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(Fox News)   You're the founder of the "It Gets Better" campaign and delivering an anti-bullying speech. Do you: C) call the Christian teens in attendance "pansy asses" and mock them for walking out of your tirade?   (radio.foxnews.com) divider line 894
    More: Fail, sex columnist, Dan Savage, advice column, Christian mythology, JEA, Savage Love, speeches  
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12774 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Apr 2012 at 2:17 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-04-29 01:59:56 AM
Failed spokesman failure.

/fired in 3, 2, 1
 
2012-04-29 02:01:18 AM

Pockafrusta: Failed spokesman failure.

/fired in 3, 2, 1


Dan is awesome. He isn't going anywhere.
 
2012-04-29 02:02:09 AM

domesticatedviking: Coelacanth: [i249.photobucket.com image 500x399]

You may wish to explain this data point.


Buzz apparently didn't like Space Food Sticks.
 
2012-04-29 02:03:49 AM

rynthetyn: One way or another, you're victim blaming, and victim blaming is a pretty jerk move.


It's same derp I see on YouTube: "OMG! u kelleded yoursef becos ur a pussy! Man up and take et!LOLOLOL"

I attempted suicide several times before I even reached my teens. I was being molested by a family member, which triggered episodes of manic depression. Half the time I wanted to die because of the crippling depression - the other half of the time was because I was being sexually abused and no one believed me. Thankfully, I got professional help and my abuser died. I didn't really deal with my sexuality until college, so I was fortunate in that respect.

So basically, if you think bullied teens are pansies because they want to get away from the constant pain forced on them 24/7, then you're an asshole. Anyone that acts so glib about it after suffering through the same just makes them a dick.
 
2012-04-29 02:03:57 AM

s2s2s2: rynthetyn: s2s2s2: rynthetyn: s2s2s2: eddiesocket: s2s2s2: eddiesocket: s2s2s2: Keizer_Ghidorah: s2s2s2: Nothing more pansy ass than offing yourself because some stupid people were mean to you.

We don't really care about your ITG status. Maybe if you had experienced daily torment during your childhood, teen years, and young adulthood for the crime of being slightly different you'd understand why some people chose death to end the suffering. Especially when your difference was actively encouraged to be tormented by parents, teachers, people in authority, etc.

Funny you should mention that. I was bullied for being gay!

So instead of killing yourself, you became a rotten, bitter person. Kudos!

Not really, but thanks for choosing me as the screen for you projection.

Only one of us here have called dead, bullied teenagers "pansies". I'll let the rest of the group decide if those are the words of a rotten, bitter person or not.

No. I called their actions pansy. Like Dan Savage did to the people who took pansy assed action in response to his reasoned analysis of how people cherry pick the bible. But I understand how you could be confused about what I meant, and take offense.

Because being horribly depressed means you're a pansy. Nice. Way to blame the victim.

Not what I said, but way to adopt the teabagger point of view.

One way or another, you're victim blaming, and victim blaming is a pretty jerk move.

So we are talking about murder, and not suicide? Suicide is taking responsibility for your own death, and it is contagious. I blame bullies for bullying. Suicide is on the person that commits it. No need to blame them, I am characterizing the act. Not blaming anyone. Stop romanticising self murder.


When someone is clinically depressed because they've been told over and over and over again that they're completely worthless and that it would be more merciful if God just struck them dead, then no, I'm not going to blame that person for deciding to end it. It's the fault of the people who made the kid's life a living hell day in and day out.

I can't believe someone is so lacking in compassion.
 
2012-04-29 02:09:16 AM

s2s2s2: Stop romanticising self murder.


WTF? How is convincing people to NOT KILL THEMSELVES considered "romancing suicide"? This isn't f*cking Romeo & Juliet.

You spewed some serious Palin levels of derp right there.
 
2012-04-29 02:14:45 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: s2s2s2: Stop romanticising self murder.

WTF? How is convincing people to NOT KILL THEMSELVES considered "romancing suicide"? This isn't f*cking Romeo & Juliet.

You spewed some serious Palin levels of derp right there.


Yeah, I'm pretty proud of Trig, there.
Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies. You folks are much smarter than me, and now that I am too angry to continue, I am going to go to bed.


/rawr!
 
2012-04-29 02:18:01 AM

s2s2s2: FuryOfFirestorm: s2s2s2: Stop romanticising self murder.

WTF? How is convincing people to NOT KILL THEMSELVES considered "romancing suicide"? This isn't f*cking Romeo & Juliet.

You spewed some serious Palin levels of derp right there.

Yeah, I'm pretty proud of Trig, there.
Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies. You folks are much smarter than me, and now that I am too angry to continue, I am going to go to bed.


/rawr!


If you honestly cannot tell the difference between depressed, bullied kids and some self-righteous kids who walked out of a conference in protest, you've got some wires crossed in your brain or something.
 
2012-04-29 02:22:25 AM

rynthetyn: s2s2s2: FuryOfFirestorm: s2s2s2: Stop romanticising self murder.

WTF? How is convincing people to NOT KILL THEMSELVES considered "romancing suicide"? This isn't f*cking Romeo & Juliet.

You spewed some serious Palin levels of derp right there.

Yeah, I'm pretty proud of Trig, there.
Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies. You folks are much smarter than me, and now that I am too angry to continue, I am going to go to bed.


/rawr!

If you honestly cannot tell the difference between depressed, bullied kids and some self-righteous kids who walked out of a conference in protest, you've got some wires crossed in your brain or something.


Both are victims of hate filled lies. Are they not?
 
2012-04-29 02:22:35 AM

s2s2s2: Yeah, I'm pretty proud of Trig, there.
Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies. You folks are much smarter than me, and now that I am too angry to continue, I am going to go to bed.


Wow. You sure showed us! Chirstians getting butthurt when their religion is questioned is EXACTLY THE SAME THING as kids killing themselves after being continually taunted and beaten.

Oh wait...IT'S NOT THE SAME! All you've "proven" is what a colossal dick you are. Congratulations.
 
2012-04-29 02:28:20 AM

s2s2s2: Both are victims of hate filled lies. Are they not?


How is pointing out the inconsistencies and hypocrisy of their bigotry "hate filled lies"?

Examples of hate filled lies would be: "You're all mentally ill child-molesters" or "You're all going to hell because Jesus said so!".

Telling Christians that it's hypocritical to follow some laws of the Bible while ignoring those inconvenient to them is not "hate" or "lies"
 
2012-04-29 02:30:01 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: s2s2s2: Both are victims of hate filled lies. Are they not?

How is pointing out the inconsistencies and hypocrisy of their bigotry "hate filled lies"?

Examples of hate filled lies would be: "You're all mentally ill child-molesters" or "You're all going to hell because Jesus said so!".

Telling Christians that it's hypocritical to follow some laws of the Bible while ignoring those inconvenient to them is not "hate" or "lies"


I'm beginning to think s2s2s2 didn't bother to watch the video and/or is just bored and trolling, considering that this makes zero sense.
 
2012-04-29 02:32:01 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: s2s2s2: Yeah, I'm pretty proud of Trig, there.
Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies. You folks are much smarter than me, and now that I am too angry to continue, I am going to go to bed.

Wow. You sure showed us! Chirstians getting butthurt when their religion is questioned is EXACTLY THE SAME THING as kids killing themselves after being continually taunted and beaten.

Oh wait...IT'S NOT THE SAME! All you've "proven" is what a colossal dick you are. Congratulations.


Making a distinction between a person and an act is simply that. A different set of circumstances doesn't absolve one and indict the other. Dan wasn't being a dick, neither was I. We both said it is a pansy assed move to remove yourself from a situation you could handle, but don't because you think you can't. It gets better, right? Are you suggesting it doesn't?
 
2012-04-29 02:36:05 AM

rynthetyn: I'm beginning to think s2s2s2 didn't bother to watch the video and/or is just bored and trolling, considering that this makes zero sense


Yeah. Between this thread and the Zimmeran threads, I'm 100% convinced he's a troll. Oh well. Orange #3 for him then.

I never give them the satisfaction of getting mad or putting them on the ignore list. After the sh*t I lived through, trolls are just entertaining distractions compared to that.
 
2012-04-29 02:38:01 AM
Finally, something we can all agree on! s2s2s2 is a colossal dick.
 
2012-04-29 02:39:33 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: rynthetyn: I'm beginning to think s2s2s2 didn't bother to watch the video and/or is just bored and trolling, considering that this makes zero sense

Yeah. Between this thread and the Zimmeran threads, I'm 100% convinced he's a troll. Oh well. Orange #3 for him then.

I never give them the satisfaction of getting mad or putting them on the ignore list. After the sh*t I lived through, trolls are just entertaining distractions compared to that.


I meant the Christians are victims of hate filled lies, from the church. Jeez Lou freaking ise.

/looks good in orange
//doesn't want to make you mad
 
2012-04-29 02:41:10 AM

Max Awesome: Finally, something we can all agree on! s2s2s2 is a colossal dick.


I'm average. Now envirodud...
 
2012-04-29 02:41:42 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: rynthetyn: I'm beginning to think s2s2s2 didn't bother to watch the video and/or is just bored and trolling, considering that this makes zero sense

Yeah. Between this thread and the Zimmeran threads, I'm 100% convinced he's a troll. Oh well. Orange #3 for him then.

I never give them the satisfaction of getting mad or putting them on the ignore list. After the sh*t I lived through, trolls are just entertaining distractions compared to that.


The only people who go on my ignore list are the boring repetitive trolls.
 
2012-04-29 02:43:45 AM

s2s2s2: Making a distinction between a person and an act is simply that. A different set of circumstances doesn't absolve one and indict the other. Dan wasn't being a dick, neither was I. We both said it is a pansy assed move to remove yourself from a situation you could handle, but don't because you think you can't. It gets better, right? Are you suggesting it doesn't?


And you're making a comparison between 2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT situations. Bullied teens can't get away from getting picked on at school or hateful parents at home. The "persecuted" Christians weren't forced to attend or stay. They came in fully aware of Dan Savage and his distain for hypocrisy and bigotry.

: Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies.

And you've spent all your time defending bigots. *clap*
 
2012-04-29 02:45:59 AM
Awww. Rynthetyn! You are so sweet. Thank you.
I promise never to play around the outskirts of victim blaming again. It was illuminating. Thank you all for your replies. I have a lot to think about:)
 
2012-04-29 02:48:17 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: s2s2s2: Making a distinction between a person and an act is simply that. A different set of circumstances doesn't absolve one and indict the other. Dan wasn't being a dick, neither was I. We both said it is a pansy assed move to remove yourself from a situation you could handle, but don't because you think you can't. It gets better, right? Are you suggesting it doesn't?

And you're making a comparison between 2 COMPLETELY DIFFERENT situations. Bullied teens can't get away from getting picked on at school or hateful parents at home. The "persecuted" Christians weren't forced to attend or stay. They came in fully aware of Dan Savage and his distain for hypocrisy and bigotry.

: Well, it has been fun getting people that have defended Dan by saying he wasn't calling those kids pansies, get mad at me for not calling people that kill themselves pansies.

And you've spent all your time defending bigots. *clap*


Nah. Fnck them, too. I agree the bigots that left are pansy asses/bigots.
 
2012-04-29 02:53:05 AM
This thread needs more Barbra Bush and hot guys in speedos:

i42.photobucket.com
 
2012-04-29 02:57:15 AM

Max Awesome: This thread needs more Barbra Bush and hot guys in speedos:

[i42.photobucket.com image 373x550]


What's the story behind that pic?
 
2012-04-29 03:09:52 AM

rynthetyn: Max Awesome: This thread needs more Barbra Bush and hot guys in speedos:

[i42.photobucket.com image 373x550]

What's the story behind that pic?


Babs was just about to show him a trick with her pearl necklace that drove George Sr. wild...
 
2012-04-29 03:21:03 AM

s2s2s2: eddiesocket: s2s2s2: eddiesocket: "I believe suicide is a poor choice" is quite a retreat from, "Nothing more pansy ass than offing yourself because some stupid people were mean to you". Perhaps you're not quite the inhuman bastard you first appeared to be in the beginning.

I'm not. I've known people that have killed themselves(not because of gay-targeted bullying). It pisses me right the fark off.

Because when children are clinically depressed enough and feeling hopeless enough to take their own lives, what's really important is how you feel about it, naturally.

Seriously, you suck.

Suck what, exactly? Take the homophobic slurs out of your vocabulary. I wasn't talking about children.


Yes, you were. Now you're a liar, too.
 
2012-04-29 03:26:30 AM

s2s2s2: Awww. Rynthetyn! You are so sweet. Thank you.
I promise never to play around the outskirts of victim blaming again. It was illuminating. Thank you all for your replies. I have a lot to think about:)


People who are wrong about everything, while insisting they are right about everything, are not people known to "think."
 
2012-04-29 03:29:07 AM
I mean, if you fail to understand the basic psychology of your fellow Farker, do you really think you have any business telling anyone about human behavior? You just sound dumb and contrarian because that's probably how you make it through the day, most days.
 
2012-04-29 03:36:51 AM

truthseeker2083: "I woild like to see another source, as a 'culture wars' 'reporter' from fox news smacks of bias, but..."


loveblondieo: "I would like to see this story come from some other source than Fox."


illusionofjoy: "A link to Fox News? I'm sure the article is fair and balanced."


Giant Clown Shoe: "transcript or video required for opinion formation.

/fox news editorial isn't credible evidence imo"


usernameguy: "Fox News."


Mrtraveler01: "Seriously though, Fox News subby? Wake me up when you have a non-biased source for this story."



I know it's been posted a few times, but here y'all go - from the Huffington Post, no less. With full video:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/28/dan-savage-speech-controver sy _n_1461863.html

Here's a parallel:
An ostensibly pro-rights speaker gets up in front of a group of Americans and says, "We can learn to ignore the bullshiat in the Constitution about gun ownership rights, the same way we have learned to ignore the bullshiat in the Constitution about only counting three-fifths of a vote from slaves versus free men....we ignore bullshiat in the Constitution about all sorts of things....If the Constitution got the easiest democratic question that America has ever faced wrong -- voting equality -- what are the odds that the Constitution got something as complicated as the right to bear arms wrong? 100%"

...and then riles everyone up to laugh at the "Constitution guys down the hall" and calls them pansy-ass for walking out of your talk. Would a reporter be wrong for referring to the presentation an "anti-democracy tirade" and calling it out as a "Constitution-bashing, profanity-laced speech"? No - he would pretty much be spot on.

/not Christian
//anti bullying
///pro gay rights
////anti hypocrisy
//pro respect
 
2012-04-29 03:49:11 AM

s2s2s2:

So we are talking about murder, and not suicide? Suicide is taking responsibility for your own death, and it is contagious. I blame bullies for bullying. Suicide is on the person that commits it. No need to blame them, I am characterizing the act. Not blaming anyone. Stop romanticising self murder.


If God is real, and there is a hell, and there is any sense of justice at all in this God character, you'll end up there. You're a terrible person, right down to the core. Most people have at least a little bit of good in them, but not you. I don't mean this to say that you say terrible things, or that you do them, but that you, as a person, are an affront to all that is good in this world.
 
2012-04-29 03:54:56 AM

spmkk: .and then riles everyone up to laugh at the "Constitution guys down the hall" and calls them pansy-ass for walking out of your talk. Would a reporter be wrong for referring to the presentation an "anti-democracy tirade" and calling it out as a "Constitution-bashing, profanity-laced speech"? No - he would pretty much be spot on.


You'd have a point, only if pointing out inconsistencies in the Constitution is considered "bashing" and "anti-Democracy", or if a speech containing three explatives is considered "profanity laced".

criticism =/= hate.
 
2012-04-29 03:59:59 AM

firefly212: If God is real, and there is a hell, and there is any sense of justice at all in this God character, you'll end up there. You're a terrible person, right down to the core. Most people have at least a little bit of good in them, but not you. I don't mean this to say that you say terrible things, or that you do them, but that you, as a person, are an affront to all that is good in this world.


In a single thread, he defended hypocritical bigots, derided bullied teens and blamed suicide victims, all in the name of trolling. If there is such a thing as an Anti-Nobel Prize, he definitely won it.
 
2012-04-29 04:10:23 AM

spmkk: truthseeker2083: "I woild like to see another source, as a 'culture wars' 'reporter' from fox news smacks of bias, but..."

loveblondieo: "I would like to see this story come from some other source than Fox."

illusionofjoy: "A link to Fox News? I'm sure the article is fair and balanced."

Giant Clown Shoe: "transcript or video required for opinion formation.

/fox news editorial isn't credible evidence imo"

usernameguy: "Fox News."

Mrtraveler01: "Seriously though, Fox News subby? Wake me up when you have a non-biased source for this story."


I know it's been posted a few times, but here y'all go - from the Huffington Post, no less. With full video:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/28/dan-savage-speech-controver sy _n_1461863.html

Here's a parallel:
An ostensibly pro-rights speaker gets up in front of a group of Americans and says, "We can learn to ignore the bullshiat in the Constitution about gun ownership rights, the same way we have learned to ignore the bullshiat in the Constitution about only counting three-fifths of a vote from slaves versus free men....we ignore bullshiat in the Constitution about all sorts of things....If the Constitution got the easiest democratic question that America has ever faced wrong -- voting equality -- what are the odds that the Constitution got something as complicated as the right to bear arms wrong? 100%"

...and then riles everyone up to laugh at the "Constitution guys down the hall" and calls them pansy-ass for walking out of your talk. Would a reporter be wrong for referring to the presentation an "anti-democracy tirade" and calling it out as a "Constitution-bashing, profanity-laced speech"? No - he would pretty much be spot on.

/not Christian
//anti bullying
///pro gay rights
////anti hypocrisy
//pro respect


The only thing that was disrespectful was the "pansy ass" comment, so no, the reporter WOULD be wrong. And don't say "profanity-laced" as if a specific combination of letters and phonemes could invalidate his point because it's considered "rude." Everything he said about the constitution is absolutely correct, and pointing out real, visible inconsistencies in an effort to get people to help IMPROVE the quality of life for the entire country is not anti-democracy. Yes, it was hypocritical to call them pansy-asses, because that IS bullying, however I can also understand that frustration with a seemingly unchangable situation can push people to say stupid things. Considering that these same "christians" are the bullies usually, I'm sure it didn't hurt that they got a taste of their own medicine for a change. I'm pro-respect too - which is why the christians who walked out on a man just because they had different opinions than him deserved to be called out for THEIR disrespectful behavior.
 
2012-04-29 04:14:50 AM

spmkk: Here's a parallel:


Never make analogies again.
 
2012-04-29 04:24:30 AM

spmkk: truthseeker2083:

Here's a parallel:


That made about as much sense as Barbra Bush partying with hot guys in speedos.
 
2012-04-29 04:48:11 AM

Keizer_Ghidorah: High-schoolers aren't children


Ha ha. Really? You must not know many highschoolers - or must not know / understand them very well...

Males don't become grown-ups until their 25 (mentally, that is... the ability to reason and make decisions, yada yada). For women, it's 22.5.
 
2012-04-29 05:41:07 AM

sweatybronson: Keizer_Ghidorah: High-schoolers aren't children

Ha ha. Really? You must not know many highschoolers - or must not know / understand them very well...

Males don't become grown-ups until their 25 (mentally, that is... the ability to reason and make decisions, yada yada). For women, it's 22.5.


Ah, magic numbers. They are amazing.
 
2012-04-29 05:56:03 AM

sweatybronson: Keizer_Ghidorah: High-schoolers aren't children

Ha ha. Really? You must not know many highschoolers - or must not know / understand them very well...

Males don't become grown-ups until their 25 (mentally, that is... the ability to reason and make decisions, yada yada). For women, it's 22.5.


On overall average, yeah, though with individual variation of course. The development of the frontal lobe is not complete until some time in the twenties. Up until that time, decisions are made with the primary input being from the limbic system, and emotionally based decisions are generally pretty dumb and childish...
 
2012-04-29 06:42:02 AM
If somebody is bashing-your-head-in with a bible you're perfectly justified to grab it out of their hands, open it to a relevant passage and point out to them that it's probably not something Jesus would approve of. That's essentially what Dan Savage did in his lecture.

This is a uniquely personal topic for me. I've spent way too many years agonizing over the glaring contradiction between the loving message of Jesus and the reality of the complete ass-hats who profess to follow his teachings and who call themselves Christian.

csb: I used to love Jesus. My idols were Jesus, Superman, Batman - and maybe Spider-Man - in that order. I wanted to be just like Him someday, or as close as humanly possible, and I became an altar boy to begin learning how to be truly close to God. But unfortunately all I learned was that actual living breathing non-mythological Christians are just typical tribal hypocrites who will do anything to protect their sacred institutions - including sacrificing their own children.

Turns out the leaders of our faith had decided to hide a pedophile priest from across the country in our quiet little parish, and then just wash their hands of him. No oversight, no monitoring - they just offered-up the asses of the kids in our community to save themselves some bad publicity out east.

As a result our new priest was far more interested in what was under my robes than what was in my heart and I quickly learned that there really was no God, or Jesus, or Superman who was going to swoop in and save me. It didn't have to take very many hands-on lessons from the priest in the chapel after Sunday services before I became a hard-nosed skeptic and atheist of the highest order. The scales were lifted from my eyes so to speak, and quite forcefully I might add.

It was a blessing in a way, as it turns out that I'm gay, and have been aware of my attraction to men - and resulting complete lack of attraction to women - from a very early age. If I had continued my religious studies as I had hoped I would likely have become a very tortured soul in that repressive homophobic environment. So yay, I suppose?

I've also been on the receiving end of some very pointed homophobic hatred as an adult. Apparently just walking through a gay-friendly neighbourhood in the evening is enough to cause some straight people to want to jump you in a group, punch you to the ground, kick you in the head and stab you in the the gut. Who knew? It was certainly a surprise to me.

I grew up knowing that my culture, my (former) church, my family would rather I as a gay man didn't exist at all, and had struggled with the internalized hatred and self-loathing that those constant negative messages had caused to blossom and grow like a dark choking weed around my soul. But I managed to survive turbulent adolescence and eke out some measure of self-worth as an adult. I'd even started to learn to have some faith in my fellow man as I developed healthy relationships with fellow outcasts in the gay community and kind, decent, caring individuals of all types.

But then I was forcefully taught how blind hatred can impact a single life, and how quickly it can take it all away. Too many hard lessons from both Christians and straight people in this one short life I'm afraid - and I'm just one of many. Far far too many young people who are shunned by their families and communities just because of the biological fact that they don't happen to be attracted to the opposite sex.

Imagine if we did the same thing to kids who are born with other physical quirks - if we demonized deaf people, or outlawed marriage between the blind, or if left-handed children were considered mentally-defective and were bullied by kids and even teachers because of it. Parents would be outraged. But if their kid turns out to be gay far too many parents turn on them - and then turn them out on to the street.

Anyway, now I'm rambling. I appreciate Callous' attempt to explain the thinking behind the anti-gay sentiment of the Christians in their community, but I'm not going to go out-of-my way to reach out to any persons who think I'm less-than-human because their pastor tells them so. I'm not going to turn the other cheek - I have no desire to. I'm not Christian so there is no compelling reason for me to counter hatred with humility and love. That's a sucker's game.
 
2012-04-29 07:00:46 AM
@Max Awesome: I'm sorry you had to suffer through all that bullsh*t. Keep being awesome!

(PS - I put you down as Cyan #3. Awesome guys get that color. Red is for trolls, orange for colossal dicks and yellow for annoying twats. The politics threads look like a beautiful sunset)
 
2012-04-29 07:48:37 AM

Urbn: People_are_Idiots: eddiesocket: People_are_Idiots: Second, that is what is called "verbal abuse." As stated, bullying is more than physical.


Absolutely no verbal abuse took place. What video did you even watch?

The one where people walked out because he was beating up the bible, something people in, then saying the honest act of walking out of something they did not like was a pansy-add move. Would you stay if I attacked your beliefs, then think nothing of it if I berated you because you walked out?

I'm sorry if your beliefs are so weak that someone disagreeing with them is unbearable to even hear. My beliefs are attacked every day by fundamentalists and conservatives that are related to me or live around me or are elected by the voters in my red district. I've never just walked away while one of them is talking (I guess if someone got violent and was threatening me with harm, I probably would walk away, but not just because they said something I disagree with). I have listened to politicians at town halls while they spout stuff I absolutely disagree with. I have listened to family members say stuff that attacks my values and beliefs. We listen to bigoted stuff all the time. The religious and conservatives have the microphone every day. Don't pretend like you're so persecuted.


I am sorry you had a gun to your head while all those people went on lengthy (and possibly wrong) tirades on how wrong your belief system is, without even trying to change the subject. Personally, I'd consider getting a firearm so you can fire back.

Seriously now, anyone can simply change the subject or walk away from speakers and demonstrators. Most of my news, oddly enough, is a mild dose of Fark, The Onion, and my local paper. It's not weak in belief to walk away from someone sewing filth, or bashing something or someone you like. Yes I could try and change their minds, and I have tried. Every time I hear someone spewing hatred (especially at this Baptist church I avoid), I simply tend to ignore, since I have found that some people are unable to be changed. The best thing you can do is not allow their idiocy to filter into your ears. After all, can you stand a "Uwe Boll" marathon?

BTW: If you so are inclined, if you have a Christian that is an idiot fire/brimstone, please quote at him/her Matthew 7:1 or even John 8:7. Let me know their reactions please :)
 
2012-04-29 07:56:34 AM

spmkk: truthseeker2083: "I woild like to see another source, as a 'culture wars' 'reporter' from fox news smacks of bias, but..."

loveblondieo: "I would like to see this story come from some other source than Fox."

illusionofjoy: "A link to Fox News? I'm sure the article is fair and balanced."

Giant Clown Shoe: "transcript or video required for opinion formation.

/fox news editorial isn't credible evidence imo"

usernameguy: "Fox News."

Mrtraveler01: "Seriously though, Fox News subby? Wake me up when you have a non-biased source for this story."


I know it's been posted a few times, but here y'all go - from the Huffington Post, no less. With full video:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/28/dan-savage-speech-controver sy _n_1461863.html

Here's a parallel:
An ostensibly pro-rights speaker gets up in front of a group of Americans and says, "We can learn to ignore the bullshiat in the Constitution about gun ownership rights, the same way we have learned to ignore the bullshiat in the Constitution about only counting three-fifths of a vote from slaves versus free men....we ignore bullshiat in the Constitution about all sorts of things....If the Constitution got the easiest democratic question that America has ever faced wrong -- voting equality -- what are the odds that the Constitution got something as complicated as the right to bear arms wrong? 100%"

...and then riles everyone up to laugh at the "Constitution guys down the hall" and calls them pansy-ass for walking out of your talk. Would a reporter be wrong for referring to the presentation an "anti-democracy tirade" and calling it out as a "Constitution-bashing, profanity-laced speech"? No - he would pretty much be spot on.

/not Christian
//anti bullying
///pro gay rights
////anti hypocrisy
//pro respect


To be fair, I asked for one before they were posted. Thanks anyways tho.
 
2012-04-29 08:49:59 AM
Watched the actual video. Fox, of course, distorts the message. Savage is talking about how some people readily ignore the BS in the Bible about slavery and shell fish and menstruation, but swear by what it says about homosexuality. And he said that the kids were "being pansy assed" not were "pansy asses," which is him labeling the behavior not the kids. The kids bounced as soon as he said the word "b*llsh*t" in the same sentence about the Bible, i.e. they were primed to run at the first sign of controversy to make their own, narrow point about him. So much for open minds.
 
2012-04-29 10:09:38 AM

peterquince: Also, this was a seminar - wasn't provided by a government institution.


Ah; didn't catch that. So, probably fine from an establishment clause stance.

Still have major doubts about "pansy-ass"; especially in the context of bullying over homosexuality, come to think of it. Though thinking about it, a case might be made given the experimental data suggesting aggressive homophobia is associated with being way into the closet.
 
2012-04-29 10:30:27 AM

Keizer_Ghidorah: phoolishone: Keizer_Ghidorah: phoolishone: The My Little Pony Killer: phoolishone: peterquince: phoolishone: That he resorted to bullying was quixotic;

He expressed disbelief at their reactions. That's not bullying. That's questioning their behavior.

Making fun of people's religion is bullying. Calling people names is bullying. He didn't say to them, "Why are you leaving? You are cowards for leaving." He berated their religion and called them "pansy-asses".

BTW, isn't "pansy" synonymous with "gay"? The man who didn't want the mean old Christians to bully gay people was calling them gay? LOL whut?

You got it backwards. Watch the video.

Yes, you're right, I did see the video later. He did indeed calmly call them out for walking away, and then called them pansy-assed.

His basic argument was they could dish it out but they couldn't take it. I think that's a pretty heavy burden to place on kids he doesn't know. His only indictment was that they believed in the Bible and their religion enough to walk out of his talk when he began berating it.

His attempt to place the adult burden of analyzing their faith on them backfired; we all know how kids that age are 100% sure of everything they believe, especially when they've been heavily brainwashed. Savage did a good job of making sure they stay stubbornly entrenched in their beliefs for years to come, simply by attacking them out of left field.

He didn't "attack" THEM. He called them out on their immature behavior. Two different things, and frankly we need to start doing it more often. If those students were willing to just up and walk out before Savage could begin that part of the talk, they're not ones who would change their minds or even have an open mind in the first place.

Sure he attacked them, in a mocking, condescending, and profanity-laden way. They did not sign up for a lecture on why their Christian values were wrong, nor were they toting signs and chanting anti-gay slogans. These were kids -- immature huma ...


I have no problem battling Christian hypocrisy and prejudice. I think it's wise to pick one's battles. These children were not there to protest gays (which would legitimately inspire pushback,) nor did they come to hear their faith mocked.

Sometimes people who have no particular faith think that people who do have faith should somehow not be offended when their beliefs are made fun of. Think, for a minute. How does that make any sense? Just because you would not be offended, somehow that means they should not be? Perhaps one should contemplate more closely the nature of faith and belief.

I saw some of those kids disturbed and near tears. Watch again.

Why foster enmity when it's not necessary? Fight with the adults who have the capacity to question their own beliefs -- especially the ones who are sponsoring anti-gay legislation or chanting anti-gay slogans. Don't pressure the kids who either don't have the developed character or the family circumstances to do so. And don't call them (or their behavior) "pansies-assed" when they do what they've been taught is right.

And yes, I'll fight people who bully Christian kids for being Christian just as adamantly as I'll fight those who bully gay kids for being gay.
 
2012-04-29 10:30:34 AM
Mongo only pawn in game of life.
 
2012-04-29 10:48:07 AM

eddiesocket: s2s2s2: eddiesocket: s2s2s2: eddiesocket: "I believe suicide is a poor choice" is quite a retreat from, "Nothing more pansy ass than offing yourself because some stupid people were mean to you". Perhaps you're not quite the inhuman bastard you first appeared to be in the beginning.

I'm not. I've known people that have killed themselves(not because of gay-targeted bullying). It pisses me right the fark off.

Because when children are clinically depressed enough and feeling hopeless enough to take their own lives, what's really important is how you feel about it, naturally.

Seriously, you suck.

Suck what, exactly? Take the homophobic slurs out of your vocabulary. I wasn't talking about children.

Yes, you were. Now you're a liar, too.


None of the people I knew were children, so no, I wasn't.
 
2012-04-29 11:05:16 AM

firefly212: s2s2s2:

So we are talking about murder, and not suicide? Suicide is taking responsibility for your own death, and it is contagious. I blame bullies for bullying. Suicide is on the person that commits it. No need to blame them, I am characterizing the act. Not blaming anyone. Stop romanticising self murder.

If God is real, and there is a hell, and there is any sense of justice at all in this God character, you'll end up there. You're a terrible person, right down to the core. Most people have at least a little bit of good in them, but not you. I don't mean this to say that you say terrible things, or that you do them, but that you, as a person, are an affront to all that is good in this world.


Well that is just stupid. Why should your lack of reading comprehension be cause to send me to hell?
 
2012-04-29 11:09:38 AM

FuryOfFirestorm: firefly212: If God is real, and there is a hell, and there is any sense of justice at all in this God character, you'll end up there. You're a terrible person, right down to the core. Most people have at least a little bit of good in them, but not you. I don't mean this to say that you say terrible things, or that you do them, but that you, as a person, are an affront to all that is good in this world.

In a single thread, he defended hypocritical bigots, derided bullied teens and blamed suicide victims, all in the name of trolling. If there is such a thing as an Anti-Nobel Prize, he definitely won it.


When did I defend bigots?
When did I defend bullies?
You are lying to yourself.
That's just sad. Grow up.
 
2012-04-29 11:26:55 AM

Max Awesome: Anyway, now I'm rambling. I appreciate Callous' attempt to explain the thinking behind the anti-gay sentiment of the Christians in their community, but I'm not going to go out-of-my way to reach out to any persons who think I'm less-than-human because their pastor tells them so. I'm not going to turn the other cheek - I have no desire to. I'm not Christian so there is no compelling reason for me to counter hatred with humility and love. That's a sucker's game.


I don't know if this will have any effect on your opinion of me, but I left my church because, though my pastor is loving towards individual gays(visiting AIDS hospice without preaching, only being kind and listening) he clings to the GOP and thinks Gays shouldn't have FULL(but maybe like 90% would be ok with him) rights. That pastor is also my father. I am not a christian, per se. I think these people that walked out are weak, because they literally fear that hearing alternate theories might get inside them, and forcibly change their minds. I love love love the gay community. I love everyone. Perhaps I let my feelings about suicide in general, cloud my views of this particular segment of suicide victims. I put them out there to see what kind of reaction I would get. This is how I change my mind on things. I say my piece, listen to the responses, and think about it.
 
2012-04-29 11:32:16 AM
I don't think the girl at 0:20 has any reason to be offended and walking out yet. Some of them really can't take anything. The very next sentence after seeing her, though, "ignoring the b******"... fair game to start leaving.

A lot of what he said was good and needs to be argued/considered. How he said it was way out of line.
 
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