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(Daily Kos)   Stephen Colbert rips David Koch to his face in front of everyone at the Time "100 most influential people" gala   (dailykos.com) divider line 219
    More: Hero, David Koch, Charles Koch, Health Care, International, Steven Colbert  
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12876 clicks; posted to Politics » on 28 Apr 2012 at 4:36 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-04-28 08:31:57 PM
Read the full text here:

Time
 
2012-04-28 08:55:00 PM

downpaymentblues: BojanglesPaladin: I'm only disputing the articles's comment that "Stewart. Colbert. Maher. These are today's leading truth tellers." I think that is wrong. And sad because so many people thing that comedy shows can be relied on for unbiased facts.

It seems you are trying REALLY hard to say satire and comedy can't be truth, or be used to demonstrate a truth.


No way, he's totally an independent. He only spends 99% of his time bashing democrats and saying they ultimately bear all the responsibility. But he's independent, honest!

/I may be partisan, but fark, just admit it.
 
2012-04-28 08:55:47 PM

gimmegimme: El Pachuco: cameroncrazy1984: BojanglesPaladin: cameroncrazy1984: So you can't even back up your own statement that Colbert and Stewart, while being funny, cannot be leading truth-tellers.

Cameron, Cameron, Cameron.

Your weak slap-fight troll is showing. Put that shiat back up OK? No one wants to watch you fark that strawman you just made up.

Aw. Someone's mad! It's interesting that you continue to refuse to back up your own point. I didn't make up the fact that you said they are not the leading truth-tellers. You said that, didn't you?

Allow me to explain:

In BojanglesPaladin's black-and-white world, only Serious PeopleTM are allowed to be truth-tellers, according to rules what he just made up. Serious People like Walter Cronkite.

In BP's very humble opinion, non-Serious people cannot speak truth to power, despite centuries of precedent. Again, according to rules what he just made up. So by that definition, Stephen Colbert does not speak truth to power even when he rips David Koch to his face in front of everyone.

And that's just sad.

But it allows him to feel oh so superior to you, little man.

/yeah, I know this will also go over BP's head
//forever!!

I just like how BP often begins comments with a statement intended to convince us he's objective. "Look, I watch Stewart from time to time, but..." "I'm not saying Obama is the worst President ever, but..."


I'm not racist, but...
 
2012-04-28 09:00:32 PM

Mrtraveler01: I don't know who got the bigger slam, the Koch Brothers or Cardinal Dolan?


I was thinking Dolan.
 
2012-04-28 09:00:39 PM
Here to also say that I would have vigorous gay relations with this man, despite not being so

/best part......forever!
//...unlike some people
///would like to see the speech before the "you can't say that in public" edit
 
2012-04-28 09:00:45 PM

ecmoRandomNumbers: This is what needs to happen in every public appearance that these assholes show up to. Uncensored public humiliation. They don't realize how much people really hate them.


They know. They just don't care. They're the true elitists.
 
2012-04-28 09:04:59 PM

Bucky Katt: ecmoRandomNumbers: This is what needs to happen in every public appearance that these assholes show up to. Uncensored public humiliation. They don't realize how much people really hate them.

They know. They just don't care. They're the true elitists.


26.media.tumblr.com

They weren't booing you, sir. They were saying "boo-urns."
 
2012-04-28 09:11:24 PM

gimmegimme: I just like how BP often begins comments with a statement intended to convince us he's objective. "Look, I watch Stewart from time to time, but..." "I'm not saying Obama is the worst President ever, but..."


BP is just skullkrusher with an InterCapped handle.
 
2012-04-28 09:17:31 PM
Dayum. I'd be Colbert's biatch. Any. Freakin'. Time.

I'm...getting all sweaty thinking about it.

StopLurkListen: [i1074.photobucket.com image 500x369]

//forevvvvvvveeeeeeerrrrrrrr


I think I must've missed a meme.
 
2012-04-28 09:27:39 PM

Shrugging Atlas: I was thinking Dolan.


cache.ohinternet.com
 
2012-04-28 09:32:58 PM

Urbn: Colbert is seriously one of the best political minds alive right now. It will be Colbert who is able to reach out to younger voters and get them to notice - and also CARE - about how corrupt our country has become; he will also be the one who shows them you can fight back and shine the light on these shenanigans.


Shine light on the shenanigans, sure. Fight back, not so much. Fighting back requires changing how the system works. The trouble is, you have to be part of the system to change the system. As it stands, you have two huge roadblocks to that.

The first is getting a real game changer into the game in the first place. It is theoretically possible, in as much as voting isn't yet a complete sham, but good luck getting that to happen when you need the support of one of the only two parties that are allowed to exist, both of whom are wholly interested in keeping the system as it is. If you're lucky, with enough grassroots organization and by energizing non-voters, you can slip someone in through all the machinations of the competitors (whether ones on the ballot, the ones already in power, or the ones influencing things behind the scenes).

The second, having somehow successfully gotten someone through who can push for fundamental changes to the political system, is getting enough other representatives to agree to a change. Guess how likely that would be? Whether from being misguided or acclimation or simply being downright corrupt, 95% of elected officials will do everything in their power to keep the system exactly the way it is. Why would they want it to change? It is a sweet ass-deal for them.

Either you play the game, or you don't get invited.
 
2012-04-28 09:35:48 PM

BojanglesPaladin: "Stewart. Colbert. Maher. These are today's leading truth tellers."

Oh good grief.

I have a serious man-crush on Colbert, and I think all three of these guys (though Bill Maher least) are very effective and important satirists and comentators.

But Today's Leading Truth-Tellers? Not even close. Too often they need to slant and mischaricterize for comedic effect. To often an intentionally biased take is funnier than an objective one, and let's be honest... None of these guys is even pretending to be unbiased.

I think it's great that we have guys like this, and honestly, I Dig Colbert for being very bold and holding no punches even when he's face to face (hello Bush). but these guys are not "truth tellers" by any stretch.

And it makes me a little sad that so many people can't see the difference.


Okay, I feel like this is not trolling, so i will respond seriously.

To be a really good, very effective truth-teller takes a long, long time with research and with data collection. You need to use the public record and have lots of practice doing it. You know how to build bibliographies, and you actually read end notes.

If you are an absolute maestro truth-teller, you can't do it everyday, at a national level. You spend too much time being precise, working hard, and mentoring a small group of helpers who inspire you. You become a minister to a church who reads all the time and has conversations with people at every level of society. You become a professor who hits the streets doing embedded research. You need an encyclopedic memory for movies, books (and you read books, not wikipedia), you can look things up, and you do - you don't look up definitions, you have read tens of thousands of pages of fiction, nonfiction, and poetry, and spent a few decades with lovers, family, and debating with friends and enemies. Dictionary definitions don't work for you, and encyclopedia or wiki entries are obviously too shallow. You look things up in all kinds of different media, and you can tell when there is stuff missing from an archive, or when two opinions that look similar are actually using different data or lenses to talk about the same subject - and you understand what those lenses are like.

So the author is correct about Stewart, Colbert, and Maher (sometimes). They are leaders. They are not some kind of paladin class of truth seekers and tellers. They are the leaders in North America, though. I bet each one of them has a few mentors and inspirations who they went to church with, or school, or who they see in concert and lectures once in a while.
 
2012-04-28 09:36:36 PM
b-b-b-but SOROS!
 
2012-04-28 09:52:07 PM

Smackledorfer: I just like how BP often begins comments with a statement intended to convince us he's objective. "Look, I watch Stewart from time to time, but..." "I'm not saying Obama is the worst President ever, but..."

I'm not racist, but...


Some people say...
 
2012-04-28 10:05:12 PM

2wolves: Smackledorfer: I just like how BP often begins comments with a statement intended to convince us he's objective. "Look, I watch Stewart from time to time, but..." "I'm not saying Obama is the worst President ever, but..."

I'm not racist, but...

Some people say...


That he wears his racing suit in the boudoir. All we know is, he's called The Stig.
 
2012-04-28 10:11:31 PM

ds_4815: Shrugging Atlas: I was thinking Dolan.

[cache.ohinternet.com image 444x414]


Yeah that's who I thought of too.

/gooby pls
 
2012-04-28 10:21:23 PM

Farker Soze: No harm. You know what they say, about how in medieval feudal kingdoms only the court jester was allowed to speak the cold hard truth. The Kochs' should approve.


I'm now imagining Stephen Colbert in a jester's outfit.
Yeah, I'd still do him. More than once.

And he's going to have a freaking orgy if we all find him at once.
 
2012-04-28 10:31:59 PM
Tag for video
 
2012-04-28 10:37:43 PM

Rincewind53: I want to have wild, hot, gay sex with Stephen Colbert.

And I'm not even gay.

I

want to have wild, hot, gay sex with Stephen Colbert.

And I'm a woman.
 
2012-04-28 10:39:55 PM
You guys sound gay.

I would only sleep with Colbert in a devil's three way.
 
2012-04-28 11:05:00 PM

Mentat: More:....


My daughter is falling asleep in the rocker behind me, and I think I just popped a blood vessel in my eye trying not to laugh out loud.
 
2012-04-28 11:41:04 PM

Antidamascus: Holy crap, my college president spoke there. I knew he was on the list but I didn't know he got to speak at the event.

/Go Hrabowski
//Go Retrievers
///slashies


Undefeated football team forever!

/m16
//curious if you know what that is :p (and it's not the gun)
 
2012-04-28 11:50:16 PM

Aexia: Lenny_da_Hog:

[i262.photobucket.com image 518x477]

I found out recently that the "FREE GOVERNMENT MONEY" guy lives in my neighborhood. He apparently likes to roll into coffee shops in his full getup and then wait for people to recognize him.


Ask him to sign your shamwow.

JackNicholsonJoker.jpg
 
2012-04-28 11:55:21 PM
So, what I've learned from this thread is that a satirists can tell the truth, but being a satirist disqualifies you from being on of today's leading truth tellers because... well, because.
 
2012-04-29 12:00:28 AM

for good or for awesome: So, what I've learned from this thread is that a satirists can tell the truth, but being a satirist disqualifies you from being on of today's leading truth tellers because... well, because.


No way man, being a satirist makes you a leading truth-teller. But to be a truth-teller savant takes a whole other kind of game. Like George Orwell was ana amazing truth-teller during this radio days, and then flipped into his satirist career, which was a little slower, and resulted in some serious failures (like the predictions in his essay The Lion and the Unicorn).
 
2012-04-29 12:02:30 AM

Bennie Crabtree: for good or for awesome: So, what I've learned from this thread is that a satirists can tell the truth, but being a satirist disqualifies you from being on of today's leading truth tellers because... well, because.

No way man, being a satirist makes you a leading truth-teller. But to be a truth-teller savant takes a whole other kind of game. Like George Orwell was ana amazing truth-teller during this radio days, and then flipped into his satirist career, which was a little slower, and resulted in some serious failures (like the predictions in his essay The Lion and the Unicorn).


I thought satire was when you say something really stupid and then people laugh at you for being stupid and then you laugh at them because they're so stupid that they think you're stupid.
 
2012-04-29 12:06:01 AM
Not going to wate time with the resident trolls, but anyone who actually read my posts will see that I approve, agree with and endorse Colbert and Stewart (and Maher to a lesser extent). I am a long-time fan of Colbert and i think he tears satirises right-wing thought better thanj anyone, and said so repeatedly. I love that he mocked Koch and the cardinal to their face just like he did to Bush- and I even linked a half hour of his brilliant eviscerating of Bush and the neo-cons at the press club.

I have said explicitly that they do good and important work pointing out the bullshiat and calling important people to task.

My ONLY observation is that they are comedians, and should not be relied upon as a legitimate news source, because the nature of what they do requires slanting and distortion sometimes for comedic affect or to enhance the impact of the point they are making. This is good and necessary part of their trade- they do not purport to be an objective source of information. Like a photo of a skunk should not be confused with a drawing of Pepe Le Pew, their work is illuminating and fact based, but is not necessarily factual.

I know it can be frustrating for the slap-fight trolls in a thread like this when no one is taking a position worth arguing with and that the feebler trolls can find no recourse but to concoct strawmen where none exist, but this is particularly sad and pathetic. And I know many Farkers who come solely to try to start a slap-fight can get very angry when no one will play with them, but I refuse to knowingly feed the trolls.

All of this was said above, and is available for review.

Everyone have a good night.
 
2012-04-29 12:11:17 AM
Lol. Projection at it's finest.
 
2012-04-29 12:12:39 AM
BojanglesPaladin is right and you libs just don't get it
 
2012-04-29 12:15:26 AM

Bennie Crabtree: BojanglesPaladin: "Stewart. Colbert. Maher. These are today's leading truth tellers."

Oh good grief.

I have a serious man-crush on Colbert, and I think all three of these guys (though Bill Maher least) are very effective and important satirists and comentators.

But Today's Leading Truth-Tellers? Not even close. Too often they need to slant and mischaricterize for comedic effect. To often an intentionally biased take is funnier than an objective one, and let's be honest... None of these guys is even pretending to be unbiased.

I think it's great that we have guys like this, and honestly, I Dig Colbert for being very bold and holding no punches even when he's face to face (hello Bush). but these guys are not "truth tellers" by any stretch.

And it makes me a little sad that so many people can't see the difference.

Okay, I feel like this is not trolling, so i will respond seriously.

To be a really good, very effective truth-teller takes a long, long time with research and with data collection. You need to use the public record and have lots of practice doing it. You know how to build bibliographies, and you actually read end notes.

If you are an absolute maestro truth-teller, you can't do it everyday, at a national level. You spend too much time being precise, working hard, and mentoring a small group of helpers who inspire you. You become a minister to a church who reads all the time and has conversations with people at every level of society. You become a professor who hits the streets doing embedded research. You need an encyclopedic memory for movies, books (and you read books, not wikipedia), you can look things up, and you do - you don't look up definitions, you have read tens of thousands of pages of fiction, nonfiction, and poetry, and spent a few decades with lovers, family, and debating with friends and enemies. Dictionary definitions don't work for you, and encyclopedia or wiki entries are obviously too shallow. You look things up in all kinds of diffe ...


I think this was a well thought out response. Thank you.
I don't think there is a binary choice between perfect purveyor of truth and lie distributor. I think all three of these men are well informed and well supported in their facts. But what they do is not designed or intended to be fact-finding exposes, and should not be regarded as such. As I said above, they are generally fact-based, but what and how they present should not be considered factual (though it may very well be). Good comedy and good satire ate always based in truth. As Homer said- it's funny cause it's true. And yes they do often 'speak truth to power'. But that is not the same thing as being a legitimate news source, or of being a 'truth teller' - there is too much commentary for them to deliver the unvarnished truth.

Although I imagine the defininition of what 'truth teller' means accounts for much of the dispute here.
 
2012-04-29 12:15:57 AM

BojanglesPaladin: anyone who actually read my posts will see that I approve, agree with and endorse Colbert and Stewart (and Maher to a lesser extent). I am a long-time fan of Colbert and i think he tears satirises right-wing thought better thanj anyone, and said so repeatedly. I love that he mocked Koch and the cardinal to their face just like he did to Bush- and I even linked a half hour of his brilliant eviscerating of Bush and the neo-cons at the press club.

I have said explicitly that they do good and important work pointing out the bullshiat and calling important people to task.

danceswithfat.files.wordpress.com

My ONLY observation is that they are comedians, and should not be relied upon as a legitimate news source, because the nature of what they do requires slanting and distortion sometimes for comedic affect or to enhance the impact of the point they are making. This is good and necessary part of their trade- they do not purport to be an objective source of information. Like a photo of a skunk should not be confused with a drawing of Pepe Le Pew, their work is illuminating and fact based, but is not necessarily factual.

I know it can be frustrating for the slap-fight trolls in a thread like this when no one is taking a position worth arguing with and that the feebler trolls can find no recourse but to concoct strawmen where none exist, but this is particularly sad and pathetic. And I know many Farkers who come solely to try to start a slap-fight can get very angry when no one will play with them, but I refuse to knowingly feed the trolls.

All of this was said above, and is available for review.

Everyone have a good night.



As we mentioned, Colbert and Stewart and the others are not seen as a source of news. The statistics bear that out. Daily Show viewers, for examples, are FAR better informed than those who watch Fox News.

The ONLY point most of us are making is that Maher, Colbert and Stewart are the only news or semi-news folks who will actually call Santorum a farking theocrat moran who is too dumb to get on Wheel of Fortune. Very few news folks will actually point out the depths to which the Republicans have sunk and how much righties really hate the way the country works. Most of us are just hoping that Brian Williams signs on someday and says, "The Romney campaign is attacking Obama's job records? Holy shiat! Romney literally exterminated tens of thousands of jobs while making millions in profits at zero risk!"
 
2012-04-29 12:20:55 AM
I'll try it one last way, then I'm done for the night.

No matter HOW bad the current state of journalism is (see above for my stated take on THAT hot mess), that does not make any of these men journalists. In many ways, they are BETTER than journalists, but they are not a legitimate news source and each of them is on record saying that themselves.

Saying that they are saying what others won't is true. We agree, but that really has little bearing on my point.
 
2012-04-29 12:29:33 AM

BojanglesPaladin: I farking love Colbert, and I give him mad props for publicly mocking Koch to his face just as I did when he did it to GW TO HIS FACE.



Yeah, good luck doing an act like that to Putin. Well, OK, good luck doing an act like that to Putin.... TWICE.
 
2012-04-29 12:35:04 AM

Rincewind53: I want to have wild, hot, gay sex with Stephen Colbert.

And I'm not even gay.


This comment sums up how every liberal feels about anybody who bashes Republicans. You people truly are repugnant.
 
2012-04-29 12:35:06 AM
Colbert made his own Super PAC, and then showed us all the fundamentally dishonest things that can be done with that PAC by actually doing those things himself. There is no more fundamental source of truth than this. Any investigative reporter just telling us that PACs are bad could not come close to what he as accomplished.
 
2012-04-29 12:41:04 AM

The Dog Ate The Constitution: Rincewind53: I want to have wild, hot, gay sex with Stephen Colbert.

And I'm not even gay.

This comment sums up how every liberal feels about anybody who bashes Republicans. You people truly are repugnant.


"I like pudding."

This comment sums up how every liberal feels about any dessert which is delicious. You dishes truly are delicious.
 
2012-04-29 12:41:10 AM

BojanglesPaladin: I'll try it one last way, then I'm done for the night.

No matter HOW bad the current state of journalism is (see above for my stated take on THAT hot mess), that does not make any of these men journalists. In many ways, they are BETTER than journalists, but they are not a legitimate news source and each of them is on record saying that themselves.

Saying that they are saying what others won't is true. We agree, but that really has little bearing on my point.



In essence that's a semantic point, and those are pretty useless even when true. Sure, you made a valid point there - but not a meaningful one. I haven't read all the posts in this thread, but I sure hope everyone hasn't been wasting time arguing that point with you.

In the final analysis, who cares what name they're called if they're doing the job of conveying information that the press is supposed to but doesn't? Is the moniker of "news source" important or is the information that one of them is supposed to convey the actual important thing?
 
2012-04-29 12:51:44 AM

mongbiohazard:
In essence that's a semantic point, and those are pretty useless even when true. Sure, you made a valid point there - but not a meaningful one. I haven't read all the posts in this thread, but I sure hope everyone hasn't been wasting time arguing that point with you.


No argument here. It was a semantic point from the get-go. There are just some Farkers who find it easier to attack what they WANT to read, rather than what was written.

Have a good night.
 
2012-04-29 12:54:49 AM

The Dog Ate The Constitution: Rincewind53: I want to have wild, hot, gay sex with Stephen Colbert.

And I'm not even gay.

This comment sums up how every liberal feels about anybody who bashes Republicans. You people truly are repugnant.


Oh, were your wittle feewings hurt?

FYFProfile: I used to frequent Fark until it was overrun by liberals, only to return recently to see it's gotten worse.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.
 
2012-04-29 01:03:33 AM

BojanglesPaladin: I'll try it one last way,


If you stick with saying things ONE way, and then don't pretend you didn't say it later, that would save everyone a lot more time than you saying it a bunch of different ways in the hopes that some people will agree with one or more of them.

BojanglesPaladin: There are just some Farkers who find it easier to attack what they WANT to read, rather than what was written.


See the below:

BojanglesPaladin: these guys are not "truth tellers" by any stretch.


BojanglesPaladin: cameroncrazy1984: You said they are not "truth tellers"

I said they are not (as the article writer said)"...today's leading truth tellers".


Which, you may note, is not the same thing as saying they never say true things.

I believe you are just being obtuse for your own amusement.




The issue here isn't that someone is reading what they want to read and not what you type. The issue is that you typed what you didn't mean to say, and people read exactly what you typed. Which given that you managed to be the center of attention for the entire thread makes you either the sneakiest troll ever, or an honest person who is one of the most frustrating people to have a discussion with.
 
2012-04-29 01:03:35 AM

BojanglesPaladin: I'll try it one last way, then I'm done for the night.

No matter HOW bad the current state of journalism is (see above for my stated take on THAT hot mess), that does not make any of these men journalists. In many ways, they are BETTER than journalists, but they are not a legitimate news source and each of them is on record saying that themselves.

Saying that they are saying what others won't is true. We agree, but that really has little bearing on my point.


4funz.com
 
2012-04-29 01:11:20 AM

ds_4815: Shrugging Atlas: I was thinking Dolan.

[cache.ohinternet.com image 444x414]


ohinternet? GTFO
 
2012-04-29 01:30:02 AM

Mentat: I thought satire was when you say something really stupid and then people laugh at you for being stupid and then you laugh at them because they're so stupid that they think you're stupid.


Almost! I think that's actually called "subtlety." Like when Homer Simpson is fat and does something dumb you really know he's just being dumb because his writers are smart and probably not fat. Like when his has to wear a mumu and get a dialing wand because of all the donuts. Only really subtle minds can pick up on the humor.

BojanglesPaladin: I know what you are going through. I see what you are saying. Yeah, this thread is all some kind of semantic nightmare. But if you just walk away from the thread, put on some Radiohead, and play air guitar, you will get over it by tomorrow. Thanks for the chance to think about the passing comments made by strangers.
 
2012-04-29 01:31:19 AM
This Colbert guy, and Stewart too, is getting close to George Carlin quality.
 
2012-04-29 01:43:01 AM

teto85: This Colbert guy, and Stewart too, is getting close to George Carlin quality.


Carlin was more clever, but also more bitter.
 
2012-04-29 01:47:20 AM
Winterwhile is so awesome, he codes BASIC in COBAL.

Forever alone
 
2012-04-29 01:51:44 AM

quatchi: By the way, if David Koch likes his waiter tonight, he will be your next congressman.

*standing ovation*


That's how Mike Pompeo got his current gig, more or less.

/resident of the 4th Congressional District in Kansas
 
2012-04-29 02:02:56 AM
Aexia: Lenny_da_Hog:

[i262.photobucket.com image 518x477]

I found out recently that the "FREE GOVERNMENT MONEY" guy lives in my neighborhood. He apparently likes to roll into coffee shops in his full getup and then wait for people to recognize him.


Um, no. He doesn't actually "wait for people to recognize him.". I have encountered him numerous times.
 
2012-04-29 02:10:21 AM

ComicBookGuy: Aexia: Lenny_da_Hog:

[i262.photobucket.com image 518x477]

I found out recently that the "FREE GOVERNMENT MONEY" guy lives in my neighborhood. He apparently likes to roll into coffee shops in his full getup and then wait for people to recognize him.

Um, no. He doesn't actually "wait for people to recognize him.". I have encountered him numerous times.


He was at the Rally to Restore Sanity. And an anti-war march. And a Tea Party rally. I think he just goes to all of the stuff on the Mall.
 
2012-04-29 02:22:35 AM

ecl: Can anyone find the first time when winterwhile said best part forever?


Yep.
 
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