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(MSNBC)   Unlike Best Korea, India is able to keep it up and perform. Bonus: they call it the "China Killer"   ( worldnews.msnbc.msn.com) divider line
    More: Dumbass, china, Chinese Communist Party, The Times of India, economic power  
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8302 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Apr 2012 at 9:48 AM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-04-19 09:50:00 AM  
Only dumbass i see is subby
 
2012-04-19 09:53:00 AM  

Joe Blowme: Only dumbass i see is subby



Yeah, I don't get it either. The headline suggests that the submitter thinks it's great that India has a missile that actually works and can counter the growing threat of Chinese expansionism in the region, and then he goes and sh*ts on it by sticking the "dumbass" tag at the end. Is the medication not working on your bi-polar symptoms today or something?
 
2012-04-19 09:53:58 AM  
Nuclear arms races are always fun. Me thinks china might step up their next space launch to remind some folks they still are in the game.
 
2012-04-19 09:55:53 AM  
FTA The launch, which was flagged well in advance, has attracted none of the criticism from the West faced by hermit state North Korea for a failed bid to send up a similar rocket last week.

That's not propagandistic at all, MSNBC.
 
2012-04-19 09:56:12 AM  
Well, according to the article the Indian missile won't be fully ready for another two years. China has missiles capable of reaching India today. So, antagonizing China by calling it the "China Killer" could be seen as a dumbass move.

/just playing devil's advocate.
//really reaching on this one, though.
 
2012-04-19 09:56:37 AM  
I was in Bangalore a few years back, drinking with some dude who runs our call center. I asked him if he ever worried about Pakistan, and he (slightly paraphrased) said "No, we don't worry about those idiots. They are wrapped up in their religion and traditions and will never get their act together. Besides we are of the same blood. We worry about the Chinese. We've gone to war with them three times since Independence. And the day they learn English (gestures to the throngs of yuppies enjoying a nice evening on MG road or wherever we were) all this is gone."

CSB.
 
2012-04-19 09:56:48 AM  
i195.photobucket.com

Getting that out of the way.

/Hot
 
2012-04-19 09:57:07 AM  
Welcome to Cold War 2.0
 
2012-04-19 09:58:59 AM  

generallyso: FTA The launch, which was flagged well in advance, has attracted none of the criticism from the West faced by hermit state North Korea for a failed bid to send up a similar rocket last week.

That's not propagandistic at all, MSNBC.


You don't think hermit state is fitting? The place is a farking information black hole.
 
2012-04-19 10:01:52 AM  
India, here's a tip: don't fark with China.

All of those spare men they have that can't get wives? Yeah, China will gladly throw them at you until tank treads are gummed up with blood and guts. And China doesn't really care all that much who the blood and guts belong to, they've always got more to spare.
 
2012-04-19 10:02:31 AM  

generallyso: FTA The launch, which was flagged well in advance, has attracted none of the criticism from the West faced by hermit state North Korea for a failed bid to send up a similar rocket last week.

That's not propagandistic at all, MSNBC.


"Hermit Kingdom" is a term that's been associated with Korea for a very long time. MSNBC is just updating the nomenclature a bit.
 
2012-04-19 10:02:59 AM  

geek_mars: Well, according to the article the Indian missile won't be fully ready for another two years. China has missiles capable of reaching India today. So, antagonizing China by calling it the "China Killer" could be seen as a dumbass move.

/just playing devil's advocate.
//really reaching on this one, though.


I assume subby was implying it's not a great idea to annoy a giant Communist country capable of wiping you out today by demonstrating a missile called the "china killer" that isn't even ready yet.

just sayin'.
 
2012-04-19 10:04:26 AM  
Seems like a lgoical move on India's part given Chinese military moves into the Indian Ocean and along their common, disputed border.

Good Deeds Do Not Go Unpunished

China And The Indian Ocean Carrier Fleet

Secret Airfields On The Chinese Border
 
2012-04-19 10:06:28 AM  
A few years ago, some idiot was trying to drum up defense spending by claiming Russia, China, India, Pakistan, and Iran were about to form the Legion of Doom and come after us.
 
2012-04-19 10:06:44 AM  

Dalek Caan's doomed mistress: India, here's a tip: don't fark with China.

All of those spare men they have that can't get wives? Yeah, China will gladly throw them at you until tank treads are gummed up with blood and guts. And China doesn't really care all that much who the blood and guts belong to, they've always got more to spare.


Sure they have less than China but lack of manpower doesn't seem to be a problem in India from what I've seen.
 
2012-04-19 10:08:17 AM  

generallyso: FTA The launch, which was flagged well in advance, has attracted none of the criticism from the West faced by hermit state North Korea for a failed bid to send up a similar rocket last week.

That's not propagandistic at all, MSNBC.


But it's true, so it's not propaganda.

North Korea isolated themselves from the world. By choice. You do that and you become a hermit.
 
2012-04-19 10:08:56 AM  

ArkPanda: A few years ago, some idiot was trying to drum up defense spending by claiming Russia, China, India, Pakistan, and Iran were about to form the Legion of Doom and come after us.


India and Pakistan allied? Yeah, that's going to happen any day now... Probably the same with Iran and India (extremist Islamic states and polytheists tend not to mix well).
 
2012-04-19 10:09:35 AM  

nekom: generallyso: FTA The launch, which was flagged well in advance, has attracted none of the criticism from the West faced by hermit state North Korea for a failed bid to send up a similar rocket last week.

That's not propagandistic at all, MSNBC.

You don't think hermit state is fitting? The place is a farking information black hole.


I'm not sure if generallyso is being an apologist for Best Korea, or
trying to give a backhanded slap to MSNBC.

/I am sure he is a troll, however.
 
2012-04-19 10:11:02 AM  
So, it ok for other countries to construct and test nuclear-capable missiles - as long as we like them.

This is why Iran, Best Korea and others will never actually stop their research, or their missile tests. They can just point to stories like this and say 'what makes them so much better than me that they can have missiles but I can't?'

Either we live in a world where we all have nukes and long range missiles, or we live in a world where no one has them at all. Allowing some to have them and not others perpetually breeds discontent and itchy trigger fingers.
 
2012-04-19 10:11:54 AM  

syberpud: Dalek Caan's doomed mistress: India, here's a tip: don't fark with China.

All of those spare men they have that can't get wives? Yeah, China will gladly throw them at you until tank treads are gummed up with blood and guts. And China doesn't really care all that much who the blood and guts belong to, they've always got more to spare.

Sure they have less than China but lack of manpower doesn't seem to be a problem in India from what I've seen.


And even that is only marginally. Plus in India, people are way more disposable than in China.

Also, Indians don't have a 1 kid per family law, which is why India is about to pass China in population.
 
2012-04-19 10:15:35 AM  
I hope they have good tech support if the missile fails.
 
2012-04-19 10:15:59 AM  

Grand_Moff_Joseph: So, it ok for other countries to construct and test nuclear-capable missiles - as long as we like them.

This is why Iran, Best Korea and others will never actually stop their research, or their missile tests. They can just point to stories like this and say 'what makes them so much better than me that they can have missiles but I can't?'

Either we live in a world where we all have nukes and long range missiles, or we live in a world where no one has them at all. Allowing some to have them and not others perpetually breeds discontent and itchy trigger fingers.


Maybe because they dont threaten to wipe other countries off the map like iran?

/are you really this obtuse or just trolling?
 
2012-04-19 10:17:31 AM  
Well, thanks a lot for giving India the go-ahead. That's directed at the last three U.S. presidents (Clinton, Bush Jr. and Obama) who were more interested in letting U.S. companies get their beaks wet in the Indian market than uphold proper nonproliferation standards.

We should have come down hard on them after their test in the 90s, rather than give them a green-light. At the very least, the Pakistanis wouldn't be able to allege double-standards. Have you heard? Now they want a NSG waiver just like the Indians got. Who didn't see that coming?

We don't need to convince the Indians to 'balance' against China. They'll do that automatically.
 
2012-04-19 10:17:54 AM  

syberpud: ArkPanda: A few years ago, some idiot was trying to drum up defense spending by claiming Russia, China, India, Pakistan, and Iran were about to form the Legion of Doom and come after us.

India and Pakistan allied? Yeah, that's going to happen any day now... Probably the same with Iran and India (extremist Islamic states and polytheists tend not to mix well).


There are as many Muslims in India as there are in Pakistan. (India is basically tied for 2nd in total Muslim population) China has fewer Muslims than Yemen. In a war for survival, India and Pakistan have more in common than Pakistan and China.
 
2012-04-19 10:19:48 AM  
It will only take one man to defeat the whole Indian Army. You march a guy to the front line holding a gun to the head of a cow and they will all surrender, and then later you can have a BBQ with some steak.
 
2012-04-19 10:21:47 AM  
Also, now that the Indians have been given a path to legitimacy despite violating every single nonproliferation norm in existence (while somehow maintaining a straight face and saying stuff like, "Oh yes, our nonproliferation record is blemish-free, unlike those Pakistanis and their AQ Khan"), they've given the Iranians hope that one day the world will accept the Iranian arsenal the same way it has come to accept the Indian arsenal.

It's all linked. Once Iran gets its arsenal (which we have virtually no way to stop), Saudi Arabia will start toying with the idea. Fan-farking-tastic.
 
2012-04-19 10:23:42 AM  

H31N0US: I was in Bangalore a few years back, drinking with some dude who runs our call center. I asked him if he ever worried about Pakistan, and he (slightly paraphrased) said "No, we don't worry about those idiots. They are wrapped up in their religion and traditions and will never get their act together. Besides we are of the same blood. We worry about the Chinese. We've gone to war with them three times since Independence. And the day they learn English (gestures to the throngs of yuppies enjoying a nice evening on MG road or wherever we were) all this is gone."

CSB.


Did someone say bangalore???

4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-04-19 10:25:24 AM  

Seth'n'Spectrum: Also, now that the Indians have been given a path to legitimacy despite violating every single nonproliferation norm in existence (while somehow maintaining a straight face and saying stuff like, "Oh yes, our nonproliferation record is blemish-free, unlike those Pakistanis and their AQ Khan"), they've given the Iranians hope that one day the world will accept the Iranian arsenal the same way it has come to accept the Indian arsenal.

It's all linked. Once Iran gets its arsenal (which we have virtually no way to stop), Saudi Arabia will start toying with the idea. Fan-farking-tastic.


News flash: There was no chance of stopping India either.
 
2012-04-19 10:27:26 AM  
Round 1
-----------

Israel vs Iran

US vs NorKo

China vs India

Russia vs Duke
 
2012-04-19 10:28:38 AM  

Antimatter: Nuclear arms races are always fun. Me thinks china might step up their next space launch to remind some folks they still are in the game.


China & India don't really need ICBMs to reach each other -- the distance is much shorter than USSR/US, and certainly not "intercontinental" since they neighbor each other in Asia.
 
2012-04-19 10:32:02 AM  

Seth'n'Spectrum: Also, now that the Indians have been given a path to legitimacy despite violating every single nonproliferation norm in existence (while somehow maintaining a straight face and saying stuff like, "Oh yes, our nonproliferation record is blemish-free, unlike those Pakistanis and their AQ Khan"), they've given the Iranians hope that one day the world will accept the Iranian arsenal the same way it has come to accept the Indian arsenal.

It's all linked. Once Iran gets its arsenal (which we have virtually no way to stop), Saudi Arabia will start toying with the idea. Fan-farking-tastic.


Actually that works out great. They'll focus on each other while we sit back and watch sports.

Then we can come in and sweep up when it's over
 
2012-04-19 10:35:07 AM  

Seth'n'Spectrum: Well, thanks a lot for giving India the go-ahead. That's directed at the last three U.S. presidents (Clinton, Bush Jr. and Obama) who were more interested in letting U.S. companies get their beaks wet in the Indian market than uphold proper nonproliferation standards.


Nonproliferation only makes sense when a country doesn't have nuclear weapons yet. After they have a working bomb, that game is already lost. Glaring at them and pouting doesn't really accomplish anything. Possessing nuclear weapons is simply too valuable of a bargaining chip to give up, no matter how many sternly-worded letters they receive.
 
2012-04-19 10:35:42 AM  

Dinobot: I hope they have good tech support if the missile fails.


Ok sir I'd like you to please unplug the missile, wait 10 seconds then plug the missile back in.
 
2012-04-19 10:39:31 AM  

This text is now purple: syberpud: ArkPanda: A few years ago, some idiot was trying to drum up defense spending by claiming Russia, China, India, Pakistan, and Iran were about to form the Legion of Doom and come after us.

India and Pakistan allied? Yeah, that's going to happen any day now... Probably the same with Iran and India (extremist Islamic states and polytheists tend not to mix well).

There are as many Muslims in India as there are in Pakistan. (India is basically tied for 2nd in total Muslim population) China has fewer Muslims than Yemen. In a war for survival, India and Pakistan have more in common than Pakistan and China.


True, but radical Islamic groups tend not to like the Hindu majority in India. Pakistan and China might not have much in common, but at least don't shoot at each other over a disputed border like India and Pakistan.

The whole point is that the idea that those countries banding together in a NATO or EU/EC type union militarily or economically is odd to say the least. Sure there will be trade agreements like all countries in the same region tend to enter into, but allies? Doubt it.
 
2012-04-19 10:47:49 AM  
"Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds."
 
2012-04-19 10:50:09 AM  
I wonder if there will finally be some real light shed on the extremely questionable 1998 Pokhran II tests. Supposedly 5 nuclear test devices were set off, three simultaneously and then two simultaneously a couple days later, and every one was a complete success. This never made any sense. It takes a lot of time and money and secrecy to build these, and you'd like the explosions to be absolutely independent so you can see how each one worked (they were various designs, different mechanisms even different isotopes). They knew the tests would be detected, and it wasn't one shot, so why not test each independently? Either they staggered the tests and all but two failed, or they actually wanted bigger blasts than they could get with one weapon, and again most of them failed. "Failed" could mean detonated but way low yield like 0.2kT. What they claim is that several of the bombs were designed to have such low yield. Bullshiat.

Anyway, it was always obvious that the thing was way political, and I don't blame the Indians for doing that but I do blame the scientific press for being dupes and just reporting it straight up.

Oh yeah, two weeks later Pakistan magically detonated 5 devices simultaneously, thereby showing their greater capability at bullshiatting the world. Note that I am not suggesting either of these countries didn't have nuclear explosions - they did, according to seismic records worldwide. What's silly is that they claim 100% success when it was probably more like 20-40%. Which is still greater than Best Korea or the Arabic nations.

Meanwhile Isreal has clearly had nuclear weapons for ages, and doesn't brag about it or even admit it.
 
2012-04-19 10:57:17 AM  
Let's go ahead and sit this one out.
 
2012-04-19 11:00:51 AM  

Bacontastesgood: Supposedly 5 nuclear test devices were set off, three simultaneously and then two simultaneously a couple days later



i945.photobucket.com
 
2012-04-19 11:02:46 AM  

jshine: Nonproliferation only makes sense when a country doesn't have nuclear weapons yet.


Yes. Tell that to South Africa, Argentina, and a whole stack of post-Soviet countries.
 
2012-04-19 11:03:06 AM  

Bacontastesgood: Meanwhile Isreal has clearly had nuclear weapons for ages, and doesn't brag about it or even admit it.


Israel has less to gain politically(and potentially a lot to lose) by publicly admitting it has the bomb. They can already beat their neighbors with conventional forces and can't risk alienating their political allies in Europe and the USA.
 
2012-04-19 11:06:54 AM  

Bacontastesgood: I wonder if there will finally be some real light shed on the extremely questionable 1998 Pokhran II tests. Supposedly 5 nuclear test devices were set off, three simultaneously and then two simultaneously a couple days later, and every one was a complete success. This never made any sense. It takes a lot of time and money and secrecy to build these, and you'd like the explosions to be absolutely independent so you can see how each one worked (they were various designs, different mechanisms even different isotopes). They knew the tests would be detected, and it wasn't one shot, so why not test each independently? Either they staggered the tests and all but two failed, or they actually wanted bigger blasts than they could get with one weapon, and again most of them failed. "Failed" could mean detonated but way low yield like 0.2kT. What they claim is that several of the bombs were designed to have such low yield. Bullshiat.

Anyway, it was always obvious that the thing was way political, and I don't blame the Indians for doing that but I do blame the scientific press for being dupes and just reporting it straight up.

Oh yeah, two weeks later Pakistan magically detonated 5 devices simultaneously, thereby showing their greater capability at bullshiatting the world. Note that I am not suggesting either of these countries didn't have nuclear explosions - they did, according to seismic records worldwide. What's silly is that they claim 100% success when it was probably more like 20-40%. Which is still greater than Best Korea or the Arabic nations.

Meanwhile Isreal has clearly had nuclear weapons for ages, and doesn't brag about it or even admit it.


That's interesting, I never really looked into the specifics of their tests. That certainly makes no sense whatsoever.
 
2012-04-19 11:16:15 AM  

Seth'n'Spectrum: jshine: Nonproliferation only makes sense when a country doesn't have nuclear weapons yet.

Yes. Tell that to South Africa, Argentina, and a whole stack of post-Soviet countries.


I know nothing about Argentina. South Africa is a very unique case (interesting reading). As for the post-soviet countries, they were in a very unique situation.

I'm not saying that no country has ever given up nuclear weapons, but I would say that no country has been successfully *compelled* to do so in the face of outside pressure, in a situation where it felt it might one day need its weapons.
 
2012-04-19 11:17:36 AM  

Seth'n'Spectrum: Also, now that the Indians have been given a path to legitimacy despite violating every single nonproliferation norm in existence (while somehow maintaining a straight face and saying stuff like, "Oh yes, our nonproliferation record is blemish-free, unlike those Pakistanis and their AQ Khan"), they've given the Iranians hope that one day the world will accept the Iranian arsenal the same way it has come to accept the Indian arsenal.

It's all linked. Once Iran gets its arsenal (which we have virtually no way to stop), Saudi Arabia will start toying with the idea. Fan-farking-tastic.


The difference is that India never signed the NPT, so we don't feel bound by it.
 
2012-04-19 11:24:20 AM  
Ya know, a nuclear war between india and china would go a long way toward reducing the human carbon footprint on the world.

They should nuke each other to save the planet.
 
2012-04-19 11:30:33 AM  

Pixiest: Ya know, a nuclear war between india and china would go a long way toward reducing the human carbon footprint on the world.


But we'd see a spike in the world's caesium-137 footprint.
 
2012-04-19 11:33:56 AM  

nekom: Pixiest: Ya know, a nuclear war between india and china would go a long way toward reducing the human carbon footprint on the world.


But we'd see a spike in the world's caesium-137 footprint.


I can live with my curry with some cesium on it. Not for long though.
 
2012-04-19 11:36:00 AM  
If India and China went to war, would America step in?

And if so, for who?

Seeing that we've been world police for so long, would we just provide rations for both sides? Or would we go in and invade New Delhi/Beijing so we can put a larger american presence in said land...
 
2012-04-19 11:42:18 AM  

Seth'n'Spectrum: Well, thanks a lot for giving India the go-ahead. That's directed at the last three U.S. presidents (Clinton, Bush Jr. and Obama) who were more interested in letting U.S. companies get their beaks wet in the Indian market than uphold proper nonproliferation standards.

We should have come down hard on them after their test in the 90s, rather than give them a green-light. At the very least, the Pakistanis wouldn't be able to allege double-standards. Have you heard? Now they want a NSG waiver just like the Indians got. Who didn't see that coming?


Which is what Clinton did, and Bush reversed.
 
2012-04-19 11:44:32 AM  
I don't recall India chanting every five minutes its gonna set the world on fire, so I'm not too worried here.
 
2012-04-19 11:44:40 AM  

Grand_Moff_Joseph: So, it ok for other countries to construct and test nuclear-capable missiles - as long as we like them.

This is why Iran, Best Korea and others will never actually stop their research, or their missile tests. They can just point to stories like this and say 'what makes them so much better than me that they can have missiles but I can't?'

Either we live in a world where we all have nukes and long range missiles, or we live in a world where no one has them at all. Allowing some to have them and not others perpetually breeds discontent and itchy trigger fingers.


Huh? Are you seriously suggesting every country should be allowed to develop nukes for the sake of fairness? How about no. The US has the power and the prerogative to keep these weapons from our enemies, and therefore the right. Fairness doesn't enter into it.
 
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