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(BBC)   Some days, being a scientist is pretty dull. On other days, you come up with a plan to air-drop poisoned mice by parachute to wipe out an army of two million snakes   (bbc.co.uk) divider line 102
    More: Silly, End of World War II in Europe, United States Department of Agriculture, Guam, venomous snakes, wildlife biologist  
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11176 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 May 2012 at 10:48 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-09 11:29:16 AM  
Since we are talking Guam, anyone know any restaurants in California that serve Chammoro food? There used to be one in Vallejo, but it closed.
 
2012-05-09 11:29:53 AM  

dittybopper: but a bounty system like that would be cheaper than parachuting poisoned mice (which *HAS* to cost more than $5 per mouse,


The Internet tells me that bulk feeder mice can be purchased for less than $0.50, and acetaminophen (the snake poison they're using) is cheap. Add a bit for helicopter rental and parachutes, but it's not like those 'parachutes' need to be miniature versions of what humans would use. Hell, wrap each mouse in a wad of tissue paper and there would probably be enough air resistance to let it land safely - and that's only a concern if you want the mice to be alive on delivery. From the article it sounded like the mice would already be dead, in which case a high-quality parachute is even less of a concern.
 
2012-05-09 11:31:59 AM  

Solstice: HotIgneous Intruder: Snakes a problem?
Why not just kill them all on sight?
Offer a $5 bounty per snake.

If I am remembering right, GovGuam used to. It didn't really help as there is alot of undeveloped and overgrown areas for them to hide so only the easy to catch ones were caught. It was a fraction of a fraction of the population


Yeah, good idea in theory, bad idea in execution. Lots of beautiful nature in Guam, but that unfortunately means that there's also a lot of places for snakes to hide since most of the island lives in the northern part.
 
2012-05-09 11:34:23 AM  

dj_spanmaster: I know a great way to make an entire species disappear: put them on restaurant menus.

Hey, they're plentiful, and probably taste like chicken. I bet I can make a dozen different things with these snakes.


Where do you think White Castle gets their chicken rings from?
 
2012-05-09 11:34:52 AM  
Get a boatload of people from some third world shait hole in the middle east, India or Pakistan that makes a dollar a day.
Offer them 50 cents for each snake head and they can eat the body.
And they would be glad to have to chance to make some real money.
 
2012-05-09 11:35:33 AM  
I dont think snakes are going to eat dead mice. I dont think they can even see something unless it moves.
 
2012-05-09 11:36:37 AM  

cig-mkr: Get a boatload of people from some third world shait hole in the middle east, India or Pakistan that makes a dollar a day.
Offer them 50 cents for each snake head and they can eat the body.
And they would be glad to have to chance to make some real money.


Well ok but then how do you get rid of the people once all the snakes are gone?

/its a vicious cycle.
 
2012-05-09 11:36:37 AM  

Solstice: HotIgneous Intruder: Snakes a problem?
Why not just kill them all on sight?
Offer a $5 bounty per snake.

If I am remembering right, GovGuam used to. It didn't really help as there is alot of undeveloped and overgrown areas for them to hide so only the easy to catch ones were caught. It was a fraction of a fraction of the population


How much of that was because the snakes themselves are nocturnal?

Actually, they did try it in a limited program. I don't know the details, but I suspect that the bounty was set too low to make it economically attractive enough. Plus, it seems that part of the justification for stopping it was "Hey, it only had limited effectiveness, so let's drop the program completely", along with fears that people would introduce the snakes to other islands in the hopes of setting up a similar system, which seems kind of silly when you take extraordinary measures to make sure that doesn't happen in the first place.
 
2012-05-09 11:38:27 AM  
Is a mouse's terminal velocity even high enough to kill it?
 
2012-05-09 11:43:59 AM  

Fish in a Barrel: Is a mouse's terminal velocity even high enough to kill it?


(BRB)
 
2012-05-09 11:45:32 AM  

quickdraw: I dont think snakes are going to eat dead mice. I dont think they can even see something unless it moves.


IIRC, acetaminophen is not poisonous to mice, so they'll be just fine. Until they're eaten, that is.
 
2012-05-09 11:46:14 AM  

dittybopper: HotIgneous Intruder: Snakes a problem?
Why not just kill them all on sight?
Offer a $5 bounty per snake.

Yep, I was just going to suggest that.

Set up a fund worth twice the expected cost (2 million snakes x $5 per snake x 2) = $20 million. The unused funds would be earning enough interest to completely fund the eradication. Make the bounty untaxable and simply pay it in cash no questions asked so that it doesn't reduce things like public benefits (welfare, unemployment, disability, etc.). People who are unemployed, or who just want some extra spending money, would decimate the snake population in short order.

You might never get completely rid of them, but a bounty system like that would be cheaper than parachuting poisoned mice (which *HAS* to cost more than $5 per mouse, and there is no guarantee a snake will take the bait).


They tried this with cockroaches in Manila, the philipinos just became cockroach ranchers.
 
2012-05-09 11:48:49 AM  

foxbrook78: Fish in a Barrel: Is a mouse's terminal velocity even high enough to kill it?

(BRB)


For those of you just joining us, today we're teaching poodles mice how to fly
 
2012-05-09 11:50:23 AM  
So, we not only reduce the planet's biodiversity by contamination, overfishing, and forest removal, we accelerate the issue by distributing killer snakes, killer shrimp, killer toads, and killer bees. Humanity FTW!
 
2012-05-09 11:53:11 AM  
For some reason I expected a sub-headline about someone spotting a platypus in a Fedora chasing a guy in a lab coat.

/the Kill-A-Snake-inator
 
2012-05-09 11:54:55 AM  

inelegy: [tommcmahon.typepad.com image 324x264]
"As God as my witness, I thought turkeys mice could fly"


Came for this, leaving satisfied.
 
2012-05-09 12:00:26 PM  

quickdraw: I dont think snakes are going to eat dead mice. I dont think they can even see something unless it moves.


That's all my California kingsnake eats
 
2012-05-09 12:06:44 PM  
Nobody posted this yet?

www.troll.me
 
2012-05-09 12:10:47 PM  
European or African mice?
 
2012-05-09 12:12:27 PM  
It is an ongoing project... Link, more details here Link.
I hope this means that the previous drops were successful enough to go full scale.
 
2012-05-09 12:15:45 PM  

quickdraw: I dont think snakes are going to eat dead mice. I dont think they can even see something unless it moves.


I found another article somewhere that said that these snacks also scavenge for food and will eat dead things.
 
2012-05-09 12:16:38 PM  
World wide cataclysm is the only way to get rid of reptiles.
Look how the planet did it last time, rinse, repeat.
 
2012-05-09 12:17:26 PM  
If they were Chinese Needle Snakes, you could send in snake-eating gorillas, and then "when wintertime rolls around, the gorillas simply freeze to death...
 
2012-05-09 12:20:22 PM  
MythDragon
The scientists are thinking too small.
I would have started with this:


They already tried bayers. They're going with tylenols.
 
2012-05-09 12:22:48 PM  
wildfiretoday.com

We fit the Big Dog robot with a camera, image-recognition software and a pellet gun.

And for indefinite mission time, solar panels.

Fortunately, we have included foolproof code that guarantees it will NEVER turn on its human masters.
 
2012-05-09 12:25:58 PM  

Omnivorous: Problem: Brown snakes are a headache.
Solution: Administer acetaminophen.

Headache gone.


Headache and liver... for those who still think acetaminophen is safe for humans, Link. It took out the usually bright, attractive, healthy 19 yo daughter of an acquaintance last winter. Dead in three days.
 
2012-05-09 12:31:56 PM  
img.wonkette.com

a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com
 
2012-05-09 12:32:54 PM  
Pigs. Pigs love to eat snakes. They are also resistant to snake venom.

The island could release a band of male pigs (no females to prevent breeding and the creation of another issue) with tracking collars. After they have helped reduce the snake population, they could be hunted, killed and disposed of, preferably with some BBQ sauce.
 
2012-05-09 12:37:07 PM  
"Mildly venomous"?

/WTF?
//Really, wtf?
///When they bite you, the wound just oozes a little?
 
2012-05-09 12:46:05 PM  

JeffreyScott: Pigs. Pigs love to eat snakes. They are also resistant to snake venom.

The island could release a band of male pigs (no females to prevent breeding and the creation of another issue) with tracking collars. After they have helped reduce the snake population, they could be hunted, killed and disposed of, preferably with some BBQ sauce.


Do you have climbing pigs? The snakes in question are arboreal.
 
2012-05-09 12:48:43 PM  

JeffreyScott: Pigs. Pigs love to eat snakes. They are also resistant to snake venom.

The island could release a band of male pigs (no females to prevent breeding and the creation of another issue) with tracking collars. After they have helped reduce the snake population, they could be hunted, killed and disposed of, preferably with some BBQ sauce.


dnr.wi.gov

Ah yes, because feral hogs have NEVER been successful on their own. But we still have those gorillas in reserve to eat the pigs.

I doubt a pig would be all that effective at hunting snakes. Pigs root, but they don't chase slithering reptiles down. TREE snakes, BTW. If pigs can climb trees, we're all farked.
 
2012-05-09 12:48:49 PM  
static.ddmcdn.com
 
2012-05-09 12:57:35 PM  
www.american-buddha.com
 
2012-05-09 01:02:09 PM  

HotIgneous Intruder: "Mildly venomous"?

/WTF?
//Really, wtf?
///When they bite you, the wound just oozes a little?


It's amazing what a simple Google search will net you: Wiki
 
2012-05-09 01:03:03 PM  

JeffreyScott: The island could release a band of male pigs (no females to prevent breeding and the creation of another issue)


Didn't you learn anything from the dinosaurs??
 
2012-05-09 01:04:32 PM  
People who saw Snakes on Plane movie (I didn't, obviously) Is there a reason they didn't just drop the cabin temp?
 
2012-05-09 01:14:50 PM  

quickdraw: cig-mkr: Get a boatload of people from some third world shait hole in the middle east, India or Pakistan that makes a dollar a day.
Offer them 50 cents for each snake head and they can eat the body.
And they would be glad to have to chance to make some real money.

Well ok but then how do you get rid of the people once all the snakes are gone?

/its a vicious cycle.


Send them home with their new found wealth, they would be king of the hill.
 
2012-05-09 01:23:21 PM  
Do the mice power the helicopter by making rotor-like noises?
 
2012-05-09 01:54:40 PM  

Oznog: Fortunately, we have included foolproof code that guarantees it will NEVER turn on its human masters


www.listoid.com
At least until it falls over once...
 
2012-05-09 01:55:02 PM  

theFword: Aren't the mice dead and laced with the poison before being dropped?


Skip the poison, then. Design the parachutes to kill the snakes when those are eaten.
 
2012-05-09 01:58:43 PM  

Jackal_N: Omnivorous: Problem: Brown snakes are a headache.
Solution: Administer acetaminophen.

Headache gone.

Headache and liver... for those who still think acetaminophen is safe for humans, Link. It took out the usually bright, attractive, healthy 19 yo daughter of an acquaintance last winter. Dead in three days.


That's a depressing read for someone who takes 6 vicodin a day.
At least the VA started using the 5/375mg pills instead of the 5/500mg ones.

Well it hasn't killed me in 6 years, so my chances are pretty good, right? Right?
 
2012-05-09 02:10:58 PM  
Drop those mothafukin' snake killin' mice from my mothafukin' plane!
 
2012-05-09 02:12:04 PM  

Jackal_N: Omnivorous: Problem: Brown snakes are a headache.
Solution: Administer acetaminophen.

Headache gone.

Headache and liver... for those who still think acetaminophen is safe for humans, Link. It took out the usually bright, attractive, healthy 19 yo daughter of an acquaintance last winter. Dead in three days.


OK, as someone who used to research acetaminophen toxicity, I have three questions: 1) Was the daughter a heavy drinker? 2) Was she taking any other prescription medications? 3) Did she have an eating disorder?

Acetaminophen toxicity is augmented by two factors: Alcohol use and certain medicines which increase the expression of liver enzymes that metabolize it to a very toxic form which wipes out the liver. The main route of suicide for many years among Eskimos for example was Tylenol OD, but they died of liver failure not outright death. Apparently a fun recreational drug for the kiddies today is Nyquil, of which one normal adult dose contains a GRAM of Tylenol. You drink half a bottle of it, you gonna get sick and die at some point.

If she overdosed on Vicodin for example, the maximum tolerable dose per day is about 8 of the 5/500 Vicodin tabs before you start getting liver damage. 4 grams taken at once is toxic. If she was knocking back 20-30 of them (as some addicts are wont to do without thinking), it could easily kill someone with liver toxicity.

Again: Prescription medications are not for everyone. There's always that outlier who reacts to everything with immediate, unexpected death.
 
2012-05-09 02:33:44 PM  
Dr Stanford explains: "We thought it would be limited: 'OK, if it wipes out the birds, it will decline.' It wasn't the case. It just switched what it was feeding on - rodents, lizards, small mammals - across the board."

Wanted for questioning...

www.dan-dare.org
 
2012-05-09 02:49:04 PM  
Snakes a problem?
Why not just kill them all on sight?
Offer a $5 bounty per snake.


Because they are tremendously poisonous. Of course... It would decrease the surplus population of idiots that think they know how to hunt dangerous animals.
 
2012-05-09 03:06:32 PM  

th0th: Jackal_N: Omnivorous: Problem: Brown snakes are a headache.
Solution: Administer acetaminophen.

Headache gone.

Headache and liver... for those who still think acetaminophen is safe for humans, Link. It took out the usually bright, attractive, healthy 19 yo daughter of an acquaintance last winter. Dead in three days.

OK, as someone who used to research acetaminophen toxicity, I have three questions: 1) Was the daughter a heavy drinker? 2) Was she taking any other prescription medications? 3) Did she have an eating disorder?

Acetaminophen toxicity is augmented by two factors: Alcohol use and certain medicines which increase the expression of liver enzymes that metabolize it to a very toxic form which wipes out the liver. The main route of suicide for many years among Eskimos for example was Tylenol OD, but they died of liver failure not outright death. Apparently a fun recreational drug for the kiddies today is Nyquil, of which one normal adult dose contains a GRAM of Tylenol. You drink half a bottle of it, you gonna get sick and die at some point.

If she overdosed on Vicodin for example, the maximum tolerable dose per day is about 8 of the 5/500 Vicodin tabs before you start getting liver damage. 4 grams taken at once is toxic. If she was knocking back 20-30 of them (as some addicts are wont to do without thinking), it could easily kill someone with liver toxicity.

Again: Prescription medications are not for everyone. There's always that outlier who reacts to everything with immediate, unexpected death.


And there is the whole "Being a three sigma sucks" angle too. MY sis spent three week in a coma at age 22 because she took two aspirin when she had the flu.. She's now a footnore in the medical texts as the oldest survivor of a case of Reye's Syndrome on record (minor miracle in how she was diagnosed : her ER attending had just finished a rotation at Pittsburgh's Children's Hospital which happens to be the world leader in Reye's research, so even though she was too old to have it, he ran a diagnostic for it anyway, and literally saved her life, she was hours away from death when treatment started)
 
2012-05-09 07:02:50 PM  
Am I the only one who read Rikki Tikki Tavi? Just drop a bunch of mongoose (mongooses?) onto the island and problem solved!

Course in a few years and ya got a mongoose problem...but at least they're not poisonous and the dogs have something new to chase.
 
2012-05-09 08:23:47 PM  

MythDragon: Jackal_N: Omnivorous: Problem: Brown snakes are a headache.
Solution: Administer acetaminophen.

Headache gone.

Headache and liver... for those who still think acetaminophen is safe for humans, Link. It took out the usually bright, attractive, healthy 19 yo daughter of an acquaintance last winter. Dead in three days.

That's a depressing read for someone who takes 6 vicodin a day.
At least the VA started using the 5/375mg pills instead of the 5/500mg ones.

Well it hasn't killed me in 6 years, so my chances are pretty good, right? Right?


Hope so, but I wouldn't leave it up to the doctors to keep track of my total daily intake of acetaminophen -- I'm not considered an ideal patient. It used to be in a lot of cold meds which is how I found out that I cannot take it at all, makes me sicker than I was. If I was taking it daily I would demand a full liver function work up every year, did I mention I'm not considered an ideal patient? Maybe polite requests are the way to go?
 
2012-05-09 08:47:53 PM  

inelegy: [tommcmahon.typepad.com image 324x264]
"As God as my witness, I thought turkeys mice could fly"


Thank you.
 
2012-05-09 08:56:32 PM  

th0th: Jackal_N: Omnivorous: Problem: Brown snakes are a headache.
Solution: Administer acetaminophen.

Headache gone.

Headache and liver... for those who still think acetaminophen is safe for humans, Link. It took out the usually bright, attractive, healthy 19 yo daughter of an acquaintance last winter. Dead in three days.

OK, as someone who used to research acetaminophen toxicity, I have three questions: 1) Was the daughter a heavy drinker? 2) Was she taking any other prescription medications? 3) Did she have an eating disorder?

Acetaminophen toxicity is augmented by two factors: Alcohol use and certain medicines which increase the expression of liver enzymes that metabolize it to a very toxic form which wipes out the liver. The main route of suicide for many years among Eskimos for example was Tylenol OD, but they died of liver failure not outright death. Apparently a fun recreational drug for the kiddies today is Nyquil, of which one normal adult dose contains a GRAM of Tylenol. You drink half a bottle of it, you gonna get sick and die at some point.

If she overdosed on Vicodin for example, the maximum tolerable dose per day is about 8 of the 5/500 Vicodin tabs before you start getting liver damage. 4 grams taken at once is toxic. If she was knocking back 20-30 of them (as some addicts are wont to do without thinking), it could easily kill someone with liver toxicity.

Again: Prescription medications are not for everyone. There's always that outlier who reacts to everything with immediate, unexpected death.


Well, I know more than I did before your post. But first the questions
...three questions:
1) Was the daughter a heavy drinker?

Not that I know of.
2) Was she taking any other prescription medications?
Possibly.
3) Did she have an eating disorder?
Possibly, super model skinny, athletic.

I was told that she was taking Tylenol (I assume over the counter) for the cramps and that she took several, got no relief took several more, and then within hours of the first dose took the final dose of several more. The school called the mom at some point to come get her sick kid (she would have graduated this year), the mom took her to the emergency room. I don't know what all they did for her but she went into liver failure. Also, I don't know if she was as squeaky clean as mom thinks, of course she is well on her way to sainthood now. Understandably.

If I remember correctly kids in England were using acetaminophen to kill themselves, so they started selling just a few at a time. Liver failure is not a pretty way to go.

Nyquil for kicks? These kids need to learn how to party.

That being said, kids are going to experiment, some adults are going to party. No one should have to risk their lives (or mine by driving around) just to get a buzz. Legalize it, tax the hell out of it, deliver it like pizza.

Oh, and thanks for the chilling, "There's always that outlier who reacts to everything with immediate, unexpected death."
 
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