robsul82: Treygreen13: It's an M and a B!

...I never saw the M B before. Holy shiat, lol.

I did not either. WTF. My mind = blown

chimp_ninja: Josh Hamilton is rapidly climbing the "Top 10 'What Could have Been' Players in MLB history" list for the year 2020. He'll be right up there with Ted Williams Who Didn't Fight In Wars, a host of African-Americans like Oscar Charleston who never got to compete on the grand stage, Tony Conigliaro, etc.

Don't forget Wood-Prior-Zambrano bringing the Cubs their first WS in a century, if not for two bum arms and a bum head.

I can't wait until the part when we find out he also relapsed on coke.

Also I lost all respect for him the "first time" he relapsed... I can respect the fact that it's hard to remain sober, I can't respect the body shots... I feel bad for his wife. She probably feels she can't leave him or she'll be the cause of his downfall. Poor woman.

Addict or not, he's a tool.

IlGreven: chimp_ninja: Josh Hamilton is rapidly climbing the "Top 10 'What Could have Been' Players in MLB history" list for the year 2020. He'll be right up there with Ted Williams Who Didn't Fight In Wars, a host of African-Americans like Oscar Charleston who never got to compete on the grand stage, Tony Conigliaro, etc.

Don't forget Wood-Prior-Zambrano bringing the Cubs their first WS in a century, if not for two bum arms and a bum head.

#1 on this list... Daryl Strawberry. He could have been the best ever if he'd had his head on straight.

oh man Sherlocks????? Im surprised there aren't NEW pictures of him with skanks on a bar.

FreakinB: buckeyebrain: IlGreven: chimp_ninja: Josh Hamilton is rapidly climbing the "Top 10 'What Could have Been' Players in MLB history" list for the year 2020. He'll be right up there with Ted Williams Who Didn't Fight In Wars, a host of African-Americans like Oscar Charleston who never got to compete on the grand stage, Tony Conigliaro, etc.

Don't forget Wood-Prior-Zambrano bringing the Cubs their first WS in a century, if not for two bum arms and a bum head.

#1 on this list... Daryl Strawberry. He could have been the best ever if he'd had his head on straight.

How about Ken Griffey Jr. if he didn't have all of those injuries?

How about Eric Davis. One of the most fun and exciting players of my lifetime, and an absolutely dominant player for a short time (like, there was a time when I thought he was going to be the Michael Jordan of baseball and bring the game to a whole new level), but he played the game so hard that he wrecked his body.

FreakinB: buckeyebrain: IlGreven: chimp_ninja: Josh Hamilton is rapidly climbing the "Top 10 'What Could have Been' Players in MLB history" list for the year 2020. He'll be right up there with Ted Williams Who Didn't Fight In Wars, a host of African-Americans like Oscar Charleston who never got to compete on the grand stage, Tony Conigliaro, etc.

Don't forget Wood-Prior-Zambrano bringing the Cubs their first WS in a century, if not for two bum arms and a bum head.

#1 on this list... Daryl Strawberry. He could have been the best ever if he'd had his head on straight.

How about Ken Griffey Jr. if he didn't have all of those injuries?

Griffey's definitely up there, but he's a first-ballot, near-unanimous HOFer as it is, so it's not like he was a total disappointment. Would much rather have seen him break Aaron's record instead of 'Roid Boy.

cookiefleck: If he was driving himself and putting others in danger, then yes, get him out of the bar. If not, I don't think it's anyone elses responsoblity to keep josh sober other than josh.

It is true that he is the one who needs to keep himself sober in the end but it does help to have a support system and people trying to help you stay on the right path.

DaJesus: Well the theory is that you never are cured from being an alcoholic.

I don't have any experience dealing with addiction or being close to an addict but I find it strange that there aren't people out there than can learn to control their impulses and not go balls out every time they have a drink. Self control can be taught, can't it?

9beers: find it strange that there aren't people out there than can learn to control their impulses and not go balls out every time they have a drink. Self control can be taught, can't it?

There are people who can control themselves. They are the ones who are not alcoholics. Self control can be taught to an extent. For alcoholics like Josh, that self control is used staying completely sober. The more you drink, the harder it is to have self control, so they go off the deep end. The same applies for most addictions. I can go into a casino, put $50 down, lose it and walk out. Gambling addicts can't. "If it is ok once, why not again, and hey, maybe I will come back out on top!"

There are numerous studies that research addiction and genetic links. It might boil down to the fact that some people's brains are wired that when it gets that hit of alcohol, coke, endorphins(gambling, shopping, weight training, eating, etc), etc, it simply wants more. That feeling of need or want is different for everyone and requires different levels of self control to placate.

I know there are also studies that show self control is not infinite. Using self control to stop one impulse can make you more susceptible to temptation to another if it comes in a certain time frame afterwards.

9beers: DaJesus: Well the theory is that you never are cured from being an alcoholic.

I don't have any experience dealing with addiction or being close to an addict but I find it strange that there aren't people out there than can learn to control their impulses and not go balls out every time they have a drink. Self control can be taught, can't it?

Also, I find it amusing to be having this conversation with someone named 9beers :)

Di Atribe: DaJesus: Well the theory is that you never are cured from being an alcoholic......

As someone who is not an alcoholic, but is friends with a few.... thank you for explaining this. It really does help. I am at a complete loss when it comes to trying to understand what's going on with them. I want to help, but I haven't the slightest idea how. But the crutch thing... that's something to think about.

No problem. Disclaimer! I have no training in psychology or any therapeutical field. In fact, without spell check, that last sentence would be atrocious. I am just going by what I have read and seen over the years

DaJesus: Also, I find it amusing to be having this conversation with someone named 9beers :)

Hey now, I know my limits.

9beers: DaJesus: Also, I find it amusing to be having this conversation with someone named 9beers :)

Hey now, I know my limits.

The question is, what kind of beer are ya drinking? Bud Light at 4.2% abv or Goose Island Bourbon County Stout at 14.5% abv? ;)

buckeyebrain: FreakinB: buckeyebrain: IlGreven: chimp_ninja: Josh Hamilton is rapidly climbing the "Top 10 'What Could have Been' Players in MLB history" list for the year 2020. He'll be right up there with Ted Williams Who Didn't Fight In Wars, a host of African-Americans like Oscar Charleston who never got to compete on the grand stage, Tony Conigliaro, etc.

Don't forget Wood-Prior-Zambrano bringing the Cubs their first WS in a century, if not for two bum arms and a bum head.

#1 on this list... Daryl Strawberry. He could have been the best ever if he'd had his head on straight.

How about Ken Griffey Jr. if he didn't have all of those injuries?

Griffey's definitely up there, but he's a first-ballot, near-unanimous HOFer as it is, so it's not like he was a total disappointment. Would much rather have seen him break Aaron's record instead of 'Roid Boy.

Eh, I dispute that he's a first-ballot HOF'er. In fact, in any other era, he wouldn't be. But now we're so desperate to find a "clean" elite baseball player that we're willing to go with potential over actuality. (Plus, with all the injuries he had, it makes me wonder if he really was clean to begin with).

mitchcumstein1: TravisBickle62: Josh, I hate to break it to you but that "God" stuff is all bullshiat, there is no God, the universe is pretty much an empty void

Prove it.

...the extraordinary claim here is that there is a God.

If you killed a father at a baseball you'd drink too.

/Poor Josh. He drinks to forget the orphaned son's pain... :(

IlGreven: Eh, I dispute that he's a first-ballot HOF'er. In fact, in any other era, he wouldn't be. But now we're so desperate to find a "clean" elite baseball player that we're willing to go with potential over actuality. (Plus, with all the injuries he had, it makes me wonder if he really was clean to begin with).

630 home runs wouldn't be a first-ballot in any other era? Really???

IlGreven: Eh, I dispute that he's a first-ballot HOF'er. In fact, in any other era, he wouldn't be. But now we're so desperate to find a "clean" elite baseball player that we're willing to go with potential over actuality. (Plus, with all the injuries he had, it makes me wonder if he really was clean to begin with).

The only era where he wouldn't be a Hall of Famer is "pre-1947". But only because he wouldn't have been allowed to play.

IlGreven: Eh, I dispute that he's a first-ballot HOF'er. In fact, in any other era, he wouldn't be. But now we're so desperate to find a "clean" elite baseball player that we're willing to go with potential over actuality. (Plus, with all the injuries he had, it makes me wonder if he really was clean to begin with).

is this some sort of a joke? i never personally gave a crap one way or the other about griffey junior, since he played most of his career in the "other league"... but there's little doubt that he was the best, or one of the few best, in his generation. i suppose you also think that alex rodriguez and albert pujols will be very much "maybes" when it comes time for them to be voted in (or not voted in). i counted 102 people on the "top 1000 homerun hitters" list who are in the hall of fame, but have less home runs than griffey (number 5 of all time). in fact, the next eligible (retired for five years) player who did not admit to steroid use who is not in the hall is no. 38, dave kingman.

From what I saw when playing against him in high school, with a dad like he has, I am not surprised by his problems. Dude had Josh in the batting cage so much during tournaments at our field, we had to kick them out numerous times. I felt bad for him really.
/ He grounded out against me the only time I faced him... :)

One less addict to talk about. No loss to the world.

I bet Josh envies the players from the 60,70,and 80s, just for the fact that their every slip-up didn't immediately end up on somebody's Facebook page.

He's a big boy, folks. As long as he isn't driving drunk, assaulting fans, or beating the shiat out of his wife and kids, what he does is his own farking business.

And if it affects his playing ability and limits his career, that's his decision.

buckeyebrain: IlGreven: Eh, I dispute that he's a first-ballot HOF'er. In fact, in any other era, he wouldn't be. But now we're so desperate to find a "clean" elite baseball player that we're willing to go with potential over actuality. (Plus, with all the injuries he had, it makes me wonder if he really was clean to begin with).

630 home runs wouldn't be a first-ballot in any other era? Really???

630 home runs would make Ken Griffey Jr. a Hall of Famer even if he was basically Jim Rice-- a big oaf who played indifferent defense and ran like he had a piano on his back.

Griffey was a slugger, but for the first 12 years of his career, he was also a premier defender at a difficult position. He was a complete hitter who drew walks and limited strikeouts at a respectable rate for a slugger. He was an smart baserunner who stole at a high percentage. He was/is a fantastic ambassador for the game.

If he retired in 2000, his career batting line could be summarized as a .296/.380/.568 hitter with 438 HR, 171 SB, as a CF with 10 consecutive Gold Gloves. (I recognize that GG voting is screwy, but Griffey was legitimately good.) He could have gotten into the Hall then, retired at age 30. He obviously wasn't the same guy after the injuries, but he was still a productive player overall (OPS+ of 114 from 2001-2010), although he should have moved to RF earlier.

Not only is Griffey a first-ballot HOFer, he's an inner-circle guy. And even still, he would make a good addition to the "what could have been" list.

buckeyebrain: #1 on this list... Daryl Strawberry. He could have been the best ever if he'd had his head on straight.

Doc Gooden as well, while we're discussing mid-80s Mets. His 1985 season was one of the best individual seasons by any pitcher in the history of the game, and he was 20 years old. In a fair world, it would have been his second consecutive Cy Young...at age 20.

IlGreven: Don't forget Wood-Prior-Zambrano bringing the Cubs their first WS in a century, if not for two bum arms and a bum head.

I don't know that Zambrano ever had the potential of the other two. Kerry Wood could have been a very interesting pitcher in the Nolan Ryan mold, even if his other flaws kept him from true greatness. Mark Prior could have been amazing, and is a great pick for that list.

Baseball sucks.

Always has, always will.

Addiction doesn't care about wealth/education/income/talent/social status/fame/etc.
It's an equal opportunity destroyer.

/Lindsay Lohan
//Amy Winehouse
///WInona Ryder ?
////Ad nasueum