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(Some Guy)   Woman receives Facebook friend request from the man who raped her when she was 14 years old. She gets the hero tag for how she handled it   ( moxiebird.com) divider line
    More: Hero, rape victims, Facebook, electronic publishing, friend request  
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66168 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Feb 2012 at 10:49 AM (6 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-02-05 03:34:37 PM  

KiplingKat872: I am not sure why you are yelling at me about this.


I'm not yelling.
 
2012-02-05 03:35:12 PM  
This is a very weighty issue. About 40 pounds' worth, I'd say.
 
2012-02-05 03:37:57 PM  

RoyBatty: KiplingKat872: This wasn't even a story about hunting the guy down to throw in jail or revenge, but her courage and maturity in dealing with her past. That's why she did not give names. It was about her healing, not destroying him.So why are so many people ready to call her a liar?

Her story does not ring of honesty.

It rings with yet another templated story of girl heroism about the evilness of men as told to hip, edgy, online women's zine.

In that sense it seems commercial and exploitative and a story designed to gain attention for her actions as opposed to generate insightful dialogue about what happened 15 years prior and its relevancy today.

Part and parcel of that is the continuation of threads like this where women and some men will just stand there and insist "no means no, always", "women bear no responsibility for their choices", "and if you disagree you are farking stupid and should not go outside without a handler you dumb farking rape apologizing ugly psycho."


Well, if people had discussed the long term emotional effects of rape, treatment, healing, and moving on, it could have been an intelligent and informative discussion.

Instead it turned into "biatches be lyin" and rape surivors who step forward are...I don't even know what to call ExperianScaresChulthulu's psycotic rant and "if you think this is rape, you're a feminazi who equates all sex with rape" nonsense.

The lack of rationality did not come from one side.
 
2012-02-05 03:38:08 PM  

Tak the Hideous New Girl: ExperianScaresCthulhu: Occam's Nailfile: Do women feel that they have any responsibility at all to avoid encouraging situations that could lead to them being assaulted?

Reading thread to see the answer to this...

Women can't win in this regard. We're stuck-up, paranoid, non-fun having prudes or we're rape-deserving, skanky whores.

//are all men so dangerous that we should only leave the house with an escort? I know, how about a garment that covers us up completely head to toe, I bet that would stop rape.
///I need to stop reading Fark rape threads.


No, no it wouldn't. If men will rape a 62-year-old grandmother, they'll rape a woman in a burqa.

And in fairness, I've been groped in public while wearing something like this:

plainlydressed.comView Full Size

/Linked like it's hot
 
2012-02-05 03:39:35 PM  

morgantx: blondski: All of these comments from women make me wonder if any woman makes it through life with out some sort of creepy ass touching them with out consent.

Honestly, many of us just get to the point where we barely even notice that sort of thing anymore.

I remember being out with my husband one day at a family buffet restaurant with our three kids. Some 40-something-year-old Mexican dude came up behind me on the line, put both of his hands on my hips, and thrust his groin into my butt. I just brushed his hands away and went on about my business, and my husband happened to look up to see me walking away from the guy with an angry look on my face while the guy was chuckling. So when I sat back down he asked me what happened, and I told him. And I was SHOCKED to see the look of rage in his face. I think he would've killed the guy if I hadn't stopped him.

Didn't make it much better when I told him that sort of thing happens a lot, but it does. I've had my breasts, butt, and even crotch grabbed while filling up the car with gas, shopping for groceries, or standing in line at a fast food place. I never really thought much of it until I saw my husband's reaction to it; I always just kind of thought that was normal male behavior.


No, it's not normal. Get out of Texas.
 
2012-02-05 03:39:54 PM  

Bathia_Mapes: She said, "No, let's stop" at least once. That's all that's necessary. It doesn't matter if she was drunk/stoned/whatever, she said NO!


NO MEANS NO!!!


That is 100% correct. And at that point, the man bears responsibility for what happens. Who bears what % of the responsibility for what happens leading up to that point requires full disclosure of all details.
 
2012-02-05 03:40:13 PM  

morgantx: Tak the Hideous New Girl: ExperianScaresCthulhu: Occam's Nailfile: Do women feel that they have any responsibility at all to avoid encouraging situations that could lead to them being assaulted?

Reading thread to see the answer to this...

Women can't win in this regard. We're stuck-up, paranoid, non-fun having prudes or we're rape-deserving, skanky whores.

//are all men so dangerous that we should only leave the house with an escort? I know, how about a garment that covers us up completely head to toe, I bet that would stop rape.
///I need to stop reading Fark rape threads.

No, no it wouldn't. If men will rape a 62-year-old grandmother, they'll rape a woman in a burqa.

And in fairness, I've been groped in public while wearing something like this:

[www.plainlydressed.com image 105x300]
/Linked like it's hot


Bullshiat. You people can't have electricity.

I just had the most adorable vision of an Amish computer being powered by team of little hamsters running in their wheels to power the generators.
 
2012-02-05 03:40:39 PM  

ChuDogg: No, it's not normal. Get out of Texas.


Oh, and I read this comment before looking at your handle and or profile, and my first thought was "She has to be from Texas... "
 
2012-02-05 03:40:41 PM  

ChuDogg: mgshamster: ChuDogg: What you are describing is a "freeze out " among the pickup artists. Think about, guys that routinely debate the best was to casually score chicks with no romantic involvement: have a word for it.

Holy fark. That's some seriously effed up shiat.

So doing exactly what a woman asks for is "seriously effed up shiat"?

Or are you just noting the irony in the way these guys talk about doing it.

Just to be clear for anybody following this convo: we're talking about a girl saying "no", and the guy listening and calling off the sexual interaction.


It's effed up in that it's a "technique" or "weapon" for a pick-up artist to use in order to get laid by a girl who might not otherwise be comfortable.

From the link: "Freeze-outs are one of the most powerful, but hardest to apply, weapons in your PUA arsenal."

They're not stopping out of respect for another human; they're stopping because they think it'll boost their own image and increase the chance of getting laid the next time around. It's just a long-term psychological game. That is what is effed up.
 
2012-02-05 03:41:24 PM  

rocky_howard: JesusJuice: Peki: Good for her. I'm glad she got some closure. It can be important for things like this. I didn't react the same.

However, my situation was a little different. I can clearly remember everything, and it wasn't a one-off thing like hers was. He contacted me after I got back in town. I remember telling him I had forgiven him for everything he'd done (considering the last few years of my life, that's actually one of the easier things I've dealt with), but that I was simply too swamped with life to explore a friendship with him. I haven't heard from him since, and I hope I don't. I've made the decision to be welcoming and friendly to him, even if he steps foot in my church, though I may have a word with a few of the parents.

This is one of the stupider things I've ever read.

Hey, don't say that. Peki has the right to be friendly with him and you're not who to criticize her.

That said, Peki, dear, you're way too submissive with men. I've read other things by you during the years on Fark. Try to stand up to the guys that hurt you. They'd probably stop doing it if you do.


Yeah, and I have a right think wanting to be friendly with him makes her either a moron or just pathetic.
 
2012-02-05 03:42:22 PM  

RaceBoatDriver: ExperianScaresCthulhu: RaceBoatDriver: FanotherFA written by the same author:
I didnt talk about rape at all back then, because I didn't have the vocabulary. Each time that it happened to me, I felt that extenuating circumstances kept it from truly being rape. He was my boyfriend, I was drunk, I got in the car. I never believed that I had fought hard enough.

eyebrow

/link?
// there's a reason

Here it is, fifth paragraph...
http://www.xojane.com/issues/why-i-talk-about-rape

Not trying to belittle rape, but to build an identify on it, and claim multiple rapes, seems a little off. She also wrote an article about the reactions she got to "Sexy biatch" temporary BOOBIE tattoos. That article can be found here:
http://www.xojane.com/fun/tatatoos-breast-temporary-tattoos.

That's not to say she was "asking for it." More along the lines of "she likes attention."


Thank you for the link. Why do people do this?
 
2012-02-05 03:42:34 PM  

ChuDogg: morgantx: blondski: All of these comments from women make me wonder if any woman makes it through life with out some sort of creepy ass touching them with out consent.

Honestly, many of us just get to the point where we barely even notice that sort of thing anymore.

I remember being out with my husband one day at a family buffet restaurant with our three kids. Some 40-something-year-old Mexican dude came up behind me on the line, put both of his hands on my hips, and thrust his groin into my butt. I just brushed his hands away and went on about my business, and my husband happened to look up to see me walking away from the guy with an angry look on my face while the guy was chuckling. So when I sat back down he asked me what happened, and I told him. And I was SHOCKED to see the look of rage in his face. I think he would've killed the guy if I hadn't stopped him.

Didn't make it much better when I told him that sort of thing happens a lot, but it does. I've had my breasts, butt, and even crotch grabbed while filling up the car with gas, shopping for groceries, or standing in line at a fast food place. I never really thought much of it until I saw my husband's reaction to it; I always just kind of thought that was normal male behavior.

No, it's not normal. Get out of Texas.


That's actually what angered my husband the most, was the fact that I thought it WAS normal behavior. The fact that it was SO ubiquitous. It had started happening to me when I was about 14, actually. And the fact that it happened to all my friends. And none of us ever stopped to say, "Maybe these guys shouldn't be groping us without our permission!" That angered him more than the behavior itself - the fact that I was so de-sensitized to it to just think that was the type of thing that happened when you weren't paying attention to your surroundings. AND the fact that most of my friends thought the same thing. I called up one of my friends that night to tell her about the incident, and she said, "I don't get why he was getting so worked up about it. It's not like it's that unusual." And THAT is the real problem.
 
2012-02-05 03:43:12 PM  

morgantx: No, no it wouldn't. men will rape a 62-year-old grandmother, & every day men rape women in a burqas.

And in fairness, I've been groped in public while wearing something like this:


Covered is sexy.
 
2012-02-05 03:43:43 PM  

gulogulo: RoyBatty: women bear no responsibility for their choices

Who said this? Ever?


I suggest you read this thread. Plenty of people are pointing out the story has holes in it, that all people admit they were out of their heads, the guy felt he was being coerced in to it, she admits to not putting up a fight. And she wasn't really sure she was raped until she'd had time to think about. Yet the wymon in this thread are all for putting the guys head on a pike and any mention that, perhaps, both of them are victims gets you on their ignore list and/or a torrent of abuse.

So in answer to your question: Right here, Right now.
 
2012-02-05 03:43:48 PM  

mgshamster: They're not stopping out of respect for another human; they're stopping because they think it'll boost their own image and increase the chance of getting laid the next time around. It's just a long-term psychological game. That is what is effed up.


It is a psychological game. We are 100% agreement on that. The only thing we disagree on is who are the ones that are playing it.
 
2012-02-05 03:43:56 PM  

gulogulo: RoyBatty: women bear no responsibility for their choices

Who said this? Ever?


No one says that, but it is the logical conclusion to the gray rape scenario all over the net a couple of years ago: two people at a party, both get so drunk they can't remember what happened, but she and he are both in bed, so she insists she was raped. And when that happened, most of the feminists insisted there is no gray rape, it is just rape.

The odd result is that feminists from Salon to Jezebel to Feministing all insist that it is the man's job to protect the woman since the woman, once drunk, cannot be held responsible for her actions.

It's a patronizing, condescending, infantilizing conclusion, but it's the one adopted by many feminists.


This seems to be the logic of the "apologists." Don't condemn the rapist until you've thoroughly acknowledged that she made bad choices. In fact, maybe only give a back handed "bad boy" to the rapist while writing a soliloquy on the shiatty choices she made.


Um, no, this is now just you speech policing and bullying the thread. If we are having a conversation then none of us are rape apologists.

PERIOD.

Just describing anyone that disagrees with you as a rape apologist is rude and dishonest.

Please stop that and apologize.


My issue here is that the evidence that 10% of rape accusations are false to act like now 100% of them are false. She didn't go to the cops. No one's life is being ruined.


My life was ruined by false accusations that a court psychologist knew were false.

There is plenty of testimonial evidence in this thread, and in real life cases, that women (and men) will lie about sex in order to use the resulting societal reaction to game and destroy their opponent.
 
2012-02-05 03:45:05 PM  

s2s2s2: morgantx: No, no it wouldn't. men will rape a 62-year-old grandmother, & every day men rape women in a burqas.

And in fairness, I've been groped in public while wearing something like this:

Covered is sexy.


I once saw a stripper start her routine in something like this. The crowd went WILD!
 
2012-02-05 03:45:58 PM  
Just so you know, this article was originally posted here: http://www.xojane.com/sex/my-rapist-friended-me-facebook-and-all-i-go t -was-lousy-article (new window), and was actually written by Emily, instead of some chick who felt like building almost an entire post out of quotes and only using a tiny "source" link at the bottom as attribution.
 
2012-02-05 03:46:01 PM  

Bathia_Mapes: She said, "No, let's stop" at least once. That's all that's necessary. It doesn't matter if she was drunk/stoned/whatever, she said NO!

NO MEANS NO!!!


True story....

I met a girl online. We chatted. We decided to meet up. Our First date.....We started messing around. I went to remove her pants and she said 'No'. She didn't mean it. We hooked up. We started dating. We moved in together. We got married. We've been together for six years now.

She's since told me she said no because 'I dunno, I didn't want to seem easy'.

No means maybe!

Most of the girls I'd met online seemed cool online, then we'd have our first date and realize we weren't right for each other. I had that happen several times. When you have very little invested in a person, and very little history with them, it's really easy to walk away. It's easy to never see them again. It's possible that, had I taken 'no' to mean 'no' I wouldn't be married to the woman I am. Truthfully, up until us messing around, it was a nothing special, awkward, first-date.
 
2012-02-05 03:46:42 PM  
Duke Lacrosse Team

that

is

all.
 
2012-02-05 03:47:08 PM  

ChuDogg: mgshamster: They're not stopping out of respect for another human; they're stopping because they think it'll boost their own image and increase the chance of getting laid the next time around. It's just a long-term psychological game. That is what is effed up.

It is a psychological game. We are 100% agreement on that. The only thing we disagree on is who are the ones that are playing it.


imgs.xkcd.comView Full Size
 
2012-02-05 03:48:05 PM  

ArkAngel: LadyHawke: AmorousRedDragon: Abuse of alcohol and drugs made it difficult for her to distinctly and positively confirm what she recalled.

Maybe the whole idea of getting trashed with 3 older males alone in some warehouse wasn't the best choice.

Yes, but that doesn't mean she deserved to be raped.

Leaving the keys in the ignition of my Corvette in South Central LA doesn't mean I deserve to get my car stolen, it means I contributed to it happening by doing something unwise.


So this is rape-rape or just rape?

/or 40lb box of it.
 
2012-02-05 03:49:11 PM  

jtfx: One thing that I always baffled me about rape, is how does the guy get it in? Dry vagina seems like that would be impossible? Does it get wet even when the owner doesn't want any parts of what is happening?



A little spit can do wonders.

/remember that for when you start dating women who are older.
 
2012-02-05 03:51:36 PM  

sarah_t_s: gulogulo: RoyBatty: women bear no responsibility for their choices

Who said this? Ever?

I suggest you read this thread. Plenty of people are pointing out the story has holes in it, that all people admit they were out of their heads, the guy felt he was being coerced in to it, she admits to not putting up a fight. And she wasn't really sure she was raped until she'd had time to think about. Yet the wymon in this thread are all for putting the guys head on a pike and any mention that, perhaps, both of them are victims gets you on their ignore list and/or a torrent of abuse.

So in answer to your question: Right here, Right now.


Christ. First of all, I've read this entire thread and no one is saying she's absolved of responsibility. That's what my beef was why so many people are saying she has to take responsibility for her actions without there being any one, not a single person in htis thread, who has said she acted responsibility. Its a straw man argument.

Second of all, if you are going to use the pejorative (as I'm assuming that's why you continue to misspell it as some reference to feminazis who I have yet to see in this thread), it's womyn. Wymon sounds like you're some whiny Rastafarian.
 
2012-02-05 03:52:23 PM  

skoobx: Oh boy, I know some will get mad at this but.....

If she is unclear whether she was raped or not, how can he be sure if it was rape? I am not defending this guy, but it seems as though he may not have been exactly sober either. Is it ok for her to be so messed up that she can't be sure what happened, but he must be completely accountable even if he was just as inebriated? There are just too many things about this story that don't seem to paint the while picture. I get that he admitted she said stop several times. But she may have been having buyers remorse, but then she may have pulled him closer, our lifted her hips. Now, if it was me, I'm done as soon as she says no. No matter what. But I can see where a young man might get confused about a girl visibly showing signs of continuing intercourse, but saying no. Especially after she just blew two of my friends. Before you flame, I'm not saying it's right. It obviously was a horrible event for the girl. But as teenagers, we all make very horrible decisions. Some in here have said that it is rape if an underage person is under the influence. But if the boys were underage too, we can't expect them to make the greatest decisions ever either. There is just way too much missing in this story to declare anyone involved as rapists. At least in this article.
Glad she could find some closure though.


The easiest way for me to make sense out of something like this is to say yes, she was raped.

And then look at the boy involved and say, he was underage and as a juvenile had diminished judgment.

I mean, figure you're out in the woods with a close friend and your friend gets shot and it's an evil murderer, and your friend dies horribly in front of you and get wounded---you survive, but you're horribly traumatized and your friend is dead.

Now, figure the same situation, only instead of an evil murderer, it's some guy and it's either a tragic accident or the guy has some degree of negligence or malice that gives him some degree of culpability less than murder. Your friend still dies horribly in front of you and you get wounded--you survive. You are still horribly traumatized and your friend is dead.

The effect on you, as the surviving victim, is exactly the same in both cases.

The treatment for you, as the surviving victim, is exactly the same.

The difference is in the degree of guilt of the guy who fired the shots.

The injury to the victim here is rape.

The culpability of the man, then a boy, is very uncertain. And not relevant to the recovery of the victim.

They're two separate things.
 
2012-02-05 03:54:02 PM  

morgantx: blondski: All of these comments from women make me wonder if any woman makes it through life with out some sort of creepy ass touching them with out consent.

Honestly, many of us just get to the point where we barely even notice that sort of thing anymore.

I remember being out with my husband one day at a family buffet restaurant with our three kids. Some 40-something-year-old Mexican dude came up behind me on the line, put both of his hands on my hips, and thrust his groin into my butt. I just brushed his hands away and went on about my business, and my husband happened to look up to see me walking away from the guy with an angry look on my face while the guy was chuckling. So when I sat back down he asked me what happened, and I told him. And I was SHOCKED to see the look of rage in his face. I think he would've killed the guy if I hadn't stopped him.

Didn't make it much better when I told him that sort of thing happens a lot, but it does. I've had my breasts, butt, and even crotch grabbed while filling up the car with gas, shopping for groceries, or standing in line at a fast food place. I never really thought much of it until I saw my husband's reaction to it; I always just kind of thought that was normal male behavior.


What the fark is wrong with the world where groping strangers at a family buffet has become the status quo. If that is "normal male behavior," then I am clearly doing it wrong.
 
2012-02-05 03:55:41 PM  

AndreMA: namatad: huge amounts of real evidence

Really? What evidence? A screenshot without much context, that would be trivially easy to fake? A written account of a telephone conversation, based on admittedly imperfect memory and made after the fact?

Have any of her female classmates come forward and said "yeah, she warned me about those guys..."? Is there any evidence that any of the three guys were ever in serious trouble, before or after? Are there even phone records that such a conversation ever took place?

No. There are a lot of assertions and claims, which are at best poor evidence unless supported by other people or verifiable facts.

If you're ever called for jury duty, please bring a copy of your comment with you and provide it to the attorneys on both sides. You'll be out of there so fast you won't even get lunch.


LOL WHAT ??

I have huge amounts of real evidence of what happened to her.
do you know anyone with PTSD?
there are things which you literally can not fake.
it is one thing to pretend to have or claim to have a panic attack, but a real panic attack is another can of worms.

seeing the things which trigger a panic attack in an abuse victim is quite educational and frightening ...

um
why did you go to court and jury?
I am talking about reality . evidence of trauma ,....
I did not state "EVIDENCE WHICH would be allowed in court"
so .. um
slow down there and stop jumping all over the place ....

when taken in total, you can infer that the evidence is true or false ...
when 90% of the story turns out to be made up, you question the remaining 10%.
when 90% of the story turns out to be true, you have less grounds to question the remaining 10%

could the whole story of her life be made up?
of course.
100% could be fake.
but ...
given all the evidence, I would bet YOUR life on the fact that none of it was made up.
could she have FAKED the letter and package her mother mailed her? of course
could she have FAKED the letter and package her father mailed her? of course
could she have FAKED everything? of course ...

but ...
the amount of energy, time, money, effort, insanity, which would have been required to FAKE everything? is not possible ....
could she have faked the scars on her body? no.
were some self inflicted. yes ... but there was no hiding that ....
could she fake the historectomy scar and the removal of her uterus and cervix?
sure ....
could she have faked the xrays and surgical reports and medical reports and and and and and
of course ...

so either you assume everything is a lie or nothing ?
so yes
I have a huge amount of evidence.
I she were able to talk to lawyer, a large amount of that could be used in a court of law ... so what .... now what we are talking about here ...

we are talking about "do you believe" that some one was raped ....
yes she was raped, multiple times, by multiple people ...
this is a fact

could she prove this in court? of course not, he said, she said.
that does not change the facts ...

so
um
what was the POINT of your reply again, other than some sort of strange anger?
some sort of not wanting me to believe her?
 
2012-02-05 03:56:05 PM  
Lets just get the no means no stuff out of the way, and the rape is bad stuff. I'm with ya. I'm not trying to defend the guy, I don't want it read that way.

I don't get the impression from the article that the intercourse with D and the warehouse gang blowjob thing were things that happened at the same time. They talked about the warehouse, she didn't remember a lot about that. Then he seemed to change the subject to talking about the time they had sex... it sounded like she remembered that a lot clearer.

Not that it really matters, but I'm having a hard time working through the sequence of events.

I do think that I'm probably just going to close the window and forget that this article exists... I've gotten nothing from it
 
2012-02-05 03:56:21 PM  

mgshamster: ChuDogg: mgshamster: ChuDogg: What you are describing is a "freeze out " among the pickup artists. Think about, guys that routinely debate the best was to casually score chicks with no romantic involvement: have a word for it.

Holy fark. That's some seriously effed up shiat.

So doing exactly what a woman asks for is "seriously effed up shiat"?

Or are you just noting the irony in the way these guys talk about doing it.

Just to be clear for anybody following this convo: we're talking about a girl saying "no", and the guy listening and calling off the sexual interaction.

It's effed up in that it's a "technique" or "weapon" for a pick-up artist to use in order to get laid by a girl who might not otherwise be comfortable.

From the link: "Freeze-outs are one of the most powerful, but hardest to apply, weapons in your PUA arsenal."

They're not stopping out of respect for another human; they're stopping because they think it'll boost their own image and increase the chance of getting laid the next time around. It's just a long-term psychological game. That is what is effed up.


WTF is this pickup artist shiat? These guys seriously need to get a farking life.
 
2012-02-05 03:57:01 PM  

gulogulo: it's womyn.


It's a bullshiat word, I give it no countenance and spell it however I wish.

That this offends you pleases me greatly.
 
2012-02-05 03:57:30 PM  

Julie Cochrane:
The next day when I complained, he got a "how do I get out of this one" expression and then told me that since I wasn't male and didn't have a penis I didn't know how difficult it was sometimes to know which orifice you were in.

I couldn't believe what the hell I just heard. "In?" I echoed. "Don't you mean at?"

"No, in." He insisted.

It took a bit for the emotional numbness to wear off and my bullshiat detector to finally override my denial, but I finally broke things off.


I'm not defending the guy you mention, but it's possible to slip into the wrong hole and not notice a difference by touch alone. That's doubly true if there is a condom involved. Again, not saying that what he did was an accident, just that it's not automatically BS (and I'm not commenting on the rape-y-ness, this is strictly off-topic.)

I would've called BS too, except it's evidently happened to me. My wife is into anal, but I make a point to always ask first and then I take it slow. One night after we finished up what I thought was vaginal sex, she says to me that she'd never been farked in the ass so hard before, but enjoyed it. At some point I slipped out and continued in the wrong hole without missing a beat or even noticing (obviously she didn't say anything). My response was "Anal? What?", and then she's confused, maintaining that it's not even the first time I've switched without asking. Evidently I don't always notice if I go in the out-door. And that's even without condoms, my wife and I don't even use them when it's just us.

If you don't slow down, I suppose both places feel about the same to a guy so long as there is enough residual KY or natural lube on him. The difference in texture gets lost once he's pounding away.
 
2012-02-05 03:57:48 PM  
jtfx: One thing that I always baffled me about rape, is how does the guy get it in? Dry vagina seems like that would be impossible? Does it get wet even when the owner doesn't want any parts of what is happening?

Rape is generally a biological turn-on for the woman being raped. Around 10% of the time, women who are being "really raped" ie fighting and screaming still have an orgasm. This aspect is what farks with their minds when they recall the event.

Chicks dig jerks, especially alpha males who just throw-down and shag whom they please.
 
2012-02-05 03:57:49 PM  

KiplingKat872: It the automatic assumption that all accusations are false that makes it hard for women to come foraward. Not the 10% of rape charges that turn put to be false.

This wasn't even a story about hunting the guy down to throw in jail or revenge, but her courage and maturity in dealing with her past. That's why she did not give names. It was about her healing, not destroying him.

So why are so many people ready to call her a liar?



I can't speak for everyone... but why are you so ready to call anyone sexist who simply isn't willing to automatically believe every detail of an entirely unsubstantiated story? Are you capable of so little self-awareness that you don't realize that you're doing the exact same thing you accuse others of doing if they don't believe her story unquestioningly? Knee-jerk belief or disbelief could both be easily argued to stem from sexism.

Again: No evidence, no witnesses, and the only account of anything related to this story - even what one of the rapists supposedly said - is completely unverifiable and only as related from the memory of the accuser - and the accuser herself casts doubts on the reliability of her memory right from the get go. The story has some details which raise suspicion (that she flat out claims to have so little recollection of the event that she didn't even know she'd been raped herself, the substance abuse, childhood emotional instability) and she's now in precisely in the kind of position which would make creating or embellishing a story which generates this much sympathy and antipathy very valuable to her.

At this stage, according to all the details we have, there is no reason to believe or disbelieve her story, but certainly room for doubt. I don't know if she's telling the truth or lying. I've personally been given false accusations of rape before (search for a long post of mine further upthread for details) but I've also had women tell me entirely truthful stories of sexual assault. People do BOTH.

Your knee-jerk, sexist, "Of course she's telling the truth, who would make something like this up" is, at the very least, incredibly naive. People DO make up stories like that. They make up WORSE stories than that even. And on the flip-side, people actually do things like that to each other and even much worse than that.

So at this stage, it is entirely appropriate to remain skeptical either way until actual evidence or corroboration turns up. If you don't like that then blame your creator, this is the universe she/he/it built for us to inhabit. Some people suck, and it isn't always the person you first thought it was.
 
2012-02-05 03:58:54 PM  

RoyBatty: Um, no, this is now just you speech policing and bullying the thread. If we are having a conversation then none of us are rape apologists.

PERIOD.

Just describing anyone that disagrees with you as a rape apologist is rude and dishonest.


See, I used the quotes around "apologists" and didn't even use the term rape before it to indicate that it was not my own term. Just a lack of a better term for the people like you in this thread, who seem to feel the need to make arguments against the woman concerning things that were not in debate. So, no problem stopping using it since I never started it.

This kind of falls in line with your argument that women expect to be protected by men from other men. Again, this is a strawman. No one has made this argument or at least not pervasively enough for it to be a legitimate issue in this thread.

Finally...your bad experience with a woman is not what this thread is about. Moreover it definitely does not negate the fact that this woman may have had a bad experience too. It's accepted that men and women lie, but there's no reason at this point to believe she is.
 
2012-02-05 03:59:06 PM  
I don't think anyone's lying.

I think everyone involved is a dumb kid, and words like 'rape' doesn't really apply to kids who are doing dumb things while they're farked up or drunk. Rape is a malicious attack, not sex that you regret afterwards or feel weird about because you bit off more than you can chew; I've gone through that a time or two myself, but handling crazy shiat comes with the territory when you're learning how to be kinky.

At the base of it, though, rape isn't about being aroused or wanting to have sex. It's a form of attack, it's wanting to hurt someone physically and psychologically, and it doesn't seem like that's coming up here so much.

It took guts to talk to the guy and I'm glad she did it. I hope it's part of her healing process. I just can't find myself filled with righteous anger at him; they were both dumb kids. He just happens to be on the side of dumb that's bigger and stronger.
 
2012-02-05 03:59:32 PM  
it is a weak and pathetic specimen of homo sapien that needs to gang up on a young and impaired female to satisfy their lustful and base desires.
a bunch of f*cking winners in fact that i wouldn't consider quite human and would destroy out of hand should that decision be left to me.
 
2012-02-05 04:00:06 PM  

sarah_t_s: gulogulo: it's womyn.

It's a bullshiat word, I give it no countenance and spell it however I wish.

That this offends you pleases me greatly.


It doesn't offend me. Just trying to help you look less like an idiot since you're the only one using it. But, to each their own, I guess.
 
2012-02-05 04:01:16 PM  
Late to the conversation here, and quite honestly, don't have the time to read all 540+ posts. Maybe I will later.


This article and the swarming of fellow females complimenting her on how heroic she is misses an obvious point. She was in a bad place for whatever reason back then and put herself in a situation she wasn't ready to handle. Teenagers are clinically proven to be underdeveloped in the brain to handle complex emotions, nuances in understanding their actions, and the importance of their actions on others. It sickens me that she placed all of her baggage on an idiot kid who was drunk and horney, when she herself was messed up in the head and drunk when the unfortunate misunderstanding occurred.

As she grew up the first thing she should have done was look in the mirror and been fairer with her assessment of the whole situation. Parents tell their kids to stay away from booze, pot, skeezy warehouses, and packs of hormonal teenage boys for a reason. She made some bad choices and should have owned them in the name of true feminism.

A similar situation happened to my sister-in-law, where she was rebellious, biatchy to her parents, older sister, and myself all the time, and ignored our advice to stay away from a group of teenage boys when we were all vacationing in Florida. The sister-in-law went off with one of the guys to let him get all to way to third base and make a run for home. Apparently she felt like it was going to far when he was almost finished, let him continue (according to her account she didn't make a loud fuss) and tried to tell us she was assaulted on the trip.

Her sister and I made it pretty clear to her she was re-writing history. You cannot put yourself in situations you know are wrong, grow up a little bit, become ashamed at your stupidity, and then claim the guy is evil. Her sister, my wife, made some pretty idiotic choices in high school and college, as many do, and owned her choices. Didn't feel proud about some of them, but owned them.

The author of the article needs to do the same and stop letting herself wallow in victimhood.
 
2012-02-05 04:01:24 PM  
Dont just teach your sons that no means no. Teach them them not to get themselves into a situation where its their word against a woman's, they will loose. That's just the way it is.

Even the school skank that will blow anyone at the party once shes had a couple of pops can make your life a living hell. You have zero control over the "conceptual" switch. Piss her off or if she comes to her senses and resolves to stop her self hating getting back a daddy ways, that switch gets flipped and there isn't a damn thing you can do about it other than get a good lawyer. That whore you knew will show up in the courtroom she's a perfect little princess who was preyed upon by you and anyone who says otherwise is "attacking the victim":
upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size


Teach your daughters that they cant rely on no means no. Teach them that have have some power here and with that power comes responsibility. If you dress like a whore you might just get treated like one. Sure the law might be on your side but your therapy is going last a lot longer than whatever jail time your "attacker"

Oh, and these lessons start earlier than you think

drumardar.files.wordpress.comView Full Size
 
2012-02-05 04:01:38 PM  

olddinosaur: Hmmm, let's see:

She showed up at a place where low-life guys hang out.;
She was blasted to the gills on dope of some kind;
She was so blasted she does not remember what happened, but she says it was rape;
There are no details as to what they were charged with, where the trial took place, or whether they were convicted;
She cannot recall simple details even to this day;
She doesn't do what any sensible person would do, which is hunt down the bastards and kill them.


The whole thing does not ring true to me. I think there was a party, everyone was stoned to the armpits, and the whole thing got totally out of hand.


I don't know if her story is true or not, but if you honestly think that every sexual assault get reported and tried, and that people don't block out traumatic events then I have a bridge to sell you.
 
2012-02-05 04:02:24 PM  
Good friend of mine got raped in college. She was a virgin, at the time (not that it really matters). She was at a party, wanted to go home, so she asked an acquaintance if he'd walk her home safely. He agreed, but on the way, he said he needed to stop by his dorm room for something. So, she followed him to his room, at which point he suddenly struck her and while she was dazed and nearly unconsious, proceeded to rape her.

She tried to continue going to the school, but she had a hard time functioning. Her coach (she played soccer) noticed her extreme personality shift and eventually pried the truth out of her. He then took steps to apprehend the rapist. The rapist just happened to be on the football team, and once the administration of this very Christian school got wind of what was coming down the pipes, they did everything they could to block the soccer coach from pursing the matter (I believe they threatened to fire him, though I'm not entirely sure of that).

It all ended with the football player getting a slap on the wrist, and told not to behave in such a manner. The girl was told the matter was taken care of. She left the school, of course -- a year later she tried to commit suicide. The fact that she didn't succeed is really shocking given what she did to make it happen.

Anyway, the girl would never tell me the boy's name that did all this to her. I'd've killed him, if I learned -- which is probably, at least in a small part, why she kept it a secret. The more likely reason is just that she didn't want to talk/re-live it.

/rapists should be castrated. I could really care less if that sounds barbaric.
 
2012-02-05 04:03:58 PM  

lohphat: John Buck 41:
Keep this up and I may delete the yellow. As long as we don't debate the (de)merits of raw milk.

Disagreeing doesn't get people on my ignore list. Ad hominem and other desperate debating tactics do. There are intentional trolls who also are on ignore. The signal to noise ratio demands it sometimes.

If we ever meet, the milkshakes are on me. Mine pasteurized, yours filled with deadly cooties.

/I keed, I keed


Yum!
 
2012-02-05 04:04:31 PM  

someahole: I would've called BS too, except it's evidently happened to me. My wife is into anal, but I make a point to always ask first and then I take it slow. One night after we finished up what I thought was vaginal sex, she says to me that she'd never been farked in the ass so hard before, but enjoyed it. At some point I slipped out and continued in the wrong hole without missing a beat or even noticing (obviously she didn't say anything). My response was "Anal? What?", and then she's confused, maintaining that it's not even the first time I've switched without asking. Evidently I don't always notice if I go in the out-door. And that's even without condoms, my wife and I don't even use them when it's just us.


I can vouch for this too. Also, I want to party with this guy.
 
2012-02-05 04:05:02 PM  

Gwynplaine: Lets just get the no means no stuff out of the way, and the rape is bad stuff. I'm with ya. I'm not trying to defend the guy, I don't want it read that way.

I don't get the impression from the article that the intercourse with D and the warehouse gang blowjob thing were things that happened at the same time. They talked about the warehouse, she didn't remember a lot about that. Then he seemed to change the subject to talking about the time they had sex... it sounded like she remembered that a lot clearer.

Not that it really matters, but I'm having a hard time working through the sequence of events.

I do think that I'm probably just going to close the window and forget that this article exists... I've gotten nothing from it


I reread that just now.

Me: I remember saying no, D****.

D: At least at one point, you said, 'No, let's stop.' Maybe a couple of times. But then everything would be OK. I remember afterward you were really emotionally unresponsive, not talking. You left in a hurry. When I heard that you were in a bad place, that's the first thing I kind of thought of.

Me: Well, yeah.

D: I do want you to know that I am so farking sorry for any pain I caused you. I did like you. There was no disrespect or ... I never saw you as a piece of meat or some biatch. You were a farked up little girl and I can see that more clearly now.

Me: Well, I was...and my background contributed....I craved that sexual attention and put myself in bad situations. And I didn't know how to ... I said no, but I didn't scream or bite or kick because that's not what I knew how to do. I just asked you nicely to stop.


She seems passive and unable to will herself to get up and leave. She lets this happen to her against her will. She cedes control to the boy.

I think telling girls that "no means no" and then insisting in forums that "no means no" is probably not a successful tactic.

I think helping girls and women understand that historically, "no means maybe" and "here's how you ensure it means no" is a better tactic.

And that we should raise our kid with enough self-respect, self-esteem, power or whatever to get the hell out of situations they don't want to be in.
 
2012-02-05 04:05:28 PM  
Ladies of Fark

[image from images.blogstream.com too old to be available]


I'm sorry for the trauma you've endured. On behalf of the men who don't suck, I wish you a Happy Valentine's Day.
 
2012-02-05 04:06:05 PM  

jtfx: One thing that I always baffled me about rape, is how does the guy get it in? Dry vagina seems like that would be impossible? Does it get wet even when the owner doesn't want any parts of what is happening?


yup, sometimes
and that has been used by the defense to argue that it was not rape.
cant be rape if she got wet your honor ....

so sad
 
2012-02-05 04:07:03 PM  
I have to add, I'm actually REALLY impressed with Fark today.

Not everybody agrees that the situation in the original article was "rape rape", and not everybody agrees on the level of culpability that the guy from TFA actually has. But the attitudes I'm seeing - even from those accused of being "rape apologists" - are refreshing. So many of you guys are absolutely horrified at the idea of rape, and many of you have expressed that you will NOT go along with a woman "playing hard to get" because you don't enjoy non-consensual sex.

It's not often that I feel inspired and impressed with Farkers. Don't know what you guys have been drinking today, but thank you!
 
2012-02-05 04:07:08 PM  

RoyBatty: John Buck 41: Keep this up and I may delete the yellow. As long as we don't debate the (de)merits of raw milk.

It's funny because you're farked in pink as: "Trolled Kennedy daughter thread", which you didn't need to do at all, you just felt like being a gratuitous asshole.


I don't remember that thread, but I'm guessing you think I'm a troll 'cos I said something negative about Ted?

Too bad. I had you as a green Favorite as 'fellow Doors fan'.
 
2012-02-05 04:07:32 PM  

Memnoch: Fact:

The only consent is enthusiastic consent.


I think that's the only safe path.
 
2012-02-05 04:09:08 PM  
Man...I wish I had some beer to drink while I read this thread.

Actually, I just wish I had some beer. Stupid Indiana liquor laws.
 
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