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(NHL)   Coyotes' Raffi Torres suspended 25 games for hit on Blackhawks' Marian Hossa   ( nhl.com) divider line
    More: Followup, Marian Hossa, Raffi Torres, Blackhawks, coyotes, Joel Quenneville, nhl playoffs, public comment, regular season  
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726 clicks; posted to Sports » on 21 Apr 2012 at 7:25 PM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



64 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2012-04-21 12:23:08 PM  
Needs to be said:

images.wikia.com
 
2012-04-21 12:26:56 PM  
I give up. It's quite clear there is two sets of rules or guidelines. One for star player and one for not star players.

The NHL is an absolute JOKE and will continue to be a joke until they start treating their star players the same as they do non-star players.
 
2012-04-21 12:30:02 PM  
Daaaaaaaaaaamn
 
2012-04-21 12:31:32 PM  
Yet, Lucic sent miller into a concussion ruining the sabres season and yet he got nothing. Shanahan needs to be fired. He's pathetic.
 
2012-04-21 12:35:34 PM  
That's a nasty hit, but that punishment is wildly out of line with other hits.
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-04-21 12:45:21 PM  

GAT_00: That's a nasty hit, but that punishment is wildly out of line with other hits.


I think the term is "repeat offender".
 
2012-04-21 12:46:43 PM  

GAT_00: That's a nasty hit, but that punishment is wildly out of line with other hits.


He's a repeat offender so you can't just compare his punishment to the others.
 
2012-04-21 12:56:05 PM  

MBK: GAT_00: That's a nasty hit, but that punishment is wildly out of line with other hits.

I think the term is "repeat offender".


Yeah, but a quick Google shows that only two guys have ever gotten a 25 game or higher suspension. So is this guy really the worst of the worst in NHL history?
 
2012-04-21 12:57:54 PM  
This is the 6th time he's been disciplined for hits to the head. The NHL even released a video explaining why the suspension was so severe.

http://video.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=60&id=173753
 
2012-04-21 12:59:12 PM  
If that doesn't work, the video is on NHL.com.
 
2012-04-21 01:23:16 PM  
Wow, I thought this was a joke headline.
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-04-21 01:23:53 PM  

GAT_00: Yeah, but a quick Google shows that only two guys have ever gotten a 25 game or higher suspension. So is this guy really the worst of the worst in NHL history?


Yes and no.

With new info coming out everyday about head hits and concussions, the NHL (along with the NFL) decided to make head shots more punishable. A first time offender might get 1-2 games. Torres has been warned before not to do this, and he doesn't listen or change his game.

I don't watch many Penguins games, but Matt Cooke has a few head shots under his belt. The NHL warned him that the suspensions will continue to grow if he keeps head hunting, and (from what I've been told) his game has changed and in fact improved.

So Torres now has two options: Continue head hunting and eventually not being worth the price of keeping him, or changing his game, learning not to LEAP and hit someone in the head, and continue to play.
 
2012-04-21 01:25:37 PM  
What a frippin' joke...
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-04-21 01:28:50 PM  

hubiestubert: What a frippin' joke...


How is it a joke?

He's been suspended 5 times before for the SAME TYPE OF HIT. Twice this year!
 
2012-04-21 01:28:57 PM  
If you watch the video and still think it's excessive, something is wrong with you.
 
2012-04-21 01:30:35 PM  

GAT_00: So is this guy really the worst of the worst in NHL history?


Look, the NHL has a real problem here. Whether or not Raffi Torres is History's Worst Monster or not has become irrelevant. The problem the NHL has is that Marian Hossa is perhaps done for the playoffs because of a dangerous hit that the league is trying to outlaw. Daniel Alfredsson is perhaps done for the playoffs because of a dangerous hit that the league is trying to outlaw. Do hockey fans pay to see players like Raffi Torres, Aaron Asham, Carl Hagelin, Andrew Shaw, etc? No. They pay to see players like Marian Hossa, Sidney Crosby, Henrik Zetterberg, Daniel & Henrik Sedin, Daniel Alfredsson, etc. The former group of players are a dime a dozen. The Phoenix Coyotes will have absolutely no problem calling up a hitter from the AHL to take Torres spot on the roster for 25 games. There is no one the Chicago Blackhawks can call up to replace Marian Hossa. There is no one the Ottawa Senators can call up to replace Daniel Alfredsson.

So the NHL is faced with, if these sorts of predatory hits from repeat offenders continue, a Stanley Cup Finals devoid of the talented players fans want to see and the networks demand for ratings.

Now then, the argument that Shanahan and the NHL dropped the ball with the Weber incident, in which a star player targeted a star player's head and no suspension was levied, thus creating the climate for the outbreak of dangerous/dirty play in the NHL...well...
 
2012-04-21 01:31:14 PM  

MBK: GAT_00: That's a nasty hit, but that punishment is wildly out of line with other hits.

I think the term is "repeat offender".


The problem is the NHL looks the other way when star players cross the line until they can't ignore it anymore so it takes a lot more them to achieve the repeat offender status. And even then they get a slap on the wrist compared to this.

Suspending Torres 25 games is easy. Suspending a star player for meaningful games is what takes balls and is what the NHL consistently fails to do.
 
2012-04-21 01:33:23 PM  

MBK: hubiestubert: What a frippin' joke...

How is it a joke?

He's been suspended 5 times before for the SAME TYPE OF HIT. Twice this year!


You can't jump up the scale like that in term. It's dishonest.
 
2012-04-21 01:34:14 PM  

Pituophis: Now then, the argument that Shanahan and the NHL dropped the ball with the Weber incident, in which a star player targeted a star player's head and no suspension was levied, thus creating the climate for the outbreak of dangerous/dirty play in the NHL...well...


Yeah, and this is the overreaction. That's why it's unfair.
 
2012-04-21 01:34:52 PM  

Zombie Jesus: Suspending a star player for meaningful games is what takes balls and is what the NHL consistently fails to do.


Yes. Shanahan set the wrong tone on night one by not coming down harder on Weber than he did. While Zetterberg was not injured, the head was clearly targeted. Furthermore, Weber should've been considered a repeat offender because he was fined $2500 earlier in the season. I firmly believe that this decision by the "Department of Player Safety" set the tone for the remainder of the first round. Players got the message that the rules in the post-season changed and that they could act with impunity. Now Shanahan is being forced to correct and/or over compensate, carrying on a fine tradition of NHL rule enforcement.

/Dammit, Pronger.
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-04-21 01:36:49 PM  

GAT_00: You can't jump up the scale like that in term. It's dishonest.


Yes you can.

NHL's CBA states

"Players who repeatedly violate NHL rules will be more severely punished for each violation"

You lose "repeat offender" status if you are clean for 18 months. Torres hasn't lost his repeat offender status. Thus the giant ramp up in suspension time.
 
2012-04-21 01:38:02 PM  

GAT_00: Yeah, and this is the overreaction. That's why it's unfair.


What would have been a fair suspension?
 
2012-04-21 01:39:57 PM  

Zombie Jesus: MBK: GAT_00: That's a nasty hit, but that punishment is wildly out of line with other hits.

I think the term is "repeat offender".

The problem is the NHL looks the other way when star players cross the line until they can't ignore it anymore so it takes a lot more them to achieve the repeat offender status. And even then they get a slap on the wrist compared to this.

Suspending Torres 25 games is easy. Suspending a star player for meaningful games is what takes balls and is what the NHL consistently fails to do.


Bingo.
 
2012-04-21 01:42:14 PM  
And now that I no longer have a horse in the race...

Let's go
Bruins
Devils
Rags
Sharks
Yotes
...and Ken Holland

(Let the rebuild in Detroit begin)
 
2012-04-21 01:42:55 PM  

MBK: "Players who repeatedly violate NHL rules will be more severely punished for each violation"


Punished more severely. What was his last one? 5 games? That's a leap.

Pituophis: GAT_00: Yeah, and this is the overreaction. That's why it's unfair.

What would have been a fair suspension?


Go off his old suspension and double the games.
 
MBK [TotalFark]
2012-04-21 01:46:13 PM  

GAT_00: Go off his old suspension and double the games.


And risk him doing it again to another player in the NHL playoffs? Fat chance.
 
2012-04-21 01:49:25 PM  

MBK: GAT_00: Go off his old suspension and double the games.

And risk him doing it again to another player in the NHL playoffs? Fat chance.


Fine. Given that this is the playoffs, I wouldn't see anything wrong with a suspension across the rest of them.
 
2012-04-21 01:54:12 PM  

GAT_00: Go off his old suspension and double the games.


The severity of the infraction needs to be considered. If not, you'd be suspending one guy 10 games for a head slap while somebody else got the same for taking someones head off.
 
2012-04-21 01:57:13 PM  

Pituophis: And now that I no longer have a horse in the race...

Let's go
Bruins
Devils
Rags
Sharks
Yotes
...and Ken Holland

(Let the rebuild in Detroit begin)


Speaking of Detroit rebuilding, not sure how much they'll be looking within their affiliates, but the KWings are going well in the ECHL playoffs.

I really want to see them in the next round, to do some scouting for fun.

On-topic: I'm in full support of the decision.
 
2012-04-21 02:58:58 PM  

Pituophis: GAT_00: So is this guy really the worst of the worst in NHL history?

Look, the NHL has a real problem here. Whether or not Raffi Torres is History's Worst Monster or not has become irrelevant. The problem the NHL has is that Marian Hossa is perhaps done for the playoffs because of a dangerous hit that the league is trying to outlaw. Daniel Alfredsson is perhaps done for the playoffs because of a dangerous hit that the league is trying to outlaw. Do hockey fans pay to see players like Raffi Torres, Aaron Asham, Carl Hagelin, Andrew Shaw, etc? No. They pay to see players like Marian Hossa, Sidney Crosby, Henrik Zetterberg, Daniel & Henrik Sedin, Daniel Alfredsson, etc. The former group of players are a dime a dozen. The Phoenix Coyotes will have absolutely no problem calling up a hitter from the AHL to take Torres spot on the roster for 25 games. There is no one the Chicago Blackhawks can call up to replace Marian Hossa. There is no one the Ottawa Senators can call up to replace Daniel Alfredsson.

So the NHL is faced with, if these sorts of predatory hits from repeat offenders continue, a Stanley Cup Finals devoid of the talented players fans want to see and the networks demand for ratings.

Now then, the argument that Shanahan and the NHL dropped the ball with the Weber incident, in which a star player targeted a star player's head and no suspension was levied, thus creating the climate for the outbreak of dangerous/dirty play in the NHL...well...


But the star status of a player SHOULD NOT MATTER when when it comes to punishments. The star status of either the player doing the hitting or the player getting hit should not be a factor in the decision. THAT is why people are upset about this.

If Its crosby delivering this hit instead of Torres, not only does Crosby walk away with at most a small fine but I'll bet that Hossa gets suspended for diving.
 
2012-04-21 03:15:09 PM  

Warlordtrooper: If Its crosby delivering this hit instead of Torres, not only does Crosby walk away with at most a small fine but I'll bet that Hossa gets suspended for diving.


Fine. Next time Crosby is getting suspended for the 7th time for delivering a violent hit (in which he leaves his feet) to the head of a player without the puck, then he should be suspended for 25 games.

The fact is, star players generally don't behave like this (Pronger excepted). Should Shea Weber have been suspended? Absolutely. Is the infraction he perpetrated against Zetterberg (a star player, mind you) on par with what Torres did and has been doing for his entire career? No. It's not an apples to apples comparison by a long shot.
 
2012-04-21 03:25:42 PM  

Pituophis: Warlordtrooper: If Its crosby delivering this hit instead of Torres, not only does Crosby walk away with at most a small fine but I'll bet that Hossa gets suspended for diving.

Fine. Next time Crosby is getting suspended for the 7th time for delivering a violent hit (in which he leaves his feet) to the head of a player without the puck, then he should be suspended for 25 games.

The fact is, star players generally don't behave like this (Pronger excepted). Should Shea Weber have been suspended? Absolutely. Is the infraction he perpetrated against Zetterberg (a star player, mind you) on par with what Torres did and has been doing for his entire career? No. It's not an apples to apples comparison by a long shot.


Neal is a 40 goal scorer. Neal has a history of getting in trouble much like Torres. Neal delivers the same hit to a player. Neal got suspended for 1 game.
 
2012-04-21 03:31:33 PM  

Warlordtrooper: Neal delivers the same hit to a player.


What is Neal's suspension history?
How severe was the injury inflicted that yielded a one game suspension?
Was the Neal hit in question three simultaneous infractions (charging, targeting the head, and interference)?

The answers are:
One suspension, one fine.
There was no injury (at least in the sense that Giroux missed no time), he was suspended for intent.
And no.

They're not equivalent, either. But your axe to grind against the Penguins is noted.
 
2012-04-21 07:44:18 PM  
He deserves it. Is she gonna be all right?
 
2012-04-21 07:47:34 PM  

Pituophis: Warlordtrooper: Neal delivers the same hit to a player.

What is Neal's suspension history?
How severe was the injury inflicted that yielded a one game suspension?
Was the Neal hit in question three simultaneous infractions (charging, targeting the head, and interference)?

The answers are:
One suspension, one fine.
There was no injury (at least in the sense that Giroux missed no time), he was suspended for intent.
And no.

They're not equivalent, either. But your axe to grind against the Penguins is noted.


The resulting injury of a hit should not factor into the equation when it comes to punishing cheap shots. Leagues should punish the intent, not the outcome. When people try to use a player's injury when determining punishment, players who have made clean hits get punished when they do it to a fragile player (or a stupid one who puts his head down).
 
2012-04-21 07:49:06 PM  
6th time repeat offender. Six.

Guy should have been banned from the league permanently by now.

Go learn about hockey you schmucks and then come back to run your worthless uninformed yaps.
 
2012-04-21 07:55:30 PM  

Aquadyne: 6th time repeat offender. Six.

Guy should have been banned from the league permanently by now.

Go learn about hockey you schmucks and then come back to run your worthless uninformed yaps.


Yeah, I don't see why 25 games is that terrible a suspension. It's about 1/3 of a season. That's significant but far from devastating. What has stopped the NHL from more than a handful of 25-gamers up to this point?
 
2012-04-21 08:13:16 PM  
Its basically to keep him out of the entire playoffs. If Phoenix doesn't get that far, then the games carry over into next season.

At the conclusion of every Brendan Shanaban suspension video, he should cap it off with "In conclusion; I hate you all, this entire league has lost its god damn mind, and you can all go fark yourselves."
 
2012-04-21 08:26:16 PM  

Pituophis: Warlordtrooper: Neal delivers the same hit to a player.

What is Neal's suspension history?
How severe was the injury inflicted that yielded a one game suspension?
Was the Neal hit in question three simultaneous infractions (charging, targeting the head, and interference)?

The answers are:
One suspension, one fine.
There was no injury (at least in the sense that Giroux missed no time), he was suspended for intent.
And no.

They're not equivalent, either. But your axe to grind against the Penguins is noted.


no apples to apples there. Neal was a fight instigator in the last 5 minutes of a game. Torres jumped at his head. if Neal would have had the clock stop with 5:01 on it, he might have gotten a fine, but I doubt it.

Not the same crime
 
2012-04-21 08:38:02 PM  

Piizzadude: no apples to apples there. Neal was a fight instigator in the last 5 minutes of a game. Torres jumped at his head. if Neal would have had the clock stop with 5:01 on it, he might have gotten a fine, but I doubt it.

Not the same crime


Huh? Neal did the same exact thing that Torres did. He jumped into a hit and went for a headshot. The only differences between the plays by Neal and Torres are a) Hossa, unlike Schenn or Giroux, was seriously hurt and b) Neal did it twice in one shift, nevermind just once in a game.
 
2012-04-21 08:50:31 PM  
Most of the people I know who are actually fans of hockey are okay with this suspension.

GAT_00: MBK: GAT_00: Go off his old suspension and double the games.

And risk him doing it again to another player in the NHL playoffs? Fat chance.

Fine. Given that this is the playoffs, I wouldn't see anything wrong with a suspension across the rest of them.


That's exactly what they did. Theoretically, Phoenix could have up to 24 more games in the playoffs, if they were to push it to Game 7 in all four rounds. In reality, the suspension probably does carry over into next season, but that's not a bad thing.
 
2012-04-21 09:07:51 PM  
Wow. Thought it was an excessive penalty at first, but the fact that he's been in trouble 5 times before, and still didn't learn negates that.
 
2012-04-21 09:14:15 PM  

AdmirableSnackbar: Piizzadude: no apples to apples there. Neal was a fight instigator in the last 5 minutes of a game. Torres jumped at his head. if Neal would have had the clock stop with 5:01 on it, he might have gotten a fine, but I doubt it.

Not the same crime

Huh? Neal did the same exact thing that Torres did. He jumped into a hit and went for a headshot. The only differences between the plays by Neal and Torres are a) Hossa, unlike Schenn or Giroux, was seriously hurt and b) Neal did it twice in one shift, nevermind just once in a game.


Not to mention that Neal is a 40 goal scorer on Bettmans favorite team.
 
2012-04-21 09:52:26 PM  

Pituophis: GAT_00: So is this guy really the worst of the worst in NHL history?

Look, the NHL has a real problem here. Whether or not Raffi Torres is History's Worst Monster or not has become irrelevant. The problem the NHL has is that Marian Hossa is perhaps done for the playoffs because of a dangerous hit that the league is trying to outlaw. Daniel Alfredsson is perhaps done for the playoffs because of a dangerous hit that the league is trying to outlaw. Do hockey fans pay to see players like Raffi Torres, Aaron Asham, Carl Hagelin, Andrew Shaw, etc? No. They pay to see players like Marian Hossa, Sidney Crosby, Henrik Zetterberg, Daniel & Henrik Sedin, Daniel Alfredsson, etc. The former group of players are a dime a dozen. The Phoenix Coyotes will have absolutely no problem calling up a hitter from the AHL to take Torres spot on the roster for 25 games. There is no one the Chicago Blackhawks can call up to replace Marian Hossa. There is no one the Ottawa Senators can call up to replace Daniel Alfredsson.


I would pay a lot of money to see Raffi Torres make that hit on Sidney Crosby.

Pituophis: Warlordtrooper: If Its crosby delivering this hit instead of Torres, not only does Crosby walk away with at most a small fine but I'll bet that Hossa gets suspended for diving.

Fine. Next time Crosby is getting suspended for the 7th time for delivering a violent hit (in which he leaves his feet) to the head of a player without the puck, then he should be suspended for 25 games.

The fact is, star players generally don't behave like this (Pronger excepted). Should Shea Weber have been suspended? Absolutely. Is the infraction he perpetrated against Zetterberg (a star player, mind you) on par with what Torres did and has been doing for his entire career? No. It's not an apples to apples comparison by a long shot.


I'm sorry, did you see Game 3 in Philly?
 
2012-04-21 10:04:09 PM  

Aquadyne: 6th time repeat offender. Six.

Guy should have been banned from the league permanently by now.

Go learn about hockey you schmucks and then come back to run your worthless uninformed yaps.


watchoutwegotabadassoverhere.jpg
 
2012-04-21 10:09:52 PM  
Personally, in addition to whatever normal rules for punishment there are for injuries in all the sports, I'd like to see a rule that says "If you do something that's clearly illegal/you've been warned about/etc. and it causes an injury, you have a MINIMUM suspension of the time that the player you injured is out for".

Seems only fair.
 
2012-04-21 10:27:12 PM  

IMDWalrus: Most of the people I know who are actually fans of hockey are okay with this suspension.


This.

Dude doesn't learn. Next time, he's banned from the league.
 
2012-04-21 10:41:27 PM  

GAT_00: MBK: hubiestubert: What a frippin' joke...

How is it a joke?

He's been suspended 5 times before for the SAME TYPE OF HIT. Twice this year!

You can't jump up the scale like that in term. It's dishonest.


The NFL drug policy goes from counseling to a quarter season to a whole season to a lifetime ban IIRC. I know that's announced in the CBA and all, but it wouldn't surprise me if Torres had some inkling this punishment was looming
 
2012-04-21 10:41:45 PM  
Maki got 30 days for giving Green brain damage.

Next they all be wearing C.C. cameras on their little hats.
 
2012-04-21 11:12:02 PM  
fark Phoenix and fark Torres. To be fair, fark Hossa, too.

This was still an absurdly long suspension. WAY too long.
 
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