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(YouTube)   DEFCON presenter walks through a presentation on why to not buy stolen computer goods, with some epic pwnage of "a man so incompetent that he misspells his own name on Facebook"   (youtube.com ) divider line
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5519 clicks; posted to Video » on 23 Feb 2012 at 6:08 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-02-23 04:54:41 PM  
Old news is old yet funny
 
2012-02-23 05:14:54 PM  
That reminds me I need to put some phone-home stuff on my laptop...
 
2012-02-23 06:21:27 PM  
DEFCON presenter walks through a presentation on why to not buy

Ehhhh?
 
2012-02-23 06:37:32 PM  
Hey smug macboy douchebag- maybe the guy just got a good deal on a used laptop. Good on you for tracking your crap down and sleuthing the whole thing out but ridiculing him publicly is kinda overkill. He may be dumb but he also may be really nice. You may be smart but you're a dick.
 
2012-02-23 06:53:43 PM  

redsquid: Hey smug macboy douchebag- maybe the guy just got a good deal on a used laptop. Good on you for tracking your crap down and sleuthing the whole thing out but ridiculing him publicly is kinda overkill. He may be dumb but he also may be really nice. You may be smart but you're a dick.


Melvin is that you???
 
2012-02-23 06:58:09 PM  

redsquid: Hey smug macboy douchebag- maybe the guy just got a good deal on a used laptop. Good on you for tracking your crap down and sleuthing the whole thing out but ridiculing him publicly is kinda overkill. He may be dumb but he also may be really nice. You may be smart but you're a dick.


THIS
 
2012-02-23 07:08:22 PM  
t0.gstatic.com
cwean out you mous, you dont swound cool
 
2012-02-23 07:50:50 PM  
"mac-oss" ? FAIL.
 
2012-02-23 07:51:12 PM  

redsquid: Hey smug macboy douchebag- maybe the guy just got a good deal on a used laptop. Good on you for tracking your crap down and sleuthing the whole thing out but ridiculing him publicly is kinda overkill. He may be dumb but he also may be really nice. You may be smart but you're a dick.


...and another thing, why didn't smug macboy douchebag have a password on his user account? Clearly the new owner didn't create a separate user since he was using the same password keyring.

They let anyone speak at Defcon these days.
 
2012-02-23 07:59:59 PM  
3rd generation copy.... Not just 'edited for time', but 'edited for time after being lifted from liveleak who lifted it from youtube in the first place'

Good grief subby, post the original....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4oB28ksiIo

Sure its 22 minutes, but at least you get the backstory...
 
2012-02-23 08:31:17 PM  
Yeah, given the limited information (possibly because this is an abbreviated version of the video) the guy's only guilty of possessing stolen property. He could've come by it perfectly innocently.
As amusing as this was, it's a douche move to do publicly unless they nailed him for the actual theft.
 
2012-02-23 08:45:24 PM  
All I saw was the sort of wire tapping that LEO's need a judge to sign off on.
I wonder who is "saving their passwords" on dweeby's "keychain" right now.
 
2012-02-23 09:12:19 PM  

FourBlackBars: All I saw was the sort of wire tapping that LEO's need a judge to sign off on


He's doing it with his own property, so no crime.
 
2012-02-23 09:17:17 PM  

J. Frank Parnell: FourBlackBars: All I saw was the sort of wire tapping that LEO's need a judge to sign off on

He's doing it with his own property, so no crime.


Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.
 
2012-02-23 09:29:21 PM  

redsquid: Hey smug macboy douchebag- maybe the guy just got a good deal on a stolen laptop. Good on you for tracking your crap down and sleuthing the whole thing out but ridiculing him publicly is kinda overkill. He may be dumb but he also may be really nice. You may be smart but you're a dick.


Yer dum
 
2012-02-23 09:35:38 PM  
That really was annoying.
 
2012-02-23 09:39:54 PM  
I really doubt that he took possession of the laptop innocently considering it was full of some other guy's data. Who would buy a used computer filled with someone else's personal information that you can't even remove because you don't have the administrator password? Even an idiot would know he got a stolen computer. And I would be angry at the guy who bought it just as much as the guy who stole it.

Melvin is not well-meaning.
 
2012-02-23 09:48:39 PM  
FileVault, how does it work? If you are going to be cool at DEFCON, do you really do a presentation showing how little you protect your data?
 
2012-02-23 10:10:43 PM  
However in the right the presenter may be, the self satisfied smug douchebaggery practically rolls off of him in waves.
 
2012-02-23 10:26:32 PM  

Doctor Funfrock: I really doubt that he took possession of the laptop innocently considering it was full of some other guy's data. Who would buy a used computer filled with someone else's personal information that you can't even remove because you don't have the administrator password? Even an idiot would know he got a stolen computer. And I would be angry at the guy who bought it just as much as the guy who stole it.

Melvin is not well-meaning.


This. So much of this.
 
2012-02-23 10:29:37 PM  
It was more like "fark you, you have my shiate, I don't care why, tell the cops your story"...the rest is showmanship, nerdgasm at pwning the guy so hard, and that accent. Especially the accent. You yanks hate those as much as your beloved hipsters.
 
2012-02-23 10:54:55 PM  

FourBlackBars: J. Frank Parnell: FourBlackBars: All I saw was the sort of wire tapping that LEO's need a judge to sign off on

He's doing it with his own property, so no crime.

Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.


You take someone else's property, there isn't much sympathy. He didn't have to hack back into the box, pretty much all the software was installed already (minus the key logger) and one could legally argue that he was simply using his property.

Even installing the key logger, since he didn't have to break in to do it, could be argued away.

Them's the breaks when you receive stolen property, even unknowingly.
 
2012-02-23 11:03:01 PM  

boobsrgood: It was more like "fark you, you have my shiate, I don't care why, tell the cops your story"...the rest is showmanship, nerdgasm at pwning the guy so hard, and that accent. Especially the accent. You yanks hate those as much as your beloved hipsters.


Oh yeah, well if you are so smart, how come you think we LIKE hipsters?
/glares
 
2012-02-23 11:21:13 PM  

Winktologist: Oh yeah, well if you are so smart, how come you think we LIKE hipsters?


Americans can be talked into anything, especially when it involves hatred.
 
2012-02-23 11:32:54 PM  

boobsrgood: Winktologist: Oh yeah, well if you are so smart, how come you think we LIKE hipsters?

Americans can be talked into anything, especially when it involves hatred.


Wow.
Incidentally, what was that horrible accent? I hated it.
 
2012-02-23 11:56:15 PM  
images.sodahead.com
 
2012-02-23 11:58:30 PM  

FourBlackBars: ...using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping.


Then couldn't I steal an iPhone and sue the owner for using Find My iPhone to track me down?

Besides, what he's doing seems far from wiretapping. It's his computer -- and he already has all the passwords for it because the thief wasn't smart enough to reinstall OS X. And remember that school district that installed webcam monitoring software on their students laptops? Even in that case, no criminal charges were filed.
 
2012-02-24 12:04:12 AM  
Question: If Melvin did not have the admin password, how could he log in and use the computer?

Answer: ??? I know Macs rarely need to be shut down or restarted but you would think Mr. Nerd would set up something where it locks up when it has been idle too long? I know some people are lax and do not bother but it seems pretty necessary for a laptop that anyone could swipe while you have it open somewhere. Also, based on Melvin's lack of computer knowledge you would think he would probably shut it down at some point, or let the battery die, or restart it.
 
2012-02-24 02:16:28 AM  

ActionJoe: Answer: ??? I know Macs rarely need to be shut down or restarted but you would think Mr. Nerd would set up something where it locks up when it has been idle too long? I know some people are lax and do not bother but it seems pretty necessary for a laptop that anyone could swipe while you have it open somewhere. Also, based on Melvin's lack of computer knowledge you would think he would probably shut it down at some point, or let the battery die, or restart it.


Ah'yup
 
2012-02-24 02:17:56 AM  

FourBlackBars: Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.


it was his property and he had the administrator password - no violation of the computer fraud and abuse act. he was well within his rights - even if someone else was unlawfully in possession of his property.
 
2012-02-24 03:53:32 AM  

haemaker: ActionJoe: Answer: ??? I know Macs rarely need to be shut down or restarted but you would think Mr. Nerd would set up something where it locks up when it has been idle too long? I know some people are lax and do not bother but it seems pretty necessary for a laptop that anyone could swipe while you have it open somewhere. Also, based on Melvin's lack of computer knowledge you would think he would probably shut it down at some point, or let the battery die, or restart it.

Ah'yup


If subby had bothered to post the full version of the video, you would have learned that this was a G5 tower, and not a laptop.
He also goes into detail at the end of the video, about how the lack of password protection was what ultimately allowed him to recover his machine.
If he had fully locked it down, the only way to make it operable again would be to reformat it, and then it would have been lost forever.
 
2012-02-24 03:58:56 AM  

Kazan: FourBlackBars: Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.

it was his property and he had the administrator password - no violation of the computer fraud and abuse act. he was well within his rights - even if someone else was unlawfully in possession of his property.


He was electronically monitoring someones private transmissions without their permission, across state lines no less, otherwise known as illegal wiretapping. Installing, monitoring, and gathering private, non employee, data via a key logger is wiretapping in one of its simplest digital forms in most states and it doesnt matter the providence of the machine involved.

I dont know think law enforcement is going to make this guy a priority but just like the uncountable number of property crimes teens love to post on youtube the result little legal actions, this is flaunting a criminal activity.

If I, and probably you too, bought a second hand computer and then found out that the previous owner had been watching what we were doing and compiling a date profile, you know sure as hell the cops would get involved on our behalf pretty quick.


Relevant Law:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1030

Interesting reading:

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/dec/16/local/me-pellicano16
 
2012-02-24 06:55:55 AM  
So, what I'm curious about and after watching the full clip that shows the lead in and how its a tower, with a static IPv4 setup meant for a typical home router...is how he managed to SSH back into his box two years later. Not a giant coincidence that the perp's router happened to use 192.168.1 as its subnet...but its a very big coincidence that it was also setup to forward SSH traffic to this box where all the fun happened. The alternative is that it was reconfigured to use dial-up with some sort of modem...but that'd mean the new owner had sudo abilities...and that kind of defeats the rest of the story.

Something smells fishy in Austria for sure.
 
2012-02-24 07:45:35 AM  
this was just as entertaining last year.
 
2012-02-24 08:05:45 AM  
Is there a way to do the same with Ipod classics? Grumble Grumble, someone stole mine. I think i know who it is, but have no proof.
 
2012-02-24 08:07:32 AM  

FourBlackBars: Kazan: FourBlackBars: Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.

it was his property and he had the administrator password - no violation of the computer fraud and abuse act. he was well within his rights - even if someone else was unlawfully in possession of his property.

He was electronically monitoring someones private transmissions without their permission, across state lines no less, otherwise known as illegal wiretapping. Installing, monitoring, and gathering private, non employee, data via a key logger is wiretapping in one of its simplest digital forms in most states and it doesnt matter the providence of the machine involved.

I dont know think law enforcement is going to make this guy a priority but just like the uncountable number of property crimes teens love to post on youtube the result little legal actions, this is flaunting a criminal activity.

If I, and probably you too, bought a second hand computer and then found out that the previous owner had been watching what we were doing and compiling a date profile, you know sure as hell the cops would get involved on our behalf pretty quick.


Relevant Law:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1030

Interesting reading:

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/dec/16/local/me-pellicano16


The nerd had software installed on his computer and he used it. He didn't secretly install this stuff on a random computer, and he didn't give an infected computer to a random person. That persons transmissions were being sent from the nerd's computer, the nerd owns that computer, and therefore he owns everything on that computer, including the transmissions.

That's enough to rule it completely legal in my opinion.
 
2012-02-24 09:31:43 AM  
The original:

https://media.defcon.org/dc-18/video/DEF%20CON%2018%20Hacking%20Confe r ence%20Presentation%20By%20-%20Zoz%20-%20Pwned%20By%20The%20Owner%20-% 20Video.m4v
 
2012-02-24 09:39:33 AM  
Sorry about sharing the sh*ttified version of the video, folks, but had I researched and posted the full-length, 22-minute version half of the 10 comments would be TL;DW. That does explain why the video was of such low res. Either way: bite my shiny, metal green light! 2nd one today!
(also, 2nd one this month, quarter, year...)

mr lawson: DEFCON presenter walks through a presentation on why to not buy

Ehhhh?


I'm figuring this mouth breather didn't hustle this computer from Boston to Vegas... I was thinking he probably got it "off a truck" or maybe from a ne'er-do-well friend and blithely ignored that this was clearly someone's in-use computer. He got what he had coming to him.

So he either stole it or accepted obviously stolen computer equipment.
 
2012-02-24 10:07:24 AM  

Tehrasha: Good grief subby, post the original....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4oB28ksiIo


I liked everything that was cut out... "nuke from orbit" approach LMAO.
 
2012-02-24 10:33:35 AM  

Mattyb710: FourBlackBars: ...

The nerd had software installed on his computer and he used it. He didn't secretly install this stuff on a random computer, and he didn't give an infected computer to a random person. That persons transmissions were being sent from the nerd's computer, the nerd owns that computer, and therefore he owns everything on that computer, including the transmissions.

That's enough to rule it completely legal in my opinion.


that that is EXACTLY the case

FourBlackBars you have unlimited legal right to to install spyware ON A COMPUTER YOU OWN - even if someone else is unlawfully in possession of it.
 
2012-02-24 11:04:08 AM  

Little_Dictator: However in the right the presenter may be, the self satisfied smug douchebaggery practically rolls off of him in waves.


It is unavoidable with computer geeks. We know we are better than normal people and after awhile pretending like we aren't just becomes too much of a bother.
 
2012-02-24 02:22:45 PM  

Mattyb710, Kazan: FourBlackBars: Kazan: FourBlackBars: Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.


The nerd had software installed on his computer and he used it. He didn't secretly install this stuff on a random computer, and he didn't give an infected computer to a random person. That persons transmissions were being sent from the nerd's computer, the nerd owns that computer, and therefore he owns everything on that computer, including the transmissions.

That's enough to rule it completely legal in my opinion.


Your state would probably disagree with your opinion and the federal law certainly seems to. In the case below, a person monitoring the actives of a another on a computer the first party owned was found in violation of the Electronic Communications Privacy Act.

Thats right: the legal owner of the computer installed software on computer they owned and then monitored the activities of another and got their ass kicked for it.

So in this video, Guzman may have committed a crime as he clearly had a stolen computer and who knows how he got it, but Dweeby certainly committed a crime when he accessed Guzmans info and the brazenly showed all the evidence of his electronic crimes to everyone on the internet.

Just like all those punks who flash wads of cash into a webcam while screaming how gangsta they are. Oh stupid criminals, when will you ever learn?

http://www.sanantonioemploymentlawblog.com/tags/brahmana-v-lembo/


Background on the ECPA:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Communications_Privacy_Act

http://blog.internetcases.com/2009/06/15/scope-of-electronic-communic a tions-privacy-act-may-not-be-so-narrow/
 
2012-02-24 02:38:47 PM  

jst3p: It is unavoidable with computer geeks. We know we are better than normal people and after awhile pretending like we aren't just becomes too much of a bother.


This is common with most techie folks; Navy nukes are notoriously weakness-devouring for example. It is entirely appropriate in the correct situation, but the wise geek remembers to shut that valve prior to interacting with the GF or wife. Women don't appreciate the biting sarcasm the same way that engineers do.
 
2012-02-24 02:56:53 PM  

FourBlackBars: Thats right: the legal owner of the computer installed software on computer they owned and then monitored the activities of another and got their ass kicked for it.


I may not be a law talking guy but in that case the victim was an employee with permission to use the computer. I think the expectation of privacy might be different on a stolen computer.
 
2012-02-24 04:24:06 PM  

jst3p: FourBlackBars: Thats right: the legal owner of the computer installed software on computer they owned and then monitored the activities of another and got their ass kicked for it.

I may not be a law talking guy but in that case the victim was an employee with permission to use the computer. I think the expectation of privacy might be different on a stolen computer.


I talked to a few IT security pros today about this and their opinion was that when he used the guys credentials to access his info (paypal, ebay, cc's) he had crossed the line into illegality. The also made a point to note that even though the mac was stolen, that didnt give the owner a free pass for identity theft. One said "If someone hits you in the head, you dont get to steal their wallet. A crime is a crime".

Both noted that dweeby would probably be a low law enforcement priority but that he definitely did something that crossed the line.
 
2012-02-24 07:18:02 PM  

Tehrasha: If subby had bothered to post the full version of the video, you would have learned that this was a G5 tower, and not a laptop.
He also goes into detail at the end of the video, about how the lack of password protection was what ultimately allowed him to recover his machine.
If he had fully locked it down, the only way to make it operable again would be to reformat it, and then it would have been lost forever.


Which is an INCREDIBLY LAME concept. Most people have information on their computers far more valuable than their computer. You can KEEP my computer if you steal it, it is nothing compared to the data contained therein.
 
2012-02-24 08:27:50 PM  
never pronounce the p in pwned. it makes you look like a "nub" (rhymes with tub)
 
2012-02-25 11:57:13 PM  

mr lawson: DEFCON presenter walks through a presentation on why to not buy

Ehhhh?


The guy who's getting pwned is probably not the thief. He probably bought it as a black market item.

redsquid: Hey smug macboy douchebag- maybe the guy just got a good deal on a used laptop. Good on you for tracking your crap down and sleuthing the whole thing out but ridiculing him publicly is kinda overkill. He may be dumb but he also may be really nice. You may be smart but you're a dick.


Melvin! Hey, how's that big black booty, bro!

Procedural Texture: the guy's only guilty of possessing stolen property. He could've come by it perfectly innocently.


Even assuming that might be true, when you open up a computer and it's filled with someone else's stuff, you know it's stolen. If you decide to keep using it anyway, and change nothing, you deserve whatever else follows.

FourBlackBars: All I saw was the sort of wire tapping that LEO's need a judge to sign off on.


You need permission to hack someone *else's* computer. This one is his own. And he's not 'wiretapping,' which is a telephony offence. He's legally accessing his own computer through the Internet whenever the creep goes online with it.

haemaker: why didn't smug macboy douchebag have a password on his user account?


In the full story, which this video doesn't show, he had it set to autoboot into his user account. So the guy never had to enter a password to use it.

FourBlackBars: J. Frank Parnell: FourBlackBars: All I saw was the sort of wire tapping that LEO's need a judge to sign off on

He's doing it with his own property, so no crime.

Looks like he accessed a bunch of information that wasnt his, the credit cards and such, and using your stolen computer to wiretap is still wiretapping. This video is the nerd equivalent of kids taping themselves smashing mail boxes.


No, he's not. He's using the data on the computer itself. He rightfully owns anything on the machine, even other people's data. If you leave anything in a stolen car, it becomes the owner's properly upon repossession of the car. When you steal something, you don't have rights over that property, or your use of it, similar to those of the rightful owner.

Little_Dictator: However in the right the presenter may be, the self satisfied smug douchebaggery practically rolls off of him in waves.


Yeah, and I think he's earned it.

FourBlackBars: the case below


These links you provide, I do not believe they mean what you think they do. (And one of them doesn't work, but I found the right page anyway.)

FourBlackBars: I talked to a few IT security pros today about this and their opinion was that when he used the guys credentials to access his info (paypal, ebay, cc's) he had crossed the line into illegality. The also made a point to note that even though the mac was stolen, that didnt give the owner a free pass for identity theft. One said "If someone hits you in the head, you dont get to steal their wallet. A crime is a crime".


I'm not sure the video provides evidence of that. He looked at PayPal and CC receipts stored on the computer, it looked like to me. Fair game, if so. And anyone can look up anyone's eBay or Facebook profile. If the guy left that info on the machine, also fair game. I'd have to watch it again, but are you sure he actually signed in and accessed those remote resources?
 
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