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(JSOnline)   After itching to get his case heard, Ryan Braun found innocent in his appeal   (jsonline.com) divider line 208
    More: Followup, Ryan Braun, Michael Weiner, Major League Baseball Players Association, David Cornwell, Rob Manfred, drug tests, Brewers, Prince Fielder  
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1207 clicks; posted to Sports » on 23 Feb 2012 at 6:30 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-02-23 06:33:28 PM  
I bet he got off on a technicality. MLB put out a statement saying that they "vehemently disagree with the decision".
 
2012-02-23 06:34:18 PM  
Good for him. The whole thing sounded really fishy. Won't stop the witch hunters, though.
 
2012-02-23 06:34:56 PM  
They have to "vehemently disagree" with it. Now every player is going to expect his case to be overturned on a technicality regardless of the merits.

/very happy he was found not guilty
 
2012-02-23 06:38:13 PM  
so he has herpes?

and who is he
 
2012-02-23 06:38:15 PM  
The arbitrator sided with Braun based on chain of custody issues. Which was probably the right call; you're going to suspend someone for a third of the season, you'd better have your process down correctly.

Still...

"I am very pleased and relieved by today's decision. It is the first step in restoring my good name and reputation. We were able to get through this because I am innocent and the truth is on our side."

I'm pretty convinced that doping is systemic in baseball (as it is in many other sports), so I'm not sure if the current testing regimen is at all practical; you may just be penalizing the players too stupid to go with the latest chemists rather than actually removing performance enhancers from the game. I definitely don't think the goofy moral high-handedness should be present in these cases. But c'mon. Don't start tossing out words like "innocent" and declaring that "the truth is on your side". You got off on a technicality.
 
2012-02-23 06:41:20 PM  
"Found innocent" is overstating it. From what I'm hearing on the radio, the testing lab can't account for the sample for a two day period. The arbitrator apparently thought that was good enough to negate the test.
 
2012-02-23 06:42:10 PM  
I'm also not sure how this is getting off on a "technicality." They haven't released details yet, but it seems like the test was just faulty. That's not a "technicality," that's a complete lack of compelling evidence.
 
2012-02-23 06:42:15 PM  
Like the local Milwaukee stations are reporting, this is a huge deal here. With the loss of Prince Fielder, the Brewers don't have a face of the franchise. No matter what, Selig needs to have the small markets competitive.
 
2012-02-23 06:43:39 PM  

boxiebrown: I'm also not sure how this is getting off on a "technicality." They haven't released details yet, but it seems like the test was just faulty. That's not a "technicality," that's a complete lack of compelling evidence.


As was said, it looks like the courier took Braun's urine home for the weekend instead of dropping in the night drop box at the local FedEx/Kinko's. Which is more preferred? Dropping it where you have no idea who will pick it up or having it in your possession the whole time until you can hand it off to someone you can see?
 
2012-02-23 06:44:46 PM  

boxiebrown: I'm also not sure how this is getting off on a "technicality." They haven't released details yet, but it seems like the test was just faulty. That's not a "technicality," that's a complete lack of compelling evidence.


The ESPN article said that the courier who was to transport the test didn't immediately ship it as per protocol, but rather let it sit in his fridge over the weekend. The article also said that Braun's side didn't contest the science of the test or the result; the argument was about chain of custody.

The arbitrator made the right call. But I don't think "I'm an innocent man" is exactly warranted here.
 
2012-02-23 06:44:47 PM  
Brauns team won because a courier didn't take positive test to fed ex building thought it was closed Saturday night
 
2012-02-23 06:45:28 PM  
Sure, he got off on a technicality, but according to ESPN, this is the problem.

"According to one of the sources, the collector, after getting Braun's sample, was supposed to take the sample to FedEx/Kinkos for shipping but thought it was closed because it was late on a Saturday. As has occurred in some other instances, the collector took the sample home and kept it refrigerated. Policy states that the sample is supposed to get to FedEx as soon as possible."

I'm sorry, but MLB's drug policy is based on collectors taking the samples to Kinko's to be shipped? Seriously? The place I go to for copies of my cheesy holiday letter? And the guy was all "Oh, Kinko's is closed. I guess I'll just keep Ryan Braun's pee in my fridge until tomorrow!" Who keeps someone else's urine in their fridge at home next to the orange juice?
 
2012-02-23 06:45:35 PM  
The sample was mishandled so the test is invalid. Seems pretty straightforward to me.
 
2012-02-23 06:45:43 PM  

The_Six_Fingered_Man: boxiebrown: I'm also not sure how this is getting off on a "technicality." They haven't released details yet, but it seems like the test was just faulty. That's not a "technicality," that's a complete lack of compelling evidence.

As was said, it looks like the courier took Braun's urine home for the weekend instead of dropping in the night drop box at the local FedEx/Kinko's. Which is more preferred? Dropping it where you have no idea who will pick it up or having it in your possession the whole time until you can hand it off to someone you can see?


Because when I find a urine sample lying around, I'm sure to fill it with my ready stash of testosterone. Braun got off but it was clearly a technicality.
 
2012-02-23 06:46:28 PM  

Burn_The_Plows: Like the local Milwaukee stations are reporting, this is a huge deal here. With the loss of Prince Fielder, the Brewers don't have a face of the franchise. No matter what, Selig needs to have the small markets competitive.


Not necessarily. Braun may be the face of the team, but even without him, the Brewers still have some good players (Greinke, Gallardo, Hart, Weeks when healthy, Wolf is good, though getting old, hell, even Marcum was solid before he imploded in the playoffs)
 
2012-02-23 06:48:42 PM  
Sounds pretty bush league to keep samples that can cost a man millions of dollars next to the leftover pizza...
 
2012-02-23 06:50:51 PM  
What, does this guy know the Commissioner or something?
 
2012-02-23 06:52:33 PM  

mloree: Sounds pretty bush league to keep samples that can cost a man millions of dollars next to the leftover pizza...


The fact that the guy kept the sample next to the leftover pizza is the reason why it is not costing Braun millions of dollars. You, Brewers fan, should be thanking the "bush league" tactics of the sample dude.
 
2012-02-23 06:53:16 PM  
If I'm Braun, I'm out to sue as many people as possible. His name is totally destroyed, and now everyone is still going to call him a doper that just got off on a technicality.

I don't know much about the MLB drug testing policy, but shouldn't he have been allowed to go through the arbitration process without any of this leaking out to the public? If proper protocols were gone through, he would've won his case and none of this never would've gotten out.
 
2012-02-23 06:54:27 PM  

Cagey B: boxiebrown: I'm also not sure how this is getting off on a "technicality." They haven't released details yet, but it seems like the test was just faulty. That's not a "technicality," that's a complete lack of compelling evidence.

The ESPN article said that the courier who was to transport the test didn't immediately ship it as per protocol, but rather let it sit in his fridge over the weekend. The article also said that Braun's side didn't contest the science of the test or the result; the argument was about chain of custody.

The arbitrator made the right call. But I don't think "I'm an innocent man" is exactly warranted here.


FTFA: "Cornwell limited his comments to that and the Braun camp closely guarded its defense strategy prior to the hearing. Word leaked, however, that Cornwell would attack the test finding on several fronts, questioning the veracity of the test itself because Braun's testosterone level was more than twice as high as any previously recorded."

Am I misreading something here? The idea that it was merely chain of custody issues (which I would argue also isn't a "technicality" since it opens the possibility of the sample being compromised) seems to be just speculation. The test itself was also suspect, as many have been pointing out since the news leaked in the fall.
 
2012-02-23 06:54:53 PM  
Bottom line: MLB didn't follow their own rules, so Braun gets off.
 
2012-02-23 06:56:31 PM  

boxiebrown: Good for him. The whole thing sounded really fishy. Won't stop the witch hunters, though.


This. (And I'm a Cubs fan.) He just doesn't seem like the type to me.
 
182
2012-02-23 06:57:02 PM  

mloree: Sounds pretty bush league to keep samples that can cost a man millions of dollars next to the leftover pizza...


you should see what csi people do.
 
2012-02-23 06:57:22 PM  
I'm disappointed that this is how the case was decided. He's not innocent...it is just that he isn't guilty because chain of custody was compromised.

ESPN radio was intimating that there was a Ron Mexico situation going on, but from his statement, it looks as though he wasn't trying to argue what he had ingested.
 
2012-02-23 06:58:21 PM  
It sounds like the MLB doesn't actually believe in the neutral party system.
 
2012-02-23 06:58:34 PM  
It's not just "bush league" delivery - it is the chance the sample could be tampered with. It has happened in court cases. Suppose the courier was a big Cardinals fan?

Meanwhile, the odds of the Cubs winning the next 10 World Series in a row are better than Braun ever giving another interview to ESPN, which damaged his reputation by reporting a leaked test result that was supposed to stay secret. There's a reason it stays secret - a case like this. Normally, it isn't reported until after any appeal, and the player's name isn't dragged through the mud until the decision is final. Braun got screwed over in that regard and deserves an apology from the Worldwide Leader in Bad Journalism.

Remember kids, you can't spell "penis" without ESPN.
 
2012-02-23 07:01:17 PM  

bahamasorbust: mloree: Sounds pretty bush league to keep samples that can cost a man millions of dollars next to the leftover pizza...

The fact that the guy kept the sample next to the leftover pizza is the reason why it is not costing Braun millions of dollars. You, Brewers fan, should be thanking the "bush league" tactics of the sample dude.


Um, not a Brewers fan. I'm just stating why the finding of the arbiter is reasonable.

/Mets fan
//yes, I drink a lot
///and cry
 
2012-02-23 07:01:40 PM  

carnifex2005: I bet he got off on a technicality. MLB put out a statement saying that they "vehemently disagree with the decision".


It looks like he did, he attacked the right thing which is their testing process and how they rarely accept any reason for a failed test, its just "well you failed so you get this unpaid holiday" It seems they should be able to tell why they failed a test since substance leaves different chemical trails with different compounds.

boxiebrown: Good for him. The whole thing sounded really fishy. Won't stop the witch hunters, though.


I dont know how it sounded fishy, he failed, whats fishy about that?
 
2012-02-23 07:02:51 PM  

bulldg4life: I'm disappointed that this is how the case was decided. He's not innocent...it is just that he isn't guilty because chain of custody was compromised.

ESPN radio was intimating that there was a Ron Mexico situation going on, but from his statement, it looks as though he wasn't trying to argue what he had ingested.


Well, in that case Braun is out and Sarah Palin is president for life.

Something is really fishy about the test.

"Braun's positive test reportedly included "insanely high levels" of testosterone, by far the most ever detected in a player. He requested an independent drug test a few weeks after testing positive, which was clean, but it was not authorized nor recognized as exculpatory by MLB."
 
2012-02-23 07:03:09 PM  

boxiebrown: FTFA: "Cornwell limited his comments to that and the Braun camp closely guarded its defense strategy prior to the hearing. Word leaked, however, that Cornwell would attack the test finding on several fronts, questioning the veracity of the test itself because Braun's testosterone level was more than twice as high as any previously recorded."

Am I misreading something here? The idea that it was merely chain of custody issues (which I would argue also isn't a "technicality" since it opens the possibility of the sample being compromised) seems to be just speculation. The test itself was also suspect, as many have been pointing out since the news leaked in the fall.


Your quote appears to be from a time period prior to the hearing itself. From the same article:

Someone familiar with the decision said the appeal went Braun's way not so much on contesting the result of the test but the testing process itself. And it was arbitrator Shyam Das who decided to rule in favor on that technicality, making it a 2-1 decision by the three-man panel.

It seems to me that if it was a question of a faulty test, it would have been a slam dunk. "I took a substance for a 'private medical condition' that is not on the banned list, causing an artificially high testosterone reasing". Why wasn't that the argument?

Once again, I agree with the decision, but it seems inappropriate to be crowing about how innocent you are. I also think the idea that this is "fishy" is kind of odd. There doesn't seem to be any immediate evidence available to us that this was clearly a botched test.
 
2012-02-23 07:04:21 PM  

DrBear: It's not just "bush league" delivery - it is the chance the sample could be tampered with. It has happened in court cases. Suppose the courier was a big Cardinals fan?


There are no names on the vials so the courier would have no idea whose test that was, every drug test just uses numbers to make sure nothing gets tampered with, and name the court cases, most of the tampering is done by the cops, not the people doing the testing.

And Braun will be giving ESPN an interview before the weekend is over.
 
2012-02-23 07:04:35 PM  

steamingpile:

boxiebrown: Good for him. The whole thing sounded really fishy. Won't stop the witch hunters, though.

I dont know how it sounded fishy, he failed, whats fishy about that?


It was an unprecedented test result - more than double the testosterone than they'd ever detected before. To me, that's a red flag, especially when you know that the testing system has the potential for false positives.
 
2012-02-23 07:05:12 PM  

Cagey B: boxiebrown: FTFA: "Cornwell limited his comments to that and the Braun camp closely guarded its defense strategy prior to the hearing. Word leaked, however, that Cornwell would attack the test finding on several fronts, questioning the veracity of the test itself because Braun's testosterone level was more than twice as high as any previously recorded."

Am I misreading something here? The idea that it was merely chain of custody issues (which I would argue also isn't a "technicality" since it opens the possibility of the sample being compromised) seems to be just speculation. The test itself was also suspect, as many have been pointing out since the news leaked in the fall.

Your quote appears to be from a time period prior to the hearing itself. From the same article:

Someone familiar with the decision said the appeal went Braun's way not so much on contesting the result of the test but the testing process itself. And it was arbitrator Shyam Das who decided to rule in favor on that technicality, making it a 2-1 decision by the three-man panel.

It seems to me that if it was a question of a faulty test, it would have been a slam dunk. "I took a substance for a 'private medical condition' that is not on the banned list, causing an artificially high testosterone reasing". Why wasn't that the argument?

Once again, I agree with the decision, but it seems inappropriate to be crowing about how innocent you are. I also think the idea that this is "fishy" is kind of odd. There doesn't seem to be any immediate evidence available to us that this was clearly a botched test.


What if someone had spiked the vial while it was with the courier? Would it still be a technicality?
 
2012-02-23 07:06:59 PM  

boxiebrown: Cagey B: boxiebrown: I'm also not sure how this is getting off on a "technicality." They haven't released details yet, but it seems like the test was just faulty. That's not a "technicality," that's a complete lack of compelling evidence.

The ESPN article said that the courier who was to transport the test didn't immediately ship it as per protocol, but rather let it sit in his fridge over the weekend. The article also said that Braun's side didn't contest the science of the test or the result; the argument was about chain of custody.

The arbitrator made the right call. But I don't think "I'm an innocent man" is exactly warranted here.

FTFA: "Cornwell limited his comments to that and the Braun camp closely guarded its defense strategy prior to the hearing. Word leaked, however, that Cornwell would attack the test finding on several fronts, questioning the veracity of the test itself because Braun's testosterone level was more than twice as high as any previously recorded."

Am I misreading something here? The idea that it was merely chain of custody issues (which I would argue also isn't a "technicality" since it opens the possibility of the sample being compromised) seems to be just speculation. The test itself was also suspect, as many have been pointing out since the news leaked in the fall.


It was easier legally to contest the chain of command. The test was probably fubar but that would have been harder to prove so they didn't attack that line. That's my guess anyway.

I think ESPN leaking the test results put MLB in a real bad place - they had to know they couldn't win this but would have wanted everything kept completely quiet so nobody knew that a drug test had ever been successfully appealed. Now everyone knows it's happened. Going to put their drug testing program in a bad light.
 
2012-02-23 07:07:05 PM  

Sabyen91: "Braun's positive test reportedly included "insanely high levels" of testosterone, by far the most ever detected in a player.


This is what I want explained. What on earth causes that?
 
2012-02-23 07:08:07 PM  

Sabyen91: What if someone had spiked the vial while it was with the courier? Would it still be a technicality?


For the reasons steamingpile noted above, that seems rather unlikely. I suppose it's possible that the ghost of Macho Man Randy Savage appeared to spooge pure testosterone into Ryan Braun's labwork and falsely implicate him, but it's highly improbable. Hence "technicality".
 
2012-02-23 07:09:52 PM  

boxiebrown: It was an unprecedented test result - more than double the testosterone than they'd ever detected before. To me, that's a red flag, especially when you know that the testing system has the potential for false positives.


And? He used his injections, got surprised with a test, then used other means to get the levels lower using his own testing. Do you even know how testing procedures work?

Personally I dont think he was really juicing but I do think he was taking a banned substance to help push recovery times from games or moderate injuries, that is a bigger problem than juicing since most of the mass does nothing for most hitters.
 
2012-02-23 07:10:02 PM  
The courier in question...?

static.oprah.com

So what would have happened if the Fedex actually was closed a few hours earlier? Would the sample still have gone home with the courier and the technicality been non-existent? What's the policy when the sample can't get to Fedex that same day?
 
2012-02-23 07:10:22 PM  

Cagey B: Sabyen91: What if someone had spiked the vial while it was with the courier? Would it still be a technicality?

For the reasons steamingpile noted above, that seems rather unlikely. I suppose it's possible that the ghost of Macho Man Randy Savage appeared to spooge pure testosterone into Ryan Braun's labwork and falsely implicate him, but it's highly improbable. Hence "technicality".


The fact is anything could have happened and there is no way to know.
 
2012-02-23 07:10:29 PM  

Cagey B: boxiebrown: FTFA: "Cornwell limited his comments to that and the Braun camp closely guarded its defense strategy prior to the hearing. Word leaked, however, that Cornwell would attack the test finding on several fronts, questioning the veracity of the test itself because Braun's testosterone level was more than twice as high as any previously recorded."

Am I misreading something here? The idea that it was merely chain of custody issues (which I would argue also isn't a "technicality" since it opens the possibility of the sample being compromised) seems to be just speculation. The test itself was also suspect, as many have been pointing out since the news leaked in the fall.

Your quote appears to be from a time period prior to the hearing itself. From the same article:

Someone familiar with the decision said the appeal went Braun's way not so much on contesting the result of the test but the testing process itself. And it was arbitrator Shyam Das who decided to rule in favor on that technicality, making it a 2-1 decision by the three-man panel.

It seems to me that if it was a question of a faulty test, it would have been a slam dunk. "I took a substance for a 'private medical condition' that is not on the banned list, causing an artificially high testosterone reasing". Why wasn't that the argument?

Once again, I agree with the decision, but it seems inappropriate to be crowing about how innocent you are. I also think the idea that this is "fishy" is kind of odd. There doesn't seem to be any immediate evidence available to us that this was clearly a botched test.


First, that quote isn't especially compelling to me. For all we know, the unnamed source could be someone from MLB trying to protect their own credibility by pushing the notion that Braun got off on a "technicality." Second, even if we take that quote at face value, it doesn't mean that the panel accepted that the test results were accurate, just that they based their decision on something else.

And I say that the test result was fishy because it was a huge outlier in a case where the proper procedure wasn't followed. That's pretty much the definition of "fishy," it seems to me.

I'm a Jays fan, btw.
 
2012-02-23 07:10:47 PM  
Good, too bad MLB did not oversee the Contador case.
 
2012-02-23 07:10:48 PM  

steamingpile:
And Braun will be giving ESPN an interview before the weekend is over.


He's a more forgiving man that I would be. I'd love to see - assuming ESPN gets over its Yankees-Red Sox fellatio - ESPN covering a game at Miller Park and fans bodily throwing the crew out on their asses.
 
2012-02-23 07:10:57 PM  

bulldg4life: Sabyen91: "Braun's positive test reportedly included "insanely high levels" of testosterone, by far the most ever detected in a player.

This is what I want explained. What on earth causes that?


No one seems to know. It's worth noting that the original BALCO compounds from the Steroid Era™ didn't show up in tests and were essentially unknown agents at the time. Perhaps an enterprising, as-yet undiscovered chemist is brewing something up. But that wasn't proven, and the sample was not handled correctly, thus Ryan Braun is rightly free from penalty.
 
2012-02-23 07:11:15 PM  

boxiebrown:
It was an unprecedented test result - more than double the testosterone than they'd ever detected before. To me, that's a red flag, especially when you know that the testing system has the potential for false positives.


I thought there was a test strip: blue if you're 'roiding, pink if yer clean. What's the big debate?
 
2012-02-23 07:12:20 PM  

bulldg4life: This is what I want explained. What on earth causes that?


He injected just a few days before their test then took counteractive measures to get it down in the weeks leading up to his own test he had done.
 
2012-02-23 07:14:20 PM  

DrBear: He's a more forgiving man that I would be. I'd love to see - assuming ESPN gets over its Yankees-Red Sox fellatio - ESPN covering a game at Miller Park and fans bodily throwing the crew out on their asses.


He has no choice, as the dominate sports channel in the world who else would he appear on to plead his case?
 
2012-02-23 07:17:20 PM  
Not sure I get the herpes jokes. Does herpes give you high testosterone? Or does Valtrex or whatever one would take for it?
 
2012-02-23 07:17:50 PM  
I fully agree that if MLB didn't follow their own rules, they shouldn't punish people as a result. But it also seems like he cheated and will evade punishment not because he's innocent, but because MLB was clumsy and stupid. Not guilty != innocent.
 
2012-02-23 07:17:51 PM  

bulldg4life: Sabyen91: "Braun's positive test reportedly included "insanely high levels" of testosterone, by far the most ever detected in a player.

This is what I want explained. What on earth causes that?


I would like to hear the MLB tell us they think causes it. It sounds awfully strange.
 
2012-02-23 07:18:04 PM  

pdieten:

It was easier legally to contest the chain of command. The test was probably fubar but that would have been harder to prove so they didn't attack that line. That's my guess anyway..


This is what I think happened, too.

steamingpile: boxiebrown: It was an unprecedented test result - more than double the testosterone than they'd ever detected before. To me, that's a red flag, especially when you know that the testing system has the potential for false positives.

And? He used his injections, got surprised with a test, then used other means to get the levels lower using his own testing. Do you even know how testing procedures work?


You don't understand - it wasn't two times the testosterone that had ever been detected in Braun's system, it was two times the testosterone that had ever been detected in any positive test. That's what makes the result seem sketchy.
 
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