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(The Nation)   Republican panelists at the House contraception hearing were all men. Some women seem to have a problem with this   (thenation.com) divider line 474
    More: Fail, Elijah Cummings, contraceptives, rights of women, Catholic bishop  
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3799 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Feb 2012 at 1:36 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-02-16 04:36:33 PM

Garet Garrett: Carolyn Maloney and Eleanor Holmes Norton) to protest the absence of women on the panel, in doing so, managed to miss the two women on the second panel, including a medical doctor.


Its funny because Elanor Holmes Norton doesn't get to vote. She's not a Member of Congress.
 
2012-02-16 04:36:36 PM

Garet Garrett: Thus a religious organization, here the Sisters of Life, which is consecrated to the task of building a culture of life (as they see it - knowing that you might reject that, but we're talking about privately-held religious beliefs here), would have to pay for contraception and abortion-inducing drugs.

The example I like is this. Let's mandate the consumption of bacon because, as we all know, it's the single greatest edible substance ever, capable of curing everything from hangovers to leprosy. Then, when Jews and Muslims object, let's pillory them for wanting to ban bacon and denying their members the right to eat what they want.


Wow. So much dumb.
 
2012-02-16 04:37:12 PM

Knara: Well, it runs along the same sort of "naive advice" lines as when you dance you should leave space between you for an angel/Jesus/whatever


Q. Why don't Baptists have sex standing up?
A. So God won't think they're dancing.
 
2012-02-16 04:37:26 PM

Mike Chewbacca: What's the moral difference between:

1. Directly paying for a woman's birth control by funding her insurance.

and

2. Indirectly paying for a woman's birth control by not funding her insurance but making her buy it on the side with the money you paid her.

It's okay if you're indirectly paying for birth control?


Your first example is actually more indirect than the second, in that it introduces a middleman. The religious-affiliated business pays for an insurance policy. The business does not pay for individual claims or services - in fact thanks to confidentiality your employer cannot learn what benefits you draw from the policy. The insurance company pays for services, in this case the insurance company pays the pharmacist for the birth control.
 
2012-02-16 04:37:28 PM

2wolves: culebra:
Thou art God. Everything that groks is God.


Thanks, I do think I'll have some water.
 
2012-02-16 04:37:46 PM

Garet Garrett: unexplained bacon: Philip Francis Queeg: Do you understand how insurance premiums work? Are you under the impression that the premiums the Sisters pay only fund the healthcare that they and their employees receive?

THIS!

I wouldn't have bothered responding to PFQ's comment except that someone chimed in to suggest that it had merit. Yes, I do understand, at least well enough for this.

1. You and I belong are among a group of people who pay money to a health insurer, along with our employers.
2. The insurer conflates the money. It doesn't care "whose" dollar is "whose."
3. Some of the dollars are used for some purposes, some others.
4. Some fraction of my money is used to pay for your erectile dysfunction medication, some fraction of your money goes to pay for my migraine medication that I have to take after a bout of Fark politicking.
5. In like fashion, some portion of the Sisters' premiums are allocable to the birth control methods used by others at the expense of the insurance plan.

QED. And under the HHS rule (actual or as proposed by the President), that (meaning the undifferentiated source of the funding) has to be the case, because there can't be a separate charge for the birth control benefits.


So you believe that the Sisters have a right to dictate what is covered by every plan that insurance company issues, not just their own?
 
2012-02-16 04:38:02 PM

Poison Appleseeds: fracto73: Poison Appleseeds: All the religious groups are including abortion-inducing drugs and sterilization along with contraception in describing the mandate to their followers. Can anyone point out a good, neutral source that proves or disproves this? Google has failed me. Is the language of the mandate even officially written yet?


My understanding is that the ACA requires preventative care be covered with no copay. The mandate is just classification of birth control as preventative. This could be wrong however, as I don't have a GED in law.

What I meant was, would abortion-inducing drugs and sterilization be covered as well in addition to contraception under this mandate? I can't find a clear answer.



According to Garet's link, No. Only contraceptives.
 
2012-02-16 04:38:08 PM
Obama beat McCain 58-43 in with women in 2008. Apparently the GOP thinks 43% was too high.
 
2012-02-16 04:38:38 PM

macil22: I don't see why this is being made into a religious rights issue. I disagree with the feds even having the authority to force insurance companies to cover contraception. If women want contraception covered then they can take their business to companies who will offer it.

Why can't women be expected to buy their own birth control anyways?


Why can't men be expected to buy their own Viagra?
 
2012-02-16 04:39:23 PM

Garet Garrett: QED. And under the HHS rule (actual or as proposed by the President), that (meaning the undifferentiated source of the funding) has to be the case, because there can't be a separate charge for the birth control benefits.


My religion says I'm not allowed to pay for boner pills for old guys. Where do I sign up for my exemption?
 
2012-02-16 04:39:40 PM

LMark: yert I am a Quaker. I am religious against war. I should not have to pay the portion of my taxes that go toward war.

I am a Christian Scientist I should not have to pay the portion of my taxes that goes toward medicine or medical research. I should not have to pay medicare. I should not have to pay it for my employees either.

I am a Rastafarian I should not have to pay the portion of taxes that goes toward marijuana law enforcement.

I am a druid I should not have to pay the portion of taxes that goes towards forest service logging operations.

I am a Hindu I should not have to pay the portion of my taxes that goes towards cattle grazing on public land. Or research grant for animal husbandry.

I see how this could get out of hand.

I am a Jew. I should not have to pay the portion of my taxes that goes towards subsidies for hog farmers.


but everyone that works for you must be circumcised.
/snark
 
2012-02-16 04:40:15 PM

Garet Garrett: unexplained bacon: Philip Francis Queeg: Do you understand how insurance premiums work? Are you under the impression that the premiums the Sisters pay only fund the healthcare that they and their employees receive?

THIS!

I wouldn't have bothered responding to PFQ's comment except that someone chimed in to suggest that it had merit. Yes, I do understand, at least well enough for this.

1. You and I belong are among a group of people who pay money to a health insurer, along with our employers.
2. The insurer conflates the money. It doesn't care "whose" dollar is "whose."
3. Some of the dollars are used for some purposes, some others.
4. Some fraction of my money is used to pay for your erectile dysfunction medication, some fraction of your money goes to pay for my migraine medication that I have to take after a bout of Fark politicking.
5. In like fashion, some portion of the Sisters' premiums are allocable to the birth control methods used by others at the expense of the insurance plan.

QED. And under the HHS rule (actual or as proposed by the President), that (meaning the undifferentiated source of the funding) has to be the case, because there can't be a separate charge for the birth control benefits.




pretty sure the point was that the pool of money is filled with money from all the people they insure, not just the people from one particular company...so even if these religious fanatics get their way they'll still be putting money into a pool that pays out for BC. Just not BC for one of their employees.

sooo, if they're involved with an insurance company that pays out for BC at all they are funding BC...if you really want to get down to it.

/am I missing something here
//could be
 
2012-02-16 04:40:17 PM

Poison Appleseeds: fracto73: Poison Appleseeds: All the religious groups are including abortion-inducing drugs and sterilization along with contraception in describing the mandate to their followers. Can anyone point out a good, neutral source that proves or disproves this? Google has failed me. Is the language of the mandate even officially written yet?


My understanding is that the ACA requires preventative care be covered with no copay. The mandate is just classification of birth control as preventative. This could be wrong however, as I don't have a GED in law.

What I meant was, would abortion-inducing drugs and sterilization be covered as well in addition to contraception under this mandate? I can't find a clear answer.


Finally found a decent article about this

http://www.justfactsdaily.com/is-the-obama-administration-forcing-pe op le-to-pay-for-abortion-inducing-drugs (new window)

By James D. Agresti
February 7, 2012
Revised 2/9/12

The 2010 Affordable Care Act (a.k.a. Obamacare) gives presidential appointees at least 40 regulatory powers that have the force of law. Kathleen Sebelius, President Obama's Secretary of Health and Human Services, recently exercised one of these powers by mandating that "most new and renewed health plans" are required to cover without cost sharing "all FDA-approved forms of contraception" by August 1st of this year.

This mandate exempts "certain religious organizations" but not others "who, based on religious beliefs, do not currently provide contraceptive coverage in their insurance plan." This means that faith-based universities, hospitals, and charities are not exempt from the mandate, but if they are nonprofits, they are "provided an additional year, until August 1, 2013, to comply with the new law."

Secretary Sebelius claims in a USA Today op-ed that this mandate will make contraception "free for most Americans with insurance," but this use of the word "free" is misleading. Someone has to pay, and when government requires insurers to provide a certain benefit, all of the insured are forced to pay for it through their insurance premiums.

Some journalists, such as Robert Pear of the New York Times, reported on this mandate without mentioning the word "abortion, while in contrast, the Washington Times ran a headline declaring that "Insurers must cover abortion pill." Meanwhile, a White House correspondent has accused columnist George Will and others of repeating "the lie" that the Obama administration's mandate will force religious employers to "provide...abortion-inducing drugs." So, what are the facts?

"FDA-approved forms of contraception" include the morning-after pill, also known by brand names such as Plan B One-Step (Barr Pharmaceuticals), Next Choice (Watson Pharmaceuticals), and ella (Watson Pharmaceuticals). The FDA's "Birth Control Guide" states that such pills function by stopping "the ovaries from releasing an egg" or stopping "sperm from joining with the egg."

However, the FDA neglects to mention in this guide that the morning-after pill can also "keep a fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus," as detailed by the Mayo Clinic. The official company websites for Plan B One-Step, Next Choice, and ella all confirm that this is the case, which implicates the issue of abortion because at fertilization, the genetic composition of preborn humans is formed. This genetic information determines gender, eye color, hair color, facial features, and influences characteristics such as intelligence and personality. Thus, morning-after pills can terminate a unique human life.

However, the start of pregnancy is typically defined in one of two ways: either fertilization (when sperm unites with egg) or implantation (when the fertilized egg implants in the uterus). Medical literature abounds with the use of both definitions, and as explained in the Encyclopedia of Birth Control:

Abortifacients, whether chemicals or objects, cause abortions, the termination of a pregnancy. However, because the definition of pregnancy varies, opinions vary greatly over just which contraceptives or fertility control methods involves abortifacients.

Therefore, how one defines the start of a pregnancy determines whether or not the Obama administration is forcing people to pay for abortion-inducing drugs. Much of the controversy over this mandate is centered around institutions such as Catholic hospitals and universities that provide health insurance to employees. These organizations will be compelled to provide drugs and services that violate core Catholic beliefs, or they can stop providing health insurance to their employees and pay the requisite fines mandated under Obamacare.

This mandate will also impact most individuals with health insurance that does not already cover such items. Twenty-eight states already mandate such coverage with varying religious exemptions, but even in such states, the Obama administration takes this a step further by requiring that no copayments are charged for these items. This means that many insured persons will have to pay for (or pay more for) items that they consider to be abortifacients.
 
2012-02-16 04:40:27 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Obama beat McCain 58-43 in with women in 2008. Apparently the GOP thinks 43% was too high.


The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on Mexicans.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on women.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on the elderly.

It's like the GOP is intentionally catering to the most backwards, bigoted group of people in our country.
 
2012-02-16 04:41:08 PM

Philip Francis Queeg: So you believe that the Sisters have a right to dictate what is covered by every plan that insurance company issues, not just their own?


Yes because Jesus. And socalesm.
 
2012-02-16 04:42:13 PM

Headso: Why would you be a republican if you were a woman, that is your first problem.


So you can hunt wolves from a helicopter and drink bleach and arm yourself with arms and be free without the govment tellin' ya you have to go to an Obama Death Camp, doncha know?
 
2012-02-16 04:43:11 PM
dunedinschool.files.wordpress.com
 
2012-02-16 04:43:43 PM

Mike Chewbacca: The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on Mexicans.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on women.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on the elderly.

It's like the GOP is intentionally catering to the most backwards, bigoted group of people in our country.


They're going to go down hard.

And that was 56-43. My mistake.
 
2012-02-16 04:44:46 PM

colon_pow: I don't. and you derped out my explanation. (which was a bit insulting, by the way) buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.


i43.photobucket.com


Dude, you're good. That's the best thing I've read yet.
 
2012-02-16 04:45:24 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Mike Chewbacca: The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on Mexicans.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on women.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on the elderly.

It's like the GOP is intentionally catering to the most backwards, bigoted group of people in our country.

They're going to go down hard.

And that was 56-43. My mistake.


Yes. And I should mention that the group they're catering to is shrinking. They're essentially catering to a dying demographic and telling everyone else, "We don't want your kind here" and so "those kinds" go join the Democrats.
 
2012-02-16 04:48:21 PM

Garet Garrett: Let's mandate the consumption of bacon because, as we all know, it's the single greatest edible substance ever, capable of curing everything from hangovers to leprosy.


Do they teach you this shiat in Derp School? Seriously, you turn requiring insurance companies to offer contraceptives to eligible employees to mandating consumption of a particular food?

You try my patience. At least find a workable analogy.
 
2012-02-16 04:48:55 PM

Dusk-You-n-Me: Obama beat McCain 58-43 in with women in 2008. Apparently the GOP thinks 43% was too high.


It boggles the mind that they are doubling down on contraception, of all things. The only reason I can think of, aside from being completely clueless and/or pure evil, is that they've already given up on 2012. They know their likely candidates are terrible jokes, and they know there's a limit to what they can do to stall the economy until the election. So they're just gonna hit back hard with the tried-and-true social issues and try to keep the base interested until next time around.
 
2012-02-16 04:49:50 PM

colon_pow: buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.


how so?

how is it any different than any other prescription pill?

where did you even get that idea? got a link or something?
 
2012-02-16 04:50:03 PM

Mike Chewbacca: Dusk-You-n-Me: Obama beat McCain 58-43 in with women in 2008. Apparently the GOP thinks 43% was too high.

The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on Mexicans.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on women.
The GOP would have a huge group of conservative people voting for them, if only they'd stop picking on the elderly.

It's like the GOP is intentionally catering to the most backwards, bigoted group of people in our country.


Just wait til they start picking on elderly Mexican women.
 
2012-02-16 04:52:02 PM

unexplained bacon: colon_pow: buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.

how so?

how is it any different than any other prescription pill?

where did you even get that idea? got a link or something?


On Facebook this week, some dumbfark friend-of-a-friend said that the pill was a female hygiene tool. I politely but firmly informed him that a douche is an over the counter female hygiene tool, and that the pill was a hormone therapy regimen that can only be prescribed by a doctor. Also, I informed him that he has no idea what the pill is or does. Strangely, he didn't post again.
 
2012-02-16 04:53:36 PM

unexplained bacon: colon_pow: buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.

how so?

how is it any different than any other prescription pill?

where did you even get that idea? got a link or something?


Let's start him out small. Like explaining the differences between the warranties on studded snow tires and all-weather road tires. Then we can move on to prescription coverage.
 
2012-02-16 04:53:53 PM

someonelse: Dusk-You-n-Me: Obama beat McCain 58-43 in with women in 2008. Apparently the GOP thinks 43% was too high.

It boggles the mind that they are doubling down on contraception, of all things. The only reason I can think of, aside from being completely clueless and/or pure evil, is that they've already given up on 2012. They know their likely candidates are terrible jokes, and they know there's a limit to what they can do to stall the economy until the election. So they're just gonna hit back hard with the tried-and-true social issues and try to keep the base interested until next time around.


I would think that if the GOP that were at the press conference announcing the senate version of the "exempt from anything you want" amendment weren't basically trying to find a way out of the room when they had it pointed out to them that their presumptive front-runner supported a bill that was 99% the same as Obama's that they're objecting to. It was like they hadn't even rehearsed how to respond to a *really* obvious question from the press.

No, I don't think this is any sort of strategy on their part. I think their leadership is simply falling apart and inertia is the only reason they're still a viable party on a national level.
 
2012-02-16 04:53:56 PM

colon_pow: KwameKilstrawberry: colon_pow:


pills cost maybe 20/mo.[citation please]

I'm going to refrain from hurling insults, because I suck at doing so, but it is so farking obvious you've never had to pay out of pocket for BCPs in your life.

why mandate insurance to provide contraception?.. [derpity do dah, derpity dey] insurance protects against unforseen and expensive accidents/illness.


There, you answered your own question. Do you get it now?

I don't. and you derped out my explanation. (which was a bit insulting, by the way) buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.


You enjoy chasing your own tail, don't you, Sparky?
 
2012-02-16 04:54:14 PM

unexplained bacon: colon_pow: buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.

how so?

how is it any different than any other prescription pill?

where did you even get that idea? got a link or something?


the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?
 
2012-02-16 04:55:20 PM

Uncle Eazy: DozeNutz: Is Obama giving them a choice? Yes. Pay for it or get fined. Got a problem with it, here is your jail cell.

He is taking away freedom of choice.

And yet, if a woman got pregnant and wanted an abortion, the right and all of these evangelical d-bags would love to deny her that. Talk about taking away freedom of choice.


Made me think about John Scalzi's old blog entry on the different political affiliations, this bit on conservative hypocrisy:
They loathe women who are not willing to have their opinions as safely shellacked as their hair. Let their sons get caught with a dime bag and see how many are really for "zero-tolerance." Let a swarthy day laborer impregnate their daughters and find out how many of them are really pro-life.

Linky pop (new window)
 
2012-02-16 04:56:02 PM

Mike Chewbacca: unexplained bacon: colon_pow: buying bcp is like buying extended warranty on your new tires, i.e., something different than your auto insurance.

how so?

how is it any different than any other prescription pill?

where did you even get that idea? got a link or something?

On Facebook this week, some dumbfark friend-of-a-friend said that the pill was a female hygiene tool. I politely but firmly informed him that a douche is an over the counter female hygiene tool, and that the pill was a hormone therapy regimen that can only be prescribed by a doctor. Also, I informed him that he has no idea what the pill is or does. Strangely, he didn't post again.



yeah he's....unsmart I think.
I'm just not hearing any real arguments from the right on this thing...it's all BS.

this is clearly an overreach and it's about something other than what it seems on the surface.

/...and it's a loser
 
2012-02-16 04:56:57 PM

colon_pow: the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?


The fact that you think hormonal birth control is inexpensive shows that you really don't know what you're talking about.
 
2012-02-16 04:57:08 PM

Mike Chewbacca: where did you even get that idea? got a link or something?

On Facebook this week...


cdn.thenextweb.com
 
2012-02-16 04:58:15 PM

Phineas J Whoopee: swarthy


Swarthy is a great word.

I just wanted to point that out.
 
2012-02-16 04:59:07 PM

DozeNutz: Theaetetus: DozeNutz: I do not get how an unborn baby being taken out and killed, is not murder. Because its not a person? It has the DNA of a person, but somehow age has something to do with it. Can you refute that an unborn baby is not a person? We are all defined by the characteristics of our DNA. Therefore, scientifically, its a person.

No. Therefore, scientifically, it's human.
"Personhood" is a philosophical term, not a scientific one. And, under US law, you are not a person until you're born.

I abhor abortion, its murdering little babies.

Again, no. You may abhor abortion, but it's certainly not "murdering little babies". That'd be infantcide, which everyone abhors.

For me, there is no justification for innocent murder. Just the fact that it is unwanted does not change the fact is it a person, or has rights.

And again, no. It's not because it's unwanted, but because it's not born yet - that's why it's not a person and has no rights.

If you asked a person that would have been aborted in the womb after he was born if they wished they were aborted, I'd bet they choose life. Its better to have lived than not have lived at all amirite? Who cares if you are poor or disenfranchised, life is a gift. There is always someone worse off, and its always better to be living than to be dead IMO.

And? If you asked me whether I'd like to have a billion dollars, I'd say yes. Therefore, I have a right to it?

Your arguments are farking dumb. A billion dollars? cmon man, that is a lame ass analogy. I hope you like sharing consciences with the likes of Hitler and Stalin though.


*Wince* Oo...godwinning. Bad move. Bad move. Troll over.
 
2012-02-16 05:00:15 PM
lol, what contraception hearing? I can see the Senate we control doing one, but the Republican House didn't have one except in the fertile minds of idiots

/proud truth squad member since 2012
 
2012-02-16 05:00:20 PM

Knara: colon_pow: the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?

The fact that you think hormonal birth control is inexpensive shows that you really don't know what you're talking about.


Oh, and not to mention that the consequence of making hormonal birth control be harder to get is many more pregnancies, which are *much* more expensive in terms of both conventional finance and implications for society.

/inb4 "bayer as birth control"
 
2012-02-16 05:00:45 PM

colon_pow: the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?



Ohh my.....Bless your little heart

You know if your auto insurance paid out if you destroyed your engine by running it without oil you might be onto something.
 
2012-02-16 05:01:04 PM
i just keep picturing picking up birth control at jiffy lube.

golf clap. seriously. that kind of goofy takes effort.
 
2012-02-16 05:02:22 PM

theorellior: Garet Garrett: Fair point. My hypothetical should have called for the inclusion of bacon on the menu at post-religious service gatherings.

Nope, swing and a miss. You're not very good at analogies, bro.


People don't need to eat pork. Just because some people choose to eat the filthy animals doesn't mean we should force those who oppose it on moral grounds to have to serve it.

Similarly, women don't need contraceptives. Just because some choose to be filthy whores doesn't mean that moral people should have to provide it for them, either.

OK, fine, maybe I'm being a bit silly.

Pigs aren't necessarily filthy.
 
2012-02-16 05:03:00 PM

colon_pow: the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?


I'm self-employed and buy coverage on the individual market for myself and the mrs. I agree with your point about what insurance should be used for and have purchased a high-deductable 'major medical' policy.

However, my coverage includes primary health care office visits and some other basic stuff. The point being that its cheaper for the insurance companies to cover the basics, just to get my sorry ass into the Drs. office now and again to find potential problems - before they get expensive.
 
2012-02-16 05:03:00 PM

colon_pow: why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?


I'll go with "It makes for a more desirable program that appeals to a broader market at an easily justifiable cost" for $800, Alex.

/huh huh...he said "broader"
 
2012-02-16 05:04:35 PM
colon_pow

the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance.

really? that's what you're worried about?
really? you just worry about insurance companies covering "smaller, inexpensive" items?

go on....let's hear your full argument about this one.


why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?

maybe the insurance company figures it's cheaper to fund the pills than the birth.
you don't like that?
 
2012-02-16 05:05:04 PM
"Alright, Mrs. Johnson - back that thing on up over the pit, and we'll take a look at it"
 
2012-02-16 05:07:21 PM

Knara: Swarthy is a great word.


I'm partial to "Levantine", myself.
 
2012-02-16 05:07:40 PM

heap: "Alright, Mrs. Johnson - back that thing on up over the pit, and we'll take a look at it"


I didn't think Obamacare had started yet?
 
2012-02-16 05:08:34 PM

Knara: colon_pow: the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?

The fact that you think hormonal birth control is inexpensive shows that you really don't know what you're talking about.


Less expensive than twins and a minivan.
 
2012-02-16 05:09:13 PM

kapaso: heap: "Alright, Mrs. Johnson - back that thing on up over the pit, and we'll take a look at it"

I didn't think Obamacare had started yet?


i think you may be at least a couple quarts low.
 
2012-02-16 05:09:16 PM

Knara:

The fact that you think hormonal birth control is inexpensive shows that you really don't know what you're talking about.


This,

but when did derpublicans ever know what they were talking about?
 
2012-02-16 05:11:24 PM

2wolves: Knara: colon_pow: the point is, smaller, inexpensive health care items shouldn't be a part of health care insurance. when compared to auto insurance, the analogy is: do you submit a claim to the insurance company if you need to change your oil? huh?
same goes for health ins. why include basic health maintenance kind of thing?

The fact that you think hormonal birth control is inexpensive shows that you really don't know what you're talking about.

Less expensive than twins and a minivan.


Which is why the pill actually saves insurance companies money. They could provide free birth control to every woman and still come out ahead, because they wouldn't have to pay for all those expensive births, prenatal exams, postnatal exams, immunizations, etc.
 
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