This kind of idiocy would only happen in FL or CA.

I'd love to be at the hearing to dismiss

Narwhal, please.

Archie Goodwin: I'd love to see the judge order the plaintiffs to appear in his court room.

I'd love to see them testify

"what'd he say?"

"umm...I'm reall not sure."

Chinchillazilla: I firmly believe that if you could ask most animals whether they would prefer to live in captivity or in their natural habitats, they would pick captivity. Safety, guaranteed food and guaranteed mating opportunities? No-brainer, really.

I don't know about orcas, though. I can't imagine a species who kills great white sharks for shiats and giggles has a lot to worry about in the wild.

/not defending this lunacy in any way, just musing

In the Blue Planet series they show Orcas killing a grey whale just for laughs

It will be thrown out of court. They don't have a leg to stand on.

The defendants simply have to apply their 6th amendment rights in the court room.

Good one subby.

With all the serious court cases waiting trial (murder, rape, theft, rape) no judge should hear this. In fact they should fine the animal rights group that is filing on behalf of the whales for taking up valuable court time.

I can only imagine if this goes to trial and succeeds... Then there will be class action suit on behalf of domestic animals, zoos, etc.

There is a place on gods green earth for all animals.... Right next to the mashed potatoes.

If we are going to treat whales as people, then it's time to put one of the plaintiffs on trial for the three homicides he's caused. So far each time that it happens, SeaWorld just keeps calling them 'incidents'.


If we're going to treat them like people that is.

Chinchillazilla: I firmly believe that if you could ask most animals whether they would prefer to live in captivity or in their natural habitats, they would pick captivity. Safety, guaranteed food and guaranteed mating opportunities? No-brainer, really.

I don't know about orcas, though. I can't imagine a species who kills great white sharks for shiats and giggles has a lot to worry about in the wild.

/not defending this lunacy in any way, just musing

Do you have any instinctual urges you are ever compelled to follow? I'm not an animal nutter at all, but to state that animals can easily supercede some instinctual needs in order to be hand fed by touristy people in flip-flops seems odd. There may be parts that would appease the instincts but overall I think there are urges that would never be met in captivity. So given a anthropomorphized human choice, I still think they'd say no, after possibly cocking their heads quizzically and smiling as only an orca can.

It's irrelevant anyway. SeaWorld is a corporation. It's rights as a human trump any animal.

A captive Orca is actually tangible personal property as far as the law is concerned, similar to a chair or a cell phone.

A chair cannot be the plaintiff of a lawsuit.

FTA:

"Peta names the five wild-captured orca plaintiffs as Tilikum and Katina, at SeaWorld Orlando; and Kasatka, Corky, and Ulises, at SeaWorld San Diego.

It is not Tilikum's first time in the media spotlight - he drowned his trainer before horrified spectators in February 2010"

Have PETA thought this through? I presume that if Tilikum can be considered "enslaved" then he can also be guilty of murder?

/they're gonna need a bigger chair.......

As long as this legal lunacy is accompanied by semi-nude women being treated like livestock, I am in support.



/fap

Objection, your Honor! Alleged killer whale.

Oh, wait, plaintiff .... never mind.

I submitted this story with a dumber headline

TravisBickle62: A captive Orca is actually tangible personal property as far as the law is concerned, similar to a chair or a cell phone.

A chair cannot be the plaintiff of a lawsuit.

$10 000+ dollars can be the defendant, though.

You're uncomfortably close to making PETA's point for them, and I think PETA is a bunch of misogynist trolls who've done more harm to developing proper ethics toward non-human animals than good.

I love the cats I live with, but I often have the uncomfortable feeling they would love to get out for a run occasionally (we live in an apartment building). I'm not even worried they'll run away and never return; I'm worried they'll run into a human driving a car without paying attention, or a human that has no compassion toward nonhumans... I intend to rectify this someday. Anyway, I can't visit zoos or aquariums in good conscience anymore unless strenuous efforts are made to provide vast spaces to move around within. Cetaceans aren't supposed to live in friggin' tanks; they're migratory aquatic mammals, ffs.

The police sniffer dogs might be OK if they're part of a pack, human or otherwise, and are allowed to live as such. If they get to go home at the end of the day and recieve compensation (steak is compensation, right?), I have less difficulty with their employment. Heck, they'd probably love to join their alpha/handler going to work everyday... if they were treated that way.

/tree-hugger
//and kitty-hugger
///and omnivore

You can't legislate sentience.

Do animals deserve human rights? Definitely not. That's ridiculous.

Do animals deserve their own set of rights, tailored for their needs abilities? Maybe so. Animal cruelty laws sometimes don't seem to be enough.

chi_tino: "As long as this legal lunacy is accompanied by semi-nude women being treated like livestock, I am in support."

Yeah, their incentives do not align with their objectives very well.

If we eat delicious meat and wear cool leather clothes, chicks will get naked and make a scene.
If we *don't* eat meat or wear leather clothes... that presumably all stops.

I'd say they're doing it wrong, but I like meat and leather, so....

Chinchillazilla: I firmly believe that if you could ask most animals whether they would prefer to live in captivity or in their natural habitats, they would pick captivity. Safety, guaranteed food and guaranteed mating opportunities? No-brainer, really.

I don't know about orcas, though. I can't imagine a species who kills great white sharks for shiats and giggles has a lot to worry about in the wild.

/not defending this lunacy in any way, just musing

Most animals, perhaps. Most animals live longer in captivity than they do in the wild. Except Cetaceans - they have a tendency to die really quickly in captivity. Lots more die during the actual capturing process. Plus doing somersaults for eight hours a day just to get fed must get old pretty quickly.

You don't have to be a radical animal liberationist to see how Seaworld is mistreating animals for profit. Their way of doing things resembles a 19th century menagerie more than a modern zoo.

What's going to hurt Sea World is the video of one of their trainers whipping an orca and demanding that the whale accept it's new name as Shamu

Sharks: Still just dumb-ass fish.

So If corporations are human, why not human rights for whales?
I'm sure it's what the Supreme Court had in mind.
I'd love to see those idiots get busted on civil rights violations for using Grubex on their lawns.

I was always taught that the SCOTUS was there to uphold and interpret.
No where does it say to make a mockery of the law.

Where'd I put my damn phone . . . I'm gonna call those bought and paid for morons and have a little chat

To hell with the orcas, I'm more worried about the humpback space program. (new window)

HailRobonia: It will be thrown out of court. They don't have a leg to stand on.

Sees what you did there.

Vestigial Pelvises notwithstanding.

I would love to see the look on PETA's faces if they won. Then the DA files murder charges against the whales for the murder of those trainers and all 5 get executed.

/Don't really want whales to be executed or be treated as people.
//That would be a big electric chair

Five killer whales
Five killer whales
Five killer whales
Five killer whales
Ding! Fries are done
Ding! Fries are done
Ding! Fries are done
Ding! Fries are done

I am humbled by the skill of the headline writer!
I bow before you, sir, maam, both....whatevah

I generally fart in the direction of Animal Rights Over Active Unemployed Fanatics, and this is sure a damn dangerous slope to be considering ..

... but then our very own Congress awarded status as a "Person" to corporations, so ...

Say Potato again Mother f*cker, I dare you.

Admit it subby; how long have you been saving that one up for?

Clemkadidlefark: I generally fart in the direction of Animal Rights Over Active Unemployed Fanatics, and this is sure a damn dangerous slope to be considering ..

... but then our very own Congress awarded status as a "Person" to corporations, so ...

Say Potato again Mother f*cker, I dare you.

[briancimins.files.wordpress.com image 305x415]


I'm no fan of Peta either, but I do believe we're pretty close to proving that some whales are sentient. I won't go over all the science here, but spindle neurons are a big part of it, as is their apparent sense of self-awareness and ability to form emotional ties to family and friends. They have a complex language. They have been known to repay debts to humans who have helped or harmed them. They are not just stupid animals.

Just because their language is completely alien, and they developed different priorities as a species due to being aquatic and lacking fingers doesn't mean they can't be sentient.

I keep hearing/reading people talking about going into space and colonizing planets, but we can't even make nice with the other sentient or near-sentient species on our own planet. How do you think extraterrestrial species will feel about that if/when we finally meet them? How can we honestly hope to leave this planet and search for other habitable places and hospitable people when we can't even figure out what makes a creature deserving of personhood?

Peta's not wrong here. The whales at these parks are treated as property when they most definitely have personalities, self-awareness, and are very likely sentient or near-sentient creatures. However, Peta's scale is all out of whack. A few whales in Sea-World aren't the problem. The mass-killing of whales by the Japanese needs to be addressed before we worry about a few well-fed whales in Florida.

Because in my opinion slavery is not as bad as murder, and if whales are sentient or near-sentient, then we need to figure out as a species if killing a sentient creature is murder, or if murder is exclusive to humans.

And if it's exclusive to humans, we'd better stay on Earth.

To their credit, they're very attractive and successful killer whales.

I'm not a PETA person at all but I've been boycotting SeaWorld for years, imo Orcas are not suitable for captivity.

I'd like to call my first expert witness to the stand, Humphrey Humpback.

wwwwWWWWEEEEEOOOooooOOOOOWWwwwww

Probably just letting it into the courts to declare the whole mess silly, establish legal precedent against this kind of shenanigan, and shut up some of the more bothersome whiners.

Reads headline: "Hmm. Probably Peta up to its batshiat antics."

Reads article: "Yup"

Archie Goodwin: I'd love to see the judge order the plaintiffs to appear in his court room.

It could happen. See, first you get some transparent aluminum, and build a tank...

Chinchillazilla: apres_ski_god

You said "rape" twice.

I like rape

Clemkadidlefark: but then our very own Congress awarded status as a "Person" to corporations

Who did what, now?

Citation, plz?