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(Labspaces.net)   NASA updating the systems that remind our GPS satellites that we're standing on a planet that's evolving, and revolving at 900 miles an hour   (labspaces.net) divider line 48
    More: Interesting, NASA, GPS, radio signals, Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter, center of mass, astronomical observatory, jet propulsions, NASA Headquarters  
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3547 clicks; posted to Geek » on 27 Feb 2012 at 4:45 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-02-27 12:23:34 AM
The earth "revolves"? What is this witch madness?
 
2012-02-27 01:51:50 AM
'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.
 
2012-02-27 05:00:37 AM
Everybody lives on a street in a city
Or a village or a town for what it's worth.
And they're all inside a country which is part of a continent
That sits upon a planet known as Earth.
And the Earth is a ball full of oceans and some mountains
Which is out there spinning silently in space.
And living on that Earth are the plants and the animals
And also the entire human race.

It's a great big universe
And we're all really puny
We're just tiny little specks
About the size of Mickey Rooney.
It's big and black and inky
And we are small and dinky
It's a big universe and we're not.

And we're part of a vast interplanetary system
Stretching seven hundred billion miles long.
With nine planets and a sun; we think the Earth's the only one
That has life on it, although we could be wrong.
Across the interstellar voids are a billion asteroids
Including meteors and Halley's Comet too.
And there's over fifty moons floating out there like balloons
In a panoramic trillion-mile view.
 
2012-02-27 05:03:00 AM
I'm going to have that tune stuck in my head all day now. Thanks, submitter
 
2012-02-27 05:06:05 AM
Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour,
That's orbiting at nineteen miles a second, so it's reckoned,
A sun that is the source of all our power.
The sun and you and me and all the stars that we can see
Are moving at a million miles a day
In an outer spiral arm, at forty thousand miles an hour,
Of the galaxy we call the 'Milky Way'.
Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars.
It's a hundred thousand light years side to side.
It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick,
But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide.
We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point.
We go 'round every two hundred million years,
And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions
In this amazing and expanding universe.

The universe itself keeps on expanding and expanding
In all of the directions it can whizz
As fast as it can go, at the speed of light, you know,
Twelve million miles a minute, and that's the fastest speed there is.
So remember, when you're feeling very small and insecure,
How amazingly unlikely is your birth,
And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.
 
2012-02-27 05:30:37 AM
Space is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind-bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space.
 
2012-02-27 06:11:21 AM
Can we have your liver then?
 
2012-02-27 07:15:55 AM
GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?
 
2012-02-27 07:16:50 AM
But do the satellites go "PING"?
 
2012-02-27 07:36:38 AM
Here's a little number I tossed off recently in the Caribbean....
 
2012-02-27 07:39:03 AM
As in ancient Greece, goatse today is a team sport, relying on observations conducted in multiple places.

Got nothing.
 
2012-02-27 07:50:02 AM
Why don't they just make up the numbers, like GISS does with the temperatures?
 
2012-02-27 07:50:54 AM

Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?


The Lord giveth, and the Lord taketh away.
 
2012-02-27 07:57:40 AM

darkscout: Everybody lives on a street in a city
Or a village or a town for what it's worth.
And they're all inside a country which is part of a continent
That sits upon a planet known as Earth.
And the Earth is a ball full of oceans and some mountains
Which is out there spinning silently in space.
And living on that Earth are the plants and the animals
And also the entire human race.

It's a great big universe
And we're all really puny
We're just tiny little specks
About the size of Mickey Rooney.
It's big and black and inky
And we are small and dinky
It's a big universe and we're not.

And we're part of a vast interplanetary system
Stretching seven hundred billion miles long.
With nine planets and a sun; we think the Earth's the only one
That has life on it, although we could be wrong.
Across the interstellar voids are a billion asteroids
Including meteors and Halley's Comet too.
And there's over fifty moons floating out there like balloons
In a panoramic trillion-mile view.


Damn you. Now I have to play that on my TV.

/XBMC and recently ripped seasons FTW
 
2012-02-27 08:10:09 AM

Cybernetic: Here's a little number I tossed off recently in the Caribbean....


My wife was engrossed in some droll PBS-style movies about royalty recently...maybe something about Henry VIII's wives? I wasn't paying attention, but she remarked how good the boys choir was.

Time to cue up All Things Dull and Ugly

/+1 Submitter
 
2012-02-27 08:16:59 AM

thisispete: Space is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind-bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space.


"Earth - mostly harmless."
 
2012-02-27 08:24:45 AM

Impasse: But do the satellites go "PING"?


yes...but 1 ping only, Vasily.

www.n2wzb.net
 
2012-02-27 08:29:58 AM

Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?


To the best of my knowledge, paper maps and magnetic compasses would still work, as would a sextant and an air or nautical almanac.

For well over 99% of normal civilian use, you don't really *NEED* a GPS. It's a convenience, not a necessity.
 
2012-02-27 08:35:41 AM
Can they help the folks at Google Maps understand the concept of a cul de sac while they're ate in?

Pretty sure those people didn't want me driving through their house to get to the business behind their back yard.
 
2012-02-27 08:39:15 AM

dittybopper: For well over 99% of normal civilian use, you don't really *NEED* a GPS. It's a convenience, not a necessity.


For many it has become the difference between getting to safety or needing to be rescued.

You can use the old tools but you're more likely to be more accurate and more effective using a GPS.
 
2012-02-27 08:45:45 AM

dittybopper: Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?

To the best of my knowledge, paper maps and magnetic compasses would still work, as would a sextant and an air or nautical almanac.

For well over 99% of normal civilian use, you don't really *NEED* a GPS. It's a convenience, not a necessity.


Modern aircraft use GPS as only one of a few postition reference systems, along with inertial ref and radio nav. Sure, there are a lot of GPS-dependent approaches out there, and that number is growing, but every major airport still uses ILS approaches, and all the air routes are still based on VOR ground stations and crossing fixes.

In the end it would mean that ATC would have to give cruising aircraft a little more space between due to them having less accuracy enroute, and those nice, finely-customized GPS approaches would go away, meaning the neigborhoods that successfully lobbied to have the approaches moved would once again have planes flying overhead. Some mountain airports would lose out to having higher weather minima as well.

But a big meh at this point as far as aviation is concerned.
 
2012-02-27 08:50:06 AM
After rereading my post, that applies to over-land navigation. Trans-oceanic stuff would suffer a lot more.
 
2012-02-27 08:55:05 AM

Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?


I think people would just stop making a left turn into the lake.
 
2012-02-27 08:58:56 AM
So you're saying that it wasn't the salmon mousse?
 
2012-02-27 09:08:22 AM

Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?


The Russians would be thrilled

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GLONASS
 
2012-02-27 09:08:33 AM

Charlie Freak: After rereading my post, that applies to over-land navigation. Trans-oceanic stuff would suffer a lot more.


Not really. Sure, it might increase fuel costs a little bit, as you'd have less efficient routes, and you would have a certain amount of positional error at the end of a long over-water leg, but we were regularly flying transcontinental distances before GPS. Hell, I used to catch non-stop flights from Honolulu to Chicago and vice-versa back in the mid-1980s, long before GPS entered into the civilian marketplace. That's a 4,200+ mile great circle distance, roughly half of which is over the Pacific Ocean and out of range of any NDBs or VORs.
 
2012-02-27 09:12:37 AM

Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_%28satellite_navigation%29
 
2012-02-27 09:14:12 AM
Knowing the Universe is dynamic and chaotic is so much more interesting and exciting.

Yet, this seems to make many uncomfortable and resistant...even scientists.
As if they can't absorb the idea
Or the fact that something isn't static or black & white...is somehow unacceptable.

I would think for those who even believe in a higher being,
would find it that much more awesome for the complexity that keeps unfolding.

/certainly makes me applaud more
 
2012-02-27 09:14:23 AM

darkscout: Everybody lives on a street in a city
Or a village or a town for what it's worth.
And they're all inside a country which is part of a continent
That sits upon a planet known as Earth.
And the Earth is a ball full of oceans and some mountains
Which is out there spinning silently in space.
And living on that Earth are the plants and the animals
And also the entire human race.

It's a great big universe
And we're all really puny
We're just tiny little specks
About the size of Mickey Rooney.
It's big and black and inky
And we are small and dinky
It's a big universe and we're not.

And we're part of a vast interplanetary system
Stretching seven hundred billion miles long.
With nine planets and a sun; we think the Earth's the only one
That has life on it, although we could be wrong.
Across the interstellar voids are a billion asteroids
Including meteors and Halley's Comet too.
And there's over fifty moons floating out there like balloons
In a panoramic trillion-mile view.


Came for Yakko's Universe song
/leaving satisfied.
 
2012-02-27 09:31:56 AM

dittybopper: Charlie Freak: After rereading my post, that applies to over-land navigation. Trans-oceanic stuff would suffer a lot more.

Not really. Sure, it might increase fuel costs a little bit, as you'd have less efficient routes, and you would have a certain amount of positional error at the end of a long over-water leg, but we were regularly flying transcontinental distances before GPS. Hell, I used to catch non-stop flights from Honolulu to Chicago and vice-versa back in the mid-1980s, long before GPS entered into the civilian marketplace. That's a 4,200+ mile great circle distance, roughly half of which is over the Pacific Ocean and out of range of any NDBs or VORs.


Suffer in terms of a greater effect. Certainly RVSM would go away and that alone would slow things down a lot.
 
2012-02-27 09:37:14 AM
I came for the Monty Python, Animaniacs and Hitch Hikers Guide references and I'm leaving one happy frood.
 
2012-02-27 09:53:16 AM

dittybopper: Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?

To the best of my knowledge, paper maps and magnetic compasses would still work, as would a sextant and an air or nautical almanac.

For well over 99% of normal civilian use, you don't really *NEED* a GPS. It's a convenience, not a necessity.


"At the Naval Medical Center, emergency pagers used for summoning doctors stopped working. Chaos threatened in the busy harbour, too, after the traffic-management system used for guiding boats failed. On the streets, people reaching for their cellphones found they had no signal and bank customers trying to withdraw cash from local ATMs were refused.
...
Why would a GPS outage cause such disruption? These satellite signals now do a lot more than inform your car's satnav. GPS has become an "invisible utility" that we rely on without realising. Cellphone companies use GPS time signals to coordinate how your phone talks to their towers. Energy suppliers turn to GPS for synchronising electricity grids when connecting them together. And banks and stock exchanges use the satellites for time-stamps that prevent fraud. Meanwhile, our societies' reliance on GPS navigation is growing by the year." Link (new window)

GPS is now so important to the economy that the military would not be allowed to take it back.
 
2012-02-27 10:44:46 AM

dittybopper: Charlie Freak: After rereading my post, that applies to over-land navigation. Trans-oceanic stuff would suffer a lot more.

Not really. Sure, it might increase fuel costs a little bit, as you'd have less efficient routes, and you would have a certain amount of positional error at the end of a long over-water leg, but we were regularly flying transcontinental distances before GPS. Hell, I used to catch non-stop flights from Honolulu to Chicago and vice-versa back in the mid-1980s, long before GPS entered into the civilian marketplace. That's a 4,200+ mile great circle distance, roughly half of which is over the Pacific Ocean and out of range of any NDBs or VORs.


CONUS-to-Hawaii flights used LVF Omega for highly accurate navigation starting in the early 70's. By the mid-80's flights could stay within a couple miles of their planned airway centerline, but the important thing is that they did not use great circle routes along such heavily flow corridors.

Instead of great circle routes, CONUS-to Hawaii flights followed one of several designated "airways" to avoid chance encounters of the worst kind. Your flight probably used the one which starts at the Farallon Islands off San Francisco and goes pretty much GCR from there to Honolulu. The return leg would have been offset 100 nautical miles to the south. You can see in the GCR map here that there is very little difference.

www.gcmap.com
 
2012-02-27 10:54:03 AM

StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: Charlie Freak: After rereading my post, that applies to over-land navigation. Trans-oceanic stuff would suffer a lot more.

Not really. Sure, it might increase fuel costs a little bit, as you'd have less efficient routes, and you would have a certain amount of positional error at the end of a long over-water leg, but we were regularly flying transcontinental distances before GPS. Hell, I used to catch non-stop flights from Honolulu to Chicago and vice-versa back in the mid-1980s, long before GPS entered into the civilian marketplace. That's a 4,200+ mile great circle distance, roughly half of which is over the Pacific Ocean and out of range of any NDBs or VORs.

CONUS-to-Hawaii flights used LVF Omega for highly accurate navigation starting in the early 70's. By the mid-80's flights could stay within a couple miles of their planned airway centerline, but the important thing is that they did not use great circle routes along such heavily flow corridors.

Instead of great circle routes, CONUS-to Hawaii flights followed one of several designated "airways" to avoid chance encounters of the worst kind. Your flight probably used the one which starts at the Farallon Islands off San Francisco and goes pretty much GCR from there to Honolulu. The return leg would have been offset 100 nautical miles to the south. You can see in the GCR map here that there is very little difference.

[www.gcmap.com image 640x320]


My point was, GPS wasn't available, and we seemed to do just fine.
 
2012-02-27 10:55:24 AM
I love the mindset of 'we used to do it this way, so people will be fine.' When you replace one tech with another, people adapt to the new tech and often forget the old tech entirely. How many people do you know that can use a ham radio? How many people under the age of 30 have any proficiency with a type writer?

What if email went down? Unrealistic of course, but think about how much business and information transfer takes place every day over email. The loss of which would be catastrophic in many places.

If we suddenly lost GPS, the FAA would shiat a brick and probably ground flights nationwide while they tried to figure out who they had on staff that could still operate by older tech, and I would wager that number wouldn't be very big.
 
2012-02-27 11:07:31 AM

stevetherobot: dittybopper: Virtuoso80: GPS is becoming so important to daily life - what if one day the military decides it wants to take back public access, but doing so would cause economic havoc and/or a few deaths and injuries? Kind of a problem, yes?

To the best of my knowledge, paper maps and magnetic compasses would still work, as would a sextant and an air or nautical almanac.

For well over 99% of normal civilian use, you don't really *NEED* a GPS. It's a convenience, not a necessity.

"At the Naval Medical Center, emergency pagers used for summoning doctors stopped working. Chaos threatened in the busy harbour, too, after the traffic-management system used for guiding boats failed. On the streets, people reaching for their cellphones found they had no signal and bank customers trying to withdraw cash from local ATMs were refused.
...
Why would a GPS outage cause such disruption? These satellite signals now do a lot more than inform your car's satnav. GPS has become an "invisible utility" that we rely on without realising. Cellphone companies use GPS time signals to coordinate how your phone talks to their towers. Energy suppliers turn to GPS for synchronising electricity grids when connecting them together. And banks and stock exchanges use the satellites for time-stamps that prevent fraud. Meanwhile, our societies' reliance on GPS navigation is growing by the year." Link (new window)

GPS is now so important to the economy that the military would not be allowed to take it back.


That's more an argument for *NOT* relying on it so much, and some of it is scare-mongering: "Chaos threatened in the busy harbour, too, after the traffic-management system used for guiding boats failed". I'm assuming the rules of the road still applied.
 
2012-02-27 11:21:04 AM

dittybopper: My point was, GPS wasn't available, and we seemed to do just fine.


That was then. Today Jet-A costs more than $3/gal compared to about 1/10th that in the mid-80's, and a typical 747-200 in the mid-80's consumed about 1 gal per second of flight, or about 10 gal per mile. So every extra mile it has to fly due to less precise navigation means an extra $32 in fuel cost, plus crew and maintenance costs...probably $50+ a mile. For a routine 10 hour flight (Chi-Hon) where inertial drift is 2-3 mile per hour (typical for that era in my considerable experience...often more), that's as much as 30 extra miles, or $1500 in added flight costs. Add that up over all the flights all over the world and pretty soon we're talking real money.

So no, we weren't doing "just fine" with INUs versus GPS.
 
2012-02-27 11:37:29 AM

dittybopper:

My point was, GPS wasn't available, and we seemed to do just fine.


We also once did 'just fine' without the internet. And computers. And electricity.
 
2012-02-27 11:50:07 AM

dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: Charlie Freak: After rereading my post, that applies to over-land navigation. Trans-oceanic stuff would suffer a lot more.

Not really. Sure, it might increase fuel costs a little bit, as you'd have less efficient routes, and you would have a certain amount of positional error at the end of a long over-water leg, but we were regularly flying transcontinental distances before GPS. Hell, I used to catch non-stop flights from Honolulu to Chicago and vice-versa back in the mid-1980s, long before GPS entered into the civilian marketplace. That's a 4,200+ mile great circle distance, roughly half of which is over the Pacific Ocean and out of range of any NDBs or VORs.

CONUS-to-Hawaii flights used LVF Omega for highly accurate navigation starting in the early 70's. By the mid-80's flights could stay within a couple miles of their planned airway centerline, but the important thing is that they did not use great circle routes along such heavily flow corridors.

Instead of great circle routes, CONUS-to Hawaii flights followed one of several designated "airways" to avoid chance encounters of the worst kind. Your flight probably used the one which starts at the Farallon Islands off San Francisco and goes pretty much GCR from there to Honolulu. The return leg would have been offset 100 nautical miles to the south. You can see in the GCR map here that there is very little difference.

[www.gcmap.com image 640x320]

My point was, GPS wasn't available, and we seemed to do just fine.


Point taken, but I don't think there was an argument to the contrary. Just pointing out there would be a few headaches, but yes, life would go on.
 
2012-02-27 11:59:12 AM

StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: My point was, GPS wasn't available, and we seemed to do just fine.

That was then. Today Jet-A costs more than $3/gal compared to about 1/10th that in the mid-80's, and a typical 747-200 in the mid-80's consumed about 1 gal per second of flight, or about 10 gal per mile. So every extra mile it has to fly due to less precise navigation means an extra $32 in fuel cost, plus crew and maintenance costs...probably $50+ a mile. For a routine 10 hour flight (Chi-Hon) where inertial drift is 2-3 mile per hour (typical for that era in my considerable experience...often more), that's as much as 30 extra miles, or $1500 in added flight costs. Add that up over all the flights all over the world and pretty soon we're talking real money.

So no, we weren't doing "just fine" with INUs versus GPS.


Sure we were. We just found a way to tweak it to make it 30/4200*100 = 0.7% more efficient by piggybacking on an (originally) military system.
 
2012-02-27 12:00:50 PM

MusicMakeMyHeadPound: I'm going to have that tune stuck in my head all day now. Thanks, submitter


This.
 
2012-02-27 12:20:25 PM

dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: So no, we weren't doing "just fine" with INUs versus GPS.

Sure we were. We just found a way to tweak it to make it 30/4200*100 = 0.7% more efficient by piggybacking on an (originally) military system.


Well, if you're going to diss on military origins, don't stop there. The modern jetliner itself is the direct descendent of military aircraft. As are the engines that push them through the air; communications, navigation systems, radar, etc. All of them and more.
 
2012-02-27 01:05:22 PM

StoneColdAtheist: Well, if you're going to diss on military origins, don't stop there. The modern jetliner itself is the direct descendent of military aircraft. As are the engines that push them through the air; communications, navigation systems, radar, etc. All of them and more.


It starts out with "How can we more efficiently kill people?" and ends with "Okay, we killed them, now how can we commercialize this?"

/Law of the jungle.
//Kill or be eated.
///Need moar coffee
 
2012-02-27 02:07:56 PM

StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: So no, we weren't doing "just fine" with INUs versus GPS.

Sure we were. We just found a way to tweak it to make it 30/4200*100 = 0.7% more efficient by piggybacking on an (originally) military system.

Well, if you're going to diss on military origins, don't stop there. The modern jetliner itself is the direct descendent of military aircraft. As are the engines that push them through the air; communications, navigation systems, radar, etc. All of them and more.


I'm not dissing on origin, I'm pointing out that the savings is less than a percent. Yes, it's seven tenths of one percent.

If you run a business with margins that thin, you've got bigger troubles than GPS becoming unavailable.
 
2012-02-27 04:01:47 PM
About 10 years ago, there was this company that offered to beam a transmission out towards a targeted star (Cosmic Call 2 )

Since in spite of all the many recorded/transmitted messages we've sent out there, no one has ever bothered to provide an example of the Human trait known as....humor.

So, I picked an .mp3 of Monty Python's "Galaxy Song", for it's humor and it relevance as it describes Earth's relative position in the galaxy.
 
2012-02-27 04:34:44 PM

dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: So no, we weren't doing "just fine" with INUs versus GPS.

Sure we were. We just found a way to tweak it to make it 30/4200*100 = 0.7% more efficient by piggybacking on an (originally) military system.

Well, if you're going to diss on military origins, don't stop there. The modern jetliner itself is the direct descendent of military aircraft. As are the engines that push them through the air; communications, navigation systems, radar, etc. All of them and more.

I'm not dissing on origin, I'm pointing out that the savings is less than a percent. Yes, it's seven tenths of one percent.

If you run a business with margins that thin, you've got bigger troubles than GPS becoming unavailable.


You don't know much about the airline industry, do you? The latest figures I found in a quick search show that in 2011 the airline industry as a whole managed to eek out a profit margin of just...wait for it...0.7%. (Source) In other words, the cost savings permitted by GPS over legacy navigation systems is precisely the difference between being ever-so-slightly profitable and going under.

Care to lecture us about how indoor toilets are mere nice-to-haves compared to hiking out to the back yard to shiat in a hole in the ground?
 
2012-02-27 10:32:33 PM
Subby lives at one of the poles?

/can't believe no one else noticed these shenanigans
 
2012-02-28 07:28:25 AM

StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: dittybopper: StoneColdAtheist: So no, we weren't doing "just fine" with INUs versus GPS.

Sure we were. We just found a way to tweak it to make it 30/4200*100 = 0.7% more efficient by piggybacking on an (originally) military system.

Well, if you're going to diss on military origins, don't stop there. The modern jetliner itself is the direct descendent of military aircraft. As are the engines that push them through the air; communications, navigation systems, radar, etc. All of them and more.

I'm not dissing on origin, I'm pointing out that the savings is less than a percent. Yes, it's seven tenths of one percent.

If you run a business with margins that thin, you've got bigger troubles than GPS becoming unavailable.

You don't know much about the airline industry, do you? The latest figures I found in a quick search show that in 2011 the airline industry as a whole managed to eek out a profit margin of just...wait for it...0.7%. (Source) In other words, the cost savings permitted by GPS over legacy navigation systems is precisely the difference between being ever-so-slightly profitable and going under.

Care to lecture us about how indoor toilets are mere nice-to-haves compared to hiking out to the back yard to shiat in a hole in the ground?


See the part I bolded above. If the airline industry absolutely *NEEDS* GPS to be available in order to maintain profitability, they have deeper issues.
 
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