Headso: With 7 billion people on the planet and many living in terrible conditions there would be more than just jobs that would bring people here.

You do know that plane tickets cost money, right?

clambam: "Loudermilk said that those were unintended consequences, and that an amendment was likely that would remedy them."

Um, what were the intended consequences? Simply to drive illegal aliens out of the state? The thing is, I think this will work. Fields will go unplanted, crops unharvested, the cost of filling low skill jobs will rise and the quality of work fall, and you know whose fault it will be?

N0LABAMBA'S!

Naw man, they'll just incarcerate the illegal aliens and then shop them out from the prisons on work release. Right back to the field with you, Jose. Except now you can't send any of your money home, and you get paid even less than you were before.

Prison makes money from the contract. Farms make money from the cheap labor. Nobody can quit. Nobody can unionize. Nobody can complain, after all they are just paying back their debt to society.

/moneymoneymoneymoney
//moooon-ey

sprawl15: Headso: With 7 billion people on the planet and many living in terrible conditions there would be more than just jobs that would bring people here.

You do know that plane tickets cost money, right?

If America was going to start letting anyone come in I'd be the first to invest in a business that brings people here on cargo ships or some other kind of super cheap transportation. Just bring them in 20,000 at a time.

Reading comprehension is hard for Farkers.

FTFA

"That would effectively bar illegal immigrants from accessing water service or marriage licenses.

Loudermilk said that those were unintended consequences, and that an amendment was likely that would remedy them."

Headso:

If America was going to start letting anyone come in I'd be the first to invest in a business that brings people here on cargo ships or some other kind of super cheap transportation. Just bring them in 20,000 at a time.



I'm sure you would.

And before you even get to the article subby lies to you in the headline. Yeah there's nothing like staking out the moral high ground to add weight to your argument.

Headso: sprawl15: Headso: With 7 billion people on the planet and many living in terrible conditions there would be more than just jobs that would bring people here.

You do know that plane tickets cost money, right?

If America was going to start letting anyone come in I'd be the first to invest in a business that brings people here on cargo ships or some other kind of super cheap transportation. Just bring them in 20,000 at a time.

Well, that's the dumbest thing I've read so far today.

PonceAlyosha: You have got to be kidding me. Do these morons want outbreaks of pestilence?

"Let's spread democracy all over the world and put up military bases everywhere" - Conquest
"They definitely have WMDs, we need to invade, like right now... to protect ourselves... or something" - War
"What legislation can we pass that will stop illegal immigrants from being here to work our farms?" - Famine
"Healthcare for the poor is teh soshulizm. If you can't afford it, then you should have worked harder." - Death

It's almost as if these fundies are trying to bring forth something... apocalyptic.

Bob16: And before you even get to the article subby lies to you in the headline. Yeah there's nothing like staking out the moral high ground to add weight to your argument.

ATLANTA (AP) - A bill before the Georgia Legislature could prevent illegal immigrants from being able to get a marriage license or access to water and sewage services in the state.

First paragraph, first sentence. Reading comprehension, how does it work? With you obviously not.

sprawl15: Headso: sprawl15: Headso: With 7 billion people on the planet and many living in terrible conditions there would be more than just jobs that would bring people here.

You do know that plane tickets cost money, right?

If America was going to start letting anyone come in I'd be the first to invest in a business that brings people here on cargo ships or some other kind of super cheap transportation. Just bring them in 20,000 at a time.

Well, that's the dumbest thing I've read so far today.

Yeah, but the day's still young so you have that going for you.

Bigdogdaddy: Yeah, but the day's still young so you have that going for you.

Yeah, but I'm already reading the Dawkins thread in the Geek tab. It's a pretty high bar that's been set, our only hope is another Zimmerman thread.

sprawl15: Headso: sprawl15: Headso: With 7 billion people on the planet and many living in terrible conditions there would be more than just jobs that would bring people here.

You do know that plane tickets cost money, right?

If America was going to start letting anyone come in I'd be the first to invest in a business that brings people here on cargo ships or some other kind of super cheap transportation. Just bring them in 20,000 at a time.

Well, that's the dumbest thing I've read so far today.

First you say hey let's let anyone come to the most prosperous nation on the planet and your argument that people wouldn't come here for a better life if is that plane tickets cost too much. But the idea that an industry for cheap 1 way travel would sprout up in such a world is the dumbest thing you've read? I can only assume you don't read your own posts.

sounds like a shiatty deal to me.

Bigdogdaddy: I have a hard time feeling sorry for them if they came across illegally. However, they come because they are hungry so again I don't blame them.

So, is this a poop thread now?

[www.tshirtgalleries.com image 500x375]


except our Benevolent One, rick santorum.

Headso: But the idea that an industry for cheap 1 way travel would sprout up in such a world is the dumbest thing you've read?

The idea that buying cargo ships and overhauling them to meet national/international standards for people transport, including the services required to provide food, the language capabilities of the staff, etc., would be a 'cheap' solution able to bring people over for tiny fractions of a plane ticket is indeed exceptionally stupid.

It's very, very stupid. The only way it makes any sense whatsoever is if you honestly think that allowing businesses to hire any foreign national as long as they have the same protections as citizens means slave boats are now legal and it will only cost 30 cents to cross the Pacific.

Bob16: And before you even get to the article subby lies to you in the headline. Yeah there's nothing like staking out the moral high ground to add weight to your argument.

Umm, no subby did not lie. Since you didn't feel like clicking the link before trying to deflect the conversation, here you go:

ATLANTA (AP) - A bill before the Georgia Legislature could prevent illegal immigrants from being able to get a marriage license or access to water and sewage services in the state.

The bill sponsored by Sen. Barry Loudermilk, a Cassville Republican, has gotten a lot of attention because it would also bar illegal immigrants from the state's public colleges, universities and technical schools.

But another provision removes foreign passports from a list of identification documents that government agencies can accept for certain transactions. The passports would have to be accompanied by federal immigration documentation proving someone is in the country legally.

That would effectively bar illegal immigrants from accessing water service or marriage licenses.

Loudermilk said that those were unintended consequences, and that an amendment was likely that would remedy them.

Georgia needs to talk to Alabama. Alabama lost a few billion from their economy when they cracked down on illegals. So much for them being a drain on the economy, eh?

Bigdogdaddy: First paragraph, first sentence. Reading comprehension, how does it work? With you obviously not.

Read the whole article. The last line in particular.

And I particularly love this part: "Loudermilk said that those were unintended consequences, and that an amendment was likely that would remedy them.

Yeah, identify the unintended consequences, then remedy them with another simple solution that will in no way have other unintended consequences, which you'll need to remedy, etc.

sprawl15: born_yesterday: Or, you know, we could just pass laws that heavily fine corporations for hiring illegals, and even more so for knowingly hiring them, placing the burden on those benefiting from the cheap labor and removing the incentive to come to this country illegally.

Or we could go with the free market solution: open up the borders and not care about citizenship when filling positions. Eliminating their 'illegal' status would take away a lot of the exploitative nature of the work they're willing to fill, and employers would be forced to choose based on the quality of the worker instead of how little they're willing to take under the table.

Funny how cons never seem to take the approach most suggested by their philosophy, huh? As a Texas lib, I'm entirely for this. An open border with Mexico, where the main focus would be stopping smuggling and criminals instead of people looking for work, would do nothing but improve the situation.

ManRay: Bigdogdaddy: First paragraph, first sentence. Reading comprehension, how does it work? With you obviously not.

Read the whole article. The last line in particular.

I did read the entire article. Isn't it funny how when they get hammered for their decision it's always there are "unintended consequences"?

Heron: sprawl15: born_yesterday: Or, you know, we could just pass laws that heavily fine corporations for hiring illegals, and even more so for knowingly hiring them, placing the burden on those benefiting from the cheap labor and removing the incentive to come to this country illegally.

Or we could go with the free market solution: open up the borders and not care about citizenship when filling positions. Eliminating their 'illegal' status would take away a lot of the exploitative nature of the work they're willing to fill, and employers would be forced to choose based on the quality of the worker instead of how little they're willing to take under the table.

Funny how cons never seem to take the approach most suggested by their philosophy, huh? As a Texas lib, I'm entirely for this. An open border with Mexico, where the main focus would be stopping smuggling and criminals instead of people looking for work, would do nothing but improve the situation.

They want the border to be transparent to the operations of corporations, but not individuals

sprawl15: The idea that buying cargo ships and overhauling them to meet national/international standards for people transport, including the services required to provide food, the language capabilities of the staff, etc., would be a 'cheap' solution able to bring people over for tiny fractions of a plane ticket is indeed exceptionally stupid.

There's millions of people living in terrible conditions less than 3 days journey by ship. It's crazy to think that cheap travel solutions would not fill that void and people would just throw up their hands and say oh plane tickets are too much, I guess I'll just keep drink feces water.

Headso: sprawl15: The idea that buying cargo ships and overhauling them to meet national/international standards for people transport, including the services required to provide food, the language capabilities of the staff, etc., would be a 'cheap' solution able to bring people over for tiny fractions of a plane ticket is indeed exceptionally stupid.

There's millions of people living in terrible conditions less than 3 days journey by ship. It's crazy to think that cheap travel solutions would not fill that void and people would just throw up their hands and say oh plane tickets are too much, I guess I'll just keep drink feces water.

Well, why aren't those people all flooding into the country now? Do you think the threat of possibly being sent back is enough to keep them drinking feces water?

Headso: There's millions of people living in terrible conditions less than 3 days journey by ship.

You do know that ship travel costs money, right?

Headso: It's crazy to think that cheap travel solutions would not fill that void

"Cheap" by our standards is very different than "cheap" to someone eating dirt in Sri Lanka.

Wait, Georgia got indoor plumbing? Damn, next thing you know, they might end slavery...

Just fine the job creators insane amounts for hiring them. Problem solved. They wouldnt be here without those jobs.

WTF? I don't pay for city sewer services so that my neighbors have a convenient place to poop. I pay for city sewer services so that my neighbor's poop doesn't contaminate the water supply and kill me.

Maybe cholera is just a liberal conspiracy in Georgia.

Bigdogdaddy: I did read the entire article. Isn't it funny how when they get hammered for their decision it's always there are "unintended consequences"?

Not really. It happens all the time.

The law was intended to restrict the types of ID that a person can use to access government services ie a foreign ID. That is very broad in its reach, so an amendment would be passed to exempt some services. Is there really an epidemic of illegal aliens trying to get married to each other in Georgia? I seriously doubt anyone was thinking of marriage licenses and sewer hookups when trying to limit acceptable IDs for drivers licenses and colleges.

Isn't this the same state that pretty much farked itself when it cracked down on illegals working on farmland? Nice to see they've doubled down.

SN1987a goes boom: Isn't this the same state that pretty much farked itself when it cracked down on illegals working on farmland? Nice to see they've doubled down.

That is such bs. The "job creators" didnt have near slave labor and refused to even pay min wage. It was much closer to Grapes of wrath than anything, letting their crops burn was preferable to actually hiring legit.

Keep pushin it GOP...keep pushin it...

/over the borderline...

ManRay: The law was intended to restrict the types of ID that a person can use to access government services ie a foreign ID. That is very broad in its reach, so an amendment would be passed to exempt some services. Is there really an epidemic of illegal aliens trying to get married to each other in Georgia? I seriously doubt anyone was thinking of marriage licenses and sewer hookups when trying to limit acceptable IDs for drivers licenses and colleges.

Why on earth would anyone want to limit who could go to school or get a drivers license?

We don't give out drivers license because people like to have little wallet-sized cards with bad pictures on them. We give out drivers license because if everyone has a license, society works better. Drivers licenses make it efficient to enforce the traffic laws. It makes absolutely no difference to me if someone is legal or illegal; I want them to have a damned drivers license, because society works better when they have a license.

The same thing is true of school. I pay a hell of a lot of money int taxes to educate other people's kids because society works better when kids are educated. I don't care if the kids are legal or illegal. Uneducated kids make society worse, and educated kids make society better.

I have no idea why any moron would intentionally try to make society worse, but it seems that if I want to find out I should ask a Georgia Republican.

I was an exchange student in Mexico for a semester and I can tell you first-hand; there are many Mexicans (not all by any count) who have no issue with dropping a load on the ground. I am sure this will do wonders for the e coli count in the Georgia farm products.

I'm sure the neighbors will be so happy about their declining home values.

Philip Francis Queeg: Well, why aren't those people all flooding into the country now? Do you think the threat of possibly being sent back is enough to keep them drinking feces water?

Because now you have to pay thousands of dollars to a smuggler to get you here and then yeah you could be sent right back or the coyote could just kill you and take your money, yet still people manage to do it. Make it 200 bucks and legal and you would have a huge numbers coming here for a better life.

Headso: Philip Francis Queeg: Well, why aren't those people all flooding into the country now? Do you think the threat of possibly being sent back is enough to keep them drinking feces water?

Because now you have to pay thousands of dollars to a smuggler to get you here and then yeah you could be sent right back or the coyote could just kill you and take your money, yet still people manage to do it. Make it 200 bucks and legal and you would have a huge numbers coming here for a better life.

Why do you think the importers are going to want to make any less a profit when it;s legal?

When you set up your company cramming immigrants into cargo ships by the thousands don't tell me you'll have any qualms about charging those who survive the voyage thousands out of their future earnings.

And now for the 50 billion dollar smart-sewer system that will let the government selectively disable drains based on a resident's citizenship status.

Philip Francis Queeg: Headso: Philip Francis Queeg: Well, why aren't those people all flooding into the country now? Do you think the threat of possibly being sent back is enough to keep them drinking feces water?

Because now you have to pay thousands of dollars to a smuggler to get you here and then yeah you could be sent right back or the coyote could just kill you and take your money, yet still people manage to do it. Make it 200 bucks and legal and you would have a huge numbers coming here for a better life.

Why do you think the importers are going to want to make any less a profit when it;s legal?

The black market drives up the price of everything. For 30 bales of hay for our horses I pay the same amount as 1/4oz of plant material for me.

Headso: Philip Francis Queeg: Headso: Philip Francis Queeg: Well, why aren't those people all flooding into the country now? Do you think the threat of possibly being sent back is enough to keep them drinking feces water?

Because now you have to pay thousands of dollars to a smuggler to get you here and then yeah you could be sent right back or the coyote could just kill you and take your money, yet still people manage to do it. Make it 200 bucks and legal and you would have a huge numbers coming here for a better life.

Why do you think the importers are going to want to make any less a profit when it;s legal?

The black market drives up the price of everything. For 30 bales of hay for our horses I pay the same amount as 1/4oz of plant material for me.

Ahh, so you are an illegal.

Sewer service? Really? It'll just give the rest of us cholera.

ManRay: Bigdogdaddy: I did read the entire article. Isn't it funny how when they get hammered for their decision it's always there are "unintended consequences"?

Not really. It happens all the time.

The law was intended to restrict the types of ID that a person can use to access government services ie a foreign ID. That is very broad in its reach, so an amendment would be passed to exempt some services. Is there really an epidemic of illegal aliens trying to get married to each other in Georgia? I seriously doubt anyone was thinking of marriage licenses and sewer hookups when trying to limit acceptable IDs for drivers licenses and colleges.

Marriage licenses I can see. It's one of the way's that you can become a citizen, or generally avoid deportation. Marry a citizen. Since the GOP tried to make a big deal out of anchor babies, I'm not sure I have trouble seeing them deliberately cutting off additional avenues of naturalization/nationalization.

Sewer? That's a little silly.

Headso: Philip Francis Queeg: Headso: Philip Francis Queeg: Well, why aren't those people all flooding into the country now? Do you think the threat of possibly being sent back is enough to keep them drinking feces water?

Because now you have to pay thousands of dollars to a smuggler to get you here and then yeah you could be sent right back or the coyote could just kill you and take your money, yet still people manage to do it. Make it 200 bucks and legal and you would have a huge numbers coming here for a better life.

Why do you think the importers are going to want to make any less a profit when it;s legal?

The black market drives up the price of everything. For 30 bales of hay for our horses I pay the same amount as 1/4oz of plant material for me.

Not necessarily the cause of high cannabis prices. I don't particularly have the energy or time to go into a discussion on the subject, but trust me. The black market isn't the fundamental factor driving up the price of MJ. It's still supply and demand. Now, you can argue til you're blue in the face about how much of an impact being a black market has on supply. There's an argument to be had there. But most people claim that the black market drive up prices due to the increased risk, and there's plenty of evidence to the contrary.

Beyond all that, the market forces driving the price of hay vs the price of pot are very different. Pot's value is generated by its quality. The goal of a grower in that market is to generate the highest quality goods in the smallest area possible. Meanwhile, the goal of a hay producer is to generate the highest *quantity* of goods in the smallest area possible. This drastically alters the supply curve.

Anything to avoid paying attention to actual problems, right?

At least it will be easier to figure out who's the king.

BeesNuts: Beyond all that, the market forces driving the price of hay vs the price of pot are very different. Pot's value is generated by its quality. The goal of a grower in that market is to generate the highest quality goods in the smallest area possible. Meanwhile, the goal of a hay producer is to generate the highest *quantity* of goods in the smallest area possible. This drastically alters the supply curve.

I disagree with pretty much your whole post, I'd say the black market aspect is what creates the high cost because it creates scarcity. If you could grow pot anywhere you wouldn't have that scarcity. Also there are different qualities of hay, cow hay and horse hay are of different quality and within horse hay there are levels of quality, timothy hay or hay with a lot of alfalfa is worth more also 2nd or 3rd cutting hay is worth more, 1st cut has winter weeds.