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(Marketwatch)   Gold falls below $1,600 an ounce. Glenn Beck can't fap to this   (marketwatch.com) divider line 49
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1239 clicks; posted to Business » on 09 May 2012 at 3:59 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-09 03:01:21 PM
What's another word for pirate treasure?
 
2012-05-09 03:06:01 PM
I was told that gold would continue rising forever until it reaches its true market value of 70K an ounce.
 
2012-05-09 03:39:05 PM
Cue the picture
diaryofahollywoodstreetking.com
 
2012-05-09 03:45:41 PM
Now what do I do with Ed McMahon's toilet!?
 
2012-05-09 04:01:59 PM
My investment in canned food and shotguns is ready to pan out
 
2012-05-09 04:03:10 PM
I wish it would fall to 500 bucks or less
 
2012-05-09 04:08:15 PM
Obviously the Fed has just artificially manipulated the value of the dollar to make it *seem* like the price of gold is falling. I won't be fooled.

/Or something. I dunno. I just remember lots of people thinking I should've invested everything in gold back when it was ~$1900/oz...
 
2012-05-09 04:08:20 PM
Remember, gold isn't going down, the dollar is going up.
 
2012-05-09 04:17:34 PM
FTA:

"The weakness in the paper gold market may continue due to technical selling or investor fatigue ... but this weakness is masking the massive activities going on in the physical gold market, especially among central banks who may be happy at a lower purchase price," said the analysts."

Looks like the pullback may be temporary, especially since there is alot of activity in India and China. Not a gold bug myself, but I suspect the demise of gold is greatly exaggerated. I'll be curious to see what it looks like when QE3 starts.
 
2012-05-09 04:18:41 PM

Dinobot: I wish it would fall to 500 bucks or less


Wait for it . . . . wait for it . . . . . [Glenn Beck screams in anguish; you feel a disturbance in the Force, as if millions of Goldbugs had suddenly cried out] - Gold spot: $500/ozt.

/If you're going to buy gold, buy bullion coins,
//old krugerrand coins generally have the lowest markup,
///if you hear the term 'numismatic value,' you're being screwed
 
2012-05-09 04:23:56 PM

RexTalionis: I was told that gold would continue rising forever until it reaches its true market value of 70K an ounce.


yglesias.thinkprogress.org
 
2012-05-09 04:28:47 PM
Gold is falling because people are fleeing to the US dollar. Not that we're doing all that great ourselves, but we're the best house in a rotten neighborhood.

i50.tinypic.com
 
2012-05-09 04:32:42 PM

Trolljegeren: if you hear the term 'numismatic value,' you're being screwed


THIS. Unless it is some ultra-rare US gold coin that survived the government call-back (in which case, there is going to be only one or two of them available at a time), buy bullion coins as close to melt value as you can.
 
2012-05-09 04:32:50 PM

jjorsett: Gold is falling because people are fleeing to the US dollar.


They're not "fleeing" to the US dollar; the economy is actually improving so demand for commodities is down. The only "problem" is that this doesn't fit election year narratives, but this "problem" of partisan hacks having a hard time getting reality to conform to their sound bites upsets me like a dogshiat fire at Tiffany's.
 
2012-05-09 04:43:16 PM
www.pequepuzzle.com
 
2012-05-09 04:53:06 PM

Dinobot: I wish it would fall to 500 bucks or less


I long for the day! Then i will buy all the gold i can and hold onto it waiting for it to rise again!
 
2012-05-09 04:59:19 PM
Meanwhile, the DOW finished below 13,000 while the S&P retested two-month lows.

Gold is down along with the rest of the market. It'll go back up after QE3 is announced. Of course, since this is Fark, an anti-gold headline is the one that gets greenlit.


dragonchild: They're not "fleeing" to the US dollar; the economy is actually improving so demand for commodities is down.


The 300K or so who dropped out of the labor force in the last official NFP report disagree with you.

Besides, your statement doesn't even follow mainstream economic thinking (according to Keynesians, an improving economy leads to higher demand leads to higher prices for everything - including commodities).
 
2012-05-09 05:00:55 PM

Sun Worshiping Dog Launcher: FTA:

"The weakness in the paper gold market may continue due to technical selling or investor fatigue ... but this weakness is masking the massive activities going on in the physical gold market, especially among central banks who may be happy at a lower purchase price," said the analysts."

Looks like the pullback may be temporary, especially since there is alot of activity in India and China. Not a gold bug myself, but I suspect the demise of gold is greatly exaggerated. I'll be curious to see what it looks like when QE3 starts.


Yup. China is still buying like crazy. The Chinese are the #1 gold mining country in the world, but they don't export any gold, and their gold imports have increased dramatically - up about 600% in Q1 2012 compared to Q1 in 2011. And it's not just China. "Countries that have a high proportion of their reserves in gold are not likely to sell, while the trend of countries seeking to diversify away from the US dollar into gold is one we expect to continue. It's a theme that has been evident since 2008,"

I wouldn't be completely surprised if the price action over the next month brings the price below $1,500. Gold price has been in an increasingly tighter range over the last several weeks, so the market was due for a breakout followed by some volatility. However, as long as negative real interest rates persist and central banks continue to buy gold, I think the bull market will still continue.
 
2012-05-09 05:03:00 PM

dragonchild: jjorsett: Gold is falling because people are fleeing to the US dollar.

They're not "fleeing" to the US dollar; the economy is actually improving so demand for commodities is down. The only "problem" is that this doesn't fit election year narratives, but this "problem" of partisan hacks having a hard time getting reality to conform to their sound bites upsets me like a dogshiat fire at Tiffany's.


The economy is improving, causing the demand for commodities to fall? You really don't know how commodities behave, do you? And yes, "fleeing" is the proper word, as you can see from the chart I posted. People think the EU is either doomed or about to undergo a calamitous upheaval, and they're getting the hell out of the Euro and into the (comparative) safety of the dollar.
 
2012-05-09 05:06:11 PM

Hydra: The 300K or so who dropped out of the labor force in the last official NFP report disagree with you.


Sure, it's a free country. Spewing one data point to make an "appeal to emotion" fallacy packaged into a sound bite is a far cry from parsing, analyzing and contextualizing data, though.

Hydra: Besides, your statement doesn't even follow mainstream economic thinking (according to Keynesians, an improving economy leads to higher demand leads to higher prices for everything - including commodities).


"Mainstream thinking", isn't. Inflation driven by demand makes several underlying assumptions, including but not limited to commodities not being in a bubble due to "too much money chasing too few opportunities".
 
2012-05-09 05:15:54 PM

jjorsett: The economy is improving, causing the demand for commodities to fall? You really don't know how commodities behave, do you?


I think I understand it pretty well. An improving economy causes an increase in real demand for commodities due to consumption. Under normal market conditions this would cause those prices to rise. . . unless said demand was offset by a decline in speculative demand for commodities (which is de-coupled from consumption). Basically, businesses will buy something like gold because they intend to use it. Speculators buy it because they expect it to go up in price by X%. . . but if X% is less than overall economic growth and some other opportunity is growing faster (which is the norm because economies don't grow monolithically), then the speculators can leave in droves. This is not a sustainable trend but can certainly explain a brief drop.

jjorsett: People think the EU is either doomed or about to undergo a calamitous upheaval, and they're getting the hell out of the Euro and into the (comparative) safety of the dollar.


If the safety of the dollar is only comparative, then why is gold going down? It was flight that sent the price of gold through the roof to begin with. Either way the Euro's been in the shiatter but that's not being disputed by anyone. Yes people are buying Treasuries but they were also buying gold. What condition would cause a wary investor to preferentially buy dollars over gold when Treasuries aren't even beating inflation while gold had been trending upwards for months?
 
2012-05-09 05:38:40 PM

ShawnDoc: What's another word for pirate treasure?


What is booty, Alex?
 
2012-05-09 05:40:52 PM

dragonchild: Sure, it's a free country. Spewing one data point to make an "appeal to emotion" fallacy packaged into a sound bite is a far cry from parsing, analyzing and contextualizing data, though.


Which, of course, is what you did in your post. Wait, no, it was simply a blind assertion without anything to back it up - in spite of what many in the mainstream call sluggish growth at best and slowing down into a recession at worst.
 
2012-05-09 05:50:44 PM
Today, gold touched the lower-rising-trendline that goes back to last December and last July (look at a one year chart). It should take a big bounce up from here, based on the 'pennant' formation that has been forming for the past year.
 
2012-05-09 06:11:12 PM
i180.photobucket.com

Not amused.
 
2012-05-09 06:16:13 PM
i201.photobucket.com
 
2012-05-09 06:23:52 PM

Hydra: ...sluggish growth at best and slowing down into a recession at worst.


Yes. April retail sales worst since 2009
Factory Orders Post Biggest Decline in Three Years

It seems as though the signs of economic recovery/growth are mixed, at best.
 
2012-05-09 06:29:03 PM
I sure am glad I listened to John Stewart over Glen Beck and didn't buy a bunch of gold back when it was at $1,200 per ounce.
 
2012-05-09 06:47:01 PM

jjorsett: Gold is falling because people are fleeing to the US dollar. Not that we're doing all that great ourselves, but we're the best house in a rotten neighborhood.


So a stalling economy is still better than your precious fad metal. But don't call it a bubble.
 
2012-05-09 06:48:44 PM

jjorsett: People think the EU is either doomed or about to undergo a calamitous upheaval, and they're getting the hell out of the Euro and into the (comparative) safety of the dollar.


Then they should be going into gold. Not the dollar. You just can't admit it's a bubble can you? Calling the dollar "safe" is hilarious. You have no idea what you're talking about. You just pedal right wing BS since 2001
 
2012-05-09 06:56:20 PM

dragonchild: unless said demand was offset by a decline in speculative demand for commodities (which is de-coupled from consumption).


Gold and Oil (and maybe silver to some extent) are about the only commodities that really have much of a speculative market. Your average commodities such as copper, tin, moly, steel all have much more of a demand driven price.

And nearly all of them are still very high compared to a historical market price.
 
2012-05-09 07:10:04 PM

Atomic Spunk: It seems as though the signs of economic recovery/growth are mixed, at best.


Hey, no one said the economy was gangbusters. But last I checked if the economy isn't in recession then it's improving. I never said I was pleased with the pace, nor do I need it to be to make my point. My point is that investors will act on non-zero growth, and some sectors are definitely growing faster than the overall economy. (And BTW, one bad month a pattern does not make.)

The main reason why investors flew to gold was uncertainty. Now they're pretty certain we're in a state of sluggish growth, but that still has some upsides compared to being the last one holding the commodity speculation bag.
 
2012-05-09 07:51:04 PM
Time to cash in on the FoxTards! Then milk them again.
 
2012-05-09 08:06:13 PM

intelligent comment below: jjorsett: People think the EU is either doomed or about to undergo a calamitous upheaval, and they're getting the hell out of the Euro and into the (comparative) safety of the dollar.

Then they should be going into gold. Not the dollar. You just can't admit it's a bubble can you? Calling the dollar "safe" is hilarious. You have no idea what you're talking about. You just pedal right wing BS since 2001


Do you have a reading disorder? Did you not see the word, "comparative" there? I stuck it in parentheses and everything. The dollar is unsafe, but it's less unsafe than the Euro.

A lot of people are going into gold instead of dollars, the Chinese to name one such group, but it cant be used as a currency and it's much less liquid, so the dollar is the best of a bad set of choices for those who need currency.

I'm fascinated by those who think hedging against inflation and currency collapse is exclusively the realm of right-wingers. George Soros made his own fortune doing precisely that.
 
2012-05-09 08:23:23 PM

Big_Fat_Liar: I sure am glad I listened to John Stewart over Glen Beck and didn't buy a bunch of gold back when it was at $1,200 per ounce.




Well, It really sucks, because I wanted to buy gold and silver back in 2004 when both were low as hell, but I didn't have any money. Now that I have the money both of them are high. What a rip.
 
2012-05-09 08:53:55 PM

dragonchild: Atomic Spunk: It seems as though the signs of economic recovery/growth are mixed, at best.

Hey, no one said the economy was gangbusters. But last I checked if the economy isn't in recession then it's improving. I never said I was pleased with the pace, nor do I need it to be to make my point. My point is that investors will act on non-zero growth, and some sectors are definitely growing faster than the overall economy. (And BTW, one bad month a pattern does not make.)

The main reason why investors flew to gold was uncertainty. Now they're pretty certain we're in a state of sluggish growth, but that still has some upsides compared to being the last one holding the commodity speculation bag.


I'd argue that there are more economic uncertainties now than there were a year ago. A year ago, the thought of the Euro completely imploding was a crazy idea - now many politicians and economists are saying it's inevitable. A year ago, the Greek problem was only beginning to creep into the mainstream media. Very few were paying attention to the fiscal problems of Italy and Portugal. The thought that the so-called "Super Committee" couldn't find some reasonable ways to make simple spending cuts in the U.S. was inconceivable. Also in the "inconceivable" category a year ago - that the S&P would downgrade the debt rating for the U.S. for the first time in history.

I realize too that one bad month doesn't make a trend. Some people want to paint a rosy picture of our economy citing job numbers. Except for the fact that the jobs numbers seem to be improving (at a glacial pace), it's still a really ugly part of our economic picture. Take a look at this trend:

static7.businessinsider.com

If you look at the time to reach the point of complete jobs recovery after a recession in the past, it's about 20 months. We're currently over 50 months in from our recession and we're not even half way to recovering the jobs we lost. It is improving, but only because of the massive amounts of QE that were pushed into the economy. Were it not for QE and the Fed's ZIRP, our economy would be on life support right now.

In regards to gold, I think the bull market still has legs. What's happening now is very similar to what happened in 2008. Back then, gold peeked above $1,000, then fell gradually into the $700s. A lot of people had written gold off, calling it a bubble that had popped. It took over a year for it to consolidate, then continue it's upward rise. It's fun to watch parabolic rises like we had late summer of 2011, but that isn't healthy for the market in the long term. Since the current bull market for gold started in 2001, there have been 5 or 6 corrections over 10%, and of those, 3 corrections have been >20%. This latest isn't unusual or unexpected. The macro conditions supporting a higher gold price are firmly in place. Real interest rates continue to be negative nearly everywhere in the developed world. Central banks are still loading up their reserves with gold. When these two conditions are no longer present, I'll exit the gold market.
 
2012-05-09 09:23:52 PM

Atomic Spunk: I realize too that one bad month doesn't make a trend. Some people want to paint a rosy picture of our economy citing job numbers. Except for the fact that the jobs numbers seem to be improving (at a glacial pace), it's still a really ugly part of our economic picture.


I agree we're NOT doing WELL. But an uptrend in employement is still an uptrend. The fact that we're BADLY lagging our prior employment peak is a Main Street problem. Investors don't go to Wall Street to make the world a better place; they don't give a rat's ass who's suffering or whether the growth is "artificial". They see that trend line and note that employment has been growing steadily for some months now.

As for this particular price drop, I just think it's a technical correction -- as I've said, speculators exiting the market. A lot of people jumped on that for some reason, but I do agree that gold's price should go up again from here. Even without all the global uncertainty in place, if nothing else the Fed devalues the dollar by design so even the strongest advocates of the dollar shouldn't expect gold to drop to prices it saw 10, 20, 30 years ago. Gold seldom ever soaks its investors; the question is whether it's excessive safe compared to other opportunities -- and in these conditions, you could do a lot worse.
 
2012-05-09 10:00:39 PM

Atomic Spunk: Sun Worshiping Dog Launcher: FTA:

"The weakness in the paper gold market may continue due to technical selling or investor fatigue ... but this weakness is masking the massive activities going on in the physical gold market, especially among central banks who may be happy at a lower purchase price," said the analysts."

Looks like the pullback may be temporary, especially since there is alot of activity in India and China. Not a gold bug myself, but I suspect the demise of gold is greatly exaggerated. I'll be curious to see what it looks like when QE3 starts.

Yup. China is still buying like crazy. The Chinese are the #1 gold mining country in the world, but they don't export any gold, and their gold imports have increased dramatically - up about 600% in Q1 2012 compared to Q1 in 2011. And it's not just China. "Countries that have a high proportion of their reserves in gold are not likely to sell, while the trend of countries seeking to diversify away from the US dollar into gold is one we expect to continue. It's a theme that has been evident since 2008,"

I wouldn't be completely surprised if the price action over the next month brings the price below $1,500. Gold price has been in an increasingly tighter range over the last several weeks, so the market was due for a breakout followed by some volatility. However, as long as negative real interest rates persist and central banks continue to buy gold, I think the bull market will still continue.


Didn't China fark itself with gold back in the 17th century?
 
2012-05-09 10:06:32 PM

Atomic Spunk: Were it not for QE and the Fed's ZIRP, our economy would be on life support right now.


I agree with pretty much everything in your post except for this little blurb - QE and ZIRP are exactly the life support for the economy that you talk about. Without them, the market would not have seen the uptick it has in recent years, and everyone we (misguidedly) bailed out in 2008 would need to be bailed out again. Were the Fed to hike rates back up to even half of their historical averages, the economy would quickly be back in recession as interest payments take up an ever-larger chunk of federal tax revenues.

At the rate we keep adding on debt, it's only a matter of time before interest payments comprise 30-50% of all federal tax receipts were rates to rise anywhere close to a "normal" level.
 
2012-05-09 10:49:09 PM
Guess I better get out to Costco before there's another run on rice...
 
2012-05-09 11:12:10 PM
Newsflash: the price of gold, like oil, is being driven more by Asia than the US.

Why do you think oil went up, when US oil production is around a 10 year high, and US consumption is at a 14 year low?

US gold consumption has also been declining. China and India's? Not so much.
 
2012-05-09 11:36:15 PM
Bought at $900, bailed at $1300.
 
2012-05-10 08:26:30 AM

impaler: Newsflash: the price of gold, like oil, is being driven more by Asia than the US.

Why do you think oil went up, when US oil production is around a 10 year high, and US consumption is at a 14 year low?

US gold consumption has also been declining. China and India's? Not so much.


This. The world no longer revolvews around the US and it hasn't for some time. Every big company has been chasing the Asian markets because of their sheer size. The US market is mature and will not be experiencing much growth. We're tapped out, yesterday's news.

By the way I would really like to know how China exports electronics without exporting gold at the same time.
 
2012-05-10 09:36:14 AM

BolloxReader: I would really like to know how China exports electronics without exporting gold at the same time.


I can speak from personal experience. The approach to using gold in electronics is:
1) Avoid it if at all possible.
2) Avoid it if at all possible.
3) Avoid it if at all possible.
4) If unavoidable, just plate the surface or make the wires so thin that they're transparent.

The nice things about gold (beyond its conductivity) are that it doesn't corrode and it's very malleable. That means you can make gold surfaces extremely thin. The companies I worked for didn't trust the Chinese with gold, anyway. The plating work was done domestically and under some very strict security measures. You don't trust your gold to some third-world worker. If anything, the labor was more expensive than the gold itself, and the security was to avoid equipment damage and/or line stoppage. A factory can write off the theft of a few ounces of gold.

Moral of the story is, "gold has industrial uses" is a very overrated argument used by goldbugs who have no farking idea what they're talking about. Per Wiki, gold's top uses are jewelry (50%) and hoarding (40%). Industry -- ALL industry COMBINED -- is a distant, distant third.
 
2012-05-11 01:28:26 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: Cue the picture
[diaryofahollywoodstreetking.com image 460x276]


Hmm. Considering he told you to start buying gold when it was $750 an ounce, id say a 130% gain on investment is pretty good.

You dick.
 
2012-05-11 05:51:49 PM

Trolljegeren: Dinobot: I wish it would fall to 500 bucks or less

Wait for it . . . . wait for it . . . . . [Glenn Beck screams in anguish; you feel a disturbance in the Force, as if millions of Goldbugs had suddenly cried out] - Gold spot: $500/ozt.

/If you're going to buy gold, buy bullion coins,
//old krugerrand coins generally have the lowest markup,
///if you hear the term 'numismatic value,' you're being screwed


Krugs are good, but in many cases they are actually up to 5% light of what they are supposed to be, content wise. I remember recently the South Africans flipping out on their mint director. Honestly, if it's a national mint and you're not paying more than 5% over spot, you're usually getting a good deal. And yes, getting anything "numismatic" is a waste unless you are specifically buying to collect.
 
2012-05-12 07:27:56 AM

jigger: RexTalionis: I was told that gold would continue rising forever until it reaches its true market value of 70K an ounce.

[yglesias.thinkprogress.org image 210x301]


also that the planet was heating up due to human activity, as well as the coming ice age that is going to kill us all
 
2012-05-12 07:44:57 PM

IvanTheSilent: Trolljegeren: Dinobot: I wish it would fall to 500 bucks or less

Wait for it . . . . wait for it . . . . . [Glenn Beck screams in anguish; you feel a disturbance in the Force, as if millions of Goldbugs had suddenly cried out] - Gold spot: $500/ozt.

/If you're going to buy gold, buy bullion coins,
//old krugerrand coins generally have the lowest markup,
///if you hear the term 'numismatic value,' you're being screwed

Krugs are good, but in many cases they are actually up to 5% light of what they are supposed to be, content wise. I remember recently the South Africans flipping out on their mint director. Honestly, if it's a national mint and you're not paying more than 5% over spot, you're usually getting a good deal. And yes, getting anything "numismatic" is a waste unless you are specifically buying to collect.


You're not joking about the underweight coins - first I heard of this :(

Though, it appears to be the collector/proof coins they were screwing people on.
 
2012-05-12 07:47:19 PM
And the SARB statement on the underweight coins - if anybody is interested.
 
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