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(WUWT)   The Sun now has four magnetic poles. Cool. I mean not cool but cool. Could be bad, maybe. Everybody be somewhat concerned   (wattsupwiththat.com) divider line 105
    More: Cool, global cooling, Scripps Institution of Oceanography, astronomical observatory, Maunder Minimum, magnetic fields, RIKEN, solar minimum, nearest stars  
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4745 clicks; posted to Geek » on 23 Apr 2012 at 11:33 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-04-24 01:41:45 AM  

WhyteRaven74: We have over 2,000 years of data on sunspots from direct human observation alone.


Which is comparable to me knowing how healthy you are after looking at you for 20 seconds.

The lifespan of humanity (much less recorded humanity) is not barely enough to gauge a worthy assessment of current solar activity. It is very large, very powerful, and very old. The heat that you feel today was generated in the core of the sun before homo sapiens even existed.

I'm not saying the sun is or is not a factor. It probably is, but there's no way we can possibly have enough data to make such an accurate assessment. It would be more useful if we had weather stations on the moon and Mars to corroborate with the evidence we have on Earth. That would bring more certainty to any claims, but nothing is definitely provable at this time.

Need moar.
 
2012-04-24 01:43:08 AM  
DrGunsforHands
Harry_Seldon: Magnetic Pole
[thinkprogress.org image 450x394]
//got nuthin'
Was confused. Thought it was this guy before I
saw the sign:
`
Huey P.? King maker, rabid isolationist and 100% old style Southern Democrat?
/if he'd lived long enough to run for President it would have made a huge difference in todays politics
//IF he had won in '40 then WoW, completely different world than we have today
 
2012-04-24 01:45:17 AM  

WhyteRaven74: GAT_00: The conditions for growth and ripening are fairly specific and tied to the end of the growing season, and are easily tracked via wine records, which yes still exist.

There's all that, but some of it is a bit broad. The thing would be to start digging through letters and things from small towns and villages. The more data you can get from more places, the better you can tell if now is the same as then or it just looks like it is when it actually isn't.


um
tree rings
coral growth
18O ratios in ice cores
Link

what I would like to see are data series JUST using tree ring data
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
there are some trees which are 2k+ years old??

Link
looking at the growth pattern of any of these trees would be amazing

sigh, they probably wont let me drill cores
 
2012-04-24 01:46:52 AM  

OgreMagi: So melting ice and rising sea due to global warming is out, and another ice age is now in?

I can't keep up.


most/all ice ages are preceded by temp and co2 increases
strange, warm and then BOOM ICE everywhere
 
2012-04-24 01:48:31 AM  

Uchiha_Cycliste: We dropped a nuclear bomb on japan almost 70 years ago, and he thinks we've only been watching the sun for 50... I don't think this is a battle to be won with logic.


Yeah, because we all remember what Tacitus wrote about the sun's magnetic field in his Annals and Histories. And let's not forget Cicero's famous quote, "Solis delenda est!"
 
2012-04-24 01:55:49 AM  
Nem Wan
`
If the sun cools, we want just the right amount
of anthropogenic global warming to negate
climate change. Where's the planetary
thermostat?
`
Total human population - add a few billion more people and the temp keeps going up. Subtract a few billion and the temp goes down.
 
2012-04-24 02:46:26 AM  
Come on Global Warming!
 
2012-04-24 02:46:46 AM  
Ishkur
Uchiha_Cycliste: We dropped a nuclear bomb
on japan almost 70 years ago, and he thinks
we've only been watching the sun for 50... I
don't think this is a battle to be won with logic.
Yeah, because we all remember what Tacitus
wrote about the sun's magnetic field in his
Annals and Histories. And let's not forget
Cicero's famous quote, "Solis delenda est!"
`
Christ, you are an idiot.
Since you're so fond of misquoted facts and butchered Latin, why don't you chew on this for a bit :

Quo usque tandem abutere, Ishkur,
patientia nostra?

`
Bonus points if you can name the guy that came up with the above quote in toto.
 
2012-04-24 02:47:53 AM  

Boatmech: DrGunsforHands
Harry_Seldon: Magnetic Pole
[thinkprogress.org image 450x394]
//got nuthin'
Was confused. Thought it was this guy before I
saw the sign:
`
Huey P.? King maker, rabid isolationist and 100% old style Southern Democrat?
/if he'd lived long enough to run for President it would have made a huge difference in todays politics
//IF he had won in '40 then WoW, completely different world than we have today


Yeah. We definitely dodged a bullet there.
/Huey vs. J. Edgar Hoover would have been something to see
 
2012-04-24 02:56:56 AM  
/The way the sun burns can give me some existential angst. I mean, a firecracker just gives a bright bang, and then it peters out and is gone. The way stars keep their constancy really trips me out when I think about it. The laws of the conservation of energy always puzzle me, since it seems most things do everything in the most excited bursts, thunder, lightning, earthquakes, storms, explosions. I know--b-b-b-but it's on such a massive scale!. I get it. It blows me away how abstract the numbers become. I've been drinking, but my thoughts are vaild. But only for a moment!


/CSB
 
2012-04-24 02:57:04 AM  

Boatmech: Since you're so fond of misquoted facts and butchered Latin,


trollface.jpg
 
2012-04-24 03:31:46 AM  
Ishkur
Boatmech: Since you're so fond of misquoted
facts and butchered Latin,
trollface.jpg
`
What's the problem? It's first year Latin.
Here is the quote again :
`
Quo usque tandem abutere, Ishkur, patientia nostra?
`
See, perfectly clear. Surely a scholar of your caliber can do the simplest translations on the fly.
Oh, and it's not a troll when you can back up your words with facts instead of half-assed stercus tauri.
 
2012-04-24 03:47:39 AM  
DrGunsforHands
Boatmech: DrGunsforHands
Harry_Seldon: Magnetic Pole
[thinkprogress.org image 450x394]
//got nuthin'
Was confused. Thought it was this guy before I
saw the sign:
`
Huey P.? King maker, rabid isolationist and
100% old style Southern Democrat?
/if he'd lived long enough to run for President it would have made a huge difference in todays politics
//IF he had won in '40 then WoW, completely
different world than we have today
`
Yeah. We definitely dodged a bullet there.
/Huey vs. J. Edgar Hoover would have been
something to see
`
Would rather he (Long) had dodged the bullet.
/take a look at what he started with - Louisiana circa the Great Depression - and you might notice some improvements. He probably wouldn't have been the best choice for Pres but the guy got shiat done.
 
2012-04-24 03:56:58 AM  
So, is there actually any reputable source on this?

If it were such a big deal as WUWT is trying to make it, I'd think there would be more information than merely the slew of crackpot sites covering this.
 
2012-04-24 04:33:56 AM  
Spots of magnetic fields on the surface of the Sun create sun spots. The strength of those fields have been decreasing for 20+ years. If this trend continues then sometime during 2015 or 16 or 17 there will be no sunspots until the fields get stronger. This is an indicator that the interior of the sun is less energetic. The sun is putting out a little less heat.
It is also putting out less particles (solar wind). The solar wind blocks a lot of cosmic radiation from entering the Solar System. With less solar wind we can expect to see on Earth and increase in Cosmic Radiation and Super Heroes.
 
2012-04-24 05:38:44 AM  

Ishkur: wildcardjack: The real problem is a lack of long term solar data for this effect.

Not only do we need long term solar data in the order of MILLIONS of years to make any worthy predictions, we also need climate data on several planets to corroborate with the solar data. Since we have neither, all claims to the sun's activity NOT affecting climate on Earth are at best guesswork and at worst specious or complete frabrication.


FTFY
 
2012-04-24 05:43:00 AM  
halcyon thought
So, is there actually any reputable source on
this?
If it were such a big deal as WUWT is trying to
make it, I'd think there would be more
information than merely the slew of crackpot
sites covering this.
`
Recent thread with both 'sides' and links to more info
`
/doesn't cover everything but it is a good place to start if you are interested
 
2012-04-24 05:48:31 AM  
FTA "World May Be Entering Period Of Global Cooling:"

I`ll just leave this here.
 
2012-04-24 06:55:49 AM  
Comments under the article are enlightening...skip the climate change derp and you'll find that the whole thing is overblown, the multipolar structure has been seen before so it's not novel.
 
2012-04-24 07:03:15 AM  

I_C_Weener: That article was full of "THIS MEANS SOMETHING!"


It means we're boned.
 
2012-04-24 07:14:56 AM  

dahmers love zombie: Yep. Gene Ray called it.

[i.imgur.com image 528x359]

Oh, and by the way, if you haven't been to TimeCube lately, you haven't been to TimeCube. Mr. Ray has upped the crazy right the hell off the charts, and that's saying a lot considering his past efforts.


You aint kidding. Last visited about 8 years ago--he has really reached a summit:

"No human has 2 hands as they
are opposites, like plus and
minus, that cancel as entity.
Academia destroys your brain,
your ability to think opposite.
The eyes of the flounder fish
were relocated, why were yours

relocated? Your opposite eyes
were moved to 1 corner to overlay
for single perspective, but that
corrupts your Opposite Brain."

Spin on, Timecube.
 
2012-04-24 07:44:40 AM  
There is not problem here. We have been assured that the sun has no effect on our weather at all.

It is humans and SUV's all the way down.
 
2012-04-24 07:51:25 AM  
This is from a blog that has the sole purpose of posting everything they can pull out of their ass to say there is no global warming. Whether you do or don't believe in climate change, you must realize this blog is full of crap.
 
2012-04-24 08:24:09 AM  
Came here solely for Time Cube. Leaving somewhat slightly verschimmelt.
 
2012-04-24 08:36:37 AM  
www.epals.com


Did you hear that Frank. I thought we we're screwed there for a second.
 
2012-04-24 08:38:37 AM  

noit: This is from a blog that has the sole purpose of posting everything they can pull out of their ass to say there is no global warming


Have they even gone so far as to, you know, post the actual temperature data from the last 15 years?

www.woodfortrees.org

Just checking....
 
2012-04-24 08:41:10 AM  

namatad: WhyteRaven74: GAT_00: The conditions for growth and ripening are fairly specific and tied to the end of the growing season, and are easily tracked via wine records, which yes still exist.

There's all that, but some of it is a bit broad. The thing would be to start digging through letters and things from small towns and villages. The more data you can get from more places, the better you can tell if now is the same as then or it just looks like it is when it actually isn't.

um
tree rings
coral growth
18O ratios in ice cores
Link

what I would like to see are data series JUST using tree ring data
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
there are some trees which are 2k+ years old??

Link
looking at the growth pattern of any of these trees would be amazing

sigh, they probably wont let me drill cores


http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/treering.html
 
2012-04-24 08:54:23 AM  

Ishkur: Which is comparable to me knowing how healthy you are after looking at you for 20 seconds.


assets.bizjournals.com
 
2012-04-24 09:19:01 AM  

noit: This is from a blog that has the sole purpose of posting everything they can pull out of their ass to say there is no global warming. Whether you do or don't believe in climate change, you must realize this blog is full of crap.


As are they all.
ALL, both sides are driven by the derp.

Only thing anybody knows for sure, is that they want money.
NOW
 
2012-04-24 09:35:36 AM  

snocone: Only thing anybody knows for sure, is that they want money.
NOW


And political power. Beyond those two things I couldn't tell you what, exactly, the environmental movement as a whole wants. I can tell you what various splinter groups and nutters who've latched on want but as a unified entity? Not so much.
 
2012-04-24 09:36:35 AM  

dahmers love zombie: Yep. Gene Ray called it.

[i.imgur.com image 528x359]

Oh, and by the way, if you haven't been to TimeCube lately, you haven't been to TimeCube. Mr. Ray has upped the crazy right the hell off the charts, and that's saying a lot considering his past efforts.


Ok, today was the first day ever visiting that site, and well...I'm not sure how to react now. I read a few sentences, they had words that in and of themselves had meaning, but the way there were put together broke my brain.

I am not sure I should thank you, or curse you for bringing that craziness to my attention.
 
2012-04-24 09:43:39 AM  

Unoriginal_Username: but the way there were put together broke my brain.


TimeCube error detected: [A]bort, [R]etry, [K]ick in the bollocks.
 
2012-04-24 09:53:21 AM  
Is Gene Ray kin to Dr. Bronner?
 
2012-04-24 10:08:50 AM  
So the Sun is now quadripolelegic
 
2012-04-24 10:18:33 AM  
Star Wars was a prophecy. Earth is really Tatooine after our sun splits into two distinct stars.
 
2012-04-24 10:39:47 AM  

Boatmech: Quo usque tandem abutere, Ishkur,
patientia nostra?


well played....

www.acegames.us
\Our patience wears thin.
\\cicero;)
 
2012-04-24 11:13:48 AM  
Didn't the Heterodyne Boys already find it a while back?
 
2012-04-24 11:32:49 AM  

SevenizGud: noit: This is from a blog that has the sole purpose of posting everything they can pull out of their ass to say there is no global warming

Have they even gone so far as to, you know, post the actual temperature data from the last 95 years?

www.woodfortrees.org

Just checking....


FTFY
 
2012-04-24 11:37:00 AM  

WhyteRaven74: It's basically applied hydrodynamics


It's applied magnetohydrodynamics, which is even harder.
 
2012-04-24 11:55:47 AM  

dahmers love zombie: Oh, and by the way, if you haven't been to TimeCube lately, you haven't been to TimeCube. Mr. Ray has upped the crazy right the hell off the charts, and that's saying a lot considering his past efforts.


Wooo. I thought about refrencing TimeCube. But you beat me to it. And you are right, I hadn't looked in about four (!) years.

/Belly-button logic?!
 
2012-04-24 12:28:20 PM  

GAT_00: WhyteRaven74: It would be interesting to dig up all accounts of what the weather was like at the start of the 17th century period in question. Granted there's a lot of the world for which we'd have no accounts, but accounts of the weather in Europe and even the Americas would be easy to come by.

It's been done. The start of the Maunder Minimum in particular was characterized by sharp swings in the NAO like we've been experiencing the last couple of years. Europe would freeze one winter and be covered in snow and the next they'd be in drought. That the population was slowly edging up due to the Medieval Warm Period and into marginal growing lands, combined with the sudden sharp increase in instability of the local climate led to some of the first famines in Europe in nearly a millennium. Wine was growing in England shortly before the Maunder Minimum began, for an example of the previous period's warmth. Wine by the way also acts as a very good barometer for climate. The conditions for growth and ripening are fairly specific and tied to the end of the growing season, and are easily tracked via wine records, which yes still exist.


I should plant some wine in my backyard this season. I tried growing tomatoes last year, but the dear would eat them.
 
2012-04-24 12:52:59 PM  

tomWright: There is not problem here. We have been assured that the sun has no effect on our weather climate at all.

It is humans and SUV's all the way down.


FTFY

/remember, weather is not climate as we have been told enough already.
//I blame the turtles...
 
2012-04-24 12:54:02 PM  

Smoky Dragon Dish: I tried growing tomatoes last year, but the dear would eat them.


keep the old lady out of the garden?
 
2012-04-24 06:59:38 PM  
Uchiha_Cycliste
Boatmech:
`
Quo usque tandem abutere, Ishkur,
patientia nostra?
`
well played....
\Our patience wears thin.
\\cicero;)
`
Close, a little tighter phrasing would be :
`
How long, Ishkur, will you abuse our patience?
`
/do my posts look funny to you or is Tats just farking with me?
 
2012-04-24 08:05:45 PM  
How is the sun's changing magnetic field news? Doesn't i happen every 11 to 12 years - Solar Maximum? I thought this was normal.
 
2012-04-24 08:07:55 PM  
Here we go - last one in 2001
Link
 
2012-04-24 09:19:26 PM  

Letdown: How is the sun's changing magnetic field news? Doesn't i happen every 11 to 12 years - Solar Maximum? I thought this was normal.


Nope, nothing other than normal here.
And natural and organic.
 
2012-04-24 10:27:43 PM  

Boatmech: Uchiha_Cycliste
Boatmech:
`
Quo usque tandem abutere, Ishkur,
patientia nostra?
`
well played....
\Our patience wears thin.
\\cicero;)
`
Close, a little tighter phrasing would be :
`
How long, Ishkur, will you abuse our patience?
`
/do my posts look funny to you or is Tats just farking with me?


Yeah, but the twins said "Our patience wears thin"(or something to that effect) So I went with it. =D
how do you mean funny? Looks normal, excepting that you didn't use the quote button.
 
2012-04-24 10:30:38 PM  
maybe they said "we are growing irritated" and I blew the quote?
Anyways, I tried to bring it into the modern age =P
 
2012-04-24 11:59:15 PM  
Uchiha_Cycliste
`
how do you mean funny? Looks normal,
excepting that you didn't use the quote button.
`
Thank you for actually doing something besides biatching.
The quote button does not work with the phone/browser set up I prefer to use. The 'mobile' Fark is a steaming pile of uselessness to me. The full site that I'm using now appears perfectly fine on my screen.
I am not seeing what you guys see.
Hell, repost this from your end and I'll try to see what is wrong.
 
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