Cyclonic Cooking Action: Can't leave out their friends across town at the crystal cathedral. I'm sure god needed this.

[www.friedmanarchives.com image 640x426]

Didn't they have to sell off that building because the church went bankrupt?

/Loved the parody of that church in The Simpsons

Paul Crouch is a co**sucker and I don't mean that in a figurative sense.

If the revelations, from nearly a decade ago, that he had many homosexual trysts with a young man who was in their ministry didn't raise the hackle's of their followers then nothing will. It seemed to barely get a blip out of the media and appears to have done no long lasting damage. (Why do you think the two of them live in separate houses?)

I the only honest one in this photo is he dog.

MrBallou: But what about the priesthood in general? Do they all realize it's BS and choose to live off the misguided faith of the masses, or do some really believe?

Like drug dealers, the smart ones abstain from using their own products, and the dumb ones are just as addicted as their customers.

People like the Crouches and their ilk truly make my blood boil. Damn the IRS for not finding ways to dig into their obvious crimes.

And they say they have no assets "in their name" yet knowingly are lying because they control the companies that no doubt hold title to those assets. Lying, theiving filth.

Midnight Rambler: My gut reaction to these things is to let fools and their money be parted. But the fact is that the people who watch, listen, believe, and send their only few dollars to these hucksters are vulnerable. In blunt terms, they're vulnerable because they're stupid. They truly don't know any better. The sad thing is, nothing can be done to prevent that.

What we can do is remove the tax-exempt status on religious organizations, or at the very least place a cap on the amount that can be exempted. Our tax code is allowing you and I to be played for suckers.

By doing that you give the government a vested interest (continuing revenue) so naturally government would want to promote more of this activity to increase the revenue flow. Taxing it is not going to create a deterrence to people getting scammed. As you say they are stupid so they would probably, a the scam artists urging, send more money to offset the taxation.

People are entitled to their stupidity as they are to their religious beliefs or lack thereof and taxation is a impediment to the practice of it. What if you had to pay a tax to exercise your right of free speech? Just stick withe Congress Shall Not rule and we will all be better off even if it means tolerating some bad along with accepting the good.

Scam artist.

And the one man who exposed the scam, could revive his "ministry" at any time he wanted to, and make millions of dollars.

But he doesn't need the money.

DjangoStonereaver: [images.catholic.org image 250x250]

Her wig makes me question the existence of God, frankly.

Didn't he used to front Twisted Sister?

SphericalTime: Nope. No shock. It's the prosperity gospel, which is already about as far as you can get from Christianity anyway.

These people were always evil scam artists.

Sure, the rest of can continue to post in this thread, but it isn't necessary after this ^^^

hasty ambush: What if you had to pay a tax to exercise your right of free speech?

If you sell a product, you pay taxes on what you make.
If you provide a service, you pay taxes on what you make.
If a company pays me a salary for the work I do, I pay taxes on what they pay me.

If people give you money, the government gets it's cut. Period. Nobody should get a free pass just because of religion.

Trance750: There's a TBN broadcast building not far from where I live, and it's been built to look like The White House.

[www.maxgreinerart.com image 640x427]

[dlarchitecture.net image 640x426]

[www.tbn.org image 375x253]

That's sick.

Alain de Botton's 'Status Anxiety' tv episode is not on youtube.

Go to the 40 minute mark where deBotton takes on a prosperity gospel. Good stuff!

swaniefrmreddeer: AbbeySomeone: I am always amazed that people send these clowns money. I wonder how much her followers paid for that cosmetic surgery? The lord loves a plastic surgeon.

They prey on little old ladies who spend all day waiting to die so they get to meet jesus. I really wish hell was real and satan had a special place to put these scammers.

Frightening, but true. The scammers need to be brought down... but no one knows how, except the IRS.

"If you really want to make a fortune, start a religion"


- L. Ron Hubbard

Melvin Lovecraft: I made a mistake on my taxes a couple years ago. When the IRS finally contacted me, they said I owed them 6k, and threatened to garnish my wages and plunder my bank account. It was an honest mistake, but that didn't matter. These people can rake in 93M in one year, have several houses, an RV for the farking dogs, and the IRS doesn't bat an eye? WTF?

Start a church, and they'll leave you alone.

Trance750: clyph: Midnight Rambler: The sad thing is, nothing can be done to prevent that.

Wrong.

Teach critical thinking starting in elementary school.

If you do that, you can't mold them into being corporate drones, when they reach adult-hood.

I think a lot of them are incapable of learning it in the first place.

Man on the street's reaction to this stunning news (^)

Mr. Coffee Nerves: SphericalTime: Mr. Coffee Nerves: Hard to believe a business model of "Terrify an old lady into thinking she'll be cast into a pit of eternal torment for those handjobs she gave to the boys going overseas back in '44 unless she buys 'salvation and forgiveness' by handing over her life savings to a huckster" would attract the dishonest.

It's worse than that. They're not even using the fear of eternal torment as much as they are promising that donations to their church will be paid back tenfold.

They're convincing people that are already in financial trouble that if they just donate their heating oil money for the winter that God will immediately reward them. And then they're in an even worse spot.

So they don't even have the common courtesy of being a pyramid scheme? They're just straight-up stealing people's money with the promise that God will be so happy He'll rig the lottery?

No matter one's personal theology (or lack thereof) I think we can all agree that scumbags that would do this should be immediately booked into the circle of hell where the "Small Wonder" reruns never end and Cialis prescription is always full for the octo-penised rapephant(s).

I received a rather unethical piece of mail the other day. It was a big picture of Jesus' face and in the adjoining letter I got, it told me that the Jesus face was a prayer rug, and if I donated money to them and prayed REALLY hard then all my financial hardships would go away and a stranger would give me money. I painted Jesus' face to look like a tranny/Charles Manson, sent it back to them with a strongly worded letter.

/are these people sociopaths???

The Vatican laughs at their meager fortune.

Mrtraveler01: Cyclonic Cooking Action: Can't leave out their friends across town at the crystal cathedral. I'm sure god needed this.

[www.friedmanarchives.com image 640x426]

Didn't they have to sell off that building because the church went bankrupt?

/Loved the parody of that church in The Simpsons

Yeah, as far as I know that's happened now. Though his financial future is at risk. Which makes me very worried...

From another article:

The elder Schullers have been embroiled in a legal battle with the board of directors regarding intellectual property and copyright infringement claims as well as back payment for services rendered, Schuller Milner said.

The exact figure for how much is claimed was not available Saturday. Attorneys for the Schullers have made almost weekly offers to the Cathedral's board to settle the claim, which includes a $120,000 annual housing allowance, a $198,000 annual payment in license fees and additional medical benefits, according to Schuller Milner.

Trance750: sharkbeagle: "If you really want to make a fortune, start a religion"


- L. Ron Hubbard

I've actually toyed with that notion,myself. You can easily obtain a Minister License online, then get a PO Box and watch the donations flow in.

I mean if Tilton, Swaggert and Binny Hinn can pull it off, why can't we?

A few buddies and I (while drunk obviously) contemplated a similar idea. Our hook was going to be to carefully track the source of all our donations; wisely (and conservatively) invest all the money, and send back dividend checks each year. Then the truly prickish part of the idea was to include some condescending "stop throwing your money away at fancy talking self proclaimed religious folk" literature with each dividend check.

EnviroDude: Some people get their mansions with floors of gold in Heaven. Others get them here on earth.

That sounds like something who's getting theirs now tells the person they ripped off to get it. I'll take any award this life has for me in the tangible now.

pxlboy: hasty ambush: Midnight Rambler: My gut reaction to these things is to let fools and their money be parted. But the fact is that the people who watch, listen, believe, and send their only few dollars to these hucksters are vulnerable. In blunt terms, they're vulnerable because they're stupid. They truly don't know any better. The sad thing is, nothing can be done to prevent that.

What we can do is remove the tax-exempt status on religious organizations, or at the very least place a cap on the amount that can be exempted. Our tax code is allowing you and I to be played for suckers.

By doing that you give the government a vested interest (continuing revenue) so naturally government would want to promote more of this activity to increase the revenue flow. Taxing it is not going to create a deterrence to people getting scammed. As you say they are stupid so they would probably, a the scam artists urging, send more money to offset the taxation.

People are entitled to their stupidity as they are to their religious beliefs or lack thereof and taxation is a impediment to the practice of it. What if you had to pay a tax to exercise your right of free speech? Just stick withe Congress Shall Not rule and we will all be better off even if it means tolerating some bad along with accepting the good.

Because many of these churches are crossing the line and engaging in political speech and endorsement. That's why they should lose their tax exempt status.

Churches have always engaged in politics it is hard to completely separate the two. Would you have revoked the tax exempt status of the churches involved in the abolitionist movement in the 1800s? How about Churches involved in the Civil Rights movement in the 1960s and 1970s. The Southern Christian Leadership Conference is political; would you revoke the tax exempt status of its member churches? What about the Quakers and their anti-war activity? Or are you just opposed to the engaging in political activity you disagree with?

As I see it we have to take the good with the bad instead of presenting government with an opportunity to restrict religious activity and define acceptable political behavior by means of taxation..

sharkbeagle: "If you really want to make a fortune, start a religion"


- L. Ron Hubbard

Make money. Make more money. Make other people make money.

- L. Ron Hubbard


"God spoke to me clearly and said, 'Did I give my son Jesus on the cross expecting nothing in return?' God bankrupted heaven and gave the best gift he could give. He gave the best offering he could give. What did God need? He needed sons and daughters, he gave the very thing he needed. You can bring God a gift fully expecting something in return. Get to the phone!"

TBN, Praise-A-Thon. Dated: 31st March 2004

That's right. Dig deeply, people. Give plenty of that folding green, and you can expect the Celestial Slot Machine to pay out a jackpot. Remember, you gotta give til it hurts.

-- Paul Crouch

pxlboy: AbbeySomeone: I am always amazed that people send these clowns money. I wonder how much her followers paid for that cosmetic surgery? The lord loves a plastic surgeon.

As am I. Could they be more obvious?

Baffles me too. I worked on Heritage USA (PTL-Jim and Tammy Bakker) in the early 90's after in was bought by a Singapore group. We got into the Bakkers personal suite there (off limits but we had to see it). The dinnerware stacked on the dining room table would have payed my wages for a year and the gold duckie faucet fixtures were a bit much. His suite had a window overlooking the indoor mall-like section of the Hotel. Some people that had their own "named" hotel rooms-

Gavin McLeod (Cpt. Stubbing, The Love Boat)
Efron Zimbalist Jr. (The FBI,60-70's tv series)
Roe Messner (PTL contractor, his room had mirrors on the ceiling. I believe he went to prison for his role)

If TBN falls another will step in to take the money of the gullible.

Trance750: There's a TBN broadcast building not far from where I live, and it's been built to look like The White House.

I live 6 miles from that monstrosity. Good God it looks cheap and tacky in person. And it's on a freeway in basically a ghetto.

/but I was alter to convince my son it was the White House when he was 6

I'm counting my blessings
I've found true happiness
Cos I'm getting richer, day by day
You can find me in the phone book
Just call my toll free number
You can do it anyway you want
Just do it right away

There seem to be a lot of songs about religious hucksters...

This 'God' fella must have a hell of a gambling problem, he always seems to need more money.

SharkTrager: Trance750: There's a TBN broadcast building not far from where I live, and it's been built to look like The White House.

I live 6 miles from that monstrosity. Good God it looks cheap and tacky in person. And it's on a freeway in basically a ghetto.

/but I was alter to convince my son it was the White House when he was 6

Not sure if you are talking about the one directly across the freeway from South Coast Plaza, but I don't think it qualifies as a ghetto. Bristol & McFadden maybe but...

http://g.co/maps/d5k35

Cyclonic Cooking Action: SharkTrager: Trance750: There's a TBN broadcast building not far from where I live, and it's been built to look like The White House.

I live 6 miles from that monstrosity. Good God it looks cheap and tacky in person. And it's on a freeway in basically a ghetto.

/but I was alter to convince my son it was the White House when he was 6

Not sure if you are talking about the one directly across the freeway from South Coast Plaza, but I don't think it qualifies as a ghetto. Bristol & McFadden maybe but...

http://g.co/maps/d5k35

This one is in Irving, TX.

I'm surprised the architect isn't ashamed to post it on their webpage.

Link

Funny you mention it as I was watching this last night:

Atheist Experience - The Prosperity Gospel. Don talks about the latest religious craze: the prosperity gospel, and what a scam it is.

Mrtraveler01: Cyclonic Cooking Action: SharkTrager: Trance750: There's a TBN broadcast building not far from where I live, and it's been built to look like The White House.

I live 6 miles from that monstrosity. Good God it looks cheap and tacky in person. And it's on a freeway in basically a ghetto.

/but I was alter to convince my son it was the White House when he was 6

Not sure if you are talking about the one directly across the freeway from South Coast Plaza, but I don't think it qualifies as a ghetto. Bristol & McFadden maybe but...

http://g.co/maps/d5k35

This one is in Irving, TX.

I'm surprised the architect isn't ashamed to post it on their webpage.

Link

Ahh sorry, didn't realize they were spreading the disease. Is yours brighter than Las Vegas during Christmas?

I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ. -- Ghandi

TV's Vinnie: [www.thefamouspeople.com image 300x250]
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ. -- Ghandi

Meanwhile in India:

Three killed as Hindus attack Muslim village

India struggles with Hindu attacks on Christians

Religions, like political ideologies, are flawed because their adherents are people.

hasty ambush: Would you have revoked the tax exempt status of the churches involved in the abolitionist movement in the 1800s? How about Churches involved in the Civil Rights movement in the 1960s and 1970s. The Southern Christian Leadership Conference is political; would you revoke the tax exempt status of its member churches? What about the Quakers and their anti-war activity? Or are you just opposed to the engaging in political activity you disagree with?

Yes, I'd take away all their tax-exempt statuses. Every single one, even the ones I agree with. No exceptions, no free passes. Everyone pays their fair share.

Hell, I'd even tax the Red Cross and other charities on the portion of their income that doesn't go directly to people in need. The stuff that actually goes to benefit people shouldn't be taxed, but should still be scrutinized for fraud and nepotism/cronyism. Buying food at 500% of market price from your brother-in-law or golf buddy and feeding it to the poor isn't "charity".

Boy oh boy, freedom of religion, and you think politics is an unethical bunch of scum sucking snakes. Never in my life have I seen a more controlling, lying, scamming, pit of viperous poison spewing people(if you can really call them that). For every one true believer that does good there are a hundred that just want theirs no matter what. I do not even have to pick on any one religion because when a wolf sees an opportunity, he pounces, he does not care what the flavor of the meal is.

You can tell the congregation to their face that you are a crook, ripping them off, living a life of debauchery that would make Hugh Hefner blush, and then claim to repent and beg forgiveness and voi`la you are forgiven and if you do it again you just had a lapse. Institutional blindness... innocent even when the blood is dripping down your arm from the entrails hanging off the knife in your hand.

drhansenej: The Vatican laughs at their meager fortune.

THIS