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(Yahoo) Interesting World Court says Germany has immunity from lawsuits over Nazi atrocities, says the country was only following orders   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 61
More: Interesting, Nazis, German war crimes, International Court of Justice, immunity, Wehrmacht, Hague, Camp David Accords, German-Italian  
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4178 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Feb 2012 at 11:51 AM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»   |    Get this fabulous T-Shirt and impress the methane out of your friends! shirt it!



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J. Frank Parnell
2012-02-03 11:54:13 AM
"world court? WTF"

opens article

"Oh, it's just the UN"
 
Calm Down You Spaz
2012-02-03 11:56:01 AM
Well, did nazi that coming
 
Jake Havechek
2012-02-03 11:57:26 AM
Well, we all know what happened after the Versailles Screwjob.
 
Magorn [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 11:58:06 AM
J. Frank Parnell: "world court? WTF"

opens article

"Oh, it's just the UN"

But a bit of the UN able to issue binding rulings on it members.
 
Primitive Screwhead
2012-02-03 11:58:08 AM
i36.photobucket.com
 
rkiller1
2012-02-03 11:58:24 AM
At minimum then Germany must set up a quota-based Affirmative Action program to hire more [fill in the blank]. 1865, 1945, let's call the whole thing off.
 
cbackous [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 11:59:10 AM
I thought they were on vacation during that time?
 
mudpants
2012-02-03 11:59:16 AM
Appeal and retrial in another 60 years ?
 
PsiChi
2012-02-03 11:59:30 AM
You know who else said they had immunity?
 
ha-ha-guy
2012-02-03 11:59:30 AM
Well we're pushing 70 terms on this. Coupled with the fact they got their country leveled over this (and the Nazi government is gone), I think statute of limitations might be up.
 
Millennium
2012-02-03 11:59:42 AM
Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?
 
FormlessOne
2012-02-03 12:01:28 PM
FTA: The U.N.'s highest court confirmed Friday that Germany has legal immunity from being sued in foreign courts by victims of World War II Nazi atrocities.

That bold bit is kinda important, subby. It prevents countries like Italy from exploiting their own laws in order to use Germany as a piggy bank, especially given that Germany is one of the relatively few stable economic powers left in the EU.
 
indarwinsshadow
2012-02-03 12:03:10 PM
Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

Try that argument in Canada regarding first nations. It gets shot down every time.

.
..
 
FormlessOne
2012-02-03 12:03:15 PM
Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

The point is that reparations were paid a long time ago. That's why Germany has immunity - in return for paying out billions in post-WWII reparations.

What you're seeing here is a poor country hoping to exploit a rich country, and the international courts realizing that.
 
Loki-L
2012-02-03 12:03:17 PM
World Court says Germany has immunity from lawsuits over Nazi atrocities, says the country was only following orders

More like double jeopardy. Germany has already paid restitution once and shouldn't have to pay again and again like a criminal should only be punished for any given crime once.

I think everyone in Germany will be glad when in a few years/decades they can finally make the same argument about WWII and the holocaust that Americans make in regards to slavery e.g. nobody alive participated in it.
 
BizarreMan
2012-02-03 12:03:33 PM
What about suing the Italian government for the deportation? Without their complicity he would have never ended up in Germany? Yea it sucks, but come on, it's like coming up with reparations for slavery. Who forks out the money?
 
Magorn [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 12:05:42 PM
Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

Well if you could say that Germany somehow still realzied a net benefit from thier wrongful acts, I'd say there was a case but since the actual outcome of WWII was the Allies letting Russia ass-rape Germany for about a month as revenge for the Battle of Stalingrad, before finally forcing Garmany's surrender, and Germany having only the "rubble production" sector of its economy left after the war, I may be inclined to call it a "push"- at least as far as the Italians are concerned. The Holocaust survivors, OTOH deserved anything they wanted, and I'm just sorry we didn't carve the state of Israel of of the Rhineland instead of Palestine. There'd be a lot less problems in the world today if we had.
 
watson.t.hamster
2012-02-03 12:09:11 PM
Assuming you got in right at the tail end of the atrocities an 18 year old Nazi would be 85 now. And that's the absolute youngest, obviously the leaders would be much older.

Even the History channel has forgotten about the Nazis for the most part, maybe it is time to move on.

/plus we hanged a bunch of them. Really if you're going to be mad at anyone it should be WWII era Japanese. No trial, no apologizes, no acknowledgement of any wrongdoing whatsoever.
 
J. Frank Parnell
2012-02-03 12:10:32 PM
Magorn: J. Frank Parnell: "world court? WTF"

opens article

"Oh, it's just the UN"

But a bit of the UN able to issue binding rulings on it members.

I'm just screwing with the NWO boys.
 
Amos Quito
2012-02-03 12:11:20 PM
3.bp.blogspot.com

Looks like the caboose is in sight.
 
Jake Havechek
2012-02-03 12:11:56 PM
PsiChi: You know who else said they had immunity?

Those South African guys in Lethal Weapon 2?
 
Mearen
2012-02-03 12:12:48 PM
9 9 9 9.
 
Amos Quito
2012-02-03 12:14:18 PM
FTA: "German representatives argued last year that if the world court sided with Italy it would open floodgates for restitution claims by individuals around the world, a situation it tried to avoid in negotiating reparation accords with Israel..."


Paying reparations to a nation that didn't exist during the war?
 
quoinguy
2012-02-03 12:21:20 PM
With the "logic" these Italians are using, why aren't they suing the Italian government for cozying up to the Germans and allowing the deportation?

Germany paid their punishment, up to the point the a-hole Russians split the country, and then finished it after reunification.
 
chuckufarlie
2012-02-03 12:21:24 PM
Germany is demanding that Belgians kidnapped during World War 2 to be slave laborers in Germany pay a whopping 17% in taxes on the compensation given to them. It is outrageous but not surprising at all and they probably feel fully entitled to it as nations become more childish, more aggressive and more insular and self serving.
 
capt.hollister
2012-02-03 12:21:50 PM
Magorn: Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

Well if you could say that Germany somehow still realzied a net benefit from thier wrongful acts, I'd say there was a case but since the actual outcome of WWII was the Allies letting Russia ass-rape Germany for about a month as revenge for the Battle of Stalingrad, before finally forcing Garmany's surrender, and Germany having only the "rubble production" sector of its economy left after the war, I may be inclined to call it a "push"- at least as far as the Italians are concerned. The Holocaust survivors, OTOH deserved anything they wanted, and I'm just sorry we didn't carve the state of Israel of of the Rhineland instead of Palestine. There'd be a lot less problems in the world today if we had.

The Russians continued to rape, plunder, ass-rape and rape-rape the part of Germany they controlled, long afer WW2 ended.

There is also this bit: Germany had argued that the Italian ruling threw into doubt a restitution system put in place after the Nazis' defeat that has seen Germany pay tens of billions of dollars in reparations since the 1950s.

As someone else already pointed out, Mr. Ferrini should have sued the Italian government.

In Italy, the level of denial about their role in WW2 is staggering.
 
maxheck
2012-02-03 12:23:43 PM
Millennium:

Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

I'm a Celtish WAS with black hair and blue eyes. The Romans did all sorts of awful things to my people. I could sue for reparations, or I could just get over it.

And how much money could I get out of the Romans these days anyway?
 
TheShavingofOccam123 [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 12:25:38 PM
This just indemnifies the US corporations that helped Nazi Germany commit those atrocities through their European subsidiaries. GM, Ford, IBM...
 
Amos Quito
2012-02-03 12:28:22 PM
capt.hollister: In Italy, the level of denial about their role in WW2 is staggering.


Wait, didn't we all agree to dump all the blame on everything from 1914 to 1947 on Germany?

Makes things neat, tidy and simple.
 
maxheck
2012-02-03 12:34:17 PM
Holy clams! Nicky actually posted outside of an ACC thread! Without his 50 cents even!
 
CygnusDarius [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 12:36:28 PM
I thought all the trials were done. I mean, we even had Nazi hunters,
 
Lipo
2012-02-03 12:38:13 PM
maxheck: Millennium:

Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

I'm a Celtish WAS with black hair and blue eyes. The Romans did all sorts of awful things to my people. I could sue for reparations, or I could just get over it.

And how much money could I get out of the Romans these days anyway?

Well, if you sue the Pope, you could go after the Nazis and Romans both at the same time. You should ask for his hat.
 
beta_plus
2012-02-03 12:39:54 PM
You know who else demanded sovereign immunity?

collegefootballbelt.com
 
itwasabright
2012-02-03 12:39:56 PM
Germany or any other country shouldn't worry, the Onion has figured out a way for governments to get out of their obligations

US Gov't Wipes Out National Debt (new window)
 
bVork
2012-02-03 12:41:22 PM
indarwinsshadow: Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

Try that argument in Canada regarding first nations. It gets shot down every time.

.
..

There has been an unbroken line of governance in Canada since 1763. Every change of power or governmental reorganization since then has been approved by both the outgoing government and the incoming government. Therefore, the current Canadian state does hold responsibility for actions committed against the First Nations (and the Doukhobors, and the Chinese, and the Japanese, and so on...) and should try to make it right. On the other hand, the Nazi state was destroyed in 1945 and denazification thoroughly eliminated any vestiges from future German states, so the modern state should not be held responsible for what happened under the Nazi regime.
 
capt.hollister
2012-02-03 12:42:39 PM
maxheck: Millennium:

Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

I'm a Celtish WAS with black hair and blue eyes. The Romans did all sorts of awful things to my people. I could sue for reparations, or I could just get over it.

And how much money could I get out of the Romans these days anyway?

Well... good point, but most of the Roman soldiers in Britannia were not actually Italian, so who would you sue ?.
 
ha-ha-guy
2012-02-03 12:46:55 PM
capt.hollister: In Italy, the level of denial about their role in WW2 is staggering.

Random CSB:

I'm stuck with a rather annoying Italian guy on mass transit. So being an asshole I bring up WWII hoping he'll switch to glaring at me and shutting up. Instead:

Italian Guy: No, no, we didn't do anything during World War II!
Me: I know you guys sucked. Germany had to bail you out everywhere but Ethiopia.
Italian Guy: No, no, our armed forces fought well and many Americans said we fought harder than the Germans (ahahahaha).
Me: Oh so you did actively support Hitler with force of arms then?
Italian Guy: *leaves*
 
maxheck
2012-02-03 12:47:12 PM
Lipo:

maxheck: Millennium:

Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

I'm a Celtish WAS with black hair and blue eyes. The Romans did all sorts of awful things to my people. I could sue for reparations, or I could just get over it.

And how much money could I get out of the Romans these days anyway?

Well, if you sue the Pope, you could go after the Nazis and Romans both at the same time. You should ask for his hat.

Well, there wasn't a pope at the time... I could backdate a guy named Peter -maybe-.

The upshot being that I will be glad when this particular breed of tribalism diies off.
 
PsiChi
2012-02-03 12:47:32 PM
Jake Havechek: PsiChi: You know who else said they had immunity?

Those South African guys in Lethal Weapon 2?

Yep.
 
toraque [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 12:56:19 PM
ha-ha-guy: capt.hollister: In Italy, the level of denial about their role in WW2 is staggering.

Random CSB:

I'm stuck with a rather annoying Italian guy on mass transit. So being an asshole I bring up WWII hoping he'll switch to glaring at me and shutting up. Instead:

Italian Guy: No, no, we didn't do anything during World War II!
Me: I know you guys sucked. Germany had to bail you out everywhere but Ethiopia.
Italian Guy: No, no, our armed forces fought well and many Americans said we fought harder than the Germans (ahahahaha).
Me: Oh so you did actively support Hitler with force of arms then?
Italian Guy: *leaves*

It's kind of interesting how of all of the nations that fought against the allies in WW2, only Germany really owned up to the past. None of the others really want to admit the horrific things they did-not Japan, not Italy, not even Canada.

I bet we even get a thread full of Canadians pretending they didn't have anything to do with the Nazis, like they weren't behind the great Poutine Holocaust.
 
Amos Quito
2012-02-03 12:58:25 PM
CygnusDarius: I thought all the trials were done. I mean, we even had Nazi hunters,


i.dailymail.co.uk

You mean like this guy?

Some question his integrity. (new window)
 
indarwinsshadow
2012-02-03 01:32:11 PM
bVork: indarwinsshadow: Millennium: Makes sense to me. The government in whose name these atrocities were committed no longer exists, and most of the people who committed the atrocities are long dead. There's even a decades-long break in the continuity of the state itself: reunification is still, relatively speaking, quite recent.

What guilty party is left, then, to pay reparations?

Try that argument in Canada regarding first nations. It gets shot down every time.

.
..

There has been an unbroken line of governance in Canada since 1763. Every change of power or governmental reorganization since then has been approved by both the outgoing government and the incoming government. Therefore, the current Canadian state does hold responsibility for actions committed against the First Nations (and the Doukhobors, and the Chinese, and the Japanese, and so on...) and should try to make it right. On the other hand, the Nazi state was destroyed in 1945 and denazification thoroughly eliminated any vestiges from future German states, so the modern state should not be held responsible for what happened under the Nazi regime.

Um...wrong. Canada only became a country in 1865. And we've only had a Canadian made constitution and bill of rights since 1982. Before that we had the British North America act (1867-1975). Quebec still hasn't signed the charter. Newfoundland joined confederation in 1949. Your so wrong it's not even worth going on. Apologists always use the same weak arguments. It's all about the money. It's not about making anything "right".
 
chuggernaught
2012-02-03 02:24:26 PM
Not sure I want to be any where near this topic, but here goes...

Don't you suppose they paid for their crimes with defeat on the battlefield, total collapse of their economy and infrastructure, national shame for their disgusting war crimes and human rights atrocities, and decades of soviet occupation over half their country?

And it's being pushed by Italy? Really?
 
FMLYHM
2012-02-03 02:28:55 PM
Let me tell you about another group of people who were "just following orders"


a1.ec-images.myspacecdn.com

Oh wait, that's the group I was talking about. Damn it where was I again? Oh yeah, smoking kills try some of this....Chewlies gum.
 
Diogenes The Cynic
2012-02-03 02:33:28 PM
One of the weird things in all of this is Germany only recently paid off the terms of the Treaty of Versailles.

Heck, the U.S. still has living children of Civil War veterans.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004623.html
 
Magorn [TotalFark]
2012-02-03 03:34:08 PM
Diogenes The Cynic: One of the weird things in all of this is Germany only recently paid off the terms of the Treaty of Versailles.

Heck, the U.S. still has living children of Civil War veterans.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004623.html

t'other day i read that John Tyler, our 10th president, who was born in 1790 has two living grandchildren, in what amounts to almost a real-life "Rule against perpetuities" problem
 
TV's Vinnie
2012-02-03 04:02:26 PM
We now have a statue of limitations for waging the Holocaust, yet copyrights can go on and on and on forever.

Let that sink in.
 
nocturn
2012-02-03 04:27:58 PM
I still want my 40 acres and a mule.
 
nread2010
2012-02-03 04:37:17 PM
The last time i checked the Catholic Church had a much longer, more prosperous history of torturing and killing people. The Nazis lasted a decade and got stomped. We forget quickly don't we?
 
Dracolich
2012-02-03 04:37:33 PM
FMLYHM: Let me tell you about another group of people who were "just following orders"


[a1.ec-images.myspacecdn.com image 600x443]

Oh wait, that's the group I was talking about. Damn it where was I again? Oh yeah, smoking kills try some of this....Chewlies gum.

Cancer Merchant! Cancer Merchant!
 
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