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(Bloomberg)   The economy is collapsing. Everybody PANIC   (bloomberg.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, U.S., consumer credits, consumer debt, personal incomes, long-run, bond funds, capital expenditures, retreats  
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3460 clicks; posted to Business » on 10 Apr 2012 at 12:39 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



39 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2012-04-10 10:31:20 AM  
Gees, the economy has been collapsing for over a year now. jut farking collapse already
 
2012-04-10 10:36:00 AM  

ManateeGag: Gees, the economy has been collapsing for over a year now. jut farking collapse already


It started on January 20, 2009. Black Tuesday, if you will.
 
2012-04-10 10:45:35 AM  

ManateeGag: Gees, the economy has been collapsing for over a year now. jut farking collapse already


Collapsing upward is harder
 
2012-04-10 10:55:18 AM  

rlv.zcache.com

 
2012-04-10 11:45:40 AM  

James!: ManateeGag: Gees, the economy has been collapsing for over a year now. jut farking collapse already

It started on January 20, 2009. Black Tuesday, if you will.


Unnecessary. You should be ashamed. Please report to a nearby re-education camp for tolerance and sensitivity training.
 
2012-04-10 12:47:02 PM  
Oh, it's gonna collapse. It's gonna collapse like a motherfarker.

/I received my PhD in economics from the University of LOLWUT.
 
2012-04-10 12:56:29 PM  
To quote George W. Bush;

"Bring it on."
 
2012-04-10 12:57:01 PM  
Is this that thing about suburbanite's houses being worth less than their mortgages?
 
2012-04-10 01:02:45 PM  
Bad article. Overemphasis on consumer spending and overuse of aggregates.

Money printing is goosing certain regions and sectors of the economy. Two examples are Silicon Valley and domestic natural gas production. People in involved in those activities and regions are doing very well.

Average those succeeding sectors of the economy with other people who can't do anything but build houses when there's already too many, and it's no wonder the average looks like crap. The whole point of the recession is not to make one big monolithic aggregate go up or down, but to shift resources from wasteful projects to more productive ones.

Though, the next layer deeper, the entire thing is dependent on the central bank providing cheap credit. When interest rates go up, then lots of projects will turn out to be unsustainable, and we'll end up worse of then when we started.
 
2012-04-10 01:04:05 PM  
again?
 
2012-04-10 01:05:23 PM  

Larofeticus: Bad article. Overemphasis on consumer spending and overuse of aggregates.

Money printing is goosing certain regions and sectors of the economy. Two examples are Silicon Valley and domestic natural gas production. People in involved in those activities and regions are doing very well.


Have you seen NG prices recently...?
 
2012-04-10 01:16:28 PM  
Americans drove 264.4 billion miles in December, up 1.3 percent from a year earlier, but they used 2.5 percent less gasoline

Okay, I get how they determine how much gasoline is being used, as that is done through orders and sales at gas stations.

But how do they know how many miles we drove? Any people in a related field want to take a stab at that, or should I just assume the author of the article is just pulling that number out of his ass?
 
2012-04-10 01:17:08 PM  

karmaceutical: Is this that thing about suburbanite's houses being worth less than their mortgages?


So other than if I lost my job and had to move to get a new job but couldn't without taking a loss on my house, what is SO bad about your mortgage being more than the value of the house?

/confuses me
//neighbors complain about it
///like where I live,
////got in WAY cheap too
 
2012-04-10 01:17:51 PM  
Some things are doing well, other things are not. On average things remain overall unchanged. This has been true for pretty much the last decade, and will continue to remain true until there is another life-altering technological advance.
 
2012-04-10 01:19:44 PM  

Dog Welder: Americans drove 264.4 billion miles in December, up 1.3 percent from a year earlier, but they used 2.5 percent less gasoline

Okay, I get how they determine how much gasoline is being used, as that is done through orders and sales at gas stations.

But how do they know how many miles we drove? Any people in a related field want to take a stab at that, or should I just assume the author of the article is just pulling that number out of his ass?


Car registrations. When you re-register your car (and when it is inspected), the mileage is logged for formal record keeping, and can be easily looked up in a database
 
2012-04-10 01:20:04 PM  
No it's not. Poor people are still buying tons of shiat they don't need and can't afford.
 
2012-04-10 01:23:48 PM  

Shazam999: Have you seen NG prices recently...?


The current natural gas price doesn't matter. These are big capital investment projects. The money isn't coming from selling natural gas it's coming from cheap loans.

I grew up in western Pennsylvania. For the past few years there has been a huge boom from drilling fracking wells there. Drilling wells, hauling rigs, pipelines everywhere, processing stations, pumps, refineries, rail lines, transportation infrastructure, buying gas rights from landowners, and on and on. Thousands of wells, and they're not even close to being done drilling or getting volume production online. Thousands of direct, well paying jobs, and tens of thousands or more indirectly boosted in the region. Paid for with loans. Loans vulnerable to interest rates.

It's a pretty safe bet that NG price will go up in the future, but what matters here is how soon it happens, and if it does so faster or slower than interest rates.
 
2012-04-10 01:28:09 PM  

RumsfeldsReplacement: No it's not. Poor people are still buying tons of shiat they don't need and can't afford.


They should really consider purchasing new refrigerators.
 
2012-04-10 01:34:06 PM  

quickdraw: again?


Did the last one even officially end? Or do they just want to be able to say they predicted it if it kind of maybe happens for most likely different reasons then what they actually thought was going to trigger it again?

Economists are about as much bs as politicians now with even less sensationalism.
 
2012-04-10 01:37:08 PM  

AverageJoe77: what is SO bad about your mortgage being more than the value of the house?


Do you like paying $200,000 for something you could buy for $150,000?
 
2012-04-10 01:39:31 PM  

Larofeticus: It's a pretty safe bet that NG price will go up in the future, but what matters here is how soon it happens, and if it does so faster or slower than interest rates.


My understanding from the local radio news this morning was that NG prices were going to stabilize because the last winter was much less harsh than expected, leading to more available that would be traded to foriegn markets. I have no idea how accurate that protrayal was, however that segment on the news was stating that it would de-stabilize the market and lower/stabilize future prices for quite some time.
 
2012-04-10 01:47:30 PM  
i232.photobucket.com
 
2012-04-10 01:49:29 PM  
Obama's gettin the Hope n Change sauce ready. You'll see! It's made with real magical unicorn tears.
 
2012-04-10 01:49:45 PM  
I've got plenty of food, water and ammo. So whatever.
 
2012-04-10 01:51:15 PM  

ManateeGag: Gees, the economy has been collapsing for over a year now. jut farking collapse already


Over a year? More like 6 years.
 
2012-04-10 01:59:26 PM  
Just as long as there are whiny, self-important douchetards with a sense of entitlement, I'm good.
 
2012-04-10 02:06:58 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Dog Welder: Americans drove 264.4 billion miles in December, up 1.3 percent from a year earlier, but they used 2.5 percent less gasoline

Okay, I get how they determine how much gasoline is being used, as that is done through orders and sales at gas stations.

But how do they know how many miles we drove? Any people in a related field want to take a stab at that, or should I just assume the author of the article is just pulling that number out of his ass?

Car registrations. When you re-register your car (and when it is inspected), the mileage is logged for formal record keeping, and can be easily looked up in a database


I don't give mileage on my car registration in Ohio, and we don't have car inspections on newer models.
 
2012-04-10 02:07:07 PM  

pkellmey: Larofeticus: It's a pretty safe bet that NG price will go up in the future, but what matters here is how soon it happens, and if it does so faster or slower than interest rates.

My understanding from the local radio news this morning was that NG prices were going to stabilize because the last winter was much less harsh than expected, leading to more available that would be traded to foriegn markets. I have no idea how accurate that protrayal was, however that segment on the news was stating that it would de-stabilize the market and lower/stabilize future prices for quite some time.


NG is not fungible at the moment, so selling to foreign markets is a while off. It ain't happening next year.
 
2012-04-10 02:09:19 PM  

Larofeticus: Shazam999: Have you seen NG prices recently...?

The current natural gas price doesn't matter. These are big capital investment projects. The money isn't coming from selling natural gas it's coming from cheap loans.

I grew up in western Pennsylvania. For the past few years there has been a huge boom from drilling fracking wells there. Drilling wells, hauling rigs, pipelines everywhere, processing stations, pumps, refineries, rail lines, transportation infrastructure, buying gas rights from landowners, and on and on. Thousands of wells, and they're not even close to being done drilling or getting volume production online. Thousands of direct, well paying jobs, and tens of thousands or more indirectly boosted in the region. Paid for with loans. Loans vulnerable to interest rates.

It's a pretty safe bet that NG price will go up in the future, but what matters here is how soon it happens, and if it does so faster or slower than interest rates.


zzzz.... I live in Alberta, where we've had NG wells for decades now.

NG reserves are sky high. There's so much farking NG, they have to keep some in the farking pipelines, because storage capacity is basically at 0%.

NG producers are surviving right now because Ng byproducts are selling for far higher than the NG itself.
 
2012-04-10 02:11:45 PM  

MugzyBrown: AverageJoe77: what is SO bad about your mortgage being more than the value of the house?

Do you like paying $200,000 for something you could buy for $150,000?


Subtract a zero out of each of those numbers and people do that with automobiles all the time

Home values should not be gauranteed, you buy a home to live in, not flip and a make a profit. It really wasn't suppose to be that way.
 
2012-04-10 02:20:21 PM  
Subtract a zero out of each of those numbers and people do that with automobiles all the time

Home values should not be gauranteed, you buy a home to live in, not flip and a make a profit. It really wasn't suppose to be that way.


Making something cost 10x's less makes the comparison idiotic. Buying something for $100 vs $1,000 is a different decision. ie If the product I want cost $100, and I knowi t's on sale for $90 an hour's drive away, I'll probably just buy it for $100. If we're talking $1,000 vs $900.. I go for the drive.

Also, a car is disposable and it's lifespan typically tops out at about 10 years. A house can last for generations.

Finally, it's not about "flipping it", it's about an investment. If you put hundreds of thousands of dollars into something, you want it to retain its value for many things.. especially a financial emergency.


If your house value is significantly less than the remaining balance on your mortgage, it doesn't make financial sense to keep paying the mortgage.
 
2012-04-10 03:18:29 PM  

MugzyBrown:
If your house value is significantly less than the remaining balance on your mortgage, it doesn't make financial sense to keep paying the mortgage.


Well, except for that whole part of being foreclosed on, getting a huge black mark on your credit rating, and probably being unable to buy a new house for quite some time.
 
2012-04-10 03:23:01 PM  
Well, except for that whole part of being foreclosed on, getting a huge black mark on your credit rating, and probably being unable to buy a new house for quite some time.

That depends on the rest of your credit history and your income and debt levels.
 
2012-04-10 04:11:43 PM  
Oh God. Oh God. We're all going to die?
 
2012-04-10 06:29:03 PM  

Dog Welder: Lost Thought 00: Dog Welder: Americans drove 264.4 billion miles in December, up 1.3 percent from a year earlier, but they used 2.5 percent less gasoline

Okay, I get how they determine how much gasoline is being used, as that is done through orders and sales at gas stations.

But how do they know how many miles we drove? Any people in a related field want to take a stab at that, or should I just assume the author of the article is just pulling that number out of his ass?

Car registrations. When you re-register your car (and when it is inspected), the mileage is logged for formal record keeping, and can be easily looked up in a database

I don't give mileage on my car registration in Ohio, and we don't have car inspections on newer models.


Same here in Wisconsin. When it's time to renew my registration, I just send them the money and they send me a sticker. There are biennial emissions tests required for registration, but only in 7 counties around Milwaukee, and many vehicles are exempt.
 
2012-04-10 06:43:17 PM  

DeltaX: Oh God. Oh God. We're all going to die?


We crashing again?
 
2012-04-10 10:24:49 PM  
I blame everyone who isn't me.
 
2012-04-10 10:38:27 PM  
When will these assholes learn that constantly blabbing about another recession can become a self-fulfilling prophecy?
 
2012-04-11 11:15:47 AM  

MugzyBrown: Subtract a zero out of each of those numbers and people do that with automobiles all the time

Home values should not be gauranteed, you buy a home to live in, not flip and a make a profit. It really wasn't suppose to be that way.

Making something cost 10x's less makes the comparison idiotic. Buying something for $100 vs $1,000 is a different decision. ie If the product I want cost $100, and I knowi t's on sale for $90 an hour's drive away, I'll probably just buy it for $100. If we're talking $1,000 vs $900.. I go for the drive.

Also, a car is disposable and it's lifespan typically tops out at about 10 years. A house can last for generations.

Finally, it's not about "flipping it", it's about an investment. If you put hundreds of thousands of dollars into something, you want it to retain its value for many things.. especially a financial emergency.


If your house value is significantly less than the remaining balance on your mortgage, it doesn't make financial sense to keep paying the mortgage.


That is pretty bad advice, hope you are not any sort of financial advisor and only play one on the Internet. Real Estate should be a long term purchase, values will flucuate over time. You only lose money if you sell or make money if you sell. A lot of people don't understand this, just because your house was worth $800K in 2007 and is only worth $300K today, does not mean you lost $500K because you would have to sell it first. Paper gains/losses are not real until the asset is actually sold. The real value will be determined by the current market demands.

If your home is worth less than what you owe, well if you can keep making the payments you should be fine. A lot of expenses in moving, taxes, cost of moving, down payments or security deposits are not cheap or free. Infact you may have to claim the default as income to the IRS, so just handing the keys over to the bank because you are "losing" money might be a pretty dumb idea. Also because homes are sellilng for less does not mean you will be qualified to buy them, you will need perfect credit (it would be destroyed because of the forclosure) and a downpayment, which would be gone because of all of those moving expenses and taxes you owe.

Just as a side note, my friend's parents are selling their house, in 2007 it was probably worth $350K, now they are lucky to get $220K and his Dad compains about the money he is "losing", but he only paid $32K for the house in 1978. Sure he is losing his paper gain, but overall he would be doing ok. I did not include taxes, repairs, mortgage interest, maintenance, insurance, etc he paid over the years, which is why homes really do make bad investments. Mortgage interest alone almost doubles the price of the home.
 
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