If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(McClatchy DC)   Quietly, the Republican Party embraces gays, adjusts stance   (mcclatchydc.com) divider line 271
    More: Obvious, Richard Grenell, Massachusetts Senate, romney, National Republican Congressional Committee, University of Kansas, gay democrat, Richard Tisei, Republican Rep. Jim Kolbe  
•       •       •

5835 clicks; posted to Politics » on 15 May 2012 at 7:36 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



271 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | » | Last | Show all
 
2012-05-16 02:51:32 AM

quatchi: [i293.photobucket.com image 640x555]


i293.photobucket.com

That's an interesting graph. Basically, as soon as Obama became president, support for gay marriage has increased more than its ever increased before, and continues to this day.

That generational shift has kicked into overdrive. The remaining GOP dinosaurs- Archie Bunker-style bigots fixed forever in their ways- are dropping like flys, and we, Gen X and Y, are taking over the reigns of power before their very eyes.
 
2012-05-16 03:28:03 AM
Actions, not words
 
2012-05-16 03:34:12 AM
I'll believe this when they nominate a guy whose Presidential platform doesn't have about 10 planks of anti-gay discrimination. And when they don't push constitutional amendments like North Carolina's Amendment 1 at the state level, or push bans on things like gay adoption. Policy matters, and the Republican Party is perfectly happy to endorse or go along with anti-gay policy because they consider it politically advantageous. It doesn't matter if they socialize with gays or think they're nice. If they had a pro-gay stance it would start showing up as controversy within their ranks about their anti-gay policies. And that hasn't happened.

The Republican Party is not moderating at the base level: it's becoming more extreme on cultural issues. This is a year where any incumbent who has not had a 100% Tea Party approved stance is facing primary challengers, regardless of seniority or the benefit of them running as an incumbent. Even Orrin Hatch is fighting a primary for the first time since the 70s. Why, I'm not sure. My speculation is that he's had a target on his back ever since he refused to get hysterical about the Several Blocks Away From Ground Zero Mosque. Culture wars.

The issue with the Republican Party is not that there aren't urban, educated Republicans who are comfortable with the gays, particularly younger people, or businesspeople because the business world loves rich gays, or non-evangelical women. It's that the Republican Party is demographically and regionally skewed in a way that makes it an anti-gay party. It's financially and electorally dependent on people who think that it's necessary and appropriate to legislate discrimination against gays. Geography and demography will continue to be destiny for the GOP until the Southern Baptist Convention starts working on their Pride parade floats.
 
2012-05-16 03:48:55 AM

bobbette: Geography and demography will continue to be destiny for the GOP until the Southern Baptist Convention starts working on their Pride parade floats.


Considering that the Southern Baptist Convention didn't officially repudiate and apologize their pro-slavery stance from the Civil War until 2009, I give it until about 2170 until the Southern Baptists start breaking out the rainbow bunting.
 
2012-05-16 05:16:30 AM

Bigdogdaddy: Funny, the two republicans that I personally know from North Carolina that are OK with same sex marriage didn't even go out to vote but one of them is sure vocal that she thinks it's an OK thing.

I also know a woman that told me privately that she was not for same sex marriage yet when she gets with a group that is, she is vocal for it....and she is married and has children with a black man.

Hypocrites come in both parties.


This is what makes this such a risky move for Obama.

This is an issue that polls higher than it gets votes out for.

And the "comfortable margin" someone was asserting up thread is actually about 47% Pro-43% Anti.

It's really a coin toss.
 
2012-05-16 05:20:34 AM

Goodfella: That's an interesting graph. Basically, as soon as Obama became president, support for gay marriage has increased more than its ever increased before, and continues to this day.

That generational shift has kicked into overdrive. The remaining GOP dinosaurs- Archie Bunker-style bigots fixed forever in their ways- are dropping like flys, and we, Gen X and Y, are taking over the reigns of power before their very eyes.


Yuppo, moral evolution in action, visible to the naked eye.

It's a beautiful thing.

People who are finding this election season boring aren't really paying attention.
 
2012-05-16 06:45:18 AM

quatchi: And the "comfortable margin" someone was asserting up thread is actually about 47% Pro-43% Anti


I said it enjoys a comfortable margin of support among independents at 57% pro.
 
2012-05-16 06:49:18 AM
Sure, they do... as long as they accept their status as second class citizens.
 
2012-05-16 07:28:24 AM
And just like I said of Obama: way too little, way too late.

Stupid politicians. They stick their finger in the air to see which way the wind is blowing, say "let's go that way!", then pat themselves on their backs for their 'leadership'.
 
2012-05-16 07:37:07 AM

Lernaeus: And just like I said of Obama: way too little, way too late.


What was way too little way too late "of Obama?" Or do you just like the rhythm of the phrase?
 
2012-05-16 08:03:34 AM

keylock71: Sure, they do... as long as they accept their status as second class citizens.


Same way they did with women voters...
 
2012-05-16 08:17:44 AM

bdub77: I can't remember, what party sponsored the most recent anti gay marriage bill in NC?


I can't remember, what party sponsored the most recent anti gay marriage bill in NC?

I can't remember, what party sponsored the most recent anti gay marriage bill in NC?
 
2012-05-16 08:40:24 AM

The Why Not Guy: quatchi: And the "comfortable margin" someone was asserting up thread is actually about 47% Pro-43% Anti

I said it enjoys a comfortable margin of support among independents at 57% pro.


Ah, sorry missed that part. Just trying to counter the new narrative by some people that this was just Obama cynically shifting with the political winds with a no-brainer vote-getter here by pointing out the fact that national levels of support for gay marriage while in the plus column have only gotten there recently and traditionally this issue has done a lot better in the polls than the voting booth.

Lernaeus: And just like I said of Obama: way too little, way too late.

Stupid politicians. They stick their finger in the air to see which way the wind is blowing, say "let's go that way!", then pat themselves on their backs for their 'leadership'.


People like this, mostly.
 
2012-05-16 09:25:58 AM

Muta: With helpful pic of what a gay republican might look like.

[media.mcclatchydc.com image 495x275]


I think they just mean gay in the "happy" sense.
 
2012-05-16 09:27:52 AM

quatchi: [i293.photobucket.com image 640x555]


very phallic chart
 
2012-05-16 09:37:14 AM

hubiestubert: Ed Finnerty: Let's face it. The GOP has only been against gay marriage because it will take the thrill out of their homosexual affairs.

To be fair, you ARE supposed to keep the worlds apart...


Yeah. Never EVER cross the streams.
 
2012-05-16 09:52:10 AM

intelligent comment below: DrVoice: I don't see how any gay person can call themselves a Republican these days. Like guns? Love moving to the left on the Laffer Curve? Think that tax cuts and trickle-down economics are the path to salvation? Awesome. None of that outweighs identifying yourself as a member of a political party that considers you a second-class citizen and uses who you are to frighten people into voting a certain way.

You don't have to vote Democratic, but for god's sake, have some self-respect and find a third party that considers you a human.

/Also looking at you, Hispanics.


I knew a gay Republican. He was just filled with self hate. He hated anyone and everyone, had absolutely no self confidence. But he fit right in because Republicans are all about hate. Hate minorities, hate women, it gave him an outlet for hate hate hate. He just conveniently ignored the hate gay part because usually it isn't top of the list.


Stereotypes are fun!

Sounds like you are all about hating Republicans.
 
2012-05-16 09:55:41 AM

bdub77: Headso: author dude, the guy republicans have running for president doesn't even support civil unions.

For the moment.


As someone from MN we would say "wait five minutes".

That's a weather joke for those who have more interesting things going on in their home state.
 
2012-05-16 09:57:32 AM

Wait... they may finally be getting a clue?

You've already lost. The current generation doesn't care.

a.imageshack.us
carryabigsticker.com


Goodfella: That generational shift has kicked into overdrive. The remaining GOP dinosaurs- Archie Bunker-style bigots fixed forever in their ways- are dropping like flys, and we, Gen X and Y, are taking over the reigns of power before their very eyes.


Actually, it's only about half due to the generational shift. The trend is about equally due to the 10% difference in acceptance per decade of birth cohort and 1% per year shift within cohorts.
 
2012-05-16 10:10:20 AM
What a gay republican Jason Segel looks like.

media.mcclatchydc.com
 
2012-05-16 10:27:10 AM

Aarontology: I'll believe it when they tell the religious right to STFU & GTFO


This. I might even re-join the party.
 
2012-05-16 10:45:52 AM
Republicans say they're for all the hot-button things the majority want, in an election year?

i301.photobucket.com

Sorry. What I meant to say is...

i301.photobucket.com

We're talking about the same party that, in 1995, said they'd have a balanced budget in 2002 while still giving tax cuts to the mega-wealthy. The only people that still believe them are the kinds of people that still take back a cheating partner that still keeps lying to them. It's the only explanation: they have no spine or self esteem.

Kick them to the f***ing kerb, already.
 
2012-05-16 11:09:31 AM

Jjaro: Stereotypes are fun!

Sounds like you are all about hating Republicans.



Stereotypes? I gave an example of some people I have come across in my travels. I never said ALL Republicans were like this, just that this type of person does exist. Way to play the strawman to get out of having to think about what was said.

And yes, who doesn't hate a group of people so backwards in their social views?
 
2012-05-16 11:32:56 AM

Jjaro: Sounds like you are all about hating Republicans.


Perhaps if they spent less time and money trying to deny me the same rights enjoyed by other hard-working law-abiding tax-paying American citizens, I'd have a better opinion of them.
 
2012-05-16 11:35:15 AM
Well that lasted all of four headlines.
 
2012-05-16 11:40:13 AM

intelligent comment below: Jjaro: Stereotypes are fun!

Sounds like you are all about hating Republicans.


Stereotypes? I gave an example of some people I have come across in my travels. I never said ALL Republicans were like this, just that this type of person does exist. Way to play the strawman to get out of having to think about what was said.

And yes, who doesn't hate a group of people so backwards in their social views?


"Republicans are all about hate. Hate minorities, hate women, it gave him an outlet for hate hate hate."

How is that not stereotyping? I am a Republican, and believe it or not, I'm not about hate. I'm about rewarding financial success. You claim that "Republicans are all about hate" with such intense hatred it makes you look like quite the hypocrite.
 
2012-05-16 11:49:40 AM

Jjaro: intelligent comment below: Jjaro: Stereotypes are fun!

Sounds like you are all about hating Republicans.


Stereotypes? I gave an example of some people I have come across in my travels. I never said ALL Republicans were like this, just that this type of person does exist. Way to play the strawman to get out of having to think about what was said.

And yes, who doesn't hate a group of people so backwards in their social views?

"Republicans are all about hate. Hate minorities, hate women, it gave him an outlet for hate hate hate."

How is that not stereotyping? I am a Republican, and believe it or not, I'm not about hate. I'm about rewarding financial success. You claim that "Republicans are all about hate" with such intense hatred it makes you look like quite the hypocrite.


I'm sorry you're suffering from that affliction. My religion teaches to love the sinner and hate the sin, and practicing republicanism is a sin. I've heard you can pray it away.
 
2012-05-16 12:03:25 PM

Jjaro: I am a Republican, and believe it or not, I'm not about hate. I'm about rewarding financial success. You claim that "Republicans are all about hate" with such intense hatred it makes you look like quite the hypocrite.


Ok, I'll play your game. Name a piece of legislation proposed by a Republican over the past, say 10 years that rewards gays for financial success rather than restricts their rights. It can be at the federal or state level.
 
2012-05-16 12:10:08 PM

Jjaro: How is that not stereotyping? I am a Republican, and believe it or not, I'm not about hate. I'm about rewarding financial success. You claim that "Republicans are all about hate" with such intense hatred it makes you look like quite the hypocrite.



The topic was an openly gay Republican.

If you want to change the subject, fine.

Yes Republicans are all about hate, that is your party platform. Have you never actually reviewed it? They hate immigrants, minorities, gays, women, liberals, intellectuals, ivy leaguers, etc. Might want to listen in to what your party leaders and pr spinners have been saying since 1980. The entire party is nothing but hate.

You're not about rewarding financial success, your party is about restricting financial success to only a small group of white men who don't feel the need to actually pay for the government they use so often.
 
2012-05-16 12:17:00 PM

Mike Chewbacca: Quietly, the Republican Party embraces gays, adjusts stance

No, they don't. This just happened, less than 24 hours ago.


You beat me to it.
 
2012-05-16 12:20:03 PM
Yes, I'd love to hear Jjaro explain how Virginia voting to approve 32 straight judges and reject 1 gay judge is "rewarding financial success" rather than "hating gay people."
 
2012-05-16 12:47:40 PM

The Why Not Guy: Jjaro: I am a Republican, and believe it or not, I'm not about hate. I'm about rewarding financial success. You claim that "Republicans are all about hate" with such intense hatred it makes you look like quite the hypocrite.

Ok, I'll play your game. Name a piece of legislation proposed by a Republican over the past, say 10 years that rewards gays for financial success rather than restricts their rights. It can be at the federal or state level.


Are you asking for a piece of financial legislation that specifically rewards gays for financial success? Because that would be discrimination as well. I personally believe that people should be rewarded for their financial success the same amount whether they are gay or straight. I can't recall any legislation that says something along the lines of "small business should get Tax Break A, unless that small business is owned by someone who is gay."

intelligent comment below: Jjaro: How is that not stereotyping? I am a Republican, and believe it or not, I'm not about hate. I'm about rewarding financial success. You claim that "Republicans are all about hate" with such intense hatred it makes you look like quite the hypocrite.


The topic was an openly gay Republican.

If you want to change the subject, fine.

Yes Republicans are all about hate, that is your party platform. Have you never actually reviewed it? They hate immigrants, minorities, gays, women, liberals, intellectuals, ivy leaguers, etc. Might want to listen in to what your party leaders and pr spinners have been saying since 1980. The entire party is nothing but hate.

You're not about rewarding financial success, your party is about restricting financial success to only a small group of white men who don't feel the need to actually pay for the government they use so often.


You changed the subject. Remember this part of your post "Hate minorities, hate women, it gave him an outlet for hate hate hate?" And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform. Just because certain Republicans do hate, doesn't mean all of us do. And trust me, I would prefer they all go create their own party more than most people. But I'm sure you would not want to be associated with the beliefs/hatred spewed by a Keith Olbermann or a Jeremiah Wright or a Eric Holder either.

And no, my party is about restricting handouts that encourage people to stay at home and keep on collecting rather than finding a job and helping the economy, and letting people who have earned their money keep a reasonable amount of it.


The Why Not Guy: Yes, I'd love to hear Jjaro explain how Virginia voting to approve 32 straight judges and reject 1 gay judge is "rewarding financial success" rather than "hating gay people."


I wasn't aware I personally did that. As I mentioned, I said not all Republicans hate hate hate, I personally am a Republican because they value rewarding financial success more so than the Democrats. Funny thing about a two party system-you can agree with some of the aspects of one side and some of the other, and register for the party who you side with on your most important issues.
 
2012-05-16 12:50:13 PM

stewmadness: Aarontology: I'll believe it when they tell the religious right to STFU & GTFO

How very tolerant of you. Put that on a bumper sticker and drive around. Be proud of your enlightened position.


That -would- be a great bumper sticker, actually.

/I am proudly intolerant of the intolerant.
 
2012-05-16 01:06:07 PM

Jjaro: Are you asking for a piece of financial legislation that specifically rewards gays for financial success? Because that would be discrimination as well.


So legislation that specifically denies rights to gays is perfectly ok, but legislation that spefically rewards gays would be discrimination? Yep. You're a Republican all right.

I wasn't aware I personally did that.

The GOP you're defending did it. Here's the thing. I hear "I don't have anything against the gays personally" all the time from individual members of the GOP. But the legislation coming from Republicans you voted into office is 100% anti-gay, and the vote splits right down along party lines. Once in a while if we're lucky a Republican or two will do the right thing and vote for equality. If we're lucky.

So if you don't like being painted with the bigot brush, stop elected bigots to office.
 
2012-05-16 01:16:03 PM

The Why Not Guy: Jjaro: Are you asking for a piece of financial legislation that specifically rewards gays for financial success? Because that would be discrimination as well.

So legislation that specifically denies rights to gays is perfectly ok, but legislation that spefically rewards gays would be discrimination? Yep. You're a Republican all right.

I wasn't aware I personally did that.

The GOP you're defending did it. Here's the thing. I hear "I don't have anything against the gays personally" all the time from individual members of the GOP. But the legislation coming from Republicans you voted into office is 100% anti-gay, and the vote splits right down along party lines. Once in a while if we're lucky a Republican or two will do the right thing and vote for equality. If we're lucky.

So if you don't like being painted with the bigot brush, stop elected bigots to office.


Wow so you deleted my sentence where I state

"I personally believe that people should be rewarded for their financial success the same amount whether they are gay or straight. I can't recall any legislation that says something along the lines of 'small business should get Tax Break A, unless that small business is owned by someone who is gay.'"

Then say that I don't believe people should be rewarded for their financial success the same amount whether they are gay or straight. That's some intellectually honest debating right there.
 
2012-05-16 01:18:46 PM

Jjaro: And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform. Just because certain Republicans do hate, doesn't mean all of us do.


Interesting how you decry painting of Republicans with a broad brush... while painting the liberals on Fark with one.

Is the argument materially weakened if instead it is merely a majority of the party that have such attitude, rather than all? Or even merely that it is a disproportionately large fraction among those who strongly support the GOP, compared to the fraction within the overall population?

Jjaro: And no, my party is about restricting handouts that encourage people to stay at home and keep on collecting rather than finding a job and helping the economy, and letting people who have earned their money keep a reasonable amount of it.


It's been said that the fundamental concern of conservatives seems to be that someone is getting something that they don't deserve, while the fundamental concern of liberals seems to be that there is someone not getting something they do deserve.

intelligent comment below: Yes Republicans are all about hate, that is your party platform. Have you never actually reviewed it?


The argument would be stronger with specific examples from the platform, by the way.

(Of course, for some issues you'd actually have to point to the voting record in Congress and the individual state legislatures; EG, how "Every effort should be made to work with women considering abortion to enable and empower them to choose life" does not include support for substantive prenatal medical care, nor maintaining/increasing assistance for a single mother raising a child.)
 
2012-05-16 01:37:10 PM

abb3w: Jjaro: And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform. Just because certain Republicans do hate, doesn't mean all of us do.

Interesting how you decry painting of Republicans with a broad brush... while painting the liberals on Fark with one.

Is the argument materially weakened if instead it is merely a majority of the party that have such attitude, rather than all? Or even merely that it is a disproportionately large fraction among those who strongly support the GOP, compared to the fraction within the overall population?

Jjaro: And no, my party is about restricting handouts that encourage people to stay at home and keep on collecting rather than finding a job and helping the economy, and letting people who have earned their money keep a reasonable amount of it.

It's been said that the fundamental concern of conservatives seems to be that someone is getting something that they don't deserve, while the fundamental concern of liberals seems to be that there is someone not getting something they do deserve.



I will agree that a disproportionately large fraction of the GOP compared to the general population acts that way, and that is one of my bigger issues with the GOP, specifically those supporters whom I wish would go form their own party already, and by whom I am sure I would be called a RINO.

And I would disagree at least on a personal level on that second point. I personally have a fundamental concern that someone is getting too much taken away from them that they do deserve.

And I do appreciate that you are willing to have a debate without resorting to name-calling.
 
2012-05-16 01:38:36 PM

Jjaro: Wow so you deleted my sentence where I state "I personally believe...


It doesn't matter what you personally believe if the people you elect to office are anti-gay. Look at the legislation coming from Republicans on the state and federal level. If it pertains to homosexuality, it's anti-gay every single time, and the vote breaks down along party lines every single time. Not a single elected Republican is standing up and saying "hey wait a minute, this is wrong."

You are voting for bigots to represent you, but you don't want responsibility for their actions.

Let me flip it around for you.

Let's say I voted for a candidate who was running on an anti-Jjaro platform. My candidate wins, and he proposes various pieces of legislation stripping you of your rights. Many of them pass. I could say "gee, I have nothing against Jjaro personally" but if I voted for the guy who led the charge in removing your rights, wouldn't you say I share in the responsibility?
 
2012-05-16 01:46:26 PM
Jjaro: And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform

Um, you do realize that anti-gay language is part of the official Republican Party platform? Because I'd hate to think someone would support a party without being familiar with that party's platform.
 
2012-05-16 01:58:46 PM

Jjaro: You changed the subject. Remember this part of your post "Hate minorities, hate women, it gave him an outlet for hate hate hate?" And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform. Just because certain Republicans do hate, doesn't mean all of us do. And trust me, I would prefer they all go create their own party more than most people. But I'm sure you would not want to be associated with the beliefs/hatred spewed by a Keith Olbermann or a Jeremiah Wright or a Eric Holder either.

And no, my party is about restricting handouts that encourage people to stay at home and keep on collecting rather than finding a job and helping the economy, and letting people who have earned their money keep a reasonable amount of it.



No, you took my post out of context. And yes the Republican party is all about hate. Sorry you can't admit it, but it's the truth.

Extreme examples? So demanding to defund NPR, Planned Parenthood, require abortion seekers to have wands stuck in them, and many other examples of bills passing or being introduced is just an extreme example of a fringe group of Republicans? False.

Stay at home and collecting? That isn't what Welfare is about. Unless you are long term disabled you cannot collect and do nothing. Not to mention that has nothing to do with the topic at all. You're just using the long discredited Reagan Welfare Queen racist statement as your only backup plan.

And what is a "reasonable amount"?

Taxes are the lowest ever, you can't possibly think that a 40% top income tax rate and a 35% capital gains rate is unreasonable. Especially when the wealthy keeps having their wealth grow at the expense of everyone else.
 
2012-05-16 01:59:15 PM

The Why Not Guy: Jjaro: And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform

Um, you do realize that anti-gay language is part of the official Republican Party platform? Because I'd hate to think someone would support a party without being familiar with that party's platform.


Maybe I missed it, but the only part of the platform I read that was anti-gay rights was the part where they want to pass the Defense of Marriage act. Nothing about Civil Unions, which give the same exact rights as marriages, except for the name.

And in response to that, if my union with a significant other could only be called a civil union and not a marriage, but was completely equal in every other aspect, but because you agreed on more pressing issues than what the hell something is called, such as the state of the economy, than I would not be upset at you at all.

Maybe I don't care as much about the meaning of a word as some other people, but I don't see the difference in name as an issue at all.

And there are plenty of Republicans who vote pro-gay rights/marriage, although the number is obviously lower than it should be.
 
2012-05-16 02:14:29 PM

intelligent comment below: Jjaro: You changed the subject. Remember this part of your post "Hate minorities, hate women, it gave him an outlet for hate hate hate?" And you are doing what is typical of the Liberal Farker, take extreme examples/beliefs of members of the Republican Party and claiming it is the party platform. Just because certain Republicans do hate, doesn't mean all of us do. And trust me, I would prefer they all go create their own party more than most people. But I'm sure you would not want to be associated with the beliefs/hatred spewed by a Keith Olbermann or a Jeremiah Wright or a Eric Holder either.

And no, my party is about restricting handouts that encourage people to stay at home and keep on collecting rather than finding a job and helping the economy, and letting people who have earned their money keep a reasonable amount of it.


No, you took my post out of context. And yes the Republican party is all about hate. Sorry you can't admit it, but it's the truth.

Extreme examples? So demanding to defund NPR, Planned Parenthood, require abortion seekers to have wands stuck in them, and many other examples of bills passing or being introduced is just an extreme example of a fringe group of Republicans? False.

Stay at home and collecting? That isn't what Welfare is about. Unless you are long term disabled you cannot collect and do nothing. Not to mention that has nothing to do with the topic at all. You're just using the long discredited Reagan Welfare Queen racist statement as your only backup plan.

And what is a "reasonable amount"?

Taxes are the lowest ever, you can't possibly think that a 40% top income tax rate and a 35% capital gains rate is unreasonable. Especially when the wealthy keeps having their wealth grow at the expense of everyone else.


Being anti-abortion is not hate at all, its about preserving life. And although I don't agree with this viewpoint, demanding to de-fund NPR is because they feel like NPR should be completely impartial and they feel like it is not. Just because people have a different viewpoint than you does not mean it is hate. Especially concerning the abortion issue.

And I've spent time volunteering/working in poorer areas, and I have relatives who teach in underprivileged schools, and I can tell you first hand experiences of people who have additional babies just to get government assistance and people who get more money from staying unemployed than looking for a job.

And its not racist at all. One of the main driving points for my beliefs are my multiple experiences with white people who have complained that 99 weeks is not enough time to find another job, and they want unemployment extended. Not because they couldn't find one, but because they couldn't find one in their field with the same exact pay in a terrible economy.

Furthermore, yeah, I do think that close to half of one's money being taken away is too high. Especially since now, the US Corporate Tax rate is the highest in the developed world. That kind of hinders small business growth a bit. Especially when we are coming out of (hopefully) a recession.
 
2012-05-16 02:14:46 PM

Jjaro: Maybe I missed it, but the only part of the platform I read that was anti-gay rights was the part where they want to pass the Defense of Marriage act.


So you missed the part where homosexuality is incompatible with military service?

Nothing about Civil Unions, which give the same exact rights as marriages, except for the name.

That is 100% false. Civil Unions do not give the "exact rights" as marriages.

1. a couple can secure the rights covered by marriage but not covered by civil unions from a lawyer. Depending on what part of the country you live in, the additional expense could run up to a few thousand dollars.

2. Civil Unions are not universally recognized. If you get married in Oklahoma, you're still married on vacation in Hawaii or if you relocate to Florida. The rights secured through Civil Union may or may not be recognized in other states or countries.

3. Civil Unions and rights secured through lawyer are far more likely to be challenged in court - successfully - than marriages.

And in response to that, if my union with a significant other could only be called a civil union and not a marriage, but was completely equal in every other aspect, but because you agreed on more pressing issues than what the hell something is called, such as the state of the economy, than I would not be upset at you at all.

Again, that is not the case. Civil Unions are not simply marriages with another name. They are a seperate, distinct and different legal contract from marriages.
 
2012-05-16 02:37:07 PM

Jjaro: Being anti-abortion is not hate at all, its about preserving life


And that's your personal view, yet your radical party wants government by force to enforce your morality

Jjaro: Furthermore, yeah, I do think that close to half of one's money being taken away is too high. Especially since now, the US Corporate Tax rate is the highest in the developed world. That kind of hinders small business growth a bit. Especially when we are coming out of (hopefully) a recession.


False. Taxes are not highest in the corporate world. American companies pay the least amount of taxes.

Close to half is not half, that's a full 10% off half. Another false statement.

It does not hinder small business growth, what hinders small business growth is high health care costs, to which Obamacare tried to fix, but the American Taliban is fighting it as some sort of Constitutional attack.
 
2012-05-16 03:09:09 PM
Lemme get this straight.

5/8/12 - Obama comes out in support of Gay Marriage.
5/9/12 - 5/14/12 GOP goes absolutely apeshiat. Every pundit and candidate starts coming out against gay marriage.
5/14/12 Wealthy Donor pulls monetary support of Romney, asks for a refund. Cites Gay Marriage as the deciding issue.

5/15/12 - "God I farking love gay people, aren't gay people the greatest? In fact? Fark it! I'm Gay. I'm so gay I eat rainbows and shiat glitter." - GOP

Tomorrow - "We're announcing the first annual GOProud 'Gay-off', funded entirely from Mitch McTurtles personal retirement fund."
 
2012-05-16 03:31:07 PM

Jjaro: And I do appreciate that you are willing to have a debate without resorting to name-calling.


I prefer saving it for really special occasions.

Jjaro: Nothing about Civil Unions, which give the same exact rights as marriages, except for the name.


Incorrect. There is NO federal recognition of a civil union; thus, the rights and privileges (such as federal surviorship benefits, immigration status, tax benefits, et cetera) associated with marriage are not available to people in civil unions. Additionally, there is no obligation of state A to recognize a civil union from state B (which I believe case law gives for marriages).

Jjaro: And there are plenty of Republicans who vote pro-gay rights/marriage, although the number is obviously lower than it should be.


In absolute terms -- but even one percent of US Republicans is a lot of people. In relative terms, among those who strongly identify as Republican, strong opposition to gay marriage outnumbers strong support by an order of magnitude. (Filter out the "strong" while continuing to exclude GOP-leaning independents, and it's still more than 2:1.)

Within the GOP, gay marriage supporters are a pronounced minority.

Jjaro: That kind of hinders small business growth a bit.


imgs.xkcd.com
 
2012-05-16 03:33:50 PM

intelligent comment below: Jjaro: Being anti-abortion is not hate at all, its about preserving life

And that's your personal view, yet your radical party wants government by force to enforce your morality


If people believe that a fetus is alive, it is akin to murder to abort. Yes that's morality, but so is punishing murder.

Jjaro: Furthermore, yeah, I do think that close to half of one's money being taken away is too high. Especially since now, the US Corporate Tax rate is the highest in the developed world. That kind of hinders small business growth a bit. Especially when we are coming out of (hopefully) a recession.

False. Taxes are not highest in the corporate world. American companies pay the least amount of taxes.

Close to half is not half, that's a full 10% off half. Another false statement.

It does not hinder small business growth, what hinders small business growth is high health care costs, to which Obamacare tried to fix, but the American Taliban is fighting it as some sort of Constitutional attack.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/30/us-corporate-tax-rate_n_1392 3 10.html

You're wrong. Again.
 
2012-05-16 03:39:43 PM

Jjaro: If people believe that a fetus is alive, it is akin to murder to abort. Yes that's morality, but so is punishing murder.



Your opinion goes against science, thus your belief is merely a belief system, not subject to government intervention.

I believe flowers are drugs and should be illegal, I demand the government ban flowers.

Jjaro: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/30/us-corporate-tax-rate_n_1392 3 10.html

You're wrong. Again.


You need to learn the difference between what corporations are supposed to pay, and what they really pay.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/03/30/456005/reminder-corporate - taxes-very-low/

You're wrong. Again.
 
2012-05-16 03:42:02 PM

intelligent comment below: Jjaro: It does not hinder small business growth, what hinders small business growth is high health care costs, to which Obamacare tried to fix, but the American Taliban is fighting it as some sort of Constitutional attack.


And that is blatantly untrue. Obamacare would make health care more expensive for small businesses. I have had multiple acquaintances who have told me they would have to take the penalty and not offer health care if Obamacare was passed because of the increase in rates.

Its not just the far right that oppose Obamacare.
 
2012-05-16 03:55:23 PM

intelligent comment below: Jjaro: If people believe that a fetus is alive, it is akin to murder to abort. Yes that's morality, but so is punishing murder.


Your opinion goes against science, thus your belief is merely a belief system, not subject to government intervention.

I believe flowers are drugs and should be illegal, I demand the government ban flowers.

Jjaro: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/30/us-corporate-tax-rate_n_1392 3 10.html

You're wrong. Again.

You need to learn the difference between what corporations are supposed to pay, and what they really pay.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/03/30/456005/reminder-corporate - taxes-very-low/

You're wrong. Again.



I'm not going to get into the morality of abortion debate, but what science? Are you saying that a fetus is not alive before it comes out of the womb? Especially since medical books such as The Developing Human: Clinically Oriented Embryology states how "The processes by which a child develops from a single cell are miraculous....Human development is a continuous process that begins when an ovum from a female is fertilized by a sperm from a male. Growth and differentiation transform the zygote, a single cell... into a multicellular adult human being." Nonetheless it is clearly not an issue of hatred, like you have claimed, but rather of when life starts.

And as for your second point: after doing like 5 minutes of research, its pretty evident that that's temporarily true, but not in the long term. A short term-set to expire subsidy is the reason the tax rate is so low for this year. It was created, because both parties realized that lowering the rates would help companies rise out of the recession. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204662204577199492233215 330.html
 
Displayed 50 of 271 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report