SurfaceTension: Ummmm...ooooookkkkaaaaay then

It's what we did to Escobar when his cartel pulled this shiat. And it worked very well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pablo_Escobar

Sad, but thank Nixon and Santa Nancy that Americans aren't forced to smoke evil weed!

fireclown: Tomorrows headline: 48 heads and sets of hands found 300 KM away.
Next weeks headline: Bodies do not match heads.

Mexico wins again!

Seriously though, If I saw a group of tough looking Mexican dudes toss 50 bodies from a truck, I wouldn't see anything either. I'd be out of there so fast that you would see a red shift.

I was actually thinking that there would be a little smoke outline of my body like in the roadrunner cartoons.

GBB: I got had 49 problems, but a head ain't one.

FTFY

/hot, like a drug war

BronyMedic:
Why you dumb assholes hiding in your foxholes while getting the rest of the world pissed off at your paranoia of brown people in Dirkaganistan don't wake the hell up and realize the actual threat is occuring right now, right on our borders, beats the hell out of me.

These gangs are the base definition of terrorists. But because they don't pray to allah when they blow things up, we don't care.

Americans can't be bothered wiht a war on theri own borders. They are too much the pussies to stand and fight for their own rights, let alone their lives.
Watch them get on a plane sometime. Watch that while reading the bill of rights.
They are beaten and defeated by their own apathy.
They don''t care. As log as they don't have to smell the war, they don't care.

Pray 4 Mojo: Pretty impressive that they can do all this with rakes and shovels and bats and stuff.

[www.bajabound.com image 288x328]

I always love discussions of Mexican gun laws.

Years ago I read an article in either GQ or Rolling Stone by an American who moved down there for work. He was socializing with some upper class, non criminal, Mexicans and they were shocked when he said he didn't have any guns. They assumed all Americans had guns. Then they asked if he'd like to see their collection.

He goes upstairs and the host had a collection of guns you couldn't have bought in America without an incredible amount of effort. The guy had enough machine guns for his own private army. And the same was true of the other men in the social circle.

So what you have is an American who, despite living in a country where guns are legal, doesn't have any weapons. And a bunch of Mexicans, where guns are 100% illegal, with personal arsenals of automatic weapons.

BronyMedic: Total war is ugly. It's horrendous. And it's the only thing these bastards will ever understand.

Yeah I already know that. The team I was on, came in second place back in the 60s & 70s.

If Calderon invited SEAL Team 6 into the country to do some of what you suggest, then I'd have no problem at all. But to willy-nilly slaughter families, well that's a bit too far for me.

Closed_Minded_Bastage: But to willy-nilly slaughter families, well that's a bit too far for me.

I'm not talking about the families of the average street solider who was forced into what he's doing now at gunpoint. They are just as much victims as the people they kill.

I'm talking about the leaders and the people who enable them. I'm talking about the foreign mercenaries and soldiers they recruit.

jso2897: 100 Watt Walrus: david_gaithersburg: elffster: More stringent laws will fix this.

So Vote Republican.

.
.
Well progressive ideas like stripping human beings of their right to defend themselves has worked just swimmingly. Just ask those 49 torsos lying by the side of the highway. Go ahead, ask them.

Oh, please do tell how US gun laws are connected to these murders in Mexico. I can't wait to hear this.

Whatever Mexico's problem is, it isn't a lack of guns. They are "lillegal" there only in the sense that anything else is - which is to say in a purely titular sense.
Everybody in Mexico has guns, laws or no laws.

Yeah no, you're making things up. The average campesino goes to jail if they are found to have a gun. It's a pretty big deal in Mexico to have a gun without a permit, which are notoriously hard to get.

Tigres & Monterrey were in the playoffs or it would have been more.

Agua....agua.

/friendo

HectorSchwartz: This thread has about 8 stupid arguments going on. I'd like to settle a few.
1. Legalize it. It wont happen. Even if it did, these guys aren't going to start flipping burgers at some resort, they will find another way to make money.
2. Gun control. What kind of gun did they use to cut off all those heads?
3. Let's invade!!!!!1 They don't have oil. We only start a war if you have oil. Welcome to America. Human life is not important outside of our borders. Oil is important.

/ I can't believe that nobody has pointed a finger at Obamacare.
// as for the heads and feet. I'd stay away from Mexican street vendors for a while. Those tacos are cheap for a reason.



Mexico is 7th in world annual oil production, fyi.

NOBODY SAW A THING.

That's their story and I guess they like breathing for another day.

BronyMedic: Closed_Minded_Bastage: Look, I'll give you that the cartels are ruthless bad people, but you DON'T drop J-DAMS or W80s on innocent families if you can avoid it. And I've had quite enough of My Lais and SSgts going off the reservation and killing innocents.

The only language these people know is brutality and violence. You know whast? I'm a pretty liberal, progressive person, and I won't lose any sleep over a few cartel leader's houses going boom in the night.

This is not a nation you can negotiate with. This is not a rational citizenry you can appease and win the hearts and minds of with food and civil projects.

These are hardcore, extranational warlords with a hard-on for rape and murder on an industrialized scale, and the bankroll of a second world country. And an army to match.

The only way you win against these people is fighting the same kind of brutal, unconventional warfare that they themselves are willing to engage in. You make their leaders and bosses scared to close their eyes at night. You make them hide their families, frends, and everyone they once shared a conversation with for fear that some unseen drone loitering overhead is going to drop a maverick in on them for a suprise celebration. You make them afraid to give the order to attack an informant, because they last time they did so their men were lined up against a wall and shot as illegal combatants for crimes of war. You start blowing up their homes with JDAMs without any warning. The US does ultraprecise ordinance drops very, very well. They attack an ambulance, you send several of theirs to some third world hellhole we outsource torture to. They recruit mercenaries, you lock them up in Gitmo, provided they leave the field alive.

You stop treating their leaders as criminals, and start treating them as the monsters they are, worthy of only being put down. They sacrified their claims to humanity and criminal justice the minute they declaired war on innocent women and children, and decided to u ...

You go ahead and fund your retarded fantasies, Mr. Bay. The rest of us would rather strip them of money and power by removing their funding. Most adults are going to laugh in your face when you suggest nuking or bombing civilians on our border. Your posts read like a 14 year old writing GI Joe or Call of Duty fanfiction.

they better start cataloging toe prints.

BronyMedic: SurfaceTension: Ummmm...ooooookkkkaaaaay then

It's what we did to Escobar when his cartel pulled this shiat. And it worked very well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pablo_Escobar

One problem here is that Mexico borders us.

It is easy to fight wars with countries we don't have borders with. The main U.S. casualties are the military, and it is very difficult for them to penetrate our borders (Not impossible, or else 9/11 would not have happened),

However... with Mexico, if you go after them, I believe very likely you'll see retaliations in the U.S. When someone finds 50 or so headless and handless bodies of U.S. citizens in a U.S. town... well, that just cannot be stomached by average U.S. citizen, to whom war is pretty much an abstraction.

No politician in the U.S. is willing to start any sort of policy or action that is likely to result in U.S. civilian casualties on U.S. soil.The cartels are already well infiltrated in the U.S., and they know if any type of major strikes starts happening to them, the best response will be to go after U.S. citizens on U.S. soil. The politicians do not want to take that risk.

I have a modest proposal.



Old Mexico.



New Mexico.

SharkTrager: So what you have is an American who, despite living in a country where guns are legal, doesn't have any weapons. And a bunch of Mexicans, where guns are 100% illegal, with personal arsenals of automatic weapons.

CSB:

In the 90's, I worked as a driver for a 'Maquiladora" furniture company that operated in Otay Mesa, CA with a plant in TJ. When executive kidnappings became a huge problem, my Mexican counterpart and I were sent to a week long security training program (weapons, driving, CPR etc). The factory was able to get (buy) us a Special Dispensation from the Tijuana Police Chief to conceal and carry there... but I could not get one from the SD County Sheriff... where guns are legal and I was basically the poster child of who should be allowed a CCW. The whole thing was eye-opening.

/Still have the 9mm they bought me
//Ahhhh... the things we'll do for 10 bucks an hour when we're young and stupid.
///I learned how to do the Rockford Files move where you back up at full speed, spin 180 degrees and take off forward without slowing down.
////I.T.G.?
//CSB over.

Christian Bale: HectorSchwartz: This thread has about 8 stupid arguments going on. I'd like to settle a few.
1. Legalize it. It wont happen. Even if it did, these guys aren't going to start flipping burgers at some resort, they will find another way to make money.
2. Gun control. What kind of gun did they use to cut off all those heads?
3. Let's invade!!!!!1 They don't have oil. We only start a war if you have oil. Welcome to America. Human life is not important outside of our borders. Oil is important.

/ I can't believe that nobody has pointed a finger at Obamacare.
// as for the heads and feet. I'd stay away from Mexican street vendors for a while. Those tacos are cheap for a reason.



Mexico is 7th in world annual oil production, fyi.

And how do they compare against the middle east as a whole? Also, they burn a bunch of it, just like we do, so much of it is not for sale.

Kar98: DubyaHater: I have a friend who married a Mexican immigrant. For some reason, the husband is having trouble getting his Green Card (no, I didn't ask why).

Because if the Mexican walked into the country illegally to begin with, there's no way, no where, no how that he'll even get a green card.

That could be a valid reason. As far as I know though, he was here on a Work Visa and they were married during that time.

Nrokreffefp: You go ahead and fund your retarded fantasies, Mr. Bay. The rest of us would rather strip them of money and power by removing their funding. Most adults are going to laugh in your face when you suggest nuking or bombing civilians on our border. Your posts read like a 14 year old writing GI Joe or Call of Duty fanfiction.

The hillarious thing is that we've been doing this to Al Queda for years. And before that we did it to the Medellin Cartel. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Search_Bloc

But you keep right on thinking that it's just something that's taken from Tom Clancy Novels and Hollywood movies.

BronyMedic: Why you dumb assholes hiding in your foxholes while getting the rest of the world pissed off at your paranoia of brown people in Dirkaganistan don't wake the hell up and realize the actual threat is occuring right now, right on our borders, beats the hell out of me.

These gangs are the base definition of terrorists. But because they don't pray to allah when they blow things up, we don't care.

Quite the strawman. The usual smear against the "dumb assholes hiding in your foxholes while getting the rest of the world pissed off at your paranoia of brown people in Dirkaganistan" is that they are do "realize the actual threat is occuring right now, right on our borders". But that's seen as bigotry against brown people, and disregarded. Despite the 49 corpses dumped on Tuesdays at the US border. But it's just dumb white ranchers who hate Messicans, right?

dr_blasto: Although, I would say dealing with the narco-terrorists like we've taken to dealing with the Islamo-terrorists through drone strikes and targeted small-team eliminations wouldn't be that bad as long as we took some action within the US towards legalization. Calderon keeps blaming this escalation in violence on our consumption and legal policies. To some extent, he's right; not that we're directly responsible for Mexico's inability to deal with their organized crime, but more indirectly responsible for the existence of the cartels through our unending consumption and large, heavily-monied market for their goods.

I agree fully. Legalization of low-societal harm drugs, like Marijuana and Ectasy, is not going to go far enough, however, and targeted assassination and destruction of cartel assets is the only thing they're going to understand.

49 bodies need a flatbed? Subby, you're talking about Mexico! That's minivan capacity over there!

/window seat

Closed_Minded_Bastage: Legalizing soft drugs would go a long way towards alleviating the massive influx of cash they get by supplying the American demand for said soft drugs and allow law enforcement to concentrate on more important stuff, like say ... human trafficking.

Mexican law enforcement is officially in favor of illegal human trafficking into the US. It's a plank of the party in charge of the Mexican government!

Relatively Obscure: 48 people saw it happen.

Winner!

BronyMedic: Closed_Minded_Bastage: Look, I'll give you that the cartels are ruthless bad people, but you DON'T drop J-DAMS or W80s on innocent families if you can avoid it. And I've had quite enough of My Lais and SSgts going off the reservation and killing innocents.

The only language these people know is brutality and violence. You know whast? I'm a pretty liberal, progressive person, and I won't lose any sleep over a few cartel leader's houses going boom in the night.

This is not a nation you can negotiate with. This is not a rational citizenry you can appease and win the hearts and minds of with food and civil projects.

These are hardcore, extranational warlords with a hard-on for rape and murder on an industrialized scale, and the bankroll of a second world country. And an army to match.

The only way you win against these people is fighting the same kind of brutal, unconventional warfare that they themselves are willing to engage in. You make their leaders and bosses scared to close their eyes at night. You make them hide their families, frends, and everyone they once shared a conversation with for fear that some unseen drone loitering overhead is going to drop a maverick in on them for a suprise celebration. You make them afraid to give the order to attack an informant, because they last time they did so their men were lined up against a wall and shot as illegal combatants for crimes of war. You start blowing up their homes with JDAMs without any warning. The US does ultraprecise ordinance drops very, very well. They attack an ambulance, you send several of theirs to some third world hellhole we outsource torture to. They recruit mercenaries, you lock them up in Gitmo, provided they leave the field alive.

How you going to find them?

You aren't gong to be abel to hurt these guys unless you are
A-willing to carpet bomb large swaths of land filled with "civilians"
B-willig to send in troops to find individuals and work up the chain until you get the bosses (durig which time they will be fighting the mexican army, the police,on top of the Zeta's (and yes I know there is some overlap there))

BronyMedic: Closed_Minded_Bastage: But to willy-nilly slaughter families, well that's a bit too far for me.

I'm not talking about the families of the average street solider who was forced into what he's doing now at gunpoint. They are just as much victims as the people they kill.

I'm talking about the leaders and the people who enable them. I'm talking about the foreign mercenaries and soldiers they recruit.

No, you are talking about the cartel leaders families;

BronyMedic: Put a few JDAMs and some Tomahawks into some of their superlabs, bomb a few of their families, and take the fight to them - and they might see that it wasn't very smart poking the sleeping bear with a stick.

BronyMedic: You start blowing up their homes with JDAMs without any warning.

I'm with Nrokreffefp on this, you're an idiot.

/and with this, I'm going back to bed.

wombatsrus: It is easy to fight wars with countries we don't have borders with. The main U.S. casualties are the military, and it is very difficult for them to penetrate our borders (Not impossible, or else 9/11 would not have happened),

However... with Mexico, if you go after them, I believe very likely you'll see retaliations in the U.S. When someone finds 50 or so headless and handless bodies of U.S. citizens in a U.S. town... well, that just cannot be stomached by average U.S. citizen, to whom war is pretty much an abstraction.

No politician in the U.S. is willing to start any sort of policy or action that is likely to result in U.S. civilian casualties on U.S. soil.The cartels are already well infiltrated in the U.S., and they know if any type of major strikes starts happening to them, the best response will be to go after U.S. citizens on U.S. soil. The politicians do not want to take that risk.

Al Queda said the same thing when they planned to use 9 predominantly saudi nationals to bring down the Capital Building, the Pentagon, and the Twin Towers on 9/11 using hijacked aircraft.

11 years later, the most dangerous job on the face of the earth is to be Al Queda #2. And, as OBL proved, it doesn't matter where you run or hide. It doesn't matter for how long you do so. We will find you. And. We. Will. Kill. You.

One thing history has shown about the United States is that a bunch of white and black guys unleashed upon someone of a different culture and/or skin color because of a heinous atrocity commited against American civilians to "teach America a lesson" , typically ends with lots of death and destruction once the US Military gets involved.

Drug money is used to rig elections,
And train brutal corporate sponsored
Dictators around the world...

THEY'RETRYINGTOBUILDAPRISONTHEY'RETRYINGTOBUILDAPRISON
FOR YOU AND ME TO LIVE IN!

Coronach: I really don't know about the minutia of what's going on down there, but it seems to me that between American drug trade from below the border and our sudden lack of interest in the other goods the cartels fund themselves with that we're implicit in what's going down here.

Only in the sense that Canada was implicitly responsible for the growth in organized crime in the US during Prohibition.

Closed_Minded_Bastage: I'm with Nrokreffefp on this, you're an idiot.

/and with this, I'm going back to bed.

You can think I'm Hitler, for all I care.

I'm not going to shed a tear that the family of some drug cartel big wig, who has personally ordered the torture and murder of hundreds of men, women, and children, went up in a sudden flash of light in the middle of the night. You cannot tell me they know full. damn. well. how they live so well.

There's plenty of horrendous things in this world to bleed my heart about. Killing cartel leaders and their familes isn't one of them.

Such is the way of forever
teeming with simple cruelties
beatings in cold rooms
hands and head not found

wombatsrus: It is easy to fight wars with countries we don't have borders with. The main U.S. casualties are the military, and it is very difficult for them to penetrate our borders (Not impossible, or else 9/11 would not have happened),

However... with Mexico, if you go after them, I believe very likely you'll see retaliations in the U.S. When someone finds 50 or so headless and handless bodies of U.S. citizens in a U.S. town... well, that just cannot be stomached by average U.S. citizen, to whom war is pretty much an abstraction.

500m mine fields worked really well for the Koreas, and they were fighting a real war, not a sort-of war.

This is how they roll South of the border since like forever i.e. (Mayan-Aztec). Why do you think Spain was like wow look at this score of a continent we discovered and conquered then they were like OMG! holy fark nothing we do will civilize this place, "Peace out", we are out of here! Then the French, etc..Then those blokes from England were like fark it just kill them all and the Mexican citizens got a clue and were nice enough to stay on their side of the world for the most part until the 80's.
Wait until they start their dumping and killing a few miles north that is when all the fun really starts.


//and done..

This text is now purple: Coronach: I really don't know about the minutia of what's going on down there, but it seems to me that between American drug trade from below the border and our sudden lack of interest in the other goods the cartels fund themselves with that we're implicit in what's going down here.

Only in the sense that Canada was implicitly responsible for the growth in organized crime in the US during Prohibition.

So we bear no responsibility whatsoever in this?

I'm just honestly trying to find out more info on this. Where are these victims from to start with? Obviously we won't know anytime soon without the heads/hands/feet, but this isn't the first batch of victims dumped.

I'm just trying to get get my head around the whole scope of how the cartels are operating.

As I stated upthread, I'm just trying to ascertain what the larger picture is so far as how these cartels are operating.

Any links to reputable sites would be appreciated.

BronyMedic: Closed_Minded_Bastage: I'm with Nrokreffefp on this, you're an idiot.

/and with this, I'm going back to bed.

You can think I'm Hitler, for all I care.

I'm not going to shed a tear that the family of some drug cartel big wig, who has personally ordered the torture and murder of hundreds of men, women, and children, went up in a sudden flash of light in the middle of the night. You cannot tell me they know full. damn. well. how they live so well.

There's plenty of horrendous things in this world to bleed my heart about. Killing cartel leaders and their familes isn't one of them.

One of the recent happenings in Veracruz was finding a hippopotamus wandering through the market one morning. If only there were some way to support a private zoo on a hacienda with 15 bedrooms, a staff of 25, a fleet of cars and private planes and not have any income.

Unfortunately, the politicians all have their $multi-million dachas in Cuernavaca. If you walk past the gated entrances at night you can hear the digging from the back-yard.

These are the guys (PRI) who refused to set reporting standards on cash transactions. They need to sweep from the top down.

ChuDogg: jso2897: 100 Watt Walrus: david_gaithersburg: elffster: More stringent laws will fix this.

So Vote Republican.

.
.
Well progressive ideas like stripping human beings of their right to defend themselves has worked just swimmingly. Just ask those 49 torsos lying by the side of the highway. Go ahead, ask them.

Oh, please do tell how US gun laws are connected to these murders in Mexico. I can't wait to hear this.

Whatever Mexico's problem is, it isn't a lack of guns. They are "lillegal" there only in the sense that anything else is - which is to say in a purely titular sense.
Everybody in Mexico has guns, laws or no laws.

Yeah no, you're making things up. The average campesino goes to jail if they are found to have a gun. It's a pretty big deal in Mexico to have a gun without a permit, which are notoriously hard to get.

Not in any Mexico I've ever been to - I do believe it is you, my friend, who is making shiat up.