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(Talking Points Memo)   Mainstream republicans got a preview last weekend of how much chaos and trouble Ron Paul could cause at the RNC, and it's scaring the crap out of them. RON PAUL   (2012.talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 30
    More: Florida, Rand Paul, Ron Paul, RNC, Republican, presumptive nominee, Mary Fallin, voice vote, Talking Points Memo  
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4152 clicks; posted to Politics » on 14 May 2012 at 10:56 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-14 09:58:55 AM  
4 votes:
At the state convention in Arizona, also this weekend, the presumptive nominee's son, Josh Romney, was booed off the stage by Paul supporters, some of whom derided his father as "the white Obama."

At the end of the day though, I have a feeling these supporters will support the white Obama over the black Obama.
2012-05-14 12:53:21 PM  
3 votes:

FeedTheCollapse: personally, I find the idea laughable and really underscores the naivete of Ron Paul supporters. They want to biatch about "stop voting for the lesser of 2 evils!", yet still are still willing to vote for a Republican, but are willing to vote for his son if only based on name recognition. It would also be funny as hell to watch former Paulites try to reconcile why Ron/Rand is promoting the previous disdained positions held by Romney.


You've hit the nail on the head. Ron Paul supporters are naive.

I call most paulites "political virgins" Ron Paul could be literally the first political figure they have supported. Not having to know how every other politician has to make comprises and get real work done allows Ron Paul's followers to imagine his brand of idealistic "Dr. No" is scaleable. It isn't.

He's the perfect candidate for political hipsters. Libertarianism allows you to look down your nose at BOTH political parties, AND say things that are shockingly uncaring and sound faux-intelligent! Win-win!

And does anybody wonder why his most rabid supporters are white college aged males with degrees from the Colleges of Engineering (Aspergers)?
2012-05-14 11:09:43 AM  
2 votes:

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Lumpmoose: a neoconservative movement

Let's make sure that we're agreeing on defined terms. I would define "neoconservatives" as "conservatives as conservatives who wish to use the government to actively advance their agenda." Now, neoconservatism is usually a Foreign Policy thing, so I'm being vague so that it can be applied to domestic issues.


Neo-conservatism is the evolved form of the political philosophy espoused by Leo Strauss. Because the word "neocon" has taken on such a broad meaning as to be virtually meaningless, I generally prefer the term "Straussian."
2012-05-14 11:04:53 AM  
2 votes:
Either they'll be marginalized and rules 'shifted' to minimize their chaos ability or Paul will get the VP nod. I doubt there will be any real trouble come convention time.

But a riot inside would be just friggin' awesome, even cooler than the brokered convention I wanted to see.
2012-05-14 10:07:17 AM  
2 votes:
i.imgur.com

Isn't this what participatory democracy is supposed to look like?
2012-05-14 10:01:35 AM  
2 votes:

clancifer: RON PAUL -- the right mix of Tea Party and crazy. Have fun, Republicans.


While the Tea Party was started by Ron Paul disciples, most teabaggers now want nothing to do with Paul's platform. It's morphed into a neoconservative movement that wants Bush back without calling themselves "Republican".
2012-05-14 09:20:39 AM  
2 votes:
Nguyen is part of an organized effort by grassroots supporters to claim delegates and national committee members for Paul. High on their list is of goals is ensuring that friendly members are in positions in both the state GOP and RNC to make sure establishment Republicans can't change the nominating process to prevent similar delegate takeovers in the future.

'We care about being heard. Also that we have a voice completely disproportionate to our actual voting base because these rules are badly written and we are, of course, opposed to rules that would be more straight forward and abiding by the popular votes of the states we represent.'

RON PAUL supporters, everyone.
2012-05-14 08:44:04 AM  
2 votes:

kona: Popcorn


They may actually need more riot police inside the convention than outside.
2012-05-14 04:40:00 PM  
1 votes:

Dimensio: Coelacanth: Hershey Highway Patrol: kona: Popcorn

They may actually need more riot police inside the convention than outside.

Didn't these guys get the right to carry handguns around for the upcoming convention?

No.


Darnit. That would have been fun.
2012-05-14 02:13:49 PM  
1 votes:

cman: And people call me misinformed


Would you like me to go in depth about it? I can, but don't have the time at the moment, so let me give you the Cole's notes version:

The death of Leo Strauss was not really anything important, it was just just coincidence that it happened in the most important year of the last half of the twentieth century (1973 -- for numerous other reasons). The man was hardly a household name when he lived but renewed interest after his death in his contributions to the philosophy of realism and political theory created, among the new business class of boomers, a ripple effect of enthusiasm in his ideas. They were a harsh mix of Machiavelli, Hobbes, Nietzsche and absolutism, and were a distinct Hegelian reaction to the social liberalism of the 60s, which he found abhorrent.

At it's crux were 4 major political values:

- Religion is mandatory (but only as a form of crowd control)
- Aggressive foreign policy (we're number 1, we're number 1)
- Elitist hierarchy (the government only tells its people what they "need to know")
- Constant fear of perceived outside threats (commies, terrorism etc)

Essentially, Leo Strauss did what all popular philosophers do: He told powerful men what they wanted to hear. Strauss' pupils (among them Henry Jaffa, Andrew Sullivan, William Kristol, Rupert Murdoch, Alan Bloom, and Paul Wolfowitz) from the University of Chicago then went on to spread his gospel further, mixing with Reaganism in the 80s to create a fiercely aggressive new political platform that we today know as neo-conservatism.

It's been running the Republican party for the past 30 years, which has become a front for these quasi-fascist principles that old Conservatives like Goldwater and Eisenhauer warned about, fought against, and wouldn't approve of today.
2012-05-14 01:47:41 PM  
1 votes:
Congress is inept becasue they can't comprimise, the GOP is inept because they can't comprimise. There is a common denominator here.
2012-05-14 12:39:05 PM  
1 votes:

God's Hubris: How dare Ron Paul delegates use the rules system placed by the GOP establishment!!


The disturbing thing is that they are using the rules against the party itself and they don't care about the consequences. Of course, RON PAUL's strategy is to do that same thing to the federal government. RON PAUL only wants to be president so he can dismantle the federal government from the inside.
2012-05-14 12:37:51 PM  
1 votes:

BMulligan: Neo-conservatism is the evolved form of the political philosophy espoused by Leo Strauss. Because the word "neocon" has taken on such a broad meaning as to be virtually meaningless, I generally prefer the term "Straussian."


Strauss' neo-conservatism is almost indistinguishable from fascism.
2012-05-14 12:11:17 PM  
1 votes:
It's pretty hilarious to see the number of people delusional enough to debate the value of complete utter shiat. "shiat with corn is way better than shiat with peas, but we may end up with shiat and broccoli. Then again, we may find refried shiat or bacon-wrapped shiat if we rehash it enough..."

/go ahead Paul, please yell at cloud again
2012-05-14 12:09:01 PM  
1 votes:

Felgraf: Why are you so convinced about, at the very least, Ohio? There's been a pretty big backlash against the Republican Governor there.


I think you might have misunderstood me. Romney needs to win those states, those states aren't in the bag for him, and if he doesn't win them his chances of winning the presidency precipitously drop.

If I was running his joke of a campaign, this would be my #1 priority. Not appeasing some wingnut portion of my party.
2012-05-14 11:37:29 AM  
1 votes:

DarnoKonrad: I honestly don't know what to think of these stories. Is this a real problem or media hype?


In no way, shape or form could the fracturing of the GOP be considered a problem.
2012-05-14 11:32:15 AM  
1 votes:
Somacandra: [i.imgur.com image 379x214]

Isn't this what participatory democracy is supposed to look like?


I find it amusing that this small contingent is using GOP tactics against itself. Sure it's divide by zero territory, but it's the same strategy that the Corporatist wing, and more recently the Fundamentalist wing has used to dominate the party. Only proper the libertarians do it too.

They won't change or stop Romney this election, but they will get their hands on some important committees and be able to change party rules for next time. Ron's committed to gumming up the work and laying the foundation for his son.

Porpcorn.gif is right.
2012-05-14 11:28:52 AM  
1 votes:
... to make sure the movement is poised for stronger runs in 2016 and beyond.

Really, people. I don't care who the guy is. He's 76. He'll be 80 in 2016. That's just not an option. And what's with this Rand Paul crap? We saw what happened with Dubya. A family name is one thing, but they are not the same person. Cut it out with the family crap, people. This is a democracy, not your personal farking dynasty.
2012-05-14 11:27:42 AM  
1 votes:

Wicked Chinchilla: How does Paul Ryan still even count? His budgets have been HAMMERED by right and left alike going on two years now.


Ayn Rand worship, a centerpiece to the Tea Party "I'm not a Republican, I'm a libertarian" movement. Funny that Ryan back-pedaled from the church of Galt when the other church he panders to for votes got jealous.
2012-05-14 11:26:30 AM  
1 votes:

qorkfiend: Mentat: Coelacanth: Didn't these guys get the right to carry handguns around for the upcoming convention?

And it's in Florida, so Stand Your Ground laws apply.

I feel decidedly threatened by the GOP Convention.


I will be passing out bags of Skittles and "I love Ayn Rand" hoodies at the convention.
2012-05-14 11:23:37 AM  
1 votes:
The GOP deserves this
2012-05-14 11:23:21 AM  
1 votes:
I don't think Ron Paul is insane. Wrong, but not insane. His supporters, however, are both wrong and insane, and I hope they cause a huge, embarrassing scene at the RNC.
2012-05-14 11:23:20 AM  
1 votes:

Coelacanth: Didn't these guys get the right to carry handguns around for the upcoming convention?


And it's in Florida, so Stand Your Ground laws apply.
2012-05-14 11:14:09 AM  
1 votes:

Lumpmoose: clancifer: RON PAUL -- the right mix of Tea Party and crazy. Have fun, Republicans.

While the Tea Party was started by Ron Paul disciples, most teabaggers now want nothing to do with Paul's platform. It's morphed into a neoconservative movement that wants Bush back without calling themselves "Republican".


It's almost as if RON PAUL's platform leads to disastrous, unintended consequences that are easily predicted by anyone with common sense.
2012-05-14 11:08:49 AM  
1 votes:

qorkfiend: Ba'boon: If this goes poorly, and the Paulites feel like they're unfairly muscled out by the GOP, it won't end well for the party. Plenty of paleoconservatives would sooner sit this election out than vote for a neoconservative. This really is for the soul of the party.

Oh, I dunno. Most of the paleoconservatives voted for Bush twice.


I have seen a lot of Paul supporters already say of he loses the primary they are voting for Fartbongo.
2012-05-14 11:02:35 AM  
1 votes:

Lumpmoose: neoconservative movement


Neo-conservatism. It's a movement and we all need one, every day!
2012-05-14 09:34:23 AM  
1 votes:
This will be fun.
2012-05-14 08:57:57 AM  
1 votes:
Will the AZ delegation be implementing "second amendment solutions" to resolve conflicts? After all, they have made some rather serious allegations against their party fellows....
2012-05-14 08:57:44 AM  
1 votes:
GARY JOHNSON
2012-05-14 08:26:49 AM  
1 votes:
Popcorn
 
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