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(UPI)   Michigan plans to dramatically increase the number of organ donors statewide   (upi.com) divider line 117
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9582 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Mar 2012 at 12:41 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-03-30 09:17:18 AM
Darwin approves
 
2012-03-30 09:27:34 AM
And yet you can be stopped an ticketed purely for not wearing a seat belt. Yeah, that makes sense.
 
2012-03-30 09:40:26 AM
Do any insurance policies require helmets? Thought just occurred to me....
 
2012-03-30 09:49:17 AM

OregonVet: Do any insurance policies require helmets? Thought just occurred to me....


You raise a good point, but down here in SC (where motorcyclists are not required to wear helmets), I'm pretty most people just lie and say they do wear one...

...which would definitely come back to bite them when they are in a vegetative state or dead after a traffic accident.
 
2012-03-30 09:56:27 AM

Nickster79: ...which would definitely come back to bite them when they are in a vegetative state or dead after a traffic accident.


Like the lack of money would affect the veg. They already obviously don't care about anyone else if they don't have a helmet on.
I'm still for choice, but there's only one smart choice.
 
2012-03-30 09:58:44 AM
Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).
 
2012-03-30 10:02:16 AM

Sybarite: And yet you can be stopped an ticketed purely for not wearing a seat belt. Yeah, that makes sense.


Apples and oranges...

There's an argument to me made that by restricting your vision and hearing, wearing a helmet might increase your chances of crashing your bike. (I'm sure this has been studied but I'm too lazy to look).

Wearing a seat belt helps keep you firmly in your seat, so in theory at least, would decrease the likelihood of an accident.
 
2012-03-30 10:04:30 AM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Wearing a seat belt helps keep you firmly in your seat, so in theory at least, would decrease the likelihood of an accident.


No way. If I'm in an accident I want to be thrown safely away from the crash site.
 
2012-03-30 10:15:16 AM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Sybarite: And yet you can be stopped an ticketed purely for not wearing a seat belt. Yeah, that makes sense.

Apples and oranges...

There's an argument to me made that by restricting your vision and hearing, wearing a helmet might increase your chances of crashing your bike. (I'm sure this has been studied but I'm too lazy to look).

Wearing a seat belt helps keep you firmly in your seat, so in theory at least, would decrease the likelihood of an accident.



Yes, it has been studied, and thoroughly debunked. The risk of death or serious injury while not wearing helmet, on the other hand, is considerably greater than the risk in not wearing a seat belt.
 
2012-03-30 10:17:00 AM

themeaningoflifeisnot: Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).


but thanks to Congress hospitals and ERs cannot refuse to treat people who cannot pay so they have to treat the idiots for free and those costs get passed along to you when you have to go to the hospital in the form of a $2 aspirin tablet.
 
2012-03-30 10:32:33 AM

NuttierThanEver: themeaningoflifeisnot: Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).

but thanks to Congress hospitals and ERs cannot refuse to treat people who cannot pay so they have to treat the idiots for free and those costs get passed along to you when you have to go to the hospital in the form of a $2 aspirin tablet.


And they get passed along to insurance companies, too. So I'm paying either way. And I'm not advocating that heath insurance carriers should be able to disclaim. Just motorcycle insurance carriers facing No Fault-type claims. Like in New York, where No Fault does not cover bikers. I don't agree that No Fault should not apply to bikers as a general proposition, but where a rider voluntarily refuses to wear head protection, why should No Fault benefits cover his/her head injury?
 
2012-03-30 10:44:05 AM
I'll preface my comments by saying that if I wasn't wearing a helmet when that lunch truck turned left in front of me I'd probably have lost my leg(s). (Considered putting the bike down knowing when the bike it the bottom of the truck I'd be the one leaving parts on the ground but since I had my helmet on I figured I'd skid straight in. I can't turn my neck much but I still have all my knees and toes)

I've ridden for over 30 years, mostly in S Cal traffic and even with a wreck where a helmet came in handy I have no delusions about what a helmet can do for you. In some cases they will save you, in others they'll rip your head off and if you get run over by several axles of an 18 wheeler it is pretty much moot but the newspaper will still feel obliged to report if you had one on.

Eddie Adams from Torrance: There's an argument to me made that by restricting your vision and hearing, wearing a helmet might increase your chances of crashing your bike.


It seems funny that a lot of states require a helmet on a bike but as far as I know they all prohibit wearing a helmet in a car because it limits your vision and hearing.
 
2012-03-30 10:48:16 AM

TwoHead: Eddie Adams from Torrance: There's an argument to me made that by restricting your vision and hearing, wearing a helmet might increase your chances of crashing your bike.

It seems funny that a lot of states require a helmet on a bike but as far as I know they all prohibit wearing a helmet in a car because it limits your vision and hearing.


If you are wearing a helmet in a car, you're either retarded or about to do something retarded.
 
2012-03-30 10:59:42 AM
Punch in the gunt for anyone who says "cagers" unironically.
 
2012-03-30 11:25:07 AM
this is a strategy to increase the Republican voter roles in Michigan.
 
2012-03-30 12:43:49 PM
I'm not sure I've approved of a single thing Rick Snyder has done since he was in office.
 
2012-03-30 12:45:59 PM
No matter how well you drive, chances are that you will eventually be in a wreck. When that dreaded day comes, do you want to be in a car or on a motorcycle?
 
2012-03-30 12:46:41 PM

NuttierThanEver: themeaningoflifeisnot: Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).

but thanks to Congress hospitals and ERs cannot refuse to treat people who cannot pay so they have to treat the idiots for free and those costs get passed along to you when you have to go to the hospital in the form of a $2 aspirin tablet.


According to Scalia the other day, hospitals should just stop treating those without insurance or a means to pay.
 
2012-03-30 12:47:51 PM

themeaningoflifeisnot: Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).


This

There is no helmet law in IL, and the bikers are just fine with that and I doubt that anyone else cares what they do.

The bikers like to put it this way: They would rather die without a helmet in an accident than live the rest of their lives having sustained grevious bodily injuries.

If they feel that way, it's ok with me.
 
Bf+
2012-03-30 12:48:41 PM
Subby: Michigan plans to dramatically increase the number of perfectly usable, but un-donated organs statewide

FIFY-- There is no shortage of available organs, but there is a major shortage of organ donors.
/Debbie Downer, I know.
 
2012-03-30 12:49:05 PM
I've heard helmets killed more lives than they save anyways.
 
2012-03-30 12:49:34 PM

EvilEgg: TwoHead: Eddie Adams from Torrance: There's an argument to me made that by restricting your vision and hearing, wearing a helmet might increase your chances of crashing your bike.

It seems funny that a lot of states require a helmet on a bike but as far as I know they all prohibit wearing a helmet in a car because it limits your vision and hearing.

If you are wearing a helmet in a car, you're either retarded or about to do something retarded.


Or you are really awesome. You cannot wear a helmet in a car and consider yourself in the middle of the scale. You are definitely going to be at one end or the other.
 
2012-03-30 12:49:43 PM
Fewer helmets -> fewer people -> fewer C02 emissions -> cooler Earth
/Global warming solved
//By a Republican no less
 
2012-03-30 12:49:49 PM
People use scary statistics, something like 80% of all motorcycle accidents ending in death or permanent disability occur when the rider is not wearing a helmet, regardless of the type of accident. These aren't made up statistics either; they're legit.

The trick here isn't that it's the helmet saving them.

The sorts of people who voluntarily wear helmets are simply more safety conscious, and end up being safer drivers as a whole, and less prone to be in an accident in the first place. It's self-selective behavior, just like choosing to drive a plastic crotch rocket instead of a cruiser - one places you in higher danger group.

Forcing someone to wear a helmet when they don't want to won't make anyone that much safer, so I don't really see the point.
 
2012-03-30 12:50:54 PM

LarryDan43: NuttierThanEver: themeaningoflifeisnot: Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).

but thanks to Congress hospitals and ERs cannot refuse to treat people who cannot pay so they have to treat the idiots for free and those costs get passed along to you when you have to go to the hospital in the form of a $2 aspirin tablet.

According to Scalia the other day, hospitals should just stop treating those without insurance or a means to pay.


According to Democrats every day we should just ignore the Constitution or law in general when we create new laws.
 
2012-03-30 12:51:19 PM
I've had 4 motorcycles over the years in my younger days. I enjoyed them all and I wore a helmet at all times. Never got in an accident but came close quite a few times. Years later my oldest son got a really nice Harley. I would harp on him about wearing a helmet to no avail. Then the company he worked for shut down and he had to settle for a job that paid less and couldn't afford the notes on the Harley anymore. Wanted me to bail him out.... too bad.. too sad.... he had to sell the bike. No regrets.
 
2012-03-30 12:51:24 PM
cdn2.mamapop.com

Gary Busey says helmets are for the weak.
 
2012-03-30 12:51:33 PM

stpauler: Punch in the gunt for anyone who says "cagers" unironically.


I haven't heard that one. Is it the same thing as "box jockey"?
 
2012-03-30 12:52:22 PM

themeaningoflifeisnot: And they get passed along to insurance companies, too. So I'm paying either way. And I'm not advocating that heath insurance carriers should be able to disclaim. Just motorcycle insurance carriers facing No Fault-type claims. Like in New York, where No Fault does not cover bikers. I don't agree that No Fault should not apply to bikers as a general proposition, but where a rider voluntarily refuses to wear head protection, why should No Fault benefits cover his/her head injury?


That's why I like helmet laws... I don't like the socialized risk. An unhelmeted rider will experience worse injuries in a given wreck (including death, which three of my close friends have dodged with proper PPE) and thus:
1. The accident is worse, the accident scene is worse, the EMS response is larger... and so the traffic jam is far worse. Thousands of people inconvenienced for up to hours because you didn't think it was worth it wearing a helmet.

2. The medical, EMS, and other public and insured costs are higher. We all pay more for that.

3. You're costing every other rider out there more money to keep his or her (who am I kidding) bike insured.

The "wind in your hair" is very costly to the rest of us. It seems like this bill contains provisions to defray that cost with the $20K insurance coverage, but $20K can get eaten up pretty quick in the aftermath of a traffic accident.
 
2012-03-30 12:52:25 PM

TheWhoppah: No matter how well you drive, chances are that you will eventually be in a wreck. When that dreaded day comes, do you want to be in a car or on a motorcycle?


I've been in 6 accidents which totaled my car. Only one, a rollover 25 years ago, was my fault. I'm a safe and cautious driver, but not everybody else is.
 
2012-03-30 12:52:28 PM

RibbyK: Fewer helmets -> fewer people -> fewer C02 emissions -> cooler Earth
/Global warming solved
//By a Republican no less


Imagine that. Freedom brought to the masses by a Republican.
 
2012-03-30 12:52:53 PM

Trackball: LarryDan43: NuttierThanEver: themeaningoflifeisnot: Given how many accidents bike owners in my family have experienced, there's no way I'd ride without a helmet. Factor in all the careless drivers who knock off bikers, it's reckless to be out there without a helmet.

But, as a matter of government regulation, hands off. Leave it to the individual to decide how much risk is acceptable (and let the insurance companies decline coverage for head injuries that occur to bikers who do not wear helmets).

but thanks to Congress hospitals and ERs cannot refuse to treat people who cannot pay so they have to treat the idiots for free and those costs get passed along to you when you have to go to the hospital in the form of a $2 aspirin tablet.

According to Scalia the other day, hospitals should just stop treating those without insurance or a means to pay.

According to Democrats every day we should just ignore the Constitution or law in general when we create new laws.


I wasn't disagreeing. I think they should have healthcare lenders available at hospitals to pre approve loans before providing service.
 
2012-03-30 12:52:54 PM
This is predictable. Since everyone knows why helmets are needed. Those who die from not wearing one can be considered suicides.
 
2012-03-30 12:53:37 PM

quietwalker: People use scary statistics, something like 80% of all motorcycle accidents ending in death or permanent disability occur when the rider is not wearing a helmet, regardless of the type of accident. These aren't made up statistics either; they're legit.
The trick here isn't that it's the helmet saving them.
The sorts of people who voluntarily wear helmets are simply more safety conscious, and end up being safer drivers as a whole, and less prone to be in an accident in the first place. It's self-selective behavior, just like choosing to drive a plastic crotch rocket instead of a cruiser - one places you in higher danger group.
Forcing someone to wear a helmet when they don't want to won't make anyone that much safer, so I don't really see the point.


wwwimage.cbsnews.com
Natasha Richarson, RIP
 
2012-03-30 12:53:55 PM

TwoHead: It seems funny that a lot of states require a helmet on a bike but as far as I know they all prohibit wearing a helmet in a car because it limits your vision and hearing.


EvilEgg: If you are wearing a helmet in a car, you're either retarded or about to do something retarded.


Motor vehicle crashes are a significant cause of head injuries, incl TBI.
 
2012-03-30 12:54:55 PM
It still completely baffles me why people don't wear seatbelts and/or helmets. Seriously, how stupid do you have to be? You should probably remove yourself from the gene pool before you cause anybody else harm.
 
2012-03-30 12:55:10 PM

Notabunny: TheWhoppah: No matter how well you drive, chances are that you will eventually be in a wreck. When that dreaded day comes, do you want to be in a car or on a motorcycle?

I've been in 6 accidents which totaled my car. Only one, a rollover 25 years ago, was my fault. I'm a safe and cautious driver, but not everybody else is.


Perhaps you're just not very good at avoiding or foreseeing an accident.
 
2012-03-30 12:56:09 PM
i149.photobucket.com
You ain't gettin' my friggin' organs!
 
2012-03-30 12:56:28 PM

Trackball: RibbyK: Fewer helmets -> fewer people -> fewer C02 emissions -> cooler Earth
/Global warming solved
//By a Republican no less

Imagine that. Freedom brought to the masses by a Republican.


Except that you're killing off exclusively low-emissions vehicle operators in this plan. Even a Harley gets, what... 40mpg? Which is certainly better than the 3/4 ton pickup the owner usually drives, but still.
 
2012-03-30 12:56:48 PM
Organ donation shoould be opt-out
 
2012-03-30 12:58:02 PM

moothemagiccow: Organ donation shoould be opt-out


But I heard in the bar that the government wants to steal our precious kidneys.
 
2012-03-30 01:00:16 PM

Iniamyen1: It still completely baffles me why people don't wear seatbelts and/or helmets. Seriously, how stupid do you have to be? You should probably remove yourself from the gene pool before you cause anybody else harm.


I've successfully broken several peoples' habits of not wearing seatbelts with that admonition. "You're an engineer, how are you so f*cking stupid? Don't make an excuse... act like your brain is doing something other than keeping your ears from slamming together and put on a seatbelt."

Of course, you do have to have a pretty good, established relationship with someone for that to work.
 
Xoc
2012-03-30 01:00:41 PM
I think it should be required that you donate your organs if you ride without a helmet. That provides society a benefit in exchange for the cost of having to clean your smear from the pavement.
 
2012-03-30 01:00:45 PM

factoryconnection: Trackball: RibbyK: Fewer helmets -> fewer people -> fewer C02 emissions -> cooler Earth
/Global warming solved
//By a Republican no less
Imagine that. Freedom brought to the masses by a Republican.
Except that you're killing off exclusively low-emissions vehicle operators in this plan. Even a Harley gets, what... 40mpg? Which is certainly better than the 3/4 ton pickup the owner usually drives, but still.


Oh, I see, you're talking about fewer vehicle emisions. True enough, but I was talking about the other greenhouse gasses generated by people: burps and farts.
 
2012-03-30 01:01:27 PM
I always wear a helmet. I can't imagine what a june bug to the forehead at 60mph feels like. I know what it sounds like when it hits my helmet; FRIKEN LOUD!!!

Plus the wind noise a lot quieter at interstate speed with a helmet on. I've ridden around NH during bike week without a helmet, it made my hair hurt. I'm glad I had my helmet with me, I put it back on after a little while.

If it was put to me in the form of a vote. I'd vote for choice; but I'd still wear the helmet,
 
2012-03-30 01:01:50 PM
Subby hit it: if you ride without a helmet, you are automatically in the organ donor program.

On the other hand, both of the people I know that were in major motorcycling accidents were wearing helmets and it didn't make any difference. They died.

I've always worn a helmet while riding and have been wearing seatbelts in vehicles since 1962. Walked away from three major crashes (wasn't driving) because of them. I do have a problem with airbags. They don't do anything that a belt can't and cost 100 times as much.
 
2012-03-30 01:02:00 PM
In Michigan we have a cap-free, lifetime-payable catastrophic injury fund to pay for for medical coverage for victims of auto accidents that kicks in after medical costs exceed $500k. It is paid for by a (2012 valued) $175 fee per vehicle per year. Right now there is debate about how long the system can last given current payouts and how viable it is to have $175 (and growing) per vehicle per year added to everyone's insurance premiums.

I can't tell if this bill will help the fund by having helmet-less motorcyclists getting killed more often or bankrupt the system by having more severe injuries in minor accidents.
 
2012-03-30 01:02:19 PM

factoryconnection: Iniamyen1: It still completely baffles me why people don't wear seatbelts and/or helmets. Seriously, how stupid do you have to be? You should probably remove yourself from the gene pool before you cause anybody else harm.

I've successfully broken several peoples' habits of not wearing seatbelts with that admonition. "You're an engineer, how are you so f*cking stupid? Don't make an excuse... act like your brain is doing something other than keeping your ears from slamming together and put on a seatbelt."

Of course, you do have to have a pretty good, established relationship with someone for that to work.


I wrote (and deleted) a comment about my very smart husband that... Yeah. What you said.

Doesn't work for me, though. He's too smart to... give in to my nagging? *shrug* Beats me. I've given up on it. Nagging never works. He's got $100k life insurance and if he's stupid enough to fly through the window, I WILL kick his stupid stupid corpse.

/Yes it really bugs me
 
2012-03-30 01:03:12 PM
Ahhhhhh yes..... "Doner-Cycles."

*Lights another cigarette* Cool! I'll need new lungs in a few years!
 
2012-03-30 01:04:30 PM

Notabunny: I've been in 6 accidents which totaled my car. Only one, a rollover 25 years ago, was my fault. I'm a safe and cautious driver, but not everybody else is.


I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the data seems to contradict your statement.
 
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