Dear Blizzard,

When you joined with Activision, you done goofed.

Signed

Falmari/Girion/Palindrake/SansaStark/Dakkon/Leatherdaddi(rogue)


/Haven't played since August 17th 2010.

This is like those articles that say Microsoft is doomed because Linux and Apple's market share each rose 0.5% this year.

WoW is still the largest MMO on the market several times over. Unlimited growth is not a feasible assumption, and WoW is 7 years old; Expecting a big surge in numbers near the end of an expansion is pretty ridiculous.

And they'll lose far more next quarter... but so will their (current) main competitor.

Whatever. It's healthy for the genre to have several games doing well, rather than one being so dominant anyhow.

In before, "OMG PANDAS R GHEY AND FOR BABBIES, LOLZ"

Losing 100,000 when the last quarter they lost 800,000 and 300,000 the quarter before isn't huge.

Not sure what changed things, perhaps some holiday sales, but they're definately bleeding, if I hadn't agreed to that year contract, they'd of lost me too...

/not even playing it anymore, been playing SWTOR

I guess it's just indicative of a change in the community, but I find the backlash over pandas hilarious. Back in the vanilla and BC days, everyone that played the game thought that adding panda characters would be the best thing ever to happen to it.

KellyX: if I hadn't agreed to that year contract, they'd of lost me too...

Weird. maybe it's just that the satisfied people are keeping quiet, but every comment I've seen on that year contract so far has been regret.

When you make the games longer and shallower instead of maintaining the level cap and make it deeper instead, players will become bored more easily, and go play other things in the meantime. Most will come back when the next expansion is release, but there will be those who are content with the games they have moved onto and not return.

Meanwhile, with every mandatory expansion, the barrier of entry for new players have been raised. Now it's more expensive for a new player to join, a longer grind to the level cap, and deader zones. Add that to the dungeon finder where the PUG players are leveling ALTS and will respond to the typical newbie player with OMG YOU SUXS and L2P Newb, followed by kicking you from the group, and now your new subscriber retention rate suffers.

So, with Blizzvisions Mandatory expansion every 1 1/2 years model , They are front-loading the money by having everyone buy it, but will be suffering subscription attrition afterwards.

KellyX: not even playing it anymore, been playing SWTOR

^^^^^

Though, I'm dreading reaching level cap in SWTOR. There's no way that they can keep up with the class specific story lines fast enough. So, I'll hit the level cap, maybe run some ops, but without more story, SWTOR is just another MMO.

For all of EVE's faults (and I really did have a love/hate relationship with it), at least I didn't have to pay more than a $5 fee to register an account and didn't have to pay for expansions either.

Why would I want to pay... is it $100 now? to start a new account with all the current expansions. But WoW will probably keep living a goo long time yet. Even $150 million/month almost certainly dwarfs the costs.

Any idea how SWTOR's subscription rate is going?

KellyX: , if I hadn't agreed to that year contract, they'd of lost me too...

Everyone I know that plays WoW (all of 4 people) agreed to that year-long renewal to get Diablo3 for free. And if you're a WoW player and a fan of the Diablo franchise that really was a no-brainer deal but its in effect a subsidization of the WoW subscription base, that it dropped 100k *with* this deal is telling.

I'm surprised none of the "analysts" are talking about it, either. If Blizzard had dropped the subscription fee equal to the cost of Diablo3 they'd surely be talking about that. Blizzard will likely get a free ride on that one as well, when Diablo3 comes out they'll happily count the WoW subcription offer among the total sales. You can't have it both ways, somewhere they lost profit on one product to boost the other, pick one.

Teufelaffe: KellyX: not even playing it anymore, been playing SWTOR

^^^^^

Though, I'm dreading reaching level cap in SWTOR. There's no way that they can keep up with the class specific story lines fast enough. So, I'll hit the level cap, maybe run some ops, but without more story, SWTOR is just another MMO.

If you play SWTOR for the story, yeah, you'll be disappointed. There's not much to do at the level cap, especially if you like to play solo. Hard modes, operations, and even level 50 pvp is ruled by guilds using teamspeak/vent/mumble or something.

They could lose twice as many subscribers as the next most popular MMO (Aion) has total, and still be slightly ahead of Aion in total subscriptions. I think the thing to remember here is that WoW's popularity was so far above anything any other MMO had seen, and the fact that the game just passed it's 7th birthday...to me the amazing thing is that they're still doing as well as they are, subscription wise.

IrateShadow: Weird. maybe it's just that the satisfied people are keeping quiet, but every comment I've seen on that year contract so far has been regret.

I don't understand it. When it came out, everyone knew what Cataclysm had been like, and there weren't massive changes incoming. The only freebies are an in-game mount, and free Diablo 3. So unless you were going to stay subscribed already, or were only going to quit for 4-5 months at most, it would've been cheaper to just buy DIablo 3.

I don't see how the Annual Pass would have had any appeal whatsoever if you were planning to quit WoW, or had already quit. Nor would it bring in new people. So I really don't understand the regret; it seems more like those people have poor impulse control than anything else to me.

IrateShadow: I guess it's just indicative of a change in the community, but I find the backlash over pandas hilarious. Back in the vanilla and BC days, everyone that played the game thought that adding panda characters would be the best thing ever to happen to it.

I always think basically this;

the opposite of charity is justice: Blizzard will likely get a free ride on that one as well, when Diablo3 comes out they'll happily count the WoW subcription offer among the total sales.

I don't think Blizz will need to pad the D3 sales figures.

Gunderson: When you make the games longer and shallower instead of maintaining the level cap and make it deeper instead, players will become bored more easily, and go play other things in the meantime. Most will come back when the next expansion is release, but there will be those who are content with the games they have moved onto and not return.

Character growth in MMO's is generally defined by the leveling process, so it's no surprise that each expansion raises the ceiling. If an expansion didn't give that sort of new content, it would argued that it's not worth the full price of admission.

Ironically, most Warcraft players treat leveling as a mindless exercise hurdle rather than a compelling part of the gameplay (and Blizzard has listened, unfortunately). The game has bred a rather short-bus brand of MMO player, one who views time sinks, difficulty, and risk as inherently bad things in a game.

These same people who gripe about how long things take to accomplish are typically the same player who has 5 alts who vp cap weekly, and are all raid-geared.

Really, for a solution to the problem, the game would have to redefine what leveling means to begin with....as long as there's content that is considered end-game, folks will simply rush to see it, and that's an issue with most games in the genre.

IrateShadow: KellyX: if I hadn't agreed to that year contract, they'd of lost me too...

Weird. maybe it's just that the satisfied people are keeping quiet, but every comment I've seen on that year contract so far has been regret.

It might be one thing when some of the other benefits come out. But all I got was a lion mount and a monthly bill.

At the time I justified it, I had been playing WoW with very little downtime since day 1, so I figured I'd still probably be doing it still for a year... Little did I know how much I'd enjoy SWTOR. So now I just got an extra monthly bill and I can't get out of the contract, which I dislike. I'd be happy if they took back the mount and let me just buy Diablo 3 myself.

It sounds like the reason people are freaking out over the panda thing is more 'WoW is cool to bash' than anything intelligent.

It's like how some annoying kid can tell a dumb joke and you aren't amused, but someone you like can tell the exact same joke and you'll at least smirk.

I have no love for WoW. I quit during vanilla, but pandas are a pretty dumb thing to complain about unless it's a proxy for 'we don't like expansions being cranked out like this.'

Thorak: I always think basically this

I chuckle at this notion that if you aren't at all looking forward to MoP, it's because of pandas.

Teufelaffe: In before, "OMG PANDAS R GHEY AND FOR BABBIES, LOLZ"

Like so.

Just like how tabletop games started moving away from the class/level system, MMOs could do the same. It's happened in a few places, and it has upsides in that it can promote more diversity in builds, but it's harder to balance well and the high end players and theorycrafters will start making their cookie cutter builds that most raiders will be expected to use.

It'd change what it means to 'level', but very likely it'd end up being a smaller playerbase.

Teufelaffe: Though, I'm dreading reaching level cap in SWTOR. There's no way that they can keep up with the class specific story lines fast enough. So, I'll hit the level cap, maybe run some ops, but without more story, SWTOR is just another MMO.

Did that on my main toon, but also leveling the other three classes (doing Imperial first) for the storyline... the class storylines rock.

I currently am doing hardmodes with my guild, a bunch of us that left WoW, and formed it. There's only 7 people in the guild, of which only 5 of us are 50, and only 4 of us really run HMs right now. We're planning to do 8man Ops eventually, but none of us wanted to feel SWTOR became a job like WoW felt like.

Sergeytov:
If you play SWTOR for the story, yeah, you'll be disappointed. There's not much to do at the level cap, especially if you like to play solo. Hard modes, operations, and even level 50 pvp is ruled by guilds using teamspeak/vent/mumble or something.

WoW was the same way for a while too... It just is how it is, it'll evolve and grow, so I'm not to worried. At this time I'm enjoying leveling my alts for the class storylines.

jayhawk88: They could lose twice as many subscribers as the next most popular MMO (Aion) has total, and still be slightly ahead of Aion in total subscriptions.

Numbers are one thing, but even 100,000 * $15 = $1,500.000.00 a month they're getting less of, eventually the corporate side of Blizzard is going to come out and lay off people...

Thorak: I don't understand it. When it came out, everyone knew what Cataclysm had been like, and there weren't massive changes incoming. The only freebies are an in-game mount, and free Diablo 3. So unless you were going to stay subscribed already, or were only going to quit for 4-5 months at most, it would've been cheaper to just buy DIablo 3.

I didn't expect to find something that I enjoyed more... to me it was something to do and cheaper entertainment than going out at night.

The Diablo 3 and honestly the Panda Pak Beta access was what sold me in the end, figured that would let me see if I hated the xpak and then fully decide to quit or not then.

I don't see how the Annual Pass would have had any appeal whatsoever if you were planning to quit WoW, or had already quit. Nor would it bring in new people. So I really don't understand the regret; it seems more like those people have poor impulse control than anything else to me.

Had no plans at the time to quit nor foresaw doing it.

Thorak:.

I always think basically this;

[cheekymonk.files.wordpress.com image 640x848]

I was SO hoping Kaluak would become a player race. I love those guys.

/May your nets always be full.

Sergeytov: Just like how tabletop games started moving away from the class/level system, MMOs could do the same. It's happened in a few places, and it has upsides in that it can promote more diversity in builds, but it's harder to balance well and the high end players and theorycrafters will start making their cookie cutter builds that most raiders will be expected to use.

It'd change what it means to 'level', but very likely it'd end up being a smaller playerbase.

What's wrong with a smaller playerbase? EVE has one of the best playerbases around, definitely the most interesting politics, and has under a half million subs.

It also is classless and has has no end to the fits(builds) and no one is expecting you to use only one particular fit as most fleet(group, raid, whatever) concepts include many variables. Want to be a "healer" today? Sure. Then you can be the DPS 30 minutes and crowd control right after that.. and your fit doesn't have to be the same as everyone elses as long as it fits the concept for that particular fleet. Then again, when you can kill the high end players and theorycrafters, it's easy to justify why any cookie cutter fit they expect you to use is wrong.

I still play EverQuest.
It has shrunk to a Fraction of players WOW has, but, some of us still enjoy it.
It is now going to Free play.

EverQuest is Going Free to Play! (new window)

Come check out some Old School Stuff if you are bored. Yea, the New Games are more pretty, but, EQ Does have a lot of content from 18 Expansions.

I am on the Povar Server, my main is Worthy. You can also find me as WorthyTrader when I am selling stuff. Leave me a message.

They also have an Invite a Friend Option with a Fast Track start at level 50.
If you want an invite, send me an E-mail from the address in my profile and I will send you an invite.

Girion47: Dear Blizzard,

When you joined with Activision, you done goofed.

Blizzard didn't willing go and sign up with Activision. Blizzard's previous parent company, Vivendi Entertainment merged with Activision. It amuses me that so many people think Bliz just decided to go shack up with Activision on their own accord and blame Blizzard for all the problems the merger has caused, without pointing a finger at Vivendi.


Meet Rene Penisson, the guy that led Vivendi into the merger with the devil himself:

Bobby Kotick

bemis23: Girion47: Dear Blizzard,

When you joined with Activision, you done goofed.

Blizzard didn't willing go and sign up with Activision. Blizzard's previous parent company, Vivendi Entertainment merged with Activision. It amuses me that so many people think Bliz just decided to go shack up with Activision on their own accord and blame Blizzard for all the problems the merger has caused, without pointing a finger at Vivendi.

[encrypted-tbn3.google.com image 275x183]
Meet Rene Penisson, the guy that led Vivendi into the merger with the devil himself:

Bobby Kotick
[origin.arstechnica.com image 560x429]

I have no illusion that it was involuntary, but whether they chose it or not, I don't care, once they started acting like super-corporate jackasses(i.e. Starcraft 2 and its multi release plan) I decided to no longer support them. And everyone that thinks the Panda expansion is stupid, thinks it stupid because its obvious pandering to the lowest common denominator. Not an actual content expansion that is needed.

Thorak:
WoW is still the largest MMO on the market several times over

So was Everquest in it's day. And people talked about each 'clone' being an EQ killer. WoW took bits of EQ (amongst others), improved them and well there you go. Eventually the majority gets tired of the same stuff and moves to something else.

Now I'm not saying that's TOR or GW2 or any other MMO released or scheduled to be in 2012, but sooner or later something will appear and *poof* WoW starts crunching servers, going F2P and so on.

bhcompy: What's wrong with a smaller playerbase? EVE has one of the best playerbases around, definitely the most interesting politics, and has under a half million subs.

It also is classless and has has no end to the fits(builds) and no one is expecting you to use only one particular fit as most fleet(group, raid, whatever) concepts include many variables. Want to be a "healer" today? Sure. Then you can be the DPS 30 minutes and crowd control right after that.. and your fit doesn't have to be the same as everyone elses as long as it fits the concept for that particular fleet. Then again, when you can kill the high end players and theorycrafters, it's easy to justify why any cookie cutter fit they expect you to use is wrong.

Depends how much smaller. EVE gets away with its smaller size because everyone is in the same world, not separated like various servers. I could argue other reasons a smaller community can have disadvantages, but I don't think small community=bad by default.

All that stuff you said about EVE? That's part of why I liked it so much. Success was defined by the player rather than 'reach level cap like everyone else.'

artthehypnotist: EverQuest is Going Free to Play! (new window)

I gotta be honest, after seeing what SOE did with EQ2 f2p, I don't want to touch any of their properties ever again, no matter how good my memories of them are.

bhcompy:
It also is classless and has has no end to the fits(builds) and no one is expecting you to use only one particular fit as most fleet(group, raid, whatever) concepts include many variables. Want to be a "healer" today? Sure.

Got Logi 5? Get in the Drake then. Because you won't even get cap transfer from the others.
No T2 weapons? *kick* These are the fits for the fleet, no exceptions.

EVE is a good game, very hardcore and it's players equally so, but to suggest you can show up with a shiatfit ship and get some action is... laughable. I've heard people tell people who couldn't yet fly an Interceptor to buy a Draimel for tackling. Yeah like a nub is going to blow 90 million ISK on a frigate.

I love some of the changes to destroyers they've made. 500dps Catalyst's and 400dps Coercers... ganky ganky.

Sergeytov: If you play SWTOR for the story, yeah, you'll be disappointed. There's not much to do at the level cap, especially if you like to play solo. Hard modes, operations, and even level 50 pvp is ruled by guilds using teamspeak/vent/mumble or something.

it's a really good thing i'm mostly playing it as a version of KOTOR which lets me occasionally run some quests with my friends.

IrateShadow: I guess it's just indicative of a change in the community, but I find the backlash over pandas hilarious. Back in the vanilla and BC days, everyone that played the game thought that adding panda characters would be the best thing ever to happen to it.

you actually hit on the problem i think. "back in the vanilla and BC days". blizzard has time and again come out with what the player base expressly desired, only 4 or so years late and typically in a watered down version. i primarily played a rogue so a good example for me would be when they finally fixed the vanish bug... which i had been living with since early vanilla, and when they finally got around to fixing it i was on my way out the door.

IrateShadow: artthehypnotist: EverQuest is Going Free to Play! (new window)

I gotta be honest, after seeing what SOE did with EQ2 f2p, I don't want to touch any of their properties ever again, no matter how good my memories of them are.

I never tried EQ2. I started EQ in Jan of 2000, but took a few Breaks. I just got my 10 Year Vet Reward.

If you do come back, you can get a better price on the HOT or VOA Expansion on Amazon, rather than buying it from Sony.

kab: Gunderson: When you make the games longer and shallower instead of maintaining the level cap and make it deeper instead, players will become bored more easily, and go play other things in the meantime. Most will come back when the next expansion is release, but there will be those who are content with the games they have moved onto and not return.

Character growth in MMO's is generally defined by the leveling process, so it's no surprise that each expansion raises the ceiling. If an expansion didn't give that sort of new content, it would argued that it's not worth the full price of admission.



Guild Wars and City of Heroes (If I recall correctly) are two MMOs that come to mind that haven't raised their level content and are still successful. The problem with WOW is that it used the leveling treadmill combined with the ilvl carrot and stick model. Once that cap is raised, all the gear you just wasted 18 months getting is now garbage, and the instances you ran to obtain them are now obsolete (heroic Mechanar, anyone?) . So now the entire game is level up, gear up, wait for new expansion. Rinse and repeat.

There are ways to fix this dilemma. Having non-permanent gear, not assigning a handful of drops unique to each boss (Think more of a Diablo II loot table, or with LOTRO, legendary weapons that level up as well)), not requiring specific gear to do specific raids..etc. It can be done and will be done successfully...Just like not centering a game around the 'holy trinity' of DPS/Heal/Tank. Want to run an instance with all fighters? sure. it may not be easy or quick, but why not allow it to be done?

artthehypnotist: I am on the Povar Server, my main is Worthy. You can also find me as WorthyTrader when I am selling stuff. Leave me a message.

They also have an Invite a Friend Option with a Fast Track start at level 50.

Heh, I was a Guide on Povar back in the pre-Velious days.

And start at level 50? Where's the fun? Crushbone, Unrest, the Karanas, Oasis???

Vaneshi: bhcompy:
It also is classless and has has no end to the fits(builds) and no one is expecting you to use only one particular fit as most fleet(group, raid, whatever) concepts include many variables. Want to be a "healer" today? Sure.

Got Logi 5? Get in the Drake then. Because you won't even get cap transfer from the others.
No T2 weapons? *kick* These are the fits for the fleet, no exceptions.

EVE is a good game, very hardcore and it's players equally so, but to suggest you can show up with a shiatfit ship and get some action is... laughable. I've heard people tell people who couldn't yet fly an Interceptor to buy a Draimel for tackling. Yeah like a nub is going to blow 90 million ISK on a frigate.

I love some of the changes to destroyers they've made. 500dps Catalyst's and 400dps Coercers... ganky ganky.

That's where you find a new corp/alliance to play with. Unfortunately, that's also the hard part. That said, they'll take you in a shiat fit Rifter in TEST if you can stand the childish idiots.

I won't be back for two reasons:

1) They went out of their way to appeal to the lowest common denominator with the Cataclysm expansion and they were successful beyond their wildest dreams
2) I have a long list of things I want to accomplish in this life and pushing digital bits around on a computer screen isn't one of them.

The reviews for D3 are going to have to be pretty good to convince me to buy the game. My experience with WoW and what I've heard about SC2 has made me completely lose faith in Blizzard.

/couldn't care less about pandas

artthehypnotist: I still play EverQuest.
It has shrunk to a Fraction of players WOW has, but, some of us still enjoy it.
It is now going to Free play.

EverQuest is Going Free to Play! (new window)

Come check out some Old School Stuff if you are bored. Yea, the New Games are more pretty, but, EQ Does have a lot of content from 18 Expansions.

I am on the Povar Server, my main is Worthy. You can also find me as WorthyTrader when I am selling stuff. Leave me a message.

They also have an Invite a Friend Option with a Fast Track start at level 50.
If you want an invite, send me an E-mail from the address in my profile and I will send you an invite.

Oh god, I did not need to know this. I can't decide whether to play my necro or sk first.

bhcompy:
That's where you find a new corp/alliance to play with. Unfortunately, that's also the hard part. That said, they'll take you in a shiat fit Rifter in TEST if you can stand the childish idiots.

I'd say finding the right group to play with is the hardest part of any MMO.

TEST & Goons, I ended up getting a lot of kills in that particular Delve war. Both in humping down from Period Basis to kill them, then we ditched IT and went spanking clowns :)

We made sure the spaz who mandated 6VDT as our staging point got podded back down to 500k SP though, which was nice.

I... was there. (frothing at the mouth in a psychotic delirium of pew pew).

Blame the silly pandas if you want but the fact is that game is old as hell and people are getting tired of it.

Personally, I'm looking forward to making my Sexual Harassment Panda. Or maybe even Peter Panda. Hell those are just the ideas I got from South Park.

Hand Banana: Blame the silly pandas if you want but the fact is that game is old as hell and people are getting tired of it.

This is true too. When they redid all the 1-60 zones I loved it. It's still better than it used to be, but it's still boring as hell leveling new characters. It gets even worse in Outland/Northrend. The worst part is even if they redo them, like the 1-60 zones, we'll all be tired of them again in 6 months anyways.

I suspect SWTOR hoovered off a lot of players. When they hit level cap, they'll go back to WoW.

That said, I'm looking forward to the pandas.

Rift

Magorn: o, people are bashing WOW because they are coming to the realization, slowly, that as a "game" it stinks on ice and always has. There is no cleverness or subtlety to the gameplay. It is ALWAYS mash button one, then button two then button three and then one again. No room for puzzles, problem solving, clever tactics...nothing, and the way you play the game solo to level up is rendered completely meaningless once you go into endgame and play as a group. All the gear and skill you chose to "balance" your character make them crap for groups and you have to completely re-spec/ re-gear to force your character into one of three utterly rote roles: Tank/DPS/Heal, and you job is NEVER to stray from that role or get yelled at by everyone else in your group. Worse yet, you are forced to do the same exact, insanely long adventures night after night in the hopes that the item you want will actually drop, and some other party memeber won't win the loot roll.

wow has room for puzzles of a sort, in that the boss encounters are not generally released with a guide on how to beat them. yes, after they have been beaten and the strategy shared for all to use, it loses that quality, but so does a puzzle lose the puzzle quality if you have instructions for how to solve it.

there have also been a number of occasions when the preferred method for finishing an encounter were not what the developers intended (re: clever tactics). sometimes the developers were happy at the creativity of the player base, sometimes they considered it an exploit and put a stop to it, but you can't say kiting bosses all the way back to vael's room was not a clever tactic.

and as for pigeon holed roles, that was true a lot more than it should have been perhaps but there were still many instances where it wasn't true. warlock tanks for the twin emperors? yeah, not a rote roll there. and a lot of encounters required offtanks that could churn out the dps once their tanking duties were finished so that required hybrid spec/gear. i also remember the first time my guild killed vael, it was with two rogues tanking the last bit of health with evasion up, and i'm pretty sure no one yelled at us for doing so.

wow was certainly not the most versatile game as far as gameplay and mechanics go, but it wasn't nearly as bad as you make it out to be, at least in vanilla and TBC, and WotLK wasn't that bad.

burndtdan: i also remember the first time my guild killed vael, it was with two rogues tanking the last bit of health with evasion up, and i'm pretty sure no one yelled at us for doing so.

When we first started running Kara, me and the other rogue would regularly act as 'off tank' for the larger pulls on the way to Atumen. Was fun trading aggro back and forth. Of course, that was also from back when you could easily gear your rogue up to 50%+ dodge unbuffed and still do good dps.

Yeah it makes a sound, it sounds like a big flop.

burndtdan: wow has room for puzzles of a sort, in that the boss encounters are not generally released with a guide on how to beat them. yes, after they have been beaten and the strategy shared for all to use, it loses that quality, but so does a puzzle lose the puzzle quality if you have instructions for how to solve it.

Not every class is good at it, but watching folks solo old content is pretty interesting, and definitely falls into this category.

my guild's vent chatter makes me laugh every day
far far FAR more entertaining than the game

the opposite of charity is justice
KellyX: , if I hadn't agreed to that year contract, they'd of lost me too...

Everyone I know that plays WoW (all of 4 people) agreed to that year-long renewal to get Diablo3 for free. And if you're a WoW player and a fan of the Diablo franchise that really was a no-brainer deal but its in effect a subsidization of the WoW subscription base, that it dropped 100k *with* this deal is telling.

That's actually a crappy deal for most people. WoW is still $15 a month, right?

So they want players to commit to spending $180 to a game that many dislike in exchange for a $50 - $60 game that may or may not come out in the next few years.

Teufelaffe: KellyX: not even playing it anymore, been playing SWTOR

^^^^^

Though, I'm dreading reaching level cap in SWTOR. There's no way that they can keep up with the class specific story lines fast enough. So, I'll hit the level cap, maybe run some ops, but without more story, SWTOR is just another MMO.

Hit the level cap in ~6 days as a Juggernaught, dropped the game after trying to level a BH. The story (for the Jugg) is really damn good. The rest of it... not worth my time.

I will state the same thing I always say: when you're competing with the biggest game of the past decade, take notes on what works and what doesn't. The Legacy stuff should've been implemented on game-release, even if that means you delay the game. There should be expectations that some players will blow through the content and will require other things to occupy their time. This doesn't mean giving us a few dungeons to run over and over, as no one really wants to do those repeatedly. Even in WoW the novelty of running the same high-end dungeons (ten or so Heroics, now?) wears off quickly.

The Codex should've been account-wide if they were intending it on being some sort of achievement-tracking mechanism. Also, if PVP is unbalanced, you delay the game and make it work.

Maybe I expect too much from a new game.