Frivolous lawsuit is frivolous.

basically the dispute is over an old update to iPod software that prevents any program that isn't iTunes from adding music to your device.

So, what's the issue then? As long as I can add content from any source to iTunes, I'm good.

Woohoo! I get $1.69 and the lawyers get $20 million.

I got like $0.13 in a lawsuit against ebay I didn't know I was part of.

iTunes has scared me for life, so what's that worth?

I bought a first generation Nano. First Apple product I'd ever purchased new. The screen broke after about 3 months of use. I just threw the thing away and said "Never again, Apple". Wish I'd kept it because they're finally (5 years later) doing free exchanges for those POS's.

I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

Headline basically plagiarized from CNN.com. YESTERDAY. Well played, subby.

I realize the above isn't actually related to the article. What's interesting about the iPod is that Apple is able to track whenever one is synced using an internet-connected computer. I'm sure they've noticed that an excessive number of their 1st gen Nanos synced a few times and were never heard from again.

It really is unfortunate how tied into iTunes that ipods/iphones/etc are.

I used to have an iPod Classic but iTunes was so damn slow, bloated, and generally worthless that I just gave up with it.

I'd really like to buy an iPhone, but instead went with an Android solely for the reason of not wanting to deal with iTunes again. I can't be the only one.

Luv my iphone - hate itunes.

Good. The quality of my last one was crap.

...and you never actually get much of anything from a class action. The lawyers and legal system get pretty much everything. It's totally farked up.

Also, Apple never promised otherwise. It always said "a computer running iTunes, and a USB port" (used to be a Mac, and Firewire port) in the system requirements for iPods. Is he gonna sue because he can't put music on his iPod using a parallel port, too?

ZAZ: Or you can do nothing and wait for the tiny checks to (maybe) roll in

More likely a 50 cent credit in the iTunes store.

What if I don't like rap?

I hate iTunes too, but after being stuck with Zune, I miss it. Zune is nice, once it finally starts, as long as you don't have anything else running.

Sharepod for the win.

95629: It really is unfortunate how tied into iTunes that ipods/iphones/etc are.

I used to have an iPod Classic but iTunes was so damn slow, bloated, and generally worthless that I just gave up with it.

I'd really like to buy an iPhone, but instead went with an Android solely for the reason of not wanting to deal with iTunes again. I can't be the only one.

You aren't, I'm in the same boat and loving my Galaxy 2.

Guess I'm not suing, because I bought my 16GB 4th Gen Nano in September 2009, when they were on clearance because the 5th Gens had just come out. Oh well, I filled the thing once, and haven't touched it since. I probably should go back and swap some songs out and and stuff, but I just can't be arsed to convert shiat to MP3 and set up the proper album covers and such, despite the fact that album cover metadata is a waste of time because the damn thing usually screws it up anyways. I mean, I'm listening to Phil Ochs and it has an album cover for the Monkees pop up. Or When I'm listening to Judy Collins, it's a Spinal Tap album cover. WTS is up with that Apple? iTunes is garbage, but I've still managed to avoid it as much as possible, and it's far easier to do so with iOS 5, even though that's still as buggy as shiat.

Kar98: So, what's the issue then? As long as I can add content from any source to iTunes, I'm good.

Because if your OS isn't supported by iTunes, you are screwed. Using Linux, I can't update my daughter's stupid iPod that her lame ass Grandfather bought for her. I won't install iTunes just to put music on the stupid thing.

Ideally, the court should force Apple to open up the changes they made to this generation of iPods so that 3rd parties could make apps for installing music on the stupid thing.

ZAZ: Or you can do nothing and wait for the tiny checks to (maybe) roll in

More likely a 50 cent credit in the iTunes store.

like what happened with the ticketmaster class action. everyone for the last ten years was overcharged for tickets... so, the class action means that ticketmaster does not have to stop overcharging everyone, it just means that you get $3 credit to your next ticket purchase.

I have had 2 iPod Classics and have never used iTunes.

There are plenty of open source programs out there that can put music onto the iPods just fine. These models did come with a change to the iTunes database on the iPod (what tells the iPod's OS what file is what song) but the open source software authors implemented that change within a month or so.

That is just how third party unsupported software works.

vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

You would probably have a case if you can show you didn't receive notice. Also DON'T cash the check they send you.

Dangl1ng: Kar98: So, what's the issue then? As long as I can add content from any source to iTunes, I'm good.

Because if your OS isn't supported by iTunes, you are screwed. Using Linux, I can't update my daughter's stupid iPod that her lame ass Grandfather bought for her. I won't install iTunes just to put music on the stupid thing.

Ideally, the court should force Apple to open up the changes they made to this generation of iPods so that 3rd parties could make apps for installing music on the stupid thing.

gtkpod on Linux works just fine. So does Amarok and a few others. Anything that uses libgpod knows how to put music onto an iPod and write the iTunes database to tell the iPod what to do.

Dangl1ng: Kar98: So, what's the issue then? As long as I can add content from any source to iTunes, I'm good.

Because if your OS isn't supported by iTunes, you are screwed. Using Linux, I can't update my daughter's stupid iPod that her lame ass Grandfather bought for her. I won't install iTunes just to put music on the stupid thing.

Ideally, the court should force Apple to open up the changes they made to this generation of iPods so that 3rd parties could make apps for installing music on the stupid thing.

I guessing you already tried using Floola?

Dangl1ng: Because if your OS isn't supported by iTunes, you are screwed.

Apple has never promised otherwise though. You might have to get a Happy Panda MP5 player from Walgreen's ;)

vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

vodka: ...and you never actually get much of anything from a class action. The lawyers and legal system get pretty much everything. It's totally farked up.

"Waaaaa, I don't get millions of dollars for free without doing anything when my damages are so inconsequential that I didn't even know I had cause for a suit! That's unfaaaaaaaair!"

Theaetetus: vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

vodka: ...and you never actually get much of anything from a class action. The lawyers and legal system get pretty much everything. It's totally farked up.

"Waaaaa, I don't get millions of dollars for free without doing anything when my damages are so inconsequential that I didn't even know I had cause for a suit! That's unfaaaaaaaair!"

Why shouldn't class actions suits be opt-in? I really don't know enough about them to have a strong opinion.

vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

Actually, I thought if you get the notice there's language in it that gives you the right to opt out of the class and file your own lawsuit.

/Why not sue Apple? Seems as if I've already sued just about every company I bought a product from in the last 20 years.

I don't have an iPod, for you see I have a cell phone and I'm not a child.

GentDirkly: I bought a first generation Nano. First Apple product I'd ever purchased new. The screen broke after about 3 months of use. I just threw the thing away and said "Never again, Apple". Wish I'd kept it because they're finally (5 years later) doing free exchanges for those POS's.

Odd, my 1st gen nano was still working fine when I took advantage of the exchange program a few months back. Screen was fine, buttons worked fine, jack still worked, the battery even still held a charge (not as *much* of one as originally, of course, but still usable). TBH, I would have rather gotten a refurbished 1st gen back instead of the 6th gen they sent me - the touch screen interface is a pain in the butt since you can't navigate it by feel without taking the ipod out of your pocket.

Carth: Theaetetus: vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

vodka: ...and you never actually get much of anything from a class action. The lawyers and legal system get pretty much everything. It's totally farked up.

"Waaaaa, I don't get millions of dollars for free without doing anything when my damages are so inconsequential that I didn't even know I had cause for a suit! That's unfaaaaaaaair!"

Why shouldn't class actions suits be opt-in? I really don't know enough about them to have a strong opinion.

Class actions exist so that the government doesn't have to spend tax money regulating minor issues. Thus we have a system where private attorneys are incentivized to punish bad corporate actors because if they do, they will be paid by the very bad actors they are suing. The only way this works of course is if they can aggregate all the minor infractions together. If it were made more difficult to aggregate - i.e. if it were made an opt in system - it would often cease to be cost effective to sue at all. In such a scenario big corporate actors will know that they can do bad acts as long as they are minor enough that no individual rational actor woudl actually go through the effort or expense to seek redress.

It is really never about the recovery by the plaintiff class per se - its a system so that big companies cannot screw you in little ways and be safe in the knowledge that they will never be called to account. It is a legal punishment system, really, not remuneration. Think of it as a private police force or bounty hunter system where minor issues are sorted out without major government action nort without the people really having to do much.

HotWingConspiracy: 95629: It really is unfortunate how tied into iTunes that ipods/iphones/etc are.

I used to have an iPod Classic but iTunes was so damn slow, bloated, and generally worthless that I just gave up with it.

I'd really like to buy an iPhone, but instead went with an Android solely for the reason of not wanting to deal with iTunes again. I can't be the only one.

You aren't, I'm in the same boat and loving my Galaxy 2.

I stopped buying products from Apple after the IIGS.

I never wanted to get involved with iTunes and to this day that's the main reason I continue to avoid their overpriced, locked down devices.

// But I'm a pragmatist and realize that there are more stupid people than smart ones so I do own AAPL stock...

Earpj: Ok. Question...How do I add music from my Windows media player thingy to my iTunes? I just got my son a new (to him) iPod from a pawn shop, and most of my songs aren't in iTunes on this computer. Home Sharing isn't working, I can't figure it out.

You drag all the songs from wherever they are now into iTunes, after making sure iTunes is set to copy and organize content.

I've been using Winamp to update my iPod for years now...

Carth: Theaetetus: vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

vodka: ...and you never actually get much of anything from a class action. The lawyers and legal system get pretty much everything. It's totally farked up.

"Waaaaa, I don't get millions of dollars for free without doing anything when my damages are so inconsequential that I didn't even know I had cause for a suit! That's unfaaaaaaaair!"

Why shouldn't class actions suits be opt-in? I really don't know enough about them to have a strong opinion.

Because then the effort to contact individuals for the class and get them to sign a legal document in exchange for a potential dollar or two of damages would take so much time and money that it wouldn't be worth it for the lawyers, and as a result, the class action suits would never be brought... and the company would get away with whatever they did.

The problem is, too many people think of class action suits the same as individual suits - people were damaged, they're owed millions in compensation, but somehow these sleazy lawyers take all that money and those damaged people only get a few pennies or a coupon, and that's unfair.

But that's not how class action suits work... The people are owed millions collectively, but each may only be owed that dollar or two. Would you go pay a lawyer a $50k retainer and take several days off work for a dollar? Of course not. No one would.

But, that means that a company can skim a little bit from millions of people and make a huge profit, Superman III-style. If I'm Bank of America and I charge every customer an extra $5 in ATM fees, maybe 1 in 1 million will complain. Heck, I'll even give them their $5 refund to shut up, but I don't have to, because what are they going to do... sue me? Ha!
But if I do this to every one of my 100 million customers, I just fraudulently skimmed half a billion dollars.

So what stops me? The class action suit. If some group of lawyers can prove that I skimmed that money and force me to pay it back, potentially with huge punitive damages, I won't do it again. $5 to one customer isn't even a slap on the wrist... $800 million in a class action suit is a huge penalty. And even if the lawyers pocket half of that for their time and trouble*, the customers get paid back $4 that they never knew they lost, and the bank won't skim from them again the following year.

But, abolish class action suits, make them opt-in, etc., and none of that happens, and the company gets away with whatever they want, as long as they ensure that they don't skim too much from any one individual.

A class action suit is like being a private attorney general. It's not about compensating the wronged, but about punishing the company for doing wrong.

*bear in mind that the lawyers are paying all fees, court costs, discovery costs, rent for their offices, salaries for their IT guy and assistants, etc., usually for years in these cases before they get paid back... and they only get paid back for a win. So, it's a huge multi-tens of millions gamble, over the course of years, at a very high risk... with the potential for a great return, which is why they do it.

Earpj: Kar98:
You drag all the songs from wherever they are now into iTunes, after making sure iTunes is set to copy and organize content.

I tried that. It's not working. Maybe I don't have iTunes set up correctly...I'm gonna mess with it again. Maybe I can figure it out.

What format is it? I don't think fruit-products allow windows music files to play on them.

Theaetetus: Carth: Theaetetus: vodka: I farking HATE that class action lawsuits can throw you into a suit without you doing anything at all. Then very often you don't even know you're in it because the only contact they make is via some old email address or old physical address . Even if they get the right address there is no guarantee you actually got it because they don't serve the documentation in a legally provable way.

If you're in a class action it completely blocks you from ever personally bringing suit for damages or whatever. What a farking scam.

vodka: ...and you never actually get much of anything from a class action. The lawyers and legal system get pretty much everything. It's totally farked up.

"Waaaaa, I don't get millions of dollars for free without doing anything when my damages are so inconsequential that I didn't even know I had cause for a suit! That's unfaaaaaaaair!"

Why shouldn't class actions suits be opt-in? I really don't know enough about them to have a strong opinion.

Because then the effort to contact individuals for the class and get them to sign a legal document in exchange for a potential dollar or two of damages would take so much time and money that it wouldn't be worth it for the lawyers, and as a result, the class action suits would never be brought... and the company would get away with whatever they did.

The problem is, too many people think of class action suits the same as individual suits - people were damaged, they're owed millions in compensation, but somehow these sleazy lawyers take all that money and those damaged people only get a few pennies or a coupon, and that's unfair.

But that's not how class action suits work... The people are owed millions collectively, but each may only be owed that dollar or two. Would you go pay a lawyer a $50k retainer and take several days off work for a dollar? Of course not. No one would.

But, that means that a company can skim a little bit from millions of people and make a huge profit, ...

Thank you. I was thinking a Lawyer just just pay to take out a full page ad in newspapers to sign up plaintiffs (since people always go on about how the laywers make so much with these suits) I didn't think of it as a way to control corporations.

Carth: Thank you. I was thinking a Lawyer just just pay to take out a full page ad in newspapers to sign up plaintiffs (since people always go on about how the laywers make so much with these suits) I didn't think of it as a way to control corporations.

Class actions only make sense as a way to incentivize lawyers to keep corporations in line. That's why i love it when people who are generally anti-corporatist get their panties in a bunch of class action suits, because mean lawyers made money and all i got was a 2 dollar coupon. Look at who hates class action suits - its generally those representatives in congress who are most in the pockets of big business.

Somehow, I think that if a court actually agrees to hear this case, the plaintiffs will lose. iPod and iTunes is proprietary hardware/software solution. The EUA is pretty clear about this. Apple is not required to make it compatible with other solutions unless they choose to. The lawyers are hoping that Apple will just consider the suit a nuisance and settle. That way, they get to pocket a few million, while the class members get something like $1.85 or an iTunes store credit that'll be just enough to buy a couple of songs.

I had a 1st-gen iPod Shuffle. It worked OK until one day it suddenly didn't. iTunes couldn't recover it, there was no paperclip-hole to reset it, and the local store told me that I was SOL (but did offer to sell me a new model). A couple of months after I trashed it and picked up a cheap Creative MP3 player, Apple quietly released a tool which could reset shuffles in that condition.

So I guess I'm suing Apple, but I really don't give a shiat about the $0.02 coupon that might come out of this class action suit. I'd rather let Apple keep all the money than help some rich lawyers get even richer.

JackieRabbit: Somehow, I think that if a court actually agrees to hear this case, the plaintiffs will lose. iPod and iTunes is proprietary hardware/software solution. The EUA is pretty clear about this. Apple is not required to make it compatible with other solutions unless they choose to.

So, Apple should win and the plaintiffs aren't entitled to any compensation.

The lawyers are hoping that Apple will just consider the suit a nuisance and settle. That way, they get to pocket a few million, while the class members get something like $1.85 or an iTunes store credit that'll be just enough to buy a couple of songs.

So, it's unfair that the plaintiffs don't get very much compensation.

ಠ_ಠ