you know who else has nostalgia for the 1930's

/amidoinitrite?

1930's

...and the 530's, 630's, 730's...

Dammit. I thought they were hating muslims now.

So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

FTA:
- He's 82
- He's an academian
- Not subject to US customs or laws

Move along, citzen, nothing to see here.

Damn Germans and their freaky 1930s swing music fetish. Can't they just stick to Rammstein and the polka?

Who is Johan Galtung?

Anybody else reading up on the French election. It's fairly interesting. The economist had a good exposé on it in their recent release

mbillips: one obscure Norwegian academic

Johan Galtung is not obscure, at least to anyone who has taken a college-level foreign policy course.

I'm a little surprised. I also take things from the American Interest with a large grain of salt. But I don't think what Galtung was quoted as saying comes anywhere near the level of anti-semitism that was the norm before WW2.

Give him some credit, It's much harder to hate people who look the same as you.

mbillips: Well, one obscure Norwegian academic is an anti-Semite, so that's enough to paint the whole continent for me.

This.

One academic's beliefs say nothing about what everyday men and women in most of Europe believe. If anything, his beliefs only point to the well-known fact that all Norwegians are racists and professors.

I don't want my tax dollars going to Israel. I would rather have them stay here in the U.S.
So that makes me ignorant and an anti Semite correct?
Just want to make sure I know my place.

Thanks

This is outrageous, considering that Jews are all innocent victims and have never done anything bad to anyone.

mitchcumstein1: Europe's Jew Hatred Isn't Just On The Fringe

Couldn't we have phrased that a little better? Anti-Semitism perhaps?

He suggested that Jews control the American media and academic establishments.

To be fair, so does everybody else.

Wait, Jews are republicans? Crap. there's goes my preconception.

Headso: So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

This.

We will take all 8 million of you. Please remove yourself from the center of the Arab World. Love, the World

One decrepit old man in diapers offering opinions = ZOMGNAZISEVRYWHAR

If you wring your hands any harder you're gonna peel some skin off.

Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Euro.

RogueVortex: Wait, Jews are republicans? Crap. there's goes my preconception.

I think he implied that Rupert Murdoch was jewish

Why don't we and the Jews just give up on ever having a civilized Europe and move Israel to Nevada?

I bet it would be cheaper in the long run to buy up all the land in that area and just tell the Syrians Palestinians to go hell.

Then all the other Jews who wanted to could leave whatever country is giving them a hard time and move to an independent Israel more easily protected by America. Think of all the cool things that could be done with the military funds that wouldn't need to be spent. New Israel could invent some really cool stuff if it wasn't always looking over its shoulder.

jiaxiaobo: Headso: So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

This.

We will take all 8 million of you. Please remove yourself from the center of the Arab World. Love, the World

The problem is a few acres of architecture that could precipitate the end of the world.

Although I'm personally in favor of nuking the site. If you kids can't play nicely neither of you get it.

For those playing the American Home Game, "Peace Studies" in Scandinavia are a cover for hard-core Marxism.

This guy cheered for frakkin' soviets during the Hungarian Uprising in 1956 and openly cheered for Mao, saying that "the whole theory about what an 'open society' is must be rewritten, probably also the theory of 'democracy'-and it will take a long time before the West will be willing to view China as a master teacher in such subjects."

Just to put things into context...

fickenchucker: Why don't we and the Jews just give up on ever having a civilized Europe and move Israel to Nevada?

I don't think their bombs can reach Palestine from Nevada.

fickenchucker: Why don't we and the Jews just give up on ever having a civilized Europe and move Israel to Nevada?

I think the U.S.-Mexico border would be better.

/similar in climate, and better food.

fickenchucker: move Israel to Nevada?

Yes, in the high Sierras and we'd call them Mountain Jews.

As one of the comments after TFA says this attitude is more common among left wing intelligentsia and often backed up with a strong dose of self-righteousness. (Odd that the Left is now more likely to be more ideological racists than the Right, it has flipped in my lifetime.)
It's one thing to have a legitimate disagreement with Israeli govt. policies but another to blame all Israelis for that. To lump all jews together in one category is just pathetically deluded.
So yeah I don't say all of us "Europeans*" are like this, or all Norwegians are like this but I will observe that in some European countries the conversation about race is less guarded than it is in Uk for example).

lake march: fickenchucker: Why don't we and the Jews just give up on ever having a civilized Europe and move Israel to Nevada?

I don't think their bombs can reach Palestine from Nevada.

well since there is no such place.....

AKTurkey: mbillips: Well, one obscure Norwegian academic is an anti-Semite, so that's enough to paint the whole continent for me.

This.

One academic's beliefs say nothing about what everyday men and women in most of Europe believe. If anything, his beliefs only point to the well-known fact that all Norwegians are racists and professors.

Agreed. If we just take logic to it's limit, we can all be like Faux News.

Relax, people. All you have to do is yell "Godwin" and it all stops.

RibbyK: FTA:
- He's 82
- He's an academian
- Not subject to US customs or laws

Move along, citzen, nothing to see here.

No at usre how those three facts are relevant at all.

mbillips: Well, one obscure Norwegian academic is an anti-Semite, so that's enough to paint the whole continent for me.

this.

trolltastic headline, submittard

I don't care.

Does that make me an antisemite?

Let's be really clear: there is absolutely.zero difference between an "Anti-Zionist" and an iron cross-wearing jackbooted elegantly mustachioed anti-Jew Nazi. Anyone who says different is selling something.

Europeans have hated Jews for, oh... ever? Not sure why people thought that was all over just because things were a bit quiet post Hitler; Soon as people start forgetting WWII, it's right back where it was before. And people being stupid and short on perspective, It'd say it's about time for some conservative european hate.

domenad: Let's be really clear: there is absolutely.zero difference between an "Anti-Zionist" and an iron cross-wearing jackbooted elegantly mustachioed anti-Jew Nazi. Anyone who says different is selling something.

I know you are being sarcastic, but it you If you take "Zionism" to mean Jews having self determination, then there is no difference.

dfacto: Europeans have hated Jews for, oh... ever? Not sure why people thought that was all over just because things were a bit quiet post Hitler; Soon as people start forgetting WWII, it's right back where it was before. And people being stupid and short on perspective, It'd say it's about time for some conservative european hate.

But Europe is the shining beacon of progressive human behaviour. Also they all ride bikes, take transit and live in little boxes on top of each other. They are beyond reproach.

jiaxiaobo: Headso: So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

This.

We will take all 8 million of you. Please remove yourself from the center of the Arab World. Love, the World

This would be amusing as it would be funny to watch what was Israel descend into a third world craphole just like most of the rest of the region in regards to human/women/gay rights and in terms of economics and standard of living, but without the whole "it's the Jews fault because they own Israel" card.

They'd probably still blame the Jews though.

mbillips: Well, one obscure Norwegian academic is an anti-Semite, so that's enough to paint the whole continent for me.

Well, there's this legitimate contender for mayor of London:

Link

And this article:

Link

But it's just one guy...right?

Not suggesting the whole continent is anti-semitic, but there is more of it lately. Should we be concerned? I think anytime hatred, racism, bigotry, etc get a foot hold we should at least take notice and watch...

So it's surprising that after almost 2000 years of institutionalized oppression and hatred of the Jews, culminating in half of them being killed or driven off the continent, Europeans didn't instantly accept them as equals when they were told they had to by their leaders?

In my purely anecdotal experience, many Europeans that I've known or worked with, even highly educated, liberal ones, have some very deep-seated issues with Jews. Nothing as overt as American-style racism, I've never had any personal problems with any of them of felt like they were treating me differently. It's more of an abstract thing, not like they expect all Jews to be bad human beings, but maybe that they have a predisposition to it. Realizing it's not terribly easy to explain now that I try.

I guess a close equivalent would be something that is similarly pervasive and insidious in Western culture even if it's not something any educated, liberal westerner would wear on their sleeve: chauvinism. You get the feeling that when modern, well-adjusted guys are joking about women making them a sandwich or staying barefoot and pregnant or being bad at math or whatever, some of the guys aren't really joking. The same people seem to get a little too excited about studies or news stories that in some way suggest women are less worthy than men. That same feeling crops up eerily often when I get to know Europeans (particularly Northern Europeans), but with Jews replacing women as the group they hold in somewhat concealed contempt.

liam76 RibbyK: FTA:
- He's 82
- He's an academian
- Not subject to US customs or laws

Move along, citzen, nothing to see here.

No at usre how those three facts are relevant at all.

Well the first two are relevant in that this is a crazy old man, and his views are only reported because he is a long-time professor, thanks to tenure. So, his views are not to be considered representative of European attitudes. Not sure of the relevance of the third point, though.

Headso: So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

Actually, they tried that in the 30s and the US told them to ESAD.

Link

In late 1938, 125,000 applicants lined up outside U.S. consulates hoping to obtain 27,000 visas under the existing immigration quota.

In a highly publicized event in May-June 1939, the United States refused to admit over 900 Jewish refugees who had sailed from Hamburg, Germany, on the St. Louis. The St. Louis appeared off the coast of Florida shortly after Cuban authorities cancelled the refugees' transit visas and denied entry to most of the passengers, who were still waiting to receive visas to enter the United States. Denied permission to land in the United States, the ship was forced to return to Europe.

1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, 2000s...

One of the only reasons there is an Israel is that after WW1, so many Europeans were glad Hitler was dead, but still wanted to know what they were supposed to do with the rest of the Jews.

LMark: liam76 RibbyK: FTA:
- He's 82
- He's an academian
- Not subject to US customs or laws

Move along, citzen, nothing to see here.

No at usre how those three facts are relevant at all.

Well the first two are relevant in that this is a crazy old man, and his views are only reported because he is a long-time professor, thanks to tenure. So, his views are not to be considered representative of European attitudes. Not sure of the relevance of the third point, though.

Even without tenure he is a well respected for the work he has done on conflict. Given his background and the peopel who would respect work like that the lack ouf outrage over his stance is that much more disturbing. Or to put it another way his views aren't considered representative, but that fact he hasn't gotten more grief for them shows they have a problem (not all of Europe, but there have beena few studies whowing it is a problem in Europe).

fickenchucker: New Israel could invent some really cool stuff if it wasn't always looking over its shoulder.

I'd argue that Israel invents such really cool stuff, because they are always looking over their shoulder.

Huzzah for the jolly old thirties! Champers at Le Touquet!

*boards de Havilland Dragon Rapide at Croydon*

I will never understand why so many people have so much animosity towards Jews. Why are these people so close minded an bigoted?

Without the Jews we wouldnt have the bible, communism, social marxism, multiculturalism, gender equality, class warfare, wars in the middle east, AIPAC's stranglehold on the congress and senate, modern art, political correctness, integration, NAACP, SPLC, gun control, holomador and 'Maud'. Among other things.

Maybe if all the people in the world spent all their energy on positive things instead of focusing on the negatives this world would be a better place. Then again, maybe not.

Okay. I agree the professor's a dick; but Helen Thomas' soul mate? I'm only aware that she committed the grievous sin of criticizing Israel's treatment of Palestinians.

jigger: Headso: So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

Actually, they tried that in the 30s and the US told them to ESAD.

Link

In late 1938, 125,000 applicants lined up outside U.S. consulates hoping to obtain 27,000 visas under the existing immigration quota.

In a highly publicized event in May-June 1939, the United States refused to admit over 900 Jewish refugees who had sailed from Hamburg, Germany, on the St. Louis. The St. Louis appeared off the coast of Florida shortly after Cuban authorities cancelled the refugees' transit visas and denied entry to most of the passengers, who were still waiting to receive visas to enter the United States. Denied permission to land in the United States, the ship was forced to return to Europe.

Ancient history. I had a great aunt who used to say "jew" in a whisper like she was calling someone just out of earshot a coont or something. Today that old woman is dead. We have a very few dipshiats on the fringes of the right and left of the political spectrum who espouse antisemitism, but today, if you held a Klan rally even in downtown Pulaski, TN, there would probably be more people who showed up to throw spoiled groceries than showed up in support.

People are down, they're frustrated and the people in power are incentivized to point the finger absolutely *anywhere* else.
So all the old boogeymen are getting dragged out of the closet.

Immigrants. Communists. Jews. Even the freakin Roma.

Pay no attention to the actual policies that caused the collapse.
Pay no attention to the policies that have prolonged it.
Blame the Boogeymen. Hate them. Kick them out, clear them out, and it will all be OK again.

I hate bankers.

Not Jews.

JackieRabbit: 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, 2000s...

One of the only reasons there is an Israel is that after WW1, so many Europeans were glad Hitler was dead, but still wanted to know what they were supposed to do with the rest of the Jews.

If only Hitler HAD died after WW1.

mbillips: Well, one obscure Norwegian academic is an anti-Semite, so that's enough to paint the whole continent for me.

Hell, Norway itself is obscure. I think the country's population is about 1/2 that of New York City.

I've never understood antisemitism. What is there to hate about them?

Every Star-of-David wearer I've met is about as white as anyone, so the easiest discrimination, skin color, is out. While it's a superficial point, several of the most attractive women in movies, television, and modeling these days have a strong Jewish heritage, so they certainly aren't an inherently ugly group of people. A significant percentage of this era's (arguably) greatest contributions from authors, directors, inventors, and researchers come from that same background, so they aren't unproductive either.

It seems to me that "they" are running the country because they're motivated, charismatic, and savvy enough to obtain and hold leadership positions. By western standards, that's a good thing. I think it's time to get over this religious nonsense and focus on the real problem - the Irish.

Spade: jiaxiaobo: Headso: So move to the US, we don't care about anything but green here.

This.

We will take all 8 million of you. Please remove yourself from the center of the Arab World. Love, the World

This would be amusing as it would be funny to watch what was Israel descend into a third world craphole just like most of the rest of the region in regards to human/women/gay rights and in terms of economics and standard of living, but without the whole "it's the Jews fault because they own Israel" card.

They'd probably still blame the Jews though.

Not only that, but they'd claim the USA is the center of the Arab world.

/and the intellectuals would find a reason to support their claim
//Las Vegas is where the Holy Nineteen vacationed, it'd become the new Dome of the Rock overnight

screwzloos: By western standards, that's a good thing. I think it's time to get over this religious nonsense and focus on the real problem - the Irish.

No. Italians. Case in point - Jersey shore. What did the italians do for this country, eh? Irish built it! Steel! Rails! Potato farms!

/Sort of kidding.

screwzloos: I've never understood antisemitism. What is there to hate about them?

Every Star-of-David wearer I've met is about as white as anyone, so the easiest discrimination, skin color, is out. While it's a superficial point, several of the most attractive women in movies, television, and modeling these days have a strong Jewish heritage, so they certainly aren't an inherently ugly group of people. A significant percentage of this era's (arguably) greatest contributions from authors, directors, inventors, and researchers come from that same background, so they aren't unproductive either.

It seems to me that "they" are running the country because they're motivated, charismatic, and savvy enough to obtain and hold leadership positions. By western standards, that's a good thing. I think it's time to get over this religious nonsense and focus on the real problem - the Irish.

I've heard some people say they find them annoying, one-on-one.

RogueVortex: screwzloos: By western standards, that's a good thing. I think it's time to get over this religious nonsense and focus on the real problem - the Irish.

No. Italians. Case in point - Jersey shore. What did the italians do for this country, eh? Irish built it! Steel! Rails! Potato farms!

/Sort of kidding.

Not that I have any desire to defend the Italians, but they *are* indirectly responsible for the foods Americans call pizza and lasagna (indirectly because American pizza and lasagna are not quite what you'll find in Italy).

/Now I want pizza.

Sarkozy orders all jews expelled from france

One of my favourite websites, jewify.org which replaces `gypsy` with `jew` to see how bad things are for people who are actually discriminated against. When jewish people have headline like this then, yes, they are victims again.

I work with a few Jewish people and my wife worked at a Jewish school, although we're Christian. The only thing I can figure with the Jew hate is people really like bacon, and don't trust non-bacon-eaters.

/Got nuthin' else. Don't understand Jew-bashing.

Wolfmanjames: The mamzer made approving comments on the 'Protocols' and all but stated Auschwitz was justified.

FTFA in Haaretz: "[It was] not unproblematic that Jews had key niches in a society humiliated by defeat at Versailles [...] In no way, absolutely no way, does this justify the atrocities. But it created anti-Semitism that could have been predicted."

I don't think that's controversial. There were many Jews of prominence in post-WW1 Germany and elsewhere in Eastern Europe, such as Austria. Many Jews were of a liberal orientation, and liberalism was out of favor... Liberalism was seen as foreign, and Jews were seen as foreign. The conflation into an "enemy of the nation" identity was potentially predictable.

There is nothing objectively anti-semitic about his comments on that point. There is a fine line between "A causes B" and "A was just asking for B", but I think he was still on the safe side of the line.

On the Elders of Zion, though, I can see why his comment on how nobody has actually read it was construed as an endorsement. But the point is, he didn't actually endorse the book, he asked if anyone had actually read it. From a historian's perspective, I'm sure it's a fascinating read based on what it says about the Russian security services that penned it and the history of anti-semitism. I think Haaretz using Galtung's comments to claim he's straight-up anti-semitic is stretching a little.

Overall, I think his comments on the Breivik murders are the most damning. What the hell was he thinking?

That said, I would still maintain that whatever the hell he said was nowhere close to the anti-semitism that was prevalent pre-WW2.

inner ted: you know who else has nostalgia for the 1930's

/amidoinitrite?

H.... Hitler?

chuckufarlie: If only Hitler HAD died after WW1.

Not to go all Brainiac on you or anything, but technically it WAS after WWI.

Thread Godwins itself? How's that for a fine ole solution?

/never understood the hate for jews

You may be interested to read (new window, PDF) actual informed research about anti-semitism in Europe, which paints a very different picture.

Summary: There are pockets of anti-semitism in Europe, particularly in the UK and slavic countries like Hungary and Poland, but overall the trends do not necessarily paint the picture of Europe as a bastion of jew-hate (at least not to the level the article suggests)

Dickens and Shakespeare both wrote stuff that makes modern anti-semites look like pikers. So, it's certainly nothing new. In England.

whatev. just the latest in the string of fake anti-jew propaganda that israel is currently spewing out to try and get people to sympathize with it and get off its back about operating the largest concentration camp in the world. Oh and they want to look like good guys for their upcoming unprovoked attack on Iran. in other words, just another day.

RibbyK: fickenchucker: move Israel to Nevada?

Yes, in the high Sierras and we'd call them Mountain Jews.

I don't know whether or not this is what you were referring to.

Just to be fair, this isn't a news article, it's just an editorial/opinion piece in the guise of news.

But then, most everything is these days...

Wolfmanjames: phrenicmonkey: Okay. I agree the professor's a dick; but Helen Thomas' soul mate? I'm only aware that she committed the grievous sin of criticizing Israel's treatment of Palestinians.

It was a bot more than that. She added the 'get back to Poland' bit too.

Sorry, Wolfmanjames. I was at work. I googled it, based on what you said. This is kind of off topic, and you're probably long gone by now. But it kind of bugs me how a little old lady's been vilified for having an opinion. Maybe I'm wrong. Everyone probably takes something different from the following. I haven't seen any footage, so I don't know what her tone was, or if she was flashing a shiv.

Nesenoff: Any comments on Israel? We're asking everybody today, any comments on Israel?
Thomas: Tell them to get the hell out of Palestine.
Nesenoff: Ooh. Any better comments on Israel
Thomas: Hahaha. Remember, these people are occupied and it's their land. It's not German, it's not Poland...
Nesenoff: So where should they go, what should they do?
Thomas: They can go home.
Nesenoff: Where's the home?
Thomas: Poland, Germany...
Nesenoff: So you're saying the Jews go back to Poland and Germany?
Thomas: And America and everywhere else. Why push people out of there who have lived there for centuries? See?
Nesenoff: Are you familiar with the history of that region?
Thomas: Very much. I'm of Arab background.
Nesenoff: I see. Do you speak Arabic?
Thomas: Very little. We were too busy Americanizing our parents... All the best to you.[51]
-May 27, 2010, RabbiLive.com [46]

At the risk of getting piled on, I don't see what's anti-Semitic here. She was asked for a comment. This is a political statement about the occupation of Palestine. She named three countries where Israelis emigrated from. Because we can't separate "Israeli settler" from "Jew", anyone that opposes Israel as it exists must be a bigot? Her background certainly goes some way to explaining why she feels the way she does. She probably could have framed her response better, but it was probably off the cuff.

/can't believe I'm white-knighting her.
/think she'll sleep with me?

phrenicmonkey: At the risk of getting piled on, I don't see what's anti-Semitic here. She was asked for a comment. This is a political statement about the occupation of Palestine. She named three countries where Israelis emigrated from. Because we can't separate "Israeli settler" from "Jew", anyone that opposes Israel as it exists must be a bigot? Her background certainly goes some way to explai ...

Simply the fact that she reversed what actually happened. The Arabs who would later become Palestinian "refugees" tried to push the Jewish community that had been living there under Ottoman rule for centuries into the Mediterranean. The fact that they lost doesn't ennoble their genocidal aims in any way, and certainly doesn't mean they were pushed out themselves. In fact, the Arabs who didn't join in the ethnic cleansing not only kept their land, but gained full citizenship in Israel, and their descendents enjoy its benefits to this day. Many of them even serve loyally in the IDF, and when Hezbollah kidnapped and tortured one to death, the IDF eventually agreed to exchange over a thousand terrorists for his corpse so he could be laid to rest, treating his return as just as important as the return of the bodies of Jewish IDF members.

But that doesn't matter, does it? Since the Palestinians lost, that automatically means they were the underdog, and must have been fighting for justice, not genocide. Then the likes on Helen Thomas wonder how so many people keep conspiring to support "Israel at any price," as if the only reason anyone could possibly support Israel is either through bribery or mind control.

dready zim: Sarkozy orders all jews expelled from france

One of my favourite websites, jewify.org which replaces `gypsy` with `jew` to see how bad things are for people who are actually discriminated against. When jewish people have headline like this then, yes, they are victims again.

Except the actual headline is removal of "illegal" gypsies.