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(Think Progress)   The grandson of a Mormon Polygamist is going to run on "defending traditional marriage"   (thinkprogress.org) divider line 180
    More: Stupid, Ed Gillespie, Daily Rundown, Chuck Todd, Republican National Committee Chairman, Mitt Romney, same-sex couples, same-sex marriages  
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1496 clicks; posted to Politics » on 10 May 2012 at 3:32 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-10 12:00:34 PM  
Well he would know the pitfalls and disadvantages of a non-traditional marriage.
 
2012-05-10 12:10:12 PM  

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Well he would know the pitfalls and disadvantages of a non-traditional marriage.


A polygamous marriage has a lot more tradition behind it than a monogamous one.

In fact, two people (man and woman, even) getting married for love, to form a partnership, is fairly recent and radical. Non-traditional, even.
 
2012-05-10 12:11:24 PM  
Yeah, "run on" that because there aren't any other more pressing issues with this country than the homos. That's the biggest problem we have.
 
2012-05-10 12:14:39 PM  
So what? My grandfather was an barely literate railroad worker. That doesn't say jack shiat about me.

A more damning claim for Romney: "Human being in 2012 is opposed to marriage equality, for no damn reason anyone can figure out".
 
2012-05-10 12:16:27 PM  
To be fair "grandson of high ranking Nazi official is going to run on equality and human rights" isn't an oxymoron. You aren't your grandfather.
 
2012-05-10 12:18:17 PM  

tallguywithglasseson: The Stealth Hippopotamus: Well he would know the pitfalls and disadvantages of a non-traditional marriage.

A polygamous marriage has a lot more tradition behind it than a monogamous one.

In fact, two people (man and woman, even) getting married for love, to form a partnership, is fairly recent and radical. Non-traditional, even.


Companionate marriages have been around for a while, but certainly in the minority, until at least fairly recently and in only some parts of the country.
 
2012-05-10 12:18:37 PM  

what_now: A more damning claim for Romney: "Human being in 2012 is opposed to marriage equality, for no damn reason anyone can figure out".


The Republicans got tired of hating women, so decided to start hating the gays for a while. They wanted to be fair to all, and programmed some anti-gay stuff into the Romney bot.
 
2012-05-10 12:27:44 PM  
Getting married for the reasons social conservatives force on you is the most traditional of marriages, as social conservatives get to arbitrarily decide what is and isn't considered "traditional"
 
2012-05-10 12:29:23 PM  
My great grandfather was a Klansman. And I only wear sheets for toga parties.
 
2012-05-10 12:40:02 PM  
i870.photobucket.com
 
2012-05-10 12:40:54 PM  

what_now: So what? My grandfather was an barely literate railroad worker. That doesn't say jack shiat about me.

A more damning claim for Romney: "Human being in 2012 is opposed to marriage equality, for no damn reason anyone can figure out".


This. I'm certainly not going to hold anyone accountable for the actions of their forebears
 
2012-05-10 12:42:06 PM  
Mitt can oppose things that his grandparents supported. He's allowed.

He's also a piece of shiat.
 
2012-05-10 12:43:26 PM  

Quasar: To be fair "grandson of high ranking Nazi official is going to run on equality and human rights" isn't an oxymoron. You aren't your grandfather.


It would be an apt comparison if the Nazi grandson was running on the "tradition in the Nazi party of equality and human rights"
 
2012-05-10 12:45:52 PM  

ArkAngel: what_now: So what? My grandfather was an barely literate railroad worker. That doesn't say jack shiat about me.

A more damning claim for Romney: "Human being in 2012 is opposed to marriage equality, for no damn reason anyone can figure out".

This. I'm certainly not going to hold anyone accountable for the actions of their forebears


Yeah but he's still a Mormon isn't he? Meaning he didn't consider black people to be regular humans until the late 1970s when he was told God changed his mind.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-05-10 12:56:29 PM  

Quasar: To be fair "grandson of high ranking Nazi official is going to run on equality and human rights" isn't an oxymoron. You aren't your grandfather.


Yeah, it's not like he is a Mormon or anything.
 
2012-05-10 12:59:10 PM  

Mugato: Yeah but he's still a Mormon isn't he? Meaning he didn't consider black people to be regular humans until the late 1970s when he was told God changed his mind.


that is a reasonable thing to ask. No one ever will, but it would be reasonable.

"Governor Romney, when you were doing your mission work in France to avoid the Vietnam War, did you consider place people human beings or the evil sons of Ham like your religion dictated at the time?"
 
2012-05-10 12:59:13 PM  

vpb: Quasar: To be fair "grandson of high ranking Nazi official is going to run on equality and human rights" isn't an oxymoron. You aren't your grandfather.

Yeah, it's not like he is a Mormon or anything.


I must have missed seeing all his other wives hiding behind Ann.
 
2012-05-10 01:00:19 PM  

what_now: A more damning claim for Romney: "Human being in 2012 is opposed to marriage equality, for no damn reason anyone can figure out".


How about: "Republican absolutely against the right of states to self government when it comes to marriage, for no damn reason anyone can figure out."
 
2012-05-10 01:06:42 PM  

Mugato: Yeah, "run on" that because there aren't any other more pressing issues with this country than the homos. That's the biggest problem we have.


When I was a scared, closeted teenager, I never dreamed that my lifestyle would be more important than the economy and national security.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-05-10 01:08:28 PM  

Quasar: vpb: Quasar: To be fair "grandson of high ranking Nazi official is going to run on equality and human rights" isn't an oxymoron. You aren't your grandfather.

Yeah, it's not like he is a Mormon or anything.

I must have missed seeing all his other wives hiding behind Ann.


Right, and since since most gays aren't married that means that they are against gay marriage. Interesting logic you have there.
 
2012-05-10 01:14:32 PM  
I don't care what his grandfather did.
Obama's dad was an asshole and I'm sure Obama would tell you that himself. So what?
 
2012-05-10 01:17:36 PM  

vpb: Right, and since since most gays aren't married that means that they are against gay marriage. Interesting logic you have there.


Perhaps I am ignorant of Mormonism, but are you automatically a Polygamist simply by virtue of being of that faith?
 
2012-05-10 01:19:52 PM  

what_now: Mugato: Yeah but he's still a Mormon isn't he? Meaning he didn't consider black people to be regular humans until the late 1970s when he was told God changed his mind.

that is a reasonable thing to ask. No one ever will, but it would be reasonable.

"Governor Romney, when you were doing your mission work in France to avoid the Vietnam War, did you consider place people human beings or the evil sons of Ham like your religion dictated at the time?"



How cute. The local anti-Mormon bigot brigade are pretending to be 'experts' together now. Maybe you two should get married.
 
2012-05-10 01:21:07 PM  

Quasar: vpb: Right, and since since most gays aren't married that means that they are against gay marriage. Interesting logic you have there.

Perhaps I am ignorant of Mormonism, but are you automatically a Polygamist simply by virtue of being of that faith?


Unless they've taken back all the stuff about plural Celestial Marriages, then yeah.
 
2012-05-10 01:21:39 PM  

Quasar: Perhaps I am ignorant of Mormonism, but are you automatically a Polygamist simply by virtue of being of that faith?


If you're asking serious historical/theological questions about Latter-Day Saints and the Restorationist tradition, you've come to wrong place. If you're trolling, then by all means troll away.
 
2012-05-10 01:22:36 PM  

Theaetetus: Unless they've taken back all the stuff about plural Celestial Marriages, then yeah.


Please, tell us all you know about the Woodruff Manifesto and the Smoot hearings. I'm sure you'll dazzle us all with your brilliance.
 
2012-05-10 01:25:09 PM  

Somacandra: anti-Mormon bigot brigade


1) Did Mitt Romney use his status as a Mormon missionary to avoid service in Vietnam, yes or no?
2) Was the official policy of the Mormon church discriminatory toward black people until the 1970s, yes or no?
 
2012-05-10 01:26:04 PM  

Somacandra: Quasar: Perhaps I am ignorant of Mormonism, but are you automatically a Polygamist simply by virtue of being of that faith?

If you're asking serious historical/theological questions about Latter-Day Saints and the Restorationist tradition, you've come to wrong place. If you're trolling, then by all means troll away.


I'm seriously asking. I assumed that you're not actually a polygamist unless you seek or partake in it.
 
2012-05-10 01:31:03 PM  

Quasar: Somacandra: Quasar: Perhaps I am ignorant of Mormonism, but are you automatically a Polygamist simply by virtue of being of that faith?

If you're asking serious historical/theological questions about Latter-Day Saints and the Restorationist tradition, you've come to wrong place. If you're trolling, then by all means troll away.

I'm seriously asking. I assumed that you're not actually a polygamist unless you seek or partake in it.


No you are not automatically a polygamist and most modern day Mormons shun the practice and are often embarrassed about it. As my former Mormon boss told me "Some of our forebears weren't right in the head."
 
2012-05-10 01:33:06 PM  

Somacandra: Theaetetus: Unless they've taken back all the stuff about plural Celestial Marriages, then yeah.

Please, tell us all you know about the Woodruff Manifesto and the Smoot hearings. I'm sure you'll dazzle us all with your brilliance.


Apparently "Congressional Hearings" now form part of the dogma of your church?

"And lo, the esteemed representative from Nebraska stood at the Lord's podium and spake, 'thou shalt name thy post office after thy most Reverend J.C. Wade,' and lo, all those in favor spake aye."
 
2012-05-10 01:38:13 PM  
Also, is it just me, or does Woodruff's official declaration not actually say anything about plural celestial marriage, but rather just his willingness to submit to "laws [that] have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriages, which laws have been pronounced constitutional by the court of last resort"?

Consider, if my religion taught cannibalism as being a holy sacrament, and I issued an "official declaration" that "because Congress has passed laws forbidding cannibalism, I shall submit to such laws," does that really mean that it's no longer a holy sacrament in my religion? Or does it just mean that I'll grudgingly refrain from practicing it, while still teaching that it as a holy doctrine?
 
2012-05-10 01:42:22 PM  
Obama is a Protestant Christian. Clearly he hates homosexuals and supports North Carolina's ban on homosexual marriage, as well as the more misogynistic policies advocated by other Protestant Christians.

This thread has told me that if someone is a member of a faith, they believe wholeheartedly every single aspect of that faith.

Now, isn't it offensive that President Obama, hates homosexuals and women so much?
 
2012-05-10 01:51:31 PM  
Is any of this bullsh*t going to fix our tax code and economic problems?
 
2012-05-10 01:55:36 PM  

NewportBarGuy: Is any of this bullsh*t going to fix our tax code and economic problems?


Again, I want you to remember how much cash MA has been making in the gay marriage business.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-05-10 01:55:43 PM  

Aarontology: Obama is a Protestant Christian. Clearly he hates homosexuals and supports North Carolina's ban on homosexual marriage, as well as the more misogynistic policies advocated by other Protestant Christians.

This thread has told me that if someone is a member of a faith, they believe wholeheartedly every single aspect of that faith.

Now, isn't it offensive that President Obama, hates homosexuals and women so much?


Wow, that's ignorant. So whatever rednecks do becomes part of Protestantism?

Link
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-05-10 01:57:19 PM  

NewportBarGuy: Is any of this bullsh*t going to fix our tax code and economic problems?


Isn't the point of these red herring issues to avoid that?
 
2012-05-10 01:57:29 PM  

vpb: Wow, that's ignorant. So whatever rednecks do becomes part of Protestantism?


They are Protestant Christians. Obama is a Protestant Christian. Therefore, according to the logic expressed in this thread, Obama agrees with everything they do in the name of their faith.

Why the different standards?
 
2012-05-10 01:58:33 PM  
I'm not going to trash Romney for his Mormonism or what his grandfather believed/practiced.

There are plenty of more germane things to trash Romney about without having to muck about in his religion.
 
2012-05-10 02:00:20 PM  
I mean, we can all agree that Christianity (particularly Protestant Christianity) places a huge emphasis on the condemnation of homosexuality as outlined in some passages from the Bible correct?

Clearly, President Obama believes that, seeing as he's a Protestant Christian and has to believe every single aspect of that faith.
 
2012-05-10 02:02:46 PM  

what_now: Again, I want you to remember how much cash MA has been making in the gay marriage business.


The gays are in high tax brackets. I love them and wish more would move here to pay our property taxes!

vpb: Isn't the point of these red herring issues to avoid that?


Yeah, I'm just sick of it. The news gets tired of talking about actual important things. "OMG THE PRESIDENT LOVES THE COCK!" We now have our narrative for the next 7 days or until they get bored and change the topic again.

America is a 16-year-old girl. We put everything off until the last minute and scream at the top of our lungs when asked if we've done our homework yet.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-05-10 02:03:56 PM  

Somacandra: Theaetetus: Unless they've taken back all the stuff about plural Celestial Marriages, then yeah.

Please, tell us all you know about the Woodruff Manifesto and the Smoot hearings. I'm sure you'll dazzle us all with your brilliance.


You have a point. Christians selectively ignore parts of Christianity, so why can't Mormons? Maybe that Joseph Smith guy wasn't right in the head.
 
2012-05-10 02:04:11 PM  

NewportBarGuy: pay our property taxes!


I would also hope that our local high school theater production would improve.
 
2012-05-10 02:09:53 PM  
So what, my grandfather was a racist, alcoholic, Chicago cop. Does that mean I can't speak out against racism?
 
2012-05-10 02:21:37 PM  

downstairs: So what, my grandfather was a racist, alcoholic, Chicago cop. Does that mean I can't speak out against racism?


No, but it means you shouldn't be defending your tolerance by appealing to the tradition of tolerance among Chicago cops.
 
2012-05-10 02:23:10 PM  
I posted I posted this little rant before, but I think I'll cut-and-paste it here since it strikes at an issue near and dear to Mittens' heart. When I first wrote this little rant and posted it on Fark, it was picked up by some Mormon websites, who did not view or comment on it too favorably. Anyway:

I have a proposal which I would think any Prop 8 supporter would find to be legally permissible, since it relies on their own arguments. My proposal is this: I hereby propose an amendment to the Constitution invalidating Mormon marriages.

As polygamists for decades (even though they no longer engage in polygamy and now want to be treated as "normal" people), Mormons historically have shown a complete disregard for the traditional marriage of one man and one woman. Plus, I gotta say--and I hope this doesn't sound bigoted--Mormons as a group make me uncomfortable, and I don't share their values or approve of their lifestyle choices. For example, they're always pumping out housefuls of kids (an environmentally irresponsible practice), riding around on bikes while wearing white dress shirts and black ties and knocking on my door to disturb me while I'm relaxing at home, all for the purpose of trying to push a copy of the Book of Mormon on me, wearing funny but unAmerican sacred underwear, never drinking coffee or booze like normal Americans do, posthumously baptizing Holocaust victims as Mormons against their descendants' will, etc. These are not traditional American values, and I do not approve of these people profaning my traditional marriage by claiming to be married like normal people. Not to mention that these Mormons are always pushing their Mormon agenda on the rest of us and trying to recruit others--including even impressionable young children, shamefully enough--to share their Mormon lifestyle choice.

Of course, as the biggest backers of Prop 8 in California, Mormons have signaled to the world that it's acceptable for me to openly advocate discrimination against groups who don't share my personal values and beliefs, and whose lifestyles I find objectionable or shameful. Even the most prominent Mormon in America, Mitt Romney, obviously agrees with this. Given their historical disregard for traditional marriage, I feel this is a cause we should all get behind. I mean, what if our schools were required to teach kids that Mormons used engage in polygamy--and that in fact some offshoot Mormon groups still do engage in polygamy? Do we want our schools teaching our kids that it's OK or "normal" to have multiple spouses? If we legitimize Mormon marriages, then wouldn't other non-Mormon churches--churches that reject Mormonism and believe it to be contrary to the teachings of their own religion--be forced to perform Mormon-on-Mormon (or Mormon-on-Mormon-on-Mormon?) two-person or polygamous marriage ceremonies, out of fear that they could be sued if they refuse to do so (just as some Mormons claimed that their church would be forced to perform gay marriages if same-sex marriage were legalized)?

Protect traditional marriage--ban Mormon-on-Mormon marriage. Of course, this doesn't discriminate against Mormons in any way, because like all other heterosexuals, they still will have the right to marry anybody they want, just as long as it's not another Mormon. If they really want to live with another Mormon, of course, they can live in sin as domestic partners--just don't confuse that sort of thing with traditional marriage.
 
2012-05-10 02:23:30 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: I'm not going to trash Romney for his Mormonism or what his grandfather believed/practiced.

There are plenty of more germane things to trash Romney about without having to muck about in his religion.


Even when his defense of marriage is rooted in his religion?

Interesting.
 
2012-05-10 02:23:33 PM  
"I'm going to stay focused on jobs," Boehner replied, before abruptly leaving the stage.

And by jobs, he means....?
 
2012-05-10 02:24:32 PM  

DamnYankees: downstairs: So what, my grandfather was a racist, alcoholic, Chicago cop. Does that mean I can't speak out against racism?

No, but it means you shouldn't be defending your tolerance by appealing to the tradition of tolerance among Chicago cops.


Thank god SOMEBODY gets it.
 
2012-05-10 02:25:52 PM  

Endrick: "I'm going to stay focused on jobs," Boehner replied, before abruptly leaving the stage.

And by jobs, he means....?


Defunding Planned Parenthood, doubling student loan rates, and taking away women's rights. Obviously.
 
2012-05-10 02:27:45 PM  

what_now: So what? My grandfather was an barely literate railroad worker. That doesn't say jack shiat about me.

A more damning claim for Romney: "Human being in 2012 is opposed to marriage equality, for no damn reason anyone can figure out".


img13.imageshack.us
 
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