oooh...

I can't wait to watch some derpers' heads assplode.

Vice First Lady Biden...it has a nice ring to it.

Tonight 5 minutes after the speech: A republican and his third wife flip out about how Obama is destroying the sanctity of marriage

LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote

I just can't hate Biden. He just says what he thinks. He's lost that filter or parking brake that younger people have. He reminds me of my grandmother shouting "Will you look at that woman's ugly clothes" to me within earshot of the woman she was talking about.

The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?

I really hope this non-issue doesn't torpedo Obama's campaign. Why the heck would gay folks anybody want to live in North Carolina anyways? Who cares what they do? Move to a good state where people have their priorities in order.

Sin_City_Superhero: Obama just wants to marry a U.S. citizen so he can stay in the country.

0/10

unless that's snark. still can't tell

Wow. First liberal thing he has done all term.

Good for Mr President Obama.

Carth: Tonight 5 minutes after the speech: A republican and his third wife flip out about how Obama is destroying the sanctity of marriage

I'll have the popcorn ready.

That Biden is one smooth dude.

Biden is getting the car ready for the honeymoon

I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...

hope he clarifies "evolving" by meaning that he was waiting to see if the US was becoming a little more compassionate and progressive toward human rights. Perhaps he's going to tip the scales a bit...

Sin_City_Superhero: Obama just wants to marry a U.S. citizen so he can stay in the country.

Speaking as the liberalest liberal that ever liberaled...
That's funny right there.

kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote

He's smarter than that. He must have information that this is good for him to do now. This administration is really excellent at timing.

The_Sponge: It's not flip-flopping when Obama does it.

it's called flip-flolving.

Tonight 5 minutes after the speech: A republican and his third wife flip out about how Obama is destroying the sanctity of marriage

/golf clap

ModernPrimitive01: The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?

Because putting equality up to popular vote is misguided.
States not not have a right to permit mob rule and oppress minorities.
We've been down this road before.

Wow, he's finally decided to embrace equality for everyone, four years after he shied away from saying anything about Prop 8 during the 2008 election because it wasn't politically opportunistic. He's also finally making the rounds on colleges to get the young vote after he spent 4 years doing absolutely nothing to either help kids get to college, or afford it.

This is all just grandstanding for the upcoming election. Forgive me for not being impressed.

I'd rather have vote for a crusty old, piece of shiat Republican that tells it like they think it is than vote back in a pandering asshole like Obama. His thoughts on gays are "evolving" , yeah, that's not a cop out. He can kiss the ass of the gays, then turn around to the bible thumpers and say "welllllllll, I'm not totally convinced, I can see their point of view, but I haven't really decided, so I'm still on your side"

ModernPrimitive01: The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?


For it to be a states rights issue DOMA would have to be repealed. As long as it is on the books there is a federal law overriding states ability to grant marriage benefits.

Oh boy. I really hope this doesn't backfire for him, although I bet it'll cost him at least NC and VA. Either way, good on him for doing this.

kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote


Well, you're certainly a master at reading polls. The people who will hate him for this already hate him, and they were coming out to vote against him already. This move is designed to recapture his momentum with the youth, a demographic he desperately needs. Disillusionment among young voters is something the GOP badly needs. It becomes harder to claim that Obama is the same old same old when he makes such a radical move (no president nor major presidential candidate has ever taken such a step.

kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote

How? The rabid right that oppose gay marriage won't vote for him anyway. Most Democrats support him, and this may be enough to sway the hardcore liberals to come back to the fold.

So that leaves Independents. And poll after poll show at best, indifference to the issue at best. All Obama has to say is, "I personally support gay marriage, but it is up to states at this time to decide the issue."

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...

Until enough like you make some noise you all get to be lumped together.

The_Sponge: Janusdog: I just can't hate Biden.


I can. That doofus is proud of the fact that he voted for the 1994 "assault weapons" ban.

Some of you gun guys give me the willies, so that's not a convincing argument.

And before you yell at me, I actually do shoot, and had to get a FOID card when I lived in Chicago. I can only go so far with gun 'rights' before I think people start sounding like David Koresh.

ModernPrimitive01: The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?

Romney wants a federal constitutional amendment banning gay marriage. Why does Romney hate state's rights?

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.


Apparently the "good people of NC" had something better to do yesterday than vote?

bump: most of us are rational, thinking human beings.

If that's true, why didn't you guys vote?

I understand that Obama needs to get re-elected to get things done, he is a politician just like all the others and putting up a fight over the gay marriage issue in a potentially close race could result in an decidedly unfriendly-to-gays administration.

But the WH is a huge bully pulpit that could be used to educate the populace in this issue that is close to a tipping point anyways, it might be time to minorities that civil rights are for *everyone*. It really bugs me knowing that blacks supported Prop 8 in California, how soon we forget the struggle.

I may just sign up to TF again to see all the herpa-derp submissions following this from the 4000 "credible" news sites retarded blogs spinning this to oblivion.

Janusdog: He's smarter than that. He must have information that this is good for him to do now. This administration is really excellent at timing.

It seems like it's early enough to make a difference in the election, but not so last second that some of the undecideds will make a rash decision and make this the single issue they're voting about.

Vice President Joebama, then?

It's got a nice ring to it.

He's obviously trying to bait the teatards into a frenzy, thereby miring Romney in derp and making GOP congressional candidates look less attractive. It's a big gamble.

Just follow this plan and you will be ok Obama.

Marriage is a religious institution. If a religion refuses to marry a couple based on their race/sexual orientation/whatever, that is their prerogative. However, everyone should have the same rights that a marriage entails as anyone else.

It's that farking simple and I do not know why more people do no see it.

Gay people already have the right to enter into marriage with someone of the opposite sex, just like everyone else.

/Yes, that's a real conservative argument.

Jim.Casy: I really hope this non-issue doesn't torpedo Obama's campaign. Why the heck would gay folks anybody want to live in North Carolina anyways? Who cares what they do? Move to a good state where people have their priorities in order.

Yes, move to Chicago where the county you will live in is $140 Billion in debt and the state is in another $120 Billion in debt. Illinois needs 1/3 of Obama's Stimulus Package just to get to $0 in debt.

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...

That doesn't work for the good people in Arizona.
That doesn't work for the good people in Texas.
That doesn't work for the good people in Fl-- okay, they don't have an excuse.

We accept you. We accept you. One of us. One of us!

colon_pow: The_Sponge: It's not flip-flopping when Obama does it.

it's called flip-flolving.

I'm not sure that this fairly counts as a flip-flop, but Obama hasn't been clear on this issue, and that is a justifiable charge against him.

You know how I know Obama's just doing this for political reasons? Because people's view don't "evolve". Evolutionism has been debunked. People's views are Created through their connection to the Divine.

thurstonxhowell: bump: most of us are rational, thinking human beings.

If that's true, why didn't you guys vote?

A lot of them are under 18. Give it a few years and hopefully this stupid thing will be overturned.

colon_pow: The_Sponge: It's not flip-flopping when Obama does it.

it's called flip-flolving.

Why Would I Read the Article: he spent 4 years doing absolutely nothing to either help kids get to college, or afford it.

My federal direct student loan for grad school and my sister's continued health insurance would strongly disagree.

Cats and Dogs

/Mass Hysteria

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...

Dude, California voted for ban gay marriage a few years ago. Califreakenfornia. Don't worry.

It should be a state matter

Obama is a politician, so he's not going to announce major policy changes during an election cycle unless it involves lowering taxes or starting a war.

I bet he comes out against gay marriage!

But seriously, does anyone want to venture into one of the forums where the "Obama is secretly gay" conspiracy theorists hang out? I'm curious about how they're taking this news.

Quasar: Obama: *unzips pants*
Biden: That is a big f*ckin' deal.


I just about spit water all over my screen. Well done

keytronic: kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote


Well, you're certainly a master at reading polls. The people who will hate him for this already hate him, and they were coming out to vote against him already. This move is designed to recapture his momentum with the youth, a demographic he desperately needs. Disillusionment among young voters is something the GOP badly needs. It becomes harder to claim that Obama is the same old same old when he makes such a radical move (no president nor major presidential candidate has ever taken such a step.

Exactly. Remember this is the President that was willing to shut the government down over Planned Parenthood. It's not that he's a principled guy (sometimes I have my doubts). Most women who care about the GOP assault on women's rights appreciated it and will not forget about that come November.

Personally I see this as a low risk, low reward move in terms of the November election. People that feel that strongly about gay marriage one way or another already had their minds made up about who they were or weren't going to vote for in November.

But otherwise it's pure farking win across the board. Good for him.

Don't forget Obama already ended "Dont ask, dont tell" because he thought it was the stupidest thing ever. I'm pretty sure people already suspect he is pro gay rights...I'm not so sure it would be suicide for reelection like some people are saying.

Sigh, why not before the NC deal?

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...

Nope. Too late. Based on your votes you are not embarrassed. Only 13 farking percent of your registered voters voted to stop this horrible amendment. So you will be lumped in with the homophobic mouth breathers who celebrate this kind of thing.

Obama will probably give some carefully crafted wording that is sympathetic towards gay marriage but stop short of actually endorsing it.

Remember folks, there are a lot of stupid bigoted right wingers who with tribalist thinking honestly believe that "The only people who support gay rights are gays".

As subby demonstrates actual endorsement would lead many of those mouth breathers to add "Obama is secretly gay" to their basket of crazy.

Hmm... Could fire up his progressive and youth base, who've been somewhat apathetic lately. I'm totally in favor of marriage equality, but I hope this doesn't backfire.

That newsflash had 'The Onion' written all over it.

The_Sponge: Aarontology: Mitt Romney signed an assault weapons ban when he was governor.

The most restrictive in the country, as I recall.


But it would be fair to say that he's changed his views considering that he recently spoke an an NRA gathering. And I doubt he would say that he's proud of that moment now.

Is that flip-flopping? You be the judge. But if it is, isn't Obama a flip flopper as well?

So Obama has flip flopped on one issue for the better. Romney has flopped on almost every issue for the worse.

You should go with that.

If he does and he loses the election because of it, the US deserves everything it gets after that. Mitt Romney and the current GOP will be our punishment for the majority of our population being immoral, bigoted, hypocritical douchebags.

I'm torn. Do I want him to do the right thing, or win and then do the right thing? I guess it doesn't really matter to me so long as he does the right thing.
Then again, if there are a lot of terminally ill gays that really really need to be married now, then I say do it.

Why the hell would you care if a dude wants to marry a dude, or a chick and chick? "It's gross" was the consensus from the guys at work when it came up awhile back. As a straight male I'd consider the act of gay guy sex pretty gross, lesbians different story. However, the common sense part of me says, so what? He wants to have gross gay sex with his husband all night, bombs away. She wants to strap on a rigid plastic instrument and plow away at her wifes vaginal cavity, have at it. Why shouldnt anybody be allowed to marry because of the different holes they beat on at night?

/If you wanna ruin your life with marriage gay people, go for it

AdolfOliverPanties: If he announces his support of SSM it will be one of the politically bravest things an up-for-reelection POTUS has ever done. It could really backfire with the religious blacks who voted for him in 2008.

I sound like Rick Romero.

Do you think it could help sway blacks in general though? Not to paint with broad strokes, but he's clearly a popular figure in America's black community. Maybe some of them will be more apt to support it if he clearly comes out in favor.

AdolfOliverPanties: If he announces his support of SSM it will be one of the politically bravest things an up-for-reelection POTUS has ever done. It could really backfire with the religious blacks who voted for him in 2008.

I sound like Rick Romero.

At the same time, Barack Obama is probably the only politician who can really talk to the black community about same-sex marriage, why it's important that the state recognize it, and the similarities to the civil rights struggle.

I hope so. Civil rights should be paramount

Dusk-You-n-Me: Why Would I Read the Article: He's also finally making the rounds on colleges to get the young vote after he spent 4 years doing absolutely nothing to either help kids get to college, or afford it.

Other than 2010 student loan reform which removed banks as a middle man saving the government about $68B over 10 years which will be put right back into providing more student loans, sure, he's done nothing.

That doesn't help the substantial number of graduates with five and six figure loans on their backs. I thought we were supposed to get some kind of forgiveness for working in nonprofits? I've got a 15 year nonprofit career at this point and I'd starve to death if I wasn't married.

fracto73: ModernPrimitive01: The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?


For it to be a states rights issue DOMA would have to be repealed. As long as it is on the books there is a federal law overriding states ability to grant marriage benefits.

Technically, DOMA doesn't prevent states from recognizing same-sex marriage. It just says that states don't have to recognize same sex marriages from another state. So it's not really overriding states' rights.

It is, however, overriding the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution, which should show you something about all these "Constitutional literalists" on the right. That it hasn't been struck down yet is a travesty.

physt: Sin_City_Superhero: Obama just wants to marry a U.S. citizen so he can stay in the country.

Speaking as the liberalest liberal that ever liberaled...
That's funny right there.

Yep. I was going to read through the whole thread to see if anyone had commented yet, but then I realized that was an impossibility. So I'll just say this.

Until enough like you make some noise you all get to be lumped together.

Vote!

... that's the frustrating part... I did (and so did 95% of the folks I know - and a vast majority of them voted against.) It's like the 80s when Jesse Helms kept getting re-elected... (actually, I'm still wondering how that happened for so long...)

When Obama endorses Gay Marriage will the Republicans morph into one huge monster and eat Washington D.C

The Amazing Rando!: Vice President Joebama, then?

It's got a nice ring to it.

The Fox News headline writes itself: The Latest Vice President Joebama Baby Mama Drama.

Then can I gay marriage Michelle? She's sasseh.

The_Sponge: Aarontology: Mitt Romney signed an assault weapons ban when he was governor.

The most restrictive in the country, as I recall.


But it would be fair to say that he's changed his views considering that he recently spoke an an NRA gathering.

LOL

bump: 'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigoted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrassed about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...



Too bad none of you farking voted,

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.
We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings.

You're surely right about some but that fact that this law passed kinda disagrees with the use of the word "most".

At the very least it suggests the rational, thinking human beings didn't bother to turn out to vote in defense of their fellow human beings' civil rights.

Dusk-You-n-Me: D_Evans45: "It's gross" was the consensus from the guys at work when it came up awhile back.

You'll notice when it comes to heterosexual marriage the right talks about love. When it comes to homosexual marriage they focus on sex. It's always about the sex.

In fairness, old people sex and fat people sex is gross too, so we should ban them from getting married.

Great news.

The_Sponge: Janusdog: Some of you gun guys give me the willies, so that's not a convincing argument.


The fact that he was PROUD of restricting our rights isn't a convincing argument? Okay.

If I believed assault weapons had no business for home defense (and I am not sure I do believe they are appropriate for home defense) and voted my beliefs, I would be content and happy with that.

So, yeah. Not convincing.

SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

If you want people to take you seriously you really shouldn't start sentences like that.

Are you implying Obama will be "riding the Acela"?

Funny headline, but that's more than a little too blatant to be anything except politics.

HeartBurnKid: fracto73: ModernPrimitive01: The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?


For it to be a states rights issue DOMA would have to be repealed. As long as it is on the books there is a federal law overriding states ability to grant marriage benefits.

Technically, DOMA doesn't prevent states from recognizing same-sex marriage. It just says that states don't have to recognize same sex marriages from another state. So it's not really overriding states' rights.

It is, however, overriding the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution, which should show you something about all these "Constitutional literalists" on the right. That it hasn't been struck down yet is a travesty.


Isn't it DOMA that prevents legally married people from filing as such on a federal tax return? That has nothing to do with any other state. It is the federal government denying a state issued marriage licence.

If that has nothing to do with DOMA, then I am wrong and you can replace DOMA with what ever law that does this in my original comment.

ongbok: The Civil Engineer: Don't forget Obama already ended "Dont ask, dont tell" because he thought it was the stupidest thing ever. I'm pretty sure people already suspect he is pro gay rights...I'm not so sure it would be suicide for reelection like some people are saying.

And he directed the Justice Department not to defend DOMA in courts. But other than that he has done absolutely 0 for gay rights.

OK, I'll give you that. I suppose many people expected him to do more. Perhaps he is walking on eggshells his first term when it comes to doing things for gay rights. He might be saving some of his plans for his second term?

thurstonxhowell: Why Would I Read the Article: he spent 4 years doing absolutely nothing to either help kids get to college, or afford it.

My federal direct student loan for grad school and my sister's continued health insurance would strongly disagree.

Same here (except for the sister part). Very glad to have the useless middlebanks out of the picture. Also, the edu.gov will want to be repaid, same as anyone, but they're not going to send over hired goons like the bank will.

/Hired goons??

Why Would I Read the Article: Wow, he's finally decided to embrace equality for everyone, four years after he shied away from saying anything about Prop 8 during the 2008 election because it wasn't politically opportunistic. He's also finally making the rounds on colleges to get the young vote after he spent 4 years doing absolutely nothing to either help kids get to college, or afford it.

This is all just grandstanding for the upcoming election. Forgive me for not being impressed.

Statistically just going by polls this could lose hm the election as well. In swing states more voters oppose gay marriage than support. Publicly supporting it takes a bit of political balls. Sure he "should" have supported it in 2008, he would have lost the election over it though.

The interviewer should ask him, as a followup question, what he thinks about politicians who will say anything to get elected.....

The_Sponge: Janusdog: I just can't hate Biden.


I can. That doofus is proud of the fact that he voted for the 1994 "assault weapons" ban.

yea what a doofus it's not like america pretty much kills everyone else in the competition of of gun homicides per year.

Janusdog: I just can't hate Biden. He just says what he thinks. He's lost that filter or parking brake that younger people have. He reminds me of my grandmother shouting "Will you look at that woman's ugly clothes" to me within earshot of the woman she was talking about.

I don't get the hate for the man. From what I've read (I mean, other than derpy blogs, Fox News and Fark Independent^TM posts), he's respected by both sides of the aisle as a legislator his solid foreign policy credentials. Sure he says goofy stuff every now and again, that just makes him human.

Sin_City_Superhero: Obama just wants to marry a U.S. citizen so he can stay in the country.

So much win.

Sbdolan: Sigh, why not before the NC deal?

On the electoral college, the typically non gay friendly places (I'm looking at you Texas) will ALWAYS vote Republican, even if Obama didn't change much from the Bush regime. However Florida, a very gay friendly state, is worth 29 votes and is typically a swing state. It's actually kind of a smart move. The entire bible belt isn't going to vote for Obama, so with one ballsy move, Obama can potentially nab Florida,Pennsylvania and Nevada.

Barack Obama
Born on a Monday
Marry Michelle on a Tuesday
Endorse gays on Wednesday
Divorce Michelle on Thurday
Marry Biden on Friday
Died on Saturday
Buried on Sunday
And that was the end
of Barack Obama

/Sadley, Grundy wouldn't be too terrible fo a republican candidate

Wow. Only a couple decades behind Dick Cheney. I hear in June he's going to learn the pledge of allegiance.

Is saying "Color Me Surprised" a racist statement.

that bosnian sniper: Close2TheEdge: How? The rabid right that oppose gay marriage won't vote for him anyway. Most Democrats support him, and this may be enough to sway the hardcore liberals to come back to the fold.

So that leaves Independents. And poll after poll show at best, indifference to the issue at best. All Obama has to say is, "I personally support gay marriage, but it is up to states at this time to decide the issue."

Yup, Obama has very little to lose from this move if he takes it. The virulently right is already going to go to the polls in November; this move isn't going to motivate them to get out the vote any more than they already are. Rather, it may just provoke them to even higher levels of idiocy and trigger a backlash. In the meantime, this move helps to reestablish his credibility with the left and provide additional reason to mobilize in November.

Romney's already failing to court the center in order to placate the right, so Obama has very little reason to not shift leftwards since he's still occupying the center.

Obama is a master at domestic political chess (not so good on the international front). We've forgotten what a politician who takes the longer view looks like. This is what that looks like.

SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

why do you support Romney? Is it because of his stance on the lakes in Michigan in "the parts" or his love for the trees that are the right height?

SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

Yeah he was so close to winning over bigots.

Wow, thanks E2cTek for the month of TF Gift! I've done it for others but that was my first time getting TF gifted in return! Thanks!

What is the political upside? What does he gain over Romney numbers-wise with this move? There has to be some angle...

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most the minority of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...


The majority of voting aged people supported the Hatemendment...until them, own your bigotry.

TommieFunk: Sbdolan: Sigh, why not before the NC deal?

On the electoral college, the typically non gay friendly places (I'm looking at you Texas) will ALWAYS vote Republican, even if Obama didn't change much from the Bush regime. However Florida, a very gay friendly state, is worth 29 votes and is typically a swing state. It's actually kind of a smart move. The entire bible belt isn't going to vote for Obama, so with one ballsy move, Obama can potentially nab Florida,Pennsylvania and Nevada.

Texas will probably go purple sooner than we think.

kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote


Handing an idiotic voter a ballot is like handing a toddler a loaded gun. I remember you stated that you didnt have a problem with our government spending more of our tax dollars on the failed "drug war" than they spent job creation. I'm inclined to believe people like you would also be likely to hold foolish opinions on other issues as well.

Are you for, or against, gay marriage?

netcentric: The interviewer should ask him, as a followup question, what he thinks about politicians who will say anything to get elected.....

That would be a weird thing to ask a guy who just got done taking a principled stand that most voters disagree with.

HeartBurnKid: fracto73: ModernPrimitive01: The people have spoken on whether gay marriage should be in America. Why does Obama hate state's rights?


For it to be a states rights issue DOMA would have to be repealed. As long as it is on the books there is a federal law overriding states ability to grant marriage benefits.

Technically, DOMA doesn't prevent states from recognizing same-sex marriage. It just says that states don't have to recognize same sex marriages from another state. So it's not really overriding states' rights.

It is, however, overriding the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution, which should show you something about all these "Constitutional literalists" on the right. That it hasn't been struck down yet is a travesty.

Article IV, Section 1:
Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof.

Sadly DOMA is bullshiat, but it does not fall afoul of the FF&C. Congress gets to decide what gets full faith and credit, and in DOMA they did. Pricks.

that bosnian sniper: Saturday, Obama enters into polygamist marriage with the family dog.

SLIPPERY SLOPE!

SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

Not really, most people who would be upset by his support of gay marriage probably aren't going to vote for him anyway.
Maybe the Black religious Democrats will go against him, but I doubt enough to be significant.

DirkValentine: I hope so. Civil rights should be paramount

this is all I am thinking too. this is his/our defining moment. you have to be willing to be brave in the face of such unabashed bigotry and hate.

Dinki: Obama knows that the anti-gay marriage vote is pretty much restricted to rightwing evangelicals, that wouldn't vote for Obama in a million years anyway. So coming out in support of it won't hurt him there. And it may well energize the gay/liberal/youth vote, which he really needs.

Right. It's literally win/win/win: it doesn't lose you any votes, energizes your base, and drives your opponent into a fit of apoplectic rage.

bump: I'd like to take a moment in this thread to express my love for NC.

We are not all hateful religious homophobic, bigotted zealots - most of us are rational, thinking human beings. Please do not let recent political events skew the good people of NC. We are just as embarrased about the aforementioned freakshows as the rest of the nation.

You are now returned to your thread, already in progress...

You say "most people" to bad it isn't most voters.

Wayne 985: AdolfOliverPanties: If he announces his support of SSM it will be one of the politically bravest things an up-for-reelection POTUS has ever done. It could really backfire with the religious blacks who voted for him in 2008.

I sound like Rick Romero.

Do you think it could help sway blacks in general though? Not to paint with broad strokes, but he's clearly a popular figure in America's black community. Maybe some of them will be more apt to support it if he clearly comes out in favor.

This actually. I find it very hard to believe that he will lose the minority vote for this issue.

Rev. Skarekroe: Wayne 985: Do you think it could help sway blacks in general though? Not to paint with broad strokes, but he's clearly a popular figure in America's black community. Maybe some of them will be more apt to support it if he clearly comes out in favor.

I hope so.
But in my experience, there are a lot of things poor rural whites and poor urban blacks have in common and one of those things is a deep-rooted hatred of gays. They're both a religious folk.

Would you say they "cling" to their guns & religion? lol

SubBass49: What is the political upside? What does he gain over Romney numbers-wise with this move? There has to be some angle...

Maybe he's uncovered evidence of Romney's secret gay love triangle.

/not intended to be a factual statement

DamnYankees: It would be nice if he did, but I'm not sure how he explains the waffling.

What waffling man? People can change their minds on shiat. I grew up a Republican and even into grad school was still well in their camp. It's possible for adults to come around later rather than sooner on any issue you can name. Given Obama's age, demographics and upbringing it would actually be quite unusual for him to have held a 'pro gay marriage' belief that manifested itself naturally under those circumstances.

Good for him coming around on the matter, particularly during an election year when you just know the dipshiats on downticket state legislature races in the South will be running this interview non-stop in their campaign ads from tomorrow until November.

SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

You realize a majority of Americans have supported gay marriage for two years straight now, right?

drjekel_mrhyde: It should be a state matter

Civil rights should never be a matter left up to the states to decide.

kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote

Nah. Polling is about 50/50 on the issue right now (although it polls a bit worse amoungst regular voters as opposed to the population at large, as you inferred). Obama and his political team are smart-if he thought there was a chance this would cost him the election, he wouldn't do it. Plus, nationwide polling is less important here than polling in swing states (I don't know the current numbers on it amoungst voters in Ohio or Florida, for instance).

One thing this will do is help him with his base, as well as with fundraising. It might help get the occasional lefty voter to the polls this time (or stop them from voting Green), and his SuperPAC will get a few million dollar checks instantly.

If he actually does this, it will not cost him the election, guaranteed.

This will hurt Obama's chances of carrying Utah.

Corvus: Ok for everyone saying "This is a great move" in this thread how many of were not going to vote for him and now you are? Or even give to his campaign?


Because I tell you what lots of independent voters or even some black and Hispanic voters are not going to vote for him if he says he supports gay marriage.

Also what will it actually accomplish? NOTHING. He already repealed DADT and no longer defends DOMA. Everything else is controlled by states. He could of "evolved" to this answer after the election and it would make no difference at all except give him more votes.


It won't win over people who supported Romney, but it could get people who didn't care to the polls. It is as important for Obama to differentiate himself from Romney as it is for Romney to stand out from Obama.

The_Sponge: It's not flip-flopping when Obama does it.

it's called being Versatile ;-) but i really think Biden would be the bottom.

and I think we could start calling them "Obiden" after they get married.

The_Sponge: Janusdog: I just can't hate Biden.


I can. That doofus is proud of the fact that he voted for the 1994 "assault weapons" ban.

But your a Republican idiot who thinks Sarah Palin is a genius.

/Vote Republican

Pants full of macaroni!!: SLIPPERY SLOPE!

DRINK!

Corvus: Ok for everyone saying "This is a great move" in this thread how many of were not going to vote for him and now you are? Or even give to his campaign?

I'm a bit skeptical about all the conclusions people are jumping to, but, if Obama actually endorses gay marriage tonight, I will donate $100 to his campaign. It will be the first political donation I have ever made, and will likely be the last.

Nightsweat: This will hurt Obama's chances of carrying Utah.

I'll go alert the Salt Lake Tribune...

Doc Daneeka: drjekel_mrhyde: It should be a state matter

Civil rights should never be a matter left up to the states to decide.

Just like integrating schools, amirite?

AMIRITE?

He'll say I think consenting adults should be able to marry whoever they want.

but I still get to put you on my secret kill list if i feel like it.

birchman: SubBass49: What is the political upside? What does he gain over Romney numbers-wise with this move? There has to be some angle...

Maybe he's uncovered evidence of Romney's secret gay love triangle.

/not intended to be a factual statement

Would be AWESOME.

Wasn't there some study of Romney's voice patterns that indicated that he may actually be gay? I swear I remember something about that...

Geotpf: kukukupo: ...

Nah. Polling is about 50/50 on the issue right now (although it polls a bit worse amoungst regular voters as opposed to the population at large, as you inferred). Obama and his political team are smart-if he thought there was a chance this would cost him the election, he wouldn't do it. Plus, nationwide polling is less important here than polling in swing states (I don't know the current numbers on it amoungst voters in Ohio or Florida, for instance). One thing this will do is help him with his base, as well as with fundraising. It might help get the occasional lefty voter to the polls this time (or stop them from voting Green), and his SuperPAC will get a few million dollar checks instantly.

If he actually does this, it will not cost him the election, guaranteed.


I like reasoned responses like this. Im also an I.E. Farker. Would you like a beer? EIP, I get around.

whew

i was here thinking he wouldn't spend any time focusing on the major problems facing our nation & instead just pander to a demographic.

/so relieved

no way Obama has that kinnda balls to do that.

$20 says Romney comes out in favor of gay marriage THIS AFTERNOON before Obama's interview.

From ABC News:

"Obama told MTV he believes marriage is "between a man and a woman" and that he is "not in favor of gay marriage.""
Nov. 2, 2008

Then again Obama said he was against preemptive military attacks and would comply with the war powers act. As president, he has presided over numerous preemptive attacks on Yemen, Libya, Somalia, Pakistan etc. He as also order the assassination of a United States Citizen.

/Patriot Act
/Warrantless wiretaps
/least number of prosecutions of members of financial institutions
/Dogs are tough

If Obama does finally evolve and supports gay marriage, I also hope he ends his bigoted position regarding polygamy.

/One Veep
//Two cones

JerseyTim: I would definitely vote for an Obama-Biden husband-husband team.

Heck, I would love to be married to Joe Biden myself.

Who wouldn't want to be gay married to Joe Biden? I bet things are never dull when he's around.

The_Sponge: It's not flip-flopping when Obama does it.

I'm more scared of a president that never changes their views than one who flip-flops too much.

For an example using Mitt.... I don't dislike Romney because he's pro-life. I don't dislike him because he used to be pro-choice and changed his opinion. I dislike him because he so adamantly claims he was never pro-choice.

Politicians should change their views as society and knowledge changes. If Obama says his views "evolved" or changed, that's the right way to do it, rather than disowning your previous outlook.

A president's view on this issue is really irrelevant in terms of it changing anything. Oh sure, it may swing voters one way or another, but as far as it impacting the actual issue it is meaningless. This is all pre-election media puffery...you know...trolling.

Good. This kind of bullshiat has gone on long enough.

Using the bully pulpit to drag our country dragging and screaming into the modern age is a good thing.

Flip flopping on the issue doesn't engender much trust in the guy, but at least he's on the right side of the issue now.

It's good to see him do the right thing now that the time is right politically.

D_Evans45: kukukupo: LOLOL

He has this election in the bag. If he 'comes out' as pro-gay marriage he is gonna take a serious dive in the polls

/from the people who matter
//by that of course I mean those who vote


Handing an idiotic voter a ballot is like handing a toddler a loaded gun. I remember you stated that you didnt have a problem with our government spending more of our tax dollars on the failed "drug war" than they spent job creation. I'm inclined to believe people like you would also be likely to hold foolish opinions on other issues as well.

Are you for, or against, gay marriage?

I am ok with the gay marriage issue exactly the way it is now. It should be up to the states with DOMA in place (which simply allows the states to either endorse or not endorse other state's marriages). As it stands at this minute; I'm a possible Obama voter (I don't see much difference between Obama/Romney) but if he comes out pro-federal-gay, I would probably vote for Romney to keep the status quo.

As for the war on drugs - I'm ok with that.

inner ted: whew

i was here thinking he wouldn't spend any time focusing on the major problems facing our nation & instead just pander to a demographic.

/so relieved

civil rights is always a major problem. and if anything, assuming he says what I hope he does, he's not pandering. this could be very bad for him politically.

SlothB77: SubBass49: What is the political upside? What does he gain over Romney numbers-wise with this move? There has to be some angle...

there isn't any. its not like disenfranchised gays were flocking to Romney. he won't gain any voters, but he risks losing voters.

Unless there are a ton of people out there who use support of or opposition to marriage equality as their single issue for choosing who to vote for, I don't see how he risks losing a whole lot of voters.

Peaceboy: Don't sell them short, I'm sure some Republicans will welcome this decision.

[0.tqn.com image 220x263]

Well, it seems that Joe Biden didn't gaffe. He was instructed to drop this bomb on Sunday to gauge reaction and set the stage for the President. If I am wrong, Arne Duncan would have not done the same thing the following day.

Barack Obama is even smarter than I think he is. One of his biggest problems is that the young people who came out in record numbers to support him last election have gone cold. This will energize them again. And he doesn't lose any support elsewhere. Those who are so opposed to gay marriage that they are going to make it a single-issue decision were never going to vote for him anyway. More, it will make the GOP attack him for coming down on the side of this issue that most Americans hold. And through it all, he is only going to talk about his personal views, not about policy. He's leaving policy to the right-wingers who are fighting gay marriage on every legal front they can. Sweet.

The bigger question is why does this matter in the long term?

/Here's a hint, it doesn't

If he flat out endorses gay marriage, I wont have to pinch my nose so hard when I vote for him come November.

paygun: It's good to see him do the right thing now that the time is right politically.

Uh no, it could hurt him among the black and latino voters that are religious that voted for him in 08

Cyberluddite:

"My fellow Americans, some might ask why I would want to marry a guy like this who, in the words of his critics, 'puts his foot in his mouth' all the time. Well, he's exactly the kind of guy I want to marry, because a guy who frequently puts a foot in his mouth is also willing to frequently put other body parts in his mouth, one of which--on me at least--is right around a foot too, if you know what I mean and I think you do."

Biden knows what you're talking about. He's keeping an eye on it.

SlothB77: there isn't any. its not like disenfranchised gays were flocking to Romney. he won't gain any voters, but he risks losing voters.

I think if he actually does come out and endorse SSM then he will quell the unrest within his base that exists over this issue. He stands to gain more than loose. If he actually does that. I am doubtful. However if he just gives undecided lip service it will just piss them off more so maybe he really is going to go for it.

Corvus: thurstonxhowell: I'm a bit skeptical about all the conclusions people are jumping to, but, if Obama actually endorses gay marriage tonight, I will donate $100 to his campaign. It will be the first political donation I have ever made, and will likely be the last.

So you didn't give a shiat about DADT repeal? Why not? Or you did and you just forgot about it like you'll forget about this?

Fine, you win. The Obama campaign won't get anything from me.

Are you always an asshole, or is it an act you put on for the internet?

Corvus: BigLuca: Wow. First liberal thing he has done all term.

And this is why he shouldn't do it.

Because he has repealed DADT his administration no longer defends DOMA and that is not good enough. He has done more for gay rights than ANY OTHER PRESIDENT. And people like you still biatch and biatch and biatch.

If he does people like you will then still go "Well he hasn't done XYZ" and still be pissed. He can't win with those types. No matter what he accomplishes won't be good enough.

His admin fought for DADT when it was struck down by a court.

SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

LOL

A Rmoney supporter!!!

So awesome!

Wayne 985: SlothB77: As a Romney-supporting republican, this is fantastic. This will hurt Obama tremendously in the polls.

You realize a majority of Americans have supported gay marriage for two years straight now, right?

how many states that have banned same-sex marriage are battleground states?

Just remember...the people yelling "flip-flop" are the same people who think Obama's policies are "socialist". There's a whole lot of willful ignorance amongst that crowd.

TommieFunk: Sbdolan: Sigh, why not before the NC deal?

On the electoral college, the typically non gay friendly places (I'm looking at you Texas) .

Never been to Austin? Houston's Montrose area?
No?
Don't drop the soap.

Mrs.Sharpier: DirkValentine: I hope so. Civil rights should be paramount

this is all I am thinking too. this is his/our defining moment. you have to be willing to be brave in the face of such unabashed bigotry and hate.

Exactly. this is his opportunity to really show he is a true progressive and is going to stand by his ideals. he's caved on many things and this would be a HUGE step in the right direction.

No way the Dog-Eater endorses gay marriage. He knows blacks overwhelmingly oppose it, and he needs them to vote for him in droves.

PanicMan: JerseyTim: I would definitely vote for an Obama-Biden husband-husband team.

Heck, I would love to be married to Joe Biden myself.

Who wouldn't want to be gay married to Joe Biden? I bet things are never dull when he's around.

If he does endorse gay marriage, it will be a courageous act of leadership... and by that I mean it's electorally risky in the swing states.

Obama embodies a person who can push people to do better things and to overcome prejudice via his leadership. Will it work on this? I don't know. Is it the right thing to do? Certainly. Is it smart? ... that would come down to the calculus of how many votes he will lose in the swing states vs. the benefit that his campaign assumes he will get from increased enthusiasm from his base, and therefore better voter turnout and better donations.

If he favours gay marriage, it means they've probably calculated that they can turn this and reproductive rights into this year's hope and change. It means they're going to run the election on strong, moral leadership on cultural issues that are almost always fought from the right and to the disadvantage of Democrats. This would represent a big change. But let's think about the position of Mitt Romney: he doesn't look like he's flipflopping away from religious right-wing positions that turn off Independents and Democrats alike (and which also would disrupt the status quo), and simultaneously, it is incredibly easy to paint him as a man who lacks conviction and leadership qualities. If Obama does make this shift, he has a moral high ground and a convincing argument that he is a bold and courageous leader.

I hadn't really thought about this angle before. I still think it's seriously risky. Are Ohio and Virginia going to take to gay marriage like gangbusters? Well... it could pay off if we see a repeat of 2008's enthusiasm, particularly from the elements of Obama's coalition of supporters (Americans under 35) who have had the terrible outcomes economically for the past 4 years.

Corvus: Ok for everyone saying "This is a great move" in this thread how many of were not going to vote for him and now you are? Or even give to his campaign?


Because I tell you what lots of independent voters or even some black and Hispanic voters are not going to vote for him if he says he supports gay marriage.

Also what will it actually accomplish? NOTHING. He already repealed DADT and no longer defends DOMA. Everything else is controlled by states. He could of "evolved" to this answer after the election and it would make no difference at all except give him more votes.

I'll be honest, I would be voting for him anyway (his promised veto on CISPA makes up for NDAA in my view), but I would find it very refreshing if he did indeed come out for gay marriage. That'd be the very definition of a leader taking a right stance instead of a politically-expedient one, showing principle, integrity, and conviction, and that's something I always love to see.

HeartBurnKid: Technically, DOMA doesn't prevent states from recognizing same-sex marriage. It just says that states don't have to recognize same sex marriages from another state. So it's not really overriding states' rights.

It is, however, overriding the Full Faith and Credit clause of the US Constitution, which should show you something about all these "Constitutional literalists" on the right. That it hasn't been struck down yet is a travesty.

No, it isn't. Don't just go by the title of the FF&C clause, go by the full text. Read the entire clause including the bit after the last comma, then read DoMA's clause 2, and tell me how it overrides the FF&C clause.