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(Yahoo)   Acupuncture, hypnosis effective in getting people to quit smoking, according to the Bureau of I've Never Done a Double Blind Study In My Life   (news.yahoo.com ) divider line 18
    More: Unlikely, acupuncture, smoking  
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2542 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 May 2012 at 5:37 PM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-07 05:49:42 PM  
3 votes:

I May Be Crazy But...: timujin: You think of the "14 international studies" none were double-blind?

I'd bet none of them were. It's a little hard to poke needles in people without them noticing. You know, so they don't know whether they're getting acupuncture.


Funny you should mention that.

Not exactly double blind, but toothpicks that don't pierce the skin and placed in random places work too
CONCLUSIONS:

Although acupuncture was found effective for chronic low back pain, tailoring needling sites to each patient and penetration of the skin appear to be unimportant in eliciting therapeutic benefits. These findings raise questions about acupuncture's purported mechanisms of action. It remains unclear whether acupuncture or our simulated method of acupuncture provide physiologically important stimulation or represent placebo or nonspecific effects.


My hypothesis: The Placebo Effect is an amazing thing, and I have no qualms about exploiting it in conjunction with REAL medicine.

//I'm going to look for studies on whether "warm and inviting" doctors have better results than "cold and analytical" doctors
2012-05-07 05:46:27 PM  
3 votes:
error303
It's been "known" for centuries that addiction stems from inadequate flow of qi within the body. Piercing the intersection of bodily meridians is a logical means of correcting the imbalance and getting rid of the addiciotn.

It's also been "known" that drilling holes in someone's head lets the evil spirits out and that letting someone's blood out is the best way to cure them when their humors are out of balance, Show me a device that can detect and quantify qi and then maybe I'll take you seriously.
2012-05-07 05:46:38 PM  
2 votes:

downstairs: How would one do a double-blind study? You can't tell if a pill is real or fake... but I'm pretty damn sure you're not going to convince someone you're putting needles in their skin and then not doing so.

Or hypnotizing them.


You can poke them in the wrong spots. The sugar pill equivalent to acupuncture isn't no acupuncture, but an acupuncture-like treatment that isn't actually accupuncture.
2012-05-07 05:43:32 PM  
2 votes:

timujin: You think of the "14 international studies" none were double-blind?


I only have personal experience to rely on. In a moment of stupidity several years ago I went to see a well thought of hypnotist to quit smoking. My health insurance even paid for it. What a painful hour that was. Turns out that - from my extremely limited experience - hypnotism is an even bigger crock than I originally thought. That I did not quit smoking isn't even the point. The point is that at no time was I anything remotely akin to hypnotized.
2012-05-07 05:42:56 PM  
2 votes:

timujin: You think of the "14 international studies" none were double-blind?


I'd bet none of them were. It's a little hard to poke needles in people without them noticing. You know, so they don't know whether they're getting acupuncture.
2012-05-07 09:22:12 PM  
1 vote:
I'm simultaneously amused and frustrated by people who think the placebo effect disproves hypnosis, when it is in fact an example of it.
2012-05-07 09:15:18 PM  
1 vote:

JuggleGeek: Electronic cigarettes work well. You don't want to get the cheapest thing you find, and if it's the size of a real cigarette, it probably won't work well. But if you get an eGo or similar (roughly the size of a sharpie marker), they work very well.

You need juice that's good for you (you may have to experiment to find the right flavor and nicotine level for you). There is a bit of a learning curve - not as easy as "open the pack, pull out a cig, light it".

But it's very effective, much healthier than cigs, much cheaper than smoking, etc.

The best resource online is ECF, a very good place to do research or ask questions. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com

It worked for me, and I had been a very heavy smoker.


Pack a day or more here. Just started with an ecig. Love it so far. Got a good deal on a KR808 kit and some tasty juice. I spend maybe 10 minutes every couple of days refilling my cartomizers. I'm sure given time I will upgrade to one of the more advanced systems, but the battery + cartomizer is a good easy start.
2012-05-07 08:11:23 PM  
1 vote:
Ah Fark.... where pseudo-scientists and pseudo-intellects use pseudo-science and pseudo-intellect to call things they don't like pseudo-science and pseudo-intellect.

/pseu-pseu-pseudio
2012-05-07 07:08:43 PM  
1 vote:
Electronic cigarettes work well. You don't want to get the cheapest thing you find, and if it's the size of a real cigarette, it probably won't work well. But if you get an eGo or similar (roughly the size of a sharpie marker), they work very well.

You need juice that's good for you (you may have to experiment to find the right flavor and nicotine level for you). There is a bit of a learning curve - not as easy as "open the pack, pull out a cig, light it".

But it's very effective, much healthier than cigs, much cheaper than smoking, etc.

The best resource online is ECF, a very good place to do research or ask questions. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com

It worked for me, and I had been a very heavy smoker.
2012-05-07 07:05:18 PM  
1 vote:
Big Tobacco can help you with this decision

i47.tinypic.com

From Mad Comic 1964. Other pages here
2012-05-07 06:39:56 PM  
1 vote:
Agh, God. There's nothing I can't stand more than these "natural health" charlatans. They get a degree in some bogus field of study, and then you can just watch them go to town on people who don't know better. It's your chi, it's your merideans, it's your spinal alignment. People fall right into this Placebo effect bullshiat. That's why half of chiropractic and other "natural health" BS is *pure marketing. Nothing more, nothing less. Come here, darling, let me sell you a bogus "natural cure" and some overpriced vitamins while I sit here on my high horse telling you about the EEEVILS of pharmaceuticals and vaccines. Farkin forget that shiz.
2012-05-07 05:51:30 PM  
1 vote:

Bondith: Honestly, if someone kept poking me with giant needles, I'd be inclined to quit smoking if it would make them stop.


Came here to say this.
2012-05-07 05:49:24 PM  
1 vote:
I once went to an acupuncturist (free coupon) and he tried to cure my neck pain by sticking needles in my feet.

First he squeezed my neck on some pressure points and it hurt.
Then he stuck needles in my toes.
Finally he squeezed my neck again and it didn't hurt.

He was squeezing in different places, so of course it didn't hurt. Call me unimpressed by this charlatan.
2012-05-07 05:48:53 PM  
1 vote:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: downstairs: How would one do a double-blind study? You can't tell if a pill is real or fake... but I'm pretty damn sure you're not going to convince someone you're putting needles in their skin and then not doing so.

Or hypnotizing them.

You can poke them in the wrong spots. The sugar pill equivalent to acupuncture isn't no acupuncture, but an acupuncture-like treatment that isn't actually accupuncture.


The studies where they say they found little difference in piercing an acupuncture point and pressing really hard on the point (sham acupuncture)? Yeah, pressing really hard is acupressure. So it wasn't placebo. And there pretty much isn't anywhere that isn't a point at some level.
2012-05-07 05:44:22 PM  
1 vote:
The Placebo effect is still an effect.
2012-05-07 05:43:05 PM  
1 vote:
How would one do a double-blind study? You can't tell if a pill is real or fake... but I'm pretty damn sure you're not going to convince someone you're putting needles in their skin and then not doing so.

Or hypnotizing them.
2012-05-07 05:43:03 PM  
1 vote:
Honestly, if someone kept poking me with giant needles, I'd be inclined to quit smoking if it would make them stop.
2012-05-07 05:31:24 PM  
1 vote:
I found my biggest incentive to quit smoking when it came down to a choice between one pack of cigarettes or several days worth of food

/cold turkey sounded good any way you looked at it
 
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