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(Fox News)   Thomas Jefferson created his own 'cut and paste' version of the Bible by removing what he felt couldn't be substantiated. The two page document is currently on display at the Smithsonian's Museum of American History   (foxnews.com ) divider line
    More: Interesting, Bibles, Thomas Jefferson, resurrections, Smithsonian, Monticello, documents, enlightenment  
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6870 clicks; posted to Politics » on 09 Apr 2012 at 5:34 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-04-09 06:16:50 AM  
It's one page with five words glued to it..."Be" "excellent" "to" "each" "other".
 
2012-04-09 06:21:39 AM  

Tatsuma: The man who believed that African-Americans were inferior to whites?...Yeah, I could see why the GOP would run away from such opinions.


Hahahahahah. Funny.
 
2012-04-09 06:23:13 AM  
Clicked on the link FOX link JUST to read the comments.
Satisfied.
 
2012-04-09 06:28:42 AM  
needcoffee.cachefly.net

Thou shalt always be honest and faithful
to the provider of thy nookie.


Thou shalt try real hard not to kill anyone, unless of course
they pray to a different invisible man than you.
 
2012-04-09 06:30:14 AM  

Bessame: Clicked on the link FOX link JUST to read the comments.
Satisfied.


Kinky.
 
2012-04-09 06:32:38 AM  
So he ignored the parts of the bible he didn't like? Man you'd think Republicans would be all over this.
 
2012-04-09 06:38:41 AM  

turbidum: FTA: But ironically, a man and future president who worked to safeguard religious freedom, Thomas Jefferson, could only believe in an earthly Jesus.

How is that ironic?


Wait, does religious freedom not mean freedom for Christians to live in a world of only Christians?
 
2012-04-09 06:48:23 AM  

NobleHam: Wait, does religious freedom not mean freedom for Christians to live in a world of only Christians?


No, it means for everyone, not just for radical atheists.
 
2012-04-09 06:54:47 AM  

Tatsuma: (And no, my point is not that Thomas Jefferson would have been a card-carrying Tea Party member with Sarah Palin posters. My point is that Thomas Jefferson, like all men of a different era, was a product of his time, and it is absolutely ridiculous to try and ascribe the different positions that the man would be holding today. It is only an exercise in mental self-pleasure, in order to think along the lines of 'My position is so right, even [wo/man that I admire] would agree! In fact, part mental self-pleasuring, part reassuring yourself that you are wrong. There is no way to know what these people would think of today's society, and even then their opinions as outsiders would be completely irrelevant, as they would not have lived and experienced life in the last decades to be able to truly appreciate it. Let's stop these retarded scenarios, ok?)

(Also everyone knows that Genghis Khan followed Straussian economy, Galileo would have been part of Occupy Wall Street, and that Rasputin would have opposed Global Warming legislation)


Not sure what your point is. It sounds almost like you're saying, "The left should stop trying to refute the right's ideological adoption of Jefferson by adopting Jefferson for the left." You do realize that the link for this story is Faux News, right? And from what I've seen, in the past several years, commentary from the left on the "founding fathers" has been largely, "you can't use a cloud of myths to make your policies today seem like they were co-created by Jesus and the 'founding fathers' 230 years ago." Rather than "Jefferson proves us right!"

I certainly agree that you can't pluck anyone from the year 1776 (or the year 33) and expect conformity with today's view of the world.

I look forward to the post-history, post-news, post-information future when bloggers make their points by describing Jefferson's tweets on the teachings of Jesus regarding health insurance mandates.
 
2012-04-09 06:55:25 AM  
I want to know what proof a mathematician has that the resurrection of Jesus actually happened.

I also want to know what in the holy fark that has to do with Jefferson.
 
2012-04-09 06:56:30 AM  

Old enough to know better: So he ignored the parts of the bible he didn't like? Man you'd think Republicans would be all over this.


Like that asshat over at Conservapedia?
 
2012-04-09 06:56:44 AM  

Paris1127: GAT_00: Somacandra: Jefferson could write Latin in one hand and Greek in the other, simultaenously.

Woah, really? I've never heard of anyone doing that before.

Actually, that was James Garfield. Probably the only thing he's famous for, aside from being shot by a lunatic preacher who wanted to be Ambassador to France...

/and then dying because the doctors couldn't find the bullet...


Don't forget his love of lasagna.

/And hatred for Mondays.
 
2012-04-09 06:56:50 AM  

Tatsuma: Weaver95: Jefferson explodes their carefully constructed lies about the intentions of the Founding Fathers. he's very inconvenient for the modern day GOP.

Thomas Jefferson?

The man who said that the Federal Government was a necessary evil that had to be observed very carefully?
The man who believed that occasional violent rebellion against the government was not only perfectly acceptable, but desired?
The man who believed that at no point should the Federal Government violate States' Rights?
The man who believed America had a duty to propagate its 'Empire of Liberty'?
The man who believed that it was fine to mess around with other countries in order to keep certain segments of America in check?
The man who proclaimed himself a proud xian, yet only against the excesses of the church?
The man who opposed and proclaimed disdain for atheism?
The man who admired self-reliant farmers?
The man who on one hand pretended to condemn slavery, yet justified it as valid in private?
The man who only freed two of his own slaves during his lifetime, and sold the 130 left after his death to settle a debt?
The man who was given a large estate in order to redeem slaves to liberty by one of his friends after his passing, yet did absolutely nothing with that estate for the rest of his life?
The man who believed that African-Americans were inferior to whites?
The man who believed that keeping African-Americans in the United States would inevitably lead to a race war of annihilation, and thus once freed they should be sent back to Africa?

Yeah, I could see why the GOP would run away from such opinions.


Man, that post was so long I decided to passover it...

/badumtish...
//try the veal...or don't...not sure if you can...
///slashies!
 
2012-04-09 06:58:47 AM  
upload.wikimedia.org

(worth reading)
 
2012-04-09 06:59:53 AM  

Weaver95: Jefferson is one of those Founding Fathers that the Republicans would rather forget about.


Except when they quote him about liberty. And then they gloss over the slaves he owned.
 
2012-04-09 07:16:12 AM  

ModernLuddite: I want to know what proof a mathematician has that the resurrection of Jesus actually happened.

I also want to know what in the holy fark that has to do with Jefferson.


---
"This idea that miracles violate the laws of nature, that is a false notion. The laws of nature are our description of what we observe regularly to happen .... But God is not a prisoner of those laws. He can feed a new event in, if he wants to. It doesn't break the laws."


that alone tells you everything you need to know - when one allows for the supernatural when evaluating the laws of nature, they've done given up on science. the rest is just mental gymnastics.
 
2012-04-09 07:19:34 AM  

ModernLuddite: I want to know what proof a mathematician has that the resurrection of Jesus actually happened.

I also want to know what in the holy fark that has to do with Jefferson.


I wonder if this jackass includes divinity in his math proofs.

Next up, a pediatric heart surgeon who has spent the last 20 years rewriting particle physics from his living room.
 
2012-04-09 07:21:46 AM  

The Evil That Lies In The Hearts Of Men: Weaver95: Jefferson is one of those Founding Fathers that the Republicans would rather forget about.

Except when they quote him about liberty. And then they gloss over the slaves he owned.


Republican Thomas Jefferson is a lot like Republican Jesus.

They like maybe one or two things he said, and ignore the rest.
 
2012-04-09 07:22:52 AM  
Old news is new news?
 
2012-04-09 07:27:00 AM  

neongoats: DozeNutz: sparkeyjames: In other words Jefferson was a liberal. Suck it cons.

lol. Classical liberalism... not liberal in today's sense of the word. so suck it libs?

Considering literally everything the so called, self named "conservatives" do is a direct assault against the enlightenment era, yeah. Suck it cons.


I'm gonna have to call bs. Libs are for a welfare state, (state run ed, health, retirement, etc) which is the opposite of what the enlightenment was. Not saying modern day conservatives are there either, but much closer.
 
2012-04-09 07:32:19 AM  

GAT_00: WI241TH: GAT_00: This is news?

For Fox viewers, yes. They think Jesus signed the Constitution in invisible ink.

I more meant 'this is new news?' It's been known for quite some time that Jefferson outright rejected large parts of the Bible which he felt was dumbing down the message.


You need to understand that Fox fans consider this guy a historian

img.photobucket.com
 
2012-04-09 07:33:23 AM  

DozeNutz: a welfare state, (state run ed, health, retirement, etc) which is the opposite of what the enlightenment was


So the enlightenment was all about opposition to things that didn't exist on Earth at that time.

Gotcha.
 
2012-04-09 07:38:41 AM  
"This idea that miracles violate the laws of nature, that is a false notion."

No, that's pretty much the definition of a miracle.
 
2012-04-09 07:40:14 AM  

DozeNutz: neongoats: DozeNutz: sparkeyjames: In other words Jefferson was a liberal. Suck it cons.

lol. Classical liberalism... not liberal in today's sense of the word. so suck it libs?

Considering literally everything the so called, self named "conservatives" do is a direct assault against the enlightenment era, yeah. Suck it cons.

I'm gonna have to call bs. Libs are for a welfare state, (state run ed, health, retirement, etc) which is the opposite of what the enlightenment was. Not saying modern day conservatives are there either, but much closer.


I have to disagree. If anything, the present day Conservative movement making the same mistakes the Greeks did in going from using science to almost outright mysticism (look at how so many Republicans denounce scientists on a regular basis now), and they are making the same mistakes that the Romans did near the end of that empire (constant military forays that stretched their forces too thin, and the wealth of Rome going to an anointed few).

I'm not sure how well you've thought out your 'welfare state' comments, as a social safety net, public education and such guaranteed a better life for many Americans who weren't 'of means'. Or do you believe we would truly be better off going back to the heady days of the Gilded Age ?
 
2012-04-09 07:46:51 AM  

turbidum: doglover: GAT_00: Somacandra: Jefferson could write Latin in one hand and Greek in the other, simultaenously.

Woah, really? I've never heard of anyone doing that before.

They go opposite directions. I've heard where ancient people would write in alternating rows to save time or something, but the details are fuzzy and google's not helping.

Are you thinking about boustrophedon?


Indeed.
 
2012-04-09 07:48:43 AM  

The Evil That Lies In The Hearts Of Men: And then they gloss over the slaves he owned.


Actually what they ignore is what Jefferson, and a lot of the other founding fathers, thought about large commercial interests.
 
2012-04-09 07:54:31 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: I'm not sure how well you've thought out your 'welfare state' comments, as a social safety net, public education and such guaranteed a better life for many Americans who weren't 'of means'. Or do you believe we would truly be better off going back to the heady days of the Gilded Age ?


I'm interested in this "guarantee" you speak of. Education serves a purpose for giving you the potential tools for the possiblity to go further in life. However, I don't know of anyone who believes that public education makes those types of 'guaranteed' promises.
 
2012-04-09 07:56:34 AM  

Minus1Kelvin: Tatsuma: Weaver95: Jefferson explodes their carefully constructed lies about the intentions of the Founding Fathers. he's very inconvenient for the modern day GOP.

Thomas Jefferson?

snippage!


Thomas Jefferson's thoughts regarding economic matters and state's rights were made invalid by the industrial age. His thoughts on revolution where made invalid with the advancement of high-tech military hardware. His thoughts regarding independent farmers was made invalid by the advancement of technology in farming and transportation. His thoughts on slavery and American empirical aims were made invalid by the increase in respect for basic human decency.

His thoughts on religion are the only area of thought not completely eclipsed by subsequent events, the only area where he is able to advance an idea, the idea that supernatural claims are bunk, which cannot be invalidated due to modern advancement. And, even there, giving that he had no idea of the revolutions in evolutionary theory and cosmology, his deistic disdain for atheism has been invalidated.
 
2012-04-09 08:05:01 AM  

Tatsuma: Weaver95: Jefferson explodes their carefully constructed lies about the intentions of the Founding Fathers. he's very inconvenient for the modern day GOP.

Thomas Jefferson?

The man who said that the Federal Government was a necessary evil that had to be observed very carefully?
The man who believed that occasional violent rebellion against the government was not only perfectly acceptable, but desired?
The man who believed that at no point should the Federal Government violate States' Rights?
The man who believed America had a duty to propagate its 'Empire of Liberty'?
The man who believed that it was fine to mess around with other countries in order to keep certain segments of America in check?
The man who proclaimed himself a proud xian, yet only against the excesses of the church?
The man who opposed and proclaimed disdain for atheism?
The man who admired self-reliant farmers?
The man who on one hand pretended to condemn slavery, yet justified it as valid in private?
The man who only freed two of his own slaves during his lifetime, and sold the 130 left after his death to settle a debt?
The man who was given a large estate in order to redeem slaves to liberty by one of his friends after his passing, yet did absolutely nothing with that estate for the rest of his life?
The man who believed that African-Americans were inferior to whites?
The man who believed that keeping African-Americans in the United States would inevitably lead to a race war of annihilation, and thus once freed they should be sent back to Africa?

Yeah, I could see why the GOP would run away from such opinions.


The man who, in Notes on the State of Virginia, said that there were only two solutions to dealing with blacks in America: keep them as slaves, or move them back to Africa - because whites and free blacks could not coexist in North America.

/he wrote that book during his very regrettable and forgettable term as governor of Virginia
 
2012-04-09 08:07:10 AM  
Stephen Mitchell did a similar project, inspired by T.J. "The Gospel According to Jesus"

A very nice read. I recommend.
 
2012-04-09 08:08:41 AM  

Javacrucian: I see he used "f"'s for "s"'s. Did they pronounce it with f's or s's? Maybe his name is pronounced Thomaf Jesserfon.


It's Olde Englishe. They also (as shown by example here) added extra vowels to their words, namely the letter 'e'. The British and those in the commonwealth still continue that tradition today. Example: colour, flavour.

Silly Brits.

WhyteRaven74: DrBenway: Weren't they trying to write him out of the history books in Texas?

Yep.


That must provide for some interesting discussion in history class over our early Presidents...
 
2012-04-09 08:11:44 AM  

WI241TH: GAT_00: This is news?

For Fox viewers, yes. They think Jesus signed the Constitution in invisible ink.


Can Jesus write something that God or Holy Spirit couldn't read?
 
2012-04-09 08:13:34 AM  

sparkeyjames: In other words Jefferson was a liberal. Suck it cons.


He was a huge liberal. Known francophile and fan of French democracy, fine wine, lots of beer and farking other women besides his wife.
 
2012-04-09 08:16:33 AM  

LewDux: WI241TH: GAT_00: This is news?

For Fox viewers, yes. They think Jesus signed the Constitution in invisible ink.

Can Jesus write something that God or Holy Spirit couldn't read?


That's an interesting theology you have there.
 
2012-04-09 08:17:56 AM  
America's First Amendment guarantees millions of Christians the right this weekend to boldly celebrate their faith's holiest day of the year

Daringly. Christfully. Resurectionally.
 
2012-04-09 08:21:21 AM  

Tatsuma: Weaver95: Jefferson explodes their carefully constructed lies about the intentions of the Founding Fathers. he's very inconvenient for the modern day GOP.

Thomas Jefferson?

The man who said that the Federal Government was a necessary evil that had to be observed very carefully?
The man who believed that occasional violent rebellion against the government was not only perfectly acceptable, but desired?
The man who believed that at no point should the Federal Government violate States' Rights?
The man who believed America had a duty to propagate its 'Empire of Liberty'?
The man who believed that it was fine to mess around with other countries in order to keep certain segments of America in check?
The man who proclaimed himself a proud xian, yet only against the excesses of the church?
The man who opposed and proclaimed disdain for atheism?
The man who admired self-reliant farmers?
The man who on one hand pretended to condemn slavery, yet justified it as valid in private?
The man who only freed two of his own slaves during his lifetime, and sold the 130 left after his death to settle a debt?
The man who was given a large estate in order to redeem slaves to liberty by one of his friends after his passing, yet did absolutely nothing with that estate for the rest of his life?
The man who believed that African-Americans were inferior to whites?
The man who believed that keeping African-Americans in the United States would inevitably lead to a race war of annihilation, and thus once freed they should be sent back to Africa?

Yeah, I could see why the GOP would run away from such opinions.


Most likely Jefferson was an Atheist who simply played along. He also cut defense to the bone while simultaneously sending forces overseas to "fight terrorism". He was a product of his times and believed in the fact that an "elite" should indeed rule the country in order to prevent the moronic masses from doing so.

He was a multifaceted man who was possibly one of the smartest men this country ever had. Trying to pigeon-hole him into the retarded GOP position now is well.. retarded. And you're a moron if you think he would ever agree with the morons who seemingly run the party. Did I mention he also believed that the way forward was education? And personally donated much of his collection of books to repopulate the Library of Congress after 1813? Yup, right in lockstep with the GOP's war on education and women.

Jefferson was a product of the enlightenment. He was not, in any way, a conservative in his time. Thinking any of the troglodytes that make up the GOP could possibly understand his reasoning for his positions, views and theories is over estimating the American "base" by a long shot.
 
2012-04-09 08:21:24 AM  

Kibbler: Tatsuma: (And no, my point is not that Thomas Jefferson would have been a card-carrying Tea Party member with Sarah Palin posters. My point is that Thomas Jefferson, like all men of a different era, was a product of his time, and it is absolutely ridiculous to try and ascribe the different positions that the man would be holding today. It is only an exercise in mental self-pleasure, in order to think along the lines of 'My position is so right, even [wo/man that I admire] would agree! In fact, part mental self-pleasuring, part reassuring yourself that you are wrong. There is no way to know what these people would think of today's society, and even then their opinions as outsiders would be completely irrelevant, as they would not have lived and experienced life in the last decades to be able to truly appreciate it. Let's stop these retarded scenarios, ok?)

(Also everyone knows that Genghis Khan followed Straussian economy, Galileo would have been part of Occupy Wall Street, and that Rasputin would have opposed Global Warming legislation)

Not sure what your point is. It sounds almost like you're saying, "The left should stop trying to refute the right's ideological adoption of Jefferson by adopting Jefferson for the left." You do realize that the link for this story is Faux News, right? And from what I've seen, in the past several years, commentary from the left on the "founding fathers" has been largely, "you can't use a cloud of myths to make your policies today seem like they were co-created by Jesus and the 'founding fathers' 230 years ago." Rather than "Jefferson proves us right!"

I certainly agree that you can't pluck anyone from the year 1776 (or the year 33) and expect conformity with today's view of the world.

I look forward to the post-history, post-news, post-information future when bloggers make their points by describing Jefferson's tweets on the teachings of Jesus regarding health insurance mandates.


He's saying, "Thomas Jefferson was a conservative, and liberals suck". As usual, Tatsuma does not know what the fark he is talking about.
 
2012-04-09 08:21:40 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: ?


The enlightenment was of science, but also of religious freedom. Freedom of thought, etc. By having the state control education, other things like that, you are taking away the freedom to think for yourself, etc. Not saying he was against education in general, but of controlled education, or "education is 'this'" if you get what i mean. State run education is not epistemology.
 
2012-04-09 08:25:18 AM  

doglover: Somacandra: Jefferson could write Latin in one hand and Greek in the other, simultaenously.

A neat trick, but not unheard of at the time. That artist who could draw a bull's head with one hand and cow's with the other was late 1700's too, I think.


Pffft. I can use a computer with my right hand while my left hand is... ah, doing something else.
 
2012-04-09 08:27:29 AM  

GAT_00: Somacandra: Jefferson could write Latin in one hand and Greek in the other, simultaenously.

Woah, really? I've never heard of anyone doing that before.


I had a religion professor in college who could do that. Actually, he would write Hebrew with one hand and Greek with the other. The best part was that he used those lectures to remind students that the modern bible is a translation of a translation of a translation, and he loved to point out the places where there were words in older versions that have less-than-direct translations to modern English.

He HATED the fact that there are people who believe THEIR translation of the bible is THE literal word of God.
 
2012-04-09 08:28:38 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: Or do you believe we would truly be better off going back to the heady days of the Gilded Age ?


I believe there are many people in this country who think exactly that... Sadly, many of these people seem to have enough wealth and power to influence our government and our laws to achieve just that.

In these people's minds, poor people are poor because they deserve it and the wealthy elite are supposed to control the vast majority of wealth in this country while everyone else fights over their table scraps.
 
2012-04-09 08:30:31 AM  
Did he take out the things that couldn't be consubstantiated or transubstantiated?
 
2012-04-09 08:31:25 AM  

pkellmey: Old news is new news?


blog.tommcfeeley.com
For some reason that made me think of this.
 
2012-04-09 08:32:46 AM  

AKTurkey: It's true. He could also rape his female slaves while putting out warrants for his male slaves. He called it multi-task-mastering


As was his Biblical right, nay responsibility, to do so.
 
2012-04-09 08:35:05 AM  

DozeNutz: By having the state control education, other things like that, you are taking away the freedom to think for yourself, etc.


No, you're thinking of the church.
 
2012-04-09 08:35:42 AM  
www.cheese-magnet.com

Bible's broken. Contradictions, false logistics - doesn't make sense.
 
2012-04-09 08:40:03 AM  

Kibbler: Tatsuma: (And no, my point is not that Thomas Jefferson would have been a card-carrying Tea Party member with Sarah Palin posters. My point is that Thomas Jefferson, like all men of a different era, was a product of his time, and it is absolutely ridiculous to try and ascribe the different positions that the man would be holding today. It is only an exercise in mental self-pleasure, in order to think along the lines of 'My position is so right, even [wo/man that I admire] would agree! In fact, part mental self-pleasuring, part reassuring yourself that you are wrong. There is no way to know what these people would think of today's society, and even then their opinions as outsiders would be completely irrelevant, as they would not have lived and experienced life in the last decades to be able to truly appreciate it. Let's stop these retarded scenarios, ok?)

(Also everyone knows that Genghis Khan followed Straussian economy, Galileo would have been part of Occupy Wall Street, and that Rasputin would have opposed Global Warming legislation)

Not sure what your point is. It sounds almost like you're saying, "The left should stop trying to refute the right's ideological adoption of Jefferson by adopting Jefferson for the left." You do realize that the link for this story is Faux News, right? And from what I've seen, in the past several years, commentary from the left on the "founding fathers" has been largely, "you can't use a cloud of myths to make your policies today seem like they were co-created by Jesus and the 'founding fathers' 230 years ago." Rather than "Jefferson proves us right!"

I certainly agree that you can't pluck anyone from the year 1776 (or the year 33) and expect conformity with today's view of the world.

I look forward to the post-history, post-news, post-information future when bloggers make their points by describing Jefferson's tweets on the teachings of Jesus regarding health insurance mandates.


It is quite obvious that he is saying "Different time, different people". Don't ascribe modern political ideas and partisan standing to long-dead people. It is ridiculous. Just like a modern person cannot hold a person in 1776 to 2012 morality standards on pretty much everything. Everybody today agrees that slavery is evil, but should we transfer that to our understanding of history and denounce Jefferson as evil for owning slaves? No.
 
2012-04-09 08:40:44 AM  

DozeNutz: AurizenDarkstar: ?

The enlightenment was of science, but also of religious freedom. Freedom of thought, etc. By having the state control education, other things like that, you are taking away the freedom to think for yourself, etc. Not saying he was against education in general, but of controlled education, or "education is 'this'" if you get what i mean. State run education is not epistemology.


You are an idiot. State Universities are only "state" in that they get a portion of funding from the state. Most have boards of regents that are appointed. Do you even know how this stuff works or are you just a moron shill.

Oh. Yea, moron shill.
 
2012-04-09 08:42:09 AM  
But ironically, a man and future president who worked to safeguard religious freedom, Thomas Jefferson, could only believe in an earthly Jesus

Of course, it's not ironic at all. It just speaks as to how much principled Jefferson was than today's fundamentalist bozos. And it illustrates how these people continually and repeatedly miss the point of just about everything.
 
2012-04-09 08:42:36 AM  
FTA:But ironically, a man and future president who worked to safeguard religious freedom, Thomas Jefferson, could only believe in an earthly Jesus

Ironic indeed that a man not given to the christ could be foreward thinking about defending religious freedom. He was protecting us from christians as much as maintaining your hegemony.
 
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