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(Detroit Free Press)   Researchers say new clue found on very old map may means the settlers of the "lost colony" of Roanoke weren't massacred by indians, wiped out by disease or abducted by aliens, but just moved up the river a bit   (freep.com) divider line 56
    More: Interesting, Roanoke, abducted by aliens, British Museum, residential community, Arnold Palmer, golf courses, positive result, rivers  
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3856 clicks; posted to Geek » on 04 May 2012 at 11:25 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-05-04 08:40:50 AM
That is interesting.
 
2012-05-04 08:46:17 AM
Joe Banks... 82 years young has come to this pond every day for the past 17 years, to feed the ducks. But last month, Joe made a discovery... the ducks... were gone! Some say the ducks went to Canada, others say Toronto. And some people think, that Joe used to sit down there, near those ducks. But it could be, that there is just no room in this modern world, for an old man... and... his ducks...

/First thing that came to mind.
 
2012-05-04 08:47:07 AM
This is why you ALWAYS leave a forwarding address.
 
2012-05-04 08:48:11 AM
So the Great Mystery is...they didn't leave a forwarding address?
 
2012-05-04 08:48:46 AM

Vodka Zombie: This is why you ALWAYS leave a forwarding address.


Booyah! So close.
 
2012-05-04 08:53:09 AM

gopher321: So the Great Mystery is...they didn't leave a forwarding address?


Well they tried, but they didn't have a zipcode yet, and forgot that the guys coming back with the ships wouldnt know where the fark Croatoan Estates was, because the developer hadn't started building the subdivision before they left. Happens all the time with new developments
 
2012-05-04 08:58:09 AM
I'm wondering how this will affect the development that is there now.
 
2012-05-04 09:00:01 AM

AbbeySomeone: I'm wondering how this will affect the development that is there now.


I'm surprised that they didn't do archeological investigations on the golf course already.

/Or maybe because it was a golf course, it wasn't that invasive to the natural fabric of the site, or something.
 
2012-05-04 09:39:54 AM
Well that's interesting. Still doesn't explain why they all died, which they must have if nobody ever heard from them again. That doesn't say anything about the colonists showing up at the fort.
 
2012-05-04 11:30:12 AM
Seriously, historians?

"This is a great mystery! No one knows what happened! What makes it so weird is that they had this super-awesome map!"

"Huh, this map has patches all over it, ever try looking at what was originally underneath?"

"No, why would we do that?"
 
2012-05-04 11:31:14 AM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: AbbeySomeone: I'm wondering how this will affect the development that is there now.

I'm surprised that they didn't do archeological investigations on the golf course already.

/Or maybe because it was a golf course, it wasn't that invasive to the natural fabric of the site, or something.


Or because it was a golf course, this is Virginia, it was designed by Arnold Palmer, and you never get in between a wealthy Southerner and his leisure.
 
2012-05-04 11:31:51 AM

GAT_00: Well that's interesting. Still doesn't explain why they all died, which they must have if nobody ever heard from them again. That doesn't say anything about the colonists showing up at the fort.


I suspect anyone alive during that time is dead by now.
 
2012-05-04 11:32:50 AM
No one knows who they were...or what they were doing.
 
2012-05-04 11:34:14 AM
they moved up the river a bit...and then were wiped out by indians, disease, the Spanish, or bigfoot.
 
2012-05-04 11:35:06 AM
Chester Copperpot, Vindicated?
 
2012-05-04 11:42:16 AM

Fano: Chester Copperpot, Vindicated?


[checks wallet] niente.
 
2012-05-04 11:44:04 AM
Look I thought everybody knew that the mice who run the program Earth took the colonists too the center of the earth for calibration and simulation testing.
 
2012-05-04 11:45:53 AM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Joe Banks... 82 years young has come to this pond every day for the past 17 years, to feed the ducks. But last month, Joe made a discovery... the ducks... were gone! Some say the ducks went to Canada, others say Toronto. And some people think, that Joe used to sit down there, near those ducks. But it could be, that there is just no room in this modern world, for an old man... and... his ducks...

/First thing that came to mind.


live.drjays.com

Burns: Smithers, do you think maybe my power plant killed those ducks?

Smithers: There's no maybe about it, Sir.

Burns: Excellent.
 
2012-05-04 11:46:05 AM
The vampire doctor did it, it's well documented in Lincolns biography.
 
2012-05-04 11:49:14 AM

squegeebooo: The vampire doctor did it, it's well documented in Lincolns biography.


came here to say this
 
2012-05-04 11:53:33 AM

GAT_00: Well that's interesting. Still doesn't explain why they all died, which they must have if nobody ever heard from them again. That doesn't say anything about the colonists showing up at the fort.


It could be that they went native, integraged into and intermaried with the native population. But I know how this offends your sensability so lets just assume that they untimely died.
 
2012-05-04 11:59:00 AM

Saiga410:

It could be that they went native...


4godssakeboys.com
 
2012-05-04 11:59:59 AM
Assuming this theory holds water, what happened to the colonists after they moved upriver? Assuming they built a new settlement, why wasn't it found by later colonists/explorers? After only three years, there should still have been easily visible traces- even if the settlement had been burned down by the locals.

All this new theory does is possibly change the location where the colony became "lost".
 
2012-05-04 12:00:18 PM
If they did move why didn't they leave something a bit easier to understand then a one word riddle carved on a post?
 
2012-05-04 12:01:47 PM

Saiga410: GAT_00: Well that's interesting. Still doesn't explain why they all died, which they must have if nobody ever heard from them again. That doesn't say anything about the colonists showing up at the fort.

It could be that they went native, integraged into and intermaried with the native population. But I know how this offends your sensability so lets just assume that they untimely died.


I"m not saying it was aliens, but it was Indians.

/wat
//What would you do if someone told your family "BRB. back in 5 months for more dudes and supplies. enjoy winter."
///I'd see what the neighbors were up to
\\\if you know what I mean, and I think you do.
 
2012-05-04 12:01:53 PM
www.100bullets.sevenpennynightmare.co.uk

/obscure?
 
2012-05-04 12:02:39 PM
Cracked (new window) had a write up on this
 
2012-05-04 12:03:09 PM

Wenchmaster: Assuming this theory holds water, what happened to the colonists after they moved upriver? Assuming they built a new settlement, why wasn't it found by later colonists/explorers? After only three years, there should still have been easily visible traces- even if the settlement had been burned down by the locals.

All this new theory does is possibly change the location where the colony became "lost".


you mean LOST?

/"verily the sky doth turned purple"
 
2012-05-04 12:03:55 PM

Skyfrog: If they did move why didn't they leave something a bit easier to understand then a one word riddle carved on a post?


Maybe they were dicks.
 
2012-05-04 12:04:53 PM

AppleOptionEsc: Saiga410: GAT_00:
//What would you do if someone told your family "BRB. back in 5 months3 years for more dudes and supplies. enjoy winter."


brain no want communicate to finger.
 
2012-05-04 12:05:10 PM
so, they failed to save up their resources to build the cities quickly enough and didn't get any victory points I bet
 
2012-05-04 12:06:17 PM
There's a Settlers of Catan joke in there, somewhere.
 
2012-05-04 12:08:42 PM

Wenchmaster: what happened to the colonists after they moved upriver?


The survivors joined the nearby tribe of Native Americans, who lived on Croatan Island. Hence the carved message, which was the agreed-upon signal if they moved.

I'm surprised so many people still think there was anything mysterious about it. It might well be the least mysterious "mystery" ever.
 
2012-05-04 12:11:12 PM
www.operatorchan.org
www.indiegamereviewer.com
 
2012-05-04 12:14:07 PM

CygnusDarius: There's a Settlers of Catan joke in there, somewhere.


I tried to make one, it may have sucked
 
2012-05-04 12:15:44 PM
Didn't Dean Koontz already get to the bottom of this?
 
2012-05-04 12:20:02 PM

loonatic112358: CygnusDarius: There's a Settlers of Catan joke in there, somewhere.

I tried to make one, it may have sucked


You rolled a seven, didn't you?.
 
2012-05-04 12:23:05 PM

CygnusDarius: You rolled a seven, didn't you?.


this game sucks, i'm going to go play something else, like civilization
 
2012-05-04 12:23:17 PM

Gunther: I'm surprised so many people still think there was anything mysterious about it. It might well be the least mysterious "mystery" ever.


Well, other than what happened to Amelia Earhart...
 
2012-05-04 12:26:31 PM

phyrkrakr: Gunther: I'm surprised so many people still think there was anything mysterious about it. It might well be the least mysterious "mystery" ever.

Well, other than what happened to Amelia Earhart...


Nothing mysterious about lesbianism...or being blind.
 
2012-05-04 12:47:39 PM

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: AbbeySomeone: I'm wondering how this will affect the development that is there now.

I'm surprised that they didn't do archeological investigations on the golf course already.

/Or maybe because it was a golf course, it wasn't that invasive to the natural fabric of the site, or something.


meddleRPI: Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: AbbeySomeone: I'm wondering how this will affect the development that is there now.

I'm surprised that they didn't do archeological investigations on the golf course already.

/Or maybe because it was a golf course, it wasn't that invasive to the natural fabric of the site, or something.

Or because it was a golf course, this is Virginia, it was designed by Arnold Palmer, and you never get in between a wealthy Southerner and his leisure.


Not sure when the law was passed, but I think Virginia requires new developments to be surveyed by an archaeologist before the land is cleared. Golf course construction would certainly fark up the soil and interfere with any site, as has centuries of farming. I worked for an archaeological crew one summer in grad school doing this kind of thing in Virginia about 15 years ago...and it probably was not the developers' good will that got us hired. Maybe Palmer's construction predates this requirement...
 
2012-05-04 12:48:59 PM

Wendy's Chili: /obscure?


unless you want the minutemen coming to your door, you should hope it's obscure.
 
2012-05-04 12:58:54 PM

Saiga410: But I know how this offends your sensability


wat
 
2012-05-04 01:00:44 PM

I_C_Weener: phyrkrakr: Gunther: I'm surprised so many people still think there was anything mysterious about it. It might well be the least mysterious "mystery" ever.

Well, other than what happened to Amelia Earhart...

Nothing mysterious about lesbianism...or being blind.


Man, I was hoping for "attic/concentration camp" but I'll take what I can get.
 
2012-05-04 01:23:56 PM
This is rather old news for anyone into history of that period. I studied 16th English Maritime history extensively and Roanoke was included in my studies. That the colony had probably moved was known many years ago.
 
2012-05-04 01:47:14 PM

GAT_00: Well that's interesting. Still doesn't explain why they all died, which they must have if nobody ever heard from them again. That doesn't say anything about the colonists showing up at the fort.


Aside from the numerous records saying new colonies kept encountering white, blond hair, blue eyed "natives" after the Roanoke colony disappeared,...
 
2012-05-04 02:23:26 PM
Yeah, I think it is safe to say the survivors just moved and found some natives and lived with them.
 
2012-05-04 02:33:50 PM

Gunther: Wenchmaster: what happened to the colonists after they moved upriver?

The survivors joined the nearby tribe of Native Americans, who lived on Croatan Island. Hence the carved message, which was the agreed-upon signal if they moved.

I'm surprised so many people still think there was anything mysterious about it. It might well be the least mysterious "mystery" ever.


Yeah, that's what I always thought, too. I didn't realize this was still considered to be mysterious.
 
2012-05-04 02:49:23 PM

meddleRPI: Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: AbbeySomeone: I'm wondering how this will affect the development that is there now.

I'm surprised that they didn't do archeological investigations on the golf course already.

/Or maybe because it was a golf course, it wasn't that invasive to the natural fabric of the site, or something.

Or because it was a golf course, this is Virginia, it was designed by Arnold Palmer, and you never get in between a wealthy Southerner and his leisure.


Ah, you poor dears. Must have gone to public schools.

The site is in North Carolina, and Scotch Hall is a gated community populated almost entirely by wealthy Yankee retirees. Wealthy Southerners play golf in places like Augusta or Southern Pines, not on reclaimed swampland next to the paper mill in Plymouth.

But I can't blame you for being confused - whoever edited that story made a hash out of the original, which was published two days ago.

The settlers sure as hell didn't go to the "Croatoan" Indians in Hatteras. The folks in Hatteras were, interestingly enough, called "Hatteras" - and they only inhabited that island for a few months of the year. Unlike modern day developers, Indians were smart enough to avoid living on a sandbar during hurricane season or winter.

The Croatoan tribe lived in (wait for it) Croatoan. That's the area near present day Chocowinity and Washington, NC, where the Tar and Pamlico rivers combine. That area has been inhabited since pre-history and recent digs in the Chocowinity area have turned up European artifacts that are earlier than the next "contact" with European settlers - more than a century later, when English explorer John Lawson was captured and burned at the stake in 1711, his companion sent home with a warning from the tribe now known as Tuscarora.

So the best guess is that the settlers moved south into a territory already established for humanity, unlike the area mentioned on the map, which was swampland. They intermingled, their language lost as the original group died out, and they were forgotten by the time Lawson and other explorers came into the area.

That area now covered by the golf course had indeed been mapped and surveyed by John White as the possible location of his next fort upriver, but my guess is that since it never happened, the map-makers simply covered it over instead of making a new and expensive map.

There's a surprising amount of information available about the Roanoke settlers and their lesser-known companions at Carolana, near present Wilmington. Carolana was established at the same time, but when it was obvious that the settlement wouldn't work, they went home. The folks at Roanoke wandered into the woods and vanished.

However, the tourist industry on the Outer Banks was originally established by peddling romance to credulous tourists. And when the story had more drama than the facts, the story gets printed.
 
2012-05-04 04:47:12 PM
...archaeologists in North Carolina, have found a symbol hidden on an ancient map...

What exactly is the cutoff to use the term "ancient"? This reminds me of a Star Trek episode when they talked about a present day car using the term. I always thought that was weird and figured they should have used 'antique'.

In school, I learned it was before the fall of the Roman Empire, but obviously that's going to have to change as time goes on. Any actual history person care to weigh in?
 
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