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(Haaretz)   "Netanyahu is expected to publicly harden his line against Iran during a meeting with Barack Obama." ( •_•)⌐■-■ Well, that might stiffen into into a.... (⌐■_■) sticky situation   (haaretz.com) divider line 443
    More: Interesting, obama, Iran, Thomas E. Donilon, Shimon Peres, Martin Dempsey, AIPAC, Vice President Joe Biden, national security adviser  
•       •       •

3994 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Mar 2012 at 1:53 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-03-03 04:16:04 AM  

RoyBatty: Biological Ali: RoyBatty: How does Israel bombing Iran help Israel or benefit Zionism? (Your claim.)

Where exactly did he claim that?

Slarti claimed that in his lmgtfy link.


No, you asked "Why? What does Israel gain? What is their motive?", to which he gave that answer.
 
2012-03-03 04:16:11 AM  

RoyBatty: Slarti claimed that in his lmgtfy link.


yes, yes I did but in direct answer to that question with all good intention and will to defend that claim

In response to:

RoyBatty: What is their motive


I feel that is a reasonable (if somewhat sarcastic) response to that incredibly stupid question
 
2012-03-03 04:16:45 AM  

Frederick: I read those links. The US is an ally of Israel. If Israel is attacked the US and other ally nations will vehemently support Israel -no doubt. I think what is really being asked is "will the US support Israel if Israel attacks Iran"? And that is a totally different question. If Israel is intimating that they would relish a go-it-alone versus Iran; then it is a bluff. Israel could not win a conventional war with Iran on their own.


Read the links again, or other links too, Israel does not seem to think it will fight a conventional war with Iran. How would that happen anyway, Jordan and Iraq are in the way.

Israel according to Yadlin, IIRC, can stop or delay Iran with a few well targeted airstrikes that will create a lot of noise but no real reprisal.
 
2012-03-03 04:17:57 AM  

wildcardjack: elvisaintdead: Oh subby, ( •_•)⌐■-■ I see...(⌐■_■) what you did there.
crypticsatellite: YEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH

I have to clip this to Evernote.

File under odd emoticons.

/:€ Jamie

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ Table flip




Jamie HAHAHAHAHAHA that's awesome!
 
2012-03-03 04:19:01 AM  

Slartibartfaster: RoyBatty: Slarti claimed that in his lmgtfy link.

yes, yes I did but in direct answer to that question with all good intention and will to defend that claim

In response to:

RoyBatty: What is their motive

I feel that is a reasonable (if somewhat sarcastic) response to that incredibly stupid question


It's an ignorant and sarcastic answer to a reasonable question.

Saying "Zionism" to the question of what would Israel gain from bombing Iraq is a derp answer, and from a derper, so no surprise. And since my question was clearly not sarcastic, you can fark yourself with your lmgtfy shiat. That was funny in 2004 for about three weeks and tendentious and obnoxious since.

So fark off and die, take your lovely family with you.
 
2012-03-03 04:19:20 AM  

FormlessOne: 9beers: FormlessOne: 9beers: generallyso: Fight your own goddamn war.

You'd be the guy running away if a couple of guys jumped your buddy at the bar, wouldn't you?

If my "buddy" was an asshole that kept poking the biggest guys in the bar, and then screaming "you can't touch me, because that guy over there will kick your ass!", well, "running away" wouldn't be necessary. I'd hand the asshole over to those guys and say, "I'm sick of his shiat and I just came in here for a drink - have fun."

That's not a "buddy." That's just an asshole using you.

If you think Israel is the aggressor, you're a damn idiot.

Perhaps, but, again, if Iran is the aggressor, then we still don't need to step in until they actually do something, y'know, aggressive. Take Kuwait, for example. Sure, Hussein asked a few countries for permission to invade, and because he got ambiguous & conflicting responses from the U.S., and France, and so on, he figured "well, if Kuwait is going to keep encroaching, I might as well start this shindig." We waited until he started the shindig before we kicked off Gulf War I, even though we knew his intentions.

What I'm saying is "let's not have another country goad us into a conflict before force is even advisable, never mind necessary." I couldn't give a rat's rectum about the "aggressor" here, although I do believe that the whole "Israel First" bit is getting tired and the constant churn of covert action against Arab countries by Israel is the equivalent of poking the bigger guys at the bar, because there's no reason at this point. What I do care about is that the United States is considering a preventive war against Iran solely on the basis of intelligence reports, political rumblings, and the constant, shrill scream of Israel behind much of it.

I think Fareed Zakaria said it best in this article:

Let's be clear: We are talking about a preventive war against a country that has not attacked us. We are talking about war on the basis of intelligence reports. ...


How noble of you. Like a cop telling a woman "sorry, we can't actually do anything about your stalker threatening to kill you until he actually has committed a crime like... killing you. Don't worry though, we'll totally put him jail after you're dead".

Israel is a tiny little nation. It would probably take five missiles max to exterminate every living person in the entire country. Once they are launched there is not a whole lot anyone can do about it but die. The first strike by Iran will be the last for Israel. The country will cease to exist. The logistics of doing this are easy if you're Iran. They know this that's why they are worried over it. Very justifiably so. We started a war with Iraq over far less. There was absolutely no chance that Iraq could wipe out the US in one simple attack.

Khamenei and Ahmadinejad have both said that they want Israel gone. The Iranian government even puts up billboards and banners saying "Israel should be wiped from the face of the Earth". In public. In both Farsi and motherfarking English. Who do you think that's for?

This doesn't even begin to address the fact that allowing Iran these weapons would start a nuclear arms race in the most deadly region on the entire planet. You think Turkey, Egypt and Saudi Arabia are just going to sit around while Iran makes bombs? Things like this are how the world ends. If ten years from now we're talking about a massive nuclear exchange in the ME that exterminates millions and destroys the world's economies it will be about our selfishness and shortsightedness. They'll wonder how we could have been so farking stupid to not act when we could have stopped it. Just because the world made it though one tense nuclear stand off without a major incident doesn't mean that's going to do so again. In fact, the more often this happens the higher the odds are it's going to happen until it becomes an inevitability. Nuclear weapons are not a game.

Iran could end this at any moment by allowing IAEA inspectors access to all of their facilities to show that they are not enriching fuel to pure enough levels to make a bomb. They don't. That's a fact. That is the part that violates the NPT they signed. They have enrichment facilities that they didn't report and have gone to great lengths to hide from the world. The only reason to do this weapons fuel production.
 
2012-03-03 04:20:34 AM  

RoyBatty: die, take your lovely family with you


You want my family to die ? classy.
 
2012-03-03 04:21:40 AM  

Biological Ali: RoyBatty: Biological Ali: RoyBatty: How does Israel bombing Iran help Israel or benefit Zionism? (Your claim.)

Where exactly did he claim that?

Slarti claimed that in his lmgtfy link.

No, you asked "Why? What does Israel gain? What is their motive?", to which he gave that answer.


It's a non answer, what does "What does Israel gain by bombing Iran? Zionism" answer the question?

"zi·on·ism/ˈzīəˌnizəm/Noun: A movement for (originally) the reestablishment and (now) the development and protection of a Jewish nation in Israel. It was establishe..."

How does bombing Iran move forward " the reestablishment and (now) the development and protection of a Jewish nation in Israel."

Be specific.
 
2012-03-03 04:22:27 AM  

Slartibartfaster: RoyBatty: die, take your lovely family with you

You want my family to die ? classy.


fark off already.
 
2012-03-03 04:22:34 AM  

FormlessOne: For a country unwilling to sign the NPT, and unwilling to admit that they even have nuclear weapons, never mind let anyone inspect them, Israel is damned concerned about a country that has signed the NPT, played along with the IAEA, and have largely been given a clean bill.


Lol, so hiding from the IAEA the entire Natanz enrichment plant was playing along?
 
2012-03-03 04:23:17 AM  

cc_rider: Am I the only one who thinks Mr Netanyahu and co. might be getting a little too involved in our politics in an election year? It's like they're trying to see which presidential candidates and Senators will pander the most.


You're not wrong, not at all.

Bebe has broken the golden rule of international diplomacy. He's gotten involved in the domestic politics of a foreign nation, worse yet, he's done it to his nation's leading protector and diplomatic partner. Bebe is so entrenched with US Republicans that the Democrats have complete cover when they choose to blow off Netenyahu.

The funny part is that poor little Bebe seems to have bet everything on the wrong horse. It's looking like he's set up his nation for another four years in the wilderness.

I'm guessing Bebe is VERY worried that the Israeli voters will wake up and realize what the'll have to do - who they have to get rid of to put Israel back on the US radar. So look for Bebe to go ALL IN with Romney, because i Obama wins, Bebe is probably out of a job.
 
2012-03-03 04:23:53 AM  

RoyBatty: fark off already


Im happily farking, thanks
 
2012-03-03 04:25:11 AM  

Slartibartfaster: RoyBatty: fark off already

Im happily farking, thanks


Well, since I don't see your wife around, I guess I was right to call you a wanker.
 
2012-03-03 04:30:08 AM  
sectorg
Israel is a tiny little nation. It would probably take five missiles max to exterminate every living person in the entire country

So in other words, we can't allow the smoking gun to be in the form of a mushroom cloud?
 
2012-03-03 04:30:29 AM  

RoyBatty: since I don't see your wife around


Do you REALLY want to start wife jokes ?

ok

I dont see my wife around because she is asleep in bed wondering why Im upstairs farking
*imply joke about how I know where your wife is, I wont cuz you already set it up and ... Im not Australian*

Dude lighten up, this is fark, relax, chill, whatever it takes you to relax
"Real news, real funny" remember ?

Or for Okkas

R E A L N E W S, (supposed to be funny)

remember ?

Make it funny so others can enjoy reading it

This is a medium for people who enjoy
 
2012-03-03 04:30:57 AM  

sectorg: Iran could end this at any moment by allowing IAEA inspectors access to all of their facilities to show that they are not enriching fuel to pure enough levels to make a bomb. They don't. That's a fact. That is the part that violates the NPT they signed. They have enrichment facilities that they didn't report and have gone to great lengths to hide from the world. The only reason to do this weapons fuel production.


You mean that NPT that Israel refuses to sign?

The easiest way to get Iran to give up their nuclear program would be for Israel to agree to an internationally monitored demilitarization of their nuclear program.

No, not gonna happen. Still, that's almost completely the entire reason Iran wants nukes. It's not about Iran wanting to take over the region or some other paranoia induced craziness. It's because Iran wants protection from Israel's nukes.

Iran may be run by a nasty bunch of dictators, but they didn't start the nuclear arms race in the mid-east - Israel did.
 
2012-03-03 04:32:38 AM  

RanDomino: So in other words, we can't allow the smoking gun to be in the form of a mushroom cloud?


Who invented that cloud - those people probably not be the ones in charge of the clouds
 
2012-03-03 04:33:52 AM  

RoyBatty: It's a non answer, what does "What does Israel gain by bombing Iran? Zionism" answer the question?


I don't even know what you're saying here. Let's just go back to your initial comment:

Why? What does Israel gain? What is their motive?


That's three different questions. Slartibartfaster was answering the third one, i.e., "What is their motive?", something which should have been obvious from the beginning, but which he nonetheless explicitly made clear a few posts ago.

You, however, responded by repeatedly asking him what Israel gains - I don't quite know why. You then seemed to develop the impression that he claimed that Israel gains something, even though he hadn't suggested anything of the sort.

Are you tired? Maybe you've been up late? That would certainly explain why you're having trouble keeping track of what was actually said in this thread (including posts that you yourself made). If that's the case, I'd suggest calling it a night - save the internet arguments for when you actually have the energy to read and comprehend.
 
2012-03-03 04:35:30 AM  
Some of you saying that we cannot bomb Iran's nuclear facilities with any success are wrong. I recently saw a top military official talking on tv(his name eludes me).. He was asked point blank if we can be successful in bombing, being that Iran says they have buried their critical parts of their nuclear program deep inside a mountain. After some hesitation, the answer was "absolutely, we now have the hardware to do just that"
 
2012-03-03 04:35:47 AM  
RandomRandom
Iran may be run by a nasty bunch of dictators, but they didn't start the nuclear arms race in the mid-east - Israel did.

Woah woah woah there buddy, you're trampling over the most important part about this. Israelis speak English. They're practically Americans. They don't have to play by these silly 'rules' and 'international law'. Iranians, now, they're not even white.*

*that'sthejoke.jpg
 
2012-03-03 04:35:48 AM  

RandomRandom: Bebe has so, SO burned his bridges with the Obama administration, there is no farking way in hell Obama will finish Bebe's surprise war.


My fiance is jewish. Her family is jewish. They have family in Israel.

We all laughed out asses off when Bibi showed up in the US early in Obama's administration, acted like a spoiled twat, to which Obama told him he had better things to do and left him there for a few hours while he did important stuff and spent time with his family.

I don't think there's anyone actually informed on the issue that thinks Bibi is anything other than a warmongering child who seems determined to bring about the destruction of his country. And if Israel uses preemptive nukes, I'll only hope for enough time for relatives and members of the otherwise decent populace to leave the country before it gets glassed. If that's what it takes to educate the world that nukes are a lose-lose option, so be it.
 
2012-03-03 04:39:08 AM  

sectorg: How noble of you. Like a cop telling a woman "sorry, we can't actually do anything about your stalker threatening to kill you until he actually has committed a crime like... killing you. Don't worry though, we'll totally put him jail after you're dead".


You do realize that's how the rule of law actually works, right? Let's stretch that silly-ass analogy a bit further.

The "stalker", in this case, has also had his alleged "victim" threaten him. Never mind the assassinated civilian scientists, mysterious explosions, and so on, which the "victim" claims he had nothing to do with, of course. The "stalker" has done nothing to date but actually utter a verbal threat.

Using your silly analogy, you can't even get a restraining order at that point, never mind actually convince the cops to do anything about it - because, so far, the "stalker" has done nothing but talk. The cops have already checked out the "stalker" repeatedly, and although he's been cited for a misdemeanor, the cops are reasonably satisfied with the current state of the "stalker". That doesn't satisfy the "victim", though, and so the "victim" is attempting to goad others into action.

As I said earlier, I honestly don't care about the "he said, she said" crap. At the end of the day, you're advocating that the United States go to war for a pretext far flimsier than the vial of powder Colin Powell was busily waving at the UN, while Israel hysterically screams "if you don't do something, I swear I will!" If the last decade of misguided military malfeasance has taught us anything, it should've taught us that the next time we pick a fight, we'd better have a damned good reason for doing so, because the last couple of fights left us broke, somewhat bloodied, and slow to recover, and those fights were against countries that were nowhere near as well armed or funded as Iran.

Yeah, I'm quite happy to wait until someone throws the first punch. I'm happy to live with the pretense that there are rules out there other than "do unto others before they do unto you."
 
2012-03-03 04:39:42 AM  

Fista-Phobia: In B4 DreidelMeinTats.


yeah, nice how they greenlight shiat like this for Sabbath.


Why?

Are you afraid of his posts? He is somewhat bent towards insanity but he makes well reasoned arguments.

II don't agree with all he says,but it's funny watching idiots defend people lobbing rockets into Israel. You like to point out how ineffective the rockets were. "See, we didn't hurt anyone" (which of course is a lie because plenty of people have been hurt or killed by rockets" - and the response is "but the Jews! They killed Hitler! I's not fair!"

I'll clue you guys in on a few other reasons why some (not all by any means) Americas like Isreal.

* They are bad-ass. Nobody messes too much with them without the Mossad performing a good old-fashioned assassination.

* They are the underdog - they are the Jewish state among many Islamic states. They've been at war with a lot of those farkers and yet they're still standing.

* They're fairly intelligent.

* IDF chicks are hawt!

encrypted-tbn3.google.com

* They haven't blown up subways or the WTC just to kill a lot of civilians. When Israel strikes they have a specific target in mind.

* The so-called "Palestinieans" have not made their case and instead resort to firing rockets to the point that Israeli children (both Jewish and Muslim - and even Christian) think it's normal for bombs to land in their backyeard.
 
2012-03-03 04:41:44 AM  

Biological Ali: Why? What does Israel gain? What is their motive?That's three different questions


Um, that's one question asked three different ways.

Like a cop asking if a suspect had means, motive, an opportunity. I had what is the motive, I asked it three times.

Why would Israel do this? What does it gain? What is its motive?

That's the same question.

Regardless, Zionism still is not an answer to the question. Presumably, Israel already has Zionism. So how does Zionism address that question?

Giving slarti the benefit of the doubt, how does bombing Iran advance the cause of Zionism? It mainly seems to just to piss everyone on the planet off. How would that advance the cause of zionism?

Remember, the root question is, is Israel or Iran the aggressor?

It seems clear what Iran's religious leaders motives are in a stupid attack on another country. They get more power as dictators, and Israel offends them so they pluck it out.

It is difficult for me to understand what Israel's motives are in a stupid attack on another country. They get shiat loads of condemnation and make life harder for their citizenry who will vote them out of office.

Zionism doesn't seem to address any of this.

Am I tired? Yes very, one more swig and then I'm probably off to the floor.
 
2012-03-03 04:45:12 AM  

Happy Hours: IDF chicks are hawt


www.patriotfiles.com

yes, they are
 
2012-03-03 04:45:35 AM  
Happy Hours
II don't agree with all he says,but it's funny watching idiots defend people lobbing rockets into Israel.

dude, farkin', it's about the best way to stop that. Yeah, you can do it Israel's way, which is slow-rolling ethnic cleansing. Or you can do it in a way that would actually work WITHOUT crushing hundreds of thousands of people in misery for decades. Yes, it means putting up with a few glorified bottle rockets for a couple years.
 
2012-03-03 04:46:21 AM  

RoyBatty: Um, that's one question asked three different ways.


Uh, no. A motive is simply your reason for doing something. Whether or not you gain is something else entirely. You could be motivated by something stupid or irrational, in which case you might actually end up losing, but that wouldn't retroactively change what your motive was.
 
2012-03-03 04:49:16 AM  

RoyBatty: is Israel or Iran the aggressor


Or is persia vs Palestine etc...
Big ole nasty battle, it's not recent and the recent stuff is just retaliation for less recent stuff

RoyBatty: Zionism doesn't seem to address any of this


Yea it does ... what do you think the natural result of zionism would be ?

RoyBatty: Am I tired?


Sleep dream and be well
 
2012-03-03 04:52:03 AM  

RoyBatty: Regardless, Zionism still is not an answer to the question. Presumably, Israel already has Zionism. So how does Zionism address that question?


Why isn't Zionism an answer to the question of motive? Isn't Zionism partly about "addressing threats to its continued existence and security"?
 
2012-03-03 04:53:05 AM  

Biological Ali: RoyBatty: Um, that's one question asked three different ways.

Uh, no. A motive is simply your reason for doing something. Whether or not you gain is something else entirely. You could be motivated by something stupid or irrational, in which case you might actually end up losing, but that wouldn't retroactively change what your motive was.


I think I'm going to disagree with you here and crash, a motive is your incentive, your incentive is what you stand to gain, it is the reason why, regardless, you wrote that in the form of a Monty Python sketch or so it sounds in my head, so I have to award you an internet while responding, "(Rings bell) Good Morning."
 
2012-03-03 04:53:11 AM  

sectorg: This doesn't even begin to address the fact that allowing Iran these weapons would start a nuclear arms race in the most deadly region on the entire planet. You think Turkey, Egypt and Saudi Arabia are just going to sit around while Iran makes bombs? Things like this are how the world ends. If ten years from now we're talking about a massive nuclear exchange in the ME that exterminates millions and destroys the world's economies it will be about our selfishness and shortsightedness. They'll wonder how we could have been so farking stupid to not act when we could have stopped it. Just because the world made it though one tense nuclear stand off without a major incident doesn't mean that's going to do so again. In fact, the more often this happens the higher the odds are it's going to happen until it becomes an inevitability. Nuclear weapons are not a game.


Wouldnt it be Israel that actually started the nuclear arms race by acquiring them first?

sectorg: Iran could end this at any moment by allowing IAEA inspectors access to all of their facilities to show that they are not enriching fuel to pure enough levels to make a bomb. They don't. That's a fact. That is the part that violates the NPT they signed. They have enrichment facilities that they didn't report and have gone to great lengths to hide from the world. The only reason to do this weapons fuel production.


This is untrue. They have allowed inspectors to all facilities that Iran is required. Inspectors were not allowed into facilities that Iran was not required to allow them.

sectorg: Khamenei and Ahmadinejad have both said that they want Israel gone. The Iranian government even puts up billboards and banners saying "Israel should be wiped from the face of the Earth". In public. In both Farsi and motherfarking English. Who do you think that's for?


Show me.

sectorg: How noble of you. Like a cop telling a woman "sorry, we can't actually do anything about your stalker threatening to kill you until he actually has committed a crime like... killing you. Don't worry though, we'll totally put him jail after you're dead".


That you dont understand the implications of what you are saying tells a lot.
 
2012-03-03 04:56:10 AM  

RoyBatty: I think I'm going to disagree with you here and crash, a motive is your incentive, your incentive is what you stand to gain, it is the reason why, regardless, you wrote that in the form of a Monty Python sketch or so it sounds in my head, so I have to award you an internet while responding, "(Rings bell) Good Morning."


Going to have to disagree with you. If gain and motive were interchangeable, they wouldn't have two different definitions. He's right. What you gain is not always the reason for your motive.
 
2012-03-03 04:57:42 AM  

9beers: You'd be the guy running away if a couple of guys jumped your buddy at the bar, wouldn't you?


Israel isn't the US's buddy.
 
2012-03-03 04:58:52 AM  

Slartibartfaster: Yea it does ... what do you think the natural result of zionism would be ?


Zionism is establishment and protection of a state of Israel for the Jews.

Attacking Iran when Iran is known not to have weapons, according to what so many are saying, would not advance Zionism.

If the original question is: who is the aggressor, Iran or Israel, a reasonable question is what does each stand to gain from attacking.

RanDomino says, "Weakening of Hezbollah". Okay, that's a measurable goal.

You say, "Zionism."

That's a non sequitur.

They already have a state, and attacking Iran for no reason pisses off the entire world, so how does "Zionism" answer the question of what Israel gains?

Why did we attack Iraq? Patriotism. That's not a real answer. We have lots of ways to improve "Patriotism" and it's very much a non-measurable goal. Not a real answer.

To stop Al Qaeda. To win a second term. To show the world we're badass and they should fear us. Those are measurable goals. Stupid goals, but measurable.

Patriotism, Zionism, are not real answers to these questions.
 
2012-03-03 04:59:10 AM  

RandomRandom: cc_rider: Am I the only one who thinks Mr Netanyahu and co. might be getting a little too involved in our politics in an election year? It's like they're trying to see which presidential candidates and Senators will pander the most.

You're not wrong, not at all.

Bebe has broken the golden rule of international diplomacy. He's gotten involved in the domestic politics of a foreign nation, worse yet, he's done it to his nation's leading protector and diplomatic partner. Bebe is so entrenched with US Republicans that the Democrats have complete cover when they choose to blow off Netenyahu.

The funny part is that poor little Bebe seems to have bet everything on the wrong horse. It's looking like he's set up his nation for another four years in the wilderness.

I'm guessing Bebe is VERY worried that the Israeli voters will wake up and realize what the'll have to do - who they have to get rid of to put Israel back on the US radar. So look for Bebe to go ALL IN with Romney, because i Obama wins, Bebe is probably out of a job.


Yes, probably to be replaced with an even more right-wing hard-line asshole: Link (new window)

I can only hope for an "Israeli Spring" a bloodless one, where they vote the Likud party out and replace them with some real leaders who are actually interested in making peace with their neighbors. Sadly, the country seems to be moving in the opposite direction.

At the very least, their leaders need to stay the hell out of our politics and stop trying to influence our election. Bibi should not be trying to involve us in a war/military action that we can't afford, in every sense of the word.
 
2012-03-03 04:59:45 AM  

9beers: generallyso: Fight your own goddamn war.

You'd be the guy running away if a couple of guys jumped your buddy at the bar, wouldn't you?


There is a real difference between a running away when a couple of guys jump your buddy at the bar and doing nothing to help your buddy when he walks up to a couple guys at the bar and starts stupid, pointless shiat with them.

If someone attacks my friend, I help my friend. If my friend attacks someone, I shrug and say "I'm not with that idiot."
 
2012-03-03 05:01:10 AM  

Slartibartfaster: RoyBatty: since I don't see your wife around

Do you REALLY want to start wife jokes ?

ok

I dont see my wife around because she is asleep in bed wondering why Im upstairs farking
*imply joke about how I know where your wife is, I wont cuz you already set it up and ... Im not Australian*

Dude lighten up, this is fark, relax, chill, whatever it takes you to relax
"Real news, real funny" remember ?

Or for Okkas

R E A L N E W S, (supposed to be funny)

remember ?

Make it funny so others can enjoy reading it

This is a medium for people who enjoy


Folks, this is why Douglas Adams and Philip K. Dick fans attend different sci-fi conventions.
 
2012-03-03 05:05:13 AM  

RoyBatty: a motive is your incentive


how is zionism NOT included in your definition here ?

"Zionism supports Jews upholding their Jewish identity and opposes the the assimilation of Jews into other societies and has advocated the return of Jews to Israel"

go sleep my tired fellow farker
 
2012-03-03 05:06:04 AM  

MeinRS6: I've agreed with some of the stuff you've posted so far, but I don't agree with this. It takes both sides to accomplish a peace and I doubt you seriously believe that Hamas, Hezbollah, and all of the other islamic terror groups and radical islamic states want peace with Israel. If you did think that, that would be a factual error on your part.


Have you ever wondered why Hamas etc hate Israel? Maybe the israelis should look into that ...

... oh wait, Israel wants to have groups like Hamas around, because they give them an alibi for their behavior. "But turrists derp!"
 
2012-03-03 05:06:41 AM  
Zionism is inherently racist - some people take that as war words
 
2012-03-03 05:07:46 AM  

publikenemy: Some of you saying that we cannot bomb Iran's nuclear facilities with any success are wrong. I recently saw a top military official talking on tv(his name eludes me).. He was asked point blank if we can be successful in bombing, being that Iran says they have buried their critical parts of their nuclear program deep inside a mountain. After some hesitation, the answer was "absolutely, we now have the hardware to do just that"


You're trying to prevent a determined government from acquiring 60+ year old technology. The best you can do is slow them down. Unless, of course, you're willing to take steps that will turn the whole world against you.
 
2012-03-03 05:08:04 AM  

RandomRandom: sectorg: Iran could end this at any moment by allowing IAEA inspectors access to all of their facilities to show that they are not enriching fuel to pure enough levels to make a bomb. They don't. That's a fact. That is the part that violates the NPT they signed. They have enrichment facilities that they didn't report and have gone to great lengths to hide from the world. The only reason to do this weapons fuel production.

You mean that NPT that Israel refuses to sign?

The easiest way to get Iran to give up their nuclear program would be for Israel to agree to an internationally monitored demilitarization of their nuclear program.

No, not gonna happen. Still, that's almost completely the entire reason Iran wants nukes. It's not about Iran wanting to take over the region or some other paranoia induced craziness. It's because Iran wants protection from Israel's nukes.

Iran may be run by a nasty bunch of dictators, but they didn't start the nuclear arms race in the mid-east - Israel did.


I have no clue where you got that idea. Iran has more and bigger enemies than Israel. Specifically, the US, Europeans and Arabs they fight against for regional hegemony daily. There is not one single reason for Israel to believe that if they lay down their arms and bare their throats that Iran won't take the opportunity to cut their head off. Seriously, why the fark would Iran give up their weapons then? Especially knowing for sure that they can kill Israel without an immediate counter attack. That doesn't even begin to make any rational sense.

It sounds like a nice idea but Iran is not trying to build a nuclear arsenal because they are worried about a nuclear first-strike from Israel. Israel has never directly attacked Iran despite the fact that Iran directly funds and arms the terrorist organizations that hound them constantly (attacks and assassinations through proxies are another thing). There is not one single reason to build a nuclear weapon to protect themselves from an Israeli invasion. It flat out makes no sense.

They are doing this so they can push their program for regional domination far more aggressively than before. The other Arabs in the region are not going to just take it up the ass from them. They hate them. They're going to respond in kind and this shiat is going to go out of control. These people are not known for their rational thinking and stability. You especially cannot expect a totalitarian regime to act rationally. 'Face' is everything. If they look weak someone else might step up and knock them off so they will forge ahead with this program no matter how devastating it is to their economy. This is all in Iran's court now. They are the only ones who can cool this down. The problem is that they will have to swallow some pride. They have been offered a lot of solutions to this problem by a lot of nations and refused. If they were a nation lead by their people the people would tell them "fix it or we're throwing you out of office". None of them want to die in a nuclear holocaust. The problem is that this mechanism doesn't exist there. That's what scares the shiat out of Bebe and the Israelis. We are likely watching a catastrophe growing before our eyes. I hope more than anything that I'm wrong but there is simply not any rational reason to believe I am. Which sucks.
 
2012-03-03 05:10:45 AM  

Slartibartfaster: "Zionism supports Jews upholding their Jewish identity and opposes the the assimilation of Jews into other societies and has advocated the return of Jews to Israel"


How does attacking Iran when Iran has no weapons program help any of that?

Jews aren't idiots. Israelis aren't idiots. They value their security. And the definitely value the lives of their soldiers, (look at the 1000:1 prisoner exchanges.) Attacking Iran makes no sense in terms of promoting Jewish identity or opposing assimilation of Jews or advocating return of the Jews. It's the opposite.

Slartibartfaster:

go sleep my tired fellow farker


Yeah, sleep well yourself, I definitely do apologize for the nasty crack about your family. You and they should all live long and prosper. Sincerely.
 
2012-03-03 05:10:49 AM  

RoyBatty: What does Israel gain?


An external enemy. Someone to help maintain the "everybody hates us so we have to do as I say" mentality. Israel doesn't actually have to bomb Iran, just make a lot of noise about doing so.
 
2012-03-03 05:11:54 AM  

RoyBatty: definitely do apologize for the nasty crack about your family


taken and appreciated
 
2012-03-03 05:15:48 AM  

RoyBatty: Iran has no weapons program


Pretty sure you were sarcastic, but Iran clearly does
But they are playing catchup
"You cant do that cuz we already did" is a lame defense
USA and Israel should stfu about nuclear arnament
USA invented them
Israel still wont officially admit to it
Not really the high moral ground in that dispute.
 
2012-03-03 05:20:58 AM  

Happy Hours: * They are the underdog


Israel is not and has never been the underdog.

- they are the Jewish state among many Islamic states.

Maybe they should have chosen a different neighborhood back in 1947. Too late to fix that now, of course.

* They haven't blown up subways or the WTC just to kill a lot of civilians.

Deir Yassin and similar events. Not to mention the more recent escapades in Gaza and Lebanon.

When Israel strikes they have a specific target in mind.

upload.wikimedia.org

* The so-called "Palestinieans"

So ... what are they then? Israelis? When do they get to participate in israeli elections?
 
2012-03-03 05:25:17 AM  

RoyBatty: Zionism is establishment and protection of a state of Israel for the Jews.


upload.wikimedia.org

How does one create a jewish state in an area where more than 90% of the population is arab? The answer to that question is the root of the problem.
 
2012-03-03 05:46:42 AM  
Religious fundamentalist psychos have been babbling about the "end times" since before Jesus.

The only thing about 2012 that scares me is the completely insane ones who want to make it a self-fulfilling prophecy.
 
2012-03-03 05:47:03 AM  

Slartibartfaster: RoyBatty: Iran has no weapons program

Pretty sure you were sarcastic, but Iran clearly does
But they are playing catchup
"You cant do that cuz we already did" is a lame defense
USA and Israel should stfu about nuclear arnament
USA invented them
Israel still wont officially admit to it
Not really the high moral ground in that dispute.


Moral high ground? We're talking about thermonuclear extermination and you're worried about your rhetorical position? Or how it makes you feel as a person? This is pure survival we're talking about here. Next to that your moral code doesn't mean shiat.

Would you consider it a moral victory if the Israelis lied down and allowed themselves to be vaporized? Would you cheer for their ashes then? Are you going to waggle your finger at Iran and tell them "that's against the rules". It's like there's something inside you that doesn't really consider the world real. Like there is actually some cosmic rule book that will intervene on our behalf if shiat gets too crazy. There isn't. This is it. We fark it up there's no one coming to the rescue.

Why do you think Israelis are going on about how they're willing to risk it all to stop them? Especially telling the world about it and ruining their chance for a surprise attack. For fun? This is serious shiat here man. No one is farking around. No one wants to risk attacking Iran but they sure as hell don't want to be exterminated but ultra-religious nutcases.
 
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