Who else thinks SCOTUS will find some way to rule for the Prop 8 people a few years from now?

themindiswatching: Who else thinks SCOTUS will find some way to rule for the Prop 8 people a few years from now?

I think Scalia and Thomas will try to fast-track it. I think it'll be much less than a few years.

Why should citizens of a "free country" have to beg for access to equality other citizens already have access to? Since when are civil rights determined by popular vote vs existing equal protection and due process clauses?

We are free by default.

But it's the neo-puritans that ruin the party every single farking time.

Family values my ass.

Someone please wake me up when christians follow the Golden Rule.

Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

Actually until Christians descended onto the scene gay was seen as normal as well as 2 males being together. However, Christianity being modeled on being entirely anti-Roman decided it was a huge sin since the Romans found it perfectly normal.

mauricecano: TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

Actually until Christians descended onto the scene gay was seen as normal as well as 2 males being together. However, Christianity being modeled on being entirely anti-Roman decided it was a huge sin since the Romans found it perfectly normal.

They most certainly did NOT. Were there gay people? Obviously. Was it considered the "norm"? No. You can't blame Jews or Christians on that one. Even Greeks had laws on the books about homosexuality. My point being, I don't know of any major civilization were homosexuality was considered normal. And again, for my part, whatever.

TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

And until 1967 much of the South felt the same way about interracial marriage. Letting races mix was not "normal". You could be arrested if you entered the state married and unmatched race.

Uchiha_Cycliste: TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

this could be the nicest thing you've ever posted. Begrudgingly tolerance a midst thinly veiled disgust and disapproval. You really are improving. .

Begrudgingly tolerence? A midst? Ima hafta look that prose up...but hey thanks, Byron.

TheDumbBlonde: mauricecano: TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

Actually until Christians descended onto the scene gay was seen as normal as well as 2 males being together. However, Christianity being modeled on being entirely anti-Roman decided it was a huge sin since the Romans found it perfectly normal.

They most certainly did NOT. Were there gay people? Obviously. Was it considered the "norm"? No. You can't blame Jews or Christians on that one. Even Greeks had laws on the books about homosexuality. My point being, I don't know of any major civilization were homosexuality was considered normal. And again, for my part, whatever.

You might want to learn your history before you make such bold statements. In Roman society, having same sex lovers and preferring men of the same sex was absolutely allowed and not frowned upon. This is the same for the Greeks, both cultures were open about it and the Greeks more so with their rules. There was not a ban by the Greeks, they preferred sex with boys as well.

You need to learn your history. The paragons of Western civilization were absolutely open about same sex relationships and they were not frowned upon. It was entirely the Christian's and their anti-Roman zeal that changed that

Here are some links for you to quickly learn something about the Romans and Greeks. You should share this with whoever told you the garbage about Greeks outlawing homosexuality too: Romans (new window) Greeks (new window)

So now you do know major civilizations where it was considered normal and acceptable. Also a shocker, before the rise of the current style of Islam, the Middle East was widely acceptable of male-male sexual acts (female no as they were property)

mauricecano: TheDumbBlonde: mauricecano: TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

Actually until Christians descended onto the scene gay was seen as normal as well as 2 males being together. However, Christianity being modeled on being entirely anti-Roman decided it was a huge sin since the Romans found it perfectly normal.

They most certainly did NOT. Were there gay people? Obviously. Was it considered the "norm"? No. You can't blame Jews or Christians on that one. Even Greeks had laws on the books about homosexuality. My point being, I don't know of any major civilization were homosexuality was considered normal. And again, for my part, whatever.

You might want to learn your history before you make such bold statements. In Roman society, having same sex lovers and preferring men of the same sex was absolutely allowed and not frowned upon. This is the same for the Greeks, both cultures were open about it and the Greeks more so with their rules. There was not a ban by the Greeks, they preferred sex with boys as well.

You need to learn your history. The paragons of Western civilization were absolutely open about same sex relationships and they were not frowned upon. It was entirely the Christian's and their anti-Roman zeal that changed that

Here are some links for you to quickly learn something about the Romans and Greeks. You should share this with whoever told you the garbage about Greeks outlawing homosexuality too: Romans (new window) Greeks (new window)

So now you do know major civilizations where it was considered normal and acceptable. Also a shocker, before the rise of the current style of Islam, the Middle East was widely acceptable of male-male sexual acts (female no as they were property)

You are wrong, There is a great deal of historical literature on the subject. See: Cicero. You go on ahead anyway, that's fine. As for me, I don't really give a shiat. As a side: preferring men of the same sexis blindling confusing.

dang sure: queer marriage is just another money grab....if it was love they'd cling to each other monogamously for life no matter what...

Bullshiat remains bullshiat....

Just another grab at power, privilege and cash.....tiresome

and nobody gives a damn about your plumbing connections... just don't expect a prize and everyone's gratitude

You're funny.

Ah, I see we already have a bigot in here arguing why we should deny people equal rights because of their genetics. It's like the Civil Rights Movement, but even more embarrassing because it's the 21st goddamn century and I can't believe there are this many backward farks still around.

GAT_00: Ah, I see we already have a bigot in here arguing why we should deny people equal rights because of their genetics. It's like the Civil Rights Movement, but even more embarrassing because it's the 21st goddamn century and I can't believe there are this many backward farks still around.

You should get job.

Lackofname: Not to defend TheDumbBlonde (oy) but I think his point, when he says norm, is average. As in, practiced by 50+% of the population.

For instance, the average American owns 2 vehicles. Therefore, owning 4 vehicles is not normal.

Therefore he's saying that regardless of if it was considered acceptable, it was not the dominant form of relationship in Rome.

And the average American isn't in an interracial marriage. That doesn't mean it should be illegal. The average American isn't gay. That doesn't mean they shouldn't have the right to get married to any consenting adult they want.

Lackofname: Not to defend TheDumbBlonde (oy) but I think his point, when he says norm, is average. As in, practiced by 50+% of the population.

For instance, the average American owns 2 vehicles. Therefore, owning 4 vehicles is not normal.

Therefore he's saying that regardless of if it was considered acceptable, it was not the dominant form of relationship in Rome.

The norm and the average are two different things. You know this, I know this, and GOD forbid you corraberate any comment I made. Meh. Let's all have anal sex in support of this judicial decision.

AverageAmericanGuy: Even if Prop 8 is upheld, it's only a matter of time before society moves beyond it and puts it on the scrapheap of history.

Yep. But not until bigots find yet another group to oppress. I'm sure if we ever make contact with aliens, they'll be the next "godless heathens".

RedPhoenix122: AverageAmericanGuy: Even if Prop 8 is upheld, it's only a matter of time before society moves beyond it and puts it on the scrapheap of history.

Yep. But not until bigots find yet another group to oppress. I'm sure if we ever make contact with aliens, they'll be the next "godless heathens".

Hey, at least they'll have the people protesting gay marriage right beside the people who protested interracial marriage and civil rights in the history books, so the kids of tomorrow can see just how utterly wrong these bigots are.

GAT_00: Hey, at least they'll have the people protesting gay marriage right beside the people who protested interracial marriage and civil rights in the history books, so the kids of tomorrow can see just how utterly wrong these bigots are.

And yet, it's been this way for hundreds of years, and yet there's STILL people who believe that shiat, then pass it down to their children, etc. Makes me wonder how much progress we've really made as a species.

Karac: TheDumbBlonde: mauricecano: TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

Actually until Christians descended onto the scene gay was seen as normal as well as 2 males being together. However, Christianity being modeled on being entirely anti-Roman decided it was a huge sin since the Romans found it perfectly normal.

They most certainly did NOT. Were there gay people? Obviously. Was it considered the "norm"? No. You can't blame Jews or Christians on that one. Even Greeks had laws on the books about homosexuality. My point being, I don't know of any major civilization were homosexuality was considered normal. And again, for my part, whatever.

Greeks outlawed homosexuality? That must have come as a suprise to these guys, and entire military unit comprised of nothing but homosexual men.

The Greeks has a law that made recieving the sex act against the law. Ergo, making the boy the criminal, but not the "penetrator" or the pimp. As for military units using pedastery as "hazing", one must only look to any British public school for much the same behavior. Men were expected to grow up and have famillies.

dave1y: muck4doo: Government shouldn't be involved in marriage, period. Civil unions for everyone.

I'll bite...
And keep your Government hands off my Medicare!
/how's that?

Actually, if they're going to change the equality of marriage, because the church doesn't like it, then the government could just treat ALL marriages as civil unions, and keep religion out of the equation. If they're not going to treat everyone equally, they can stay out of government affairs. I do find it strange that they disallow gay marriage for religious purposes, but allow Buddhists, Pagans, and Atheists to marry.

DarnoKonrad: Marriage *is* the civil institution. Churches wed people, the state marries them. We didn't need to change the name to allow interracial marriage either.

I know. My point is, if they're going to ban a group because they don't agree, then they can get out of the entire institution of marriage, and all the money it brings into the church. Fark them and everything they've ever done.

divgradcurl: Lackofname:

Wow, I try to take some of the heat off of you and you bite me for it. You're a real winner you know that?


well, if they start off by making fun of someone's grammar and then include the word "corraberate" in a later post...

/forget it Jake lackofname, it's Chinatown politics tab

That's genius. You should run for office.

Philip Francis Queeg: nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Unless that person is a different color, or gender, or sexual preference, or religion, or "suspected of being a terrorist", or shares the same race as a country we are at war with, or looks like they're an immigrant, or...shall i go on?

TheDumbBlonde: Gay marriage isn't normal. It's outside the "norm". However, if two committed people want a lifetime of misery, alimony and child support, I'm all for allowing it.

Why should gays be allowed to escape the onerous duties of marriage and child-rearing?