Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Some Guy)   6/2(1+2) = 9 no no, 6/2(1+2) = 1 no no, 6/2(1+2) = 2   (mathmagical.co.uk) divider line 821
    More: Fail  
•       •       •

30217 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Mar 2012 at 9:56 AM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



821 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | » | Last | Show all
 
2012-03-30 11:03:34 AM  

NetOwl: DarwiOdrade: mamoru: SoothinglyDeranged: Meet Us at the Stick: Confabulat: I don't know what's going on here but it frightens and confuses me.

PEMDAS, my friend

I was taught it as BEDMAS, but yeah, same basic principle.

I say Parentheses, You say Brackets, let's call the whole thing off! ;)

Anyway, it is clearly written from a "learn the order of operations so you don't screw up when using a calculator" standpoint, but it is terribly written from a mathematically aesthetic standpoint. Unless I were testing my kids on P/BEMDAS, I would write it differently in order to specifically prevent confusion. Probably something like (6/2)(1+2) or 6(1+2)/2 or something like that.

/teach 7th grade math in Thailand

Considering younger Americans (including middle-schoolers, high-schoolers and, unfortunately, college students) can't add 6+8 without their calculators, it's incumbent on teachers to make sure they can at least use them correctly.

It's our job to give them failing grades until they learn what the rest of us learned in elementary school. Don't enable them. Don't encourage ignorance.

Calculators are for chemistry class. They are NEVER needed in legitimate math courses, and they should never be allowed.


No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.
 
2012-03-30 11:04:22 AM  
I was told there would be no backward people of poland.

/I never could learn the rules for that
 
2012-03-30 11:04:37 AM  

Grables'Daughter: You know why girls can't do math?


Because "fark it, I'll be a stripper?"

Or was that about reading?
 
2012-03-30 11:04:50 AM  
My Radio Shack EC-4021 (new window) Scientific programmable calculator provided a result of 9.

/for the record :p
 
2012-03-30 11:05:02 AM  

cyanide64: No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.


When I was in school, we learned to do trig using tables, and we liked it!
 
2012-03-30 11:05:06 AM  

GORDON: 6/2(1+2)
6 / (2+4)
6 / 6
1

The original equation was written lazily.

This is why there is an entire webpage devoted to it.

If the majority of Farkers say the answer is OBVIOUSLY 9, that should make a LOT of people look at it again and wonder why they are agreeing with the majority of Farkers, because that usually isn't the path of wisdom.

All I'm saying.


Unfortunately, you are also guilty of violating the order of operations, you need to multiply and divide left to right, you can distribute, but only after doing the first division.

6/2(1+2)
3(1+2)
3+6
9

Division is not commutative you cannot distribute the divisor, unlike multiplication where you could have distributed either term.

Not sure if trolling, or just ignorant.
 
2012-03-30 11:05:46 AM  

Junzi Nicuzn: How to write the equation if you want the answer to be 1:

6/(2(1+2))


Came here to say this.

/got the wrong answer initially - guess i'm not as cool as the awesomeness that is filling this thread.
 
2012-03-30 11:06:11 AM  

cyanide64: No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.


There are sine, cosine and tangent charts in the inside covers of math textbooks.

Or, at least, there were when I went to school. Maybe I'm an old fart now.
 
2012-03-30 11:06:32 AM  
I don't even know why we're getting into what answer's the right one - it's a stupid example deliberately designed to be interpreted in a number of ways. The correct answer is

Re-write the farking expression so it's unambiguous

/ And 1
// Multiplication binds more tightly than division.
 
2012-03-30 11:06:33 AM  
IT'S F*CKING 3RD-GRADE MATH
 
2012-03-30 11:06:33 AM  
This is the first Fark thread that made me want to commit murder.
 
2012-03-30 11:06:40 AM  

Someguyonfark: Not sure if trolling, or just ignorant.


I'm going with ignorant, and adamantly ignorant at that.
 
2012-03-30 11:07:04 AM  

MLWS: Using an implied multiplication with a number adjacent to a left bracket is sloppy and annoys me (engineer).

///Always write out the implied function.


This. Be as explicit as possible or you might not get the result you want
 
2012-03-30 11:07:15 AM  

Someguyonfark: Not sure if trolling, or just ignorant.


I'm starting to think trolling, since he's ranting against the collective knowledge of Fark.

If everybody on Fark says that water is wet, he's going to start ranting about how dry water is.
 
2012-03-30 11:07:40 AM  

cyanide64: NetOwl: DarwiOdrade: mamoru: SoothinglyDeranged: Meet Us at the Stick: Confabulat: I don't know what's going on here but it frightens and confuses me.

PEMDAS, my friend

I was taught it as BEDMAS, but yeah, same basic principle.

I say Parentheses, You say Brackets, let's call the whole thing off! ;)

Anyway, it is clearly written from a "learn the order of operations so you don't screw up when using a calculator" standpoint, but it is terribly written from a mathematically aesthetic standpoint. Unless I were testing my kids on P/BEMDAS, I would write it differently in order to specifically prevent confusion. Probably something like (6/2)(1+2) or 6(1+2)/2 or something like that.

/teach 7th grade math in Thailand

Considering younger Americans (including middle-schoolers, high-schoolers and, unfortunately, college students) can't add 6+8 without their calculators, it's incumbent on teachers to make sure they can at least use them correctly.

It's our job to give them failing grades until they learn what the rest of us learned in elementary school. Don't enable them. Don't encourage ignorance.

Calculators are for chemistry class. They are NEVER needed in legitimate math courses, and they should never be allowed.

No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.


TI-89 was necessary in my high school math courses so I could play space invaders, mario and tetris to avoid shooting myself out of boredom.
 
2012-03-30 11:07:59 AM  

BurnShrike: res ipsa dixit: Why does it matter whether you do multiplication/division left to right or right to left?

This thread shows exactly why it matters.


No, as long as you do the parentheses first, it doesn't matter whether you multiply and then divide or divide and then multiply. It's called the commutative property.
 
2012-03-30 11:08:48 AM  
If this weren't Fark, I'd say I can't believe that people are actually arguing about this.

This proves that education in this country SUCKS.
 
2012-03-30 11:08:51 AM  

Hollie Maea: NetOwl: Calculators are for chemistry class. They are NEVER needed in legitimate math courses, and they should never be allowed.

You haven't gone very deep into math, have you?


Yeah I was wondering that too. I just finished multivariable calculus and used a Casio similar to the one in the article. I use it to do simple math I'm too impatient to do in the column [31*17, shiat like this]. I never used it to get the answer for any of the problems, but I used it to check to make sure my answer made sense. Of course I could do that arithmetic myself, but why? It's not the point of the class and it distracts from the "flow" of the rest of the problem.
 
2012-03-30 11:08:52 AM  

res ipsa dixit: It's called the commutative property.


Oops, I meant associative property.
 
2012-03-30 11:09:25 AM  

An Account To Make Comments: On my iphone, if you punch it in without the implied '*', then hit =, the result shown is '2'. Am not sure wtf is going on with this.


Seems the iPhone calculator doesn't support implied multiplication notation, and Apple was too lazy to make it report syntax errors, so it just ignores it.

Or does this notation work in other expressions?
 
2012-03-30 11:09:27 AM  

res ipsa dixit: BurnShrike: res ipsa dixit: Why does it matter whether you do multiplication/division left to right or right to left?

This thread shows exactly why it matters.

No, as long as you do the parentheses first, it doesn't matter whether you multiply and then divide or divide and then multiply. It's called the commutative property.


1) Division is not commutative
2) You're talking about the associative property
3) Division is also not associative
4) There is no associative property for mixed operations
 
2012-03-30 11:09:39 AM  

Subliterati: I don't even know why we're getting into what answer's the right one - it's a stupid example deliberately designed to be interpreted in a number of ways. The correct answer is

Re-write the farking expression so it's unambiguous

/ And 1
// Multiplication binds more tightly than division.


Exactly. Since I'm a big fan of the associative property, I prefer to bracket the 6/2. (6/2)(1+2) is completely unambiguous. :)
 
2012-03-30 11:09:43 AM  
i1034.photobucket.com
 
TWX
2012-03-30 11:10:03 AM  

DarwiOdrade: TWX: The point of Calculus is to learn how to apply the discipline of calculus, not to recalculate the area under a complex curve at thirty points in order to get close to the real answer.

Actually it's both. You have obviously never taught calculus.


Okay, I'll bite. What's the benefit, assuming that the student understands the process and how to apply it, of setting up the problem and then manually performing the calculation to get a less accurate answer, where the student comes to despise the process, as opposed to the student understanding the process, understanding how to do the process manually, but now substituting a tool to allow the student to come up with more accurate answers instantly after correctly setting up the problem?

When I took Calc in high school, we did learn how to manually calculate answers, but once we learned this, we stopped manually calculating answers and instead learned how to program machines to give us the answers based on what we needed. As a consequence, the bulk of students were ready to apply their math to the engineering tools of the day, like spreadsheets, various computer languages, and handheld calculators, where they might need to take the paper version of the equation and turn it into machine-understandable input, as opposed to doing everything by hand for ever and ever.
 
2012-03-30 11:10:38 AM  
More fuel for the fire. This is from a TI-85 emulator that I personally tested.
i.imgur.com
 
Bf+
2012-03-30 11:11:09 AM  
The correct answer is always:
rlv.zcache.com
 
2012-03-30 11:13:39 AM  

TWX: Okay, I'll bite. What's the benefit, assuming that the student understands the process and how to apply it, of setting up the problem and then manually performing the calculation to get a less accurate answer, where the student comes to despise the process, as opposed to the student understanding the process, understanding how to do the process manually, but now substituting a tool to allow the student to come up with more accurate answers instantly after correctly setting up the problem?


There are cases when you cannot come up with an exact answer. To wit: Integrate to find the area between the curve y=sin(x^2) and the x-axis for x between 0 and 1.

Answer: you can't, because there is no elementary antiderivative of sin(x^2). The only way to solve this is by approximating the area. This can be done to any degree of accuracy you wish, but there is no expression for the answer.
 
2012-03-30 11:14:30 AM  
Wolfram Alpha Link (new window)
Google Link (new window)
 
2012-03-30 11:14:48 AM  

John Dewey: Even if you were right subby, that would still leave 1 for the chandelier, one for the singing telegram girl and 7 for the people who didn't get your reference


I buttle, sir.
 
2012-03-30 11:14:51 AM  

SweetSaws: Could someone explain how that could possibly = 2?


I reverse engineered it as I was curious...

The iPhone evaluates the stuff in the parenthesis first... so...
6/2(1+2) becomes 6/2(3). If you do 6/2(3) you still come up with 2... moving on...

If you enter 2(3) and hit enter, it returns 3. 6/3 obviously equals 2.

So, it's very obviously horribly programmed, but I would venture to guess the programmer didn't account for his interpreter having to decipher 2(3) and instead expected it to have 2*(3) which comes out okay.

On the iPhone to get a correct answer, you would need to put in 6/2*(1+2) which comes up with 9 as expected by most of the people in this thread.
 
2012-03-30 11:15:10 AM  

DarwiOdrade: cyanide64: No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.

When I was in school, we learned to do trig using tables, and we liked it!


True, but you had to do like 4 questions, not 40.

/just jealous I wasn't taught to use the charts
//necessary for desert island, zombie apocalypse, etc
///long slashies
 
2012-03-30 11:15:13 AM  

Harry Freakstorm: According to my calculator, the answer is Lo Bat


Milhouse is not a meme.
 
2012-03-30 11:15:30 AM  
[ ] brackets
( ) parentheses
 
2012-03-30 11:15:37 AM  

jaxdahl: More fuel for the fire. This is from a TI-85 emulator that I personally tested.


The TI-85 is a piece of shiat. The real programmers, who all went to work on the 89/92 engine, got it right.
 
2012-03-30 11:16:49 AM  

DarwiOdrade: GORDON: DarwiOdrade: GORDON: That isn't how it works. The 2(1+2) is its own entity in the equation. The 6/ doesn't enter into simplifying the parens.

Again, I don't think there is a right or wrong answer, the way the original problem was written. This is why actual mathematicians are divided. It is the Farkers being idiots about it saying "It couldn't be more cle4r!!" that I find annoying.

Stupid, fat farkers.

That's exactly how it works, there is exactly one right answer, nobody is divided over this, and you don't know what you're talking about.

No matter how many times you say it, it won't make it true. TFA actually states there is a divide, it is only you and your ilk in this silly. anonymous that say there isn't.

But you're really smart, so.........

TFA is wrong. I am a mathematician. Nobody is in disagreement over this.


I've seen it all today. A math troll (GORDON) and a medieval warfare/archery troll elsewhere on FARK.

I can die happy now.
 
2012-03-30 11:17:27 AM  

TWX: When I took Calc in high school, we did learn how to manually calculate answers, but once we learned this, we stopped manually calculating answers and instead learned how to program machines to give us the answers based on what we needed. As a consequence, the bulk of students were ready to apply their math to the engineering tools of the day, like spreadsheets, various computer languages, and handheld calculators, where they might need to take the paper version of the equation and turn it into machine-understandable input, as opposed to doing everything by hand for ever and ever.


The problem with using computers to calculate the answers is that the computers are, by the way they're programmed, incapable of symbolic computation. Computers calculate by using reducing the operations to approximations of the original problem to give you an answer that is "good enough" rather than correct answer. Because of the way calculators are programmed, you also have to contend with error introduced by, say, the representation of a number within a machine - i.e. the errors introduced when you take a decimal number and convert it into a number format like a float or something.
 
2012-03-30 11:18:29 AM  

cyanide64: DarwiOdrade: cyanide64: No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.

When I was in school, we learned to do trig using tables, and we liked it!

True, but you had to do like 4 questions, not 40.

/just jealous I wasn't taught to use the charts
//necessary for desert island, zombie apocalypse, etc
///long slashies


Actually it was more like 40 - my high-school trig teacher was a biatch. :)
 
2012-03-30 11:18:58 AM  

Someguyonfark: GORDON: 6/2(1+2)
6 / (2+4)
6 / 6
1

The original equation was written lazily.

This is why there is an entire webpage devoted to it.

If the majority of Farkers say the answer is OBVIOUSLY 9, that should make a LOT of people look at it again and wonder why they are agreeing with the majority of Farkers, because that usually isn't the path of wisdom.

All I'm saying.

Unfortunately, you are also guilty of violating the order of operations, you need to multiply and divide left to right, you can distribute, but only after doing the first division.

6/2(1+2)
3(1+2)
3+6
9

Division is not commutative you cannot distribute the divisor, unlike multiplication where you could have distributed either term.

Not sure if trolling, or just ignorant.


Multiplication is commutative. He distributed 3 across (1+2) which is A-OK.
 
2012-03-30 11:20:08 AM  

Meet Us at the Stick: optikeye: a poorly presented equation is open to interpretations.

As it's written in the headline it's not poorly presented at all

6/2(1+2)

Order of Operation says perform the operation in parentheses first

6/2(3)

Now since the only operations left are division and multiplication, perform those from left to right

6/2 = 3

So we are left with

3(3) = 9

It couldn't be more clear.


bears repeating

/goddamned schools here teach arithmatic with calculators now
 
2012-03-30 11:21:00 AM  

schivvers: dittybopper: Walker: farkingismybusiness: I was told there would be no math.

THIS! I hate math!

/maths for those in the UK, Australia, etc.

Poor you. The Universe, and everything in it, is math. Even yourself. All of your actions, thoughts, emotions, everything you see, hear, touch, taste, and experience is math. Everything that you are and do is, at some basic and fundamental level, governed my mathematical principles.

All of it.

Dear sir, I regret that you are wrong. Math is a description of the physical world. It is a system that the human mind has invented to describe and predict what is happening in the real world. This is something that math folks and scientists sometimes have a hard time seeing eye to eye on. Math is a tool. A good tool! But nothing more than that. (I love people who build good tools by the way...) This is the reason that the sums always work out in math. We laid the rules down so that they would. In the beginning of math, the rules were laid down as assumptions. Now these are subtle...but it makes a difference. We said, and usually agreed, that 1/0 is null. That 2 points describe a line, that 3 points describe a plane. What if we change any one of those? We get a whole new set of answers to the same problems! and some these "wrong" answers in the old system are actually more right in the real world. (look up non-euclidian geometry and gps/stellar cartography etc) The statement that math GOVERNS the universe is false. Math DESCRIBES the universe. The reason this is such a big deal is that as a scientist I must accept when my data does not fit our model. The math is wrong...not cause I screwed it up, but because the whole model is broken. That happens. I'm not mad, but telling people that the mathematically correct answer is always the "right" answer leads to a rabbit hole where we get a lot of thing WRONG in reality.

Compare the predicted folding of a polymer or protein to it's actual folding. All the math is r ...


I would actually say that you are looking at it from the wrong direction: Objectively, mathematics exists outside of human experience. You are mistaking the tools we use to measure and define something for the thing itself. A sketch of an elephant isn't actually an elephant, just the representation of one.

For example: Hydrogen atoms vibrate at a certain frequency. We measure that frequency against our arbitrary measurements of time, but it doesn't matter what units we chose, those atoms are going to vibrate the same whether we measure it in cycles per second, or Elbonian flops per minootka.

If a theoretical model that you've built doesn't precisely describe some phenomenon you've observed, that's a problem with the model. In other words, you built the tool wrong, or the wrong tool. Now, that can be a valuable thing in and of itself, as it allows us to improve the tools we use, but it in no way implies that the Universe is separable from mathematics, as mathematics is built into the very fabric of the Universe. If that weren't true, we couldn't exist, as there wouldn't be any predictable processes that could lead to the formation of stars and planets, much less intelligent life.
 
2012-03-30 11:21:38 AM  

dittybopper: /Let's see if your droid is still working 40+ years after it was manufactured.


Somewhere around here I have a 30 year old TI calculator. I had to change the batteries a few years back, they were the original union carbide made dots. It's solid state, no reason it shouldn't last 500 years.
 
2012-03-30 11:22:35 AM  

Voiceofreason01: Meet Us at the Stick: optikeye: a poorly presented equation is open to interpretations.

As it's written in the headline it's not poorly presented at all

6/2(1+2)

Order of Operation says perform the operation in parentheses first

6/2(3)

Now since the only operations left are division and multiplication, perform those from left to right

6/2 = 3

So we are left with

3(3) = 9

It couldn't be more clear.

bears repeating

/goddamned schools here teach arithmatic with calculators now


TFA and this thread indicate you still need to know arithmetic to use a calculator.
 
2012-03-30 11:23:00 AM  

GORDON: For the stupid idiots who can't RTFA,

"Yet when I asked some A-level mathematics pupils which was correct,
they quickly polarised into two equal groups,
each arguing passionately for one of the two suggested answers."

I have more respect for the thoughts of "A-level mathematics pupils" than I do for the average Farker. Just my perception. Anyone who think there is any good amount of collective wisdom on Fark... well good for you. :-) I shall continue being sort of glad that I go against what Farkers, as a group, consider to be "conventional wisdom."

It is obvious why there is a divergence on this issue for those with even the tiniest scrap of knowledge about why math works. Everyone who says, "It could not be more clear!" is, to put it nicely, mistaken.



You are an idiot, and wrong. You say farkers are unable to do basic math, and yet you are a farker. So should I believe the basic math rules that everyone should know, or some ignorant ass who can't possibly be wrong?
 
2012-03-30 11:24:24 AM  
(Sometimes you can't hear me because I'm in parentheses.)

1
 
2012-03-30 11:26:11 AM  
If order of operations is left to right (after brackets and exponets), how are equations written in those cultures whose writings go right to left?
 
2012-03-30 11:27:03 AM  

dittybopper: Hydrogen atoms vibrate at a certain frequency.


Maybe, maybe not. ;)

/I assume they do
//Not 100% sure though
 
2012-03-30 11:27:09 AM  

Hollie Maea: NetOwl: Calculators are for chemistry class. They are NEVER needed in legitimate math courses, and they should never be allowed.

You haven't gone very deep into math, have you?


I have, and NetOwl is right. In every mathematics course I've taken from college to the PhD level, there has never been a need for a calculator, and I don't allow any calculating devices on any of my exams---not because people could cheat, but because the only thing a calculator can do for the students is take them up the wrong tree.

NateAsbestos: Of course I could do that arithmetic myself, but why? It's not the point of the class and it distracts from the "flow" of the rest of the problem.


Of course you could learn to spell words without help, but why? It's not the point of a British literature class and distracts from the "flow" of the essay questions.

It may seem irrelevant and pointless to learn to do these things reliably with your own brain, but you need to exercise your brain in that way or it will become mush. Today it's 31*17. Next year it's 1/20.

I'm not making that up, either. One of my collegues gave a quiz to a class of college sophomores, and one of them asked him if he could use a calculator. The quiz only had questions like "compute the period of a 20Hz signal." So he said no, calculators, and he watched this kid write "1/20" on the paper and stare at it for half an hour, occasionally writing stuff like "x=20, y=1/x" and staring at it more.

Arithmetic develops the skill of in-head manipulation, which is necessary for manipulating more abstract things, rapidly.
 
2012-03-30 11:27:31 AM  

Harry Freakstorm: Is this like "What's the square root of 69?"


Eight...something?
 
2012-03-30 11:27:35 AM  

cyanide64: No calculators? I'd like to see you plow through a stack of papers full of SIN, COS, and TAN in an hour. Don't forget to show ALL your work.


Sure. I'll use one of my slide rules. How many decimal places are you interested in? That determines whether I'm going to use my 6" Pickett N200 Pocket Trig, the 10" Sterling Precision, or the circular slide rule I made from this website.
 
2012-03-30 11:28:05 AM  

vudukungfu: I got 42.


How many roads must a man walk down? It doesn't work...no pazzaz, you see.

/love the H2G2
//RIP Dougie
///Virgules FTW
 
Displayed 50 of 821 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
Advertisement
On Twitter






In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report