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(MSNBC)   PETA claims Siegfried and Roy bribed officials to keep show legal   (msnbc.com) divider line 220
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9179 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Oct 2003 at 12:25 PM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2003-10-22 02:26:44 PM
Lenny_da_Hog,

Yes, unfortunately, that is the truth. It would be an interesting thesis, I think, to try to study how long a "focus group" like PETA, or MADD, or the NRA can maintain a "mainstream focus" without the fringe elements taking over and subverting the method. I wonder if there's some sort of formula one could come up with. Something taking the group's size, general age, finances, and political leanings into account. Hmmm.
 
2003-10-22 02:26:53 PM
I don't know which I hate more, PETA or keeping wild animals captive for human amusement.

I credit PETA for making me change my mind about being a vegetarian. 7 years of no meat ended by a single PETA mailer. PETA makes me want to be a less compassionate consumer. Their advertising makes me want to bite the heads off of live chickens...out of spite.
 
2003-10-22 02:27:08 PM
Lenny_da_Hog

True that.
 
2003-10-22 02:28:25 PM
Tourney,

No, the animals don't "attack the humans and win." The animals that are like humans throughout the novel )ie, greedy, corrupt, etc.) become indistinguishable from humans in the end. The un-human animals stay normal animals and don't win anything. There's nothing PETA like about the book. Read it.
 
2003-10-22 02:29:54 PM
Lenny_da_Hog
Sociological phenomenon. Happens in nearly every organization -- Look at the NRA, GOP, Democrats, or even your local PTA. Zealots move into positions of power in an organization because zealots are the only ones sufficiently motivated to seek power.

I think it has more to do with Group Polarization and the cult phenomenon. The longer certain personality types hang out with people who agree with them on a topic, the more fanatical and outrageous those people become, even to the point of defying logic.
 
2003-10-22 02:30:26 PM
Pocket Ninja:

So you're saying the pigs never run the farmer off and take over his house?

I believe it's you who needs to read it.
 
2003-10-22 02:31:06 PM
I don't like the idea of people wearing fur much, and I don't like the idea of torturing animals so vain women can have prettier shades of eye shadow

I tend to think that testing on animals is not all that bad. I mean, who am I to think that rubbing mascara in a bunnies eyes is bad for it? I'm sure the bunny looked quite stunning after getting the hourly runny mascara treatment. Just imagine those eye-catching eyelashes! Take a pig for example, a boar wallowing in its own filth is deplorable, until you add some classy rouge. Just who do we think we are, projecting our "feelings" onto animals, there is a possibility they like it.
Damnit! Make the monkeys smoke, put some fur on your loin, and if nothing else give the pigs some rouge!
 
2003-10-22 02:33:20 PM
Tourney, I won't bother trying to explain to you how an isolated instance of plot builds a story's message and theme. I'll just let it go.
 
2003-10-22 02:36:01 PM
 
2003-10-22 02:36:28 PM
Peta:

"Hey, let's make some shiate up to start an investigation."

"Evidence? Shemidence, we will will just pull some out of are arse."
 
2003-10-22 02:37:14 PM
Pocket Ninja:

And I won't bother trying to explain that no one ever said Animal Farm is based on PETA. It's a book whose very origin is based on the animals rebelling from humans and forming their own society. I'm sure nothing like that interests PETA, though. Right?
 
2003-10-22 02:37:55 PM
Speaking of pigs and Orwell:

http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/in_our_opinion/pigs_constitutio nal_rights.htm

That's right, equal rights for pigs. My question is what happens when there is a Sow eats a piglet? Should they put the sow in the electric chair for porcinicide? How would they get a jury of peers?
 
2003-10-22 02:39:04 PM
Does anyone think that PETA related articles are getting about as boring as Askmen.com articles?

At least the postings for the Askmen articles make me laugh.
 
2003-10-22 02:41:08 PM
*sigh*

Yes. Animals rebelling from humans and forming their own society. That's what the book is about. Yes.

I can't wait to read your book report.
 
2003-10-22 02:41:28 PM
I'm going to beat the next PETA member I see with my spraypainted cat.
 
2003-10-22 02:41:31 PM
You can stop all the factroy farms and logging sales you want, but it won't be worth squat for animal rights or the environment if the public hates you because of your tactics.

The environmentalist who led the campaign to reintroduce wolves into Yellowstone actually consider that campaign to be a loss because they did without ever taking the proper time to work with the local public on issues they might have had with the reintroduction. Many of the locals now hate them and the wolves, and probably will for decades to come.

They have since taken this lesson to other reintroduction campaigns, and actually take the proper time to meet with locals. The result has been compromises that don't leave the locals feeling bitter about the whole project.
 
2003-10-22 02:42:42 PM
pizzle.. never EVER post of furry pic again. dear lord that was disturbing.
 
2003-10-22 02:49:51 PM
Re: Animal Farm:

Maybe everyone needs to re-read it and realize that the plot has NOTHING to do with animals or animal rights?
 
2003-10-22 02:53:26 PM
We SUSPECT that PETA is currently being run by a group of former Nazis that wish to reestablish the 3rd reich, take over complete control of the world, and install Brain the mouse as world leader. Pinky unavailable for comment, but was last heard saying: "Brain, why do you want to extinguish humanity? I didn't know they were on fire!"
 
2003-10-22 02:53:53 PM
I'm strongly against cruelty to animals... ..Having said that, if some PETA activist ever, ever tries to use his scaremongering tactics to frighten my son into seeing his twisted cult-like ways, rest assured he will experience hitherto unimagined realms of unethical treatment.

Cruelty to animals, bad. Cruelty to terrorist cult freaks, not so bad. Off to eat a steak.
 
2003-10-22 02:55:55 PM
Re: Animal Farm:
Maybe everyone needs to re-read it and realize that the plot has NOTHING to do with animals or animal rights?


It was an alligory for the history of the CPSU, no?
 
2003-10-22 02:56:17 PM
2003-10-22 02:41:08 PM Pocket Ninja

That's what the book is about. Yes.


No one ever said that's what the book is "about".

I said that's the origin of the book. Ultimately we all know what happened, but it originally happened because they didn't want to live under the humans, rebelled, and formed their own society. If you consider that an inconsequental point in the book, that's your problem.

Judging by your inability to read and comprehend what I've posted, I'm not too sure I'd like to read your book report, either.
 
2003-10-22 03:03:50 PM
Bill_Wick's_Friend

To add to the point "cows eat corn to feed humans", what is left out is that a lot of the corn is not fit for human consumption. Some of that corn is too hard and too rough for us to eat.
 
2003-10-22 03:06:34 PM
It was a great song by Spirit....
 
2003-10-22 03:06:48 PM
Is there other evidence of bribery other than free tickets? Despite MSNBC making a big stink over the price, I'm sure the inspectors would simply have filed a travel expense once they were done, and the cost of the tickets would be reimbursed. So they were bribed with something that they probably wouldn't have to had paid for in the first place?

As a former employee of the US government, I've seen them reimburse some goofy travel expenses, and they could argue that observing the treatment of the animals during the show was in line with their duties.
 
2003-10-22 03:13:26 PM
It was Animal Zoo I guess, but it was still more important than anything PETA has to say.
 
2003-10-22 03:18:18 PM
People
Eating
Tiger
Association
 
2003-10-22 03:24:26 PM
hey PETA!

P roctal
E xams
T o
A cquire


must.get.heads.out.
 
2003-10-22 03:26:51 PM
I'm not seeing what the problem is.

The USDA inspectors were in town and to show them that the S & R Show was coolio... MGM/Mirage gave 'em tickets to check it out on their own....


where's the bribe ?
 
2003-10-22 03:29:31 PM
Should have a PhotoShop contest of Russell Crow, since he likes being seen on the internet so much.
 
2003-10-22 03:33:19 PM
Please
Eat
Tiger
Anus

oh, I can't believe she wrote that, that's nasty. she is a bad person.
 
2003-10-22 03:33:34 PM
Actually, George Carlin has it wrong.

The people are farked for sure, and we're taking species down with us as fast as we can. Whoopie- I get to witness the greatest. mass. extinction. ever. With our big brains, you'd think that we could overcome that. But everyone is so farking greedy we get to slide the slippery slope downward.

As Nick Lowe said, what's so funny about peace love and understanding? and how about people for the ethical treatment of animals? you never know when the other shoe might fall....
 
2003-10-22 03:48:59 PM
Wow, way to get into a weird off-topic arguement over Animal Farm. Personally, I thought the original comment was funny. I can imagine a hard-core PETA foot soldier in love with the idea of animals taking over a farm, and completely miss the commentary behind it.

Much like metal heads thinking "Spinal Tap" was real.
 
2003-10-22 03:55:33 PM
Oh, come on, syberpud. The book has the word *animal* in it. It's about *animals*. They, like, take over a farm. You know. *Animals*. PETA does something with animals, don't they? They'd like it if animals took over a farm, wouldn't they? *Animals*. It's about *animals*.

*snicker*
 
2003-10-22 04:02:02 PM
mmmmm....McTiger
 
2003-10-22 04:09:28 PM
Pocket Ninja is a farking moron.
 
2003-10-22 04:11:29 PM
TripSixes, your point would make sense to me, but we would have to exclude human from the rest of nature. If we destroy or create anything, it is an act of nature. We are not above nature, we are not seperate from it. It's that kind of lame thinking that put us in this position. If an ant makes an anthill, it is an act of nature. So how is that different than humans building a dam? Humans are not the only species to take out groups of lifeforms. Ever hear of bacteria? Species came and went by the millions before the industrial revolution ever began. Just because we have the lame power of rationalization, doesn't mean we are above or seperate from nature.
 
2003-10-22 04:22:57 PM
PeterGruntmuscle asks:

Besides, isn't PETA just really pissing off the kind of people that would most likely support them and donate to them in the first place?

Actually there is a faction within PETA that is against animal ownership of any kind, including all typical household pets. They would rather S&R release all their tigers into the wild--where the tigers will be promptly killed by poachers or starve from lack of food, since most all their cats would probably not know how to hunt for themselves.

--h
 
2003-10-22 04:24:26 PM
RE: Animal Farm

Word of the Day: Allegory
allegory
Pronunciation Key (l-gr, -gr)
n. pl. allegories

The representation of abstract ideas or principles by characters, figures, or events in narrative, dramatic, or pictorial form.
A story, picture, or play employing such representation. John Bunyan's Pilgrim's Progress and Herman Melville's Moby Dick are allegories.
A symbolic representation: The blindfolded figure with scales is an allegory of justice.
 
2003-10-22 04:31:34 PM
I think it's funny how many vegans say everyone should wear cotton. The pesticides used in cotton growing are very strong as well as used in high quantites. You wouldn't believe how many ecosystems were destroyed by cotton farming, nevermind the people.

Yeah, and have you ever tried cow corn? The stuff is all starch, no sugar, tastes like crap. You can grow it a lot easier than sweet corn too.
 
2003-10-22 04:35:27 PM
Farking asshat motherfarking biatches... someone needs to take all of these PETA people and put them on a desert island. Maybe that way they can eat eachother instead of the beautiful wildlife.
 
2003-10-22 04:35:28 PM
Thank you alexi. That can be tourney's vocabulary word of the day.
 
2003-10-22 04:36:04 PM
Quote: I hope Sigfried and Roy sue PETA for defamation. It's one thing to spout off your opinion; it's quite another to make allegations for which there is no basis in fact.

Actually, this is quite interesting - in my Civics class we've just been talking about the first amendment and it's limitiations - i.e. when you can sue someone for libel.

Seems to me like S&R could successfully sue PETA for libel...
 
2003-10-22 04:40:20 PM
What makes us different, slowmoriot, is that human beings are capable of manipulating nature. Animals are at its mercy.

Ah, you say, but some animals manipulate nature. Beavers, for example, build nice warm lodges and dam rivers.

Which is true. But a beaver can only build as big a dam as the wood supply it's provided with allows. The lake it lives in will ebb and flow with the rain, and it can't do anything about it. If someone further upstream builds another dam, the beaver is sol.

Humans, on the other hand, control everything. If we run out of wood, we bring in more. We need more water, we build a pipeline.

Is that good or bad? Who knows. Maybe it's both. As long as the animals don't rise up against us on our farms, we're ok.

*snicker*
 
2003-10-22 04:40:59 PM
And again, Pocket Ninja has to piehole in.

I never said Animal Farm was simply "about animals". I've already said that, but your inability to read made it a moot point.

You're still a farking idiot.
 
2003-10-22 04:44:03 PM
Interesting...how you and I barely utter criticism or even an unkind word without being arrested and/or sued by such ass clown organizations for "hate speech" or harrassment. Or how the courts have built an enormous physical and legal barrier between protesters and abortion clinics, making arrest and /or a lawsuit quite probable (and in SOME cases, appropriate).

But ultra-liberal outfits like PETA and Greenpeace can mouth off, malign, libel and harrass anyone as much as they like, with seeming impunity. WUWD? (what-up-wid-dat)

Hmmm...
 
2003-10-22 04:48:08 PM
what was the headline again?
I'm lost. Animal farm and George Carlin? Threadjacking ensues...
 
2003-10-22 04:48:21 PM
"Mouth off" and "malign" are general terms with no legal ramifications. "Libel" and "harass" do have consequences. If Greenpeace and PETA have been guilty of such activities (and I don't deny that, maybe, they have been...I just know of no specific instances), and they've been allowed to get away with it because the offended party failed to file charges, then who's really to blame?
 
2003-10-22 04:49:43 PM
*animals*, slowmoriot. It's about *animals*.
 
2003-10-22 04:51:02 PM
2003-10-22 04:49:43 PM Pocket Ninja


*animals*, slowmoriot. It's about *animals*.


I'm simply amazed that even after all this, you still believe that was my point.

I've read about your people, but have never encountered them in the wild. Hopefully I will get used to this.
 
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