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(Hot Air)   "Why are 'progressives' opposed to outsourcing?" Well I can only speak for myself but all things being equal I just didn't think it was a funny show   (hotair.com) divider line 304
    More: Dumbass, Bruce Bartlett  
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1852 clicks; posted to Politics » on 17 May 2012 at 1:24 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-17 02:49:47 PM  

tenpoundsofcheese: intelligent comment below: tenpoundsofcheese: yeah. so?
can't have your cheap products and services without cheaper labor. (legal thing to do)
can't have you cheap arugula and lettuce without illegal immigrants. (illegal thing to do)

and yet the lefties whine about how important illegal immigrant labor is


You were just saying how everyone should be thankful for all those well paying jobs being created by call centers. I showed how those companies are fleeing because of the well paying wage and going to a new cheap labor haven, and all you can say is yeah. so?

what is the problem? Of course they go to a better labor market. Haven't you seen the positive transformation outsourcing has had for India?
FTFA. they also go their because the english spoken in the Philippines is better than that in India.


I will take your word for it.



Lefties point out that the job illegal immigrants do in America is a job that someone like yourself would never volunteer to do. And that's the truth.

you would volunteer to work in a call center for $5/hour? It is the same thing.


You referred to such labor markets as "better"? Better for whom? The workers? The society at large? Or only the businesses?

The reason most Americans would not take such a low-paying job is because we have a higher standard of living and Americans respect the importance of the laborer more than in other countries. Why do you want to decrease the American standard of living and eliminate the respect a worker deserves?
 
2012-05-17 02:51:03 PM  
seriously?

is the GOP going with a (openly) pro-outsourcing stance now?

this really speaks volumes about how effective their propaganda has become.
if the gop could get blue collar Americans to argue FOR outsourcing they can do just about anything. it's nuts.
 
2012-05-17 02:52:08 PM  

whidbey: No. The company basically farked 50 people's lives, their families' lives and whoever is affected personally or professionally by those losses.

Whether stuff is cheaper now is pretty irrelevant.


I don't know if you're intentionally trying to prove my point, just pulling my leg, or actually being serious.

If you are being serious though I have to ask, just out of curiosity, did you study any economics in college?
 
2012-05-17 02:52:50 PM  

whidbey: Biological Ali: whidbey: Well, I mean obviously if a company decided to outsource its entire call center from Seattle to the Philippines, and I and about 50 other people suddenly lost the jobs we depend on, the move would be a negative effect on employment in Seattle, and in the region.

We suddenly lost our jobs so some company could save money, and they pay the people in the new call center sh*t wages and no benefits.

The problem with how outsourcing is perceived is similar to the problem with how free trade in general is perceived - the losses are concentrated and highly visible, while the gains are diffuse and harder to see; this can cause the former to loom larger in the imagination even if they are practically outweighed by the latter. For instance, in the case of the hypothetical 50 outsourced jobs, do you take into account any additional investment the company was able to undertake due to their reduced costs, or the benefits to consumers themselves from having cheaper products available (including the stimulative effects of any additional purchases it would allow them to make)?

No. The company basically farked 50 people's lives, their families' lives and whoever is affected personally or professionally by those losses.

Whether stuff is cheaper now is pretty irrelevant.

It allows a company to make more money with little or no growth.

As for the area where they picked up and left, they don't care about that anymore.

What? I don't quite follow what you're trying to say there.

I'm saying that the company has no responsibility to the community once it has picked up stakes. They've left a hole just so they could make more money.

You can't be in favor of this. Just because of cheaper stuff? Come on. That doesn't sound very compassionate.


If you are looking for compassion, join a church.

How many investors are investing based on how compassionate a company is? Is that how Warren Buffet made all his money?
 
2012-05-17 02:53:10 PM  

unexplained bacon: seriously?

is the GOP going with a (openly) pro-outsourcing stance now?

this really speaks volumes about how effective their propaganda has become.
if the gop could get blue collar Americans to argue FOR outsourcing they can do just about anything. it's nuts.


Why hide it?

They honestly believe that jobs in this country are evolving to the point where we can keep shedding off the less desirable jobs to some poorfolk in India, and that we're all going to be working the hot new jobs--if we learn how to bootstrap it.
 
2012-05-17 02:53:12 PM  

whidbey: You can't be in favor of this. Just because of cheaper stuff? Come on. That doesn't sound very compassionate.


Compassionate conservative seem to be an oxymoron if you ask me.
 
2012-05-17 02:53:23 PM  

Biological Ali: For instance, in the case of the hypothetical 50 outsourced jobs, do you take into account any additional investment the company was able to undertake due to their reduced costs, or the benefits to consumers themselves from having cheaper products available (including the stimulative effects of any additional purchases it would allow them to make)?


If a company was able to sell shoes for $100, why would they drop the price? To be nice? The market has proven that price is fair. So if they cut the cost of production and keep the price the same, then profit is increased. In other words, outsourcing increases concentration of wealth.
 
2012-05-17 02:53:39 PM  

Saiga410: I just cannot back the hate for outsourcing. It is market forces, adapt or die.


Read a book. America didn't become a superpower by letting foreign competition pillage its economy.

Adam Smith would be aghast at the slavish devotion to "market forces" that's so common these days.
 
2012-05-17 02:54:42 PM  

gimmegimme: skullkrusher: Ed Grubermann: skullkrusher: Philip Francis Queeg: Shaggy_C: unexplained bacon: yeah, but the problem with that is these corps doing the outsourcing for the most part are paying next to nothing (like 31cents an hour) and driving their neo-slave labor to suicide.

That is just what the local labor market supports. It's simple supply and demand. Only a fool would think that the cost of living should not factor into the wages. For 31 cents an hour a man can live like a king in some areas of the world. Why do you think that a top-down approach where everyone earns the same should be the proper model? They tried that in the Soviet Union and see how that worked? I don't know about you comrade but I will take the free market equilibrium any day over the politician's grand schemes.

So why don't you emigrate and take one of those 31 cents an hour jobs where yo\u get to live like a king?

[iam141.org image 340x255]

[i140.photobucket.com image 640x426]

because in those places they're paid 4 cents an hour

You always have been, and will always be, a dishonest prick.

in places where you can live like a king on $.31 an hour people aren't generally paid $.31 an hour, they are paid far less. Otherwise, you'd have a country filled with ordinary workers living like kings. Does this country exist? Of course not.

Please, do not mistake your own abject stupidity for my alleged dishonesty, ok?

What living like a king on 31 cents an hour might look like:

[feathersproject.files.wordpress.com image 600x400]


The average person makes $680 a year in Burundi which is just slightly more than $.31/hr for 52 40 hr weeks. I don't think anyone is living like a king anywhere on $.31 an hour
 
2012-05-17 02:55:16 PM  

MyRandomName: Progressives only support the poor that can vote them more power, fark non citizen poor. How dare India and China raise.their standard of living, they can't vote for American progressives. foreign pour should stay that way.

To liberals it is all about an increase in their political power.


s3-ak.buzzfed.com

And neither is the exploited worker
cdn.styleforum.net
 
2012-05-17 02:56:02 PM  

whidbey: unexplained bacon: seriously?

is the GOP going with a (openly) pro-outsourcing stance now?

this really speaks volumes about how effective their propaganda has become.
if the gop could get blue collar Americans to argue FOR outsourcing they can do just about anything. it's nuts.

Why hide it?

They honestly believe that jobs in this country are evolving to the point where we can keep shedding off the less desirable jobs to some poorfolk in India, and that we're all going to be working the hot new jobs--if we learn how to bootstrap it.


Stop knocking the Republicans. They've made it very clear that those hot new jobs are easy to create. All an American has to do is 1) ask their millionaire parents to pull some strings or 2) create Facebook.
 
2012-05-17 02:56:47 PM  

CanonicalNerd: Biological Ali: For instance, in the case of the hypothetical 50 outsourced jobs, do you take into account any additional investment the company was able to undertake due to their reduced costs, or the benefits to consumers themselves from having cheaper products available (including the stimulative effects of any additional purchases it would allow them to make)?

If a company was able to sell shoes for $100, why would they drop the price? To be nice? The market has proven that price is fair. So if they cut the cost of production and keep the price the same, then profit is increased. In other words, outsourcing increases concentration of wealth.


THIS


Price is determined by how much the public is willing to pay, if the cost of making that product goes down the price does not go down, the profit goes up.
 
2012-05-17 02:56:49 PM  

whidbey: Petey4335: whidbey: WhoIsNotInMyKitchen: Outsourcing = fine
Offshoring = big problem.

There's a difference?

Yes, it is called "consulting." It feeds my family.

It wouldn't if they decided your rates were too high.


Then our price was too high and we'd need to adjust? I don't see the problem.
 
2012-05-17 02:57:18 PM  
if a corp outsourcing it's labor to the cheapest most easily exploited work force isn't helping Americans, and it isn't help the exploited workers...who is it helping?

just the corp and it's investors. right?

so the choice here is, what is more important to america? Corporate/investor profits or american jobs, american families, human rights, and human decency?

I know where the GOP stands, and it's not the least bit surprising.
it's a pretty simple choice really.

/end free trade, we need fair trade.
 
2012-05-17 02:57:26 PM  

Biological Ali: whidbey: No. The company basically farked 50 people's lives, their families' lives and whoever is affected personally or professionally by those losses.

Whether stuff is cheaper now is pretty irrelevant.

I don't know if you're intentionally trying to prove my point, just pulling my leg, or actually being serious.

If you are being serious though I have to ask, just out of curiosity, did you study any economics in college?


What does that have to do with wanting to protect my job and my community's well-being?

I just made the argument that 50 people lost their jobs. It's a big deal. Your argument seems to be leaning toward the "needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" contention and that it's not a big deal if the company invests and stuff gets cheaper.

I'm lost here. How am I proving your point?
 
2012-05-17 02:59:28 PM  

Petey4335: whidbey: Petey4335: whidbey: WhoIsNotInMyKitchen: Outsourcing = fine
Offshoring = big problem.

There's a difference?

Yes, it is called "consulting." It feeds my family.

It wouldn't if they decided your rates were too high.

Then our price was too high and we'd need to adjust? I don't see the problem.


You would if they wanted half of what you charge now. Or a flat rate of say, 15 dollars an hour.

I don't think you're getting the point.
 
2012-05-17 03:00:03 PM  

Petey4335: whidbey: Petey4335: whidbey: WhoIsNotInMyKitchen: Outsourcing = fine
Offshoring = big problem.

There's a difference?

Yes, it is called "consulting." It feeds my family.

It wouldn't if they decided your rates were too high.

Then our price was too high and we'd need to adjust? I don't see the problem.


You could support your family on 10% of your current salary? Lucky.
 
2012-05-17 03:00:28 PM  

whidbey: unexplained bacon: seriously?

is the GOP going with a (openly) pro-outsourcing stance now?

this really speaks volumes about how effective their propaganda has become.
if the gop could get blue collar Americans to argue FOR outsourcing they can do just about anything. it's nuts.

Why hide it?

They honestly believe that jobs in this country are evolving to the point where we can keep shedding off the less desirable jobs to some poorfolk in India, and that we're all going to be working the hot new jobs--if we learn how to bootstrap it.


well, that's what the useful idiots who gulp down the gop talking points on this subject might believe. I'm sure the people pushing for more outsourcing (along with tearing down regulations in the US) know very well they're not helping America in any way...of course why would they care, profits are the only motive to do anything.
 
2012-05-17 03:01:10 PM  

CanonicalNerd: If a company was able to sell shoes for $100, why would they drop the price? To be nice? The market has proven that price is fair. So if they cut the cost of production and keep the price the same, then profit is increased. In other words, outsourcing increases concentration of wealth.


Because they're not the only company in the world? They drop their price to capture market share,or maintain market share in response to competitors who have dropped their prices.
 
2012-05-17 03:01:18 PM  
(Outsourcing also had the secondary benefit of offering gainful employment to residents of third-world countries, in essence "teaching them to fish," rather than "giving them a fish," as liberals are so fond of doing.)

...Wow. White Man's Burden argument only a few paragraphs in.
 
2012-05-17 03:01:36 PM  

make me some tea: Days gone by, I remember conservatives lamenting that everything is made in Japan Taiwan Mexico China, and no longer in the good ol' U S of A. Whatever happened to that?


The checks started to clear
 
2012-05-17 03:02:12 PM  

Brostorm: CanonicalNerd: Biological Ali: For instance, in the case of the hypothetical 50 outsourced jobs, do you take into account any additional investment the company was able to undertake due to their reduced costs, or the benefits to consumers themselves from having cheaper products available (including the stimulative effects of any additional purchases it would allow them to make)?

If a company was able to sell shoes for $100, why would they drop the price? To be nice? The market has proven that price is fair. So if they cut the cost of production and keep the price the same, then profit is increased. In other words, outsourcing increases concentration of wealth.

THIS


Price is determined by how much the public is willing to pay, if the cost of making that product goes down the price does not go down, the profit goes up.


Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.
 
2012-05-17 03:03:19 PM  

gimmegimme: Why do you want to decrease the American standard of living and eliminate the respect a worker deserves?


Because jorb creators! Soshalizm.

/duh
 
2012-05-17 03:03:57 PM  

Saiga410: Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.


It's actually more likely you would go on an advertising blitz and steal their customers. Admit it.
 
2012-05-17 03:06:34 PM  

PsiChick: (Outsourcing also had the secondary benefit of offering gainful employment to residents of third-world countries, in essence "teaching them to fish," rather than "giving them a fish," as liberals are so fond of doing.)

...Wow. White Man's Burden argument only a few paragraphs in.


More like "teaching them" that shiatty wages are a fact of life. hey it's better money than the nickels an hour you were making before.

I can't even read that shiat.
 
2012-05-17 03:06:56 PM  

unexplained bacon: I'd pay 30% more for the next iPhone if I could buy one that was made by free people who weren't working in the conditions they're in now. Bet I'm not alone.


Difficulty: Telling that they are lying when you pay 30% more for that, but the product is actually secretly made under the same sweatshop conditions.
 
2012-05-17 03:07:09 PM  

Saiga410: Brostorm: CanonicalNerd: Biological Ali: For instance, in the case of the hypothetical 50 outsourced jobs, do you take into account any additional investment the company was able to undertake due to their reduced costs, or the benefits to consumers themselves from having cheaper products available (including the stimulative effects of any additional purchases it would allow them to make)?

If a company was able to sell shoes for $100, why would they drop the price? To be nice? The market has proven that price is fair. So if they cut the cost of production and keep the price the same, then profit is increased. In other words, outsourcing increases concentration of wealth.

THIS


Price is determined by how much the public is willing to pay, if the cost of making that product goes down the price does not go down, the profit goes up.

Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.


collusion? Have you ever wondered why video game prices within a console generation stay the same no matter who publishes it? The idealism of some farkers is amusing. The race to the bottom does not happen with products as much because that is BAD for business overall, but it seems to be the soup de jour with labor.
 
2012-05-17 03:07:20 PM  

PsiChick: (Outsourcing also had the secondary benefit of offering gainful employment to residents of third-world countries, in essence "teaching them to fish," rather than "giving them a fish," as liberals are so fond of doing.)

...Wow. White Man's Burden argument only a few paragraphs in.


it'd be great to set the text of this argument next to pictures of the lucky recipients or our benevolence "learning to fish". They're a bump up from slaves and the conditions they endure should be criminal.
 
2012-05-17 03:08:43 PM  
Biological Ali: They drop their price to capture market share,or maintain market share in response to competitors who have dropped their prices.

That's a reasonable theory, but hasn't been seen in practice. Instead, the concentration of wealth has been observed.
 
2012-05-17 03:08:50 PM  

tenpoundsofcheese: If you are looking for compassion, join a church.

How many investors are investing based on how compassionate a company is? Is that how Warren Buffet made all his money


Your defense of offshoring in pursuit of profits is amusing considering how you like to rail on Obama about the unemployment rate.
 
2012-05-17 03:08:53 PM  

Vlad_the_Inaner: unexplained bacon: I'd pay 30% more for the next iPhone if I could buy one that was made by free people who weren't working in the conditions they're in now. Bet I'm not alone.

Difficulty: Telling that they are lying when you pay 30% more for that, but the product is actually secretly made under the same sweatshop conditions.


sad but true, our corporate leaders have certainly earned that level of trust.
 
2012-05-17 03:11:07 PM  

Saiga410: Brostorm: CanonicalNerd: Biological Ali: For instance, in the case of the hypothetical 50 outsourced jobs, do you take into account any additional investment the company was able to undertake due to their reduced costs, or the benefits to consumers themselves from having cheaper products available (including the stimulative effects of any additional purchases it would allow them to make)?

If a company was able to sell shoes for $100, why would they drop the price? To be nice? The market has proven that price is fair. So if they cut the cost of production and keep the price the same, then profit is increased. In other words, outsourcing increases concentration of wealth.

THIS


Price is determined by how much the public is willing to pay, if the cost of making that product goes down the price does not go down, the profit goes up.

Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.


What happened in the airline industry a few years ago when a tax was allowed to lapse? Was that savings passed onto the customer? Nope
 
2012-05-17 03:11:26 PM  

theknuckler_33: tenpoundsofcheese: If you are looking for compassion, join a church.

How many investors are investing based on how compassionate a company is? Is that how Warren Buffet made all his money

Your defense of offshoring in pursuit of profits is amusing considering how you like to rail on Obama about the unemployment rate.


every time that guy breaks out his wisdom on fark is amusing considering he's the same farker who thinks replacing the O in Obama with a zero is, well I don't know what he thinks that is, but I wouldn't waste my time with him.
 
2012-05-17 03:12:49 PM  

Philip Francis Queeg: What happened in the airline industry a few years ago when a tax was allowed to lapse? Was that savings passed onto the customer? Nope


Yeah but people need to fly. They'll pay it.

*posted with a straight face*
 
2012-05-17 03:15:01 PM  

whidbey: Saiga410: Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.

It's actually more likely you would go on an advertising blitz and steal their customers. Admit it.


Probably both. Being the lowest cost provider while placing high in the industy in quality would be a good bragging point.

Though my current experience is in a high margin, high complexity, high quality low volumn world. And that is where I would personaly rather be competing in.
 
2012-05-17 03:16:50 PM  

Saiga410: whidbey: Saiga410: Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.

It's actually more likely you would go on an advertising blitz and steal their customers. Admit it.

Probably both. Being the lowest cost provider while placing high in the industy in quality would be a good bragging point.



You'd "brag" about firing 500 workers to come up with a cheaper price?
 
2012-05-17 03:21:47 PM  

unexplained bacon: PsiChick: (Outsourcing also had the secondary benefit of offering gainful employment to residents of third-world countries, in essence "teaching them to fish," rather than "giving them a fish," as liberals are so fond of doing.)

...Wow. White Man's Burden argument only a few paragraphs in.

it'd be great to set the text of this argument next to pictures of the lucky recipients or our benevolence "learning to fish". They're a bump up from slaves and the conditions they endure should be criminal.


Actually, I think it's a form of slavery called economic enslavement. It's illegal, but the UN can't enforce it against a key member.

/I think
//We might just be tricking them by putting it at the bare minimum to miss the requirements
 
2012-05-17 03:22:32 PM  

whidbey: Saiga410: whidbey: Saiga410: Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.

It's actually more likely you would go on an advertising blitz and steal their customers. Admit it.

Probably both. Being the lowest cost provider while placing high in the industy in quality would be a good bragging point.



You'd "brag" about firing 500 workers to come up with a cheaper price?


Why yes. Imagine the comercial, a slide show of each and every one of the laid off workers standing infront of their house with their families, a forclosed sign sitting right next to them. Brings a warmth to your heart don't it. Or I can just say "Now X% off. Bestest in quality. New new new....." While showing my product in .5 second quick takes... ohhh maybe we can afford some micheal bay sized explosions in the background.
 
2012-05-17 03:23:03 PM  

whidbey: Saiga410: whidbey: Saiga410: Only if there is no competition in the market. If I was in the market and my competetors kept their prices the same I would drop my price so that I gain market share.

It's actually more likely you would go on an advertising blitz and steal their customers. Admit it.

Probably both. Being the lowest cost provider while placing high in the industy in quality would be a good bragging point.



You'd "brag" about firing 500 workers to come up with a cheaper price?


A good businessman extracts as much money from the customer at the lowest cost. The same thing goes for employees; the businessman must extract as much labor as possible from the smallest number of the cheapest workers possible.
 
2012-05-17 03:23:12 PM  

PsiChick: (Outsourcing also had the secondary benefit of offering gainful employment to residents of third-world countries, in essence "teaching them to fish," rather than "giving them a fish," as liberals are so fond of doing.)

...Wow. White Man's Burden argument only a few paragraphs in.


Beating the slaves taught the savages to become more civil.
 
2012-05-17 03:24:00 PM  

Saiga410: ohhh maybe we can afford some micheal bay sized explosions in the background.


Shouldn't cost more than a couple extra jobs. No one'll notice.
 
2012-05-17 03:24:06 PM  

Wendy's Chili: tenpoundsofcheese: KJUW89: Aar1012: Why are 'conservatives' in favor of putting Americans out of work?

Exactly. I'd rather have a thousands more Americans working than put a thousand more dollars in the CEO's hands.

so are you against all of those illegal immigrants who are working here? Or are you just against people from china, india, and other countries that provide a lot of outsourced services?

Both. Economic activity within the US should be subject to American laws. Immigrants should be working on the books, and goods produced overseas should not come from sources that undermine our labor and environmental standards.

BTW, where are you and MyRandomName getting the idea that the US government is obligated to altruistically hand out favors to people it does not govern?


That's not what they're getting at. They're pointing out that the government is obligated to hand out favors for the people who paid for their campaigns, and pretending that they care about the people in 3rd world countries.

So what if they're dying from mercury and arsenic poisoning of the products and factories they work in? Their lives are better because some rich capitalist pays them pennies per day!
 
2012-05-17 03:24:31 PM  
I for one thought it was a funny show, at least in the first couple episodes. It got a lot less funny as it went along though, until I was glad it was mercy-killed.
 
2012-05-17 03:24:58 PM  

CanonicalNerd: Biological Ali: They drop their price to capture market share,or maintain market share in response to competitors who have dropped their prices.

That's a reasonable theory, but hasn't been seen in practice. Instead, the concentration of wealth has been observed.


Hasn't been seen based on what?
 
2012-05-17 03:27:02 PM  

PsiChick: unexplained bacon: PsiChick: (Outsourcing also had the secondary benefit of offering gainful employment to residents of third-world countries, in essence "teaching them to fish," rather than "giving them a fish," as liberals are so fond of doing.)

...Wow. White Man's Burden argument only a few paragraphs in.

it'd be great to set the text of this argument next to pictures of the lucky recipients or our benevolence "learning to fish". They're a bump up from slaves and the conditions they endure should be criminal.

Actually, I think it's a form of slavery called economic enslavement. It's illegal, but the UN can't enforce it against a key member.

/I think
//We might just be tricking them by putting it at the bare minimum to miss the requirements


even if it's not illegal it's clearly immoral.

...and we're all part of it. I'm certain every one of us is posting with a device that has at least some parts made in these hell holes.

I don't think you could buy a computer that wasn't. it's pretty shameful.
 
2012-05-17 03:27:57 PM  

unexplained bacon: every time that guy breaks out his wisdom on fark is amusing considering he's the same farker who thinks replacing the O in Obama with a zero is, well I don't know what he thinks that is, but I wouldn't waste my time with him.


Well, it is a tad more subtle than FARTAXHUSSEINBONGO!!!
 
2012-05-17 03:28:25 PM  

Biological Ali: CanonicalNerd: Biological Ali: They drop their price to capture market share,or maintain market share in response to competitors who have dropped their prices.

That's a reasonable theory, but hasn't been seen in practice. Instead, the concentration of wealth has been observed.

Hasn't been seen based on what?


Reality. Prices go up as a whole, not down.
 
2012-05-17 03:31:27 PM  

theknuckler_33: unexplained bacon: every time that guy breaks out his wisdom on fark is amusing considering he's the same farker who thinks replacing the O in Obama with a zero is, well I don't know what he thinks that is, but I wouldn't waste my time with him.

Well, it is a tad more subtle than FARTAXHUSSEINBONGO!!!


well sure, but it's the same sentiment.
I just can't respect an opinion coming from someone who thinks that's clever.
it says a lot about that person
 
2012-05-17 03:31:56 PM  

whidbey: WhoIsNotInMyKitchen: Outsourcing = fine
Offshoring = big problem.

There's a difference?


Absolutely. Its the concept of the "value chain" they teach in business school. If my organization's key strength is in (for example) manufacturing bathtubs, it doesn't mean i'm going to use my staff to personally deliver the tubs... I'm going to outsource that to FedEx or some other delivery company.

The difference between good outsourcing, is that ideally it still means that those activities that add value are done by people getting paid in your local economy so that everyone benefits from the development of the product.

Bad outsourcing is when I set it up so I made 5x the profit by having as much of the work done in countries with no labor laws or environmental rules. In those cases, I'm perpetuating slavery, destroying the environment, and ensuring as few jobs in my local economy as possible, just so I can maximize my personal return.

... but don't worry, I'll make sure my wealth "trickles down" to you too... I need someone to mop my yacht and pick up after my kids while I'm vacationing in Cannes.
 
2012-05-17 03:35:15 PM  

wildcardjack: I can make a pseudo-progressive argument in favor of outsourcing.

America has been at the top for a long time. In order to get the poorer countries up a notch we must employ them at the cost of our own. Yes, the poor here will remain poor, and the rich will remain rich, but the important thing is that the poor will get closer to the poor of other countries and become competitive with them once again.

/If you can say that with a straight face you might be GOP VP material.


The sad thing is, I have heard people seriously say something similar.

Where do you think the claim by the Heritage Foundation that the poor in the U.S. are doing pretty well because 96% of them own refrigerators came from?
 
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