows for anyone with a military ID?
 
2012-05-17 06:23:07 PM

Bonkthat_Again: This is going to bite them in the ass. It's basically saying, we don't need any more volunteers.


good. we can go back to a draft and maybe people will think before starting random farking wars.
 
2012-05-17 06:31:46 PM
Fark advertising. Just send the troops back into Little Rock with fixed bayonets. You'll get plenty of recruits.

Rinse and repeat across the nation.

/Seriously, why not pay the advertising fees out in signing bonuses.
 
2012-05-17 06:44:31 PM
Talk about a thread that could be on all the tabs.

HOW COULD THE TROOPS GIVE UP ON CENA IN HIS TIME OF NEED
 
2012-05-17 07:59:54 PM
How is this not a hero tag? The government does not need to support pay for play entertainment.
 
2012-05-17 08:05:52 PM

Whatthefark: Does the WWE still give free tickets to live shows for anyone with a military ID?


Yes. They have for quite a few years + each year, around Christmas, they do a Tribute to the Troops show either on a base here in the U.S. or on a base in an active war zones. I went to WrestleMania last year in Atlanta, and while at the fan/superstar meet n greet (Axxess), I thanked every person I seen in uniform. The WWE supports them 100% and respect their requests as such with the next "Marine" movie WWE was looking to produce, they planned on Randy Orton to be the lead, and the U.S. Marine Corps requested not to because of his dishonorable discharge years ago. They honored those wishes.
 
2012-05-17 08:18:25 PM
People: Hell no you can't have a draft! No more compulsory service! Try to get people that want to serve!

Government: Well, that's going to make it tougher, but fine.

People: Whoa, what are you doing? You can't ADVERTISE to people! That's a waste of money.

Government: Hell yeah, we're wasting money!

*years pass*

Hey, how come no one's signing up for the military? Random cold calls and no presence anywhere doesn't work?

I love how everyone in this idiotic nutsack of a country has the long-term planning abilities of a squirrel.
 
2012-05-17 08:19:28 PM

IAmRight: People: Hell no you can't have a draft! No more compulsory service! Try to get people that want to serve!

Government: Well, that's going to make it tougher, but fine.

People: Whoa, what are you doing? You can't ADVERTISE to people! That's a waste of money.

Government: Hell yeah, we're wasting money!

*years pass*

Hey, how come no one's signing up for the military? Random cold calls and no presence anywhere doesn't work?

I love how everyone in this idiotic nutsack of a country has the long-term planning abilities of a squirrel.


I don't know... don't squirrels thoroughly plan for the future by storing nuts?
 
2012-05-17 08:27:31 PM

downstairs: Old_Chief_Scott: As a NASCAR fan I'm kind of ambivelent about it. Good teams always manage to find sponsors.

Yeah, but the problem is its a trickle-down (or up?) situation.

Dale Jr. loses his National Guard sponsorship. He'll find a new sponsor in a minute. But most likely it'll be wrestling it from a mid-level team. Maybe Mikey Waltrip Racing loses NAPA to Dale Jr. Well, now Mikey has to wrestle sponsorship from a developing team most likely.

There are more active racers right now than there are sponsors. (Just look at the blank cars in every race... especially the Nationwide and Trucks.)

Those are supposed to be the stars of the future.


That's a problem NASCAR allowed to happen. They saw how team budgets were exploding and the haves were creating multi-car teams. They didn't take the necessary steps to reign it in. The fact that start and park teams even exist is piss poor management by NASCAR.
 
2012-05-17 08:39:20 PM

FirstNationalBastard: I don't know... don't squirrels thoroughly plan for the future by storing nuts?


Squirrels' lifespans are such that they think a year is a significant amount of time. As do people currently.
 
2012-05-17 09:11:12 PM

A Fark Handle: good. we can go back to a draft and maybe people will think before starting random farking wars.


Excessive, or lack of personnel isn't a deciding factor for the war machine. They're just shifting from manned vehicles and troops to unmanned vehicles and smart weapons. Make no mistake, the companies who bought and paid for Congress will get their wars one way or another.
 
2012-05-17 09:30:55 PM

relaxitsjustme: downstairs: Old_Chief_Scott: As a NASCAR fan I'm kind of ambivelent about it. Good teams always manage to find sponsors.

Yeah, but the problem is its a trickle-down (or up?) situation.

Dale Jr. loses his National Guard sponsorship. He'll find a new sponsor in a minute. But most likely it'll be wrestling it from a mid-level team. Maybe Mikey Waltrip Racing loses NAPA to Dale Jr. Well, now Mikey has to wrestle sponsorship from a developing team most likely.

There are more active racers right now than there are sponsors. (Just look at the blank cars in every race... especially the Nationwide and Trucks.)

Those are supposed to be the stars of the future.

That's a problem NASCAR allowed to happen. They saw how team budgets were exploding and the haves were creating multi-car teams. They didn't take the necessary steps to reign it in. The fact that start and park teams even exist is piss poor management by NASCAR.


Oh look, it's 2008 again. Awesome.
 
2012-05-17 10:30:00 PM
Well of course the DoD is cutting advertising costs. How else do you expect to pay for rail guns and F-35s?
 
2012-05-17 11:55:47 PM
All branches aren't exactly hurting with recruiting. NASCAR and other advertising has always seemed frivolous to me.
 
2012-05-18 01:55:20 AM

Bonkthat_Again: This is going to bite them in the ass. It's basically saying, we don't need any more volunteers.

The business model with NASCAR has, and most likely always will be, a 3 time return on your investment.
For the armed forces, this will mean significantly less recruits next year.

NO ONE stays in Nascar sponsorship if they aren't getting a measurable return.


To me, it's saying, "hey, we don't need to spend this money on this, because it's not very cost-effective." And big-time (citation needed) for that 2nd paragraph. Your third remark perhaps best sums up McCollum's reason for supporting the bill: they don't feel they're getting a measurable return, even something as (allegedly) as profitable as NASCAR sponsorship.

Which sort of confuses me, because it seems like every year there's always a few drivers that have rides and teams but no major sponsors. Who wouldn't want to drop whatever it takes to buy in to that if you're guaranteed a 3x return on your investment?


Sgt Otter: Is there an actual study showing that NASCAR sponsorships aren't a cost-effective recruiting tool, or is this just a "it sounds frivolous, so it must be!" knee-jerk reaction?


Hmmm... good question... I feel like I've read something recently that discusses that, but I can't quite recall what it was.

Oh yeah: (McCollum) said that the Air National Guard paid $650,000 to sponsor (the NASCAR Sprint Cup race at Richmond International Raceway in September 2010).
"One night, one race ... 439 recruitment leads,'' McCollum told USA TODAY Sports. "Six of those - only six - qualified as potential recruits and then they got zero out of it.


Okay, so not so much a study, as it is an actual example. Point is, they can still send recruiters to man booths at these events, but they won't be spending hundreds of thousands and millions of dollars to plaster their logos all over as official sponsors when, to be perfectly honest, most people there are probably already fully aware of just how awesome the military is.
 
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